Metagame Ubers Metagame and Set Discussion

Nayrz

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Ubers Leader

With all the data out there and speculation mostly had, I think it's time to move on to actual metagame discussion! This thread is the place to give your points of view on the current metagame as well as popular or underrated sets. Until we get more things like projects, resources and VR to put in here I'll refer back to the old thread that had all the data and early metagame speculation.

Thread Guidelines:

- Discussion should only be focused around SS Ubers and its metagame. No national dex stuff.
- Discussion should only be focused around what is currently (or recently announced will be) available! Theorymon on the upcoming events are a no go in here until they arrive.
- Follow the rules, and keep things peaceful.
- Questions go here.
- Other generations discussion goes here.

Have at it!
 
Hello Ladies and Gentlemen My name is Skysolo and im here to present the team you want to use in SWSH.
https://pokepast.es/96edbd17a50cffed
top 1.jpg

Now you're probably asking yourself, " This team has no Hazards ", " where is the goth quag core?? ". well bump those, The main focus on this team was meant to be around Toxtricity who is a potent threat with its ability Punk Rock and access to sound moves like Boomburst and Overdrive. its unique typing also allows to serve as a decent offensive check to Zacian and Zamazenta. Another mon i wanted to use was also CB Zamazenta as it's an extremely good wallbreaker with it's STAB Close Combat, Crunch hits ghost types like Aegislash and Corsola-galar, Wild Charge smashes toxapex and gyarados, and Iron Tail for fairies like clefable. Corviknight is here to remove hazards as well as check and stop a number mons such as excadrill, and the legendary dogs notably. Ditto is here because its honestly one of the best mons right now in pretty much both Ubers and OU as its able to stop dynamax sweeps by dynamaxing on its own. Gyarados and Zacian are the premier wallbreakers of the team notably gyarados with dd sub as it's able to sub up vs mons like Toxapex. Zacian is another monster that has the potential to ohkos or 2hkos half tier with a swords dance up.

Threatlist: too many to list honestly like come on

Hopefully we get to see some interesting games for SWSH in the upcoming team tour for new ideas and innovation. looking forward to it :)
 

Y8

formerly ara
Hey, im gonna share a team that has had some success within the few ladder games i played and vs a few of my friends (who are good at ubers trust me)

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Behemoth Blade
- Play Rough
- Sacred Sword

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Whirlwind
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Toxic

Eternatus @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Cosmic Power
- Dynamax Cannon
- Flamethrower
- Recover

Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Transform

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance
- Bounce
- Substitute

This team focuses on crippling opponents with quag and eternatus so zacian and gyara can cleanup, gyara can dd sub dynamax and claim afew kills if used correctly but does not get sent out early on against more bulkier teams as it lacks coverage for certain pokemon that are dominant in the meta. Ditto is used to transform into opposing zacian/shuckle/eternatus or any mon that can hard check zacian/gyarados, ditto applies offensive pressure within setting up because of imposter, choice scarf is the obvious set letting it transform outspeed and then proceed to kill the opposing mon. Quagsire can use toxic+scald to weaken opposing threats like hippowdown/ excadrill/ eternatus/zamazenta and or corviknight if burned, while you may rely on chance for burns for most of the pokemon to be cripplied correctly scald can still do a pretty decent job without the burn. Hippowdown runs whirlwind to switch out potential setup sweepers like corviknight, zacian, sometimes gyara if played correctly, running EQ helps vs the eternatus mu and vs the zacian matchup while being able to live one of each of their best stab moves and can return an attack that does a decent load of damage. Eternatus runs cosmic power recover for the sake of keeping it healthy for opposing eternatus' while dynamax cannon still does so much you have a zacian for the immunity, This team is more on the bulkier side and can deal with most of the more predominant threats in ubers rn

Quick Edit: You could also run a Haban berry set i stole from Holy Ghost which can benenfit more depending on the mu

Eternatus @ Haban Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon
- Flamethrower
- Protect
- Sludge Wave

Hope u enjoy the team btw shouts to Holy Ghost Six
 
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dream

It's Prime Time
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Hey, im gonna share a team that has had some success within the few ladder games i played and vs a few of my friends (who are good at ubers trust me)

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Behemoth Blade
- Play Rough
- Sacred Sword

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Whirlwind
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Toxic

Eternatus @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Cosmic Power
- Dynamax Cannon
- Flamethrower
- Recover

Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Transform

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance
- Bounce
- Substitute

This team focuses on crippling opponents with quag and eternatus so zacian and gyara can cleanup, gyara can dd sub dynamax and claim afew kills if used correctly but does not get sent out early on against more bulkier teams as it lacks coverage for certain pokemon that are dominant in the meta. Ditto is used to transform into opposing zacian/shuckle/eternatus or any mon that can hard check zacian/gyarados, ditto applies offensive pressure within setting up because of imposter, choice scarf is the obvious set letting it transform outspeed and then proceed to kill the opposing mon. Quagsire can use toxic+scald to weaken opposing threats like hippowdown/ excadrill/ eternatus/zamazenta and or corviknight if burned, while you may rely on chance for burns for most of the pokemon to be cripplied correctly scald can still do a pretty decent job without the burn. Hippowdown runs whirlwind to switch out potential setup sweepers like corviknight, zacian, sometimes gyara if played correctly, running EQ helps vs the eternatus mu and vs the zacian matchup while being able to live one of each of their best stab moves and can return an attack that does a decent load of damage. Eternatus runs cosmic power recover for the sake of keeping it healthy for opposing eternatus' while dynamax cannon still does so much you have a zacian for the immunity, This team is more on the bulkier side and can deal with most of the more predominant threats in ubers rn

Quick Edit: You could also run a Haban berry set i stole from Holy Ghost which can benenfit more depending on the mu

Eternatus @ Haban Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon
- Flamethrower
- Protect
- Sludge Wave

Hope u enjoy the team btw shouts to Holy Ghost Six
Team feels a little awkward as presently constructed. I feel like having both Quag and Hippo is both redundant and just doesn't really fit with what I assume you're trying to accomplish with this (both huge momentum drains that tend to check similar Pokemon), plus the fact that you have both Hippo and Quag and neither has Shed Shell just makes you disgustingly weak to opposing Gothitelle, which all of a sudden dismantles your defensive backbone, leaving you more and more susceptible to being overloaded. Toxapex also kinda just sits on all of your Pokemon, so there's that too. I'm not really sure how to "fix" these without changing what you're going for/the idea behind the team, but hey, Cosmic Eternatus is cool!
 

Y8

formerly ara
Team feels a little awkward as presently constructed. I feel like having both Quag and Hippo is both redundant and just doesn't really fit with what I assume you're trying to accomplish with this (both huge momentum drains that tend to check similar Pokemon), plus the fact that you have both Hippo and Quag and neither has Shed Shell just makes you disgustingly weak to opposing Gothitelle, which all of a sudden dismantles your defensive backbone, leaving you more and more susceptible to being overloaded. Toxapex also kinda just sits on all of your Pokemon, so there's that too. I'm not really sure how to "fix" these without changing what you're going for/the idea behind the team, but hey, Cosmic Eternatus is cool!
nah youre completely right now that i take a second look at the team i realize where it struggles, im currently figuring out ideas to replace hippo and put shed shell on quag, i made this team and completely forgot about those two specific mons when building which is where the team lacks, ill find a better variant to the team and update it to make it more suitable and viable for the meta, thanks for the feedback
 
What methods of Imposter proofing are people using? The only things I can think of are Substitute, Unburden Hawlucha and Silvally, of which only Substitute is at all practical in ubers.

I'm quite worried that the omnipresence of Ditto is gonna make this meta a stallfest tbh.
 

Cynara

How cute...
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What methods of Imposter proofing are people using? The only things I can think of are Substitute, Unburden Hawlucha and Silvally, of which only Substitute is at all practical in ubers.

I'm quite worried that the omnipresence of Ditto is gonna make this meta a stallfest tbh.
Sub on Zacian has commonly arised off the top of my head. Sub eternatus is also worth exploring maybe. As you can probably tell sub mons are usually the best way to go since ditto cant copy mons behind a substitute.

I do agree that Ditto is a top tier pokemon but it feels like its more a byproduct of Zacian, the real demon is Gothitelle, which many people are putting on their teams as the main abuser with Zacian to completely remove its defensive checks and render most stalls useless. The set is as follows if youre curious:

Gothitelle @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Cosmic Power
- Trick
- Rest
- Stored Power

Methods people are using to get around this are Spikes Uturn mew instead of ferrothorn and U turn on Corviknight, Shed Shell Quagsire etc and I feel this shows how much of a pressing issue.

Irrelevant to the above post but I feel Coil Centiskorch is worth exploring as a offensive Zacian Check, Behemoth Blade really feels like a ladder move but it isnt really an issue for Centiskorch, it can easily Coil and 1v1 Zacian and dynamax when required. It also has power whip to bypass Quagsire as an unaware wall.
 
What methods of Imposter proofing are people using? The only things I can think of are Substitute, Unburden Hawlucha and Silvally, of which only Substitute is at all practical in ubers.

I'm quite worried that the omnipresence of Ditto is gonna make this meta a stallfest tbh.
I think imprison might be a cool substitute alternative, haven't built with it personally yet though.

wanna post some teams i've been experimenting and having some success with. fyi not exactly perfect as ion know what all the new stuff does yet
Quagsire @ Shed Shell
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Recover
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Protect

Corsola-Galar @ Eviolite
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Strength Sap
- Night Shade
- Haze

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Leech Seed
- Spikes
- Gyro Ball
- Protect

Eternatus @ Black Sludge
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic
- Flamethrower
- Dynamax Cannon
- Recover

Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Crunch
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave

Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin
Made a prototype stall w what Manaphy posted in the other discussion thread. Swapped cosmic power for dynamax cus I rarely needed to use it. Still unsure on all the threats so this might get ran down by something.
Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Play Rough
- Sacred Sword
- Crunch
- Wild Charge

Eternatus @ Haban Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower
- Recover

Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Transform

Gyarados @ Metronome
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Substitute
- Waterfall
- Earthquake

Darmanitan-Galar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Icicle Crash
- Superpower
- Earthquake

Corviknight @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Defog
- Roost
- U-turn
- Brave Bird
I just wanted an offense I can ladder with so I came up w this. Pretty straight forward, Corviknight thrown in to compress the Zacian/Exca pivot to Ditto/Darm and hazard remover. Couldn't decide on the best item for Gyarados so just threw a metronome on it for the waterfall spam but not sure if it counts the dyna waterfall and reg waterfall the same lol.
Hippowdon @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Roar

Excadrill @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rapid Spin
- Rock Slide

Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Transform

Eternatus @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Recover
- Dynamax Cannon
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Play Rough
- Sacred Sword
- Wild Charge

Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Recover
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Protect
This is like the first team I came up with and also pretty straight forward.
also wanna say this mon is an absolute threat
Darmanitan-Galar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Icicle Crash
- Superpower
- Earthquake
Also Belly Drum zen mode might be cool. As well as Polteageist with like smash/bp/strength sap/sub for some baton pass cheese. Still think Zacian and Ditto are the best mons with like Eternatus, Darm and Goth following imo. Not on the Zamazenta hype train yet.
 
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Grimmsnarl (M) @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Taunt
- Power Whip

This thing has got to be one of the bulkiest Dual Screens setters in the entier tier. Grimmsnarl has Prankster as an ability, which lets it usually get at least one screen up as well access to priority Taunt. This allows it to beat other hazard setters and completely invalidate Gothi. The last move is filler, but Power Whip allows you to have a 25% chance to OHKO Unaware Quagsire after Stealth Rock, one of Zacian's best checks. Grimmsnarl pairs well with Shuckle and Dual Screens proves to be invaluable for sweepers like Polteageist, Gyarados, and Zacian-C. Heck, a team structure consisting of something like Grimmsnarl/Shuckle/Polteageist/Gyarados/Zacian-C/Revenge Killer of Choice (Jolly Scarf Excadrill or Ditto) is great for overwhelming many teams currently seen on ladder.
 
View attachment 208068
Grimmsnarl (M) @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Taunt
- Power Whip

This thing has got to be one of the bulkiest Dual Screens setters in the entier tier. Grimmsnarl has Prankster as an ability, which lets it usually get at least one screen up as well access to priority Taunt. This allows it to beat other hazard setters and completely invalidate Gothi. The last move is filler, but Power Whip allows you to have a 25% chance to OHKO Unaware Quagsire after Stealth Rock, one of Zacian's best checks. Grimmsnarl pairs well with Shuckle and Dual Screens proves to be invaluable for sweepers like Polteageist, Gyarados, and Zacian-C. Heck, a team structure consisting of something like Grimmsnarl/Shuckle/Polteageist/Gyarados/Zacian-C/Revenge Killer of Choice (Jolly Scarf Excadrill or Ditto) is great for overwhelming many teams currently seen on ladder.
Does its G-max move have any potential? Forcing things to switch out or get put to sleep seems exploitable when you're also getting off some damage in the process, and seems more broadly useful than a Sp Def reduction on a physical attacker in a meta full of physical attackers.
 
Does its G-max move have any potential? Forcing things to switch out or get put to sleep seems exploitable when you're also getting off some damage in the process, and seems more broadly useful than a Sp Def reduction on a physical attacker in a meta full of physical attackers.
Haven't tried it personally yet, but Light Screen is extrmeely useful for opposing Polteageist trying to sweep and Eternatus, which is quite threatening to this team as well. Grimmsnarl is an excellent support mon though, looking forward to test out other variants of it as well!
 
I'm gonna be posting the full versions of my teams from the other thread:


theres some slashed moves/items so be careful if copy/pasting lol

Quagsire @ Shed Shell / Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Stockpile
- Recover

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 248 HP / 80 Def / 180 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Power Whip / Protect
- Gyro Ball
- Spikes
- Leech Seed

Corsola-Galar @ Eviolite
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Night Shade
- Will-O-Wisp
- Stealth Rock / Haze
- Strength Sap

Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 52 Atk / 204 SpD /
Adamant Nature
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave

Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Swords Dance
- Rapid Spin

Zamazenta @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Dauntless Shield
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Wild Charge
- Psychic Fangs
- Fire Fang


Same as last thread but I'll explain in more detail. Essentially Quagsire is your main answer to Zacian, he can come in and ignore and stat boosts he has and stockpile up. The main thing is Shed Shell, unless you want to play it fast and loose and expect your opponent to not be the one to carry Gothitelle, you have to run Shed Shell since Quagsire is critical to the teams defensive backbone. Honestly Gothitelle is once again making this meta more match-up reliant than it already was so I'm definitely not a fan of that. but anyway. Ferrothorn is your way of laying down Spikes, the thing about Ferrothorn is that he's not really critical to checking the top ubers threats, and he absolutely needs Leftovers for recovery, so in the way that I see it, if they come in with Gothitelle on your Ferrothorn, they take out your Ferrothorn in exchange for you getting up a full set of spikes, which isn't a bad trade imo. Since Tyranitar is Dark type, Gothitelle cannot sweep the team as long as Tyranitar is alive since her only attacking move is Stored Power. Corsola is the best way to spinblock atm, the only relevant spinner here is Excadrill and Corsola does the best job at trying to block him. I went with a physically bulky set here to best take on Excadrill and random physical attackers. Tyranitar is your way of setting up Sand, acting as a stop to Eternatus with his special bulk, setting up Rocks and spreading around Paralysis. Excadrill is your spinner, with Air Balloon he ignores Sticky Webs and Spikes and has a lot of offensive presence. You can often checkmate offensive teams by damaging down their one Ground resist until Excadrill can sweep, since so many teams run Zacian/Ditto/Eternatus; Rock Slide (or Rock Tomb) is mandatory IMO for setting up Sand for surprise sweeps, which can often be done due to Air Balloon providing you an opportunity. The last slot is honestly the most flexible, I originally was using Aegislash for priority, but I realized I was Power Whip Gyarados weak so I switched it to Scarf Zamazenta as an all-around bulky revenge killer, I think Eternatus would be very solid in this Pokemon slot too however, since he can absorb Toxic Spikes and provides a decent matchup for Gyarados.
With this team you have to be careful about Choice mons like Band Zamazenta or Specs Eternatus, since if they predict right they can blast some good holes in the team. Don't let things carelessly set-up Substitute either, assume that basically most offensive mons have it atm just in case.



once again some slashed moves so be careful with the copypasta

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Play Rough
- Fire Fang / whatever
- Swords Dance
- Psychic Fangs / whatever

Zamazenta @ Choice Band
Ability: Dauntless Shield
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Psychic Fangs / Iron Tail
- Crunch / Iron Tail
- Wild Charge

Eternatus @ Black Sludge
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe (You can put less in Speed)
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Toxic / Sludge Wave / Dynamax Cannon
- Cosmic Power
- Recover

Hippowdon @ Smooth Rock
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Roar
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off

Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Swords Dance
- Rapid Spin

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- King's Shield
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Sneak


I wanted to create a team that featured all of the legendary mons and this is what I came up with. Zacian is the standard set, you can run Substitute but in practice I found the extra coverage to be quite nice for this team. Choice Band Zamazenta is NASTY, it breaks through team cores very easily, is fast and bulky and just generally good; together with Zacian they can beat down each other's checks. Eternatus is the stalling set I came up with, Cosmic Power up and watch your opponent freak out and try to figure out a way to kill this thing. Fast, bulky, with Recover and Pressure means you can boost up and kill most things in this meta, Toxic lets you stall out some random stuff like Quagsire, Flamethrower takes care of Steels, the main thing to take out for a sweep is an opposing Eternatus or Toxapex. You can run Sludge Wave or Dynamax Cannon if your want more offensive presence. Hippowdon is to set up sand for Excadrill, set-up Rocks and act as a Zacian and all-purpose physical check. The Smooth Rock has saved me quite a few times and I generally don't think Hippowdown needs Leftovers, but I suppose you could run something else. Excadrill is Excadrill, he spins and is good, I'm still going with Air Balloon here as I like being Ditto-proof and I don't think you need the power of Life Orb in particular. Aegislash is another Zacian check, priority, and all-purpose bulky mon, he can also set-up sweeps pretty often as many teams don't expect a SD Boosted Aegislash to ram through their team with priority. this team is pretty fun to play with so give it a shot!

some general thoughts about the meta:
-ditto is undeniably a very good mon but I personally feel like it's lazy teambuilding, and it makes the metagame more matchup reliant than it should be I think. In general when I see a metagame where ditto is extremely common i think it's not a good sign for the health of the game. That being said I do like SS ubers quite a bit for the time being but we'll see where it goes.
-gothitelle is really dumb and I want it gone
-zacian is really good but not gamebreaking like people hyped him up to be. the fact that the 3 legendaries can't dynamax gives a unique feeling to this tier in comparison to OU. also the fact that you can't run 6 680 BST pokemon and have a cohesive team unlike the last two generations is imo pretty neat as well.
-has anyone found a good use for Fighting/Steel Zamazenta yet? I've seen the howl and dual screens versions on webs teams but it seems a bit underwhelming at the moment.
 
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Got top 4 with this team before I stopped playing. Similar to what I posted in the AG thread since these are near identical tiers.
https://pastebin.com/ZDxHCcwz

Key points:
- Imprison Zacian is pretty nice to stop revenge kills from Ditto / Zacian / some CC mons without having to keep a substitute up, which can be broken either immediately or through priority. But I've heard it is a bug in Showdown that Ditto does not get an additional +1 when coming in on Zacian. If that is true, then this set might not be as effective after fixing, because Zacian will take around 50% from struggle alone. Still good right now though and still has potential into the future.

- Obvious alert, but it bares repeating: Goth is the best pokemon in the meta, or at the very least way better than the legendaries. Everything defensive mustrun shed shell, phasing, haze, or taunt, else you'll be setting up an auto-lose to CP/NP/Rest/Stored Power. Phasing often doesn't even stop it from getting its kill (e.g. on defensive Eternatus) thanks to Dynamax, but at the very least you stop it from setting up and being completely swept. Dark types offer a hard stop to it offensively, but that often doesn't even matter - I've regularly PP stalled out Mandibuzz's or Ttars without Crunch (or with Crunch if you don't get too unlucky) and then kept going with my sweep. Ditto can also be handled if you don't get +6 SpA right away (which honestly for most things you do not need).

What I think isn't talked about enough is how the already strong Goth gets truly absurd with screen support. It can easily set up and win on many offensive mons barring a poorly timed crit. Darms, Drils, etc can all fall victim to the game of praying for a crit ASAP or the game is over. Its easy enough to Shed Shell up your defensive core, but when this thing starts setting up on offensive mons it is pretty clear how game breaking it is.

- Defensive Eternatus with Toxic/Recover/Flamethrower/Dragon Tail is really good right now. This thing ends up completely shredding teams over-prepped for Zacian. Not much to say here other than try this thing out.
 
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Key points:
- Imprison Zacian is pretty nice to stop revenge kills from Ditto / Zacian / some CC mons without having to keep a substitute up, which can be broken either immediately or through priority. But I've heard it is a bug in Showdown that Ditto does not get an additional +1 when coming in on Zacian. If that is true, then this set might not be as effective after fixing, because Zacian will take around 50% from struggle alone. Still good right now though and still has potential into the future.
Indeed, Ditto doesn't look to be correctly implanted right now according to this : https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sword-shield-battle-mechanics-research.3655528/post-8287865
"- As expected, Intrepid Sword activates again upon Transformation, effectively granting Ditto +2 against it."

Which will make Ditto still stronger than it already is and will punish Zacian more effectively. I guess it wil also be valuable against zamazenta crowned but this mon doesn't look amazing anyway. I guess Hippowdown will also be less effective when that will be implanted because it cannot switch on Ditto-Zacian at +2.
 
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Hey so, i've been a fan of ubers on the past gen and i wanted to try this one too, this is the team i came up with:


Corsola-Galar @ Eviolite
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Strength Sap
- Stealth Rock
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hex

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Knock Off
- Power Whip

Leif (Zacian-Crowned) @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Psychic Fangs
- Play Rough
- Behemoth Blade

Glue factory (Darmanitan-Galar) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Icicle Crash
- Earthquake
- U-turn

Joe (Shedinja) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Spite
- Leech Life
- Agility
- Protect

Ninetales @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Memento
- Dark Pulse


So, the main gimmick of this team is shedinja, whose mission is to be an antiditto and antizacian to an smaller scale. Choice scarf ditto seems to be one of the best, if not the best way to currently deal with zacian, which is why mine doesn't have any more that would normally hit shedinja supereffectively, to make sure that the enemy ditto doesn't have it either. Protect is there to scout the enemy's moveset in case they run supereffective coverage or choice lock them. Ninetales is there to prevent hippowdowns from ruining shedin's day, the rest of the team is pretty standard. After playing for a good while, the biggest flaw that this team seems to have is being weak to eternatus, so it's definitively far from perfect and i would really apreciate suggestions to improve it (without changing the hole gimmick of the team ofc).

Also i will give a medal to the person that got the reference on zacian's name
 
Unfortunately, you guys aren't even close to taking goth to its logical conclusion. The conclusion is that only pp matters. In this respect, you must stack up multiple goths and/or rest dugtrio to preserve the pp by switching and resting. Also, you want to use multiple goth and/or memento dugtrio to weaken then definitely trapping whatever threat you want. This includes zacian.

Knock off techs is still unexplored to beat shed shell too.
 

Exiline

the flyest
is a Tiering Contributoris the defending Ubers Circuit Championis the defending RBY Circuit Champion
Hello laddies and kekkers, the sexiline ladder's conquest just successfully ended and he's now here to teach you how SS Ubers is meant to be played.

missed the 50/0 because I choked a won game smh


The team I used


My main objective while building this team was to have as many defensive measure as possible while also still being able to apply a strong offensive pressure if needed.

I first started with Corviknight and Ditto. Ditto seemed like a pretty obvious choice due to the incredible number of set-up sweeper in the tier, it's a huge stop for most HO in the tier, not much to explain about this since pretty much everyone know what it does. Next is Corviknight, I absolutely wanted to get a U-Turn user in order to abuse my opponents with Ditto/Zacian but also to get a safe way for Gothitelle to trap shit, Corviknight also gives me a way to clear Spikes off the field which would be deadly for a team as retroactive as mine (keep in mind that thanks to Pressure defog gets more PP than any Entry Hazards), finally Corviknight is an amazing pivot for my team and it can easily generates a ton of momentum. I lowered the Speed EVs to lose the tie against other Corviknight (in order to get the momentum with U-Turn) while still being faster than Tyranitar.

As I already stated, I wanted a team that could react retroactively to whatever means of offense my opponents could bring, thus my next mon had to be able to directly switch on Zacian which is the number 1 threat right now, I didn't had to think for long since there is only one mon able to do this feat : Quagsire. Quagsire is incredibly passive but well, it does the job which it was asked to do, it can even be quite fearsome in some endgame scenarios where it can be very tedious to switch on a quagsire. Stockpile is amazing in these endgame scenario precisely, it also get your back against Zacian since it will need 2 crits instead of 1 if it wants to kill you.
Curse is usable here too, since the team can be at put at difficulty by Eternatus, curse allowing you to safely kill it without getting pp stalled, (you have to trap it with Gothitelle or to outpressure it with Zacian if it's some Recover set). Shed Shell is, I think, mandatory on quagsire right now, there is just too much Gothitelle and getting your quagsire trapped is really bad since it really puts you in a position where you have to outplay your opponent with Zacian and Ditto.

Next you have Zacian, undoubtedly the best mon in the tier, it's my main offensive weapon, I'm using a 4 attacks sets here since you realistically never ever click Sword Dance and I really needed all this coverage in order to not get walled by some random mons. Zacian is also pretty useful to soft check some threats, especially Gyarados (jolly Zacian outspeeds it even after a Dragon Dance) or Eternatus.

Tyranitar serves as the Stealth Rock setter and the Eternatus check of the team, Crunch and Earthquake are mandatory for obvious reasons, I picked Thunder Wave as the last move since there isn't anything really useful outside of this move and the yellow magic is never a bad thing (you could run DD here to pressure the fatter squad I guess, I should try it sometime, you rarely click T-Wave anyway).

Last but not least, Gothitelle is here to primarily assist Zacian in its sweep but it's also useful in order to keep certain Eternatus sets in check (as I explained above). I didn't got to experience with it but Goth can probably relatively be remplaced by something like Choice Band Zamazenta or Aegislash here, those 2 could improve your match up against variable shit while making you weaker against other shit too.

In the end, this team suits my playstyle very well and is very polyvalent which is something I really like about it, feel free to give it a try (click the sprites for the importable). !

Here is a replay that illustrates pretty well how the team is meant to be played.



My thoughts on the meta + some sets [WILL COMPLETE LATER; ITS ALMOST 1AM AND IM TIRED]




On Stealth Rock not being mandatory

Dynamax sweepers (
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Spikes (
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Holy shit those gen8 mini sprites are amazing.
 
Aegislash seems to be able to 2hko crowned zacian with neutral moves.

Wobbuffet seems viable as usual (doubly so since there are no strong dark types)
 
Hi there, I'd like to talk about the potential of Rain teams in this meta. The lack of primals opens up options for weather based cores, and I've seen people running the obvious Tyranitar + Excadrill cores, but I think that Rain cores could potentially cut it as well, especially since many teams seem underprepared for them.


Most Ubers teams right now seem a little light on Water resists, with the most common being Eternatus who is admittedly quite a solid one. But Rain can also facilitate your Eternatus matchup by weakening its Flamethrower, letting you go into your Zacian-C or other Steel type much more freely against it. Pelipper itself as a mon obviously isn't great (and doesn't have defog access right now) but it does resist Steel, and can match up okay against Zacian-C depending on set. Zacian-C sets not running Wild Charge, SD, or Play Rough (big ifs here) can potentially be walled by Pelipper, especially if it gets a Scald burn.

+1 252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Behemoth Blade vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Pelipper: 108-127 (33.4 - 39.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Psychic Fangs vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Pelipper: 123-145 (38 - 44.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Play Rough vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Pelipper: 195-229 (60.3 - 70.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zamazenta Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Pelipper: 105-125 (32.5 - 38.6%) -- 98.9% chance to 3HKO
Zamazenta seems to always have Wild Charge. But it can heal up on any of its other moves.


252+ SpA Life Orb Seismitoad Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Zacian-Crowned: 281-330 (86.4 - 101.5%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Seismitoad Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Zamazenta-Crowned: 229-273 (70.4 - 84%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Seismitoad Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eternatus: 330-390 (78.3 - 92.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Seismitoad can hit the big three super effectively with Earth Power and if it Dynamaxes it can turn all three of the above calcs into guaranteed OHKOs. As you can see it doesn't quite have the same oomph as Sand Rush Excadrill's Earthquake, but Seismitoad makes up for it by.... not really being as easy to check defensively. Where Excadrill can be stopped by Rotom-W or Corviknight, Seismitoad's Hydro Pump can bust through them pretty easy (I believe it does about 50% to phys def Rotom-W under rain). You got Focus Blast for Ferrothorn, and besides that Gyarados resists this set but is not really a sturdy check. Seismitoad can be EV'd to be faster than Scarf Darmanitan-G under Rain without giving up a Modest nature and that's probably as fast as you'd want to go.
or

I suggest running a really bulky water resist on these sorts of teams to prevent Ditto reverse sweeping you. Maybe also run Protect on Seismitoad to scout if they predict your switch to the water resist. Hydro Pump / Earth Power / Focus Blast / Protect seems fine. Ferrothorn also benefits from the weakened Flamethrower giving it more wiggle room against Eternatus.


Gyarados seems to be a viable sweeper and can benefit from Rain powering up its Waterfalls, simple as.


You could use Barraskewda too, but its speed tier doesn't seem super valuable, being slower than regular Zacian and Zamazenta when rain is not up. Being able to snowball with Max Knuckle and hit a lot of things super effectively is nice but most of the time Ditto just comes in and revenges you using your Max Knuckle boosts.


252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Eternatus in Rain: 417-491 (86.1 - 101.4%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. +1 0 HP / 0 Def Zamazenta-Crowned in Rain: 387-456 (119 - 140.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Now that we've figured out all the mechanics of Fishious Rend, it looks like Dracovish has no switch-ins in Ubers either. Eternatus can maybe check it under certain circumstances but even it falls to the power of Rain boosted Fishious Rend. Its Speed tier is even worse than in OU though as even with a Scarf it outspeeds nothing relevant, but Dracovish seems like it can just demolish the defensive sort of teams going around, even when Rain isn't up.

So what do you think of Rain? Is it worth using over Sand at all? Is it better to just pair a Swift Swimmer up with a Max Geyser user? It definitely seems overlooked at this point. Would definitely like to hear more experienced players' opinions :smogthink:
 
How is Gigantmax Gengar as a Mega Gengar replacement ?
It has the crippling flaw that you have to use a move for the trapping -- Shadow Tag's strength is that it gives the opponent zero opportunities to respond to it.

Despite its flavour, it's more like Spirit Shackle or Thousand Waves than anything.
 
I wouldn't call myself a particularly good player, but I've had some ladder success with this sand offense team:


Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Behemoth Blade
- Play Rough
- Crunch
- Sacred Sword

This is a fairly traditional set. My default is just to click Behemoth Blade, which hits opposing Zacian and Eternatus and the occasional Darmanitan -- it's quite spammable and even hits resists decently hard unless they're bulky. Play Rough is for random things weak to Fairy, such as Hero Zamazenta, but it seems optional until post-Home and I think you could slash it with Wild Charge for Corviknight. Sacred Sword is for Steel types; Zacian doesn't really want the defense drops from Close Combat IMO, and Sacred Sword hits Crowned Zamazenta and random mons that buff their defense (such as Excadrill after a Max Steelspike) harder. Crunch hits Aegislash, Corsola on the switch-in and Gothitelle slightly harder than Behemoth Blade, plus you can fish for haxy defense drops.

I'm not running Swords Dance because Ditto. It's just suicide, and I didn't find openings to use it. Zacian is well prepared for and in my opinion needs all the coverage it can get. I also think its speed tier is too important to run Adamant, particularly vs Band Zamazenta.


Zamazenta @ Choice Band
Ability: Dauntless Shield
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Crunch
- Psychic Fangs
- Facade

I like Facade because it's a nasty surprise for things which try to burn Zamazenta. I considered Wild Charge, but Zamazenta's other moves hit most of its other targets better and it's not a good move to be locked into. The rest of the moves are standard. This thing can usually take a hit from anything not named Zacian that has set up once, and Close Combat deals good damage to any switch-in not immune to it. I like Adamant because this thing rarely needs the speed and can usually take a hit from Eternatus, but I'll probably want to swap to Jolly when Home is released and Marshadow and Mewtwo enter the meta.


Eternatus @ Expert Belt
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower
- Recover

I've been unimpressed by Sludge Wave and will probably replace it with either Toxic or Sludge Bomb -- it's rare that I want the damage, and most of the time I used it, I was just hoping for a poison proc. Dynamax Cannon is for opposing Eternatus and general damage, as well as obviously chunking any Dynamaxed Pokemon that Eternatus can outspeed. Eternatus ends up hitting its target for supereffective damage more often than not, so I used Expert Belt for the 20% power boost, but I might experiment with Black Sludge and see if the loss of power makes much of a difference.


Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Transform

This is Ditto. You know what Ditto does. Ditto is mandatory.


Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin

This is a standard Excadrill moveset. Air Balloon was mostly for Imposter-proofing and better handling opposing Excadrill, but it has also been quite useful for getting around Sticky Web. Sadly, Excadrill is needed to offensively pressure the opposing team too often for Rapid Spin to be as useful as I'd like, but it's still a good option to have. Most commonly, I send this in under sand and proceed to Dynamax sweep. Needs to run Jolly to speed tie with itself, and to outspeed Jolly Zacian at +1.


Hippowdon @ Smooth Rock
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Roar
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off

The extra 3 turns of sand from Smooth Rock is extremely useful for Excadrill, and Hippowdon walls a lot in this meta. Often I just sacrifice it to get Excadrill in safely under sand, but it's tanky enough that you can also sometimes put rocks up and just shuffle things with Roar. Helpless against flying types generally, but there's not much that can be done about that.

This team generally has a poor matchup vs stall (particularly Corsola, which dies to Eternatus but otherwise destroys this team), Corviknight, and opposing Hippowdon. In general, I think it could use a second special attacker of some sort, but ubers is pretty short on options.
 
IMG_20191126_020258.png


Enter the Gen8 HO lead meta.
Since Cloyster doesn't get spin anymore, oftentimes instead of attacking you opponents will simply try to SR in front of you allowing a free smash.
Icicle spear + skill link is pretty shitty in the current meta and Overcoat lets you smash safely in front of TTar/Hippo and not die to sand chip later in the game, hippo you can just hydro turn 1 to kill. Being special also means you beat Quag. If you do pull off a free Smash off T1 without getting attacked it's at least two Pokémon dead, often including Ditto as it can't kill you thru sash and geyser kills back. Max ice move is great for coverage, between these two moves you hit the entire tier neutrally hard

don't set up vs lead excadrill


replay to show it off vs a bog standard team, ignore the rank as that was definitely not a low ladder team
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ubers-1014397995
 
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The team plays well in the tier with a 83% win rate.

Eternatus @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon
- Flamethrower
- Sludge Bomb
- Shadow Ball


Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Behemoth Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Swords Dance
- Play Rough


Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Power Whip
- Earthquake
- Waterfall

Dragapult @ Choice Band
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Darts
- U-turn
- Psychic Fangs
- Dragon Claw

Grimmsnarl (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Sucker Punch
- False Surrender
- Spirit Break
- Fake Out

Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Darkest Lariat

Replays
Replay 1
Replay 2
Replay 3
Replay 4
Replay 5
 
Dragapult @ Choice Band
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Darts
- U-turn
- Psychic Fangs
- Dragon Claw
Why both Darts and Claw? Am I missing some reason why Claw would ever be relevant in singles?

If it's just filler, I'd consider Body Slam for paralysis fishing, or Facade for if you get burned.
 

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