The Universe: Can we really be the only ones in it?

assassinfred

assassinfred

I've been engaged in this forum a lot recently, so I decided to post something I've always been interested in, and like to hear the opinions of others on. So, here are a few questions, followed by what I think on the matter.

1. Is Earth the only planet with life on it?

2. If other lifeforms find us before we find them, how will humanity react, and will they react correctly?

3. If we find other lifeforms before we find them, how will we react, and will we react correctly?

4. How will the lives of humans in general be affected by the discovery of other lifeforms in the Universe?

5. How will people's perspectives on the Universe change on the discovery of other life?


First of all, I think it is very likely there is life somewhere else in the Universe, and I believe there is. Why? Simply because I find it very hard to believe that in a Universe with millions of stars and star systems, most of which are still undiscovered, that there is only one single planet that has life on it.

Next, if other lifeforms find us first, I think we will react the same way humanity always has when someone uninvited goes to your boundary: We will attack to defend it. Whether or not this is the right decision depends entirely on what their intentions at Earth are, but in general, this is not the right reaction.

If we find other lifeforms before they find us, I think the reaction will be very different. We will see it more as a scientific discovery, rather than an attack, and we will most likely be much more peaceful. This is the way I think humanity should react.

The lives of humanity in general will be very different, I think, knowing that there are others out there. Their beliefs and quality of life will be changed drastically in one way or another. This is because they will either see it as an amazing discovery and opportunity for trade or diplomacy to further understand the Universe as whole, or a threat.

People's perspectives will definitely change if other life is discovered. They will see the Universe as more than just stars and planets, they will see it as a vastly undiscovered world, where anything is possible.

So, I would like to hear your guys' thoughts, as I'm very interested in people's opinions in this matter.
 
What are the odds that other life is sentient? What are the odds that we even have anything close to the same cultural universals as them? What are the odds we will be able to have any kind of communication?

I think the odds of these lining up are a lot less strong than life existing.

The big one though? Odds that there is life within "reach" of Earth. Right now, we would never be able to travel outside of our solar system due to relativistic effects, so the point is basically moot.
 
I think until we discover the presence of thousands or even millions of other planets revolving around thousands or millions of stars and take a ratio of what is needed for life in the planets that we can see, (example: we discover planets x001 through x999, y amount have a breathable atmosphere, z amount have required radiation levels, so on and so forth) we can't tell what the likelihood is of another planet having life on it. And religion also likes to butt its head into this debate.
 
Ever read any Kurzweil? His section "Why SETI will fail" is an interesting argument against advanced forms of life existing out there in the universe. His point being that we are likely to be the most advanced species, which seems idealistic but he defends it admirably.
 
Even if we were to discover another sentient life somewhere, question three is kind of pointless, as all we could do is study and not interact. Atleast not personally. Our space vehicles are sadly lacking, atleast the ones that can ferry humans. The nearest reaches of space to Earth have been scoured for any kind of planet that could support lifeforms.

"y amount have a breathable atmosphere".. is that oxygen or nitrogen or.. what. Earth's life depends upon oxygen, yet another may depend on something entirely different.

Considering the vastness of the universe itself, and the reaches of our telescopes, the things we are seeing from millions of light years away are not present, as the time it took that light to reach Earth, the advancement of millions of years could yield life, or it could not. I believe it entirely possible. Life, yes. Sentient, maybe not. There's so much of even our own galaxy we don't entirely know. There are thousands upon thousands of galaxies.

Who knows?
 
I think there defiantly has to be intelligent life on other planets. Like Chris said, the odds of any communication happening between humans and other intelligent life is near improbable though I'm sure after some time some translation system might work out.

My basic theory of what will happen when another intelligent life form makes contact with us is sort of based around War With The Newts (a novel). The novel itself pretty much says that the other life form will be taken in as slave work > immigrant work > sub-human rights > human rights > above humans (decided on by the other lifeforms) > dominate species. Of course, there's a way to prevent that line of events, and that's ignoring/going to war with them right off the bat. I would predict humans to do the latter regardless of how we come into contact with such life.

The discovery of organic human-like intelligence in general would put a lot of questions/debates on the plates of highly religious folks and probably nobody else.
 
Let's define the argument here.

Statistically, it is extremely unlikely that there are no forms of other intelligent life in the universe. Near impossible, in fact. Why? Because just within range of our instruments are hundreds of likely candidates for "earth-like" planets, and our sensor range doesn't even cover a fraction of the Milky Way galaxy.

In other words, there are billions of stars in this galaxy which we are completely in the dark about. And there are billions of galaxies on top of this, each with their own billions of stars!

Even if the likelihood of intelligent life existing is mind-bendingly low, the simple fact is that the sheer number of chances for it to evolve somewhere in the universe make it highly like that it exists.

Now, the more relevant question: does intelligent life exist in a form and place wherein we can be aware of its existence? The answer to this is a lot harder, primarily because we don't know the level of technology other forms of sapient life possess. Perhaps they're more primitive than us, in which case we won't be able to detect radio waves or electricity or anything else denoting civilization unless we drop a probe into the planet. Or maybe they're vastly more advanced than us, in which case it's possible they'll make first contact...and probably kill or enslave us all, if the way humans treat new and exotic species is any indication.
 
I heard a great quote once: "The single biggest proof that life exists elsewhere in the universe is that we humans exist on Earth." That sums it up pretty well for me. If humans could evolve to our present state against all statistical improbability, what proof do you have that this hasn't happened elsewhere in the universe?

We're currently nowhere near viable manned exploration of another star system. If aliens and humans were to meet they'd probably visit us first, if so, their technological advancements must be lightyears ahead of us. We would probably treat a true alien visitation with cautious diplomacy.

That is not to say I believe aliens have already visited Earth. Isn't it interesting how in alien abduction stories the aliens never try to make contact with scientists or world leaders but choose truck drivers or suburban housewives instead.

Actually, come to think of it, I wish aliens would show up just so they could tell people that no, they didn't build the Pyramids, Easter Island Statues, Stonehenge or countless other crap attributed to aliens.
 
I believe that, more likely than not, there are other forms of life in the universe. Whether that life is sentient or not is debatable.

But let's take a look at why there WOULDN'T be other beings way out there. Sure, there are in fact billions of galaxies in the universe, but that doesn't necessarily mean that there is life out there. It is a miracle that we humans even exist, we are the correct distance away from the sun, our atmosphere happens to be the right size and composition, and on and on and on. Yes, statistically it is very possible that there is life out in our universe, but don't forget about the other 1%.
 
It's mathematically possible, even probable, that we are the only intelligent life in the universe.

I just don't think it's realistic. I would say there's one or more other civilisations out there, but we may never be in contract with them.
 
ATTN POSTERS: this thread is not just about the title. try discussing the potential impact on human life (religion, science, technology, space travel etc) instead of "my completely uneducated guess about the probability of alien life" (see above post)
 
1. Is Earth the only planet with life on it?
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I seriously doubt this, be it mathematically unlikely or not. As Fatecrasher mentioned, if that wasn't the case, WE shouldn't exists. And with how wast the Universe is, it would be... quite shocking if we are the only ones that have a "cultured" civilization.

2. If other lifeforms find us before we find them, how will humanity react, and will they react correctly?

3. If we find other lifeforms before we find them, how will we react, and will we react correctly?
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I answer these 2 together, because I believe the answer is the same: We would react wrong. Now, call me a pessimist, but I believe that if we find another lifeform or another lifeform finds us, we would try to enslave/eradicate it. Maybe not all of us would do it, but many would feel they should be removed or put under our control. Hell, we do it to our own kind, and with some of humans feeling we are "the top of the food-chain", I wouldn't be surprised at all if we would go straight to war with the other lifeforms.

4. How will the lives of humans in general be affected by the discovery of other lifeforms in the Universe?
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Well, if we find them first, our insight on evolution, maybe even our origins would gain huge leaps. This is considering we find it when we can't space-travel. If we, however, would be confronted by aliens, and we enslave/eradicate/live peacefully (lol) alongside them, our technological advancment would be huge. Also, depending on the situation/lifeform we find (in this latter case), the first option would also be within reach.

5. How will people's perspectives on the Universe change on the discovery of other life?
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Turned upside down. Maybe some would feel threatened that there is some sort of lifeform that can destroy us in matter of seconds, while others would be intrigued and be even more eager to search out there for more life and more knowledge. And then some wouldn't give a flying fuck.
 
1. Is Earth the only planet with life on it?

No. I refuse to believe that with the improbable amount of stars in the millions to billions of Galaxies in our universe doesn't have some form of life. It's near impossible. I would be truely shocked if this were the case.

2. If other lifeforms find us before we find them, how will humanity react, and will they react correctly?

Negatively. It's a instinctive thing to see something more powerful than you as a threat. Some people might not but the majority of people I believe would over react.


3. If we find other lifeforms before we find them, how will we react, and will we react correctly?

If this were the case I'd say positively. We have more control than if an alien just poped up on our doorstep while we weren't prepared. However I do believe we'd act a little naively. I don't think we should come into contact with any other alien civilization until we as a race are advanced enough to understand this new chapter.

4. How will the lives of humans in general be affected by the discovery of other lifeforms in the Universe?

Far differently. For one thing alot of religions would crumble and die. I suspect that alot more work and money would go into the space foundation in order to get to/study this new life.

5. How will people's perspectives on the Universe change on the discovery of other life?

As a human race we've always though of ourselves as the pinicale of evolution. The results of billions of years of time and startling mutations from animals that may or may not look like us. I think that if we were to finally discover life in another planet we would grow out of this phase and truely start to evolve and understand the universe.
 
There's probably intelligent life somewhere. Anyway.
If they find us we'll probably attack unless there is nothing we can really attack them with. (I mean they got to earth, they've got to have really potent technology)
If we find them it'll probably be scientific as there is no threat at all. How the natives react though will really determine this.
 
Aqueos said:
If they find us we'll probably attack unless there is nothing we can really attack them with.
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Yeah, great way to get the interplanetary relations ball rolling! I'm sure we'd be really popular back at Planet X. /sarcasm

If they found us, having armed forces ready to defend us in case they do attack would be a good idea, but there's no need to open fire until it becomes clear that their intentions are hostile.
 
assassinfred said:
1. Is Earth the only planet with life on it?
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Probably not.

2. If other lifeforms find us before we find them, how will humanity react, and will they react correctly?
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I feel this is a highly unlikely event. But the expectation if it did happen would be global cultural shock. For the long-term consequences, look at groups like Native Americans and Eskimos now. A lot of them are in lives of high unemployment, drug and alcohol abuse, and so on. If we met a more advanced alien race, the majority of the human population would be like that.

3. If we find other lifeforms before we find them, how will we react, and will we react correctly?
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Indirect evidence: Front page news story, scientific research, little general impact.
Single-celled organisms: Massive news story, lots of research.
"Animals": News goes apeshit. If in the solar system, huge investment in manned spaceflight. Consideration of how to exploit them.
Intelligent life within reach of space travel: Serious attempts at slavery and similar exploitation, quite probably war.
Intelligent life beyond reach of space travel: Lots of radio transmissions at them, and listening to their broadcasts. If we pick up their transmissions of cultrual materials like music and video, the aliens get to number 1 in all the Earth charts.
All cases: Religions find a way for it to not affect their beliefs.

On the likelyhood - don't forget that not only SPACE is big, but also TIME. In fact relative to us, I'd say time is MUCH bigger. We can observe across billions of light-years of space, but we've only been doing astronomy for a few centuries (and most of that we'd never have noticed any but the most ridiculously obvious intelligent species). If intelligent species have a fairly short typical duration they're observable for of centuries to millenia, then they could be popping up in their millions and we'd never see them because they'd always "miss" the time we can see.
 
From the perspective of a technologically advanced sentient species capable of intergalactic travel, I do NOT see the incentive to be immediately militant if they made first contact. What the hell would that do? I highly doubt they would need resources at all, being able to effortlessly expand at their own choosing. The only thing of value that we could present them is intelligence, in terms of us teaching them how much our civilization has advanced.

I'm sure it'd be more of a history lesson for them to see life before interstellar travel.
 
They could hold religious or political ideologies that motivated them to exterminate or enslave other species. Many Earth religions essentially teach that humans have the God-given right to exploit all other species.

Or they could be expanding so aggressively that they use every resource they find, other life be damned.

Don't assume an advanced alien race would be peaceniks - we have advanced massively over the course of millenia but have become scarecely less warlike.
 
MrIndigo said:
It's mathematically possible, even probable, that we are the only intelligent life in the universe.

I just don't think it's realistic. I would say there's one or more other civilisations out there, but we may never be in contract with them.
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This is very wrong. It is mathematically possible, but it is highly improbable that we are the only form of intelligent life in the universe, if you would believe a reasonable amount of research. Sure we make assumptions, but at the moment they're the best we can go on.

I am quite a big fan of the Drake equation, which makes quite a reasonable case for there being about 0 probability that there exists no other life. That is of course assuming that life is somehow produced naturally by the universe, rather than being "added" by some other power c.f. God.

That guy arguing about exponential growth makes an enthusiastic, but I think his predictions are very wild. I for one don't even believe that growth will continue on an exponential growth curve. There may be some natural limiting point. It's a bit... speculative.
 
I find it hard to believe alien races, even if they were sentient and communicated, would be anything like us. People raise concerns about attacking each other. What if they don't even have the concept of "attack"? What if the idea that you could hit or shoot someone else was something that had never occurred to them?

There are so many aspects of different culture that are universal because of our species. Religion as a whole is something many cultures developed independently. Valuing the lives of others in our species. Reproduction and companionship. The odds that something else in the universe shares enough of these cultural universals that we'd be able to even begin to comprehend them is really what seals the deal for me. (That and the whole "so far away we can't travel to see them in a lifetime" bit)
 
or you could just look at the fact that every single animal on earth has a concept of territory and aggression and come to the conclusion that it is universal due to the very nature of evolution
 
Chris is me said:
I find it hard to believe alien races, even if they were sentient and communicated, would be anything like us. People raise concerns about attacking each other. What if they don't even have the concept of "attack"? What if the idea that you could hit or shoot someone else was something that had never occurred to them?

There are so many aspects of different culture that are universal because of our species. Religion as a whole is something many cultures developed independently. Valuing the lives of others in our species. Reproduction and companionship. The odds that something else in the universe shares enough of these cultural universals that we'd be able to even begin to comprehend them is really what seals the deal for me. (That and the whole "so far away we can't travel to see them in a lifetime" bit)
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I find it extremely hard to believe that alien races would be anything like us, physically, but there's no reason to believe they wouldn't have evolved concepts such as 'attack' on their own.

That's not to say interspecies warfare, but competition inevitably leads to resentment and fights. (I think it's fair to claim scarcity and competition will be elements of any ecosystem.) They may not have guns, or developed weaponry, but it is likely they will have some method of deterrence.

Culture, caring, companionship are all concepts that we have selectively developed. We have them because at some point in history they were useful. If they were useful to us in this climate, what's to say they won't be useful to another alien species?

That being said, I don't know if reproduction or any of the above concepts are necessary. Depending on the climate, it's possible their organisms could live infinitely and evolve themselves(Think cells adapting substantially rather than whole organisms).

I think the key point is that the chance that the other race is similar to us is almost zero. They could be 1000 years ahead of us, they could be 1000 behind us, they could be 10**9 years ahead of us, they could be 10**9 years behind us. As cantab pointed out, time is a major factor in what extra-terrestrial life could turn out to be. Even if we exist at the same time as other creatures, either they discover us and we are wholly inferior to them, or we find them to be single-celled bacteria.
 
monkfish said:
or you could just look at the fact that every single animal on earth has a concept of territory and aggression and come to the conclusion that it is universal due to the very nature of evolution
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We all share gene ancestry, aliens do not.
 
I think it's very probable that intelligent life exists somewhere else in the universe and if they were to come to earth we would probably be fucked.

I don't think that we will ever make contact with another form of intelligent life, however.
 
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