Sword & Shield **Official news only** DLC Crown Tundra 22nd October

[dodiabla]

The only relevant thoughts that I have on the Home news that hasn't already been posted is that TPC is really expanding from their core, which, while making them more money, also risks fan burnout.

As far as we know, to get the "full experience" (every Pokemon, every form, every feature, etc.) in ShSw you would need (and have friends) to invest time and money into:

1. Pokemon GO (for Meltan/Melmetal)
2. Let's Go Series (for G-max Pikachu/Eevee)
3. Sword and/or Shield
4. Expansion Pass
5. HOME App (for HOME Mystery Gift, GTS trading, and Nat Dex)
6. Pokemon HOME for Console (to move pokemon to the games)
7. Nintendo Online Subscription (this isn't TPC fault, but still necessary)

I'm not counting Bank because that's more legacy support but you can if you have a valued collection or a mon that's only good competitively with a legacy moveset (which, as of now, is uncertain to be supported).

That's...a lot of things to juggle. Now, granted, not every player is going to be a perfectionist and certain products are replacements for others (DLC for sequels) but some of these seem redundant. HOME should have the same features regardless if you are accessing it from a phone or a console (except for the actual transfer to a game). HOME itself seems like a Frankenstein union of a next-gen Bank and certain features that should have been in the base game (a friend list would have been very welcome for Max Raids, you even could do a cute interface with the trainer cards!). That you have to pay $16 US is just a slap in the face, especially since the franchise is so profitable, even as it is falling in line with other AAA studio practices.

My biggest worry with this development is that Pokemon becomes tedious, not because of in-game mechanics like breeding, repetitive storylines, etc. but because I'm going to have to be on my phone, Switch, some messaging app (to communicate with friends I want to trade with because we are adults and have lives), whatever to trade a few Pokemon or fight a 5-star Lando-T in a den. That sounds like a chore, not entertainment. Not to be a curmudgeon but back in the old days, you could do all that with just a base game and, at worst, a link cable. I'm not going to mention the other spin offs like Masters, Mystery Dungeon, Rumble, etc. because I think these serve different audiences and don't interact with the core games.

I know every form of media is competing in the attention economy right now, but at least to me, splitting a pair of games across two platforms and charging out the nose to have them be compatible is not a way to get people to tune in.

 

[Worldie]

Yeah with the new moves/move tutors I guess it makes sense to just not display movesets until they're "official".

It's possible G-Max Toxtricity & G-Max Melmetal's artwork are in the app just hidden until release, but fair enough I did forget about them. I wonder if G-Max Memetal might coincide with Home getting Go compatability

I would not forget that being Home an actual Switch/Phone app (thus, not hosted in some weird separated server like Bank was) nothing prevents them to update movesets and dex entries/arts overtime.

My guess is that they will just have the latest moveset and art available, and update them whenever they get changed and they aren't lazy enough to not update them.


On side note, I still want to credit GF for maintaining GTS free. Obnoxious yes (because you need to juggle 3 apps for it), and should definitely just have been in the base game, but they are not charging any money for it.

Everything else, eeeeh I can understand / agree with, but one (almost) good thing they did.

 

[Rapti]

Well this is utter shit
the only thing more depressing about this entire situation is the people saying that this service is decently priced or not completely unreasonable somehow

why would anyone defend a service that's so barebones for 16$ a year? This is not an unprecedented service, file hosting services cost far lest than that, 16$ a year is basically 4GB a year, is 6k pokemon really 4GB of data, really?

nonetheless those really emphatic about defending Gamefreak fucking you up the ass deserve some sort of recognition, so here have a mascot

The "Gamefreak's policies are Great" Skowvet

you might wanna try Fallout 76, I heard is right up your alley

 

[Kurona]

On side note, I still want to credit GF for maintaining GTS free. Obnoxious yes (because you need to juggle 3 apps for it), and should definitely just have been in the base game, but they are not charging any money for it.

Why do they deserve credit for not making us pay for a feature that was always free? This is a very strange form of praise to give; they made it actively worse but because they didn’t go the extra mile in making it worse, that’s something worthy of credit?

 

[Worldie]

Why do they deserve credit for not making us pay for a feature that was always free?

I usually rather think "could have been worse" than "should have been better".

You know, the old "glass half full rather than half empty". I'd still rather have the full glass but that's what we got.

Random semipersonal rant: I think far too often (like in this case) my words are considered "defending GameFreaks" (i've got addressed way worse than this on the subject).
No, I just like to contextualize / understand what's going on. As much as everyone else, I think the system is overpriced and features should have just been in the games to begin with.
That doesn't mean I cannot see the similarities with all other systems, and I see how GF is simply doing what everyone else is.
Just, unfortunately for them, the quality of the features isn't on par with the others, so they get all the rage while everyone else gets away with it, which also is useless internettian rage as "we" are such a huge minority compared to the actual pokemon buyerbase that it's irrelevant in the large scheme, and GameFreaks knows it very well.

GameFreak's developers and leading staff arent stupid. At all. They know what they are doing, they know they can get away with it, and exactly like other companies, do it.
They played everyone extremely well with the DLCs, they also played everyone extremely well with Home knowing that 90% of the players wouldn't have used it *anyway*, but those who need it are encouraged to get the yearly pass due to how much cheaper it is compared to a single one. Cutting content from main game and taking a potential backlash only to come back with "it was a prank all along!" with DLCs is also a common marketing strategy.

No matter how you look, this is solid, tried and tested marketing strategies. And Gamefreaks would be stupid to not use them.Call them "scummy". Call them "evil", but that's standard AAA practice you can see in almost literally any title, on Switch, home console or PC, nowadays. Some companies perform it better than others (cough cough EA), but that's the standard.



It's basically same as when everyone got mental about Switch having a mandatory online subscription, when other console systems have had it for ages and noone seemed to be bothered by spending 80 € per year to use PS-plus, but hell 20 € per year for NSO is madness and insane.

 

[Siggu]

Frankly, between these comments about them being disappointed that the GTS is in HOME instead of in the game... I'm more disappointed that the GTS was brought back at all instead.

IMO it's a feature that has repeatedly proven to not accomplish what it intended to do (although not everything is its fault - many players making unrealistic requests hurts it a lot). I'd rather see it replaced by something else (which they tried to do in SwSh, mind you, but we'd rather not talk about the execution).

But Wonder Trading 10 Pokémon at the same time? You got me there. That's something I like.

 

[R_N]

I would not forget that being Home an actual Switch/Phone app (thus, not hosted in some weird separated server like Bank was) nothing prevents them to update movesets and dex entries/arts overtime.

My guess is that they will just have the latest moveset and art available, and update them whenever they get changed and they aren't lazy enough to not update them.

I would assume since its still cloud storage and is able to reach into Bank directly that these are still separate servers by design. So they'll probably still push updates no easier than Bank did. Or slightly easier since the 3ds had some limits on updates. But still theres probably no change in how they push updates to the apps

 

[DreamPrince]

The problem I have with HOME and trading is that it expects you to have a smartphone. What happens if someone has a Switch but not a Smartphone? Are they just locked out of features simply because they don’t have a right phone model? And yes I know most people have smartphones but some people do not, so this causes just an unrequired hassle for consoles.

 

[Jerry the great]

It's upsetting how much of a hassle it is just to be able to transfer Pokemon from Pokemon Home to Sword and Shield. First, you need to buy Pokemon home and make sure you're paying for your Wi-Fi on the switch. Not too bad. Or so you might think! As someone else mentioned, you ALSO need a smart phone for it to work! Granted, many adults have them, but what about the other portions of many people who don't? Seriously. If Pokemon was intended for children, then why on earth is game freak making you pay all this money, JUST to get some fucking Pokemon? Like holy crap... Wow. All of that just to trade over your squirtle or something. Now if Pokemon Swsh was a mobile game and Pokémon Home was optimal DLC for it, then that'd be OK (as long as they weren't so stupid as to make it crazy overpriced). But nope. Seriously. Just... Why Game Freak? Why must we do all these requirements + prob some more just to trade over our non Galarian Linoone or Squirtle or something?

 

[R_N]

It's upsetting how much of a hassle it is just to be able to transfer Pokemon from Pokemon Home to Sword and Shield. First, you need to buy Pokemon home and make sure you're paying for your Wi-Fi on the switch. Not too bad. Or so you might think! As someone else mentioned, you ALSO need a smart phone for it to work! Granted, many adults have them, but what about the other portions of many people who don't? Seriously. If Pokemon was intended for children, then why on earth is game freak making you pay all this money, JUST to get some fucking Pokemon? Like holy crap... Wow. All of that just to trade over your squirtle or something. Now if Pokemon Swsh was a mobile game and Pokémon Home was optimal DLC for it, then that'd be OK (as long as they weren't so stupid as to make it crazy overpriced). But nope. Seriously. Just... Why Game Freak? Why must we do all these requirements + prob some more just to trade over our non Galarian Linoone or Squirtle or something?

Some clarity:
Thankfully don't need NSO to use Home
The mobile app is used for a lot, like trading, but is not needed for transfers. Bank to Home, Home to Switch and Switch to Home can just be done with the switch app.
Strictly speaking home/switch transfer is free. Its only up to 30 Pokemon at a time, so its still not great and clearly a push to get you on Premium, but it IS free.
You do need to pay for Bank to Home, though, yes.

 

[Jerry the great]

Some clarity:
Thankfully don't need NSO to use Home
The mobile app is used for a lot, like trading, but is not needed for transfers. Bank to Home, Home to Switch and Switch to Home can just be done with the switch app.
Strictly speaking home/switch transfer is free. Its only up to 30 Pokemon at a time, so its still not great and clearly a push to get you on Premium, but it IS free.
You do need to pay for Bank to Home, though, yes.

Well thanks for correcting much of my mistakes. I guess it wasn't nearly as stressful as I had been thinking! But not to say it's flawless though, as seen from comments before mine.

 

[Siggu]

It's upsetting how much of a hassle it is just to be able to transfer Pokemon from Pokemon Home to Sword and Shield. First, you need to buy Pokemon home and make sure you're paying for your Wi-Fi on the switch. Not too bad. Or so you might think! As someone else mentioned, you ALSO need a smart phone for it to work! Granted, many adults have them, but what about the other portions of many people who don't? Seriously. If Pokemon was intended for children, then why on earth is game freak making you pay all this money, JUST to get some fucking Pokemon? Like holy crap... Wow. All of that just to trade over your squirtle or something. Now if Pokemon Swsh was a mobile game and Pokémon Home was optimal DLC for it, then that'd be OK (as long as they weren't so stupid as to make it crazy overpriced). But nope. Seriously. Just... Why Game Freak? Why must we do all these requirements + prob some more just to trade over our non Galarian Linoone or Squirtle or something?

Just to make this clear, you don't need a phone to transfer from Bank to HOME - you can do it with the Switch app just fine.

(Ninja'd about that one)

Now, about the matter of a children-targeted game having functions locked to the premium version of a mobile app... unless it's yet another cultural difference between Japan and the rest of the world (that Nintendo does not exactly have a good record at) and pretty much every kid has their own phone there, it's... difficult to explain at best. It's either that or "kids don't care about tradeforwards so the premium version is not targeted at them"; I can't think of anything else.

 

[Worldie]

"kids don't care about tradeforwards

It's mostly this.

The demand for Bank / Home compatibility is mostly from adults and veterans.

Almost all actual kids barely even touch the games after finishing the main story, let alone are bothered with completing pokedex or bringing over old pokemon.

 

[DreamPrince]

Some clarity:
Thankfully don't need NSO to use Home
The mobile app is used for a lot, like trading, but is not needed for transfers. Bank to Home, Home to Switch and Switch to Home can just be done with the switch app.
Strictly speaking home/switch transfer is free. Its only up to 30 Pokemon at a time, so its still not great and clearly a push to get you on Premium, but it IS free.
You do need to pay for Bank to Home, though, yes.

Without the mobile app though, you are just using a Bank at 3x the price. Sure you get more storage, but is that worth 16x dollars. Without a smartphone, you are just losing on those extra features you are paying for. A smartphone is basically required for the extra features that you pay for.

 

[pkmfan]

Feature wise it looks nice. But that price seems a bit steep considering Switch Online is $20. Moving on from that.

Still no firm release date?
Still no info on what Pokemon can be transferred from 3DS games into Sword/Shield when Home releases?

Sounds like at release (date not announced?), you can move everything into Home. But can you transfer all Poke types into Sword/Shield right away? If not I hope they let you know which ones beforehand, because moving Pokemon into Home and having to wait a year for them to come to a Switch game would be frustrating. Better off keeping them in the 3DS games so you can use them in those until they can be transferred from Home to Sword/Shield/Whatever. Keeping them in limbo sitting in Home for a Sword/Shield update wouldn't be fun...

 

[Kurona]

I usually rather think "could have been worse" than "should have been better".

You know, the old "glass half full rather than half empty". I'd still rather have the full glass but that's what we got.

That's understandably and justifiably pragmatic, but it's hardly something I'd be grateful for.

 

[Worldie]

Still no firm release date?

While there's no official words, pictures on the website show mystery gifts received on 7 february.
It might be a placeholder date obviously, but could very well be the release date.

Still no info on what Pokemon can be transferred from 3DS games into Sword/Shield when Home releases?

While no info is given, purely by the fact they are present in SwSh's data you can assume all the 400 + the famous 35 + the newly added slowpoke (all regional forms included, several are actually present in some fixed camps in game even)

Sounds like at release (date not announced?), you can move everything into Home. But can you transfer all Poke types into Sword/Shield right away? If not I hope they let you know which ones beforehand, because moving Pokemon into Home and having to wait a year for them to come to a Switch game would be frustrating. Better off keeping them in the 3DS games so you can use them in those until they can be transferred from Home to Sword/Shield/Whatever. Keeping them in limbo sitting in Home for a Sword/Shield update wouldn't be fun...

Understandable, but personally as soon as it releases i'm moving everything I have on my 3ds games onward and not planning to ever touch my 3ds games again. I see little reason to play them with all the QoL, better graphic and bigger screen of SwSh, honestly, other than nostalgia, and for nostalgia replay I can just start new save files where I don't need any of my pokemon anyway.

 

[Kurona]

In terms of transfer, there's two things that make me very curious.

1. Slowpoke. This is pretty contentious to me because while Kantonian Slowpoke is coded into the game, its evolutions are not. So will we not be allowed to transfer over our Slowpokes until June; will there be an update to add Slowbro or Slowking; or will we be in an awkward situation where we can transfer over Slowpoke, but despite being able to reach Level 37 and having the King's Rock available in the game we just won't be able to evolve it?

2. This one's a bit more hopeful... but starters. There's strangely multiple screenshots on the Home website showing collections of Pokémon that consist exclusively of Pokémon coded into SwSh... and other-gen starters not in the coding. Will we maybe see an update that adds these starters when Home releases? This is largely speculation, but it's still very odd and specific to show things this way. If they were just showing off some more popular Pokémon, why not also legendaries like Rayquaza or Palkia? And coming back to the reason I want starters programmed in no matter what, starters are the Pokémon most past-gen players are most likely to have and want to transfer over in the first place -- not everyone uses Taillow or Mareep even if they are popular picks, but at least nine out of ten players will at some point have used a starter. Considering that, it's possible they consider it important enough to code the rest of the starters (and Slowbro and Slowking?) into the game when Home releases.

Looking at the Slowpoke update, an update that adds Pokémon that doesn't coincide with DLC but still with momentous occasions is not unprecedented and is quite possible. If I recall, there were also updates by necessity for Gen 6 and 7 games to be able to even make the Bank software compatible with it? So while of course we can expect the 436 we know of, I don't think it's out of the question to see a handful of Pokémon added.

 

[pkmfan]

While no info is given, purely by the fact they are present in SwSh's data you can assume all the 400 + the famous 35 + the newly added slowpoke (all regional forms included, several are actually present in some fixed camps in game even)

So with luck, we can play around with those 35 soon. Kind of thinking that is all they will allow for now to help push the expansion pass. And they'd have to allow some new types to be transferred in, otherwise paying for the service seems a bit steep if you can't bring in other old types. Alolan forms would be great.

Understandable, but personally as soon as it releases i'm moving everything I have on my 3ds games onward and not planning to ever touch my 3ds games again. I see little reason to play them with all the QoL, better graphic and bigger screen of SwSh, honestly, other than nostalgia, and for nostalgia replay I can just start new save files where I don't need any of my pokemon anyway.

Personally I'd hold out. Not sure I'll use the 3DS much more, but if I can't use my Garchomp or Dragonite until late this year may as well keep in Sapphire just in case I do decide to get into a match or two with it.

 

[R_N]

2. This one's a bit more hopeful... but starters. There's strangely multiple screenshots on the Home website showing collections of Pokémon that consist exclusively of Pokémon coded into SwSh... and other-gen starters not in the coding. Will we maybe see an update that adds these starters when Home releases? This is largely speculation, but it's still very odd and specific to show things this way. If they were just showing off some more popular Pokémon, why not also legendaries like Rayquaza or Palkia? And coming back to the reason I want starters programmed in no matter what, starters are the Pokémon most past-gen players are most likely to have and want to transfer over in the first place -- not everyone uses Taillow or Mareep even if they are popular picks, but at least nine out of ten players will at some point have used a starter. Considering that, it's possible they consider it important enough to code the rest of the starters (and Slowbro and Slowking?) into the game when Home releases.

I don't think this is quite that strange. Going through every screenshot the only ones (or sets of ones) that meet what you're saying are:
-the gts example which has Chikorita alongside standard & galarian Ponyta, Venusaur and Sableye.
-The screenshot for Mobile's judge mode, which against has Chikorita among nothing but known Galar Dex (+ Foreign) pokemon

Which at first blush is optimistic but this has to ignore:
-the set of Wonder Box shots that has Tornadus-T as the stand out among Rotom, the 2 Ponytas, a Mimikyu and for some reason like 12 Karrablasts
-Room trade screenshots that's stuff we know but also Raticate-A, Buzzwole & Arbok
-this image https://home.pokemon.com/assets/img/screens/en/p08_03.jpg that's chock full of pokemon that are coming who knows when. Including Unown, of all Pokemon.

Course I also think Armor itself will have all the starters to mirror Crown having all the legends so perhaps I'm biased.

 

[Worldie]

I do share the question about Slowpoke.

Personally I think they might simply prevent transferring regular Slowpoke (even though tecnically it's in game data) OR code in kanto Slowbro/Slowking with a minipatch on Home release day.

 

[Rarycaris]

I wouldn't be surprised if we get a few new things. We'll need some sort of update to actually implement Dex entries for the 33 at some point, certainly an update for Home compatibility, and they've had time to make more models. Maybe they'll add a few more mythicals or something.

I'd be surprised if we got the genies right away though.

 

[Pikachu315111]

After mulling it over a bit, I did think of one thing that would lessen the price sting... though it's something many of us were afraid they may do.

With HOME having its own Mystery Gift, obviously one way they could make the price feel like it's worth it is if they have a healthy amount of events. Legendaries, Mythicals, Shinys, Hidden Abilities, rare items, combinations of mentioned; at least to someone like me it could be worth the price if they offer at least 3 such Events. Why 3? Because New York subway/bus fare is $2.75 one way, so round trip would be $5.50. Now, back when they would have game stores like GameStop, Toys R Us, etc. offer Event Giveaways I would try to make it so I could stop at one along my way back home from work, though sometimes I would have to bite the bullet and plan a trip out there just to get the Event Pokemon. So with that in mind, if they offer a nice amount of Events, and taking it as a replacement for them having game stores doing the giveaways, for someone like me it could be worth the price.

There's also the (slim) possibility of them adding onto HOME at time goes on if they really want it to last for at least a few generations. Yeah, sure, they can do nothing and they'll make a lot of money... but at the same time, if that's the case, why not add onto it and make it something fans would at least consider "worth it"? Alright, they'll probably never add in a battle simulator, but would it be too much for them to add in mini-games? Add in the Dream World? Add in Secret Bases? If they're doing major DLC for Sword & Shield why not also do major DLC for HOME?

 

[R_N]

I wouldn't be surprised if we get a few new things. We'll need some sort of update to actually implement Dex entries for the 33 at some point, certainly an update for Home compatibility, and they've had time to make more models. Maybe they'll add a few more mythicals or something.

I'd be surprised if we got the genies right away though.

The 35 foreign Pokemon all have dex entries, actually, they're just...unviewable. Even mew, the one of them you can explicitly obtain right now with that pokeball+, doesn't let you view the entry.
I assume they'll be viewable in Bank's national dex, at least.
Well, actually, a bit oddly but Slowpoke doesn't have any dex entries at all. Neither of them. Guess they're just saving that for Isle of Armor

I also don't think SWSH needs an update to be compatible with Home. iirc none of the gen 6 games required one

After mulling it over a bit, I did think of one thing that would lessen the price sting... though it's something many of us were afraid they may do.

With HOME having its own Mystery Gift, obviously one way they could make the price feel like it's worth it is if they have a healthy amount of events. Legendaries, Mythicals, Shinys, Hidden Abilities, rare items, combinations of mentioned; at least to someone like me it could be worth the price if they offer at least 3 such Events. Why 3? Because New York subway/bus fare is $2.75 one way, so round trip would be $5.50. Now, back when they would have game stores like GameStop, Toys R Us, etc. offer Event Giveaways I would try to make it so I could stop at one along my way back home from work, though sometimes I would have to bite the bullet and plan a trip out there just to get the Event Pokemon. So with that in mind, if they offer a nice amount of Events, and taking it as a replacement for them having game stores doing the giveaways, for someone like me it could be worth the price.

Bank also had events, just not as explicit mystery gifts. So Home will probably have the occasional special give away eventually (Hidden Abilities of rare pokemon, legendary pokemon, mythics...) but considering Home also has "local giveaways" I have some doubts at how great the mystery gift exclusives will be wrt not needing you to travel all over. And their example give aways being a Pikachu and a code for some pokeballs isnt inspiring confidence.

 

[deluge]

Wow. Reading the updates on Home in this thread I have to say that Gamefreak really justified my decision to jump off the Pokemon treadmill this generation. The reality (price, features) is worse than the most pathological predictions I would have come up with.

It's strange enough that GTS isn't in the games but why on earth is it limited specifically to the mobile phone version of the Home app? I bet they have some silly justification like, "only older players, who'll have phones, care about those features and we must protect the young ones from any 'communication' with strangers".

It's sad to see the series decline and for Pokemon to depart from the Nintendo tradition of giving customers the perception of value and of money well spent. Even with more primitive graphics, I used to feel like I got a TON of content when I bought a Pokemon game; now it feels like players are being nickle and dimed. I derive no glee from GF failing the fans. Sorry guys. My terminal disappointment was earlier, but I know how it feels.