Resource SS NU Viability Ranking Thread [See post #38]

[Finchinator]

SS NU Viability Ranking Thread

art by lyd | VR OP credit goes to PK Gaming | thread run by Finchinator​

Welcome to the first official SS NU Viability Rankings thread. In this thread, we as a community will be ranking every single usable Pokemon into "tiers." You're encouraged to post your thoughts and opinions on the various Pokemon that are usable in NU and what tier they should fall under. Posts in this thread will be taken into account when deciding rank changes.

The general idea of the topic is to rank each NU Pokemon under "rankings" that go in descending order. Since this is a tier list for the entire metagame, everything is lumped together. There won't be any segregation between offense, defense, and supportive presences in the metagame within this thread. For example, Eldegoss can be ranked in the A tier as a supportive presence, Sawk can be ranked in the A as an offensive presence, and Stunfisk-Galar can be ranked in the A tier as a defensive presence. While these three examples can also be found in the initial rankings, the viability of Pokemon and their roles within the metagame can and will change over time, so we will be sure to keep an open mind to this as well and adjust the thread accordingly during each update.

Finally, there will be a council of experienced players who will discuss and vote on the ranking of Pokemon. Depending on how the metagame is developing, we could update the thread every couple of weeks or every month+. Please note that your posts still very much matter and will be factored in to what we discuss and the discussions themselves. This thread is nothing without the posters and every informed opinion that is shared is considered a valuable contribution in my eyes, so do not hesitate to post if you know the metagame well and understand the forum rules. The council will consist of the following users:

• Eternally
• Finchinator
• Garay oak
• Kiyo
• quziel
• Rabia
• Realistic Waters
• rozes
• Sjneider

SS NU Ranking Tier List

(In alphabetical order)

NEW:

​

​

S Rank:

S Rank

Cofagrigus​

Decidueye​

Toxicroak​

A Rank:

A+ Rank

​

Gourgeist-Small​

Kangaskhan​

Persian-Alola​

Rotom​

Silvally-Dark​

Silvally-Dragon​

A Rank

Clefairy​

Lanturn​

Miltank​

Piloswine​

Stunfisk-Galar​

Weezing​

A- Rank

Basculin​

Eldegoss​

Ferroseed​

Garbodor​

Golurk​

Liepard​

Magneton​

Rapidash​

Rotom-Fan​

Rotom-Frost​

Sandaconda​

B Rank:

B+ Rank

Abomasnow​

Accelgor​

Alcremie​

Froslass​

Gurdurr​

Qwilfish​

Sawk​

Silvally-Poison​

Silvally-Water​

Skuntank​

Wishiwashi​

B Rank

​

Drednaw​

Cramorant​

Flapple​

Malamar​

Ninjask​

Silvally-Ghost​

Tangela​

Togedemaru​

B- Rank

​

Avalugg​

Bouffalant​

Klinklang​

C Rank:

C+ Rank

Butterfree​

Hattrem​

Morpeko​

Perrserker​

Quagsire​

Thievul​

Thwackey​

C Rank

​

Cursola​

Ditto​

Drifblim​

Dugtrio-Alola​

Luxray​

Orbeetle​

Pyukumuku​

Silvally-Ground​

---

Rules - Updated as of 4/5/2020

• Post intelligently. Posts like "I think pokemon X should be in this tier" will be deleted. Expand on your opinion with actual analysis showing understanding of the metagame and perhaps bringing a unique perspective to the conversation.
• Absolutely no flaming, personal attacks, or general idiocy will be tolerated. Part of this is under moderator discretion and please know that posting in this thread is a privilege, not a right. You'll get warned initially if it is not something overly malicious, but harsher punishments can and will come with repeated behavior or severe offenses.
• Usage statistics may be used to support an argument or a claim, but don't base your ENTIRE argument around them. There needs to be more substance than just this. For example, you can't just say "Pokemon X shouldn't be this tier because they aren't used that often!"
• When nominating a Pokemon to move from one rank to another, do not merely list its obvious qualities such as stats, typing, movepool, etc. If you think a Pokemon deserves to rise or drop, explain what has changed in the meta to cause such Pokemon to get better or worse. I can assure you that the VR Council already knows the obvious qualities and we are far more interested in understanding why you believe it has increased or decreased in viability.
• Unrelated discussion such as talk of (potential) suspects and unproductive one liners that do not greatly contribute to discussion will be deleted. If this becomes a recurring issue for any particular user, then it could lead to an infraction. If you are unsure where to post something, feel free to start a conversation with me on here or discord. Moreover, if you have a general question, then odds are it belongs in the SQSA, not here.
• Being NU by usage alone does not guarantee a ranking. We touched on usage not being the sole reason behind viability of anything before, but this is very true here as a lot of things accumulate ladder usage despite not being the best option. Do not mistake the correlation between usage and viability as stronger than it actually is. If you have any further questions about this, please start a conversation with me on here or discord instead of posting it in this thread.
• When new Pokemon, items, abilities, and/or anything else relevant to the NU metagame are released, please hold off on discussing the ranking of the new Pokemon or the rankings of Pokemon that are impacted by these developments until there is approval to discuss the matter by an NU Moderator in this thread.
• Failure to follow these rules after warning(s) will result in an infraction or possibly a ban depending on the severity of the offenses.
• If you are nominating a Pokemon to be ranked (meaning it was previously unranked), then you need to provide replays of it being used in the metagame and you also should go out of your way to be as thorough as possible in explaining why it has a niche in the metagame (Example of GOOD UR Nomination from the OU thread) -- a vast majority of nominations have been of poor quality historically and we reserve the right to revoke nomination privileges from thread posters at any point in time. If you are in doubt, then feel free to start a conversation with me on here or discord prior to nominating a Pokemon and I will give you honest feedback on the post.

Blacklisted Pokemon: All posts regarding these Pokemon will be deleted (or nominations of these Pokemon will be removed)

• N/A -- let's try to not have this list grow too much this generation!

I am hoping for a productive discussion to take place in this thread throughout the generation. I am looking forward to seeing the metagame develop in front of our eyes; I find this to be a very cool prospect and it is one of the main reasons why I elect to run this thread. With this said, I am still only one person and our moderation team only consists of so many people, so try not to make our lives too hard here...post intelligently, lurk before commenting if you are new, and do not expect everything to be moderated super closely 24/7. We are all volunteering our time and effort to maintain threads like these, so we expect a certain degree of respect and understanding of this.

 

[Yoshi]

-> S
Cofagrigus should definitely rise to S. Not only should it have been S before the past couple of days but now that Sneasel and Haunter are gone, I see no reason not to raise this up. Nothing can kill it, Nasty Plot + Trick Room is big broken, and the defensive sets just sit there and throw up Toxic Spikes the entire game.

-> S
I could definitely see this as a rise, but I'd like to know what more people think about Sandaconda. I feel like it's just so easy to fit on every team and so strong to where it's effective in 90% of the games its in. I can understand why people may not want this to rise to S, though; the fact that the tier has other rockers that are plenty viable is probably a turn-off here. However, Sandaconda is just such a good rocker, and we're already seeing it to be the most used Stealth Rock user. On top of that, it even has really great utility outside of Stealth Rock with Coil sets, too. This should rise to S in my opinion, although I'm sure many disagree.

-> A-/B+
Big Chungus here isn't all that great right now. I suppose losing Haunter is great for it but with Cofagrigus being the most used Pokemon in the tier, there are a ton of match-ups where Dubwool isn't going to get a lot of opportunities to set up. Besides, we even got Drifblim in this recent shift which Dubwool has trouble with, and some new special attackers as well that Dubwool doesn't really like to face off against. I think it's alright in a good chunk of match-ups, but certainly not enough to have this thing in A rank.

Just some initial thoughts, I'm sure there are other changes that should be made on here that I'll take a look at in a couple of days or so.

 

[jcbc]

Well i've been playing a lot this new gen and i'm quite happy on how the tier is looking as off rn. I'm going to drop some initial thoughts.

Rises​

Cofagrigus (A+ > S): Cofragrigus is just so good rn, it has absolutely no reason to bot be ranked as a top tier mon, haunter and sneasel leaving made it just so hard to kill and check, in addition to that,it has multiple sets and all of them are troublemaker for a vast majority of teams.

Silvally-Dark (A- > A): It's no secret that this mon was very good before the bans, but sometimes it faced competition with sneasel for being the offensive darktype of the team, now that sneasel is not around anymore it gained that; and despite haunter not being around anymore there's still a much need for a dark type because sir cofagrigus exist and this mon can perfectly scare it out altho it fear WoW.

Skuntank (B > B+/A-): Similar to silvally-dark case, sneasel leaving let's skuntank be more easy to be slotted on teams, it is a good dark type and even tho it doesn't have the good speed tier that darkvally has it's still good. Not only that but it can compress the Tspike absorber and or deffoger too and NP sets can be quite threatning.

Klinklang (B- > B/B+): Is this a tier without steelix? POOGGGGG!!! Now for real.
It is true that klang still has it's counter and checks here and there (ID+BodyPress users like cofag or lanturn) but it's definetly a threat to think of when building, sub/magnet rise and magnet rise 2 attacks are both very good and can sweep entire teams with just one shift gear.

Ninjask (C > B-): Why is good mon ninjask in C? we don't have rhydon anymore... itemless acro doesn't really have switchins, boots sets can fit very well into volturn teams making it a nightmare for the opps and the speed tier is cash. It is true that being weak to rocks sucks but with good team support ninjask can sweep a lot of teams just feom preview.

Drops​

Dubwool (A > B+/B): Ok so idk what has the council smoked when voting on dubwool but i definetly want some of that shit lol. the chungus sheep is definetly not bad but the prominence of psychic types being better with no sneasel around (especially the last addition of the tier indeedee) and cofag being everywhere make it not be that scary.

Flareon (B+ > B/B-): Flareon is not bad by any means it works very well on really fat balances or stall, it's biggest niche is to be one of the very few "safe" switchins to specs abomasnow (always that it doesn't click earth power) but reality is a lot of teams don't really want to open a slot for it; as a wishpasser clef and even togedemaru overshadow it and there are other spd sponges in the tier that have better role compression than flareon, in addition to that being rocks weak sucks and if you are boots you don't have lefties recovery which could be problematic.

Drifblim (B > B-): Now i know this one might sound weird but as someone that have tried drifblim in all possible ways it just doesn't feel as good as i initially thought it would be,defog sets feel very passive and very underwhelming, inviting special breakers such as abomasnow drampa and indeedee in everytime without much to do back and offensive sets doesn't really break the checks it has.

Anyways this is just some initial thoughts, i will probably come with another post with some pokemons UR additions that i feel to be good. I hope more people post so qe can kickoff a good discussion here.

 

[Spacial]

Falinks (B- ->C)
I know this may seem like a harsh drop, but I sincerely disagree with where Falinks is placed now. Falinks in general just has a hard time distinguishing itself from other Fighting-types like Sawk and Hitmonchan, since they have better stats, less situational abilities, and utility in the case of Hitmonchan. No Retreat looks good on paper, but more often than not it just ends up failing to sweep because it can't carry all the coverage it wants: with two slots filled by No Retreat and Close Combat, Falinks wants Iron Head/Poison Jab to threaten Fairies, Throat Chop so it isn't food for Cofagrigus, and Zen Headbutt to break through Garbodor. On top of all this, the tier recently gained 2 great new answers to it in the form of Ninjask and Quagsire. Unfortunately, I just don't see these little buggers having any viability.

I also second the nominations made by Yoshi, with the exception of Sandaconda moving to S.

 

[poh]

Drops

-> B/B-

Meta is extremely unkind towards it. One trick pony/sheep cause SD sets are outclassed by Silvally. S-rank Cofagrigus does the same job but better essentially and way too many things force it out. Dead weight vs Ghost-types and usually a sitting duck/sheep for the majority of the game. A lot of shit needs to leave the tier for it to be actually viable imo.

-> C

Ah Failinks. Yeah this mon is pretty unviable. Still slow after boosting, not that strong, 4MSS syndrome, etc. The list of negatives is endless. Defiant is cool i guess but we have way better Fighting-types that offer more in terms of offensive prowess or utility like Sawk, Toxicroak and Hitmonchan.

-> A-

Eldegoss isn't that bad of a mon. Forces out most rockers, Regenerator as ability, good utility with Sleep Powder/Leech Seed/Rapid Spin. The main negative this thing has is giving dangerous mons free turns. Drampa, Toxicroak, Silvally-Fire, Ninjask, etc. are mons you really don't wanna let in for free. I think a drop of 1 subrank is fine.

Rises

-> B-

Ninjask recently rose from PU and I believe this mon has a bright future here. Constant chip with U-turn, almost impossible to revengekill and has a strong acrobatics. I've talked briefly about this mon in the NP thread and I think it's definitely better than the other C-ranks. Ime its only problem is obviously the 4x weakness to rocks. This can be easily mitigated by running Hattrem and an offensive defogger.

-> B-

At the start of the gen everyone was panicking cause we had no hazard control. People were trying out different things and among them was Hattrem. I was extremely skeptical at first but after a while I realised it's actually not that bad and a valid mon to use. We all know the mindgames Xatu caused over the past generations and Hattrem also causes the same mindgames. It's actually bulkier than Xatu and has the tools to defeat the most common rockers and spikers. Good utility in Nuzzle and Healing Wish to support your team even further. No recovery sucks obviously but it does what it needs to do: chew hits and scare off rockers.

-> B/B+

Galarian Rapidash didn't have the best reputation at the start of the gen. Most tried to make best of its physical movepool and complained about it being not as strong as they hoped and the inaccuracy of its stabs. Sandaconda and Cofagrigus are everywhere which doesn't help it. Now, the special set is imo way better. You get rid of the inaccuracy of your stabs but you're gonna use its lower base spatk. which can be solved by running life orb and calm mind. It also benefits of the Psychic Terrain surge to boost its damage output even further. Its speed is also key in this meta, being faster than Silvally.

 

[S1nn0hC0nfirm3d]

Glad the VR is finally out! Here are my noms, they ended up mostly being Silvally forms lol, and I agree with 99% of the replies so far by the looks of it too.

Rises:

(water) A- > A
(dark) A- > A
(dragon) B- > A-
(ground) B- > B+
(normal) C+ > B-
(fire) C+ > B
(grass) C+ > B
(flying) C > C+

A > A+
B+ > A-
C > B-

UR > C+
UR > B-
UR > C+

Reasonings

You're gonna see me praise all Silvally forms and nom them for a rise, mostly because the Silvally formula works so well in NU. A non-consequential, spammable Multi Attack with boosting, great relative Speed, decent coverage, and the option to be special / mixed is unstoppable. I don't think its worth going into too much specific detail on the specific sets / matchups of each form, as there is an inherent value to all Silvally sets that the VR is not currently representing to the fullest.

Water, Dark, and Dragon I believe are top tier for their coverage or relative lack of competitive typings. Dragon in particular takes a big rise but either its SD sets or special Draco Meteor sets make it a great offensive force that's hard to deal with. Ground is also offensive with a ton of the right support, but its inability to Grass-types too hard and competition with other Grounds and Silvally forms limit it. Fire and Grass have some awesome offensive capabilities too but are constrained by lacking near-perfect coverage like the other forms, and are often walled by Flareon and Quagsire or Garbordor and Rotom-Fan, respectively. Normal is shy to being on par with any of the higher forms as even though it can make a cool Choice Scarf or Choice Band set, its typing is just a little lacking. Not to mention that the vally forms enjoy being Knock Off switch ins still, and Normal just is a little underwhelming. Flying is the last deserving of a small rise as it is often very offensive, but its SR weakness as well as inability to threaten multiple Electric-types gives it too much competition from the other forms. Still, it should be one of the top considerations for a niche mon.

Togedemaru is an easy A+ pick for me for being the best, safest Choice Scarf user in the tier. Many teams love its typing and Speed, as often offense relies on it for a Dragon-, Steel, Fairy-, Ice-, and Flying-type resit; otherwise, they would have a very hard time revenge killing Unfezent, Mime Galar, Frosslass, Klinkklang, Ninjask, ect. Being able to afford a status spreading move in Toxic or Nuzzle as a 4th move is also so valuable if the team could afford a way to wear down walls like Lanturn or stop sweepers like Silvally-Dark from boosting too much. All this, and Toge still affords pivoting with U-Turn. There's so much value that you can get from a single Toge set that it totally is on par with the other A+ mons in the meta. Even though now that it isn't as relevant for revenge killing Sneasel and Haunter, Toge still does everything else mentioned earlier so well that I think it earned its spot.

Malamar has proven itself to be a top-tier in this meta with how well it can tear through bulky teams with its RestTalk set. Sure, Unaware Quagsire just dropped, but the Knock Off support and status absorbing still makes it a great addition against the stall match up. It can be very hard to deal with, and even common U-Turn users fail to consistently revenge kill it. Malamar can switch from defensive utility in the midgame into a great wincon in the late game, and that value is very reliable and needed for teams to have.

Ninjask has had a lot of success in the meta for how naturally fast and powerful it can be, making it a great revenge killer or even sweeper. Rhydon and Sneasel leaving has helped its case a lot, even if Stunfisk-Galar may soar in popularity. It needs support against Steel- and Electric-types, but that is somewhat circumvented with the very viable Ground-types in the tier to help out, and by pivoting potential if HDB. I prefer Sitrus Berry and Defensive investment instead of Speed, as its already faster than everything after a Protect, and can give an opportunity to set up an SD on Silvally forms, Garbodor, and Rapidash Galar.

Theivul is an awesome partner for Indeedee as a cleaner. It's coverage in Dark Pulse, Psychic, and Mudshot for Toge and Skunk hits everything. It also is surprisingly bulky for a sweeper, and can afford defensive investment while still outspeeding Scarf users; that and the Psychic Seed boost can help with NP oppertunites! Check replays like this here where my opponent is using a team I built with it, and how well Thievul is able to sweep offensive teams after Indeedee and Silvally were able to punch holes through my team. It's totally deserving for recognition, even if its role is limited to Indeedee teams (an A+ mon nontheless!).

Hitmontop has had usage all of this gen in NU, but it's nothing too stellar. Rapid Spin, Intimidate, Toxic, and priority options are all cool for a mon and all but nothing that other mons in the tier like goss or mime can do better with their more relevant stats, typings, and abilities. Regardless, the inherent value of Hitmontop as an option is relevant and worth considering as a small niche; especially if the out-classed Mr. Rime gets a spot!

Hattrem, like poh said, has an awesome abillity in Magic Bounce, and enough bulk from Eviolite to beat hazard setters like Garbodor, Sandaconda, Piloswine, Drednaw, and Ferroseed with Psychic, Giga Drain, and Mystical Fire. This is relevant as it not only stops these setters from setting up their hazards, but can force them out or beat them 1v1. Even with the advent of HDB, many relevant Rock-weak Pokemon like the Rotoms, Unfezant, and Ninjask still have viable sets without this item. Then there's mons like Silvally-Fire, -Flying, Sawk, and Abomasnow that either absolutely can't or totally would rather not have HDB, and supporting these sets by keeping hazards off early is awesome. Hatt might not be much more than fodder against some setters like Cursola, Froslass, and Crustle that have super-effective coverage for it, but at the very least it can switch in and deny hazards. This ultra specific support is worth considering.

Drops:
A > B+
B > B-
B > B-
B- > C

Reasonings

Dubwool's strategy is often dependent on the right match up, and it fails to threaten some of the most relevant Ghost-types and sets there is. It take a ton of pressure from special attackers, so much so that special Toxicroak can switch in always and capitalize greatly on it. Defensive teams have the newly acquired Quagsire to help stall it out, and Dubwool's reliance on either Subsitute or Rest can be annoying / tricky for the user to deal with. It still has merit for what it might scare out itself in the midgame, and it still is a good wincon, but too unreliable to be this highly ranked. The lack of any utility besides damage on a mon like this is very annoying when something like Iron Defense Cofag does a similar role but can at least provide Trick Room or Wisp support as well.

Dred is okay as a lead or wallbreaker, but nothing too special and ultimately competes way too much with other leads or Silvally-Water. Cusola's Ghost-typing and firepower or Sandaconda's bulk and Glare make them better rockers. Silvally-Water has a better Speed and Water-type STAB attack, and just more potential in how it can pivot on Grass-types or check Toxicroak instead of being revenge killed by it. Dred is a good addition to Rain, sure, but that's nothing special; Abomasnow makes sure that other weathers are pretty match up based.

Golurk essentially suffers the same problems as Dred as a lead, and as a wallbreaker its okay but compresses the roles of the tier's Ground- and Ghost-types to an underwhelming result. It has nothing too good to bring to the table, with a Speed that loses to Abomasnow and is somewhat frail as is. Piloswine and Cursola usually do its job better.

Falinks, as many have already pointed out, just fails to Sweep or wallbreak on some of the most relevent physical walls in the tier, and relies on SD and perfect coverage in the right MU to really pull its own weight. Even then, its best used to bait these walls for other sweepers like Silvally-Dragon and Crustle can clean up after. Still, with physical defensive Clefairy and Quagsire now seeing use, Falink's lack of coverage for these walls is even more apparent. It has a small role on a very specific team dynamic, and even then it doesn't do that job too well.

There's some more that I'm unsure on, like Cofag / Sanda to S, or Appletun to C+, but I'll leave it here for now!

 

[Bad Player]

A to A+
After spamming this mon on the ladder for a while, I can say that it should definitely go up. Very strong stab combination combined with high power moves and the perfect coverage move in ep makes this mon very dangerous. It almost always gets a kill just spamming blizzard or clicking leaf storm and its really consistent at doing its job almost every game. The only mons in the tier which can take 2 hits from aboma are spdef clef and spdef ferro, and the ladder has no recovery option so its not doing much and while clef can consistently come in, any sort of chip will stop it from checking aboma. Overall I think its probably the best wallbreaker in the tier and it should def rise.

C+ to B-
I spammed this alongside the mon above and was surprised at how decent it was. Slow u-turn is very valuable in any tier (see teleport clef) and thats probably wishiwashis biggest perk. However, its also quite bulky, has a very strong scald, and is generally a nice defensive mon and pivot. One may think that this is kind of outclassed by lanturn but the perks of a stronger scald, slower pivot move, more physical bulk, and no ground weakness set it apart. And while its still definitely worse than lanturn, it can be used on teams which can already beat the things lanturn checks that washi can't.

A- to A
Not much to say here as the mon is pretty self-explanatory but it's a very solid rocker and in my opinion the second best rocker even over stunfisk, which is why I think it should rise to A alongside stunfisk. The problem with stunfisk is that it can be very passive and times, and while its longetivity is better than pilos because of lefties, pilos combination of bulk and power mean that it is the only rocker which can offensively pressure pretty much every hazard remover out there, which I believe to be a very valuable trait in this meta.

UR to C+
Honestly im kind of surprised that this isn't already on here, but basically its a really strong wallbreaker with a fairly spammable stab move and good coverage (eq/heat crash/superpower). Against certain teams, banded stonjourner can be an absolute menace, as theoretically there arent many things which can take 2 edges or 2 of its other coverage moves. It also has respectable speed and nice physical bulk, which only allow it to pressure teams more with its attacks. Now obviously its terrible spdef and as such it being easily revenged are certainly issues, but I think stonjourner has enough good qualities to at least be ranked and I would suggest more people to try it out.

Also agree with pretty much all of the posts above

 

[Lucario]

First, I will start with what should go to S tier.

Cofagrigus (A+ --> S) Cofagrigus is a Pokemon that is unstoppable if it has set up, just like everything else. However, its version(s) of setting up is different. It has Iron Defense which can make its Defense stat maxed at 1708. It also has Body Press which will destroy anything that isnt immune to Fighting. For those Pokemon it has Shadow Ball. Since Sneasel and Haunter left, Cofagrigus has had a better time in the meta because of its two main threats are gone. It also can set up Nasty Plot and be a special wallbreaker. It eats physical moves like people eat at an eating competition.

Sandaconda (A+ --> S) Sandaconda can be a threat to many wallbreakers because of Glare. It suppresses fast threats such as Indeedee, Unfezant, Klinklang, and Pokemon that can scare its teammates. It also has access to Stealth Rocks, which needs to explanation. Sure, something like Eldegoss can force it to switch out, but it could run Fire Fang to help fight the Fire types of NU. It can also take a few physical hits as it has a Defense stat of 125, which is pretty good.

Now onto the non-S tier Pokemon.

Silvally Ground (B- --> B+) First of all, this thing gets a STAB move even more powerful than Earthquake with no side-effects, that's nice. Secondly, it has decent stats. 95 across the board means it can also soak some hits from both physical and special attackers. It can also use Fire Fang to scare off an Eldegoss or Ferroseed that wants to cause trouble. Parting Shot is also too good to pass up. It also gets Defog, so you don't need an Unfezant or Skuntank for Defog. Back to Multi-Attack, it is able to destroy top wallbreakers such as Toxicroak, Perrserker, Drednaw and Jolteon, as well as a few tanks in Lanturn and Garbodor. Silvally-Ground may not be the best Silvally, but certainly is a good one.

Roselia (Unranked --> c) Roselia is a bulky, thorny little tank. Eviolite is the only item it'll run, but it runs it well. Whether you want a physical or special defensive tank that resists fighting, then Roselia is your girl. It had access to Leech Seed and Aromatherapy for a cleric set, it gets Giga Drain, Synthesis, Sludge Bomb, and Sleep Powder for a bulky set. It can also set up Toxic Spikes, which is nice. It is able to take down things such as Drednaw, Quagsire, Lanturn, and Eldegoss with its 100 Special Attack stat.

 

[Finchinator]

Thanks to lyd for the great new art featured in the OP!

 

[jcbc]

I've been waiting on people to post more so the discussion started but i gotta admit i agree with pretty much everything listed above (except with sandaconda rising). So i'm going to mention some mons that no one mentioned yet.

Swoobat (don't have image for it lol) (UR -> C+/B-) - ok so i used the bat a fair amount and holy fuck this mon is disgusting. With the amazing speed tier it has it can just sweep entire teams super easy having access to a inmediatly +4 is dumb and pretty impossible to switch in and cheesy sets are very threatning too.

Stunfisk-Galar (rank it in the same subrank as sandaconda either rise this to A+ or put sanda in A) - ok so this may be a hard statement and not everyone might agree but i believe stunfisk is as good if not a better rocker than sanda rn. the typing and the bulk it provides makes it so easy to just add to pretty much every team, it compresses a lot of roles togheter which is amazing rn and while it doesn't have glare nor the speed sandaconda has it is still very hard to kill. In a metagame that lack good steel types fisk is a premier one and i believe it deserves that.

Clefairy (A -> A+) - it's no secret for anyone if you played nu that clef is just a must, it has everything you may want for a team, additionally, being one of the very few things that can switch for free into abomasnow makes is even better.

Arctovish (C+ -> B+) - ok so the fish is actually super threatning, it has a raw power that is amazing and we lack good water resist that also resist ice type stab moves, it hits super hard and pretty much the only real switchins are lanturn and wishiwashi who also take a lot from fishious rend.

Again i would like to say i support every nom so far except sandaconda going to S (that is the only cofagrigus rank rn) golurk going to B- (i think is a very good rocker still and can fit very well in some teams) and i think wishiwashi should go higher than B- due to how good it is rn. This is all for now.

 

[Rabia]

Stunfisk-Galar (rank it in the same subrank as sandaconda either rise this to A+ or put sanda in A) - ok so this may be a hard statement and not everyone might agree but i believe stunfisk is as good if not a better rocker than sanda rn. the typing and the bulk it provides makes it so easy to just add to pretty much every team, it compresses a lot of roles togheter which is amazing rn and while it doesn't have glare nor the speed sandaconda has it is still very hard to kill. In a metagame that lack good steel types fisk is a premier one and i believe it deserves that.

I vehemently disagree with this notion that Galarian Stunfisk is even close to the level of Sandaconda; I would sooner drop this Pokemon to A- than put it in the same rank as Sandaconda.

Sandaconda is quite possibly the most versatile Stealth Rock setter in terms of archetypes it fits on. The only build I wouldn't ever consider Sandaconda on at all is stall; otherwise, I think it's pretty fair game on the others, including certain hyper offense teams. Sandaconda provides a lot to teams in terms of a status absorber, an Electric immunity, broken Glare, and a relatively decent check to some of the common Swords Dance Silvally formes. Galarian Stunfisk offers some of the same tools, but it is significantly less splashable, rather passive, and one dimensional. Like, the difference in versatility isn't huge, but Galarian Stunfisk is limited to essentially Stealth Rock / Earthquake / status move / Pain Split or Protect with a defensive spread. Sure, Sandaconda isn't really doing a whole lot more---you're basically limited to the same moveset on every team---but I feel being able to tailor Sandaconda to more teams and at least do something different than boring defensive support Pokemon is notable.

The Arctovish nomination feels overblown for sure, but I wouldn't be against seeing it in B-. Maybe that speaks more to the Pokemon currently in B- being awful, but Arctovish is definitely on par with several of them.

A couple nominations I want to make:

Silvally-Water -> A+ and Silvally-Dark -> A
These are both very clearly the best Silvally formes at our disposal, and I think they are underappreciated on the VR currently, especially Silvally-Water. Silvally-Water can provide a lot for teams between being a pivot, a Defogger, and a sweeper with Swords Dance. The tier lacks good Water-types, and Silvally-Water takes advantage of this by easily slotting onto teams that need the defensive utility it brings while still providing in other areas. You'll very rarely regret putting this Pokemon on a balanced or bulky offensive team...

unless you want to use a different forme, in which case Silvally-Dark comes to mind as an option. Much like Silvally-Water, Silvally-Dark is a good way to take advantage of the tier's lack of viable Dark-types. While it's a bit more limited than Silvally-Water---it doesn't do Defog sets nearly as well, mostly because it's just so good at using Swords Dance sets---it's really potent. Our Fairy-types are basically limited to Clefairy and occasionally Alcremie, and our Fighting-types are frail and get smacked by Psychic Fangs. It's also really nice to have a Psychic immunity that also outspeeds Indeedee-F.

In general, though, the Silvally formes are slept on. Ho3nConfirm3d did a good job covering them overall, and I support rises for Dragon, Ground, and Fire at the least. I'd have to think a bit more on the others for now, but I can vibe with his takes on them.

Drampa -> A/A+
I feel like I'm going to regret calling Kiyo a dumbass for voting to ban this Pokemon LMAO. Drampa is fucking insane; we lack any real meaningful defensive counterplay to this Pokemon, and its defensive utility gives it more opportunities to switch in and wallbreak than I'd like it to have. Generally with slow wallbreakers, your goal is to prevent them from freely switching in and beat them that way; it's hard to do that with Drampa because of how many Pokemon it arbitrarily takes advantage of. The person playing against Drampa has to make far too many reads than necessary I feel just to stay afloat versus it. At least with something like, say, Abomasnow, there are some soft checks that can take a hit from it. If you don't read Drampa's coverage moves every turn, you're basically constantly picking one.

Falinks -> C
Yo, this shit blows dick. Like, there are so many matchups in which it does fucking nothing because of how many common defensive Pokemon wall it. You can't really get away with dropping No Retreat or Swords Dance, and you have to run a STAB move, so you're forced to pick between Throat Chop and Zen Headbutt. If you go with the former, Garbodor and Toxicroak sit on you harder, and if you go for Zen Headbutt, you are never breaking Cofagrigus. Even Lum Berry can't save this Pokemon from being statused because it takes so many turns for it to become threatening.

Galarian Mr. Mime -> C+
Yo, this shit also blows dick. I'm not sure why it's ranked so high because it's definitely a relic of the past when the tier lacked hazard control outside of like it, Hitmonchan, and Unfezant, but Galarian Mr. Mime hasn't been relevant for several weeks. I think you can warrant keeping it ranked above shit ass Mr. Rime because at least this has some application on offense teams with Nasty Plot, but it's just not a very inspiring pick.

Froslass -> C+
Froslass is really hard to justify using a lot of the time from my experience. Like, Spikes stack offense builds aren't very common right now, and it's generally just outdone by Garbodor as a Spiker on other builds. It has some merit with utility options like Taunt, Will-O-Wisp, and weird Switcheroo sets, but meh, it has never felt like the teamslot was worth it to me.

Not saying we need an S rank Pokemon currently, but were we to have one, I think I'd lean towards Cofagrigus -> S. It's not unstoppable by any means because of how prevalent Toxic and Pokemon that pressure it are, but it can still feel a bit cumbersome to manage because of how many Pokemon it just comes in on and walls. It's also got a nice amount of splashability between its defensive and offensive sets, which helps its case.

 

[Expulso]

Liepard: C --> B or B+

Liepard is criminally underrated right now, at least in these rankings. It is faster than the Silvallys and basically every relevant unboosted mon (except, uh, Jolteon?), letting it get kills versus many more offensive teams once they have been worn down. It has a valuable, rare (in SS NU) Dark typing and can use STAB Knock Off to weaken its switchins before cleaning up later. It also gets excellent coverage; Gunk Shot + Grass Knot (or Seed Bomb) does an excellent job breaking through the common Clef + Quag defensive core. U-Turn is great for momentum, but Liepard gets a bunch of other moves that can work in the fourth slot; Sucker Punch can stop weakened Scarfers from revenging it, Play Rough can hit Silv-Dark and Toxicroak well, Psycho Cut can KO Toxicroak and let you take less chip from Garbodor, and a priority Encore/TWave lets it serve as a blanket check to a lot of threats.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1091730712-72af45rl9xfkhz5qw00qc27nk72yha4pw
Liepard puts in some work in turns 10-15. I didn't know about its coverage, and definitely could have played better if I did. Liepard is still good without the element of surprise, however; if I had made the optimal play of going to Stunfisk-galar, it still would have taken 40%, lost its item, and then been U-Turned on before probably getting 2HKOed the next time it came in.

Liepard is definitely not switching into any attacks it isn't immune to with its very mediocre bulk. However, Liepard's excellent coverage, speed tier, and the usefulness of Knock Off make it at least a B-rank pokemon in my eyes.

And if you thought Liepard was a big jump...

Wishiwashi: C+ --> A-

This is a big jump, but Wishiwashi definitely deserves it. Sandaconda and Piloswine are on basically every team and Wishiwashi does not fear them at all. 45/130/135 bulk is awesome, and it is augmented even further by Leftovers + Protect, letting Wishiwashi stay out of the dreaded Schooling range for pretty much the whole game. Scald is great off of 140 base Special Attack, doing major damage to neutral things that would scare it out such as the Rotom formes. Earthquake lets it hit Toxicroak, U-Turn lets it build momentum and hit Grass-types. Scald / EQ / U-Turn / Protect is the most common set, but Ice Beam is also an option to do ~50 to Eldegoss and ~90 to Gourgeist-Small.

This is the best bulky water in the tier for non-defensive teams, since it fits onto bulky offense / balance more easily than Quagsire by nature of not sharing a typing with Sandaconda or Piloswine. It is a top bulky pivot in general, and definitely deserves the high rank I am nominating it to.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1098030292
^ here's GW putting in work with it in a roomtour game against me. the game before, wishi put in even more work vs me. part of that was my team not having a grass type. however, it's kind of easy to chip things like sandaconda / pilo if that's the only thing stopping your sweep. wishi was the only resist to drednaw, but it took me a very very long time to chip it.

 

[iLiekMudkipz_]

Sandaconda A+ --> S
Sandaconda is the best Stealth Rock setter we have right now ever since Rhydon was revenge stolen bc of gigalith's ru departure was took from us. It has some good stats for NU and is able to run a multitude of sets.

Mr Rime <=^=> Mr Mime Galar

Mr Rime dropping was a direct improvement to the tier's hazard control. Mr Rime can also run more roles as a viable Nasty Plot sweeper. Meanwhile, the only niche Galarian Mime has over its evolved form is that it has 100 Speed, which is why i'm saying they should just swap places. Galarian Mr Mime is a relic of the past, when our only hazard control consisted of it, Unfezant, and Hitmonchan. Ever since Pokemon Home, Galarian Mr Mime has slowly became more and more useless. Mr Rime is criminally underrated in my opinion and should swap places with its overrated son.

 

[banks]

C+ -> B+ / B

A mon I'm quite an advocate for — Multi Attack / Flame Charge / Dragon Claw is a set I've been using with great success. Practically nothing resists its attacks and it exploits many popular styles and pkmn right now, like Clef Eldegoss teams with either no or just one switch-in, usually in the form of Sandaconda, Cofag, Drampa (dealt with w claw), and Wishiwashi. (not counting quag for obvious reasons). On offense teams, people will often be reliant on Togedemaru revenging and their own Silvally-formes like Dragon, Ground, or Water, all of which aren't hard checks to Silvally-Fire by any means. Rockers like Drednaw, Sandaconda, and Piloswine do exist on offence, but realistically Dred and Sanda don't have the longevity (or recovery) to stay healthy late-game, whereas Pilo just isn't a proper answer generally. The noticeable lack of physical Fire-type checks, reliable revengers, and multiple openings for Silvally-Fire to just dent teams are enough to warrant a significant rise. Also, hazards are problematic, but Eldegoss is a perfect partner for this mon and Rotom-formes work well too.

C+ -> B

I'm aware there was a lot of ambivalence on the viability of this mon, but I'm pretty sure that doubt has been dispelled. Banded sets are absurdly strong and absolutely tear apart balance / fat if played right, and pivot support from Vallys, Rotoms, and really just any pivot that gets this thing are greatly appreciate, and will likely result in Arcto claiming something. Scarf sets can also be incredibly clutch due to outpacing Vallys and Gourgiest-Smalls, and breaking through teams when stuff like Ferro, Eldegoss, Drampa, Croak etc are eliminated / weakened. It's also noteworthy that those mons can be hit with stab Icicle crash and Psychic Fangs. I don't want to ramble on this mon since it's pretty self-explanatory and the sheer power should be enough for a rise.

B -> B- / C+

Hitmonchan's never really made a splash in the tier, except maybe in its very early days. Yeah revenging Togedemaru and being a solid go-to for stuff like Galarian Stunfisk is nice but put simply, this meta is extremely unkind to Hitmonchan. Firstly, Cofag and Garb being as good and as common as they are is a massive hit to Hitmonchan, whereas stuff like Croak can power through with NP sets. Croak can also bypass so many mons a million times better than chan, like Clef, Gourgeist-Small, Rotom-Fan and so on. Chan will rarely even get a chance to spin since it switches on very little, successfully blocked by most of our ghosts (yea it has ice punch or throat chop but without lo it's piss weak and without av it's piss frail, which is another issue), and would rather just get off a mach punch before spinning cause it's likely dying on that turn to any physical attacker. All in all, there's not much justifiable reason to use this mon over Croak as a fighter or over basically any other hazard remover.

B -> C+ / C

I've never felt a desire to put this thing on a team, and I've never seen it do something successfully. There's probably some experimentation you can do with this when it comes to special sets or pivots, but those are utterly matchup reliant / fishing. While this does have some merit, like bearing the ability to come in comfortably vs Clef, check Croak semi-decently if you run Psychic Fangs (which is basically delegating you to running physical, which I'll get too soon), and capitalising on Eldegoss's prevalence. The problem is then, once you actually come in vs these mons, then what? Poison Multi-Attack really is not great, you could try some special sets to 'lure' Sandaconda and other ground-types except you don't actually have poison stab then, so why ever over the other numerous viable types. It's hard to articulate clearly what's wrong with this mon since the main problem is it's just very underwhelming.


Some other things: agree with Wishiwashi rising but absolutely not as high as A-, think Silvally-Grass could rise up a rank, agree with Liepard rise but not as high as B+, Falkins is just meh and should not be as high as B, stuff like Ninjask and regular Mr. Mime could probably be bumped up a rank or two

 

[Lucario]

C+ -> B/B+
Silvally Fire has obviously been seeing some usage as of lately. It can take down things such as Eldegoss and Toxicroak which are big threats, that's without the +2 from Swords Dance. With Swords Dance, it can KO even more such as Clefairy and Rotom-Fan. It is one of the Silvally (plural) that works wonders in the tier.

C+ -> B/B+
Scarf Arctovish is amazing in the tier. A Fishious Rend can scare any threat such as Rotom-Fan, Quagsire, Clefairy, and so on. Some of its counters, such as Jolteon, cannot even switch into Arctovish without having to sack another teammate. Arctovish can also scare high HP mons such as Wishiwashi School with Super Fang.

A- -> A/A+
With Silvally-Fire rising in popularity, there is no doubt that Quagsire will rise in usage as well. Unaware also suppresses things that set up, which is really nice. Not only that, it has access to Toxic and can ensure a Cofagrigus cannot setup. It also has little counters in NU, Appletun and Eldegoss are the obvious with an every now and then Silvally with Grass Pledge. Quagsire is a bulky tank with a single weakness that is annoying in battles and needs to rise.

Also, ignore my post from a few weeks ago with Roselia, I know, it was bad.

 

[Denial]

VR post cause im bored

UR -> B
Butterfree is a very scary threat that people seems to still sleep about. Sub + Quiver Dance is the most annoying combo ever, allowing you to always get at least one Quiver Dance, and sweep trough teams. Example of unprepered team getting destroyed by the butterfly: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8nu-492828

Most Steel-types are also not enough to deal with it, as seen in this replay: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8nu-496201
since the absence of rock coverage made stunfisk completely useless vs Butterfree behind a sub. And talking about Butterfree

UR -> B/B-
Hattrem makes dealing with hazards very easy, with its amazing bulk and coverage. It also has amazing utily moves in Nuzzle and Healing Wish or setup moves like Calm Mind, making it even more annoying to deal with.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8nu-492828 (again)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8nu-493108

Fire/Ground/Dragon to B
I believe that those are the best offensive typings for Silvally in this particular meta, thanks to their extremely good spammable stab, good resistences and coverage to support. I could expand more, but i alredy talked about my point of view on Silvally overall, and talking about it here would just make me repeat myself.


If we had to pick an S tier i think it would easily be Togedemaru and Sandaconda.

Lets start with him. One of the most used Pokemon in NUPL rn (second only to silvally lol), Sandaconda is just amazing, and the best rocker in the tier. Can easily beat every remover that isnt Eldegoss, can provide support with Glare, Shed Skin is amazing for recovering from statuses, and even Sand Split has his niche as a suicude lead. Its bulk allows it to deal with the most threating physical sweepers in the tier, like Toxicroak and most of the Silvallys Form. Glare imo is what makes this mon amazing, making what are the most safe switchins vs it possible dead slots.

This may be controversial, but i think Togedemaru is also one of the best Pokemon in the tier. One use behind Sandaconda in usage, this mon can run so many sets. Scarf, Band, Wish, SubTox, and all of them work perfectly. Its also worth noting that Togedemaru is the only scarfer that can outspeed Silvally at +1, making it (imo) the best scarfer in the tier. His typing also provides so many good resistances, allowing it to check Rotom-Fan/Frost, Butterfree, Unfezant and opposing Togedemaru. Its ability are also incredibly good, making it immune to Electric moves or chipping constantly physical Pokemon. I truly think this Pokemon is amazing, and A+ is at least the minumum it deserves.


I agree with a bunch of old nominatios that were previously posted in here, like Wishiwashi, Arctovish, and Liepard rising, and Dubwool and Hitmonchan dropping, but those are the overall Pokemon i wanted to talk about mainly. Thank you for reading.

 

[Finchinator]

Rises

• from C+ to B-: Arctovish has a high ceiling, being capable of large damage outputs. It is an inconsistent Pokemon, but we believe the upside is enough for a small raise.
• from UR to C+: Quite threatening considering the utility moves it has that enable offensive sweeps if the opponent lacks one of a handful of normal checks. It is not as consistent as you would like for a top tier win condition to be, but for a C+ Pokemon it is making waves, as seen by some mentions above.
• from A- to A+: Clefairy has been one of the most common non-Silvally Pokemon in the tier. It offers great deals of utility through Wish passing thanks to Teleport and setting up Stealth Rock while crippling foes depending on the variant used.
• from A+ to S: Cofagrigus is the best Pokemon in the tier right now; it has insane defensive utility coupled with superb damage output possibilities between Body Press being as strong as ever and special attacking options. You cannot go wrong with Cofagrigus in the current metgame.
• from A- to A+: People are slowly starting to notice that there are no hard counters to this thing in the metagame. Draco Meteor and Hyper Voice both hit absurdly hard; low speed is mitigated by acceptable natural bulk and a typing that allows for some safe entry throughout games.
• from UR to C: A lot of people have been starting to recognize it as a legitimate option in the metagame, so I would not be shocked to see it go even higher in the future. For now, Hattrem is a very viable utility presence in the tier and it being ranked is a step in the right direction.
• from B- to B: It turns out that the gears are alright in a metagame that lacks Steelix. Who would've thought?
• from C to B: Liepard has a lot of offensive utility coupled with being able to abuse Prankster in a couple different practical ways depending on the team. Not the best Pokemon, but it offers enough to various archetypes to reside in the B tier.
• from A- to A: Piloswine is slowly becoming a top-tier Stealth Rocker. It has superb dual STAB to compliment respectable attack and it is able to threaten most removal, letting it have a clear niche offensively over Sandaconda.
• from B- to B: Rapidash-Galar has not quite caught on, but it can pose a threat, especially to opposing offensive teams. It also has a nice speed stat, which comes into handy in a Silvally infested metagame.
• Dark from A- to A+: The original slap-on-to-check-Indeedee option! Silvally-Dark is one of the best Silvally types right now, abusing Multi Attack + coverage nicely and providing some defensive utility against both Psychic and Ghost types in a pinch.
• Dragon from B- to B+: Offensively, Silvally-Dargon is able to make the most of Multi Attack. Defensively, Silvally Dragon is not superb, but it does resist the FWG trio to at least assure some survivability in some match-ups. It is enough to be a relevant Pokemon in the B+ rank, but it does not stand out as much as Silvally Dark.
• Fire from C+ to B+: In a metagame deprived of bulky Waters that were not regarded as complete meme-tier Pokemon historically (Wishiwashi), Silvally-Fire finds itself very viable. It is nice offensively with Multi Attack because of this, making use of Swords Dance to bolster its damage output and even abusing Flame Charge as a STAB option to raise speed. The main issue is an SR weakness and inability to withstand Earthquakes from Sandaconda, leaving it still in the B ranks.
• Flying from C to C+: Much like Silvally Fire, a SR weak Silvally form with semi-spammable STAB Multi Attack has found a niche in the metagame. Unfortunately, there are still some Steel and Electric types to slow its progress. This coupled with even less redeeming resistance limits it, but a small rise to C+ is still appropriate for the time being.
• Water from A to A+: The ultimate utility Silvally and one of the most common forms alongside Dark. Silvally Water offers a premium defensively while still being strong offensively due to lack of many Water resistances that don't drop to Psychic Fangs. It's pretty great, earning a spot in A+ alongside Silvally Dark.
• from C+ to B: Everyone's...least favorite?...fish has found a niche in a competitive tier; it has a lot of utility as a bulky Water that can pivot without taking up the Silvally slot. It also checks both Silvally-Water and -Fire, which can go a long way.
• , , and from UR to C: Fuck Sun teams.

Drops

• from B to B-: The Ghost balloon has not been gaining much traction after it saw some hype upon dropping into NU. It has some viability overall, but it is limited and tends to be phased out of the main balanced and bulky-offensive archetypes you see frequented in the metagame.
• from A- to B-: We ranked this too high initially. It also has been steadily dropping in usage since the start of the tier. Dubwool has a niche with Body Press + Cotton Guard, but at this point it is bordering upon cheese to use it and it is nowhere near a top tier Pokemon, leaving it to reside in the lowly B- subrank.
• from A to A-: Eldegoss is great with Regenerator, Rapid Spin, and more, but it is still just a limited Grass type without a great offensive footprint. Overall, it works on a lot of builds, but it is not versatile or threatening enough to warrant a placement in the A rank as a Pokemon predominantly focused on utility. Higher ranked utility Pokemon offer high damage output alongside their utility (i.e: Sandaconda offering strong EdgeQuake alongside SR setting) or completely unmatched forms of utility (i.e: Clefairy with Teleport/Wish).
• from B to C: You know, I have never actually used Falinks, but every time I see it on the ladder it is after waiting 4 minutes to face someone ~300 points lower than me and it never does anything, so I'm going to go out on a limb and say this drop was justified and it probably saw more hype initially due to being a new toy for the playerbase to experiment with.
• from B+ to B-: BREAKING NEWS defensive Fire types lack sticking power in competitive metagames.
• from B- to C+: It has a lot it can bring to the table, but being frail and not strong offensively makes it very hard to justify right now, especially with Cofagrigus being the primary Ghost type to use.
• from B to C: Hitmons are never good, not even in NU metagames. This is just fact at this point. Sorry not sorry.
• from B to C+: Never used this Pokemon, but it seems to be very niche in the current metagame and checked by a couple of common Pokemon, leaving it a subpar option currently.
• from C to UR: Well, yea...what did you expect?
• Ground from B- to C+: It actually is not this bad, but people tend to use SR Grounds + Silvally forms that are not Ground, which makes this one of the most awkward Pokemon to fit consistently in the metagame unfortunately.

Rabia just won the NU Contributor lottery, with the grand prize being editing the OP since it's 4am and I'm gonna drop (if not, I will edit it tomorrow afternoon so DW). Thanks to everyone for posting!

 

[Rabia]

Rises

• from C+ to B-: Arctovish has a high ceiling, being capable of large damage outputs. It is an inconsistent Pokemon, but we believe the upside is enough for a small raise.
• from UR to C+: Quite threatening considering the utility moves it has that enable offensive sweeps if the opponent lacks one of a handful of normal checks. It is not as consistent as you would like for a top tier win condition to be, but for a C+ Pokemon it is making waves, as seen by some mentions above.
• from A- to A+: Clefairy has been one of the most common non-Silvally Pokemon in the tier. It offers great deals of utility through Wish passing thanks to Teleport and setting up Stealth Rock while crippling foes depending on the variant used.
• from A+ to S: Cofagrigus is the best Pokemon in the tier right now; it has insane defensive utility coupled with superb damage output possibilities between Body Press being as strong as ever and special attacking options. You cannot go wrong with Cofagrigus in the current metgame.
• from A- to A+: People are slowly starting to notice that there are no hard counters to this thing in the metagame. Draco Meteor and Hyper Voice both hit absurdly hard; low speed is mitigated by acceptable natural bulk and a typing that allows for some safe entry throughout games.
• from UR to C: A lot of people have been starting to recognize it as a legitimate option in the metagame, so I would not be shocked to see it go even higher in the future. For now, Hattrem is a very viable utility presence in the tier and it being ranked is a step in the right direction.
• from B- to B: It turns out that the gears are alright in a metagame that lacks Steelix. Who would've thought?
• from C to B: Liepard has a lot of offensive utility coupled with being able to abuse Prankster in a couple different practical ways depending on the team. Not the best Pokemon, but it offers enough to various archetypes to reside in the B tier.
• from A- to A: Piloswine is slowly becoming a top-tier Stealth Rocker. It has superb dual STAB to compliment respectable attack and it is able to threaten most removal, letting it have a clear niche offensively over Sandaconda.
• from B- to B: Rapidash-Galar has not quite caught on, but it can pose a threat, especially to opposing offensive teams. It also has a nice speed stat, which comes into handy in a Silvally infested metagame.
• Dark from A- to A+: The original slap-on-to-check-Indeedee option! Silvally-Dark is one of the best Silvally types right now, abusing Multi Attack + coverage nicely and providing some defensive utility against both Psychic and Ghost types in a pinch.
• Dragon from B- to B+: Offensively, Silvally-Dargon is able to make the most of Multi Attack. Defensively, Silvally Dragon is not superb, but it does resist the FWG trio to at least assure some survivability in some match-ups. It is enough to be a relevant Pokemon in the B+ rank, but it does not stand out as much as Silvally Dark.
• Fire from C+ to B+: In a metagame deprived of bulky Waters that were not regarded as complete meme-tier Pokemon historically (Wishiwashi), Silvally-Fire finds itself very viable. It is nice offensively with Multi Attack because of this, making use of Swords Dance to bolster its damage output and even abusing Flame Charge as a STAB option to raise speed. The main issue is an SR weakness and inability to withstand Earthquakes from Sandaconda, leaving it still in the B ranks.
• Flying from C to C+: Much like Silvally Fire, a SR weak Silvally form with semi-spammable STAB Multi Attack has found a niche in the metagame. Unfortunately, there are still some Steel and Electric types to slow its progress. This coupled with even less redeeming resistance limits it, but a small rise to C+ is still appropriate for the time being.
• Water from A to A+: The ultimate utility Silvally and one of the most common forms alongside Dark. Silvally Water offers a premium defensively while still being strong offensively due to lack of many Water resistances that don't drop to Psychic Fangs. It's pretty great, earning a spot in A+ alongside Silvally Dark.
• from C+ to B: Everyone's...least favorite?...fish has found a niche in a competitive tier; it has a lot of utility as a bulky Water that can pivot without taking up the Silvally slot. It also checks both Silvally-Water and -Fire, which can go a long way.
• , , and from UR to C: Fuck Sun teams.

Drops

• from B to B-: The Ghost balloon has not been gaining much traction after it saw some hype upon dropping into NU. It has some viability overall, but it is limited and tends to be phased out of the main balanced and bulky-offensive archetypes you see frequented in the metagame.
• from A- to B-: We ranked this too high initially. It also has been steadily dropping in usage since the start of the tier. Dubwool has a niche with Body Press + Cotton Guard, but at this point it is bordering upon cheese to use it and it is nowhere near a top tier Pokemon, leaving it to reside in the lowly B- subrank.
• from A to A-: Eldegoss is great with Regenerator, Rapid Spin, and more, but it is still just a limited Grass type without a great offensive footprint. Overall, it works on a lot of builds, but it is not versatile or threatening enough to warrant a placement in the A rank as a Pokemon predominantly focused on utility. Higher ranked utility Pokemon offer high damage output alongside their utility (i.e: Sandaconda offering strong EdgeQuake alongside SR setting) or completely unmatched forms of utility (i.e: Clefairy with Teleport/Wish).
• from B to C: You know, I have never actually used Falinks, but every time I see it on the ladder it is after waiting 4 minutes to face someone ~300 points lower than me and it never does anything, so I'm going to go out on a limb and say this drop was justified and it probably saw more hype initially due to being a new toy for the playerbase to experiment with.
• from B+ to B-: BREAKING NEWS defensive Fire types lack sticking power in competitive metagames.
• from B- to C+: It has a lot it can bring to the table, but being frail and not strong offensively makes it very hard to justify right now, especially with Cofagrigus being the primary Ghost type to use.
• from B to C: Hitmons are never good, not even in NU metagames. This is just fact at this point. Sorry not sorry.
• from B to C+: Never used this Pokemon, but it seems to be very niche in the current metagame and checked by a couple of common Pokemon, leaving it a subpar option currently.
• from C to UR: Well, yea...what did you expect?
• Ground from B- to C+: It actually is not this bad, but people tend to use SR Grounds + Silvally forms that are not Ground, which makes this one of the most awkward Pokemon to fit consistently in the metagame unfortunately.

Rabia just won the NU Contributor lottery, with the grand prize being editing the OP since it's 4am and I'm gonna drop (if not, I will edit it tomorrow afternoon so DW). Thanks to everyone for posting!

fuk yu

 

[Landon]

UR -> B/B-
Let me put you guys on this behemoth. First off, what comes to mind with Basculin is more than likely a physical set. Well, in this case let me show you a special set which I think is much better in this meta. Since I'm nomming this mon as a whole, I will include both sets, but this post will be focusing on its special set.

Sets

Basculin @ Choice Specs
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Naive Nature
- Surf / Scald
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Mud Shot / Superpower / Aqua Jet / Psychic Fangs

Basculin @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly / Naive Nature
- Liquidation / Waterfall
- Aqua Jet
- Superpower
- Ice Beam / Psychic Fangs / Taunt

• Physical Set: Liquidation or Waterfall is for your main stab. Liquidation has only slightly more base power, while Waterfall has that 30% chance to flinch. Aqua Jet is priority that dishes out good damage thanks to LO + Adaptability. Superpower is for mons like Drampa and Abomasnow. After running calcs, Beam is overall better than Ice Fangs. It hits mons like Eldegoss, Flapple, and even Appletun which eat Liquidations. Psychic Fangs is for Toxicroak and Taunt can be good to stop sweepers from setting up or to prevent hazards from being set.
• Special Set: I feel having two water moves is essential, as Hydro Pump doesn't have enough PP to be used on it's own and the accuracy isn't the best. Surf is offering more BP over Scald, but Scald could be run because of the burn chance. Hydro Pump is for a STRONG stab attack which is 330 BP (I think that's correct?). Ice beam is for grass mons such as Eldegoss, Appletun and the newly added Flapple. The last move can be whatever your team needs. Mud Shot hits mons like Toxicroak and is a safer option for mons like Lanturn. Superpower gets off good chip against Arctovish and Lapras, although Lapras isn't very common. Aqua Jet is a form of priority, which still hits decently hard thanks to Adaptability. Psychic Fangs is giving you a 87.5% chance to OHKO Toxicroak after rocks, so that's another option as well.

Replays

A buddy of mine is currently #2 on ladder with 1642 elo and I'm currently #3 at 1582 elo.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1108559213 Basculin straight up KOs Rotom and Pilo, making it near impossible for oppo to win
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1106712089 Basculin come in and picks off 2 Gourg and Mawile and sweeps late game
https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen8nu-1106778333-k2rx92meevjdmyb0u3w1diftjblkh1lpw Basculin pressured most of the oppo mons thus making Lanturn switch-in and get worn down enough to where the W was obtainable

Lots of Calcs

252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 202-238 (58.7 - 69.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Surf vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 204-240 (63.7 - 75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 248-294 (77.5 - 91.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
You think your Clef is a switch in? LOL. 252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 164-194 (47.6 - 56.3%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire: 366-432 (92.8 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Abomasnow: 148-175 (46.1 - 54.5%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Rotom-Frost: 244-288 (101.2 - 119.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally-Water: 135-159 (40.7 - 48%) -- 64.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally that Pump hits neutrally: 270-318 (81.5 - 96%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Small: 164-193 (65.3 - 76.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Small: 268-316 (106.7 - 125.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Drampa: 228-270 (63.5 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eldegoss: 180-214 (55.5 - 66%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eldegoss: 136-160 (41.9 - 49.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Thick Fat Appletun: 256-304 (60.3 - 71.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Mud Shot vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Toxicroak: 184-218 (59.9 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

• There are very few switch-ins to this mon. A couple of those, bulky Wishi and bulky Lanturn, are still taking a good chunk. Both of these mons don't have reliable recovery option as well. RestTalk Wishi isn't very common and RestTalk Lanturn is even more uncommon. It has a good enough speed tier letting it outspeed Silvally's. Another thing about running special is it's somewhat of a surprise factor. Players will gladly switch in their Cofagrigus or Quagsire thinking it's physical. Special Basculin has very few switch-ins and you're forced to outplay your opponent by predicting if you don't carry one of its few switch-ins. Considering all of this, I think it deserves a spot on the VR. Sidenote: In my opinion, pairing this with a Stealth Rock setter and Spike and/or Toxic Spike setter works the best.

UR -> C/C+

Set

Glaceon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Ice Beam / Frost Breath / Blizzard
- Water Pulse / Shadow Ball / Frost Breath / Blizzard
- Shadow Ball / Frost Breath / Blizzard

• Another underrated mon with limited switch-ins. With base 130 special attack, specs Glaceon fires off stab ice moves like it's nothing. The tier has a very limited amount of defensive steel and fire types, which makes this mon dangerous. Fire types aren't the best defensively and are in general very limited in NU. The only fire type switching into this without taking a good chunk is defensive Flareon. Same goes with steel types. Most of the steel types are offensive, thus only defensive Togedemaru is switching into it and not taking much. Bulkier Klinklang is a decent enough check as well. or klang... someone hop on the Klang wave with me... especially now that Flapple is here
• Running a timid or modest nature is up to you, but running timid allows you to not risk the speed tie with Golurk and allows you to outspeed Abomasnow and Sandaconda's creeped for Abomasnow. On the other hand, a modest nature allows for more power giving you a better match up against mons like specially defensive Stunfisk and Clefairy. You could also run 136 evs in HP which will allow you to live a Body Press from Cofagrigus after rocks. It also allows Galceon to take a EQ into Stone Edge from Sandaconda, providing it isn't heavily attack invested.
• Freeze-Dry is essential as it allows you to 2HKO or OHKO water types such as Lanturn, Wishi, and Silvally-Water. Ice Beam is for a stronger stab and has 100% accuracy unlike Frost Breath or Blizzard. Frost Breath can be used as it's good for random setup mons like Calm Mind Alcreamie. Blizzard is for more power, securing a 2HKO on mons like specially defensive Clefairy and OHKOs against Silvally where Blizzard hits neutrally. However, the accuracy can be a major drawback. Water Pulse is a good option for a common switch-in like Piloswine, which is 2HKO unless it's running a good amount of special defense. It also is doing a decent chunk to Flareon and even has a 75% chance OHKO Rapidash if modest. Shadow Ball is a good option for dealing with one switch-in checks to Glaceon such as Mr. Mime-Galar or Mr. Rime. Options like Toxic or Wish could serve some use too as well.

Replays

*currently gathering*

Lots of Calcs

252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Wishiwashi-School: 290-344 (98.6 - 117%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Wishiwashi-School: 266-314 (90.4 - 106.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Lanturn: 320-380 (70.4 - 83.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (i dont think anyone good would be running max spdef and hp but put to show the damage)
252 SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally-Water: 356-422 (107.5 - 127.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 283-334 (88.4 - 104.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 231-273 (72.1 - 85.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 186-220 (54 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Frost Breath vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy on a critical hit: 153-181 (44.4 - 52.6%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Stunfisk-Galar: 238-282 (56.3 - 66.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Stunfisk-Galar: 195-231 (46.2 - 54.7%) -- 8.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Water Pulse vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Rapidash: 260-306 (95.9 - 112.9%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Rapidash: 145-171 (53.5 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Water Pulse vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Piloswine: 216-256 (53.4 - 63.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally that gets hit neutrally by Blizzard: 307-363 (92.7 - 109.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Togedemaru: 156-184 (57.5 - 67.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mr. Mime-Galar: 314-370 (130.2 - 153.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mr. Rime: 288-340 (79.1 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Frost Breath vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Alcremie on a critical hit: 207-244 (61.9 - 73%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 100 HP / 4 SpD Klinklang: 138-162 (48.2 - 56.6%) -- 39.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (some run more bulk too)
252 SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Arctovish: 186-220 (57.9 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Arctovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Glaceon: 199-235 (73.4 - 86.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

I won't go as in depth as I did with the last two mons as I felt those needed some serious explaining.

UR -> C+/B-

• Mawile is a good defensive check to a lot of physical attackers in the NU tier. It's pretty much an auto switch-in to Liepard, Unfezant, Ninjask, and Flapple. It also does a great job at checking Togedemaru and Silvally-Dark. With a Rocky Helmet, mons like Togedemaru and Ninjask get chipped every time they U-turn against it, which eventually can lead to your opponent flat out switching and having to predict instead using U-turn. It's a good check to physical fighting types like Sawk, where a CB Close Combat isn't even 2HKOing. It has good utility in Taunt, Toxic, Pain Split, Knock Off, Stealth Rock. It can run a variety of offensive moves fitting whatever your teams needs. -> Iron Head, Play Rough, and Seismic Toss.

If I made any mistakes or anything along those lines, feel free to correct me! Didn't mean for this to be so lengthy, but that's how it turned out. Thanks for reading!

 

[King Roma]

View attachment 243465UR -> B/B-
Let me put you guys on this behemoth. First off, what comes to mind with Basculin is more than likely a physical set. Well, in this case let me show you a special set which I think is much better in this meta. Since I'm nomming this mon as a whole, I will include both sets, but this post will be focusing on its special set.

Sets

Basculin @ Choice Specs
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Naive Nature
- Surf / Scald
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Mud Shot / Superpower / Aqua Jet

Basculin @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly / Naive Nature
- Liquidation / Waterfall
- Aqua Jet
- Superpower
- Ice Beam / Psychic Fangs / Taunt

• Physical Set: Liquidation or Waterfall is for your main stab. Liquidation has only slightly more base power, while Waterfall has that 30% chance to flinch. Aqua Jet is priority that dishes out good damage thanks to LO + Adaptability. Superpower is for mons like Drampa and Abomasnow. After running calcs, Beam is overall better than Ice Fangs. It hits mons like Eldegoss, Flapple, and even Appletun which eat Liquidations. Psychic Fangs is for Toxicroak and Taunt can be good to stop sweepers from setting up or to prevent hazards from being set.
• Special Set: I feel having two water moves is essential, as Hydro Pump doesn't have enough PP to be used on it's own and the accuracy isn't the best. Surf is offering more BP over Scald, but Scald could be run because of the burn chance. Hydro Pump is for a STRONG stab attack which is 330 BP (I think that's correct?). Ice beam is for grass mons such as Eldegoss, Appletun and the newly added Flapple. The last move can be whatever your team needs. Mud Shot hits mons like Toxicroak and is a safer option for mons like Lanturn. Superpower gets off good chip against Arctovish and Lapras, although Lapras isn't very common. Aqua Jet is a form of priority, which still hits decently hard thanks to Adaptability.

Lots of Calcs

252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 202-238 (58.7 - 69.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Surf vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 204-240 (63.7 - 75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 248-294 (77.5 - 91.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
You think your Clef is a switch in? LOL. 252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 164-194 (47.6 - 56.3%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire: 366-432 (92.8 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Abomasnow: 148-175 (46.1 - 54.5%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Rotom-Frost: 244-288 (101.2 - 119.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally-Water: 135-159 (40.7 - 48%) -- 64.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally that Pump hits neutrally: 270-318 (81.5 - 96%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Basculin Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Small: 164-193 (65.3 - 76.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Small: 268-316 (106.7 - 125.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Drampa: 228-270 (63.5 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eldegoss: 180-214 (55.5 - 66%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eldegoss: 136-160 (41.9 - 49.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Thick Fat Appletun: 256-304 (60.3 - 71.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Basculin Mud Shot vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Toxicroak: 184-218 (59.9 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

• There are very few switch-ins to this mon. A couple of those, bulky Wishi and bulky Lanturn, are still taking a good chunk. Both of these mons don't have reliable recovery option as well. RestTalk Wishi isn't very common and RestTalk Lanturn is even more uncommon. It has a good enough speed tier letting it outspeed Silvally's. Another thing about running special is it's somewhat of a surprise factor. Players will gladly switch in their Cofagrigus or Quagsire thinking it's physical. Special Basculin has very few switch-ins and you're forced to outplay your opponent by predicting if you don't carry one of its few switch-ins. Considering all of this, I think it deserves a spot on the VR. Sidenote: In my opinion, pairing this with a Stealth Rock setter and Spike and/or Toxic Spike setter works the best.

View attachment 243476UR -> C/C+

Set

Glaceon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Ice Beam / Frost Breath / Blizzard
- Water Pulse / Shadow Ball / Frost Breath / Blizzard
- Shadow Ball / Frost Breath / Blizzard

• Another underrated mon with limited switch-ins. With base 130 special attack, specs Glaceon fires off stab ice moves like it's nothing. The tier has a very limited amount of defensive steel and fire types, which makes this mon dangerous. Fire types aren't the best defensively and are in general very limited in NU. The only fire type switching into this without taking a good chunk is defensive Flareon. Same goes with steel types. Most of the steel types are offensive, thus only defensive Togedemaru is switching into it and not taking much. Bulkier Klinklang is a decent enough check as well. or klang... someone hop on the Klang wave with me... especially now that Flapple is here
• Running a timid or modest nature is up to you, but running timid allows you to not risk the speed tie with Golurk and allows you to outspeed Abomasnow and Sandaconda's creeped for Abomasnow. On the other hand, a modest nature allows for more power giving you a better match up against mons like specially defensive Stunfisk and Clefairy. You could also run 136 evs in HP which will allow you to live a Body Press from Cofagrigus after rocks. It also allows Galceon to take a EQ into Stone Edge from Sandaconda, providing it isn't heavily attack invested.
• Freeze-Dry is essential as it allows you to 2HKO or OHKO water types such as Lanturn, Wishi, and Silvally-Water. Ice Beam is for a stronger stab and has 100% accuracy unlike Frost Breath or Blizzard. Frost Breath can be used as it's good for random setup mons like Calm Mind Alcreamie. Blizzard is for more power, securing a 2HKO on mons like specially defensive Clefairy and OHKOs against Silvally where Blizzard hits neutrally. However, the accuracy can be a major drawback. Water Pulse is a good option for a common switch-in like Piloswine, which is 2HKO unless it's running a good amount of special defense. It also is doing a decent chunk to Flareon and even has a 75% chance OHKO Rapidash if modest. Shadow Ball is a good option for dealing with one switch-in checks to Glaceon such as Mr. Mime-Galar or Mr. Rime. Options like Toxic or Wish could serve some use too as well.

Lots of Calcs

252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Wishiwashi-School: 290-344 (98.6 - 117%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Wishiwashi-School: 266-314 (90.4 - 106.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Lanturn: 320-380 (70.4 - 83.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (i dont think anyone good would be running max spdef and hp but put to show the damage)
252 SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally-Water: 356-422 (107.5 - 127.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 283-334 (88.4 - 104.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cofagrigus: 231-273 (72.1 - 85.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 186-220 (54 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Frost Breath vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy on a critical hit: 153-181 (44.4 - 52.6%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Stunfisk-Galar: 238-282 (56.3 - 66.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Stunfisk-Galar: 195-231 (46.2 - 54.7%) -- 8.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Water Pulse vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Rapidash: 260-306 (95.9 - 112.9%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Rapidash: 145-171 (53.5 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Water Pulse vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Piloswine: 216-256 (53.4 - 63.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Blizzard vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Silvally that gets hit neutrally by Blizzard: 307-363 (92.7 - 109.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Togedemaru: 156-184 (57.5 - 67.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mr. Mime-Galar: 314-370 (130.2 - 153.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mr. Rime: 288-340 (79.1 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Frost Breath vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Alcremie on a critical hit: 207-244 (61.9 - 73%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Ice Beam vs. 100 HP / 4 SpD Klinklang: 138-162 (48.2 - 56.6%) -- 39.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (some run more bulk too)
252 SpA Choice Specs Glaceon Freeze-Dry vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Arctovish: 186-220 (57.9 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Arctovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Glaceon: 199-235 (73.4 - 86.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

I won't go as in depth as I did with the last two mons as I felt those needed some serious explaining.
View attachment 243526UR -> C+/B-

• Mawile is a good defensive check to a lot of physical attackers in the NU tier. It's pretty much an auto switch-in to Liepard, Unfezant, Ninjask, and Flapple. It also does a great job at checking Togedemaru and Silvally-Dark. With a Rocky Helmet, mons like Togedemaru and Ninjask get chipped every time they U-turn against it, which eventually can lead to your opponent flat out switching and having to predict instead using U-turn. It's a good check to physical fighting types like Sawk, where a CB Close Combat isn't even 2HKOing. It has good utility in Taunt, Toxic, Pain Split, Knock Off, Stealth Rock. It can run a variety of offensive moves fitting whatever your teams needs. -> Iron Head, Play Rough, and Seismic Toss.

If I made any mistakes or anything along those lines, feel free to correct me! Didn't mean for this to be so lengthy, but that's how it turned out. Thanks for reading!

Ya need replays, read da rules

 

[Finchinator]

Ya need replays, read da rules

I would prefer if you did not mini-mod in the future, but yes UBERLandon21 you do need replays to nominate a Pokemon to be ranked. I will let you keep the post up for the next 2-3 days so you have time to edit some in as evidence to back your nominations. Normally, I would just delete the post, but you put in a lot of time and effort it appears, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt to edit it in!

Also, the OP was updated with the last slate finally. Apologies for the delay; I have had my last week of college recently, but now I will be a lot more hands-on moving forward. It was only the OP being delayed thankfully, but expect a fully new slate in the next ~10-12 days, too!

 

[jcbc]

Time for another vr post, but first i want to say that i like how the meta is looking and the vr shows pre accurately the metagame (altho i think ninjask deserved better but this is not the topic i want to talk about today) as they are rn and with this said.

Mons that dropped from shifts​

Persian-Alola (rank it B+): Persian-Alola is a nice addition to the tier; having the best non scarfed speed tier added to the natural bulk and fur coat makes it a decent parting shot pivot. It also has decent coverage. And Nasty Plot sets can be quite surprising and threatning, overall it works very well on balance teams. Despite this, having no recovery and being kinda frail in spd makes it not the best pokemon.

Flapple (rank it into B+): The controversial apple that a lot of people feared when they heard it was dropping. It's been already a full weekand i barely see flapple to do enough in a game to get to a point to say ok this mon is uncheckable/unrevengable. It is true that versus more fat builds it does his job (as a good breaker should do) but having a not very good speed tier, not having any more coverage other than its stabs and being quite frail makes it do little to nothing versus most non fat teams. Again i want to point out that flapple is a good pokemon and is a nice addition to the tier, but the prominance of piloswine being really high in usage, having the rng.exe ability and the already mentioned flaws makes flapple to not be broken.

Dugtrio-Alola (rank it into A-): This pokemon is kinda one dimensional, but despite this, it is very good. SubTox stabs set can outright sweep teams in the late game if played correctly, the only real switchin is sandaconda. Good speed tier and good power creep, to bad the defenses are quite bad tho.

Rapidash (rank it into A+): ok the horse has no switchins at all, the coverage it has slaps everything, blitz, swords dance, morning sun and pick the other move from high horsepower/wild charge/Will-o-Wisp/flame charge is amazing, the speed tier is also very good and unlike silvally fire you can give yourself an item which is amazing, the base power it has is strong and there's nothing really that can revenge kill it.

I'm not going to talk about the rest of the drops because they just aren't worth talking to me maybe i change my mind but i doubt it

Rises​

Wishiwashi (from B to A-/A): Wishiwashi has proven himself to be a top pokemon this gen, the bulk it has added to leftovers is just amazing, and with no invesment at all, it hits harder than other fully invested pokemon. There's not much to say about this little but schooled fish that wasn't mentioned already in the posts before the update of the vr, i just felt the need to say i think it deserves to go higher than B.

Drops​

Indeedee-F (from A+ to A): Originally when this mon dropped it was everywhere and it had arguably no switchins but the metagame developed and while it's still a very good mon, is not as good anymore, compared to other specs breakers it got a bit behind, both abomasnow and drampa specially the latter are prime breakers rn.

Rotom-Frost (from A to A-): To me there's not much reason to keep rotom frost this high, compared to its other version, it has a less reliable stab, but not only this, as a defogger it's not that good while fan is one of the prime speed control in the tier rn, and as a NP sweeper relying on blizzard to hit is not good when you can just use fan and it every time.

 

[S1nn0hC0nfirm3d]

New drops, new VR post!

Rises:

UR > A
UR > B+
UR > B
UR > B- / C+

:gourgeist-small: B+ > A-
(dragon) B+ > A-
B > A-
B > A
B- > B+

Reasoning

Rapidash is probably the most relevant out of the new mons, as having a fast Fire-type for teams to abuse is great. I still think it has issues finding opportunities to clean and set up however due to its poor bulk and recoil, and its a lot better as a revenge killer. For its rare typing I do think its still great and relevant. On the topic, Silvally-Fire is a better wallbreaker / stallbreaker due to its Grass and Dragon coverage, so I don't think that should drop.

Flapple is a little underwhelming, and I can't recommend it over any of the more viable wallbreakers above B+. I might be biased in thinking that Hustle is just annoying to deal with, but its also the prevalence of so many offensive threats that pressure it that wasting its chance to wallbreak due to a miss is really annoying; that, and the fact Outrage can make it fodder to Clefairy if it snags a KO is super annoying. Doesn't help that it can't revenge kill one of the most relevant Ground-types in Piloswine due to Ice Shard either. The tier's established wallbreakers outclass it, and the niche due to its speed is what makes it worthwhile in B+ as is.

Persian is essentially a faster Skuntank with less coverage for its NP sets. There's a lot of merit here for its speed alone, but NP is a really cool cleaner / Stallbreaker with Taunt. Its a great pick for the ever coveted Dark-type that teams need for Indeedee-F, Cofag, and other Ghost-types to check. In the Skuntank is a bit better for reasons I'll clarify below, but Persian is still a great alternative.

Duggie is another pick I haven't been sold on at all so far. None of the innovations have been particularly effective, and it needs a lot of support. The typing, Tangling Hair, and speed are all very valuable though, and it can generate a good chunk of momentum for the right match up. Still hit or miss.

Gourg-S is a great offensive pick, and I also think the SubSeed sets can tear through teams unprepared for them. As the Vallys and midspeed wallbreakers get more popular, having Gourg there to revenge kill most of them is a blessing; what it does have trouble with, Explosion is a great work around, and is real effective when Ghost- and Steel-types are gone. I think the offensive coverage and support it gives HO is invaluable, and only its move choices limit it from outright sweeping teams.

SilvDragon's coverage is near unstoppable, and with special def Clef being 1HKO'd by a +2 Iron Head, there's not much else standing in its way for Multi Attack to sweep. It helps that Flame Charge lets it clean while also hitting Ferroseed, and then it only has to worry about some unfavorable phsy walls and Steel-types. Its very easy to support and is a top tier Silvally form and sweeper to watch out for.

Skuntank tears through bulky teams, and with Aurora Veil, a lot of speed control fails to touch it. Its NP set was relatively recently considered as standard, and it blows through defensive cores of Cofag, Goss, Clef, and Garb. Sandaconda has to be cautious of the LO sets, while bulky sets with Black Sludge and Veil support let it deal with Piloswine and Stunfisk a lot better. Faster support like the Rotoms and Gourg-S fail to break, while Sawk and Silvally forms on offensive teams can still be chipped heavily from Aftermath. Setting up on Indeedee, Silvally-Dark, and Cofa is another great pro against offensive teams. I think there's always some value to work Skuntank into your wincon due to these attributes, and it ends up being a great pick.

Wishi is turning out to be an absolute staple for teams. This is in part due to the realization that teams needed a reliable Fire-resist for Rapi and Silvfire, but it also has great MUs against the tier's Ground-types; on top of all that, no switch-in likes the possibility of Toxic and U-turn for pivoting. So many cores end up relying on Wishi, and its undoubtable a top tier for this support.

Dubwool dropped a little too far from where it was initially ranked, and I believe this was due to the playerbase being split between two sets: Substitute and RestTalk. While these strats are still alright, I believe its a lot more consistent for Dubwool to run a mix of RH, Rest, and offensive investment to supplement it best. It's still centralizing in the teambuilder, and it helps that so many special wallbreakers are weak to Fighting. This may come off as fishing, and sometimes it is, but there's a lot reliability from midground plays too. Checking almost all physical attackers while still sweeping past Indeedee, Abo, Drampa, and Rotom-F has got to be worth more than B-.

Drops:

B > C+
B- > C / UR
B- > C
C > UR

Resonings

Rapi is in many ways outclassed but the new and underused forms of speed control that the recent meta much more prefers. Galarian Rapidash is outclassed in many ways by its Kanto form in regards to the rarity and offensive pressure of the the Fire typing and its coverage, while galarian's typing and coverage has better examples and is relatively weak. It ends up being best surprisingly as a cleaner to teams that are unaware of its capabilities, but otherwise it fails to break way too many relevant phsycial walls / pivots. There isn't much that it accomplishes, and its typing / healing wish support is arguably done better by scarf indeedee, if not Mr Mime because at least that finds switch-ins to Drampa.

Appletun as a wall lacks purpose when there are more relevant Grass-type walls, and its sub Dragon-typing is a liability most of the time. It often fails to hit too hard, and its too weak to status while it can't status back, just Leech Seed. I don't see the merit in it, and it is very underused as is.

Drifblim also is all over the place with its sets, stuck between a very underwelming wall, outclassed unburden sweeper, and conditional florb wallbreaker. It is often hard to fit on teams with its defensive typing being targeted by way too many attackers, and its speed is just short of the relevant midspeed wallbreakers of Indeedee, Sawk, and Toxicroak. There's not much this is doing in any of its sets that its competition can't do more effectively.

There's no reason for Rime to be on the VR if g-mime is this low already. All the pros of its roll is done better by its prevo, as being faster is such a better opportunity to spin and revenge kill. Rime fails to do anything else significant, so it is utterly unclassed and not worth it in the least.

 

[Rabia]

What does RH stands for?

Rocky Helmet. In the future, please refrain from posting one-liners like this.

 

[Rabia]

don't have too much to say about the VR right now, but here's a nomination to gauge community response:

A+ -> S
So before the last slate, I mentioned how I would sooner increase the gap between Galarian Stunfisk's and Sandaconda's rankings before I would decrease it. Well, here's a nomination to go through with that. Sandaconda is the definition of splashable in terms of Stealth Rock setters. It realistically can fit on any sort of team archetype except maybe full stall/very defensive builds, which aren't particularly in favor currently anyhow. It checks so much of the upper echelon of threats: physical Toxicroak, Swords Dance Silvally formes not of the Water variety, Togedemaru, etc. all get vibe checked by Sandaconda, and having Glare limits the pool of reliable switch-ins to it. It also just synergizes so well with other common defensive Pokemon like Clefairy, Eldegoss, Cofagrigus, and Rotom-S. It was on the slate last time, and I voted against it then, but I think it's just continued to solidify its position at the top of the metagame.

some short comments on the new drops:
I'd probably rank this at about A- or A currently. I think the competition from Silvally-Fire is pretty fair and why I lean to an A- ranking more than an A, but the ability to run another Silvally variant on your team + an unrestricted item slot and useful ability give it a very established niche over the former.
I'd also probably put this at like A- right now. It's hard to switch into, but between Hustle, its lacking Speed, and its poor defensive typing, it's much easier to play around than something like, say, Durant in previous generations. I think more experimentation with Ripen Dragon Dance sets should be done; those are pretty cool.
I think B+ would be a fine spot to put this. Utility-based sets are nice. Yeah I really don't have a lot to say about this lol.
This guy can also go around like B or B+. The Speed + useful defensive typing let it soft check a fair amount of Pokemon, and SubToxic sets are generally great at disrupting the opposing team. It can be pretty hard to fit on teams admittedly, so I can see why it hasn't been getting as much usage at it maybe should.