Metagame Tier Shift [OM of the Month]

No one seems to be discussing Thwackey for some reason. How is it in the meta? Is it a good alternative to Rillaboom, or not worth mentioning?
 
The most recent tier shift is absolutely insane.

For the first time :Gengar: :Diggersby: :Terrakion: :Thundurus: :Tornadus: :Suicune: :Raikou: :Entei: :Conkeldurr: :Kyurem: :Darmanitan: :Porygon-z: :Haxorus: :Mimikyu: :Chandelure: :Doublade: are all in RU without being RUBL, and :Volcarona: :Thundurus-Therian: are also UU without being UUBL.
This is just from the recent tier shift of older Pokemon. After DLC2, :Tapu Lele: dropped to UU last shift, and :Weezing-Galar: which just entered RU as a new Pokemon.

Edit: Well nvm about :Gengar: and :Volcarona:. Both are now UUBL, so no more Spectrier with a good movepool and no more Super Mothra.
 
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Oh, god. Light ball isn't banned. *Hyperventilating* (Light ball Pika effectivly has 190 AtK and a stab physical 120 base power move. Ban lightball or we will all die to Pikachu. :ss/pikachu: :light_ball: :ss/pikachu:
1. It actually has the equivalent of base 239 Attack.

2. It honestly isn't as good as you're making it out to be. For example:

252 Atk (base 95) Light Ball Pikachu Volt Tackle vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 93-111 (26.4 - 31.5%) -- 18.9% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk (base 95) Light Ball Pikachu Volt Tackle vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 102-121 (28.9 - 34.3%) -- 99.7% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

Admittedly a lot of damage for a resisted hit against a top-tier physical wall, but between recoil and its abysmal 35/80/90 bulk, if it fails to both outspeed and KO its opponent, it'll probably be knocked out in return by almost any nonresisted attack (and a fair amount of resisted ones, too). And its base 130 speed, while not bad by any means, isn't exactly great either.

Though Volt Tackle is obviously still worth running on your moveset a lot of the time (Volt Switch, Knock Off and Surf are all good options as well), its best niche imo is abusing Fake Out and Extremespeed to revenge-kill or clean late-game:

252+ (base 95) Atk Light Ball Pikachu Fake Out vs. 0 HP / 0 (base 75) Def Ninjask: 98-116 (37.2 - 44.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ (base 95) Atk Light Ball Pikachu Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 (base 75) Def Ninjask: 196-231 (74.5 - 87.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

...but even this still isn't great due to, y'know, 75% of things being significantly bulkier, having no STAB, etc.

In short, due to the overall increase in the levels of speed and bulk throughout the metagame, there is certainly enough offensive and defensive counterplay to keep Pikachu in check.
 

temp

legacy
is a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Driver Alumnus
Wanted to make a post on some of the bulky Pokemon I think are pretty potent in Tier Shift right now. Hopefully this can get some discussion flowing.

Utility Pokemon

Tier 1


:cresselia: :kyurem: :gastrodon: :vaporeon: :celebi: :rhyperior: :slowbro-galar: :sylveon: :snorlax: :suicune: :quagsire:

Tier 2

:appletun: :audino: :mantine: :umbreon: :palossand: :bewear: :zarude: :slowking: :registeel: :weezing-galar:

Tier 3

:celesteela: :amoonguss: :skarmory: :jirachi: :latias: :weezing: :stunfisk: :stunfisk-galar: :altaria:

We have a large pool of solid defensive Pokemon to choose from in Tier Shift, especially with recent tier shifts. Cresselia and Kyurem immediately stand out to me, having some ridiculous stat spreads that can let this Pokemon act as walls, general utility Pokemon, or late-game cleaners given the right set.

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Psychic isn't the absolute best defensive typing out there, which is the one thing keeping Cresselia from being "broken" in my eyes. 120/150/150 bulk, however, can somewhat offset that middling defensive type. My favorite set to use with Cress is Sub CM, given that you have a decent speed tier, a manageable special attack, and ridiculous bulk. This is an extremely solid win condition—psychic + fairy coverage is hard to wall, especially in a format with less relevant bulky steels than your average meta. Even after 2-3 CMs, you're punching holes. A basic utility set rocking Toxic or Thunder Wave can also suffice.

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Man, this thing is borderline broken. One look at its stats should already tell you what you're getting into when trying to fight Kyurem, defensively and offensively. I will once again bring up the point of the low amount of relevant steels in this OM to suggest that sometimes Kyurem doesn't even need Earth Power to be effective. A Sub Roost set rocking Protect or Icicle Spear > Earth Power can work perfectly fine, the former providing more longevity and better PP stalling, akin to SubTect Suicune, and the latter giving Kyurem itself more PP to work with. On the defensive side of things, 125/110/110 doesn't stand out as ridiculously broken, but then you look at its offensive stats and see where the issue comes in. You're eating hits and dealing a ton of damage back with 150/150 offenses, even if you run next to 0 offensive investment. I personally prefer running offensive investment on this Sub Roost set.

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Tier Shift has a good number of reliable Bulky waters that all perform different roles. Gastrodon, Vaporeon, and Mantine provide Water-immunities to completely shut down opposing Waters and attempts to Flip Turn. Each also check completely different targets; Gastrodon is better intended for Grass-types, Mantine can tackle special attackers better thanks to its monstrous 170 SpD, and Vaporeon acts a bit like a middle ground that also has access to momentum in Flip Turn. Suicune acts as a PP Staller with Pressure. Quagsire is damn near essential on a solid stall build thanks to Unaware and a good defensive typing. Slowking, while having noticeably worst stats than the other above options, can also perform well as your team's special wall. Future Sight Teleport support is amazing for wallbreakers, and Teleport in general is just very solid in tandem with Regen.

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This is a random niche Pokemon I wanted to talk about briefly for its Trapper set. Altaria has pretty solid stats in 75/130/145, which can help it easily trap more passive Pokemon that can't pivot out. A large number of the above Utility Pokemon would lose 1v1 to Altaria, and I think this gives decent room for its spot on stall or semi-stall builds. Dragon/Flying is decent defensively; it benefits from Heavy-Duty Boots but can also make Altaria susceptible to Knock Off / Corrosive Gas users, where its effectiveness can diminish after Stealth Rock chip. The EVs are fairly customizable. The EVs on the second set listed allow you to outspeed 0 investment base 130 Speed Pokemon and below, which I think is a fairly reasonable benchmark.

I'd also like to talk about Offensive Pokemon like Thundurus or Porygon-Z at some point, but I think this post is long enough.
 
Wanted to make a post on some of the bulky Pokemon I think are pretty potent in Tier Shift right now. Hopefully this can get some discussion flowing.

Utility Pokemon

Tier 1


:cresselia: :kyurem: :gastrodon: :vaporeon: :celebi: :rhyperior: :slowbro-galar: :sylveon: :snorlax: :suicune: :quagsire:

Tier 2

:appletun: :audino: :mantine: :umbreon: :palossand: :bewear: :zarude: :slowking: :registeel: :weezing-galar:

Tier 3

:celesteela: :amoonguss: :skarmory: :jirachi: :latias: :weezing: :stunfisk: :stunfisk-galar: :altaria:

We have a large pool of solid defensive Pokemon to choose from in Tier Shift, especially with recent tier shifts. Cresselia and Kyurem immediately stand out to me, having some ridiculous stat spreads that can let this Pokemon act as walls, general utility Pokemon, or late-game cleaners given the right set.

View attachment 297688

Psychic isn't the absolute best defensive typing out there, which is the one thing keeping Cresselia from being "broken" in my eyes. 120/150/150 bulk, however, can somewhat offset that middling defensive type. My favorite set to use with Cress is Sub CM, given that you have a decent speed tier, a manageable special attack, and ridiculous bulk. This is an extremely solid win condition—psychic + fairy coverage is hard to wall, especially in a format with less relevant bulky steels than your average meta. Even after 2-3 CMs, you're punching holes. A basic utility set rocking Toxic or Thunder Wave can also suffice.

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Man, this thing is borderline broken. One look at its stats should already tell you what you're getting into when trying to fight Kyurem, defensively and offensively. I will once again bring up the point of the low amount of relevant steels in this OM to suggest that sometimes Kyurem doesn't even need Earth Power to be effective. A Sub Roost set rocking Protect or Icicle Spear > Earth Power can work perfectly fine, the former providing more longevity and better PP stalling, akin to SubTect Suicune, and the latter giving Kyurem itself more PP to work with. On the defensive side of things, 125/110/110 doesn't stand out as ridiculously broken, but then you look at its offensive stats and see where the issue comes in. You're eating hits and dealing a ton of damage back with 150/150 offenses, even if you run next to 0 offensive investment. I personally prefer running offensive investment on this Sub Roost set.

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Tier Shift has a good number of reliable Bulky waters that all perform different roles. Gastrodon, Vaporeon, and Mantine provide Water-immunities to completely shut down opposing Waters and attempts to Flip Turn. Each also check completely different targets; Gastrodon is better intended for Grass-types, Mantine can tackle special attackers better thanks to its monstrous 170 SpD, and Vaporeon acts a bit like a middle ground that also has access to momentum in Flip Turn. Suicune acts as a PP Staller with Pressure. Quagsire is damn near essential on a solid stall build thanks to Unaware and a good defensive typing. Slowking, while having noticeably worst stats than the other above options, can also perform well as your team's special wall. Future Sight Teleport support is amazing for wallbreakers, and Teleport in general is just very solid in tandem with Regen.

View attachment 297700

This is a random niche Pokemon I wanted to talk about briefly for its Trapper set. Altaria has pretty solid stats in 75/130/145, which can help it easily trap more passive Pokemon that can't pivot out. A large number of the above Utility Pokemon would lose 1v1 to Altaria, and I think this gives decent room for its spot on stall or semi-stall builds. Dragon/Flying is decent defensively; it benefits from Heavy-Duty Boots but can also make Altaria susceptible to Knock Off / Corrosive Gas users, where its effectiveness can diminish after Stealth Rock chip. The EVs are fairly customizable. The EVs on the second set listed allow you to outspeed 0 investment base 130 Speed Pokemon and below, which I think is a fairly reasonable benchmark.

I'd also like to talk about Offensive Pokemon like Thundurus or Porygon-Z at some point, but I think this post is long enough.

Notable movers since this post:

:vaporeon: NU ->PU now has an even more ridiculous 130/105/100/150/135/105 stat distribution. Being able to wall mons like arctovish, being able to sponge fairly strong neutral hits on both sides and being able to hit back hard even uninvested and unboosted make this look like a mon destined for high usage. Not to mention access to Haze, Roar, Yawn, wish, and heal bell.

:Palossand: NU->PU now 85/115/150/140/115/75. Seems like a good physical wall with rocks and recovery and immunity to bolt beak. Doesn't jump off the page to me quite like vaporeon does, but we'll see.

:Kyurem: RU->RUBL I'm not sure if I would buy Kyurem being in that first tier even before the ban from RU, given it's poor typing combined with it's seemingly low speed tier for this meta, but the ban from RU makes it pretty unappealing to me

:Slowbro-Galar: NU->NUBL Now has "only" 95/115/90 bulk and is attacking back off of base 120 instead of 130. Regen is obviously still great an it has a very functional movepool still, but I don't know if it will wind up belonging near that top tier anymore



Some bulky mons that I haven't seen mentioned all that much that I feel are worth at least looking at:

:Goodra: 90/100/180 bulk. Nothing to write home about on the physical side but it can run a good assault vest set for absolutely crazy special bulk+ much improved 130/140 attacking stats

:Coalossal: 110/160/130 +flame body.

:Mudsdale: Another tank without reliable recovery so I'm not sure how well it can function, but 100/130 physical bulk combined with
stamina should be crazy hard to break on the physical side and you have a 155 atk stat to fire back with



:Guzzlord: Again no reliable recovery, but 223/93/93 is crazy bulk and 141/137 attacking stats are nothing to sneeze at and it's movepool isn't atrocious aside from the lack of recovery


:Jellicent: Might just be outclassed by vaporeon given it's inferior 100/110/145 bulk and much weaker 125 SpA, but it's ghost typing+access to strength sap, will o wisp, and recover may make it a viable choice in some situations


:Aromatisse: 101/112/129 is certainly not the best bulk out there in this meta, but it is pretty good and half decent fairy types are hard to come by and it has all the tools it needs to function as a good cleric

:Aurorus: Really just listing it here because I think it looks like the best hail setter of the bunch. The rest are still slow now and are frailer. Rock/Ice is still terrible typing but 122/112/132 should give it some hope of being durable enough to continue to set hail for the arctobros


Primarily offensive mons that are still quite bulky

:Regidrago: 200/70/70 bulk is certainly formidable and the measly +20 boost to its attacking stats is magnified by it's ability. I could see a variety of items too. You could run scarf to have a very high chance of a full power dragon energy or specs dragon energy/draco meteor off of a base 120 special attack with dragons maw should destroy walls. You could maybe even go for some weird AV set to catch people off guard given it's buffed defenses


:Kingdra: Now down in PU. Oh how the mighty have fallen. 75/135/135/135/135/125 plus the potential for swift swim use. Damp rock is banned so you would have limited turns to try to sweep, but you could set rain yourself or use politoed which now has respectable stats since it is back in pu since drizzle has been banned in the low tiers

:Machamp: 90/120/125 is respectable bulk and 170 atk with guts and great coverage including access to priority could potentially wreak havoc

:Frosmoth: Terrible typing and relatively slow (base 105) , but 70/130 special bulk combined with ice scales is tough to break through without a fire move and one quiver dance and you are faster than most of the metagame and are quite threatening with a base 165 special attack. Other downsides are your only recovery is giga drain, walled by steels with solid bulk (You could just forgo quiver dance and run it as a fully defensive mon with screens/veil, defog, etc. though), and if your boots get knocked then you are taking 50% to rocks.

:Silvally: Every single form is now PU. 95/135/135/135/135/135 is good stats all around. I think basically every decent typing was NU before the mid december drops and Silvally fairy was RU pre DLC2 so there are a lot of new options there. I'd imagine Fairy and steel (maybe normal?) will be the only ones seeing much usage, but I could see both seeing a good amount of usage since steel and fairy types are mostly lacking in the lower tiers and the ones that are there mostly have low hp.

:Copperajah: 122/99/99 bulk with steel typing and 160 attack to hit back with.

:Volcanion: Recent UU to RU drop, so now it has 80/140/110 defenses combined with water absorb and good dual stabs to use with a 150 special attack




All out offensive mons:

:Magneton: The new steel murderer. 160 special attack and 110 speed.

:Malamar: Contrary with 132 atk now and much more respectable bulk to try to start stacking up those superpowers.

:Electivire: 163 atk, 135 speed, great coverage, an electric immunity that can boost your speed, passable bulk.

:Salazzle: Fast as all hell , now has 141 special attack, still frail as hell but if you really want to spread poison and maybe get a revenge kill there is no substitute

:Flareon: Guts+ 170 atk. Still slow and physically frail for this meta, but if you come in on something weak or threaten something out and get a flame charge up this thing should be able to break most things you throw at it

:Inteleon: still frail as hell, but 150 speed and 155 special attack combined with criting snipe shot should be quite hard to switch in on
 
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Hello Tier Shift! I come to you with sets!

They'll be sure to make Tiers Shift from your opponents eyes!

:swsh/accelgor:

Wallbusters @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sticky Hold
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Acid Spray
- Water Shuriken / Final Gambit
- Bug Buzz
- U-turn

♪♪I ain't afraid of no wall!♪♪

Because Accelgor is PU, it's stats are 80/110/80/140/100/185. Yeah, this thing outspeeds almost the entire unboosted metagame, and has a solid Special Attack stat. This set was designed to weaken walls with Acid Spray, halving their Special Defense, making STAB Bug Buzz hit really hard unless they switch out. You can predict switches and just use it again to weaken the new mon, and if they keep switching, they take more hazzard damage if hazards are up. Water Shuriken hits fire types and goes before almost every other priority. Final Gambit can be a surprise to many weakened walls, possibly removing troublesome walls. Finally, U-turn at his speed allows him to chip and escape really easily, and switch to a steel type killer such as Magneton, which Accelgor can't break.

:swsh/porygon-z:

Z-Warrior (Porygon-Z) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tri Attack
- Thunderbolt / Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse
- Trick

Kame...hame...TRI ATTACK!!!

Porygon-Z is in NU, and that is scary. Wanna know what else is scary? 155 Special Attack Adaptability Tri Attacks with 110 Speed and a scarf. It has Trick shenanigans to cripple walls, Dark Pulse over Shadow Ball to deal with Indeedee switch-ins, and Thunderbolt or Ice Beam for your teams needs.

:swsh/passimian:

Gotta Pass Em All (Passimian) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Gunk Shot
- U-turn

This guy means monkey business!

This is one pokemon you won't want to passimon thanks to its stats at 100/160/130/80/100/120. Great bulk for such a hard and fast hitter. STAB Close Combat hits hard, and with a Defiant boost is down right nuclear. Knock Off hits ghost types and Gunk Shot vaporizes fairies. It can also deal great chip damage and pivot with U-turn.


Hopefully these guys help my fellow HO players out!

I'm really looking forward to post dlc2 Tier Shift!
 
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Pincurchin @ Terrain Extender
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rising Voltage
- Memento
- Toxic Spikes
- Spikes

Raichu-Alola @ Choice Specs
Ability: Surge Surfer
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rising Voltage
- Focus Blast
- Surf
- Psyshock
calcs



252+ SpA Choice Specs Raichu-Alola Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Eviolite Chanse(115 spdef) in Electric Terrain: 295-348 (41.9 - 49.5%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

252+ SpA Choice Specs Raichu-Alola Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Ferrothorn in Electric Terrain: 221-261 (62.7 - 74.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Choice Specs Raichu-Alola Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Ferrothorn: 390-460 (110.7 - 130.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Raichu-Alola Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Raichu-Alola(125 spdef) in Electric Terrain: 207-244 (79.3 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Raichu-Alola Surf vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 400-472 (125.3 - 147.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

it has only a few checks, this is one example

252+ SpA Choice Specs Raichu-Alola Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Celebi(130 spdef) in Electric Terrain: 150-177 (37.1 - 43.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

0 Atk Celebi(130 atk) Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Raichu-Alola: 192-226 (73.5 - 86.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 Atk Celebi(130 atk) Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Raichu-Alola: 138-164 (52.8 - 62.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
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G-Luke

Sugar, Spice and One for All
is a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Ok guys. Starting tomorrow Tier Shift will be on ladder, so i will be notifying us of what we plan on doing for this month!

:ss/zamazenta-crowned:
Firstly, I have decided to urban Zamazenta-Crowned. Its already received even minimal discussion in OU suspecting, and Tier Shift is truly a much stronger meta than OU. Fighting types are already a major part of the metagame, so not only will the tier be heavily prepped for it, but it will also be weak to the most popular wallbreakers. Thus I have determined that it deserves the chance to roam free.

Watch list

:ss/abomasnow: :ss/arctovish: :ss/arctozolt: :ss/vanilluxe:
Hail has been controversial in lower tiers for quite sometime now, and thus, are bound to be a major threat to look out for coming in this month. Personally, Hail itself is most likely easily manageable, as its objectively the worst weather, and players worrying with Aurora Veil should take comfort in the fact that any AVeil user is stuck with RU boosts at most. What I am concerned about are the Arctos - two controversial breakers who were ultimately decided to let get by thanks to them being too slow to threaten anything outside of fat builds. But now thanks to the release of Slush Rush, these two Pokémon can wreck offense. Will be closely monitoring them and will ban if needed.

:ss/pincurchin: :ss/raichu-alola:
Terrain in general looks very strong, but I decided to take a special mention to Electric Terrain, as I feel its the most consistent of the bunch. Raichu-Alola is definitely a problem, as Rising Voltage is EXTREMELY difficult to come into, especially if boosted by Choice Specs or just Nasty Plot. Its secondary STAB and colourful coverage options give it means to break past most traditional means of checking electric types as well. Its definitely a banworthy candidate, but I all want to observe how shifts will affect its placement and what checks it by passing judgement.

:ss/archeops: :ss/sirfetchd: :ss/sigilyph: :ss/machamp: :ss/virizion:
Crown Tundra has resulted in the displacement of several notable Pokemon that use to reside in upper tiers prior to its arrival, and as such, forced plenty of top threats in lower tiers (we all remember Terrakion and Conk in RU). RU and NU (for the most part) have recovered from that, but unfortunately for PU (and us), the same cannot be said. Thus threats that are not only truly RU and NU worthy lurk in PU giving them PU level power. For perspective, last time TS was OMOTM, Sigilyph and Sirfetchd gained UU boosts, while now they get PU! While PU has yet to do its major ban slate an with the incoming shifts, this paragraph (and frankly this whole post) may become largely irrelevant by tomorrow, but if worse case scenario happens and all of these top threats stay unbanned, expect action to be taken on the lot of them.


Thanks for giving this a read, I look forward to leading Tier Shift into 2021!
 
So the previous gen rule that running a banned ability reduces your shift was removed for Gen 8?

I missed that. My bad. Yea so rain should be pretty unusable with the banning of damp rock combined with the fact that politoed is still pretty awful with only RU boosts
 
Right-o let's talk about the Pokemon in places they probably shouldn't be and the mess we'll have to deal with should they decide to stay

:virizion:
91 / 130 / 112 / 130 / 169 / 148
To nobody's surprise this has insane stats, but just how good it is? Having 91/169 SpDef is certainly nice (in more ways than one), and it's got great Speed and good offensive stats. The problem comes in with that STAB combo: dealing with Ghost, Poison, and Flying is going to be rough for Virizion, and there are plenty that can take its hits. Virizion is also mediocre in the Specially Offensive department, lacking any non-STAB and Normal moves outside Air Slash.


:sigilyph:
72 / 98 / 120 / 143 / 120 / 137
what the fuck. if flying/psychic wasn't so exploitable this would be an absolute nightmare. right now it's just your average, run-of-the-mill nightmare. Not as fast or powerful as Kadabra is (hell even Solosis hits harder), but what it does have is a more unique, probably better typing, actual defenses, and a much improved movepool.

:exploud:
104 / 131 / 103 / 131 / 113 / 108
In an era where getting teammates onto the field is easier than ever, this guy looks extremely promising. Scrappy Boomburst is one of the freest moves in the entire game and, as a three-stage Normal types, Exploud has access to tons of strange coverage moves to help blow past anything that might want to try and wall it. Having all defensive stats sit nice and pretty above Base 100 isn't too shabby either.

:machamp:
90 / 170 / 120 / 105 / 125 / 95
Does so much damage it makes other sources of damage seem irrelevant. The combination of CC/Knock/Facade is horrifying to face, especially in the face of a Guts boost off 482 Attack. Even if this does leave PU it's going to be getting better stats than it did last gen assuming RU is off the table.

:gigalith:
85 / 175 / 170 / 100 / 120 / 65
Weather Ball Gigalith is finally viable. If you're bad. A Pure-Rock typing with auto-sand + phenomenal bulk is bound to be good, especially one with such devastating attack power. Still really let down by lack of recovery, but this may as well be the textbook definition of a tank.

:mienshao:
65 / 155 / 90 / 125 / 90 / 135
Mieinshao with NU boosts is not okay. Gaining CC this gen is incredible for it, though I could see some still tempted by the raw power of Reckless HJK. Regen is also better now that this can actually stomach hits.

:sylveon:
95 / 95 / 95 / 140 / 160 / 90
As someone who has had a lot of experience with Sylveon being stronger than should be allowed, this immediately caught my attention. No Hidden Power is a setback but Mystical Fire is good compensation all things considered. Still has really strong Hyper Voices and enough attack to potentially run some of its cooler physical moves, like Quick Attack or Body Slam.

:xurkitree:
83 / 109 / 91 / 193 / 91 / 103
this guy walks up to your om and "252+ SpA Xurkitree Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Electric Terrain: 339-400 (47.4 - 56%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO" its ass wyd
In all seriousness this really suffers from not having tail glow and not having the best speed all things considered, but i can't get over how gross that special attack stat is

Onto more serious and likely permanent topics

:thwackey:
70 / 125 / 110 / 95 / 100 / 120
Reminder that this exists and, for all intents and purposes, is just a straight upgrade of offensive Rillaboom sets. Having low HP is a letdown for Wood Hammer recoil, but in exchange you have vastly improved speed and beefed up defenses that nearly matches its evolved form's physical side and actually improves on the special side. It doesn't even miss on on Rilla's best moves in Glide, WH, Knock, SD, Acro, and U-Turn.

:tangrowth:
100 / 110 / 135 / 120 / 60 / 60
Falling to UU this gen has done a lot to shorten the gap between it and Tangela. This is better on the physical side but loses out on the special side, while being slower as well. The only other real advantages over Tangela is having enough HP for 101 substitutes, which is probably not worth running, and access so some other moves like EQ. Had this been in RU Tang would be a great "side-grade" to Tangela, but as it stands now its pretty niche.

:passimian:
100 / 160 / 130 / 80 / 100 / 120
May not remain PU but I see this having a ton of potential use as of now. It's strong, decently fast, and has a lot of great tools. Defiant is great to have as well. This is a famously reliable Scarfer in lower tiers and I could see it remain as such going forward. Slower sets also don't seem bad. To me this looks like a Pokemon that can make a lot of progress throughout a match while being sturdy enough to actually survive should it come in on attacks.
 
Ok guys. Starting tomorrow Tier Shift will be on ladder, so i will be notifying us of what we plan on doing for this month!

:ss/zamazenta-crowned:
Firstly, I have decided to urban Zamazenta-Crowned. Its already received even minimal discussion in OU suspecting, and Tier Shift is truly a much stronger meta than OU. Fighting types are already a major part of the metagame, so not only will the tier be heavily prepped for it, but it will also be weak to the most popular wallbreakers. Thus I have determined that it deserves the chance to roam free.
how will it be usable with base zamazenta banned? will it be in crowned by default like in BH? or will you just complex ban it to only be usable with the crown item?
 
how will it be usable with base zamazenta banned? will it be in crowned by default like in BH? or will you just complex ban it to only be usable with the crown item?
It's just like how base Silvally is in a higher tier than some Silvally forms like Bug.
 
Right-o let's talk about the Pokemon in places they probably shouldn't be and the mess we'll have to deal with should they decide to stay

:virizion:
91 / 130 / 112 / 130 / 169 / 148
To nobody's surprise this has insane stats, but just how good it is? Having 91/169 SpDef is certainly nice (in more ways than one), and it's got great Speed and good offensive stats. The problem comes in with that STAB combo: dealing with Ghost, Poison, and Flying is going to be rough for Virizion, and there are plenty that can take its hits. Virizion is also mediocre in the Specially Offensive department, lacking any non-STAB and Normal moves outside Air Slash.


:sigilyph:
72 / 98 / 120 / 143 / 120 / 137
what the fuck. if flying/psychic wasn't so exploitable this would be an absolute nightmare. right now it's just your average, run-of-the-mill nightmare. Not as fast or powerful as Kadabra is (hell even Solosis hits harder), but what it does have is a more unique, probably better typing, actual defenses, and a much improved movepool.

:exploud:
104 / 131 / 103 / 131 / 113 / 108
In an era where getting teammates onto the field is easier than ever, this guy looks extremely promising. Scrappy Boomburst is one of the freest moves in the entire game and, as a three-stage Normal types, Exploud has access to tons of strange coverage moves to help blow past anything that might want to try and wall it. Having all defensive stats sit nice and pretty above Base 100 isn't too shabby either.

:machamp:
90 / 170 / 120 / 105 / 125 / 95
Does so much damage it makes other sources of damage seem irrelevant. The combination of CC/Knock/Facade is horrifying to face, especially in the face of a Guts boost off 482 Attack. Even if this does leave PU it's going to be getting better stats than it did last gen assuming RU is off the table.

:gigalith:
85 / 175 / 170 / 100 / 120 / 65
Weather Ball Gigalith is finally viable. If you're bad. A Pure-Rock typing with auto-sand + phenomenal bulk is bound to be good, especially one with such devastating attack power. Still really let down by lack of recovery, but this may as well be the textbook definition of a tank.

:mienshao:
65 / 155 / 90 / 125 / 90 / 135
Mieinshao with NU boosts is not okay. Gaining CC this gen is incredible for it, though I could see some still tempted by the raw power of Reckless HJK. Regen is also better now that this can actually stomach hits.

:sylveon:
95 / 95 / 95 / 140 / 160 / 90
As someone who has had a lot of experience with Sylveon being stronger than should be allowed, this immediately caught my attention. No Hidden Power is a setback but Mystical Fire is good compensation all things considered. Still has really strong Hyper Voices and enough attack to potentially run some of its cooler physical moves, like Quick Attack or Body Slam.

:xurkitree:
83 / 109 / 91 / 193 / 91 / 103
this guy walks up to your om and "252+ SpA Xurkitree Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Electric Terrain: 339-400 (47.4 - 56%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO" its ass wyd
In all seriousness this really suffers from not having tail glow and not having the best speed all things considered, but i can't get over how gross that special attack stat is

Onto more serious and likely permanent topics

:thwackey:
70 / 125 / 110 / 95 / 100 / 120
Reminder that this exists and, for all intents and purposes, is just a straight upgrade of offensive Rillaboom sets. Having low HP is a letdown for Wood Hammer recoil, but in exchange you have vastly improved speed and beefed up defenses that nearly matches its evolved form's physical side and actually improves on the special side. It doesn't even miss on on Rilla's best moves in Glide, WH, Knock, SD, Acro, and U-Turn.

:tangrowth:
100 / 110 / 135 / 120 / 60 / 60
Falling to UU this gen has done a lot to shorten the gap between it and Tangela. This is better on the physical side but loses out on the special side, while being slower as well. The only other real advantages over Tangela is having enough HP for 101 substitutes, which is probably not worth running, and access so some other moves like EQ. Had this been in RU Tang would be a great "side-grade" to Tangela, but as it stands now its pretty niche.

:passimian:
100 / 160 / 130 / 80 / 100 / 120
May not remain PU but I see this having a ton of potential use as of now. It's strong, decently fast, and has a lot of great tools. Defiant is great to have as well. This is a famously reliable Scarfer in lower tiers and I could see it remain as such going forward. Slower sets also don't seem bad. To me this looks like a Pokemon that can make a lot of progress throughout a match while being sturdy enough to actually survive should it come in on attacks.
:Machamp: looks the most terrifying of any of these to face. Obviously it is slow, but it just makes it so hard for balance and stall to work. Once it gets in against something slow or non-threatening it seems like it should just get a kill against most teams. It will easily 2HKO fat mons like 252/252+ vaporeon. Maybe try switching in a fairy type? Well even if you come in on a close combat a relatively bulky offensive fairy like Silvally fairy with 0/4 investment will be 2HKOed by a combination of CC on the switch+bullet punch. You could maybe live with 252/4 or 252/252 but I feel like at that point you are really sacrificing it's overall usefulness. A bulky aromatisse should be able to switch in fine but other than that I see very few hard switch options. Problem is most of the bulkiest physical walls are weak to fighting and the second best options after that are at least neutral to CC or are weak to knock off.
 
dropping a calc for anyone interested in sun

252 SpA Choice Specs Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Toxapex in Sun: 246-291 (80.9 - 95.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


Ah.

In any case, because Crowned Zamazenta is completely separate from regular Zamazenta (it begins the battle in crowned form and cannot be revert) it is tiered completely independently.
i forgot that it starts the battle in crowned form
 
Something I would like to see for resources for Tier Shift would be a speed tier list because everything's speed is changed from normal battles. It should probably wait for the PU banlist before it is made, but it would be really helpful when preparing for certain pokemon. I am aware this would be time consuming because it would need to be updated to reflect pokemon going up and down tiers, but I think it would be worth it.
 

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