NOC The Mafia Invitational Redux Game Thread - GAME OVER

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Knights, who my vote is on. Other than that, I lack the health to read into it well enough.

I'll look more into DLE or Asek when less sick; maybe my thoughts on them are off. Doubt it's LW at any rate.
 

Yeti

dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
so... you don't think anyone in a fairly widely agreed upon poe is scum, you think the guy voting you is scum, and no idea on the other 2?

mehhhhhhhhhhh
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
ahem

This was not expected at all. Will scan through things more, but for now, adios.
What was unexpected if you literally even in the present claim you defended Proph? You never really claimed Hawkie was scum either.
That did not tag me but w/e

As weird as it is. Kills are usually too wifom to look too deeply into ftr

Aura Guardian hi welcome

lynch aura guardian

make me think otherwise
This is a pointless to pressure a sub for being a sub for seconds. This is the least productive thing to start a day with.
Vote empoof/aura guardian

Congrats on bust
Then again based on this it is exactly what town would do.
and...thread dies but I'm not busy right now so may as well continue that thread...

Asek (note, not a vote, just formatting)
Starts by asking people to be hl'd. Then vanishes forever until saying he would do something in 15 hours. Nothing was done after 15 hours.

Okay, first big post. This has been chewed to death by other people and myself. But it bears repeating that nothing in this post really matters. Like, he comments on things, but doesn't express thought anywhere. *Interesting* note though, he has parts of his post


(and a few other parts that got lost because when quoting I lose the part he was responding to but this is good enough) where he pushes for proph, without actually saying outright *why* he thinks proph is scum or really showing any thought other than outright suggesting proph is scum and going from there

then he does a real post #556 which ngl, seems fairly solid. He actually shows thought process here including a reason to vote proph (a recycled reason yeah, but not an awful one) and also does the koc-proph link push again.

Weird. I got the sense until then he had been favoring proph on the lynch but goes after KOC, for pressure I guess? Again, weird.

then more one liners



Says this to yeti, who then responds she's already done so. Though interesting that he does this since iirc in his wall post he said he would ISO her? Yet this is hte first time he's interacted with her since doing his intro wall.

Comes around to texas/walrein/proph as scum without explaining why and feels kinda random/low effort

but then after SRing walrein's slot....he soft defends that slot here


then he says he wants to talk with moody more and at least up to where I'm reading...doesn't.

Another soft defense of leet...and then turns around and says he made 1 post? Is this actually a (soft) defense? ngl after reading that second part I could see it either way but it is interesting that he has really only defended anyone to any degree, and that's leet twiceish.


Keeps ignoring his texas/walrein/proph push in favor of going for an idler

Then I would want to know why. ngl I wish people had followed up on this more because he doesn't give any context for this. Like he pushes proph early, then includes proph as part of his solve but then just doesn't want to lynch him?

Then posts this and no one brings up the previous quote again

and then spars with KOC a bit but nothing too feisty


Leet never responds to this as far as I can tell in fact his next response is

which then promps asek to do

...without any apparent reasoning

later says he would like to lynch leet because of a few posts he made (er wait, he actually said that before I think. w/e so maybe he did give a reasoning and kept with it)


He then says he wants to wagon leet

he then votes proph helping to end the day

Conclusion: Asek's had a lot of picking up something, then dropping it. Like he'll push for something a bit and then drop it when no one else seems to respond. Then pick up something else entirely different. This to me is the same sort of issue I had with yeti last game (not that i'm making a connection between them here, just saying this feels scummy to me) in that it feels like a scum is trying to find issues with people will agree with and push for them.

The *BIG* thing of my interest here, is the growing connection between asek and leet. Like, asek starts up by suspecting walrein a bunch. Then straight up drops that read in favor of empoof and then randomly near EOD picks up a leet push and pushes, but not too hard other than asking if people would join the wagon. Like, that's just so super strange to me and frankly, it comes off as scum buddying, defending one another and then trying to distance later in the day.
Yeah okay FH is looking better than day 1's coasting already. Disagree that the Asek Hitmon relation being scumbuddies, asek had plenty option beyond offering token support to the hitmon lynch, such as supporting the Hitmon vote on me if they were buddies. Any push towards a Hitmon lynch however insignificant could easily have steered the lynch to hitmon if proph picked up his pants he dropped late into the day.
I didn't see much of LW, so I decided to start with him and those near him on the list, for sake of ease.
LightWolf
2 posts: RVS followed by a useless post 22 pages later. That feels like trying to be forgotten.
Verdict: highlight him a little, and if he's not replaced in a cycle or two, lynch him - should be enough time for a sub if he's actually inactive.
LightWolf in the hopes he's just an idler and not idling scum.

Metal Sonic
After the joke posts, votes Texas for fake first pages, and tr's Former Hope. Gonna look into both of those more soonish. Then more junk posts. Some banter with Texas over his vote, feels a little off. Goes against Hawkie and is for Proph. The latter looks better with Proph's flip, but the former looks worse with Hawkie's. Both wrong would be bad town, but both right would be spooky. Just sort of makes me think the kill was to clear him from looking like he knows all alignments - and soon after voting Hawkie, says (#166) "ok please dont be scum bby my heart will break if u are". Though he soon after votes Proph and claims he was just memeing. Also tried to (note: I've been in a game with proph town before) push an obvtown Proph - frankly, I don't trust anyone that pushed proph at this point. But he also voted Texas for voting Proph despite a TR because of Hawkie's points, and continues trying to push him for a while. So, he's really all over the place here, but more anti-Texas than not. After starting on Texas, a lot more junk posts. Then he changes to Walrein for basically no reason given - off of Texas for Mason softclaim??? I don't see how the quoted #269 is a softclaim. And he still considers Texas super-scummy, which is weird. Also he jumps to Asek and DLE before returning to junk posts. The junk posts continue a while, but he occasionally offers an unsubstantiated opionion of just recent posts, and then tries to lynch an idler day 1.
(Does anyone else read post #165 as casting shade on Knights?)
post of note: #267: "hey if Hawkie / me / yeti are town we are better than masons"
#398: TRs Hawkie, Former, Texas, Yeti, Proph. Two are flipped town. Also around the post, but not in it, reads Texas scum except for mason softclaim???
Verdict: He reads as active idling of sorts - lots of fluff so people think he's active, but not much actual content. Some, to break the mold, but also it feels like a spooky coincidence if it's actually coincidence and not a mafia plan to make him look better. Vote Metal Sonic

Going to get back to finding people to ISO.
I find the fact that of the two ISOs he did, one being a waste of space the other on MS he instantly stumbles into someone to vote. Spooky coincidence indeed. I feel like it's far more natural to get a feel for the game first, instead of instantly voting your first ISO when you don't understand the context of it all. Feels less like looking at what people did and more looking for someone to vote.
Hi, Yeti! Trying to jump in, and now that I responded to a couple job recruiters, I can get back to more posts.

Re: MS and calling me OMGUS: I actually did almost literally have OMGUS in the reasoning, just as a joke. Anyway, Former and Texas next, so see you all when I finish with them.
Is this REALLY the thing you take away from MS voting you? Haha omgus haha? There is proph brushing off Hawkie's vote and then there is ignoring the guy you are voting and going to do something else entirely, as great as it is to catch up.
And, last game empoof town went 18 pages of iso, LightWolf town barely posted anything too. So.
I mean thank you, but god I can already see how he is gonna die... The reasoning literally boils down to Empoof ditched us therefore scum.
Still writing up a read, but just gonna chime in with: I would have done a read on hawkie for that lynch, but then he died (this was before I was doing worse than skimming).
That is the relevant bit of information you wish to chime in with? This feels like a fun fact to post so people don't start asking why you ain't taking part in a discussion centered around your current vote.
Looking at it shows 110. Which... is a lot to read into a noseface. Combine that with Lightwolf dodging the prod and my continued feeling that something bad has happened to The Dude and I can't agree with the sloppy take at all.

Poor play is not a guarantee of scum caught, but
I still don't get how my prod dodging is such a serious offense that is alignment indicative when all that happened is I get on smogon, I see alerts, I see the alerts are for the game, I go to the thread and see it's 23 pages long, I make a post after checking when the game actually started, which was like a day and a half prior to me noticing it did start, and start my catchup. The only way my idling would be scummy is if you are arguing that I went invisible for those 1.5 days or inentionally avoided the thread to not post and never be seen viewing it(when if anyone had checked my last time online they'd have seen I haven't been on smogon since the game officially started) to then fake a post I noticed the thread to fake catching up, only to post my announcement I finished catch up and will post day 2, only 1 hour after day 2 got hammered early. Yet people are no accusing me of wearing my Matrix pants, yet I'm also a scum who is afraid of posting. Point is, you guys post in the middle of the night for me, I wake up to the thread having grown like 10 pages usually, and I had two workdays where I went sleeping the second I got home because I had Raid nights at mightnight the first day and was dead tired the second day, then I got lazy because I had given up on catching up day 1, and then day 2 got killed after I wrote a crap of catchup notes on my damn phone during work, get home inspired to make a stupid movie poster and then go to sleep because I was tired again and planed to wake up 3 hours before work to get in the thread, combine my notes in a post and post it while also making a realistic looking copyright claim to FH which I had to scrap when I ended up posting the thing at the start of day 3. Point of point is, no one can list a reasonable reason to suspect me on my idling, beyond the fact I feel like a piece of crap for it, then maybe instead of lynching me pressure me or try and ask me stuff you want to hear my opinion on I haven't stated and form your opinion based on that, because right now people are taking the very easy way out by lumping me into their poes(spit on that) and hey they have 3 or 4 people with me, scum MUST be there the rest are def not being given a pass by me and could NEVER be scum! Village has been collectively wrong for 2 lynches, and plenty people who did not agree with the mislynches suspected the major pushers of some of them, who then ended up flipping town too. Point is this is the time to reevaluate instead of deciding on a box to pull random names from. Anyone who wants to push me I expect to disect the little I said, and same for pushing anyone else, so people can't bullshit their
no, you just idled out end of day and didn't show up to have any say in that, huh

:smogthink:
In contrast to last game where he was scum and claimed to be unable to show for deadline but then still did so. You were scum with him yet show little need to base assumptions on his previous game or the insight into his scum thinking he may have shared with you during game 1. The only real point you made is echo someone when they claimed MS likes to reasonless tunnel by mentioning Josh(which wasn't a reasonless tunnel, he had brought up some meta analysis to support his claim, which just wasn't applicable for the vast majority).
lol hawkie dying n1 even after a tunnel onto town feels bad
oh no you didn't
vote metalsonic
Oh god this is how it all ended? Day 2 was completely wasted on an event that was completely NAI, because no scum would attempt this for real but voting while catching up is either... This is such a sad fucking waste.
vote metal sonic
This vote is much more suspicious, what with no reason given l-1 with no indication DLE was unaware of that fact. L-1 is pointless here and only invites accidental hammers, especially when no points are raised to make an additional argument for the suspicion of the target of the vote.



Well day 2 was shite. FH looks better after some actual effort I could actually perceive rather than the coasting of day 1.
I don't quite like Yeti's lack of using the last game to shed insight into MS, and rather just memey bloby back and forths which made sure MS was never gonna get serious about it. With Walrein day 1 she did multiple times refer to last game to contextualize the lynch, but here it was lacking in that department, though I can't really see how that makes sense, beyond not wanting to be seen pushing too hard for MS since he was actually getting strong support, unlike Walrein.
Ag's initial vote then vanishing to do more ISOs while the entire thread revolved around who he voted, and only chiming in with unrelated stuff never acknowledging MS vote on him in any serious capacity doesn't sit quite right with me. While I know the feel of dropping live interaction to catch up, I disagree with dropping a vote on your first real ISO, and not following up on it at all even when the whole thread is talking about MS. Also unrelated note your ISOs are hard to read, seperate points by something(I seperate them with links). Sorta forgive him never getting around to addressing MS again because the day ended like that, but while it was going I still find his actions more scummy than town.
Knights had a burst early, then dropped into a pointless argument with MS which was really just fluff even in the context of arguing with the main lynch target. This feels more inline with expectations of town KoC after last game, but the day was way too short to tell, too small of a sample size.
Everyone else had no meaningful contributions beyond popping in to vote. Asek and Hitmon both popped in to specifically say not to vote MS, again both ending the day with no thinking the main lynch is scum. One of them is scum trying really hard to be on the correct side of the lynch, the other is psychic with a bad records. They never scum together, their interactions as previously described don't fit, and distancing could have been far more subtly without risking either getting lynched by distracting from the main lynch. For obvious reasons my current preference is voting between them.

Asek and Hitmon, please be deers(not a typo) and address my points against you. Doubly goes for Hitmon whose reaction to my posts ended with overreaction and accusation while misrepresenting what I was doing. If I am scum then what I am saying is a lie because you are town who I am twisting the actions of, therefore all the actions I have a problem with should be explainable from a village perspective, or mistakes made by a villager that should be admitted as such, if that can't be done that the only truth that remains is that they are the actions of a scum.
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Asek
Of those 3 other people yeti just mentioned, who would you like to see lynched and why?

Aura Guardian LightWolf Da Letter El same question. Particularly though, if:

Asek is lynched and is town who do you look for next in the pool
Asek is lynched and is mafia who do you look for next in the pool
Asek from the pool, if asek is town I'd look at Hitmon, as both of them have the previously explained uncannuy ability to state at the end of previous days that the person getting mislynched is a mislynch. Oh sure limtied sample size so a town can easily pull it off too, but specifically a scum WANTS to pull it off and one at least will pull it off. And if isn't asek, it's gotta be Hitmon, though day 2 was so short some people didn't comment at all on the lynch in any meaningful capacity. If neither is scum I'd look at Yeti, but we can't mislynch twice.

If Asek does flip scum, then DLE or AG(yeah cop out answer I know). I'd not want to lock myself into either from that pool, for outside of the pool I'd much rather look at Moody, but AG and DLE I have qualms with day 2, that will greatly be contextualised by the finishing of day 3. I'd put Knights into that group as well, though that's mostly in that day 2 was too short for me to clear up if my Knights suspicions from day 1 were reasonable or just an after effect of reading too much into last game. Or the reverse and not reading into him enough after.
 

Yeti

dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
Asek from the pool, if asek is town I'd look at Hitmon, as both of them have the previously explained uncannuy ability to state at the end of previous days that the person getting mislynched is a mislynch.
do you think they could be scum/scum and asek pushes at a leet wagon that doesn't take off or do you think leet had enough genuine risk of being lynched on d1 that wouldn't be worth it? like if both of them are accuracy reading dying towns to mislynches but asek pushes leet and leet has omgused asek (i think) is that significant?
 
Votals the Twelfth
Hitmonleet
(2): LightWolf, Asek
Asek (2): Former Hope, Yeti
Aura Guardian (2): KnightsofCydonia, MoodyCloud
KnightsofCydonia (1): Aura Guardian
LightWolf (1): Hitmonleet

Not voting: Da Letter El
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
do you think they could be scum/scum and asek pushes at a leet wagon that doesn't take off or do you think leet had enough genuine risk of being lynched on d1 that wouldn't be worth it? like if both of them are accuracy reading dying towns to mislynches but asek pushes leet and leet has omgused asek (i think) is that significant?
As I said in reply to the big FH post of day 2, I think Asek would have pushed me instead if it was to just signal off Proph, pushing Hitmon when he is the only reasonable counterlynch is going a bit far. And both jumping on each other day 2 seems too silly to be scum. I'd reevaluate this if we flip one scum maybe, based on how they act around the lynch, but at the moment it's either or
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
tbh those wagons are very likely to contain all 3 scum, if dle votes himself it would be just about guaranteed
I get why yourself not being on that list makes sense.
I can understand why FH would get a pass by you.
But what reason could you have to trust Moody enough to say he is in your top 3 out of 9.
 
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