Togekiss

ab15 said:
She could just aura sphear the mole (not in sand though)
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You don't exactly see Doryuuzu outside of Sandstorm teams, so this could be a problem. It's a good thing players use Adamant Doryuuzu outside of Sand, though I can't see why they would use him over Terakion or Gatchomp (maybe for Mold Breaker Rapid Spin?)

Also, I want to post here that I'm having decent success will with Nasty Plot + Heal Bell set. Checks? Tyranitar, Scizor, and of course random weather sweepers. The lack of Roost somewhat hurts Togekiss, but I really like trolling Blissey and Cresselia.
 
Concerning Mold Breaker, it won't allow Dory to spin against Ghosts, if that's what you're implying.

As for Togekiss, is Tri-Attack + Serene Grace a reasonable option on an NP or Paraflinch set? Probably not on the Paraflinch, as you would be forgoing Aura Sphere and possibly setting a burn instead of Para/Freeze, but it gets nice power anyway.
 
Tri Attack seems workable since it gets STAB and makes good use of Serene Grace, but the type coverage you get with Air Slash sucks since you've no way around Rock and Steel types. Air Slash + Aura Sphere is always the better choice, even if it struggles with Zapdos, Borutorosu and Rotom.

Anyway, I've found Togekiss to be a pretty neat team player this generation. That SpD stat is great since it can actually survive two Draco Meteors from Specs Latios in a row with Protect. It also passes rather hefty Wishes, and is a good choice on offensive teams that don't want to run a Chansey or something.
 
Shimrit As said:
Tri Attack seems workable since it gets STAB and makes good use of Serene Grace, but the type coverage you get with Air Slash sucks since you've no way around Rock and Steel types. Air Slash + Aura Sphere is always the better choice, even if it struggles with Zapdos, Borutorosu and Rotom.

Anyway, I've found Togekiss to be a pretty neat team player this generation. That SpD stat is great since it can actually survive two Draco Meteors from Specs Latios in a row with Protect. It also passes rather hefty Wishes, and is a good choice on offensive teams that don't want to run a Chansey or something.
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For an offensive team, what set would provide both solid support and offense like you describe? I'd like to hear the set you're using, even though it's tailored to your team's needs, because I want to get a general feel of what Togekiss can accomplish this Gen.
 
Togekiss (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 68 SAtk / 188 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere

Its incredible special bulk lets it check special Birijion, non-CM Lati@s, LO Gengar and a whole bunch of other stuff. It can come out on top vs. Heatran, Urugamosu and most slow walls, and STAB Flying is super valuable when you consider all the Fighting-types running around in OU.

I'm not touting the set or saying its analysis-worthy or my own creation or something. It's just the set I've been using and it's been consistent in doing what it needs to.
 
Togekiss has been working really well for me, in a number of roles:
Dual-Screen+ Wish Pass
Paraflinch with Heal Bell (best set IMO)
Nasty Plot + 3 Attacks
NAsty Plot + 2 Attacks + Roost/Heal Bell/Substitute.

Generally only Zapdos and Jolteon have caused me problems, mainly due to abilities. Roobushin and Doryzuu are easily dealth with, with Togekiss surviving Life Orb Rock Slide from Doryzuu with roughly 10-13% HP left, whilst Aura Sphere is a OHKO with Rocks down, provided Modest 252 EV's. Roobushin is OHKO'd or 2HKO'd by Air Slash so it poses no real problem. Tyranitar is dealt with easily enough too, though it depends on the set it's running more than the other 'checks'
 
Shimrit As said:
Togekiss (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 68 SAtk / 188 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere

Its incredible special bulk lets it check special Birijion, non-CM Lati@s, LO Gengar and a whole bunch of other stuff. It can come out on top vs. Heatran, Urugamosu and most slow walls, and STAB Flying is super valuable when you consider all the Fighting-types running around in OU.

I'm not touting the set or saying its analysis-worthy or my own creation or something. It's just the set I've been using and it's been consistent in doing what it needs to.
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That seems like a really interesting set, as I do enjoy using a Togekiss (had one on almost every team of mine) I will give it a trial run
 
Shimrit As said:
Togekiss (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 68 SAtk / 188 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere

Its incredible special bulk lets it check special Birijion, non-CM Lati@s, LO Gengar and a whole bunch of other stuff. It can come out on top vs. Heatran, Urugamosu and most slow walls, and STAB Flying is super valuable when you consider all the Fighting-types running around in OU.

I'm not touting the set or saying its analysis-worthy or my own creation or something. It's just the set I've been using and it's been consistent in doing what it needs to.
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While the set is good, it does not beat Ulgamoth. It sets up a Butterfly Dance, is faster so you can't flinch it, and has Morning Sun to heal itself.

Oh, and what are the SpAtk EVs for?
 
After one dance, Urugamosu's Fire Dance does ~40% and your Air Slash averages slightly more. I think it's probably a 50/50 thing but if you have your hazards up you should come out on top. I put the SpA as filler lol. Calm + all those EVs are for Specs Latios Draco Meteor.
 
Hmmmm… interesting. I'll have to try out both a wishpassing and a healbell set. The team I'm building needs a cleric that can go on the offensive anyway, and I want to try out something a little less conventional this time around like Togekiss or Gardevoir.
 
yawn said:
An entire togekiss discussion without mentioning its best set?!?

Togekiss @ Choice Scarf
Timid
Serene Grace
6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
~ Trick
~ Air Slash
~ Aura Sphere/Yawn
~ Roost/Wish

Yeah, trick is hgss move tutor only, but otherwise with the scarf air slash is amazing. Even better, the rotom forms lose their ghost typing so aura sphere covers all of its counters except zapdos. Yawn is still an option since togekiss has nice bulk to survive.
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That is the nice set from the others I seen, I'd go for more for attack variety instead of combo. I'd like air slash, flamethrower, trick, and something one more thing.

is tri attack a special move?
 
I think its notable to note that Rotom A is no longer a ghost type, and thusly not resistant to aura sphere (unless your a fan). So that basically leaves you with Zapdos. I know people have theorymonning tri attack on this thread, but is it viable to hit mons that resist Air Slash and are neutral to aura sphere. Or would Hidden Power Ice be better?
 
Hidden Power Ice does have the advantage of having 20+ more power super effectively than a neutral Tri Attack would, but then again...both of them aren't very practical options because Togekiss already achieves perfect coverage with Air Slash, Aura Sphere, and Fire Blast/Flamethrower.

Togekiss also doesn't like the possibility of being outsped by Zapdos and never using Hidden Power, so it resorts to Fire Blast. After a Nasty Plot boost, Fire Blast already puts a dent into Zapdos anyways. Other targets of Hidden Power Ice are hit by a moderately powerful Air Slash or Aura Sphere.

And yes, Tri Attack is a special move. Shame on you, Dodrio.

As far as EV spreads go, I'm ultra sensitive about outspeeding Breloom. Not many Togekiss teammates likes taking a Spore to the face, but that's my preference. Togekiss is in with Dragonite and Shandera for average Speed; not good, and yet not bad.
 
Isn't there an item that increases the odds of secondary effects happening?? Maybe this could be used in conjunction with ancientpower/ominous wind??
 
lmitchell0012 said:
Isn't there an item that increases the odds of secondary effects happening?? Maybe this could be used in conjunction with ancientpower/ominous wind??
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No only Serene Grace is capable of increasing secondary effects, no items exist to boost that further otherwise... *imagines an even further boosted Jirachi/Togekiss/Skymin-S*
 
Togekiss:
XD Gale of Darkness

If you are lucky enough to get this pokemon, (like me! :)) with pretty almost flawless IV's then this pokemon is just amazing.

Togekiss@Life Orb/ Leftovers
Timid, Serene Grace
EV: 88 Def | 124 SpA | 46 SpD | 252 Spe
-Tri Attack
-Air Slash
-Nasty Plot
-Baton Pass/Aura Sphere
This set can wall a jolly lucario using ice punch@life orb if it has 31 IV's all around, with 88 Def.
It can air slash hax most pokemon, and destroy with STAB tri-attack, (with a 40% burn/freeze/paralysis)
 
King's Rock COULD be used to increase the flinch chance of the already hax-inducing Air Slash, but Thunder Wave and Leftovers kind of compensates for the lack of bulk (and the hidden cheapness behind King's Rock). King's Rock never did make it in Jirachi's or Togekiss' analyses on Smogon, so it's not quite as viable (if you could call it that...) as anybody thinks. Why? It doesn't stack with Serene Grace.

Other than that, not sure I want to run anything other than Choice items (besides Band), Leftovers, of Life Orb though. Leftovers especially.
 
sometimes i run CBkiss for the lulz

Togekiss @Choiceband
Hustle/ 252 att/ 60 hp/ 196 speed
Extremespeed/ Drain punch/ Aerial Ace/ Trick

This was a ginormous gimmick, but it was fun. Extremespeed is the main draw, with choice Band and hustle pushing kiss's subpar attack to acceptable levels (424 iirc). I used Brick Break in fourth gen, but Drain punch is better in 5, so use that. If you have giant balls, you can use focus punch, but i wouldn't. Aeriel ace is better than Zen Headbutt and gives you a more reliable Stab move that will never miss (important when using hustle.) Trick is filler; It might be useful to disable random crap like Suicune, but this kiss really need the power band provides.
 
Straight from the Smogon page on King's Rock:

Precisely the following moves gain a 10% flinch chance. Moves that already have a flinch chance in the following list do gain an additional chance to flinch when the user holds King's Rock. The total flinch chance for a move with inherent flinch chance p when the user holds King's Rock and the move appears in the following list is given by p + (1 - p) * 0.1. For example, a Serene Grace Pokemon using Air Slash while holding King's Rock has a 0.6 + (1 - 0.6) * 0.1 = 64% chance to flinch.
 
Look at it this way: King's Rock gives it a 10% chance to flinch. However, 60% of those times (6% of total), it would have flinched anyway, so the real benefit is 10%-6%=4%.
 
Gimmick Togekis FTW
Modest (252 Hp/ 160 Def/ 96 SpA)
Serene Grace @ Leftovers
Thunder Wave
Ancient Power
Silver Wind
Ominous Wind

T-wave then spam and pray for boosts. Hehe. It is strictly for fun... and people will never see it coming...
But it is extremely unreliable. Luck is fun.
 
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