breh
強いだね
They throw galaxies at each other like fucking ninja stars; there's obviously no logic in the later parts of the show; you just have to ignore its absence
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Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann!
- Thread starter joshe
- Start date
I really loved this anime, and particularly loved the way it fused the badassery of of a mecha anime with personal feel of a fighting anime (and thanks to this thread I've got a few more animes like that to try out too). There is really nothing revolutionary here; it's just really well made, with a unshakable single-minded focus on it's core themes and a truly epic scale. It isn't perfect but the nitpicks for me are minor; Yoko has too much fanservice, especially at the beginning, and while Yoko is a fine character and serves as an important plot point fairly early, she honestly isn't too remarkable in and of herself. Also, maybe I am just missing something, but the whole Boota thing at the end felt really unresolved, almost stuck in to just give a reason why the anti-spiral didn't destroy them right away, then is never touched on again. Also, everyone bags on episode 4's animation, but honestly I found the whole episode supremely uninspired even beyond that, though it does introduce some important characters.
On the other hand I feel there are some gripes with the series that aren't really justified.
Kamina is too one dimensional- Yeah he is, but he isn't so much a character as a force, a personification of the themes that guide the entire series. His one dimension is the dimension that makes him such an effective rallying cry for the rest of the series.
The scale of the series' second half (both physical and scientific) pushes the suspension of disbelief - I felt this on my first view through, but every viewing since I've never had a problem with it. The scale is absolutely ridiculous by the final episode and the back half of the anti-spiral arc is filled with pseudo science technological drivel. One of the mottoes of the series is "kick logic to the curb and do the impossible" and the second half does just that. The illogical scale jumps provide a suitably epic background for the battles, and the nonsense science talk is just a means to an end, which boils down to a completely non-scientific battle between wills. I personally applaud the scope of the story, it's a major selling point for me, and as long as you don't over think it, it holds up exceptionally well.
As for dub vs sub, I much prefer the dub version, but I'm not sure so much if that's because I think it's better (though English Kamina is PERFECT don't care what you say) so much as it's what I first watched, and in a show so filled with mottos and catch-phrases the English versions are the ones firmly ingrained in my mind.
On the other hand I feel there are some gripes with the series that aren't really justified.
Kamina is too one dimensional- Yeah he is, but he isn't so much a character as a force, a personification of the themes that guide the entire series. His one dimension is the dimension that makes him such an effective rallying cry for the rest of the series.
The scale of the series' second half (both physical and scientific) pushes the suspension of disbelief - I felt this on my first view through, but every viewing since I've never had a problem with it. The scale is absolutely ridiculous by the final episode and the back half of the anti-spiral arc is filled with pseudo science technological drivel. One of the mottoes of the series is "kick logic to the curb and do the impossible" and the second half does just that. The illogical scale jumps provide a suitably epic background for the battles, and the nonsense science talk is just a means to an end, which boils down to a completely non-scientific battle between wills. I personally applaud the scope of the story, it's a major selling point for me, and as long as you don't over think it, it holds up exceptionally well.
As for dub vs sub, I much prefer the dub version, but I'm not sure so much if that's because I think it's better (though English Kamina is PERFECT don't care what you say) so much as it's what I first watched, and in a show so filled with mottos and catch-phrases the English versions are the ones firmly ingrained in my mind.
Gurren drags on long for a series that sells itself on style, music, art and robots (instead of detailed story-line/character development like your typical JUMP shonen series).
Gurren is better compared to something like FLCL or Cowboy Beebop; in which case it does kind of drag a bit. Since these series thrive on "showing" rather than "explaining" (like a Naruto of Death Note), they have a lot more impact and tend to be better-- but it also means you drag more easily (since you're forcing the viewers to infer a lot).
Still, a really fun watch.
Gurren is better compared to something like FLCL or Cowboy Beebop; in which case it does kind of drag a bit. Since these series thrive on "showing" rather than "explaining" (like a Naruto of Death Note), they have a lot more impact and tend to be better-- but it also means you drag more easily (since you're forcing the viewers to infer a lot).
Still, a really fun watch.
You're wrong, but let's pretend that doesn't matter :)
Honestly, after watching both the dubbed & sub version, I just prefer to dub overall. Kyle Herbert IS Kamina and some of the other characters like Leron, Gibby and Viral (who sounds more pathetic in the english version... which is a good thing!) are more fitting.
Yeah sorry let's pretend there's a shred of credibility there PK Gaming
Compare this fucking snoozefest: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHrb5J6wEgs ("You lose your drill? Too bad" yeah too bad your voice acting sucks shit Hebert)
To this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXWjYHLYXq8&feature=player_detailpage#t=19s
The moment where Konishi yells "馬鹿やろう! ("BAKAYAROU!"/"Dumbass!" in the English dub)" should be more than enough, but the speech that follows immediately should only serve to further prove the point. (The delicious ONI RIIDAAA is pretty much the icing on the cake. Hebert is nothing compared to this.)
Also I have no idea where you're coming from with the Viral comment, Viral's voice actor is motherfucking Nobuyuki Hiyama and you can hear how clearly he sounds like Link at the end of the JP example I gave. Viral's not supposed to sound pathetic, he's supposed to sound like a cocky warrior who looks down on his enemies.
Compare this fucking snoozefest: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHrb5J6wEgs ("You lose your drill? Too bad" yeah too bad your voice acting sucks shit Hebert)
To this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXWjYHLYXq8&feature=player_detailpage#t=19s
The moment where Konishi yells "馬鹿やろう! ("BAKAYAROU!"/"Dumbass!" in the English dub)" should be more than enough, but the speech that follows immediately should only serve to further prove the point. (The delicious ONI RIIDAAA is pretty much the icing on the cake. Hebert is nothing compared to this.)
Also I have no idea where you're coming from with the Viral comment, Viral's voice actor is motherfucking Nobuyuki Hiyama and you can hear how clearly he sounds like Link at the end of the JP example I gave. Viral's not supposed to sound pathetic, he's supposed to sound like a cocky warrior who looks down on his enemies.
1) Not about to get into a pissing contest about which language is better, I just prefer Dub, and my comment to Phil wasn't serious.
2) Can't watch either of these videos, they're blocked in my country.
3)Viral is the biggest jobber in all of TTGL. Badass warrior? Please. This is the guy who's gotten owned by Simon/Kamina/etc on multiple occasions. Even the Spiral King can see that. Sam Riegal did a good job at sounding like a cocky, shit but he could also sound pathetic, like when he got his ass handed to him on a silver platter for the umptieth in part I.
Also Nobuyuki is fucking overrated and you know it.
2) Can't watch either of these videos, they're blocked in my country.
3)Viral is the biggest jobber in all of TTGL. Badass warrior? Please. This is the guy who's gotten owned by Simon/Kamina/etc on multiple occasions. Even the Spiral King can see that. Sam Riegal did a good job at sounding like a cocky, shit but he could also sound pathetic, like when he got his ass handed to him on a silver platter for the umptieth in part I.
Also Nobuyuki is fucking overrated and you know it.
I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people prefer the version they saw first. Both are incredibly cheesy in their own way, and both have legitimiate dramatic elements in their own way. I tend to prefer Japanese anime voice acting because
1. I saw the Japanese version first...
2. Languages we don't understand tend to mesmerize us more or something like that.
3. I tend to tolerate the Far East Asian brand of cheesy more than the North American anime brand of cheesy (though I much prefer North American comedy in general because Korean/Japanese comedy tends to be REALLY meme-centric). In North America, anime is still a niche industry, and I think the voice acting kind of reflects this in the styles. In Japan, anime is roughly equivalent to prime time as far as prominence goes, and VAs are significant celebrities there, so they tend to be more one-dimensional and memetic BUT they do that one dimension well. Or maybe I'm just full of shit.
I'm not saying that "pathetic" isn't a legitimate angle to take the voice acting. It just isn't the only one. Viral has legitimate pride in the fact that he's one of the top fighters around, plus the propaganda fed to him that the humans are inferior and deserve to be pushed underground.
1. I saw the Japanese version first...
2. Languages we don't understand tend to mesmerize us more or something like that.
3. I tend to tolerate the Far East Asian brand of cheesy more than the North American anime brand of cheesy (though I much prefer North American comedy in general because Korean/Japanese comedy tends to be REALLY meme-centric). In North America, anime is still a niche industry, and I think the voice acting kind of reflects this in the styles. In Japan, anime is roughly equivalent to prime time as far as prominence goes, and VAs are significant celebrities there, so they tend to be more one-dimensional and memetic BUT they do that one dimension well. Or maybe I'm just full of shit.
Well, I don't think it's fair to put the jobber label on Viral like that. Surviving as long as he did is commendable in itself (he was the sole survivor of the sea battle in the original series and the Doten-Kaizan battle in the first movie). I wouldn't necessarily refer to him as pathetic, just because he lost to the protagonist. That was more of a limitation of the beastman race, as Lordgenome explained. So as a beastman warrior, yeah, he is pretty up there in badassery. If Simon put him in Kamina's old seat, that's good enough for me.
I'm not saying that "pathetic" isn't a legitimate angle to take the voice acting. It just isn't the only one. Viral has legitimate pride in the fact that he's one of the top fighters around, plus the propaganda fed to him that the humans are inferior and deserve to be pushed underground.
I've always been very interested in voice acting, and with the massive increase in quality in the last decade I've become a pretty huge fan of the western dubbing industry. I tend to watch a few episodes of any anime in both English and Japanese, but I usually settle for English if I recognize some great actors.
And there are great actors in the English Gurren Laggan. It's too bad that they were all miscast and the voice direction sucks. Yuri Lowenthall has a constant falsetto while trying to sound epic. Kyle Hebert is pretending to be Steve Blum when he can't overact at all. Yes, Sam Reigal does come across as a jobber in the English dub. The fact that you think he is so pathetic is evidence of the dub's failing to establish a convincing enemy. Hynden Walch is not miscast as Nia, but is such a poor actress in general that they even get rid of her halfway through the show. Michelle Ruff by all means should be a fine Yoko, but her stale delivery is evidence of the poor direction. And holy fuck they what they do to Anti-Spiral???
Only Steve Blum and Jamieson Price are well used.
And there are great actors in the English Gurren Laggan. It's too bad that they were all miscast and the voice direction sucks. Yuri Lowenthall has a constant falsetto while trying to sound epic. Kyle Hebert is pretending to be Steve Blum when he can't overact at all. Yes, Sam Reigal does come across as a jobber in the English dub. The fact that you think he is so pathetic is evidence of the dub's failing to establish a convincing enemy. Hynden Walch is not miscast as Nia, but is such a poor actress in general that they even get rid of her halfway through the show. Michelle Ruff by all means should be a fine Yoko, but her stale delivery is evidence of the poor direction. And holy fuck they what they do to Anti-Spiral???
Only Steve Blum and Jamieson Price are well used.
I started watching is series because of this thread. Just now finished, I was kinda hoping to be able to give some huge awesome post about it once I finished but I'm finding it hard to find the words. Yeah I'm not ashamed to say I cried while watching parts of this, a few to sadness but most because of how wonderfully beautiful it was. All the mecha stuff was cool but the characters were what drew me so deeply into this anime.
Its not that they're even super complex, Simon is the most so but even he "finishes" developing fairly early. For me it was how real they made them all feel. The show never forgot its roots, right to the last scene. I loved when Rossiu returned to his first home, and how Simon planted the Team Gurren flag on the moon before taking off into deep space. These things showed where all the characters had been, I feel like too often do stories lose track of whats behind them in favor of whats in front. Gurren Lagann never had that problem. Seeing Gimmy and Darry grow into awesome Dai-Gurren members is amazing, and seeing Simon's small steps towards his future was the reason to watch the anime.
Man I feel like I've got a lot more to say, but I can't think of it now :/ Thanks Joshe!!
Ps. So looking back at the very first scene of the show, was that some kind of alternate future? Boota was in his human form and Simon was on board the last ship but in the normal timeline Simon never sees humanoid Boota, I didn't get that part.
Its not that they're even super complex, Simon is the most so but even he "finishes" developing fairly early. For me it was how real they made them all feel. The show never forgot its roots, right to the last scene. I loved when Rossiu returned to his first home, and how Simon planted the Team Gurren flag on the moon before taking off into deep space. These things showed where all the characters had been, I feel like too often do stories lose track of whats behind them in favor of whats in front. Gurren Lagann never had that problem. Seeing Gimmy and Darry grow into awesome Dai-Gurren members is amazing, and seeing Simon's small steps towards his future was the reason to watch the anime.
Man I feel like I've got a lot more to say, but I can't think of it now :/ Thanks Joshe!!
Ps. So looking back at the very first scene of the show, was that some kind of alternate future? Boota was in his human form and Simon was on board the last ship but in the normal timeline Simon never sees humanoid Boota, I didn't get that part.
joshe
the best
im p. sure they changed the whole series after episode 5 because the original producer guy criticized the guest producer animation guy of episode 4 and said something along the lines of "it looked like planting your face in an ass and breathing deeply" so yeah FIRED! :(
also <3!
oh and the reason im so attracted to the dubbed version is because of the character development in a language i can understand and relate to. the whole thing about kamina's voice actor being shit compared to the japanese va might be true but i feel it isn't so much the case. after watching the subbed movies i came to see that the actors took more different paths in the dubbed and subbed. subbed was always fiery and unbreakable like he should be while dubbed focused more on the bond between simon and kamina and how kamina would be simons foundation. atleast that's how i saw it. plus this part is where dubbed really stuck for me (kinda obv): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bg3wrDN9ws
#demmotivationalspeeches
also <3!
oh and the reason im so attracted to the dubbed version is because of the character development in a language i can understand and relate to. the whole thing about kamina's voice actor being shit compared to the japanese va might be true but i feel it isn't so much the case. after watching the subbed movies i came to see that the actors took more different paths in the dubbed and subbed. subbed was always fiery and unbreakable like he should be while dubbed focused more on the bond between simon and kamina and how kamina would be simons foundation. atleast that's how i saw it. plus this part is where dubbed really stuck for me (kinda obv): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bg3wrDN9ws
#demmotivationalspeeches
Movie 1 is
everything up to before Genome battle. Only the first general actually dies and the others combine in the end to fight against Simon and lose.
Movie 2 is
everything after the Genome fight (WTF WHY DID THEY SKIP THE GENOME FIGHT; MOVIES ARE SHIT) and in the end instead of becoming two giant mechs, becomes giant plasma man and Simon and the Spiral guy have fisticuffs.
EDIT: Oh and no one really dies and they all get suped up ROW ROW mechs for awhile
EDIT: Oh and no one really dies and they all get suped up ROW ROW mechs for awhile