Solar Frost- An OU Sun Team Featuring Kyurem [2172 ACRE]

=~Solar Frost~=

Hi! I have been playing on PO / PS on and off since the beginning of 5th gen, but to this point have never bothered signing up for the forums, let alone posting. What better way to introduce yourself than an RMT? Anyway, this is a balanced sun team I made featuring the criminally underused Kyurem, who is undoubtedly the MVP. Kyurem is a monster in the current metagame, primarily because it eats rain for breakfast- when it gets a sub up the opponent is in for a world of pain. This team has no significant peak as of yet (currently 11-0 and ACRE still provisional), but I will be sure to update with its progress.

Edit: I've gone on to lose 3 games, two because of my internet crashing. ;-;
I don't have too much time to ladder in but I'm sure a better, more dedicated ladder player could go pretty far with this team.


Team at a Glance



A Closer Look




Ninetales @ Leftovers
Trait: Drought

Evs: 156 HP / 136 SDef / 216 Spd
Calm Nature
- Flamethrower

- Hidden Power Fighting
- Roar / Sunny Day

- Will-o-Wisp

Yeah, Ninetales sucks, but drought is a thing, and an important thing at that. Ninetales serves simply to summon the sun that Venusaur and Heatran benefit greatly from, as well as to check certain special attackers, Scizor etc and provide burn support. HP ground is used over Roar for Heatran and other opposing fire types which would otherwise be hard to deal with, and need to be weakened for Venusaur to sweep. Sunny day to turn the tables on Politoeds that switch in or are defensive- standard stuff.




Kyurem @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
Evs: 52 HP / 220 SAtk / 236 Spd
Modest Nature
- Substitute
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power

Ah, the beast. Why I don't see Kyurem more often is beyond me. Kyurem not only lets me dismantle archetypal rain teams, but messes with stall too thanks to its 101 HP subs. It's never, ever a dead weight. You think your Ferrothorn can check my Kyurem? Nope. Pressure lets Kyurem beat it 1 on 1 from full HP, stalling out all of its Gyro Balls and escaping the matchup with its sub intact. Ice Beam and Earth Power give phenomenal coverage, and few pokemon that resist it, such as Rotom-W and Bronzong, can do little back. With the given evs Kyurem is able to outspeed and OHKO jolly Dragonite through multiscale, as well reaching that crucial 404 HP. Kyurem's bulk is outstanding too; it can live pretty much any unboosted neutral hit and hit back hard off 130 base special attack. Kyurem works especially well in sun in my opinion because water 'mons such as Keldeo and Politoed must be careful not to give Kyurem a free sub. Also, threats to Kyurem such as Scizor and Blissey are handled well by the rest of my team.

Here's a game I had that demonstrates just how easily Kyurem wrecks rain: http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/ou-49255580



Starmie @ Leftovers
Trait: Analytic
Evs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd

Timid Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Psyshock
- Grass knot
- Ice beam

What Kyurem hates most is hazards. Toxic Spikes ruin its stalling capabilities and Stealth Rocks cuts its HP by a quarter, and it is weak to spikes. So a spinner is pretty much a necessity. I chose Starmie as my spinner because you can never have too many water resists, and my team was a bit slow for my liking. Rapid spin is a given, but the other slots are up for grabs. Grass knot can 2HKO BandTar after rocks due to analytic, and dent any Jellicents that try to spinblock. Psyshock for stab since Hydro Pump is ineffective in sun, and Ice beam to prevent dragons from setting up on me. Although with these moves I can't touch steel types, I don't find this problematic because no Scizor dares pursuit me with the threat of HP Fire, and steel types in general are easily handled by the rest of my team. Starmie also acts as a secondary rain check, as well as taking on Conkeldurr and CM Keldeo effectively.



Venusaur @ Life Orb
Trait: Chlorophyll
Evs: 72 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 180 Spd
Timid Nature
- Growth
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire
- Sludge Bomb

No sun balanced or offensive team is complete without a chlorophyll abuser, and Venusaur is arguably the best of the bunch. It's not hard to set up a growth thanks to its more than respectable bulk, and proceed to clean up. Venusaur got even better than it already was with the advent of BW2 move tutors which gave it Giga Drain, remarkably letting Venusaur beat the pink blobs 1 on 1. 180 speed evs and a timid nature gives Venusaur the jump on scarf Latios (and other base 110s), and the spare evs are put in HP and defence to hit a life orb number and let it eat up stuff like Scizor's bullet punch unfazed. Venusaur's Grass / Poison typing provides yet another water resist, and lets it switch into Breloom safely if need be once something has been put asleep, which is a rarity as only Landorus-T fails to outspeed and OHKO it.


Landorus-Therian @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
Evs: 248 HP / 172 Def / 88 Spd
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Stone Edge

At this point of the teambuilding process I was horrifically weak to a host of physical attackers, especially dragons and in need of Stealth Rock supporter, making Landorus-T an obvious choice. The way that it sees such high usage in a metagame dominated by rain is a testimony to how good a pivot it is, largely thanks to initimidate. Terrakion, once the most feared pokemon in the OU tier is shrugged off by Lando-T. After switching in on a physical attacker, Lando-T can either get up rocks or U-turn out to gain vital momentum for my team and keep pressure on the opponent. I chose Stone Edge over HP Ice as a check for bulky Volcarona with roost, which could potentially outstall my Heatran. The unsung hero of the team.



Spanish Inquisition (Heatran) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Flash Fire
Evs: 56 HP / 252 SAtk / 200 Spd
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power Ice

- Lava Plume

Cookie for anyone that gets the nickname. Scarf Heatran patches up a lot of holes in the team, checking Alakazam, Volcarona, Dragonite, Gengar etc, as well as providing another win condition. But the best thing about this 4th gen relic is that nobody ever expects it, which often lets me nab surprise kills. Furthermore, Dugtrio cannot trap scarftran with rocks up unless locked into Earth Power, which stops me from having to be overly cautious whenever I see Dugtrio in the team preview. The speed evs let me outspeed positive base 130s, with max special attack and the rest put in HP to help Heatran switch in to 'mons like Alakazam, and then at the very least bring it down to its sash before being hit by a Focus Blast.

Overview

Kyurem is definitely a fun 'mon to use if you enjoy imagining the opponent tearing their hair out. I'm pretty happy with this team, especially since I have personally never seen Kyurem used on a sun team before. That said, a well-played Alakazam can pose a huge problem late game, but this is the case for a lot of teams. TR Reuniclus and SubCM Latias can sweep my team with the right condtions and I have no proper switch-in to Mamoswine and Kyurem-B. Nonetheless, this team is original and very fun to use, and I expect it will bring me some success on the ladder. ^^

Constructive criticism is much appreciated.
nintels (Ninetales) @ Leftovers
Trait: Drought
EVs: 156 HP / 136 SDef / 216 Spd
Calm Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Flamethrower
- Roar
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

venosur (Venusaur) @ Life Orb
Trait: Chlorophyll
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SAtk / 184 Spd
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SAtk / 30 Spd
- Growth
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Sludge Bomb

kiurm (Kyurem) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 52 HP / 220 SAtk / 236 Spd
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Substitute
- Roost

stamy (Starmie) @ Leftovers
Trait: Analytic
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SAtk / 30 Spd
- Grass Knot
- Rapid Spin
- Psyshock
- Ice Beam

Spanish Inquisition (Heatran) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 56 HP / 252 SAtk / 200 Spd
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Fire Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Earth Power
- Lava Plume

landrus t (Landorus-Therian) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 172 Def / 88 Spd
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 Def
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock
 
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Shurtugal

The Enterpriser.
is a Tiering Contributor
Hello!

So this team synergiezes fairly well. One of my biggest concerns is that you don't have a sturdy steel type on this team (Scarf Tran easily wears down) and things like LO Lati@s and CB Dragonite look like huge pains to take down. Opposing sun teams with Venu look stressful to face, especially if they partner up with Dugtrio. Nothing is switching into LO Mamoswine (given, most sun teams have issues with Mamo, but even still). I feel like this team has no "fallback plan" if you lose the weather war too -- rain would easily clean this with Keldeo if they eliminated Ninetales and successfully set up rain. Sand looks equally hard to face once sun is eliminated (think: scarf TTar).

However, I may be able to help you:

1.) I have some minor tweaks for you to try: Ninetales should run 156 Hp / 136 SpD / 216 Spe because outspeed KyuB and Will-O-Wisping is pretty neat in this metagame, as well as all the speed creeps as well as outspeeding Jolly Mamoswine (which is really cool since most suns, including this one, hate switching into those LO'd attacks). I'm rather indifferent to Hidden Power [Ground] though. Scarf Heatran is such a great lure for opposing sun Heatran that you're better off with Roar to phaze enemy Dragonite and Co. Grass Knot is a bad idea on Starmie when you really could use all the longevity you can get to make Specs Keldeo easier to deal with -- as well as rain in general, so I'd replace GK for Recover (being able to keep Keldeo constantly checked is important when in the weather war vs. rain / sand). Also, Lava Plume over Flamethrower on Scarf Tran is interesting for burn rates. Lastly, I'd run 188 Hp / 176 Def / 144 Spe Landorus-T to outpace Specs Goth, SD Scizor, and Modest Heatran.

2.) By replacing Psyshock for Thunderbolt on Starmie, I feel you have more insurance vs. rain teams. Boltbeam is pretty good coverage to maintain for this team.

That's it from me! I like this team! There wasn't much for me to fix, so kudos!
 
Just wanted to stop by and say, being a huge fan of sun teams and an avid sun abuser myself that I love the creativity you put into this team.
First of all, It synergizes well as Shurt said above, so thats great. But you have 3 water resists, generally speaking sunnyday is less important if you have 3 water resists, so in regards to that move slot you can place roar over sunnyday which would let you keep hp ground. however when using hidden power ground its free game for balloon trans to come in for free and one misprediction and you can lose your own heatran. Perhaps it wouldn't hurt to try HP fighting or Hp rock over ground, the former for heatran (at least somewhat) and the latter for Volcarona, both however at least pop its heatrans balloons. As for starmie, its a risky choice but it definitely has the potential to reward you, its just that with the set you're running it can die quite fast and may not always get the spin off which is crucial. My thought process is leaning more towards custap skarm teams with scarf/sash gengar... can be annoying if you don't predict right with starmie, my best answer to help with this is to run magma storm over one of your fire stabs on heatran, this allows for skarm to only ever get 1 layer since it brings down to sturdy and dies from magma storm residual after. This prevents starmie from having to come in right away and allows you to time your rapid spin for later since its so fast you can easily choose a good time to spin. Other than that, great team. I enjoyed reading it :]

Edit small nitpick, make nintales HP 248 since itll end on an odd number allowing you to switch into SR 5 times instead of 4.
 
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First off thanks for the rates!
So this team synergiezes fairly well. One of my biggest concerns is that you don't have a sturdy steel type on this team (Scarf Tran easily wears down) and things like LO Lati@s and CB Dragonite look like huge pains to take down. Opposing sun teams with Venu look stressful to face, especially if they partner up with Dugtrio. Nothing is switching into LO Mamoswine (given, most sun teams have issues with Mamo, but even still). I feel like this team has no "fallback plan" if you lose the weather war too -- rain would easily clean this with Keldeo if they eliminated Ninetales and successfully set up rain. Sand looks equally hard to face once sun is eliminated (think: scarf TTar).
You're right that dragons can be a pain to take down. However, CB Dragonite finds it hard to come in for free so it's manageable. LO Latios is in the same boat as Alakzam, especially if it has recover, so I'll definitely try Lava Plume on Heatran to perhaps wear it down better or get burns on the switch. I never have trouble with sun teams though, since I try not to let their Venusaur or Volcarona to come in for free without rocks up so I then am safe in the knowledge when switching in Heatran that I can't be trapped by sash Dugtrio and swept by the other. Scarf Heatran pretty much gives the middle finger to Dugtrio, and if I don't see Dugtio in the team preview I just have to scout for earthquake, in which case I can check it well with Kyurem. As for what happens when I lose the weather war, you'd be surprised- between ScarfTran and Kyurem I stand a good chance against Sand and Rain, and I really shouldn't be losing the war vs Hail bar a random Hail Dugtrio team. I agree that if I miss a will o on the switch into BandTar, or if they have a ScarfTar the odds to win the weather war are stacked against me, but with Rotom-W and TTar being a typical sand team's answers to ScarfTran and Kyurem and Landorus-T handling them respectively, I often end up winning regardless. As for when I lose the war to rain, I still have two good keldeo checks in Starmie and Venusaur (100 base SDef come at me). I've played matches where I've gone 3-0 down, lost the weather war but weakened the right mons, got a sub up with Kyurem and won the game 3-0 from there. And these are fairly standard rain teams, albeit not against great players. As for the Mamo weakness it's hard for me to fix. ScarfTran does an alright job of luring it (Fire Blast has OHKO'd in the sun in my experience), but other than that I usually have to pivot into Lando then go into Starmie, which is very risky if for instance they also have a Terrakion.

The Ninetales spread looks sweet so I'll definitely be using that, but my concern about having Recover / Tbolt / Ice Beam / Rapid Spin on Starmie is that Conkeldurr will be a huge problem, as will CM Keldeo. Psyshock also helps out with Skarm HO teams to OHKO non-scarf Gengar, which I can safely scout for with Ninetales since these type of teams are usually weatherless. Being able to hit Blissey for >50% on the switch-in is also really nice. Furthermore, I become pursuit bait for Ttar, which can mean a loss if I don't double at the right times and it's paired with something like E-belt Keldeo. Basically with these changes I feel as if I would be bettering my matchup vs rain but compromising myself against sand (and HO), when Kyurem already does fantastically against the former. The Landorus-T spread looks interesting and worth testing, but the loss of bulk could hurt against Dnite, Chomp etc who are already big threats to the team. I'll definitely try out Lava Plume and experiment with Roar on Ninetales.

Edit: Another reason I love the idea of lava plume is that flamethrower is usually a dead giveaway that I'm scarfed, so thanks!

But you have 3 water resists, generally speaking sunnyday is less important if you have 3 water resists, so in regards to that move slot you can place roar over sunnyday which would let you keep hp ground. however when using hidden power ground its free game for balloon trans to come in for free and one misprediction and you can lose your own heatran. Perhaps it wouldn't hurt to try HP fighting or Hp rock over ground, the former for heatran (at least somewhat) and the latter for Volcarona, both however at least pop its heatrans balloons. As for starmie, its a risky choice but it definitely has the potential to reward you, its just that with the set you're running it can die quite fast and may not always get the spin off which is crucial. My thought process is leaning more towards custap skarm teams with scarf/sash gengar... can be annoying if you don't predict right with starmie, my best answer to help with this is to run magma storm over one of your fire stabs on heatran, this allows for skarm to only ever get 1 layer since it brings down to sturdy and dies from magma storm residual after. This prevents starmie from having to come in right away and allows you to time your rapid spin for later since its so fast you can easily choose a good time to spin.
Thanks for rating! Facing balloontran is tough so HP fighting is a possibility and would also help with Ttar. I'll test Roar over Sunny Day too; racking up rocks damage on Politoeds that switch in is almost as good, but it also helps out in other ways such as against SubDisable Gengar. Against Custap Skarm teams I don't actually find it hard to spin for reasons I mentioned to Shurt- I can always check for scarf or sash with Ninetales since those types of team tend to be weatherless. Lastly, you're completely right about the Ninetales nitpick, but I think I'll be using the spread Shurt suggested to help with Kyu-B and Mamo.
 
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ShootingStarmie

Bulletproof
is an official Team Rateris a Tiering Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Hi there. I know you asked me to rate your team, and I had a look at it, and I generally couldn't find anything wrong with it. I didn't want you think I couldn't be bothered, I just didn't post in your thread because I couldn't find anything significant to change. I really like the team, and most of Sun's general weaknesses (Chomp, Dragonite, etc) I think you handle really well.

However, you could maybe try out Scarf Landorus-T over Heatran, and make Heatran the SpDef set? This helps you quite a bit with CM Latias, while Landorus-T still checks Dragonite and Garchomp very well with the Scarf set (while also still providing you with a revenge killer). While this does make you more prone to Dugtrio trapping you, Dugtrio is generally only used to win weather for Sun teams, and it's pretty un common and shouldn't be that big if a deal if you face it.

Other than that, I can't think of much else to say, good teams are hard to rate lol. Good luck in the future with it, and congrats on the cool Sun team.
 
However, you could maybe try out Scarf Landorus-T over Heatran, and make Heatran the SpDef set? This helps you quite a bit with CM Latias, while Landorus-T still checks Dragonite and Garchomp very well with the Scarf set (while also still providing you with a revenge killer). While this does make you more prone to Dugtrio trapping you, Dugtrio is generally only used to win weather for Sun teams, and it's pretty un common and shouldn't be that big if a deal if you face it.
Funny you should say that- my original draft of the team was exactly that. I clicked find battle and got swept by a Volcarona after Heatran got trapped lol. For me the surprise factor of ScarfTran is hard to turn down, and I love the way I can pivot in on stuff thanks to its host of resistances then outspeed and KO unexpectedly, even when the opponent sees I don't have leftovers (shed shell anyone?). Also, I find Fire Blast and Lava Plume are a lot better for spamming mid game and cleaning up with than Earthquake, for obvious reasons.

Thanks for the rate!
 

Halcyon.

@Choice Specs
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Hi!

As others before me have mentioned, Sub CM Latias seems to be the biggest threat to your team. It can set up on Heatran, and Ninetales can only phaze it out once before it loses. Basically, any time Heatran comes in you give Latias a chance to sweep your team. I know that you put Roar on Ninetales, but honestly it isn't the best answer to Latias. I agree with ShootinStarmie that you should use SDef Heatran over Scarf. SDef Heatran fits your team better (and honestly, I never really liked Scarf Heatran since it's outsped by just about every other Scarf Pokémon and setup Pokémon) than Scarf does, as it counters Latias completely. By using Roar on Heatran, you can free up a move on Ninetales, which definitely needs Sunny Day. However, I don't think using Scarf Landorus is a good idea, since it makes your team very weak to Terrakion, as Stone Edge is an easy 3HKO from the Scarf set, which means Landorus-T can only switch in once on Terrakion before it can demolish your team with Stone Edge. I don't really know if you need a Scarf Pokémon, but if you really need one, then you can use a Scarf Starmie with Trick to cripple walls.

Some minor changes would be to run a spread on Ninetales with 136 Speed and a Timid nature, as this lets you outspeed Toxicroak and Mamoswine, which can otherwise be huge problems, and Will-o-Wisp them.

Anyway, this is a really cool team! I like it a lot :) Hope I was able to help!
 
Hi!

As others before me have mentioned, Sub CM Latias seems to be the biggest threat to your team. It can set up on Heatran, and Ninetales can only phaze it out once before it loses. Basically, any time Heatran comes in you give Latias a chance to sweep your team. I know that you put Roar on Ninetales, but honestly it isn't the best answer to Latias. I agree with ShootinStarmie that you should use SDef Heatran over Scarf. SDef Heatran fits your team better (and honestly, I never really liked Scarf Heatran since it's outsped by just about every other Scarf Pokémon and setup Pokémon) than Scarf does, as it counters Latias completely. By using Roar on Heatran, you can free up a move on Ninetales, which definitely needs Sunny Day. However, I don't think using Scarf Landorus is a good idea, since it makes your team very weak to Terrakion, as Stone Edge is an easy 3HKO from the Scarf set, which means Landorus-T can only switch in once on Terrakion before it can demolish your team with Stone Edge. I don't really know if you need a Scarf Pokémon, but if you really need one, then you can use a Scarf Starmie with Trick to cripple walls.

Some minor changes would be to run a spread on Ninetales with 136 Speed and a Timid nature, as this lets you outspeed Toxicroak and Mamoswine, which can otherwise be huge problems, and Will-o-Wisp them.

Anyway, this is a really cool team! I like it a lot :) Hope I was able to help!
SDef Heatran would help with a lot of the biggest threats to the team in its current state, but I can't help but feel that the loss of a scarfer would open me up to even more :/. I rely on Heatran to check Mamoswine and Kyurem-B among other things, and if Starmie were to assume this role it's moveset would become even more awkward with the inclusion of trick, and it would be more prone to being trapped. Furthermore, even SDef Heatran still wouldn't be able to stop a CM Latias if it were the last pokemon and I let it come in on the wrong 'mon.

Thanks for the rate and I'm glad you like the team :)
 
Luvdisc'd! I managed to outstall with a burned Kyurem (this pokemon has really grown on me and you're to blame xD ), both a Rotom-W and a Slowbro. /ban Kyurem OP much.
 
Thanks. I don't think Kyurem's getting banned any time soon :c . But I'd like to see it come up from BL; it's seen some usage lately.
 
Thanks. I don't think Kyurem's getting banned any time soon :c . But I'd like to see it come up from BL; it's seen some usage lately.
Just being sarcastic. :p He's severely underated, and many fat pink blobs called Blisseys think that they can outstall , and outsmart him.Anyway, great team again!
 

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