Project SV PU Personal Viability Rankings

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WARNING: Raboot :raboot: wasn't among the icons so I used Oricorio-Baile :oricorio:

Not much to explain here. Here you have the two QDers :lilligant: :vivillon: and the flame dog :houndoom: and they still heavily restrict team building imho. Bringing any of these mons grants you a free advantage which is independent from the way you play the match.

S tier is composed of the most solid mons of the tier that are always able to accomplish something. Their typing is also a plus and they might have different sets that have to be handled accordingly. Magneton :magneton: can be bulky with eviolite or fast with scarf and Haunter :haunter: can be specs, scarfed, sub/will-o, sub-disable, Nasty plot or even a sort of lead with T-Spikes

This rank consists of very solid mons that are definitely staples of the tier, but which need extra care because, in some scenarios, the opponent can take advantage of them (like blocking duck's Rapid Spin :quaxwell: or exploiting Tuff's :tinkatuff: non-existent offensive presence). Pyroar :pyroar: is less problematic than Houndoom imho.

These mons are less splashable than the previous ones but they proved to be very good. Billy :squawkabilly: is a nuke, Crab :crabominable: is very strong and it's scary under Trick Room, Gabite :gabite: is a very annoying rocker, Misdreavus :misdreavus: is a bulky spinblocker and Rotom-Frost :rotom-frost: has the dangerous bolt-beam coverage.

These mons are good, but sometimes they might cause some disappointment. Raichu :Raichu: and Lycanroc-Midnight :Lycanroc-midnight: are underrated scarfers imho.
Regarding the most outlandish ones, I really appreciated the performance of Dugtrio:dugtrio: and Raboot :raboot:: the triple mole has amazing speed and Sword Dance is a huge buff; the rabbit is a really good pivot and can exploit its ability Libero very well because of its mono-type (a very spammable mono-type!)

Here you have mons that can work very well, but they need good support and they're less consistent than the previous ones.
In any case, as the meta adapts to deal with the S/A tier mons, these B+ ones might not be completely taken into account by the opponent in their team building, so you might gain an unexpected advantage (spinblocking Toedscool :toedscool: is more dangerous, Rotom-Fan :rotom-fan: has some different resistances compared to the fridge...). Camerupt :camerupt: checks the strong fire types of PU, but it's honestly not as good as they depict it. Rabsca :rabsca: is mandatory in Trick Room teams and can be detrimental if it revives Crabominable, but outside of that it doesn't shine.

These mons do effectively their job, but their job is not exactly necessary and vital: they're good picks in some teams.
I valued the annoying bulk of Oinkologne :oinkologne: and I think that Stonjourner :stonjourner: with Iron Defense/Body Press is underrated. Luxray :luxray:, Wugtrio :wugtrio:, Indeedee-F :Indeedee-F: and Flapple :flapple: are probably the most consistent ones in this group. Ampharos :Ampharos: bulk and phaser role shouldn't be overlooked though.

This rank includes mons with a useful niche or heavily outclassed by something else or with shaky efficiency (like Golduck :golduck:, Beartic :beartic:, Shroodle :shroodle: rain)

This rank includes mons that I've seen sometimes on the ladder doing something, but I can't say that I was impressed. Wigglytuff :Wigglytuff: provides the fairy type and rocks, Murkrow :murkrow: can haze stuff, Slaking :slaking: and Zweilous :Zweilous: are nukes, but very unreliable and exploitable

Here you have mons that have a niche, but that niche doesn't even make them sufficiently justifiable in your teams.

For example
- Sap Sipper Stantler :Stantler: and Girafarig :girafarig: or Insomnia Hypno :hypno: are immune to the sleep powder of the QDers (but you have to waste your tera too).
- Pikachu :pikachu: took a big hit by losing ESpeed and the special set doesn't help you much.
-The defogger Fletchinder :fletchinder: needs the HDB and so it loses lots of bulk.

These mons simply shouldn't be used
 
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LettuceLeaf07

*refreshes forums*
is a Pre-Contributor
I've never put an image onto Smogon before so idk if this is done correctly or not, but here's my tier list. This is objectively correct because I am currently 435th on ladder so I am the only real expert on the tier. Individual tiers are not ordered, and it's a tragedy that Meditite isn't on here.

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Some quick write-ups on like every mon:
I felt like there weren't any of these mons that stood out as S-tier, so I put them all into A-tier.
Crab is impossible to switch into, but possible to play around. It's kind of mid-risk high-reward, and it almost always gets a KO or 2.
I really like Houndoom. I think the dark STAB is better than anything Pyroar has, especially since nobody runs counters to the tier's 1 ghosts (grammar intentional).
Haunter is scary, but I find it easier to switch into and play around than Crab. 317 speed is good, but running sucker punch on literally anything (Houndoom for me) counts as a Haunter check.
Scarf Lycan is scarier, since no, your steel type is not a switch in to a potential stone edge.
I'm still scared of Magneton. I haven't seen it in a minute, but I don't think it's gotten easier to answer.
Quaxwell is the tier's ONLY good removal. It's not S because it's still a little passive and not actually a Crab check. That or I'm stubborn.
Finally, Stunky has sucker punch, Toxic, Tspikes, Fire to hit steels, good stats, and only one weakness. I've never used it, so it may be a little higher than it should be, but it doesn't suck.
I've been swept by Fraxure once. You have to prepare for it, or it will sneak up on you. Maybe I'm just salty from being swept by it.
Gogoat is everything I want it to be, except with fire coverage pre-tera. It can be a bulk-up wincon or a defensive wall to stuff like Raichu, Duggy, and Wuggy with milk drink, defensive stats, and its typing. BU + horn leech also just sits on Quaxwell.
Misdreavus is probably the best designated spinblocker. I think it's in a similar boat to Fraxure, where you need to consider it or be swept, but since I haven't been swept by it, Missy could be lower.
Squawk has one thing going for it, which is Guts Facade. It is either a nuke or an invitation to your Lycanroc or Raichu.
Viv does Viv things, such as sleep powder and quiver dance. I don't think it's meta defining like the A+ tiers, but it needs to be accounted for.
Raichu is fast, able to spam volt switch, and not walled by Camerupt. Win.
Duggy is your only option for a fast, offensive ground type.
Gabite is a good rocker and dragon tail and EQ are nice, but it has no recovery.
Someone once described Golduck as a 'jack of all trades, master of none.' I agree. Water is also very good in this meta.
I'm trusting whoever says Dragonair is good because I've never faced it.
Lilligant is discount Viv with a more wall-able typing, and I've seen it like twice. It doesn't take games, but a discount Viv is still a Viv.
Luxray is terrifying with it's agility facade set. I don't know why I don't see it more often because I think it's good. I've also never used it.
Pyroar is a discount Houndoom that comes at the opportunity cost of not using Houndoom. I heard it's good with specs? Also never used it.
Scarf Sawsbuck is actually good. I never get flinched by headbutt though. It also gets a ground move, so it's at least A-.
MEDITITE IS GOOD! It reaches an attack of 358 and (w/ scarf) a speed of 360, which outspeeds every non scarf threat besides Duggy/Wuggy. It does a lot of damage with stab cc, and you can click zen headbutt on a haunter switch. All it needs is that stab cc, since fighting resists don't exist really. It's also a fake scarfer, so think of it like a CB user.
Flapple. I heard it's good? I've never used it so I wouldn't know. It gets sucker punch, I think, which is not bad.
Ampharos is a slow volt switch user. It probably should be lower, but I keep thinking it works.
Cacturne is another mon I heard was good. I do not have the guts to use it, but it also has sucker punch.
Camerupt is hard to switch into, but it does NOT have the same opportunities as Crab does.
Drakloak has wisp, uturn, a Quaxwell-proof typing, and speed. I've faced it once, and something that can spam wisp is nice.
Hatt is a good hazard deterrent and an excellent TR setter. Healing Wish support is amazing.
I forgot Indeedee existed. It can't be thaaaat bad, right?
Perrserker is not everything you want in a steel type. It has an amazing support movepool though, so B+.
Rabsca is finally usable for more reasons than one. The second reason is trick room. I think trick room, in general, is very viable but shy of meta, so I think that's where Rabsca should be ranked.
Tink is so much fun because you put up rocks and cripple stuff with Twave + knock. The free-est knock in the tier.
Wuggy is worse than duggy, but still blazing fast, and water is a good offensive type in this meta.
Raboot is if Meditite played like a scarfer and not a CB user. It can check Crab and is just strong enough, but it does not have the power of Meditite.
These mons are fine, I guess.
Electrode is fine. Fast, can Tera Ice, but actually kinda easy to wall.
Falinks is bad. But no retreat + being fighting is enough for it to be ranked here.
Frogadier is underrated. Yes, Golduck is miles better, but don't forget about Frogadier.
Slaking is impossible to switch into, and might I say even usable. But it's Slaking.
I don't see Grumpig much anywhere. It isn't good into Houndoom, but I guess still usable as a defensive option.
Both Oinks are equal to me. They are by no means bad, but they lose to Crab, rely on rest for recovery, and aren't Quaxwell.
Scovillain is Fire + grass, which is what I want in Gogoat. I have never used or lost to a Scovillain in memory, so I don't know if this is lower than it deserves.
Sliggoo and Swalot are both good enough defensive options, I think. There is nothing wrong with them. But neither of them are Quaxwell.
I'm just trusting everyone that says Vigoroth is good here. I have never used it or faced it.
I haven't seen a Banette win games. It has knock, priority, and some other moves I guess.
Hail is kinda underrated and underexplored. The downside is Snover, while bulky with hail + evio, doesn't get veil. Your best bet is leech seed + protect. Or, even better, use crab and skip hail.
Carkol could be worse. Flame body is something.
Eiscue can sweep if you aren't prepared. IF.
Dartrix can actually sit there, spam knock, recover damage, and defog. It's typing is also horrible.
I guess you can use Girafarig?
Jumpluff is a fast sleeping pivot, or a weak fast SD sweeper. Idk which is better, but it's not like that matters much.
Persian is a fake out + uturn bot with twave and taunt. Not bad, but it's not Quaxwell or Tink.
Shroodle is only good for setting weather and parting shot. You could also just have Golduck set its own weather. It may be good on sun?
I still believe in Scarf Stonjourner from SS. I have not used or faced this thing. Maybe wonder room could work?
Dunsparce, if you're going to be weak to fighting, don't also hand out a free invite to Crab.
At least Corvisquire isn't 4x rock weak.
I don't think Mareanie or Glimmet should be used over Stunktank. But you can?
Hippopotas exists. Sand is probably the worst weather, because who is going to abuse it? Dugtrio who can't switch in? Sudowudo? Stonjourner? At least it can set rocks and do other things, of which I am not going to name.
Hypno is Grumpig but worse, so not good.
I think Leafeon is under explored, but it does have NO movepool, and is probably that much worse than Gogoat.
Lummy, as much as I hate on it, is not UR worthy. I have been hurt by a LO storm drain hydro pump exactly once. Once. Don't use it unless you are crying at Cacturne's speed stat and lack of u-turn.
Mudbray seems slightly usable, as a ground type, but nobody has tried yet.
I always think Oranguru is better than it looks. It looks UR, so I think it's C. I implore you to try it, since this thing is kinda bulky.
Pawniard gets sucker punch, I guess.
Stantler is not untier garbage, but I cannot tell you what it does. Sap sipper??? Worse Girafarig/Sawsbuck? Remind you of Wyrdeer?
Toedscool is a cut above the spinners that should never ever be used. Which is here.
Wigglytuff is a fairy. It's not a good fairy, but unless you count tera Missy, tink, or Dedenne, it's our only one. It's kinda like Oranguru, so it's better than what you think it is, which puts it in C rank.
Frankly, I don't know if anyone made Flareon's 130 atk work with guts, trailblaze, and tera normal facade. I don't know if it would, either.
Some people say Glaceon is good, and I can see Freeze Dry being good, but I have never seen this thing. I would go C, but I expect anyone who has seen this thing to disagree.
Murkrow does not get Defog, but it can prankster roost and haze. Is that good? probably not, but you can try it
I have no opinions on either Rotom form. I think Raichu is better because speed, and I think the Rotom forms are probably better than my (overranked) Ampharos, but I haven't seen one do more than click volt switch or trick once.
I will tell you Sneasel is good. I will. Once it gets its moves back, and as soon as someone can sweep with trailblaze + sd. It has potential, especially if you forget Weavile is RU.
Bramblin? It can spinblock AND spin. cOol. Now someone actually use it.
Delibird. Best Present abuser, lost defog but still has spin. Gets Freeze Dry and hustle. Is Delibird.
Don't use Fletchinder. If you want flame body removal, use Carkol. Don't use a 4x rock weak NFE defogger.
Krickitune = webs. Webs are not good enough, but I guess they aren't unusable?
Morgrem = screens. Screens are not good enough, but I guess they aren't unuusable?
Pincurchin is weird. You can run eterrain or lightning rod, and people can argue that either are viable. I'll let them aruge. I don't think it's good, but I cannot discount the fact that it technically has a niche one way or another.
I've seen a Bronzor once. If you want rocks + tr + steel beam, Bronzor exists. If.
UberSkitty what is that last one?
Look, all of these are bad. They are either Sunflora-esque, outclassed (goth), or NFE mons that have not proven themselves. If you can tell me why any of these are more usable than Toedscool, Wigglytuff, or Hypno, without still being outclassed, I'll consider ranking them.
 
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Didn't find Pikachu I put it on B-

S
Magneton -> for me the best mon in the tier. Insane bulk and nice offenses (both for specs sturdy and eviolite analytic) + momentum. Almost every team needs an hard check/counter (or another magneton). Still 4x weakness saves it from brokenness

A+
Houndoom -> versatile attacker with good matchup against sun and quite a lot of other things
Skuntank -> toxic spikes on such a solid mon is crazy good. Super splashable
Quaxwell -> single-handedly allowed SV PU to become random focus sash: the tier. Not S because it's kinda passive and magneton walks over it.
Perrseker -> priority, rocks and u-turn with good attack make it the #2best steel in PU. (And a prime member of the random focus sash club)
Haunter -> fast hard hitter with 3 immunities. Our miniature pre-nerf Gengar. (And another prime member of the random focus sash club)

A
Dugtrio -> effective lead/revenge killer/late game sweeper that shapes the metagame with its insane speed coupled with a rare typing (ground) and move (stealth rock). Quaxwell is an hard counter but a good teammate too (yes, he's a sash user)
Gabite -> a bulkier ground type stealth rocker. Dragon tail and the ability to check most magnetons is what makes it A
Lycanrock -> Another mon on the list of extremely effective sashers. But it's also a good scarfer. Theoretically grants 100% accurate stone edges but still I fear it misses everytime
Squaqwabilly (I don't care if spelled wrong) -> hits so hard it's ridicolous, while having stab priority + u-turn
Vivillion -> Guess what? A sasher. This time it sweeps your team and makes at least one of your mons fall asleep. It's really frail and that's the only thing that makes it (somewhat) manageable. Giving only A because it has some degree of 4MSS but I can see the point of A+ or even a ban.
Crabominable -> bulky (expecially with AV) wallbreaker . Shines with tera but doesn't need it. Drain punch recovery makes it annoying to face. Can sweep teams with TR up.

A-
Camerupt -> hard counters magneton (except tera water) and blanket checks a large portion of the meta, while setting up rocks. And on TR it's a menace.
Hattrem -> enables trick room to be a viable playstile if it wants too. If it doesn't it's still got one of the best abilities in the game paired with insane bulk
Leafeon -> tera fire tera blast under sun is S+ (if you run sun without it you're running it wrong) but you need to dedicate your tera and run sun, greatly limiting your options. Without tera blast it's better as a defensive mon.
Liligant -> Comparable to vivillion, but has arguably worse movepool and ability. Compensates with a better typing and bulk. Needs tera most of the times.
Gogoat -> solid defensive mon / bulky attacker. Sap sipper is ridicously good paired with tera.
Falinks -> First impression and no retreat are 2 very viable sets, expecially with the scarcity of good fighting types.
Pyroar -> Frail, fast attacker, faces competition with houndoom but differentiates itself with extra speed and slightly better bulk.
Rotom -F -> best rotom. Bolt beam is awesome. Sadly one of the super-rare bolt beam resists is also the best mon in the tier and a direct competitor.
Tinkatuff -> bulky annoyer that can set up stealth rock. Most people put it higher but despite its plethora of tools to cripple the opponent its offenses are really bad and it doesn't have viable recovery. Still an extra-solid choice

B+
Flareon -> has 2 good abilities. One day I swear I'll run it with tera normal fire orb because it really dies fast with toxic orb + flare blitz. Flash fire is arguably better
Fraxure -> good typing, quite solid bulk, first impression and DD. Arguably best dragon dancer
Raichu -> hard magneton check, with very good speed and offenses. Super frail but guess what? focus sash
Mismagius -> if you really want your opponent not to spin away your rocks that's the way to go
Murkrow -> best manual weather setter in the tier. Brave bird hits decently hard (even uninvested) and it's got other good moves like u-turn, haze, taunt. Sadly heat (or damp) rock means no eviolite
Persian -> unleashes powerful fake outs against the plethora of sashers and frail mons in the tier, while outspeeding most of them. It can set weather too.
Sawsbuck -> serene grace is an annoying ability
Scovillian -> best non-tera sun sweeper. It's really frail and needs a growth boost to sweep teams for real. Can't do anything outside sun.
Raboot -> best protean clone user. It his surprisingly hard while being surprisingly bulky (with eviolite) and fast.
Ampharos -> a special wall (with phasing capabilities) that can hit hard too and even threaten a sweep with agility.
Wugtrio -> Triple dive hits hard (laughing on sashes), and it's fast. It's also super frail.
Rotom-F -> worse than S, but it has a better defensive typing even with levitate meme.

B
dedenne -> fast annoyer that can paralyze and pivot. Both the best grounds in the tier are 2HKOed on the switch. Camerupt has a way better matchup
golduck -> best rain sweeper, decent scarfer, and kinda good anti-sun mon with cloud nine.
glaceon -> hits hard while providing some degree of defensive utility
rabsca -> expecially good on TR , can work on other playstyles. It hits really, really hard.
Flapple -> you fear it while you face it. You fear it more while you use it.
glimmet -> insane ability but there are mons setting tspikes while actually being good (Skuntank).
dragonair -> our dragonite
kricketune -> webs mean you have to run it. There's no alternative.
indedeedee-F -> crazy that his brother might get to OU. Here she doesn't enable dangerous sweepers but can still get some work done on its own
frogadier -> spikes differentiate it from raboot
banette -> it's got a random sash, I know it, you know it. Destiny bond is super annoying.
carkol -> if you really want a spinner that doesn't invite magneton in (and has rocks too)
grumpig -> insane bulk paired with thick fat and good support movepool. Good weather setter.

B-
cacturne -> spiker with priority. Of course it's got a sash.
beartic -> good rain sweeper, best (and only) hail sweeper
greedient -> its bulk is ridicoulous and it's got a wonderful ability. I'm okay in putting it higher but I find it quite passive
drakloak -> i didn't see that much from it, but I can be convinced it's stronger.
mareanie -> another good tspikes option
dunsparce -> bulk and more bulk (+ recovery)
hippopotas -> sand can break sturdy and sashes. But most sashers and sturdy mons don't care. And there are no sand abusers because someone in the OU council decided to ban houndstone and not last respects. (still, it's likely NU would have taken it anyways).
pinchurichin -> good tspikes option, sadly its terrain isn't that useful. EDIT: On the other hand, its other ability hard counters magneton in the hardest way possible. It can be B/B-
seviper -> I've seen some of them in the (middle to high) ladder. It's not completely clear to me why to use it instead of skuntank. Glare?
sneasel -> I've seen very few of them. I feel it could be higher than this, possibly even A/A-, but I haven't got enough proof about it and it's not a key part of the current meta (at least on the ladder).
zweilous -> kind of outclassed by flapple, it differentiates itself enough
luxray -> It can hit quite hard and now has trailblaze I think
vigoroth -> Can threaten a sweep with bulk up and it's got the stats to back it up. Suffers 4MSS.
Pikachu -> hard hitting fake out + very good offenses, but it's extremely frail and not that fast.

C
shroodle -> nice anti sweep button but it's very frail. Arguably a noob trap
sligoo -> it should have some niche
toedscool -> lots of good moves but they go last
snover -> you have to run it for hail. Or just run rain if you like beartic
bramblin -> does it spin? I don't remember
mudbray -> I guess it should have isurprising physical bulk
girafarig -> didn't see it enough to rank it better than C. Psychic competition is real but it's got nice bulk, decent offenses and NP/agility, so I guess it's ok if you put it higher
dartrix -> defog. No other reason to use it
morgrem -> enables dual screens as a playstyle, but I didn't see it at all. Is light clay banned?
fletchinder -> appreciates hazard removal being easy in the tier
pawniard -> didn't see it on the ladder. It could be better than C but I dunno
bronzor -> bulky rocks setter, it's quite passive
stonejourner -> I had some fun with weakness policy, but ... you've got Stone edge that doesn't miss + more speed in lycanrock. But I'm open to ranking it higher, its physical bulk is amazing.
sudowoodo -> can be a decent lead. Sets rocks and threatens quaxwell on the switch with wood hammer
swalot -> good bulk, stockpile, but what does it actually do?
tropius -> anyone who plays randbats know this mon can be a pain to face if you can't OHKO it.
wigglituff -> decent rock setter choice. Sadly a set of rocks + wish + protect + dazzling gleam is super passive (and I'm not sure it's legal).


No explanation for URs, except for
eiscue: I could put it in C but it's a noob trap
slaking: same as above
zorua: same as above
delibird: same as above
slowpoke: I could see it have some niche but saw none on the ladder
oinkologne: greedient arguably outclasses it as a stuff cheecker. But it's faster and can run salac, so maybe there could be some niche
donald trump: to frail
glalie: wait for moody unban. Then realize it's outclassed by scovillian.

NFEs and LC mons lmissing from the tier list look all like UR to me except for pikachu. Maybe krokorock could have a niche (B-/C) too. I've seen people using it and intimidate is good, but it faces severe competition from gabite and dugtrio. EDIT: meditite too should be rankable
 
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Thanks to the update on the tier list, the pa'u ban and overall refinement of understanding of the tier, I decided to give the list a re-do.

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Organised all my tiers alphabetically because the idea of committing to exact places ain't it. I'll speak about some key mons below.

One comment I have on the meta overall is that it's still pretty overwhelmingly offensive despite a couple bans, walls essentially don't exist and for the most part we've replaced them with bulky offensive mons that can take a hit and threaten back. Spamming Tera wallbreakers and setup mons is still the prime strategy of choice.

S - The outliers, strongest pokemon in the tier and most likely to be looked at for a ban.
Haunter :haunter: is the most versatile mon in the tier with several incredibly good sets.
Magneton :magneton: is a meta warping threat also with a couple sets you have to prepare for.
Vivillon :vivillon: is the most problematic mon in the tier and also the most feast or famine.
--
A+ - Meta definers, mons it'd be hard not to justify having 2+ of on a team.
Tera Water Golduck :golduck: is the hardest mon to switch in to in the whole tier.
Quaxwell :quaxwell: is not just the only good hazard control in the tier it's also a threat and a decent tank in its own right.
Skuntank :skuntank: is borderline S tier the way it's so essential to teams.

A - Glue mons and top threats.
Camerupt :camerupt: continues to be one of the most essential mons in the tier despite the doubters.
Gabite :gabite: is a fantastic mixture of defensive utility and threat.
Tinkatuff :tinkatuff: has surprised a lot of us by surpassing Perrserker as the premier defensive steel.

A- - Great mons with some marginal flaws that stop them from taking over.
Grumpig :grumpig: has proven to be a consistent defensive and offensive threat at this point, it's threatened by some crucial mons but at least it threatens back.
Lilligant :lilligant: is a bit of an outlier here as despite its potential broken status it remains somewhat unproven.
Rabsca :rabsca: might be the least used incredible mon in the tier, it is so threatening with TR and/or CM sets and can come in on a lot of stuff.
Squawkabilly :squawkabilly: continues to be feast or famine like Vivillon is but tends to famine a little more often than the broken butterfly.
--
B+ - Borderline A tier mons with a clear place in the tier but some clear factors restricting their effectiveness.
Dragonair :dragonair: is the most reliable priority in the tier which is crucial, but doesn't hit quite hard enough.
Indeedee :indeedee: might become a spammable mon at some point but the A tiers have so many switch ins for it right now.
Misdreavus :misdreavus:, the most reliable spinblocker but it's so limited and linear in its capacity.

B - Clear niches with more limited application.
Frogadier :frogadier: surprisingly effective spiker and pivot.
Hattrem :hattrem: might be better than this if Healing Wish is a bigger deal but right now it's strong utility that struggles to threaten.
Rotom-Fan :rotom-fan: is finding itself a little outclassed by upper tiers but is still usable.
Shroodle :shroodle: rain is quite polarised but Shroodle is clearly the best setter for it.

B- - These mons have some niche that either remains less proven or struggles somewhat against the meta.
Falinks :falinks: has some solid revenging with its CB set, not seeing much use but has high potential imo.
Glalie :glalie: is a spiker that beats Quaxwell which alone is a niche, too bad about literally everything else about it.
Glimmet :glimmet: has a clear place in the meta but teams are preparing quite hard for t-spikes and it's pretty linear especially needing support from another linear mon in Misdreavus.
Oranguru :oranguru: OTR is an underrated set right now. It's the only TR/NP mon with low enough speed to run the set and the flexibility of STAB Tera Blast is quite nice.

I'll stop writing so much here but basically C tier is fully unproven but may have potential, or a tiny niche. UR for me demonstrates mons that just won't see serious play without major meta shifts imo.
 

EonX

Battle Soul
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Ok, I finally got around to doing one of these. Probably not 100% accurate, but here's my overall thoughts. Tried to order as best I could, especially in higher ranks.

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S-rank: The best in their given role, easiest to place on teams, and potentially broken in some cases.

Vivillon: Probably the craziest Pokemon in the tier. It Quivers and wins unless you have priority.
Houndoom: Another silly mon that can either set up and win or clean late game with Scarf Tera Dark Pulses.
Gogoat: By far and away the best bulky booster. Not broken, but very easy to place on teams as a SpDef tank + late-game win con.
Gabite: I feel this is our best Rocker. It's a Mag deterent, chips away at Quaxwell, can set up SD, and phazes. Every team needs a Ground rn; this is easily the best one.
Lycanroc-Midnight: Best Scarfer and best Bander in the tier. It either cleans like nothing else or deletes stuff like nothing else. It can even set Rocks if you need it to, but why waste time Rocking when you can just kill stuff?
Tinkatuff: It's utility, the Pokemon. Great defensive typing, 3 of the best moves in the whole game (Knock, Rocks, T-Wave) and Encore to trump setup so it isn't too vulnerable. For balance teams, this is a top pick imo. Offense probably wants Gabite

A-ranks: Extremely good Pokemon; potentially broken in very specific cases. Otherwise, generally only outclassed by S-rank mons or have minor flaws that keep them from running over the meta reliably.

Pyroar: Houndoom with a higher Speed tier and less spammable secondary STAB. Bonus points for Tera Blast acting as Normal STAB pre-Tera to free up a moveslot it would otherwise use for coverage on Boots sets. Specs is delete button strong, but hazards suck.
Magneton: Potentially broken? Super strong breaker with bulk. Can have issues getting in on offensive teams, but that's really it's only major drawback. Scarf might work.
Haunter: Very dangerous, but very squishy. Wishes Normal moves were more common. Strong Speed tier for setup sets and Specs sets. Best Ghost on offense.
Quaxwell: Best hazard removal in the tier. Misdreavus usage increasing knocks it out of S imo, but it's still very good and the absolute best in its role.
Rotom-Frost: Faster Mag with more potent offensive typing in exchange for worse defensive typing. Placing it in the same tier as Mag for its sweeping potential.
Misdreavus: Easily the top spinblocker in the tier. Can pose an offensive threat with Plot / CM sets and can stallbreak with Taunt + Wisp + Hex sets. Similar to Quaxwell, best in its given role by a mile.
Perrserker: Generally worse than Tinka imo, but has way more offensive potential. Band hurts btw. Tera Fighting Tough Claws CC is a massive nuke. Wishes it had more Speed.
Crabominable: Reliance on Tera keeps it from going higher imo, but it's very good. Wishes its hazard removal options were better. Probably has to run Boots on sets it would want AV on.
Dugtrio: Very potent late-game sweeper with SD. EdgeQuake is stronk and Sucker can beat Scarfers. Generally needs VoltTurn teammates to get in safely because bulk doesn't exist. Really good Speed tier
Lilligant: It's basically Vivillon at home in every way. It's still super good. Only reason it isn't higher is because Viv is the most broken mon in the tier and its main competition. Why use this when there's Viv?
Sawsbuck: Powerful physical sweeper with a Ghost immunity. Serene Grace shenanigans can win games outright and Tera coverage beats Steels.
Cacturne: Probably the best offensive Spiker in the tier. Too many faster mons resistant to Sucker for it to reliably SD tho. Absoluely blanks Quaxwell w/o Brave Bird, so Spikes are staying until it switches out
Indeedee-F: Very solid Choice user. Healing Wish on Scarf gives it great utility. Can opt for Tera Fairy Dazzling Gleam or go the Pyroar route with Tera Blast as Normal STAB and then coverage when needed. Specs is a strong enough breaker with Terrain
Skuntank: Great overall utility mon. Nothing special, but generally can take 1-2 hits and force damage or KOs somewhere. Offensive Tera Ground sets can stick it to Steels and block Volt from Mag.

B-ranks: Generally solid Pokemon that are easy to fit onto teams for certain roles, role compression, etc. Generally outclassed by S and A mons, but still should be accounted for in teambuilding. Easily capable of punishing unprepared teams. Won't list all mons in these ranks.

Squawkabilly: Strong Scarfer that really wishes hazard control was more reliable. Guts sets are a thing, but suffers similar issues to Scarf.
Raichu: Super fast Electric sweeper and Lightning Rod blocks opposing Volt Switches. Really frail on the physical side in particular and the best Scarfer is physical.
Electrode: Fastest unboosted mon in the tier and can set weather reliably for Golduck or Scovillan. Wishes it had more Special Attack to be a better standalone mon, but being the most reliable weather setter when Golduck and Scovillan are solid is worth a lot imo.
Raboot: Sneaky good Fire-type. Generally outclassed by Doom and Pyroar, but can break with good utility in U-Turn and Sucker Punch. Non-existent bulk hurts, but no reliance on Tera helps.
Glaceon: Underrated mon that hits pretty dang hard rn. Trailblaze can fix its Speed issues and the tier is not well equipped to handle Ice + Tera Ground defensively. Initial Speed and horrible defensive typing keep it down here.
Golduck & Scovillan: The best sweepers in their respective weathers. Don't work well enough as standalone sweepers to be higher as they generally require a setter so that they can run full coverage and / or a boosting move.
Pincurchin: SpDef handles Mag and other Electrics quite well if they aren't Tera Ground (which you can Surf for good damage) and has Recover to stick around. Spikes pushes damage onto the opposing team and Quaxwell isn't a fan of it. So Spikes are sticking around a few turns at worst
Rotom-Fan & Wugtrio: Worse versions of Rotom-Frost and Dugtrio respectively. Fine Pokemon in and of themselves.
Camerupt: A Ground neutral to Rocks is rough and Gabite generally does better at handling Electrics. Yawn can slow up boosting threats and Lava Plume burns aren't bad
Fraxure: Powerful breaker, but wishes it had a better speed tier to be more consistent and less reliant on First Impression.
Vigoroth & Sneasel: Niche sweepers that can punish teams lacking good responses to them. Vig messes up teams that are slower with limited damage options. Sneasel's high Speed tier can rough up faster teams lacking an Ice resist.
Grumpig & Oinkologne-F: Situational special tanks that can step up to handle the likes of Pyroar, Glaceon, and Houndoom thanks to Thick Fat and good special bulk. Probably want Tera Fairy for Houndoom.
Stonjourner & Sudowoodo: Stealth Rock users that lack the utility of Tinkatuff or Gabite. Offensively, they're outclassed by Lycan-Midnight. Role compress resistances to Normal, Flying, and Fire with a Stealth Rock user.
Leafeon: Decent Sun sweeper, but is otherwise entirely outclassed by Sawsbuck who can run Tera specifically for Steels thanks to Normal STAB hitting other Grass resists for neutral.

C-ranks: Extremely niche Pokemon. Typically outclassed by a pretty significant margin, but may have a small role on specific teams to warrant sparing usage.

Drakloak: Blanks Quaxwell's STAB due to its secondary Dragon typing and has Wisp to cripple it. Misdreavus's access to boosting moves gives it way, way more utility outside of spinblocking.
Luxray: Looks good on paper, but then you see Magneton and Squawkabilly. Better than Flareon as a Guts user at least and most Grounds can't handle boosted Facades as they're typically SpDef invested while Steels get trucked by Wild Charge.
Dragonair: Shed Skin makes SpDef RestTalk useful and it can spread T-Wave as well. General lack of offensive pressure from such a set makes it inconsistent and offensive sets are too reliant on Tera to be consistent. The most common Scarfer also resisting ESpeed doesn't help this case
Flareon: Wish, good SpDef, Lava Plume to spread burns. Seems fine. Wait, what's our hazard control? Oh, it has to run Boots and probably needs to Tera for a better defensive type? Yeah, too easy to pressure as a defensive mon and too slow to reliably use Guts. Flash Fire Tera Fairy Tera Blast makes Houndoom cry itself to sleep for what it's worth...
Dartrix + Bramblin: You might be pressed into using these for hazard removal. Grass sucks defensively though; you probably want a different type. Using Tera on your hazard removal is too restricting, but what other options do you have if you have another Water on your team already?
Murkrow + Shroodle: Secondary weather setters, but full weather teams are inconsistent at best. Prankster is cute.
Hippopotas & Snover: Auto-weather setters. Hippo can also set rocks and has Slack Off for healing. Blocks Volt Switch, but what is it doing offensively? Snover can set up Beartic, but 2 Ice-types on a team is sketch.
Mudbray: You might be pressed to use this, but why is this over Gabite? Maybe you want to phaze through Sub? Probably gets Taunted by Missy... and burned. At least its EQ will KO something uninvested, which Hippo can't do all the time

Unranked: Pokemon that I feel have no place in the current meta. They are either wholly outclassed by something else or are simply so bad that you shouldn't consider them, even if you're desperate.

Ampharos: Magneton is just better in every way. If you need full bulk out of your Electric, use Pincurchin's Spikes and reliable recovery over Ampharos.
Fletchinder, Corvisquire, Carkoal & Delibird: Hazard removal options that are generally deathly afraid of Knock Off, which isn't good with Tinkatuff being so solid. Cacturne, the top offensive spiker, also harasses these into Roosting and Pincurchin, the top defensive spiker, doesn't care about anything they can do to it.
Kricketune: It has Sticky Web and Taunt! Oh, its stats are horrendous... rip and Quaxwell probably walls at least one offensive threat on the team.

/end text wall
 
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just gonna do a quick rundown of some mons throughout the tiers, sorry if I type like a schizo, A- and up are ranked in their tier but obv theres a lot of nuance.

S: Magneton and Vivillon both feel incredibly oppressive, Magneton more than Viv imo mostly cause theres a lack of electric checks that dont get bopped by tera water or want to take an analytic flash cannon. Overall it feels like it takes 2 mons minimum to even handle it. Viv is self explainable theres little checks without tera and priority and it easily runs away with games

S-: Lilligant is in a similar spot as Viv but since its slower its a tad easier to revenge also theres more checks to Giga + Rock tera aka steel types / Gogoat it might be broken later but rn I believed its outshined. Houndoom is incredibly powerful and easy to slap on teams Trail Blaze+NP being the best set nothing really counters this mon outside of spdef quax which can still lose at +2 with tera grass and potential flinches or tera fairy Grumpig it has little issues chipping its counters by itself though. Skuntank is incredibly splashable having so much set variety and a strong sucker being so nice in this tier.

A+: Haunters strong but it struggles to come in and a lot of mons can take a hit and threaten it can also sometimes feel like its missing LO if you're not running it, but it has lots of set variety and the incredibly potent tspikes. RotomF is similar to Magneton nothing wants to switchin and it always forces a ton of pressure through volt. Quaxwell is our best hazard control and while teams can easily take advantage of it its still a must on a lot of teams. Gabite also incredibly splashable with spdef dtail being a nice emergency check to most of the tier, easily my favorite and most consistent rocker, Offensive Rocks is also incredibly difficult to deal with at times.

A: Gogoat is very strong rn spdef tera rock is very helpful vs a lot of top threats. Lycanroc is an incredible scarfer that finds itself cleaning games very easily. Golduck in rain is stupid to deal with outside of it, its trash imo. Grumpig is something people might be surprised I have so high but its a nice pivot into RotomF and Pyroar if you're spdef and Tera Fairy helps with Houndoom. NP sets are also pretty good as with earthpower and solid bulk its hard to revenge or even one shot.

A-: I've found Hattrem to be incredibly reliable both HW sets and Psychic, Nuzzle Restalk as it can struggle with longevity trying to check hazards. Sawsbuck is a great scarfer and headbutt gets you out of a lot of bad situations. Pinch is rated so high because it has the incredibly annoying spikes / tspikes and the only magneton counter (until it tera grounds). Rotom-S is nice NP sets are hard to switchinto and it has Zapdos typing but it relies on Tera more than other electrics, but dont sleep on it.

B+: Leafeons incredibly potent on sun and even has viability with wish tera water sets outside of it can rely on its tera though due to its limited movepool and mid defensive typing. Glimmlet is something thats picked up steam lately and justifiably so Hazards are so strong and Spdef is nice for Houndoom + Pyroar. Drakloak DD sets are okay but I think its restalk sets with wisp on spikestack are where it shines.

No Clue: Glaceons been getting a lot of hype lately haven't used or seen it so I can't say. Dragonair has dropped off a fair bit for me maybe rest talk sets are potent I'd put it somewhere in B. No clue about oinkologne. Rabsca is something I think is relatively untested OTR, CM 2 Atks could be nice.

- the rest of the mons are self-explanatory and idr feel like going over all the tiers and these rankings are a little more nuanced.
 
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After reclaiming #1 on ladder I decided that I'll give my VR/meta takes post Pa'u ban. Won't be saying something about every single mon just a few that I want to mention in the S/A Ranks.

S Rank -
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-
Only mon that I consider to be problematic with the tier as of currently. The ability to run three very viable sets, alongside it's very good choice of abilities, almost unwallable volt switch thanks to tera, and extremely high SpA pushes Magneton over the edge for me. Although I do believe Scarf and Specs sets are far more manageable than Eviolite sets, they are still very very good and I personally don't believe that the tier has the right tools to deal with this mon as the only hard walls (Camerupt+Pincurchin) get smashed by tera blast whether water or ground. It also can legit fit on any build because of its extremely useful typing+once again set variability+volt switch so yeah I'm heavily pro ban on this.
- Houndoom is also very good but I don't consider it broken. Although it does lack defensive switchins that resists its dual stabs (only Zweillous) there are plethora of walls that can still handle it defensively including but not limited to Quaxwell, tera'd Gogoat, Camerupt, tera'd Grumpig, and Dunsparce. Furthermore, it's frailty makes it so susceptible to the plethora of priority in the tier and while it's speed tier is pretty good, it still finds itself outsped by top tier mons like Raichu, Dugtrio, and Pyroar. Outside of this, Houndoom is extremely good though. It's strong special attack, amazing STAB combination, and ability to run so many teras/sets (although I do think scarf is kinda a waste) makes Houndoom the best, non-broken, mon in the tier.

A+ Rank -
-
Super underwhelming as of late but still very good. Unwallable STABs (well skuntank but that dies to +2 focus blast), great special attack, and great utility options (wisp+hex, sub+encore/disable etc). Scarf is probably my favorite set because of its ability to outspeed and trick the QDers+being a great cleaner thanks to its immunity to Fake Out/Quick Attack and once again, good STAB options
- I won't speak for the rest of the council but I think? they're mostly still on the same page with me on this. Personally, I don't think neither Vivillon or Lilligant are broken in any means. They are both extremely reliant on Tera, easily revenge killed with priority/faster Scarfers, and are still walled by a lot of things pre and post tera (tera'd Gogoat, Sliggoo, Rotoms for Vivillon and Steels/Fires for Lilligant depending on whether its Tera Rock or Ice). That being said, they are still very good sweepers that can easily win if they are well played, especially with Sleep Powder, but I think there is a lot of things that limit both of them. Personally, I rank Lilligant slightly higher than Vivillon just because its faster lmao
- Misdreavus is so good right now it's kinda insane thanks to its ability to basically perma spinblock Quaxwell, the only great removal in the tier making spike stack a very scary playstyle. I think at one point in the future I can see it being broken of this alongside the fact that it can run so many different sets but we're not quite there yet.

A Rank -
- Some of you might think I'm psycho for putting Fraxure at A rank but it's criminal how underrate this thing is. DD sets are almost unstoppable if it can get to +2 which it frequently can thanks to its already great typing + ability to tera to steel/fairy. The primary drawback to DD sets is that it's so ungodly slow that its slower than all scarfers at +1 but once again, I don't find it to be that difficult to get to +2 and atp it OHKOs basically the entire tier with Dclaw/Tantrum/Iron Head. It's poor bulk is also a drawback but that's kinda patched up with Eviolite. Tinkatuff being the only viable pre-tera fairy makes CB dclaw/outrage so spammable alongside the fact that it has access to First Impression that, paired with tera bug, gives it the strongest priority attack in the tier. Very good mon should be used more.
- Best rocker in the tier thanks to amazing utility in Knock Off, Thunder Wave, and Encore. Great typing, really good bulk, and very easy to fit on teams. Love this mon rn
- Fell off kinda hard after Pa'u ban in my opinion. AV sets are still very good and pretty good checks to the amazing special attackers after Tera but it's awful defensive typing pre-Tera is such a drawback since I rarely ever want to waste my tera on the crab. I think it's gonna continue to fall off as the tier progresses.

A- Rank -
-
Another criminally underrated Pokemon. I've seen so many people only use Rabsca for the sole purpose of Full Trick Room or Revival Blessing (both very niche and bad ideas) whereas the very good set is 3 atks with recover or trick room as the last move. Unwallable combination with really strong special attack and ironically decent typing for the tier even though being weak to Houndoom, Vivillon, and Haunter kinda blows. It's a strong cleaner end game with trick room which is easy to set up with thanks to its bulk, also saw someone pair it with terrain extender Indeedee and once it set up TR and tera psychic'd i got my ass handed to me. Even without Trick Room, however, it's still a great breaker with Recover
- Yep, urchin in A- rank. Thanks to walling Magneton with Lightning Rod pre tera (and post tera if you decide you want to tera the urchin), also walling Raichu/Rotom-Fan/sort of Vivillon, access to Spikes that Quaxwell doesn't come in to spin on, pretty decent bulk, and the ability to spread paras with Discharge makes the urchin very useful to me

- stop using this please there's actually 0 reason to use it over Lycanroc-Midnight as a scarfer/band user/offensive rocker and if you want to use it for defensive rocks just use Sudowoodo
 
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Here's my list to kick things off! I haven't played a crazy amount of the tier so the ranks from B+ down are probably pretty (very) dicey! I added in a broken rank for the Pokemon that I think are currently unhealthy in the tier, namely Oricorio-Pa'u, Haunter and Houndoom. In S rank I have Perr and Gogoat as I think they're the most splashable Pokemon in the tier and just really consistent regardless of what team they end up on. A+ is a little bare but I do think Mag, Crab and Skunk really separate themselves from the Pokemon below them. Again, you know exactly what you're getting from them and they'll consistently perform well. A and A- are kind of a toss up because I feel like I need more experience with a lot of these to properly placement but I'm fairly comfortable with the placing for now. The B ranks are just a massive toss up it's really hard to tell with a lot of these Pokemon if they're actually good or not, and some of these placements are based off of my experiences with these Pokemon in previous generations.

Not the most comprehensive list and I'd love to give more of a fleshed out analysis if I could but I definitely need to play more to do so. Mainly just wanted to get this up to give an example for a first post. Happy posting everyone and I can't wait to see what you all come up with!
Personally, Fraxure is actually a hidden gem that can sweep really well late or mid game. I think B+ or even A- would work.
Also, Shroodle is an amazing disrupter and weather setter, def deserves higher than C.
 
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My personal tier list:
Ban list: Broken mon that compress team building a lot. Few checks that are beaten by diferent Tera-type/Blast. Any QD outside of Lilligant need to go ASAP
S Tier: Meta defining mons. Both Crab and Indeedee-F can be suspect/banned but still are too good and they help the tier more often that destroying it
A Tier: Great mons overrall.
B Tier: Good mons. Weather could be toxic sometimes.
C Tier: Niche Mons. Outclassed or small enought niche. Only reason Kricketune exist in C bc he is the only Full Evolved Sticky Web Setter Still Trash
What makes Magneton and fucking Vigoroth with its 80 base attack banworthy?
 

asa

is a Site Content Manageris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
PU Leader
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Thanks again for stopping me from writing the rest of my long-ass VR post (for now). I think this is mostly self-explanatory minus the occasional nuclear take (Basculin and Honchkrow are frauds, but at least Basc punishes you for building badly), so I'll only talk about some of the rankings.

Skuntank is still number 1 to me. It brings a lot to teams in one slot without being niche whatsoever and never feels like deadweight in any matchup. Even though Hisuian Qwilfish is better defensively, Skuntank feels less predictable, is a little more consistent, and has more outs in bad situations. Also, it feels too soon to say that Qwil is just better or equally as good as Skuntank. That said, I'm willing to keep an open mind about this and see how things develop for both Pokemon.

Charizard is probably number 2 for similar reasons: never feels like deadweight, very flexible, and hard to predict. On top of this, nothing punishes you for guessing wrong harder than Charizard, and it is the offensive threat regardless of its set. Special sets have to contend with low accuracy on every move besides Flamethrower and Air Slash, though, and physical sets can sometimes take a few turns to really get going. Random defensive Teras can also screw it over because of its relative frailty.


I don't think our VR needs an S- rank, but since this is personalized, I included it for two Pokemon in particular: Gabite and Misdreavus. These two are very consistent and offer plenty to teams, though they're a cut below Skuntank and Charizard for me.

Gabite's useful resistances and immunity to Volt Switch are massive, and Hattrem getting less and less common means there's not much to stop it from Stealth Rock at least once. Even with no recovery, taking Gabite down reliably can be very hard, and it's good at both trading with frailer threats and forcing chip against physical attackers. Dragon Tail is insanely punishing to switch into, especially with how good Spikes are, and the best Fairy-type in the tier (Tinkatuff) wants nothing to do with Earthquake. Swords Dance is really good against bulkier teams too, though it's getting harder to pull off with the meta getting faster and stronger. Overall, I find Gabite nicely ties a lot of teams together and will almost always do something for your team. Rotom-F dropping is really unfortunate for it, since blocking its Volt Switch is way harder for Gabite, but one Pokemon isn't enough to ruin its viability.

Misdreavus isn't as dominant as it was before, and blocking Rapid Spin isn't quite as useful anymore, but it's still very annoying to deal with. Like Gabite, cleanly OHKOing Misdreavus is really difficult, especially since it almost always has either Pain Split or Draining Kiss. Defensive sets are good at stopping opponents from gaining too much momentum, while offensive sets can steal entire games under the right conditions. That said, basically every team has both a Dark-type and Fire-type while Normal-types are steadily getting more common, all of which can limit the progress Misdreavus makes. Offensive sets also don't get free turns like they used to, and moves like Taunt and Encore that tend to stop Misdreavus in its tracks are easier to fit on teams than ever.


Hisuian Qwilfish isn't quite S-rank material for me, but it definitely is (depending on the set ofc) the new best Spiker, a really good setup sweeper, and a decent choice for rain. Doing all of this while being very sound defensively and forcing chip like little else puts it in A+ for me.

Rotom-F is, imo, the best offensive pivot around rn, and it's very easy to build teams that fold against it without even trying. Very flexible in what it can do while also having some decent defensive uses and patching up team weaknesses pretty well thanks to Tera.

Hisuian Sliggoo just turns some teams off so to speak, crazy how only having two real Fighting-types and a handful of Ground-types will do that. Curse + RestTalk is cracked and definitely the best set, though there might be merit to other stuff like specially offensive sets. In general, its defensive presence is amazing and accidentally giving it free turns is easier than you'd think.

Zangoose is about as good as Squawkabilly, though I will say that Zangoose feels way harder to use due to being slower and frailer, dying faster, and having fewer points of entry. Depending on how many turns you get right with it, Zangoose will either feel like Igglybuff or Extreme Killer Arceus. Despite that, this thing can be very hard to play around without a Ghost-type, and it is noticeably stronger than Squawkabilly.

I don't have anything interesting to say about Thwackey. Choice Scarf is decent, Heavy-Duty Boots could be okay, and Swords Dance feels awkward and not good. There aren't as many sweepers that take advantage of Grassy Terrain as there were last gen, though the passive recovery is still nice. Losing Grassy Slide was also really bad and makes out-offensing Thwackey pretty easy. All in all, kind of just a disappointing Pokemon that doesn't do very much, but I wouldn't count it out just yet.


Golduck is super fire even without rain, give it a try if you haven't.

Use Crabominable more, it is very good versus so many teams.

Honchkrow is not good. Physical is easier to play around than ever, special is legit just worse Charizard/Houndoom. You can build weak to this and still win against it without much effort.

I swear Camerupt isn't complete garbage :D

Quaxwell is bad more often than not, let the poor thing go.

Fraxure might be ok maybe? Not CB, though.
 

Bella

Why can't we just pretend?
is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogon
So, noticed its been awhile since this thread has been used and wanted to share my takes, Lets talk about this!
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Everything ordered btw.
If anyone wants to discuss a mon you feel that was unfairly ranked i am open to being @d in PU cord about or in the PU room :3
 

LettuceLeaf07

*refreshes forums*
is a Pre-Contributor
Decided to give this a go. Tiers are ordered.

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S: Misdreavus and Gogoat are the best 2 mons in the tier.

A+: Carbink and Haunter are close behind Misdreavus and Gogoat. I didn't put them in S because Carbink may be forcing more things to run a steel move, but that's it, and so many things outspeed Haunter that I think it can't be S tier. Klawf is also up here because I think its set diversity makes it hard to counter. I don't have experience with Whiscash or Persian.

A: A-Dugg and Perr are here because Carbink and Haunter make steel types really cool in this meta. Skuntank stocks should be going up with Haunter around being a Poison that can't remove tspikes. Raichu and Rotom-f are both fast, electric, and have coverage moves; the difference is Rotom-f is slower but stronger. I don't have experience with Masquerain, but I think QD will find a way despite the rock types.

A-: Crab is a pokemon I forget about until it's in my face and being annoying. Dachsbun is the only fairy type that isn't Carbink, has wish, and is fast. Indeedee is a mon I haven't used in a minute, but it should be good into Haunter. I put the 3 special fire types together because I haven't used or lost to any of them in a while. They kind of run together for me rn, with one being Zard, one being fast, and one being dark. They don't like the meta being Rock and Water type, and they don't like the best grass type being a good tera abuser. Rotom-fan is worse than the ice one. Chansey and Tink are about the same, with one being a SpD wall and the other having a typing.

B+: Electrode is fast. That's it. It's a good tera abuser too. I sleep on flapple because I now understand it is deadly and not usually 80% accurate, but I still haven't used it. Zangoose can be deadly but is kinda slow and Quick Attack isn't E-speed. Golduck is deadly. Of the mons above it, double dance duck only really loses to Gogoat, Chansey, or a lot of chip (I mean a lot). Gabite, Dug, and Lycanroc all feel like relics of a past meta. They're not bad, but they're outclassed now. Scarf Lycan also doesn't like being outsped by Electrode. Sawsbuck and Honchkrow have always felt like options, which is why they're here. I put Spiritomb at the bottom of B+ because it's usable, but that may be the new toy syndrome talking.

B: Someone mentioned Lumineon stocks being on the rise post-cunogate, so I put it here. Sliggoo-h is gonna struggle with our steels and taunts. Dartrix is best removal, but unless Leaf Storm + Knock means it isn't passive, it's just B tier. Ampharos is a slow pivot, and I can see its steel resistance becoming useful in an ideal world. Dunsparce. Glaceon is Discount Cuno, if you wanted 80% off of the defensive capabilities. It gets freeze dry. Camerupt is not that good rn and I haven't seen it in forever. Finally, Squawk is outclassed by Zangoose, but still has roost and parting shot over it.

B-: Idk what Banette does but it gets knock and priority. Calyrex, Rabsca, and Wyrdeer(?) are slow special sweepers who usually run stored power, and due to their similarities, I put them together. I love how Glimmet that Glimmet is, because sometimes you need one team slot just dedicated to hazards. Not a meta pick, but very useful on the right team. Leafeon seems to be on the rise for some reason. Quaxwell is meh, because Encore + spin can only get you so far. I do heavily disagree with it being lower, however. I dislike Falinks and I think it's bad and exploitable, but you can always catch someone off guard. Scovillian is the Golduck of sun, and I don't think that it's as effective, but it is a valid pick. Finally, I decided to appease last generation me by not putting Thwackey in C tier.

C: These are mons that I wouldn't be utterly confused finding on ladder. Interesting picks, but still very much valid.
 

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