Pet Mod Ubermons - Concluded

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
Voting has started!

You can vote for a maximum of three people. Self-Votes are allowed but not in first place.

Currently only this submission is vetoed:
Kyogre-Primal


Changes that were made: Stats, Typing, Movepool
Types:

Abilities: Primordial Sea
Stats: 95 / 105 (+25) / 100 (+10) / 150 (+40) / 135 (+15) / 85 (+10) BST: 670
Movepool Changes: Dragon Tail, Dragon Pulse, Outrage
Description: An excellent wall... WIP

Other : WIP...
Voting will last for 3 days, have fun and good luck!
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
:groudon-primal: Mygavolt, abismal, analysis geek
:kyogre-primal: Mygavolt, analysis geek, ViZar
:rayquaza-mega: abismal, Mygavolt, analysis geek
:necrozma-ultra: abismal, ViZar, Mygavolt
 

G-Luke

#Cunogate
is a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
:groudon-primal: ViZar, Mygavolt, abismal
:kyogre-primal: analysis geek, ViZar, Mygavolt
:rayquaza-mega: Mygavolt, ViZar, analysis geek
:necrozma-ultra: ViZar, Mygavolt, abismal


People blanket voting abismal tells me all I need to know about people's thoughts on balance for this metagame
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
Here's the winner and you who it is...

Congrats to abismal for winning all Pokemon!

Pokémon: Primal Groudon
Changes that were made: Stats, Primal Reversion
Types:

Abilities: Desolate Land
Stats: 90 HP / 160 Atk / 155 Def / 110 SpA / 90 SpD / 65 Spe [BST: 670]
Movepool Changes: none
Description: Rather than being able to Primal-Revert right off the bat, this way Groudon-Primal becomes a bit more prediction reliant. In order to activate it, you'd need to be throwing yourself at a water, ice or grass type, which can be more easily done when replacing a fainted pokemon. I don't have a lot to say because, its just Primal Groudon.


Pokémon: Primal Kyogre
Changes that were made: Stats, Typing, Primal Reversion
Types:

Abilities: Primordial Sea
Stats: 95 HP / 120 Atk / 120 Def / 140 SpA / 120 SpD / 75 Spe [BST: 670]
Movepool Changes: +Earth Power
Description: In order to make this mechanic a bit interesting, I gave Kyogre the Ground typing. 1. This helps it have a better match-up against Groudon, and 2. It can gain an immunity to Electric moves when switching into them, but it is definitely not a safe option against Grass pokemon. Water/Ground is also really freaking powerful bearing 1 weakness, and its added bulk lets it run Calm Mind more effectively, and even has the option of running Rest/Talk sets for longevity.


Pokémon: Mega Rayquaza
Changes that were made: Stats, Movepool, Mega Evolution
Types:

Abilities: Delta Stream
Stats: 85 HP / 145 Atk / 95 Def / 145 SpA / 90 SpD / 110 Spe [BST: 670]
Movepool Changes: +Extreme Speed
Description: So, Mega Rayquaza can still technically hold an item, at least prior to Mega Evolving. This allows it to run things like Heavy-Duty Boots to land onto the field safely before setting up a sweep, or it can run a berry or weakness policy or focus sash. Honestly the options are pretty much endless, the idea that it can hold an item makes it broken but I thought this would add some variety to my idea.


Pokémon: Ultra Necrozma
Changes that were made: Stats, Typing, Movepool
Types:

Abilities: Neuroforce
Stats: 97 HP / 139 Atk / 91 Def / 139 SpA / 91 SpD / 127 Spe [BST: 684]
Movepool Changes: +Crunch
Description: Psychic/Dragon faces some competition with the Lati twins, so I thought a completely offensive typing with Neuroforce could be interesting. It lacks most of the coverage Mega Mewtwo-Y possesses, but it makes up for with powerful STAB and a pretty free Z-Move it can launch at any time. Prism Armor prior to ultra bursting is handy to setup with Calm Mind, Dragon Dance or Swords dance.
When the pokemon is holding a Red Orb or Blue Orb, Primal Reversion triggers when they switch into a pokemon with a super-effective move.
When Rayquaza mega evolves, its held item will be incinerated.
These are interesting takes for the Primals, Mega Rayquaza and Ultra Necrozma, excited to see how they'll do in a playtesting phase. Speaking of which:


Slate 20: Fly Home
:ss/tornadus-therian:

You didn't expect this. I was there, sitting and thinking how to continue this mod + when do to playtesting and I realised that this metagame just got stronger, faster and bulkier with :tornadus-therian::darkrai::naganadel: being the lesser Ubers. What to do? Simple, we will do a real suspect test, kind of. For 2 weeks you can collect data, discuss the Pokemon in question and make suggestions for making it balanced. As a requirement, you have to provide a replay with Tornadus-Therian if you want to change it in someway.

Discussion will close on Friday (10rd June) at 4 pm (GMT +1)
Have Fun!​
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
This mod is really close on being done, so might as well bring it back to live one, and hopefully, last time. The reason why I normally wanted to test Tornadus-T instead of adding to a slate, is because it is one of the weaker bans, at least compared to the Box Legends and others. With the meta getting powercrept with each slate, I figured that we could maybe just unban it. Is that the case thought? Here's my opinion.

1. Defensive Sets
:ss/tornadus-therian:
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- U-turn
- Knock Off / Toxic
- Defog / Toxic
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Assault-Vest:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
- Knock Off / Icy Wind
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- Taunt
- Toxic

Defensive sets are good additions to the tier since they provide a fast Defog user that is, first useful and second provides more than Defog. Its good offenses make it less reliant on stuff like Toxic to do damage and combined with Hurricane, it can dish out a lot of damage. Furthermore, its movepool is good. You have Hurricane, U-turn, Defog but also Knock Off, Toxic, Taunt and Icy Wind for utility and Heat Wave, Focus Blast and Sludge Bomb for coverage. Nasty Plot can also be fit to break through bulkier teams.

Checks
:blissey::clefable::dialga::heatran::lunala::magearna::necrozma-dusk-mane::tapu-koko::toxapex::tyranitar::tyranitar-mega::weavile::zacian-crowned::zapdos::zekrom::zygarde:
:arceus: (Pretty much all)

Victims
:blaziken::blaziken-mega::groudon::groudon-primal::lucario-mega::marshadow::mewtwo-mega-x::rillaboom::scizor-mega::serperior::urshifu::zamazenta:
:arceus: (Offensive variants)
2. Offensive Sets
:ss/tornadus-therian:
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots: :flyinium-z::fightinium-z:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast
- U-turn
- Nasty Plot
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots::Life-Orb::flyinium-z:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Weather Ball
- Focus Blast / Heat Wave
- Nasty Plot / U-turn
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Assault-Vest:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast
- Heat Wave
- U-turn

Speaking of Nasty Plot and breaking through teams, offensive sets are a menace and the reason why (spoiler) I wouldn't unban it yet and instead move onto a balance slate. Its speed is really good and its aforementioned coverage compliments its good traits very well. Nasty Plot is one thing, but Z-Moves bypassing the shaky accuracy of Hurricane or Focus Blast and giving those already strong moves more power is just ludicrous. Those two aspects make it quite hard to switch in. Revengekilling with Scarfers, Koko, Greninja, Zekrom, Zeraora, Lopunny and Weavile, which are admittingly good Pokemon, are the only options to outoffense it

Checks
:blissey::clefable::lunala::tapu-koko::weavile::zapdos::zekrom:
:arceus: (Electic > Rock > Steel)

Victims
Almost the entire metagame.



3. Conclussion

I think that the only issue with Tornadus-Therian is its access to Nasty Plot. Without it, its offensive sets are still threatening but actually wallable. Defensive sets are quite useful in the meta and the meta could really use its traits as a Flying-type with Regenerator and good utility moves.
 
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G-Luke

#Cunogate
is a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
This mod is really close on being done, so might as well bring it back to live one, and hopefully, last time. The reason why I normally wanted to test Tornadus-T instead of adding to a slate, is because it is one of the weaker bans, at least compared to the Box Legends and others. With the meta getting powercrept with each slate, I figured that we could maybe just unban it. Is that the case thought? Here's my opinion.

1. Defensive Sets
:ss/tornadus-therian:
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- U-turn
- Knock Off / Toxic
- Defog / Toxic
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Assault-Vest:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
- Knock Off / Icy Wind
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- Taunt
- Toxic

Defensive sets are good additions to the tier since they provide a fast Defog user that is, first useful and second provides more than Defog. Its good offenses make it less reliant on stuff like Toxic to do damage and combined with Hurricane, it can dish out a lot of damage. Furthermore, its movepool is good. You have Hurricane, U-turn, Defog but also Knock Off, Toxic, Taunt and Icy Wind for utility and Heat Wave, Focus Blast and Sludge Bomb for coverage. Nasty Plot can also be fit to break through bulkier teams.

Checks
:blissey::clefable::dialga::heatran::lunala::magearna::necrozma-dusk-mane::tapu-koko::toxapex::tyranitar::tyranitar-mega::weavile::zacian-crowned::zapdos::zekrom::zygarde:
:arceus: (Pretty much all)

Victims
:blaziken::blaziken-mega::groudon::groudon-primal::lucario-mega::marshadow::mewtwo-mega-x::rillaboom::scizor-mega::serperior::urshifu::zamazenta:
:arceus: (Offensive variants)
2. Offensive Sets
:ss/tornadus-therian:
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots: :flyinium-z::fightinium-z:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast
- U-turn
- Nasty Plot
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Heavy-Duty-Boots::Life-Orb::flyinium-z:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Weather Ball
- Focus Blast / Heat Wave
- Nasty Plot / U-turn
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ :Assault-Vest:
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast
- Heat Wave
- U-turn

Speaking of Nasty Plot and breaking through teams, offensive sets are a menace and the reason why (spoiler) I wouldn't unban it yet and instead move onto a balance slate. Its speed is really good and its aforementioned coverage compliments its good traits very well. Nasty Plot is one thing, but Z-Moves bypassing the shaky accuracy of Hurricane or Focus Blast and giving those already strong moves more power is just ludicrous. Those two aspects make it quite hard to switch in. Revengekilling with Scarfers, Koko, Greninja, Zekrom, Zeraora, Lopunny and Weavile, which are admittingly good Pokemon, are the only options to outoffense it

Checks
:blissey::clefable::lunala::tapu-koko::weavile::zapdos::zekrom:
:arceus: (Electic > Rock > Steel)

Victims
Almost the entire metagame.



3. Conclussion

I think that the only issue with Tornadus-Therian is its access to Nasty Plot. Without it, its offensive sets are still threatening but actually wallable. Defensive sets are quite useful in the meta and the meta could really use its traits as a Flying-type with Regenerator and good utility moves.
I think removing Nasty Plot is a clean cut way to rebalance Tornadus-Therian. Sure it loses the ability to outright wallbreak, but Flyinium Z even without NP was a viable offensive pivot set in Generation 7, prior to NP's addition.
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
Slate 20.1 Suggestions & Voting
:ss/tornadus-therian:

We will move on to a mixed slate for Tornadus-Therian. You can submit simple/small changes to Tornadus-Therian to be balanced in the tier. If you don't think that Tornadus-Therian has to be changed, then you can just vote: No Changes. If you submit a change, then you have to provide a small justification, however if you submit a suggestion, you automatically vote for it. You can also vote for suggestions that have been brought up.
Note: Overhauls or big changes will be vetoed.


I personally agree with G-Luke to just remove Nasty Plot. It is the move that makes its offensive sets really hard to deal with.
Therefore my suggestion and ultimately, my vote is going to be: Change: Removed Nasty Plot

I will keep this Vote open for 72 hours. If you change your vote, then lmk via Discord.​
 
personally i hate it having nasty plot regardless of z-moves but when z-moves are taken into account tornadus just becomes ridiculous, and i think at least for me and my observations Tornadus seems to be one of the main offenders when talking about "are z-moves broken"

so yeah the only change necessary is removing nasty plot
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
With a unanimous vote, Tornadus as a whole will loose access to Nasty Plot and Tornadus-Therian will get unbanned without further changes.

Without furtherado, we will now move onto the next slate.

Slate 21: Enter Sandman
:ss/darkrai:

With the nerf to Dark Void, Darkrai become, pretty much, unviable Uber Pokemon. However, when packing Nasty Plot and Z-Moves, it can easily defeat most opponents. Darkrai will most likely not be fully unbanned in this tier and thus will go under some balance changes. We will still allow it for 2 weeks to see how we go about it or if it doesn't need fixing.

This slate will end on 24th August at 4 pm (GMT+2)​
 

Ema Skye

Work!
is a Pre-Contributor
Remove NP. Boost Dark Void accuracy to 75. It resonates with its intended playstyle revolving around sleep, but doesn't become as punishing without NP boosting.
 

G-Luke

#Cunogate
is a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Remove NP. Boost Dark Void accuracy to 75. It resonates with its intended playstyle revolving around sleep, but doesn't become as punishing without NP boosting.
This is an insane thing to say considering a lot of the best Darkrai sets in Ubers never loaded up Nasty Plot.....
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
We are currently testing Darkrai and thus no suggestions yet, just sharing first impressions and experiences. I have a feeling that Darkrai without NP is still too strong and I would like to figure out how to balance it properly. So please, do not share any suggestions yet
 

ViZar

Each and Every Day
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
I came here to announce that Darkrai is now playable in the tier!

With that, I wanted to share some initial thoughts and some sets that I created and there were some sets that I didn't think of.


General thoughts: It's broken. Like I said in my intial slate announcement, its speed and special attack combined with Nasty Plot and Z-Moves is overwhelmning. However, there are other things that limit its counterplay. First, it's Sludge Bomb. Hitting Fairies is huge and it limits counterplay even more. In addition, it has access to the changed Spacial Rend. For the uninitiated, Spacial Rend summons Gravity and with the boost in accuracy, Hypnosis has a 100% accuracy, therefore it can put an opposing Pokemon out of commision. The only drawback is that it needs Dark Pulse as STAB, Spacial Rend and Hypnosis, so it has to give up on coverage or Nasty Plot, but the extra 1/8 damage you deal makes out for that.

With that let's get to the Sample Sets. I will not provide any further informations on them, since they are self-explainetory and I already talked about them with my intial thoughts.

Nasty Plot Sweeper
:ss/Darkrai: @ :Darkinium-Z: / :life-orb: / :fightinium-z:
Ability: Bad Dreams
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Focus Blast
- Nasty Plot

Hypnosis Attacker
:ss/Darkrai: @ :Leftovers:
Ability: Bad Dreams
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Spacial Rend
- Hypnosis

All-out Attacker
:ss/Darkrai: @ :Life-Orb:
Ability: Bad Dreams
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Focus Blast
- Sludge Bomb
- Sucker Punch

Utility Attacker
:ss/Darkrai: @ :Black-Glasses:
Ability: Bad Dreams
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Focus Blast
- Knock Off / Pursuit / Taunt / Will-O-Wisp
- Sucker Punch / Pursuit / Taunt / Will-O-Wisp

All in all, Darkrai has to undergo some changes. I don't know how to go about them, but removing Nasty Plot is a must. However, I think that a secondary change has to be done too.
 

koista12

I COULD BE BANNED!
Hot take but I don't think there's anything wrong with playing into Darkrai's ability to abuse sleep. Fast sleep inducers arent inherently uncompetitive or tier ruining imo, but they are obviously powerful. I would say remove Sludge Bomb and 10 Speed. This puts Darkrai at a much more manageable 115 Speed, and makes it deadweight against fairies outside of Sleep. I think giving Darkrai a unique identity other than special, much bulkier weavile would be something that's worth trying. If that's still too much, try removing Nasty Plot.
 

G-Luke

#Cunogate
is a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Can we actually submit some nerfs? All this talk and no actual subs

:Ss/Darkrai::Darkrai:
Pokémon: Darkrai
Changes: Stats, Movepool, Dark Void
Types:

Abilities: Bad Dreams
Stats: 70 HP / 110 Atk / 90 Def / 125 SpA / 90 SpD / 110 Spe [BST: 600]
Movepool Changes: -Sludge Bomb, -Thunder
Custom Effects: Dark Void - 65% Acc. Perfect acc against Dark, Ghost and Bug type Pokémon.
Description: Darkrai had it's speed scaled down to the common 110 speed tier, while losing 10 SpA and Sludge Bomb leave it unable to punch holes into Fairies, it's biggest natural check. Also axed Thunder so Electrium Z didn't go off either. For them it relies on sleep inducing with Dark Void or breaking past them with a Z-Move. Even so, Darkrai is a menace to face.
 
Last edited:

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