Metagame SV RU Metagame Discussion (Enamorus-Therian banned, see post #235)

The first thing I want to point out is that Forretress has no recovery. It is absolutely debilitating since it is a team's hazard control that is vulnerable to both Stealth Rock and Spikes. Assault Vest Cyclizar shares this hazard vulnerability, but it also has access to Regenerator, which allows Cyclizar to shrug off hazards damage consistently. Because of this complete absence of recovery, Forretress is forced to run Leftovers as to not be worn down too quickly, which means no Boots to switch into hazards.
Not to detract from your point (which I wholeheartedly agree on, forretress usage NEEDS to stop), but Forretress does have a form of recovery in Pain Split, which can pressure bulkier teams due to its relatively low HP while also working against offense by virtue of Sturdy + Rapid Spin. A more usable forre set would be:

:forretress:
Forretress @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 168 HP / 252 Def / 88 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 Spe
- Rapid Spin
- Pain Split
- Volt Switch
- Body Press

the 30 speed IVs are to get the slow volt switch on other ferros, since they're common enough for that interaction to be viable (sadly). Honestly, hazards on this guy are kinda bad, since you sacrifice a LOT of momentum on them and are exploited by anything with a lighter in its vicinity.

Honestly, if people want role compression with its spinner, Brambleghast is right there:

:Brambleghast:
Brambleghast @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Wind Rider
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Spikes
- Strength Sap/Power Whip
- Poltergeist/Shadow Sneak

You can compress a spinblocker, a spinner AND spikes support while also having some incredible damage potential against mons like Slowbro. Wind Rider also means standard Hippo has no viable options against you, since Whirlwind will give you an attack boost (or Roar you, I guess :smogonbird: ). Yeah, your sustain is non existent, but it's not like people were picking Forre to stay on the field forever anyway.

In conclusion: Ladder, PLEASE, STOP USING FORRE ;-;
 

FlamingoPokeman

I SHOULD BE BANNED
is a Tiering Contributor
I can no longer sit idly by while my guy :forretress: gets slandered and made fun of by people who clearly lack the insight and team-building prowess to make use of the ULTIMATE role compression mon.
1711027355293.png
People often fail to recognize that Forretress is much more than a slow pivot with access to rocks and spin - this lovable guy has a bevy of options at his disposal and can comfortably slot onto most team structures if used properly. Allow me to elaborate:

:forretress: #1 - BP / EQ / Pain Split / Toxic Spikes - This particular set is the anti-HO mon. Capable of comfortably switching into Mimikyu and Revavroom, Forre here can establish a layer of Toxic Spikes before BP into EQ kills the Revavroom, effectively shutting down HO and setup mons in their tracks as most teams only run one Poison type. In the event you run into a non-HO structure, Tspikes remain incredibly useful, BP can blow up opposing Cyclizars, and EQ/Pain Split are comfortable coverage to catch somewhat obvious predicts such as Gengar or Okidogi coming in to remove the establish Tspike.

:forretress: #2 - BP / Lunge / Spin / Rocks - This more common set opts for Lunge over Volt to shut down setup sweepers while retaining the Hazard Control role.

:forretress: #3 - BP / Spin / Spikes / Volt - Another common set but with Spikes over Rocks, pairs comfortably with a Rocks setter to dominate the Hazard Control game.

:forretress: #4 - BP / Counter / Spin / Rocks - Counter??? WHAT??? This set tries to establish rocks before eating something like a boosted Okidogi Drain / Knock or Revavroom Iron Head / HHP and threatening an OHKO back.

:forretress: #5 - Gyro Ball / Spin / Thunder Wave / Toxic Spikes - Gyro Ball is nice coverage for stuff like Agility Enam (run that more, too), Thunder Wave and Tspikes dominate the Status game and Spin is comfortable here.

:forretress: #6 - Explosion / Iron Head / Spikes / Rocks - Double Hazard setter with Custap to boom and get your setup sweeper in for free? Iron Head for decent damage output? Sign me up!

Ultimately, Forre remains incredibly good at what it does, which is filling multiple roles at once while also having the coverage to establish whatever Hazards your team needs. Thunder Wave / Spikes / Rocks / Tspikes is insanely good utility and people are definitely underestimating my guy :forretress:.
 

LBN

Tournament Banned
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
UPL Champion
Time for some Sleeper Threats Showcase. I'll be posting on some pokemon I think are under-valued, and showcase em a bit cuz whynot. ...Also BAN HOOPA OH MY GOD THIS MON IS DUMBBBBB

Normal.png

I apologize for my prior disrespect. Thundurus-T with a higher speed tier, Aura Sphere for Cyclizar memes, and Scald for Hippowdon? Say less. Annoyed by amoonguss but between you and me that mon is shit and vileplume clears. That aside, CM Discharge/Tbolt Aura Scald is a good ass set, and it's good at soft checking Thundy-T to boot. It's a solid enough Volt switcher aswell, though CM is definitely the selling point. Use it, it's very good at what it tries to do right now.

Normal (1).png

I promise you all this. Noivern still got it. Volcanion check? Yes. Faster than Cyclizar? Yessir. U-Turn bot? AYE CAPTAIN. Not a momentum sink like punk ass mence? Oh yes, you speaking my language. Unironically, I think this thing is easier to splash on a team than Salamence is. It's blanked by Fezandipiti, but U-turn fixes that issue easily as long as you got summ that fucks w it, which isn't a huge ask. It's got some variety to its kit, Taunt, Hurricane/Draco etc. I've used it multiple times in RULT playoffs and it's performed quite well for me. Is it better than Salamence? ...I think it's on par. Salamence is much less of a paper weight, and invested special mence is quite dangerous w draco spam, but Noivern is a team player for anybody who doesn't need Cyclizar to spin. And truth be told, Cyclizar is quite exploitable between things like Sticky Webs Araquanid, Discharge Electrics like Thundy-T, Raikou and Rotom-Heat, and wisphex gar can make it even weaker than it usually is. Noivern isn't as good into the electrics overall, but there are ways to deal with that, (like your own Raikou woahh). Truth me, slap this thing on a balance and you will like what you see. Infernape check btw.

Normal (3).png

I was right to call this thing A rank. Special sets with Meteor beam SR are a neat way to let hippowdon not run rocks, and since alot of people go hard hippo on a Necrozma rn fearing DD, special photon doing like 64 to phys def hippo is a huge value. DD is also effective, Zarude being gone is a boon, though Hoopa-U being around is annoying for the special set, DD sets just Knock/X-Scizzor it out of the game p easily. Great HO wincon which imo does the job better than Mew on HO thanks to the bulk and power. Definitely a pokemon who will continue to get better as time goes on.

Normal (4).png

You guys remember Specs Pelippers from SS? Doing like 55 to Pex with a raw Hurricane? How it was very surprisingly strong despite being p meager otherwise? Yeah well that applies to Politoed too. I used specs Politoed in RULT playoffs vs PCD, and it cleaned the end game extremely easily. Volcanion and Empoleon both get cleaved by Earth power, the latter can be potentially 2 tapped with a specs tera water weather ball, and Cyclizar takes a mind boggling 55 from a weather ball with Tera, and Ice beam does roughly 74% on average. It's a nuke that's not bad atall, and sometimes Drizzle can apply decent team utility if your creative, like with a Hurricane Mence in the back, though I wouldn't use this set on dedicated rain. Zarude being gone is very nice for it, and alot of times you can find openings from Cyclizars bringing it in, and it's natural bulk can usually give it a chance to put in damage consistently.
I used it on the team below, with the prior mentioned Noivern and Necrozma, aswell as a static bellibolt to provide static support to cripple Cyclizars. Feel free to spam this on ladder, Noivern Shall Be RU Soon Enough.
https://pokepast.es/01597ad78f3b9bbf

Normal (5).png

This pokemon is S rank and I'm so serious. It's so fucking good man. Fairy resists are fairly meager alot of the time, it's a fantastic scarfer, gives good options vs Rain. Good on HO, good on BO, good on Offense, it's fucking great. Trick support, HWish, Psychic Noise can catch Moltres off guard, moonblast is fairly spammable, you can run things like Aura Sphere/Focus blast for coverage, Tera fairy moonblast mops games so fuckin easily it looks like janitorial work. Trust me when I say this mon is nuts. Any cobalion team gotta rock a fire or something to keep it down cuz this pokemon is so good at forcing the advantage or simply taking it back. Genuinely top 2, only behind Cobalion itself, and Fezandipiti isn't far behind imo.

As for the tier as a whole, this is what I think the tier is looking like overall. Not ordered within tier outside of S and S-. Its 2:40am so imma check out now, so peace
download.png
 
Not a super long post, but I've been experimenting on ladder to find what I find fun (set up sweepers are my bane istg, here's looking at you blastoise) (hoopa-U too, I love mispredicting the set and losing a key defensive piece). However, I think I've found something of note. A pokemon that I hated back then for how oppressive it is, but may be interesting now... It's yet another offensive Poison type!
The one... the only...
:sv/toxtricity:Toxtricity!

And particularly, two pokemon I've found to match pretty well with it. See, Toxtricity thrives off of kicking you while you're down. It's great at either sweeping games, or just chunking holes in the other team. Now see, we don't have Blissey in the tier anymore. And, special walls are pretty sparse, which is exactly what Toxtricity wants. Additionally, two Pokemon have been added to the tier, which help facilitate Toxtricity's reign of terror: Gengar, and Araquanid. Both of these help do one thing: Reduce speed. Gengar I've been using with a hex set w/ t-wave, and araquanid with it's sample set. This ensures that you can beat most standard cyclizars, since you can spinblock / paralyze em, and outspeed w/ teammates to take em out. Toxtricity
then can clean up and take advantage of the slower opposing team to outspeed faster offensive threats, and continue to bully slower mons as it's always done.
The team probably needs some work, but the idea of a paraspam/webs team that uses toxtricity and other threats that are slow(er) and enjoy moving first could honestly be solid imo

feel free to say that i'm a total idiot in response if you disagree with any of these points and think that i should stop yapping
 
This is a post containing personal thoughts about some mons. nothing more, nothing less.

Miscellaneous

:pmd/maushold::pmd/cinccino:
I'm actually content with their presence in the tier, unlike a good portion of the playerbase. While yes, I do agree that it breaches cheese territory, the fact that their existence encourages the use of 1 Rocky Helmet is a good thing overall and anything that disincentivizes 6 Boots spam is a positive in my book. Whether their almost exclusive presence in HO is due to the mons themselves or the HO elements surrounding them, I do not know and I would like some of your input on that, people.

:pmd/breloom:
As a Moltres enjoyer, I really don't like this thing. I don't wanna roll the lottery on which move it's gonna click. That's it. I wouldn't be as mad if Amoonguss wasn't so mid, then I wouldn't have to try to justify using a subpar mon for 1 specific niche mu. Fortunately, it's not the best into BO, but as a Balanced enjoyer, I shit myself a little when I see it at preview.

:pmd/moltres:
My goat. Lots of variety in Tera, moveslots, Nature and EV spreads lets it cover anything you need, Flame Body is an amazing ability that lets Moltres act as a Maushold/Cinccino/Triple Axel punisher among the dozen of applications it has. imo a top 5 mon rn.

:pmd/hippowdon:
Overrated. It's great against ladder bullshit but gets abused to no end against actual good teams. It sucks, as a ladder warrior I feel obligated to put it in my teams and I love it until I face a good player and it just acts as a glorified momentum absorber in a pinch that just serves as prime setup bait against the most dangerous high-level setup sweepers like Ghost IDBP Coba and fat BU Oki.


Broken bullsh*t !

:pmd/thundurus-therian:
Hoopa-U is getting a lot of talk, but this right here is my number 1 choice for a suspect test. It threatens entire Balance cores just by existing and doesn't even need a damage boosting item to do so, it can run Boots and still threaten anything and everything while having a clean 101 Speed tier allowing it to outspeed the sea of 80 and 85 base speed mons in the tier. The only thing keeping in from being quickban material is AV Cyclizar + Scarf Gardevoir cores which can play mindgames around it kind of reliably, but even that is a maybe since Sludge bomb hits both and you REALLY don't want your Cyclizar to get poisoned from that. Add to this the unpredictability of the sets, between Boots pivot, Specs and Nasty Plot, all with different Teras, AND its ease at making progress thanks to Knock Off + Taunt + Volt Switch AND its specific but great defensive profile thanks to an immunty to Ground and Electric, and you have one of the most dominant and influential Pokemon in the tier. It made Electrics disappear from RU and if bulky waters are largely extinct (outside of Empoleon but that's really because it's a Steel-type, the Water part of it is not what makes it popular), it is because of it and Iron Leaves's presence in the tier. Thundurus-T can be played around and there is counterplay, but he absolutely 100% deserves to be the next suspect test. Speaking of suspect tests...

:pmd/hoopa-unbound:
Suspect worthy... after a few other bans. Overrated rn, ppl would make you believe it's some kind of almighty god who 6-0s teams. Really, it's a Speed problem. I do think that a suspect test for Hoopa-U is also 100% warranted but in my mind, it's just not to the level of Thundurus-T. Teams are already forced to play aggressively because of the threat saturation to where we play as to not lose first, which is the exact opposite of what Hoopa-U wants. I already covered Hoopa-U in one of my previous posts on here, feel free to read that for my opinion on Hoopa-U. This is my number 4 contender for a suspect test. Moving on to my number 2 suspect contender...

:pmd/iron_leaves:
I have been on the no ban camp for a while when it comes to Iron Leaves, but I recently (finally) changed opinion. It is my contender for suspect number 2 for the following reasons:
  • Teambuilder constraining
  • Shaky counterplay Iron Leaves can work around
  • Deceptively tanky despite susceptibility to hazards and questionable defensive typing
  • Gatekeeps too much
  • Gets too strong too fast
In this case, teambuilder constraining stems from the limited pool of defensive play. Moltres is its best answer but Tera Fire quickly makes it a 50/50 on whether you hit Hurricane. Outside of this, Iron Leaves forces Tera out of the defender so Hippo can Whirlwind/Amoonguss and Wo-Chien can Foul Play.
Deceptively tanky is self-explanatory. 90/88/108 is good bulk for a quick setup sweeper like Iron Leaves and it even runs some HP EVs due to Quark Drive math. Its Grass/Psychic typing also means that it resists both Crawdaunt's Aqua Jet and Breloom's Mach Punch, which makes it that much harder to revenge kill.
The gatekeeping part is also quite simple to understand: It makes any scarfer under 105 base Speed difficult to justify.
Thanks to Booster, Iron Leaves only needs 1 turn to Swords Dance and get to +2/+1, making defensive counterplay that much more difficult to pull off.

I believe that if RU wasn't such a threat-saturated tier, prepping against Iron Leaves would be a reasonable goal; However, in a tier where it is next to impossible to have tools for every situation to a reasonable extent, having to dedicate multiple slots and Teras specifically for Iron Leaves adds just enough pressure on the builder that I would call it unhealthy. Oh well, I actually liked playing with and against this mon, but... even I cannot cover its ass anymore.

:pmd/kleavor::pmd/revavroom::pmd/mimikyu:
The faces of HO. Revavroom singlehandedly makes playing against HO miserable, cannot be outsped after a Shift Gear, then the game becomes fuckin dnd: just roll 5 dice and see what happens. It might just hit every Gunk Shot and flinch on every Iron Head and might run the coverage move and Tera that beats your answer to it. It's not as pressing as my first 2 suspect candidates but Revavroom definitely deserves its place of number 3 suspect contender.

:pmd/enamorus-therian:
Will become broken when the tier eventually slows down after some bans. Games are just a little too fast for it right now.


Top 10

I'm interested in what everyone's ordered list of what they believe the top 10 mons in the tier are (Cyclizar not included). I'll post mine to start things off:
:thundurus-therian: > :iron_leaves: > :okidogi: > :cobalion: >:moltres: > :enamorus-therian: > :revavroom: > :zoroark-hisui: > :gengar: > :gardevoir:





elec-ant u r idot
 
Last edited:

HoopsspooH

ZARDOZ
is a Tiering Contributor
I want to give my opinion on the current meta with the help of the survey that was just released regarding RU at the moment.

How enjoyable do you find the current SV RU tier? I gave this a 9 at the time, although 8 or 7 might be more accurate. I currently enjoy the meta very much right now, and while there are a lot of the same cores roaming around tournaments and ladder, I still believe that there is so much exploration that can be done, and that personally makes teambuilding and playing for me extremely fun. There are so many fun things to use in both this tier and NU, and while there are definitely a few overbearing things in the tier, I feel like we are in a pretty decent place in terms of enjoyability.

How competitive do you find the current SV RU tier? Think I said 7 here. Overall I have found the tier to be decently competitive while I was in RULT, never felt like the worse player won, but there are definitely some things that push this idea in the tier. Overall pretty good, and you can build around the broken stuff, but not at the peak it could be.

What is your opinion on Hoopa-Unbound in the current metagame? Answered 4 here. I think that Hoopa is the most broken thing in the tier right now, very easily able to break essentially any team with the right set and moves coming off of outrageous base attacking stats. Hoopa does undoubtedly have some flaws though, the most obvious being a subpar speed stat that allows its non-scarf sets to be outrun by some of the best mons in the tier, and with pretty abysmal physical bull and defensive typing, it’s not that hard to RK on paper. That isn’t necessarily the case in practice though against a well built team that is able to easily cover for Hoopa’s weaknesses while abusing its insane power. Hoopa just warps the meta around it to an insane degree, I brought an Alolan Muk to a game as a Hoopa counter, which isn’t the case if it uses a banded set, which has a more than probable chance to 2HKO after rocks and sand chip with Hyperspace Fury. Anyways, I definitely think that there is some forms of counterplay to Hoopa, and I will be sad to see my free win mon leave the tier, but overall I do think that it would be for the best.


What is your opinion on Thundurus-Therian in the current metagame? I said 4, however I feel like I don’t have enough experience with or against it to have a super valid opinion on it. It does have pretty insane damage output, but in my mind I feel like it’s even more a usable than Hoopa, because it lacks any form of recovery, while also not having any super outstanding bulk like Hoopa does specially. I still do think that it sounds pretty great on paper, I just don’t have the proper experience to be super confident with my opinion.

What is your opinion on Enamorus-Therian in the current metagame? I said either a 3 or 2, I’m not entirely sold on Enamorus yet, like, what does it do against Moltres. I’ll have to see how it develops, but currently I feel like it doesn’t feel like a very pressing problem, I could be completely wrong, but that’s just how I view it right now.

What is your opinion on Iron Leaves in the current metagame? I said 2 at the time, but after viewing some recent games I could definitely move it up to like a 3. I think most booster energy stuff is pretty stupid, so I wouldn’t mind to see the most prominent user in the tier gone. It’s main weakness
is being kind of slow after losing the speed boost, and it doesn’t have the greatest damage output without a SD, but if played right, it can definitely win games with ease. Tera exemplifies this problem, but it also works against it as it’s pretty easily to RK after a well timed tera. Not entirely sure on it, would like to see how it develops in RUPL.

What is your opinion on Revavroom in the current metagame? 2, I’ve kinda joined the no ban train over the past week or so for Rev, as I feel like we have much more counterplay to it now that the meta has developed a bit. Things like Hippo commonly run SE which shuts down the easy setup that it would use in the past. You need extremely specific teras to break through things that the opponent might not even bring. I think that it it’s still pretty good, just not as broken as it seemed before when HO ruled the tier. Also, secret tech, use Scarf Vroom, it’s the goat.

I don’t think that anything else is outright busted in the tier right now, and I’m really excited to see how it develops now that all the DLC are over.
 
Voted around an 8 for likeability of the tier, and around an 8 for competitiveness. I don't put much stock in these kind of numbers personally unless it skews really severely to one side or the other, a point or 2 difference between these scores feels pretty insignificant.

I think the survey was interesting, forces you to put a number down on certain Pokemon, which lets you have a nice shorthand for how you felt about a Pokemon in the tier at a certain point in time. I think surveys in general should come out pretty frequently, not because we need to "Do Something" about whatever was voted the highest that...month? every 2 months? ( I'm not sure what an appropriate time frame would be, but I feel its around there.) It just helps us see what people are thinking at the moment, even if it's not always a good representation of how people will feel later.

4s :Thundurus_Therian: , :Hoopa-Unbound: , I believe I voted 4s for the Thundurus-T Hoopa-U duo, maybe a 5 on Thundurus but I'd say 4 right now. Both absurdly strong with Thundurus trading the godly mixed attacking stats and monster SpD of Hoopa for merely amazing stats, better speed, and a better defensive typing with an absurdly strong pivot move. That strong volt switch or tbolt+u-turn make this such a pivotal mon for maintaining momentum, removing items, and it even can stay alive and eat a few strong resisted hits before dying. Well played or not, Thundurus is devastating against an opponent that doesn't have a specific counter to it. I feel like in the builder most of the time you're either running HO or you assume at least one mon is getting claimed by this and you just hope to kill it before it does too much damage. Maybe that means its not ridiculously broken. I think nasty plot is too much of a tera hog to really justify a lot of times, but maybe I just haven't tried it out enough. It has definitely smoked me before don't get it twisted, but I felt my team was just not well prepared for it or was built too passively. pivot Thundurus though, that thing is scary and doesn't have as much incentive to for example stay in on a Cyclizar knock off as nasty plot does given its limited chances to boost. If this thing knocks bike and hits a focus blast later in the game, it could be devastating if the rest of your team isn't fast enough to deal or your fast mon can't kill it. Doesn't HATE taking sand chip but doesn't like it either, could be best used outside of sand. It's funny that its a good check to itself depending on the set, I miss hail weather ball Thundurus so much, man. Anyway I'd support a test or be open to a qb.

Both are insane breakers, but Hoopa is probably the more unhealthy one because it doesn't add as lovely a typing for making teams work as nicely as Thundurus. That one is at least forced to run boots+special attacks mostly. Instead, We have seen Hoopa run 6 different sets that can all get a kill when they get on the field in different ways depending on your team. I do like that Hoopa has a strong stab knock off that only Zarude was really able to replicate with a similar speed tier. Who would be the best replacement for this? Krook? It's much weaker but I'd love to hear other options. Support a test but open to a qb.

3s :Revavroom:, :Enamorus-Therian: , :Iron Leaves: Revavroom is so important for defining this tier. I have heard of the era with spdef rev and it sounds so beautiful yet so terrible at the same time (I know the fight for steels was tough). Shift gear just happens to be the broken setup move this thing was gifted from god with, and it has only existed to punish us ever since. Amen. I think the combination of Rev sets is very deadly, but iron head flinch machine will always be the most broken to me. Yes it doesn't outright do as well against hippo as tbgrass, but that reliable, amazing midground click is so useful instead of clicking the Gunker and losing games for it. Support a test or qb because its just annoying at this point.

Enamorus is another 3, It reminds me a bit of Mamoswine in that it's stabs are only checked by like 2 or 3 good mons (Moltres, Rotom-Heat, probably some more) and then a few that would be not great or niche otherwise (Orthworm, Bronzong). You can make your team better against it even when you don't have these specific mons like by having a very sturdy moonblast switch and a flying type/levitator, just so Enam can't click either move as freely (and will be more likely to pick moonblast). I think people kind of stopped tera-ing as much with this which shouldn't really be the case because of how good defensive tera is on it, but it's not necessary for it to be threatening. Good defensive typing that I like to have around, but the moves are just so strong and draining kiss is a bit busted. Love the defensive profile and sand immune when building teams so I don't think
banworthy yet but would support a test.

Booster energy's last big abuser Iron Leaves can be frustrating to play around with tera. Speed booster is clearly not the only viable set, but provides a lot to hyper offense and even bulky offense teams due to its revenge killing abilities. It’s basically the scarfer principal, even if it’s not always the best set for a mon, SOMEBODY has to wear the scarf and be a bit “nerfed” or you get swept by random set up. Obviously leaves will take that trade every day because speed booster may just be its best set anyway. I thought master chief bringing an attack booster tblaze iron leaves worked VERY well in Rult last week and I think other sets can work, but speed booster is the main culprit for tiering action. You have to tier based off sets that people are actually using consistently in my opinion. It is a bit weak on speed booster so you really just need something that takes a neutral hit well enough to kill back or blow tera. Would support a test.
 
Last edited:
I want to talk about a few mons that are interesting in this meta.
:pmd/iron leaves: This mon is really busted. It is so powerful, I accidently didn't ev it correctly to get the quark boost for speed (I am using an electric terrain life orb set), but it didn't matter, it just hits way too hard. This mon is absolutely disgusting, and it suprisingly only needs psyblade and cc to destroy a large portion of the tier. I thought this was alright, but the combo of its speed and power (its typing isn't even that bad defensively, resisting water and fighting is kinda good) is too good.
:pmd/maushold: Another disgusting abomination, but moreso because of t-wave. T-wave on maushold is devestating, since no ghost or steel types want to switch in to that move. Thus, only magnezone (which sadly isn't a good mon from what I've heard) is the only one that can take the two moves combined. Combine that with encore, and even steel or ghost types don't like facing it. Maushold has a good support movepool, and with a bit of experimentation, they could be disgusting. Some options include copycat to use disruptive moves before the opponent, charm to make the opponent weaker thus giving maushold an opportunity to set up and tickle, which does similar things to charm but also makes the opponent want to switch out.
:pmd/regidrago: Regidrago is disgusting. With a scarf, dragon energy can hit insanely hard, or if you are chipped, then dragon pulse. Combine this with earth power, and not much wants to switch in. The fairy types we have in the tier are enam-t, fezandipiti, gardevoir and mimikyu. All are hit really hard by tera blast steel. Idk why people aren't picking up on this, it really is amazing. Something like cres is 2hit ko'd by dragon energy. Only specially defensive empoleon can take this on, non-specially defensive takes 50%.
:pmd/tentacruel: Tentacruel is an amazing mon, but people are using it wrong. Instead of trying to spin, though that is still a good option to have, sweeper tentacruel is great. At max evs and +speed nature, it can reach a speed stat of 328, which only a few mons can outspeed. Then add on the speed boost from rapid spin, and it can outspeed anything bar scarfers. Then you can sd up which makes a suprisingly devestating sweeper. Deoxys defense and forretress, two of the bulkiest mons in the tier, take 35% from this thing, and it can easily sd up again against them. So chew on the idea that two of the bulkiest mons in the tier can't do a thing against it and are forced to recover (in the case of Deo-D, forretress can at best use pain split). Water + poison is only resisted by basculegion and empoleon, both which take 30% upwards from it. It is an amazing cleanup mon, and I think experimentation could be worthwhile (it also can use knock off, though you have to drop rapid spin for that).
 
:pmd/regidrago: Regidrago is disgusting. With a scarf, dragon energy can hit insanely hard, or if you are chipped, then dragon pulse. Combine this with earth power, and not much wants to switch in. The fairy types we have in the tier are enam-t, fezandipiti, gardevoir and mimikyu. All are hit really hard by tera blast steel. Idk why people aren't picking up on this, it really is amazing. Something like cres is 2hit ko'd by dragon energy. Only specially defensive empoleon can take this on, non-specially defensive takes 50%.
To add to the draco brokenness it can also run a good dragon dance set with loaded dice scale shot earthquake and either sub with Tera ground/steel or terablast steel to destroy enamorous. Sp. Def emp (the common set in my experience) gets two hit kod straight up by scale shot and earthquake straight up kos it after little chip.. Sub variants set up all over emp btw. This on top of its insane specs set is pretty dam good.. I wonder why no one is using it more..
 
To add to the draco brokenness it can also run a good dragon dance set with loaded dice scale shot earthquake and either sub with Tera ground/steel or terablast steel to destroy enamorous. Sp. Def emp (the common set in my experience) gets two hit kod straight up by scale shot and earthquake straight up kos it after little chip.. Sub variants set up all over emp btw. This on top of its insane specs set is pretty dam good.. I wonder why no one is using it more..
Honestly, yeah. The only two dragons we have in the tier are cyclizar and salamence, both which do very different things and don't have nearly as much explosive power. Salamence can attempt a scarf moxie/dd set, but that's not as good as drago's one. And if it wants to go special, it is nowhere near as good.
Maybe its just an underslept mon, like new toy syndrome from all the mons that dropped means everybody forgot about it, if that's case, honestly fair. When you have stuff like hoopa unbound and thundurus therian running around, the funny little charizard dragon doesn't look too apealling.
 
Also, I am using shadow sneak mismagius.
4 Atk Tera Ghost Mismagius Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 116-140 (44.4 - 53.6%) -- 23.4% chance to 2HKO
4 Atk Tera Ghost Mismagius Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tera Ghost Cinccino: 116-140 (39.8 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
4 Atk Tera Ghost Mismagius Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mimikyu: 92-112 (36.6 - 44.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
4 Atk Tera Ghost Mismagius Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Hoopa-Unbound: 58-70 (19.2 - 23.2%) -- possible 5HKO
4 Atk Tera Ghost Mismagius Shadow Sneak vs. 96 HP / 0 Def Iron Leaves: 88-104 (25.5 - 30.1%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
4 Atk Tera Ghost Mismagius Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Basculegion-F: 112-132 (29.3 - 34.6%) -- 3.3% chance to 3HKO
This is a 40 base power move off a base 60 attack stat. WHY IS IT DOING THAT MUCH.
 

EviGaro

is a Member of Senior Staffis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
Super Moderator
:hoopa-unbound: :hoopa-unbound: :hoopa-unbound:

Hlelo, so the survey results are coming soon™ but RU Council decided to take immediate action on Hoopa-Unbound. The average it got on both the qualified and global surveys was considered significant enough for a vote to be held despite it being in the tier for a while now. Three options were given: quickban, suspect test or no action. Here are the results:



Thus, with a 7/10 votes, Hoopa-Unbound is now banned from SV RU. Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement on ladder, thank you both!
 
Thus, with a 7/10 votes, Hoopa-Unbound is now banned from SV RU. Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement on ladder, thank you both!
First off, thank you for the Hoopa-U ban!

Secondly, I know a lot of the RU player base has been begging/asking (whining maybe?) for faster council action and QB or accelerated suspects (and I had initially been somewhat part of the group), but I suddenly feel like the tier is in a much better place after literally just removing Zarude. So in my opinion, a conservative approach has let me appreciate all of the options, get used to a higher power level, and have the time to discern the specific issues. I might be in the minority of the casual player base, but I think the tier is a pretty good spot after Zarude (and soon to be after Hoopa-U). I can happily accept the current state of things since the remaining threats aren't as teambuilding and playstyle restrictive as Zarude was (although it might still be nice if :Thundurus_Therian: and :Iron Leaves: are given a look at. I think they are kind of manageable, but still do restrict some aspects of teambuilding, and I certainly won't miss them).

Finally, I'm not particularly competitive so take the above with a grain of salt
I know we are all creatures of bias and in this time maybe I've just developed some form of Stockholm Syndrome and love the way these top tier threats just beat me down all day...

... and it's all ok because the true reward is the friends we made along the way haha.

For full disclosure, I mostly build balance or BO and have been using like 80% trick room teams the last 10 days or so. I like to counter team HO even if it means folding to stall and I enjoy the little things in life, such as managing to build a decent team without the bike and watching maushold/cinccino kill themselves on a rocky helmet.
 
APRIL SHIFTS:

For the first time we didn't lose anything, and we gained:



Jirachi
& Barraskewda dropped to the tier. Jirachi is a very needed steel for the tier, working as a check to Enamorus-Therian, Reuniclus, & overall being a good utility steel you can adapt to your team. Be it Calm Mind, Choice Scarf, Stealth Rocks or just a Wish passer, Jirachi is very likely to shift the entire tier, hopefully in a good way.

Barraskewda drops back to RU after being an OU threat under rain. It'll make rain teams more annoying to handle, but I've also been a fan of using Barraskewda outside of rain as an offensive breaker thanks to the high speed & attack stats.

I'd like to comment on the mons that rose from NU to RU:



Chansey comes back to RU now that Blissey is gone. This seems to be normal and expected now whenever we lose Blissey, so not much I can comment on this. Necrozma and Armarouge are 2 similar breakers that seem to be more popular now that we've banned Zarude & Hoopa-Unbound, 2 dark types that really prevented either from doing much. Overqwil I think might have risen due to RU trying to fill in the void left by the previously mentioned dark types, but I've also been theorymonning about it for a while now, and I think it has a decent niche in the tier, although it might not be as good as I think it is, who knows. It is also a breaker used under rain, and with Barraskewda dropping, it seems the playstyle might be more potent.
 
:pmd/barraskewda:

I think this mon is going to be a BIG problem. Amoonguss and Vileplume stocks are going to blow up but it only makes Iron Leaves and Thundurus-T even better than they are as they already heavily pressure these 2 mons. Gastrodon is also a questionable pick due to how broken Thun-T and Iron Leaves are. We really need to get rid of these 2 as soon as fucking possible.

:pmd/jirachi:
SO hype about this. A good steel with a plethora of sets is going to shake things up in the best way possible.
 
Also, just going to drop my thoughts about the new mons/some old mons I've been having decent success with.
:pmd/jirachi: Goated mon. It can take so many hits and not be passive at the same time. I feel like with cobalion, it kinda allows a lot of dangerous mons in because fighting is resisted by so many tops mons. With jirachi, you can either pivot out with u-turn (which is better than volt switch) or get a body slam off which the para chance screws over so many things. I especially like doom desire, it threatens a lot of mons with big damage compared to future sight (which has more top mon resistances). Really liking this mon, is probably top 10 mon material.
:pmd/barraskewda: Really liking this mon. It is able to outspeed cyclizar, which is amazing for a lot of teams. I find that cyclizar is a really annoying mon, so naturally outspeeding it is great. I've been using a choice scarf set, which outspeeds basically everything and with the combo of water+fighting+dark, most things get chuncked for big damage. Flip turn means it can still deal good damage, while not letting in some mons that resist it. Really interested in this mon.
:pmd/rhyperior: Been using both a rock polish and choice band set, and this thing is great. The rock polish set can outspeed most things not named cyclizar and is an easy lategame wincon, while the choice band set has basically no switch ins, even resists get pounded by its moves. On this set, I've been using rock wrecker since rock+ground+fire covers most of the metagame, and it gives me a nuke button. Even cobalion, who 4x resists the move, takes 25% from it. Empoleon takes 75% max from it. I think next tier shifts, rhyperior could easily rise up, its good both offensively and defensively.
:pmd/brute bonnet: I've been using an assault vest set from the NU forum page, and it works quite well here. It can take many hits from a lot of mons, and while the 4x u-turn weakness is annoying, if you can get around that it is a great mon.
 
:rs/jirachi:
Jirachi @ Expert Belt / Leftovers / Shuca Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 32 HP / 252 SpA / 224 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind / Encore
- Psychic
- Grass Knot
- Aura Sphere


Superachi is back from ADV OU/DPP OU in full power. This set is great at softening up or outright blowing up defensive cores that rely on Pokemon weak to the typings this set proposes, ranging from Hippowdon, Gastrodon, Swampert, Chesnaught, Amoonguss, Vileplume, Moltres, Empoleon, Fezandipiti, Forretress, Vileplume and Quagsire. This makes this set a great way of softening up key mons in the opposing team so a teammate can come in and wreak havoc while providing somewhat of a defensive utility. I think it's a safe bet to say that this set and the Meteor Beam/Power Herb variant in lieu of Calm Mind/Expert Belt or Leftovers is going to be Jirachi's best set.

Calm Mind can also be replaced with Encore. EV spread can probably be tinkered with.
 
Last edited:
So, been messing around with a few unique mons/sets, and I've got a few things to report.
:pmd/overqwil: This mon is decent, definetely RU material though. Its speed stat is a bit underwhelming, but everything else about it is pretty good. I've been running a destiny bond, spikes, crunch and barb barrage set. Barb barrage is great for chipping down teams, the poison and double damage effects really means in late game scenarios it can be great. It can also be great in early game scenarios to get off a spike and potentially take something down with you. A good mon, and I do want to experiment with this more.
:pmd/necrozma: This mon is actually great. I've been using a sunny day set with morning sun, heat wave and photon geyser. It has both a lot of longevity and great damage. Not much wants to switch into boosted heat waves or photon geysers, and any chip damage can be recovered off with morning sun. It has been really great and works well.
:pmd/lucario: Really great mon in the tier I think. I've been using a bulk up, extreme speed, drain punch and psychic set with lefties. It can switch in quite a few attacks due to its typing and do good damage. I honestly was suprised how it felt like it was an RU mon, not NU mon that you can use in RU. It has quite a lot of competition, especially with cobalion, but it feels like it could really work. It's got a lot of set variety, so I want to see how this looks in the future.
:pmd/empoleon: I decided to just quickly try out the agility set with life orb (reliving DPP days), and my god did it destroy teams. You give up the ability to wall everything but gain the ability to destroy everything. With just stabs+air slash, nothing really wants to switch in. You reach a speed stat of 438 after an agility. This outspeeds every mon in the metagame unboosted, and even a few slow scarfers such as gardevoir. The faster scarfers can't really do that much damage to you. With tera water, you destroy everything. IMO, really great set, I was struggling to use empoleon before, but this set is going to be my go-to when I use empoleon I think.
 
Last edited:

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 2)

Top