Resource USM LC Viability Rankings (VR Update @ #249)

This nom probably looks really odd and probably seems like an instant reject but I recommend trying out this mon, it's honestly far better than it looks on paper. I'm gonna beef up this post and provide as much reasoning and evidence as I can since I'm suggesting such a massive change in rank, sorry in advance for this probably long post. I've had this post written up for quite a while, slowly been adding to it over time, but with snake upon us, I decided to post it now to see if it would influence lc in snake in any way.

Shellos: Unranked to B+/A-

This is the set I've been using for like the last 7 months and it has impressed me a lot every time I used it in tests and tours.

Shellos-East @ Eviolite
Ability: Sticky Hold
Level: 5
EVs: 228 HP / 212 Def / 20 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Curse
- Amnesia
- Recover
- Facade

It looks weird on paper but it's far better than it looks. Fantastic bulk of 27/14/14, two weaknesses, and sticky hold making it impossible to remove evio means that shell finds it very easy to set up on a good chunk of the meta and is very hard to break once boosted. Mono facade looks weird, and the first thought you get is 'What does it do vs ghosts?' but, barring heysup and jake, pump and fril are very rare rn and gast is very easily trappable. Since this set relies on sitting there forever and chipping away at mons, coverage isn't needed and +6 facade still hits most mons pretty hard.
Here's why it deserves to be raised.

EDIT: Shoutouts to teeno for the suggestion but a week later, he and I both realised that facade is almost infinitely better than return. Return normally hits harder but, in most matchups, it's highly likely you'll get burned by mareanie or wingull or poisoned by mareanie or foongus, so facade is much better to take advantage of status more while still hitting most stuff hard.

Reason 1: It reliably sets up on a ridiculous amount of the meta, and can outstall a good chunk of the meta

I made a list of all the mons on the viability rankings that shell can setup on and beat, and the list is honestly pretty impressive.

S rank

Dig - Yes, only scarf typically runs final gambit so you might have to click recover quite often to avoid being in fg range if scarf, but not many dig carry that and it's very easy to setup on other digs.
236 Atk Diglett Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)
236 Atk Diglett Earthquake vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 6-7 (22.2 - 25.9%) -- 0.1% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 7)

Mienfoo - Yea, barring reckless scarf, band and sd foo. Easily sets up on bulk foo and fastfoo.
236 Atk Mienfoo High Jump Kick vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-15 (44.4 - 55.5%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 15)
236 Atk Mienfoo High Jump Kick vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)

Vullaby - Easily sets up on offensive vull and shrugaby. In theory, it should beat np vull but you can get flinched to death unfortunately.
236+ Atk Vullaby Brave Bird vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-13 (37 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)
+6 240+ SpA Vullaby Air Slash vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 7-9 (25.9 - 33.3%) -- 0% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 9)

A+ rank

Abra - Yes, have to scout for counter tho, although I'm pretty sure shell is favoured to win the counter war since counter has 32 pp while amnesia and curse have a combined pp
240 SpA Abra Energy Ball vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-16 (44.4 - 59.2%) -- 68.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 16)
240 SpA Abra Energy Ball vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-10 (29.6 - 37%) -- 1.1% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 10)
240 SpA Life Orb Abra Psychic vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-16 (44.4 - 59.2%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 16)
240 SpA Life Orb Abra Psychic vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-9 (29.6 - 33.3%) -- 0% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 9)

Foongus - Yes, once something else has absorbed spore. Clear smog foon is no set rn.
0 SpA Foongus Giga Drain vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 14)
0 SpA Foongus Giga Drain vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 6-8 (22.2 - 29.6%) -- 2.2% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 8)
This calc is particularly impressive.
0 SpA Foongus Giga Drain vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 2-6 (7.4 - 22.2%) -- possible 5HKO
Possible damage amounts: (2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 6)

Mareanie - Yes, if no haze. I think iron defense mareanie also potentially can stall out shellos, never tested that.

Onix - Yes, unless it's the very rare roar or taunt

Pawniard - Sets up on normal sr pawn, scarf pawn and evio pursuit. Doesn't set up on sd and snatch pawn, but both sets are very rare.
236 Atk Pawniard Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)

Snivy - No. snivy leafstorm only has 8pp tho, so if u bait out and waste 7 storm pp, you can setup on this.

Timburr - Yes to 4 attacks, bu comes down to who crits first.
196+ Atk Iron Fist Timburr Thunder Punch vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-16 (44.4 - 59.2%) -- 68.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 16)
196+ Atk Iron Fist Timburr Thunder Punch vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-12 (37 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)

A rank

Gastly - Nah, although if you're lucky you can actually outstall lo gastly, assuming you've got to +2 spdef min before.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7lc-788331282

Mag - Nah, unless you're already +2 spdef before it comes in. Setting up on mag not recommended tho, since opp can fish for both crit and para. You probs get free kills on bj mag tho, since it can only volt, assuming no crit.
240+ SpA Magnemite Thunderbolt vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 14)
240+ SpA Magnemite Thunderbolt vs. +4 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-12 (29.6 - 44.4%) -- 17.6% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 12)
240+ SpA Magnemite Thunderbolt vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 6-8 (22.2 - 29.6%) -- 2.2% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 8)

Pony - Yes, unless hypno bloom doom or hypno sunny day, but both those sets are super rare rn and it needs to hit hypno too

Staryu - Yes, even sets up on lo tbolt. Easily sets up on defensive sets.
200 SpA Life Orb Staryu Thunderbolt vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 13-18 (48.1 - 66.6%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (13, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)
200 SpA Life Orb Staryu Thunderbolt vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-10 (29.6 - 37%) -- 1.1% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 10)

Wingull - Yes
240 SpA Wingull Supersonic Skystrike (185 BP) vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)
240 SpA Wingull Hurricane vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 6-7 (22.2 - 25.9%) -- 0.1% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 7)

A- rank

Carvanha - Yes
196+ Atk Life Orb Carvanha Crunch vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-13 (33.3 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)
196+ Atk Life Orb Carvanha Crunch vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 8-9 (29.6 - 33.3%) -- 0% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 9)
236+ SpA Life Orb Carvanha Dark Pulse vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 9-13 (33.3 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)
236+ SpA Life Orb Carvanha Dark Pulse vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 5-8 (18.5 - 29.6%) -- 0.1% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 8)

Croagunk - Probably, you beat mixed, bu gunk probs comes down to who crits first, similarly with timburr and I believe beating np is technically in your favour but it's close since the cumulative crit chance isn't much over 50. You lose to np if it's z and you get 1/16ed.
188+ SpA Croagunk Sludge Wave vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 7-10 (25.9 - 37%) -- 82.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10)
188+ SpA Croagunk Acid Downpour (175 BP) vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18
+6 188+ SpA Croagunk Sludge Wave vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 7-10 (25.9 - 37%) -- 82.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10)
+6 188+ SpA Croagunk Acid Downpour (175 BP) vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)

You amnesia along with the nps, attack to check for bj or evio and then curse/recover to the appropriate level til you kill with return. Not entirely sure how many turns you have to avoid being crit for but I believe croagunk needs to sludge 17 times before the cumulative crit chance is in it's favour so technically shell is favoured here.
(23/24)^16 = 0.506...
(23/24)^17 = 0.485...

Doduo - Yes, if scarf/bj, probs not to sd and no to lo
236 Atk Doduo Brave Bird vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-15 (44.4 - 55.5%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 15)
236 Atk Doduo Brave Bird vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 7-10 (25.9 - 37%) -- 82.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10)

Ferroseed - No

Grimer-A - Yes
196+ Atk Grimer-Alola Poison Jab vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 7-10 (25.9 - 37%) -- 82.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10)

Mudbray - Yes
196+ Atk Mudbray Earthquake vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-13 (37 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)
196+ Atk Mudbray Earthquake vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 7-10 (25.9 - 37%) -- 82.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10)

Shellder - Nah

Spritzee - Yes, shell is actually the best sprit counter in the meta rn, takes 25 from defensive moonblast, can't be coveted, and it even beats np sprit too, unless you get crit early
252+ SpA Spritzee Moonblast vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)
+6 252+ SpA Spritzee Moonblast vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)
Find replay

Tirtouga - Yes to defensive sets, no to ss
132 Atk Tirtouga Stone Edge vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)
132 Atk Tirtouga Stone Edge vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos on a critical hit: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)

B+ rank

Chinchou - If rocks aren't up, shell can actually set up on stab se tbolt because chinchou is absolute dogshit.
232 SpA Chinchou Thunderbolt vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 14-20 (51.8 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (14, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 20)
232 SpA Chinchou Thunderbolt vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-12 (29.6 - 44.4%) -- 17.6% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 12)
Unless you get 1/16ed, you are good. Easily beats chinchou if already at +2 assuming you don't get crit early.

Elekid - Can't setup on it, but beat it if already at +2 spdef, unless early crit.
240 SpA Life Orb Elekid Thunderbolt vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 10-16 (37 - 59.2%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 16)
240 SpA Life Orb Elekid Thunderbolt vs. +4 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-10 (29.6 - 37%) -- 1.1% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 10)
240 SpA Life Orb Elekid Thunderbolt vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-10 (29.6 - 37%) -- 1.1% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 10)

Larvesta - Yes, I think shellos outstalls defensive larv even when burnt since morning sun only has 8pp. Also sets up on scarf wild charge
+6 0 Atk burned Shellos Return vs. 76 HP / 236+ Def Eviolite Larvesta: 6-8 (26 - 34.7%) -- 0.9% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 8)
0 Atk Larvesta Flare Blitz vs. +6 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 1-2 (3.7 - 7.4%) -- possibly the worst move ever
Possible damage amounts: (1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2)
You take 3hp damage per turn while larv takes 7 and shell has 16 recovers compared to larv's 8. If larv u-turns, whatever comes in takes a semi-strong return.
252+ Atk Larvesta Wild Charge vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-16 (44.4 - 59.2%) -- 68.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 16)
252+ Atk Larvesta Wild Charge vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-12 (37 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)
Unless you get double 1/16ed and this is ada scarf too

Scraggy - Bulk up rest comes down to who crits first. Shellos beats dd drain. Should beat dd hjk unless early crit
236 Atk Scraggy High Jump Kick vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-15 (44.4 - 55.5%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 15)
This calc does not change when scrag and shell are both at +1, +2 etc.
Shell can curse up alongside dd, if scrag attacks you don't get 2hkod barring 1/16ed, and when they dd on recover you're back at the same position. Scrag can spam hjk to fish for crit but if it misses it's done. +4 return 2hkos scrag
+4 0 Atk Shellos Return vs. 36 HP / 36 Def Eviolite Scraggy: 11-14 (50 - 63.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (11, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 14)
I believe shellos is favoured to win vs dd scrag

Slowpoke - Yes, unless twave intervenes

Snubbull - Yes vs normal snub, unless twave intervenes. BU snub can come down to who crits first but since bu snub lacks recovery, it should be in shells favour.
196+ Atk Snubbull Play Rough vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)

Vulpix-a - Yes
200 SpA Vulpix-Alola Freeze-Dry vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO after hail damage
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 14)


B rank

Bunnelby - Probably no, can set up in jolly scarf if there's no other play but does not setup on other bunny sets like lo or bulk up or ada scarf. Not ideal to set up on.
228 Atk Huge Power Bunnelby Return vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)
228 Atk Huge Power Bunnelby Return vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)
Unless you get 1/16ed, it can work out, barring early crit but this is the strongest physical hitter in lc

Corphish - Yes, unless early crit

196+ Atk Corphish Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 6-8 (22.2 - 29.6%) -- 85.9% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 8)
+2 196+ Atk Corphish Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-11 (33.3 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 11)
+4 196+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. +2 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-12 (37 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 12)
+6 196+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. +3 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 11-13 (40.7 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)
Never 2hkos, while return will 2hko and once shell is at +6 corp does nothing
DD is even easier

Dwebble - Probably not unless it’s hazard stack. No to ss unless you get lucky with low rb hits, not recommended

Frillish - Nah, probably can’t outstall either

Kabuto - Yes

Omanyte - Yes, even if ss
+2 196+ SpA Omanyte Earth Power vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-15 (44.4 - 55.5%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 15)
Zero

Pump-Super - Technically no, but I believe it is entirely possible to outstall this and kill it with struggle. Typical pump-super has a combined 56pp while shellos has 96pp. Pump only has 16 gigas too. Getting burned is kinda annoying, but not a huge problem unless your opponent has multiple recovery mons. Switching in and out from pump to other mons to conserve pp could be annoying, but unless it’s regencore, the chip you obtain still puts you at an advantage and that can’t be done indefinitely unless the team is regencore plus pump.
4 SpA Pumpkaboo-Super Giga Drain vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 14)
4 SpA Pumpkaboo-Super Giga Drain vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 6-8 (22.2 - 29.6%) -- 2.2% chance to 4HKO
Possible damage amounts: (6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 8)
4 SpA Pumpkaboo-Super Giga Drain vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 2-6 (7.4 - 22.2%) -- possible 5HKO
Possible damage amounts: (2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 6)
Needs back to back crits to break

Rufflet - Nah, but similar to bun, if this mon hits, it’s one of the strongest physical attackers in the tier

Surskit - Yea, unless the very rare haze

Trapinch - Yes, unless the team is ultra old and it turns out to be toxic, then rip

Wynaut - No

Zig - No

B- rank

Archen - No to headsmash, sets up on every other set
180 Atk Archen Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-15 (44.4 - 55.5%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 15)
180 Atk Archen Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. +1 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 7-10 (25.9 - 37%) -- 82.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10)

Amaura - Yes

Cottonee - No if encore, otherwise yes
252 SpA Cottonee Giga Drain vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 14)

Dewpider - Yes

Drilbur - Yes

Meowth - Yes

Munchlax - Yes to recycle sets unless you get body slammed para into multiple paras. Curserest comes down to who crits first, although shell is definitely favoured since munch provides turns to crit when it rests.
236+ Atk Munchlax Return vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-13 (37 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)

Pancham - Yes, unless bu or sd, then who crits first if bu and shell beats sd unless crit

Salandit - Yes, unless crit by np salandit. Shell beats non-np

Taillow - Yes to special, no to physical guts

Not gonna bother with most of C rank sorry, barring clam and ches, I can’t remember the last time I’ve seen the other C rank mons in any big lc tournament.

Clamperl - In theory, yes. Probably one of shellos’ most impressive feats, being able to in theory set up on +2 tooth clamperl lacking hp grass, and beating it, assuming no hazards are up.
+2 248 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 15-18 (55.5 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 17, 17, 17, 17, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18)
+2 248 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-9 (29.6 - 33.3%) -- 12.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9)
Ignoring crit chance, clam has a 15.6 percent chance to beat shell here
Eventually clam will ss again, at which point shell should be at 100
+4 248 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. +2 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 4.3% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 14)
+4 248 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. +4 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-9 (29.6 - 33.3%) -- 12.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9)
Then clam ss again, shell at 100
+6 248 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. +4 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 10-12 (37 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 11, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12)
+6 248 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. +6 228 HP / 100 SpD Eviolite Shellos: 8-9 (29.6 - 33.3%) -- 12.5% chance to 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9)
Barring crit, shell now walls, and clam isn’t favoured to crit with 6 surfs.
On the other side
0 Atk Shellos Return vs. -3 0 HP / 76 Def Clamperl: 13-16 (65 - 80%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (13, 13, 13, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16)
Return 2hkos

I can’t think of a single mon with the ability to set up and beat +2 clam, but shellos can.

Chespin - Yes
28 Atk Chespin Seed Bomb vs. 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 12-14 (44.4 - 51.8%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 14)


That list is pretty big, but the two messages from that are that shellos sets up on a large chunk of the meta, more importantly I believe it sets up on 18/24 of the mons in S to A- or at least their most common sets rn, which is massive, highlighting its ability as a standard killer. It also can setup on super effective hits and potentially beat elec and grass types barring snivy once at +2 spdef or def which, again, is pretty ridiculous.
Secondly, even though it sets up on a huge chunk of the meta, in practice it’s usually not too difficult to set up on weaker mons to heavily reduce the chance of early hax ruining the clean. Shellos can set up on lo staryu and chinchou and clamperl but, in practice, you should never go for that unless you have no other plays. It’s far easier and less hax risky to set up on dig, bulk foo, physical vull, foon, onix, pawn, sprit, mud, tirt etc. Mons which don’t typically carry boosting moves, since unless you get crit by the first hjk or eq, by the time you’ve boosted to +2 def or spdef, these mons need back to back crit to kill shell. In most games, you can position yourself to set up on these mons since they’re everywhere rn. Setting up on clam, dd mons, bulk up and np mons is possible but is more like a last resort.
On top of that, there are in that list, roughly 10 pokemon shellos can’t setup on. Snivy is fair, mag is fair but can be trapped, ferro can also be trapped, gast can be trapped and potentially killed by lo, shell is fair, ss tirt is rare, ss dweb even rarer, bunny, zig and wynaut are uncommon, pump and fril and ruff are virtually non-existent. Barring snivy and shell, team support gets rid of the other two common threats, highlighting just how good shell is vs most standard.

Reason 2: Most standard methods of beating shellos are non-existent in lc rn.

Usually, in higher tiers, a set like this would be quickly stopped by toxic, haze, phasing, unaware pokemon, taunt etc. Fortunately for shellos, none of these really exist in lc. Toxic is non-existent, no-ones running unaware wooper/cleffa if it gets it. Mareanie hazing was popular in torch meta but not rn, phasing doesn’t really exist barring the rare roar onix and rarer roar mudbray and taunt also doesn’t really exist barring onix on veil and maybe taunt foo on teams with no spore switch.
None of the usual methods of dealing with this set exist in lc, so shellos can thrive.
It would be interesting to see if toxic, phasing and haze mare start seeing usage if this set picks up usage, maybe frill will rise up in viability too.

Reason 3: A lot of current metagame trends really favour shellos rn

Most importantly, the fact that webs has sharply decreased in usage helps shell a lot. Pump and frils usage primarily came from being spinblockers on webs teams but, due to the decline of webs, neither of those mons are seen much rn, meaning two of the 3 ghosts on vr are not used, letting return be spammed freely once setup.

Snivy’s decrease in usage also helps heavily. Snivy was pretty big at the start of lcpl and pre-lcpl, where people were talking about potentially suspecting the mon due to the scarf set having few checks. Now, with snivy’s big draw of single handedly beating webs not being relevant, plus facing heavy competition from vull as a defogger, it’s not nearly as splashable as it once was. Both scarf and evio are heavily affected by foon being everywhere, evio also dislikes the rise of gast and gull which can’t switch in but heavily pressure it. Scarf hates protect gull and onix and abra, since they can waste leafstorm pp and, if snivy attempts to aggressively knock on ferro or foon switch in, that’s also scouted.

Electric types also aren’t too common rn, which helps shellos. Mag is kinda common but not nearly as popular as it was 2 months ago, protect scout really hurts the scarfset and it’s still prone to getting trapped by scarfdig and the rising trapinch. Elekid I’ve seen a few times, but again, not common as it’s difficult to fit on teams, provides zero defensive utility and even offensively fails to ohko a lot of stuff. Usually, elekid only puts in work if your opponent has no elec immunity or you get every play correct. Chinchou is awful.

Barring snivy, ferro is the only viable grass that heavily pressures shellos but it gets trapped easily. Out of 5 mons that are viable and pressure shell with se stab, 3 get trapped easily and the other one in elekid is uncommon and loses if shellos is at +2 spdef.

Last point, not really a trend but a gameplay mechanic change, but crit chance being lowered to 1/24 helps shellos out massively too.

Reason 4: It’s a fantastic tour mon and it’s capable of cleaning vs 4 or 5 mons with ease

Shellos is a poor ladder mon, since you can face haze mareanie or frill or toxic or roar on ladder, but in a tour scenario, shellos is fantastic. Beats standard with ease and a good mon to bring if you know your opponent doesn’t use snivy or setup much.

The second point is very important imo, since it allows you to play very passively if the matchup is favourable. There are many games I’ve played with shellos where I purposely let ferro or gastly kill a mon instead of hard grimer or hard mag, knowing full well that as long as I trap those mons, shellos can make up for the mon disadvantage. Plus, if your opponent doubles predicting the grimer or mag, you gain momentum or damage.

Shellos negatives

The big negative I’ve found with using shellos is that it’s very difficult to outplay out of poor mu’s like snivy or snivy gast barring luck or choke, meaning there’s a few mu’s which are sorta an autoloss.

Wynaut is the single worst pokemon to face when using shellos, it can happily switch in, lock you into return if you went for it and trap or encore into curse/amnesia and waste your pp, then once it’s run out of encores, click the dbond into counter/mirror coat combination and stall you out of pp and eventually 1v1 you. I haven’t tested this scenario fully but I can’t see any way on paper for shellos to come out of that alive.

Another negative is probably the fact that it requires some degree of team support. You need a ferro trapper or a team that lures/heavily pressures ferro. You need a gast trapper. Ideally want a mag trapper. Also want to build a team that doesn’t autolose to snivy and you realise that there isn’t much variety in what you can build around it. There’s potential to forgo either a gast or ferro remover if you’ve scouted and are confident your opponent won’t use it but that’s risky. Usually, if shell gets crit early, game tends to be over since shellos teams I’ve built aren’t designed to have a backup plan if shellos gets crit.

Getting crit sucks but I don’t think that’s particularly a negative, since relying on crit to break a mon is not ideal for an opponent. Against non-setup, crits are only game changing if they happen within the first 1-4 turns of setup usually, which at most, has a 16ish percent chance of occurring, which is heavily favourable. After that, consecutive crits are needed, which has a 1/576 chance of occurring.

I imagine now that the set is public, if people do end up using it, shifts might occur to make shellos less good but I think that’s a good thing honestly, it might spice up this stagnant meta a little. Similarly, you could argue that the surprise factor was a main reason why shellos consistently put in so much for me, but I’d argue that shell sets up on so much of the meta that even if you know exactly what it does, trying to prevent it from setting up is still very difficult, especially if the mu is poor.

Replays

Nominating unranked pokemon require high-level replays. I’ve got a few replays which I think are at a high level.

Tour replays

Swiss quarterfinals vs OP

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7lc-753697994

Brought shellos because it 6-0ed most of OP’s standard builds. From preview, I just needed to trap mag and absorb spore with grimer and the game should have been mine from there. Unfortunately, OP turned out to have np skystrike vull as opposed to the physical vull I was expecting. Shellos comes in turn 29 since it’s easiest to set up on foon. Vull nps alongside it and op gets an important flinch turn 38 and since he was skystrike he didn’t need another flinch. I think if I got two recovers and one return off, the game was mine unless foo got a first turn hjk crit.
I don’t think this game was a negative for shellos tbh, once it got going, op needed flinches to win and he was, in my opinion, the perfect vull set for that mu, since skystrike helped with reducing the number of flinches needed. I haven’t seen anyone else use that set so I write off that game as OP having a cool set that won with a bit of luck, as opposed to shellos was poor.

BLT semifinals vs Mikaav

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7lc-789631764

This was a semifinals team tour game with the score being 3-4. Knockout game for my team. Shellos had great mu, just needed to remove and trap ferro, and I was free to throw away my foo to achieve that since I knew shell could clean. Shellos came in turn 18 and setup, switched out on abra to scout for counter and trapped then setup again on mudbray. Mud crit eq on turn 28 but, as highlighted before, if shell sets up enough, non setup needs double crit to break through it or almost consecutive crits. Setup again and won. Mu was very favourable.

LC Open vs Bluxio

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7lc-792080707

This was two days ago, mu looks more threatening due to clam and what turned out to be lo staryu but similar to last game, once I got rid of ferro shell could clean. You could argue that surprise factor helped me a lot here, I think my opp misplayed a bit. Once I got rid of ferro, I just had to get shellos in for free on defensive sprit and setup amnesias to win. Shellos came in on sprit, got up two amnesias, cursed up on the mudbray and cleaned. Mu harder than the other two but still pretty manageable for shellos

DAT vs levi

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7lc-792839460

This happened today. Mu was actually kinda unfortunate, np gunk and np sprit are manageable with shellos but zig is not, especially with memento support. I think I played this as well as I could tbh, setting up with shell is impossible while zig is alive since it can bd and overwhelm. If you curse up on the switch, it is possible to beat bd zig if its best move to hit you is espeed, but not if its return/seed bomb since they do too much to +2 shellos.
+6 196+ Atk Zigzagoon Extreme Speed vs. +2 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 10-13 (37 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (10, 10, 10, 10, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13)
+6 196+ Atk Zigzagoon Extreme Speed vs. +3 228 HP / 132+ Def Eviolite Shellos: 9-12 (33.3 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 12)


Apologies for this super long post, wanted to flesh it out as much as possible since I’m requesting such a big rank increase. Had this post fleshed out for a while, but realised I lacked replays with it, which is why the last three replays above happened in the last week. I’d recommend trying it out before writing it off, it’s far better than it looks.
 
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A- is a terribly huge shout out for a Pokemon which:
  • Has 1 replay of it working out in an actual tour recognised by the circuit tour. A- is full of Pokemon like Spritzee with 24.4% LCPL usage and similar impact in other tours.
  • Is said to need a bunch of support. That team has both Trapinch and a pursuit user and doesn't seem to have space to fit in any hazards. High viability Pokemon typically need less support, see Zigzagoon being B despite being the most threatening sweeper in LC.
  • Extremely easy to adapt to if it actually becomes popular. Throw toxic on something, run clear smog Foongus, Taunt Mienfoo, bring Roar/WW Onix/Snubbull/Mudbray/Munchlax.
  • Is a free switch in for ghosts or sweepers like SD Pawniard when they confirm the set first. I know you addressed this but since the entire exemplar replay team is focused on Shellos it just seems to me like an extremely matchup reliant pokemon (which typically leads to a lower viability).
Despite all that it seems like a cool set that would have probably caught me out the first time I saw it (if you ruin it by posting it publicly). I'd give it no higher than C rank and reassess in a few months if people actually start using Shellos more now.



Side note: Clamperls in C+ and has seen the tournament usage recently to move up. Levi or someone can post the paragraphs though.
 
I actually fully agree on A-/B+ being objectively ridiculous for shellos. Main reason why I nominated it for such a high rank was because I felt like a good chunk of people wouldn't even bother with that long post if it was recommending shellos to C+, which is rn where I think it deserves to be.
To address you other points,
Agree on lack of replays, which is why I posted this now with such high praise. The purpose of that post was to inform people that shellos exists and its pretty good and with snake and lc open happening rn and winter seasonal in a few weeks I believe, I want people to try it in tours and add to its tour usage. Now that its known, hopefully it sees tour usage from people other than me. I think shellos has the potential to hit the high B's and maybe low A's but it needs a few months of solid tour usage before that can happen.
Your second point is semi-valid, the team in question is just one team I built with shellos as a semi-general purpose team. Other people might build different types of teams which might work on pressuring shellos checks thorugh offense or lures as opposed to two hard trappers.
I disagree with the third point, even if shellos becomes popular, I'd argue that feeling forced to run sets such as clear smog foongus, taunt foo, toxic anything or the roar mons you've mentioned would show how big of an influence shellos has on the meta, if that happened. All those suggestions are great vs shellos but almost completely useless and potentially detrimental vs most forms of standard. I can't think of many mons that can willingly replace any of their moves with toxic, clear smog foon loses the foon war and being forced to run roar snub/munch/onix etc is highly suboptimal in every non-shellos game. If people feel forced to run these sets to check shellos, then I think it has done its job of being a metagame threat you have to take into account.
With the ghost and sd pawn point, yh that's true, I can't deny that but there's only 3 ghost types on the viability rankings, two of which are virtually non-existent in tours rn and while the other is a massive metagame threat, shellos is paired with pursuit trappers. Depending on how good the mu is, you can let gast get a kill for the guaranteed trap and I'd argue that, if shellos is used enough to warrant the rise in usage of fril and pump in tours then again, it's affected the metagame by becoming a genuine threat. Sd pawn also true but barring the one recent dundies levi open game, I can't remember the last time I've seen sd pawn in a competitive setting so stating a pretty rare set of a common pokemon as a switch in isn't fair on shellos imo.

Agree with your last point, I posted that just because I want to see people try it in tours. Shellos needs a few months of good tour usage before you could legitimately argue for a place in the B to A- rankings
 
I'll give my opinions of potential VR changes:

Rises:


A+ --> S
This annoying thing forces players to have one of its few proper switchins to avoid getting spored. It can comfortably switch into several mons and keep itself healthy throughout the match with regenerator and synthesis. When the spore absorber is down it can put something important sleep in late game. It can lure ferroseed with hp fire and outstall the opposing foongus with knock off support. Definitely a S-worthy threat.


A --> A+
Wingull is great at spreading destruction and scald burns, revenge killing, cleaning, removing hazards and much more. Its frailty and stealth rock weakness hold it back to some extent but with reasonable plays it's able to apply lots of pressure into the opposing team.


A- --> A
Ferroseed is a great utility mon that can take hits from several threats quite comfortably while setting hazards and crippling its switchins with knock off and thunder wave. Walling foongus lacking hp fire is also nice.


A- --> A
Spritzee is the best knock off sponge the metagame has to offer. It can consistently check fighting types and wall quite a lot of other mons. Offensive sets give it some versatility and surprise factor, too.


B --> B+
Trapinch faces competition from diglett but it's able to trap and beat some threats more easily than diglett thanks to its better bulk and power and certain important moves. For example it has an easier time beating onix, magnemite and diglett itself which makes it a mon worth having for certain teams.


C+ --> B
Possibly the best setup sweeper in the current meta, clamperl is able to destroy entire teams. It has a hard time setting up due to lacking eviolite and disliking knock off which is why it needs support from the likes of memento diglett. Its sweep can also be stopped by certain mons like sash abra, ferroseed and timburr which makes it somewhat matchup reliant. In a good matchup, however, it can quite easily set up and demolish an entire team unlike any other sweeper LC has to offer. Clamperl is also able to wallbreak certain mons such as foongus and timburr before attempting to set up and sweep.


C --> C+
Look at all the trash mons in C. I don't think chespin fits there as it's debatably the best foongus switchin while also checking most gastly variants and being a good defensive mon and spikes stacker. It's quite passive and is scared by many standard mons but thanks to its qualities it's a mon worth building around.


UR --> C (originally nominated by Hawkie)
Drowzee can switch into spore from foongus thanks to insomnia. It's able to use its great bulk to stall mons while many of the mons it can't stall it can defeat with counter.


UR --> C (originally nominated by Pamplona)
Venonat is a great asset for teams that utilize baton pass. It can put something to sleep and pass agility boosts/substitutes to its teammates. Its good bulk and decent defensive typing helps venonat in its role but baton pass is its only niche.


UR --> C (originally nominated by Simbo)
Shellos has potential to keep setting up until it can comfortably beat the entire opposing team. It's matchup reliant and requires support and when it fails to sweep it accomplishes nothing.

Drops:


A+
--> A
Mareanie is passive, is beaten by diglett unless it manages to set up iron defenses and is scared of knock off and many other common attacks in the metagame. It's still a sturdy defensive mon but not A+ material.


A- --> B+
Croagunk is easy to wear down and revenge kill. Diglett destroys it. It has an unique set of resistances but there's not much else going on for it.


A- --> B+
Doduo is hard to pick over vullaby or wingull. It has great offensive presence but it's very frail, lacks a pivoting move and hates weak armor mons. Its stealth rock weakness combined with brave bird recoil wears it down quickly to the point where priority users can revenge kill it.


A- --> B+
While shellder is a quite threatening sweeper many healthy standard mons can take hits from it and stop its sweep cold. It can't set up easily against special attackers and priority can be used to stop it in several cases.


B+ --> B
Slowpoke has great defensive stats and regenerator but being weak to knock off + voltturn cripples it ultimately.


B+ --> B
Scraggy with DD is countered by spritzee while many other mons such as mienfoo, sash abra and fast scarfers can beat it comfortably, too. Scarf scraggy can't spam its stab moves well enough to clean in most cases and lacks a pivoting move.


B+ --> B
Not having reliable recovery like spritzee forces snubbull to rely on berry juice. For this reason diglett destroys it if it switches into u-turning mienfoo or vullaby. Spritzee can also sponge special hits much more comfortably than snubbull.


This is my first VR post so I apologize if you find some of these nominations and reasonings ridiculous. Many of these noms were also inspired by earlier ones suggested by others.
 
Snivy: A+ to A

Might be a bit controversial but I don't think snivy is nearly as good as it was in SM, early USM and even at the start of lcpl when people were potentially talking about suspecting it due to the scarf set having very few checks and counters.
Main reason is foongus, scarf snivy cannot break foongus, evio snivy finds it difficult to break foongus and zwring out is niche but then you lose snivys defensive utility of switching into most rockers and beating them 1v1. Foongus is everywhere and heavily spammed rn because it's good and splashable which hinders snivys ability to apply offensive pressure and break teams. Similarly, the ferrospritz core is on the rise, which is another core scarf snivy and non-hp fire evio snivy find difficult to break without semi-heavy team support.

Scarf snivy is entirely shut down by foon and ferro, and also checked by defensive bj vull or evio vull, grimer, evio pawn, bj pony etc, which are all common rn barring pony and a lot of standard teams naturally have one or more of these mons, making it very difficult for scarf snivy to clean without a lot of chip and work. On top of that, scarf snivy is typically easy to spot from team preview. Usually, if you see snivy + mag, wynaut, or geo-a, it's normally scarf and you can look at your team and come up with ways to prevent scarf snivy from cleaning. Snivy plus dig can be harder to determine from preview alone but can be determined after a few turns or when it comes in. Scarf snivy teams are usually heavily orientated towards removing the threats/resists and going for clean, which means they are defensively lacking. Most lack reliable foon switchin/spore absorbers unless using wynaut, but then you need ferro removers/pressurers and have less slots for general defensive utility. I've seen scarf snivy paired with foon or ferro but again, less defensive synergy there and fewer slots for pressuring opposing foon/ferro. Scarf snivy teams are hard to pull off successfully against a decent chunk of current standard builds and are open to lose to setup like shell/clam especially with memento support or mons like shrugaby because they lack the defensive backbone that usual standard has in favour for foon and ferro lures/trappers. Scarf snivy switches into almost nothing freely, dig or scarf/elctrium mag switch into little barring weak resisted hits or knock from pawn in mags case if eved to tank or good predictions, meaning you've got 4 slots to give yourself defensive checks to the metagames top threats or at least some form of counterplay.

Evio snivy similarly is a lot less splashable than it was in SM and early USM. Webs are almost non-existent rn barring a few lcers who use it semi-consistently, which means you don't need snivy on your team to counter webs anymore. It faces heavy defog competition from vullaby, which is far more splashable and is a lot harder to switch into for most teams. The rise and popularity of mons like lo gastly and wingull also make evio snivys job harder, neither switch in but they pressure snivy heavily on free switchins and are generally very difficult to switch into.
Biggest issue rn with using evio snivy is probably the fact that it's the grass on the team. Unless you decide to double grass with ferro/ches/foon, the matchup vs foon is kinda poor and you're forced to either run overcoat vull as the foon check/spore absorber, run some sleep talk mon or let foon spore something. I've seen snivy teams with sleep talk pawn, mag and vull as spore absorbers but it's not particularly ideal giving up a valuable moveslot for sleep talk. It's a lot easier to run a foon checking grass like ferro/ches/foon and then using gast, gull or abra or some other fast strong special attacker over snivy.

Another smaller factor which don't help snivy much is the rise of protect on mons like onix and gull and defensive sprit always having protect. Leaf storm only has 8pp so you're wasting pp on the protect, then if you opt to stay in and storm again on the foon/ferro, you're 2 storms down for very little. Scarf snivy is even more heavily affected, since you can't aggressively knock the foon or ferro on the switch and you waste storm pp if you lock into it.

I think the biggest issue with snivy rn is lack of immediate pressure plus not being particularly splashable. The first leaf storm is not as strong as you want it to be, being unable to do more than 50 percent to 14 spdef evio neutral pokemon like foo and mare on first storm (10 dmg is standard roll). Compare that to other A and A+ special attackers like gast, gull and abra. Lo gast has immediate huge offensive pressure, boasting immediate ohko potential on a decent chunk of the tier depending on coverage and fully customisable coverage that bops certain cores. Z move gast gives up power for one time nuke to lure/kill something and scarf gast boasts ok power but can revenge +2 clam and +2 non jolly shell. Abra has good offensive presence, decent coverage, good speed but also the very useful 1-time blanket check to everything barring ss shellder if sash. Lo abra boasts immediate power and is difficult to play around if its against non-dig or grime teams. Gull boasts very difficult to switch in stabs with the 30 percent chance to make pawn useless and no longer a gull check if protect roost and 30 percent chance to make tirt ultra passive. It also boasts a very strong z fly and the low chance of hurriconfing through even its best defensive checks in sprit, ferro and the less common fril. Also has defog if you need hazard removal.
I think it's rare to build around a core or build a team and think that snivy fills the gap in the team well. More often than not, if you're using snivy, you've actively decided to build using scarf/evio or some other snivy and have built a team supporting it. It's not particularly splashable and most standard builds appreciate the immediate power or threat level of gast/gull/bra/potentially 4 attack staryu over snivy. It's still a good pokemon that can plow through unprepared teams but that's not enough to justify A+ imo.
 
Kabuto: B to B-/C+
This thing is no longer an adequate birdcheck. With the rise of max attack weak armor vullaby, kabuto has had its utility reduced to just stealth rocks and rapid spinning. Calcs below to prove it
On switching into a knock off:
236+ Atk Vullaby Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 116 HP / 36 Def Eviolite Kabuto: 7-10 (33.3 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Possible damage amounts: (7, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10) so we assume 9hp done
Then another knock off:
236+ Atk Vullaby Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. -1 116 HP / 36 Def Eviolite Kabuto: 12-15 (57.1 - 71.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Possible damage amounts: (12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 15)
Typical sets run 21 hp, so by now your kabuto has been killed by the ever present vullaby (at +2 speed). Alexa plays despacito as birdspam proceeds to run through your team.

Other noms:
Foongus to S
Mareanie to A/A-
Snivy - Leave it yeah
Chespin to B-/C+
Trapinch to B+
Shellos to C-/C
 
Foongus To S
Chespin to B/B+
Trapinch to B+
Wingull to A+
Foongus doesn't die
We all know about chespins vr history lol
Trapinch has had good usage in snake and has its niches over diglett
Wingull impossible to switch into with its coverage
 

sister

Banned deucer.
I think I would go as far to say that Spritzee should go up to A+. I'm glad this thing is finally getting some real tech outside of Wish / Protect / Moonblast / Aromatherapy that was pretty typical early on. It's defensive capabilities are obviously well passed proven, but with things like Trick Room / Nasty Plot / Draining Kiss / Calm Mind becoming more popular, Spritzee is showing to be a scary offensive threat. And while it needs some team-support, the ability to go from one of the best defensive walls in the meta to also maintaining a potential offensive presence absurdly increases Spritzee's splashability. Even without considering that aspect, Spritzee's defensive and support options are nigh unrivaled. I'm sure I don't need to go into detail but this things got Wish, Aromatherapy and Covet all the while checking most of the scary shit this meta can throw at it- Mienfoo, Vullaby, Wingull, Abra, etc. It can even run Psychic to pressure its potential counters. Just an overall good mon that really adds a lot to your team, and its a mon I don't feel you can get passed simply.

On a similar note: Ferroseed. I definitely agree with the nom to bring it to A, though I could certainly see an argument for A+ as well. Whenever I do some teambuilding, or I'm looking into potential sweepers, the answer always is: How can it get passed Ferroseed? I feel like this thing is the bane of just about everything. Wingull, Abra, Gastly, Snivy, Staryu, Clamperl, Shellder, Spritzee, Elekid, Chinchou, Magnemite, Onix, Zigzagoon, Bunnelby, Meowth like fuck this thing just straight walls everything, and is the sole reason why HP Fire is anywhere in this meta. But the size of what it can wall also seems to be it's main issue- Ferroseed is easily worn down throughout the match. That said, I feel like a big part of most matches comes down to who can chip away the enemy's Ferroseed the fastest, so I would definitely say it's in the top 10 most meta-defining Pokemon right now. Great support options in SR / Spikes / Twave / Knock Off, great synergy with other defensive mons. Just overall really good, and certainly on a level similar to Onix, Abra and Pawniard, in my opinion.

Anyway other thoughts I've been thinking but really don't have much to say about:
Timburr to A, Mach Punch Meme Man is still strong enough to make thinks like Carvanha and Bunnelby scared, but I feel like a lot of the roles it wants to play are done better by other mons. It seemingly works best as a Fighting spam partner to Mienfoo... what a leech. Though its good coverage and Iron Fist makes Foongus and Vullaby think twice about switching in.
Ponyta to A-, The best Fire-type in the meta by a large margin, though thats a title that doesn't come with much these days. Cool for beating common Ferrospritz cores but thats really it. The meta just isn't a comfortable place for it, in my opinion.
Staryu to A-, 4-Attacks Offensive is Fire but thats really it, being the best spinner in the meta just doesn't mean much anymore.
Doduo to B+, yeah basically what muksu said.
Mudbray to B+, it just doesn't fill any real niches to be honest. It hits hard but thats really it. Pure Ground isn't the best defensive typing right now, and your Stealth Rocker role can easily be filled by Onix or Ferroseed or Tirtouga, who actually can reliably wall much more that Mudbray can. It obviously has a lot of good points, but not enough to set apart from other B+s imo.

Also, I disagree with Shellder to B+. Yeah, like any sweeper, it has its challenges when setting up and maintaining the sweep, but I'd still argue its the best set-up sweeper in the metagame right now. Looking at it from a purely team-building perspective, if you don't have an answer for Shellder, you lose. Straight up. And yeah you can say that about most mons, but anything that isn't an answer to Shellder isn't an answer to Shellder. With other mons you can possibly play around it with prediction and positioning, but not Shellder. Even it's susceptibility to priority can be questioned because non-evio Shellder at -1 still only takes 9 damage (max is 10) from Timburr Mach Punch, and 13-17 damage from LO Pawniard Sucker Punch, which can lead to some mindgames that are just as easy to win then they are to lose. Interesting Tech with Protect to block Fake Out make Shellder a lot more interesting. Is it perfect? Certainly not, but I think A- is a fair placement for it. I just never feel safe while the thing is still on the field.
 

Altariel von Sweep

Yoooo Mista!
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About the Croagunk matter, I disagree dropping it to B+. As we can see, Snake S1 P1 has featured a lot of usage on the Ferroseed + Spritzee core, which means Croagunk is able to break, and despite Chespin is now a thing, many have started running Sludge Wave to avoid getting countered by it. One thing that doesn't like is the Diglett and Vullaby usage (which is MASSIVE), same with Abra, Gastly and Wingull, but I feel it's easier to make it fit on specific teams that require a wincon that serves as a emergency check to Fighting-types and can clean unprepared teams in late-game. Definitely not B+, keep it.
 
Agree with

Wingull to A+
Ferro to A
Sprit to A
Trapinch to B+
Clamperl to B
Chespin to B
Venonat to C-
Mareanie to A
Doduo to B+
Shellder to B+
Kabuto to B-

For reasons already stated by other people in previous VR posts.

To address your points about shellder, sister, I think shellder is a pretty underwhelming setup sweeper in the current metagame which requires far too much work done to most current standard builds, making it pretty poor at sweeping. It's true that if you lack a shellder check you lose but I feel like it's almost impossible not to have at least two shellder checks on a standard team, unless your team consists of foo foon onix vull not-scarfdig filler that loses to shell at +2 like gull or abra, a team core that was popular a few months ago but is bad rn, since those kind of teams have little defensively for current big threats like gull, gast, clam etc.

Vullaby being so good has mandated the use of 15 defense foo on a good chunk of teams, which is a fantastic shellder check, since spear does 15 at +2 normally. Ferrospritz is a very common defensive core rn, since it's the best defensive core against wingull, which haxes through checks like pawniard and tirtouga semi-consistently. 15 def foo ferrospritz was a very commonly used core in first phase of snake, so theres 3 shellder checks already. Looking at vr, there are 11 pokemon from S to A- which can tank a shellder attack at +2, and since most standard builds typically are pick 6 from S to A- or 5 with one cooler mon, that's potentially a lot of pokemon that need to be weakened or removed in a typical match.

Looking at snake usage, huge mienfoo usage which were mostly 15 def, so that's a good check, 40% ferro and sprit usage, good checks, both bj and scarfmag check the more common protect shellder, evio pawn tanks a +2 liq and any pawn set tanks +2 spear, then there's mareanie, tirtouga, timburr too. I believe every team in phase 1 snake had at least two good shellder checks, some had three in 15 def foo ferrospritz, a few had 4 and I believe one team had 5 shellder checks in 15 def foo, ferrospritz, scarfmag and tirt. I don't know how many of them prepped for shell but while building to check other mons, you can naturally stack up multiple shell checks. Shell requires far too much effort to work against most current standard builds. You need to weaken and potentially knock all these pokes, while preventing defensive spritzee from coveting evios back then finding a good opportunity to set up, all while knowing a good opponent will try to preserve one of their shell checks as much as possible. Even a lot of offensive pokemon like tr spritz and opposing shellder can tank +2 hits in a pinch.

Compare all that to clamperl, the superior smasher rn imo, capable of absolutely dismantling most teams with memento support. At +2, only one pokemon in the meta can boast taking a hit from any clam set and that's mareanie. Ferro dies to hp fire or beam after minimal chip, shellos and poke die to grass and nothing else tanks surf. Clam is far more dangerous to current standard builds and cores and warps gameplay far far more than shellder typically does. Against shellder, you typically just have to preserve one of potentially multiple shellder checks. Against clam, some scarfers cannot lock themselves into certain moves like mag, you have to be careful with what mons on your team kill what to avoid losing to memento plus clam afterwards and, against non-dig teams, clam can happily come in on free switchins on some slower pokemon like slowfoo and 88 percent foongus and slightly chipped sprit and fire off a free surf or beam, something shellder can't boast. They both share the same issues of faster scarfers and clam takes more from prio, but clam destroys almost everything at +2, whereas shellder doesn't. Shellder's only real advantage over clam is that it's bulkier and sets up on more pokemon but offensively it's too poor, even at +2.

Shellder still has decent usage and is good on some ho builds, most notably veil, smashspam and shellclam based teams, but I think that's primarily because it's not the standalone wincon. On those teams, shellder can happily 1v1 and die in exchange for an opposing pawniard or chipping ferro or sprit enough for another setup mon to win. Shellder + 5 standard poke based teams with shell as the wincon are heavily underwhelming rn imo and haven't done anything impressive in a tour for quite a while I think. It's definitely not A- worthy rn, clam is a bigger threat to most teams.
 
Tbh the VR need two urgent modifications :

-Foongus should be S rank : Atm Foongus centralise the tier. One of the best Pivot with regenerator and spore support. It could deals with ground/water/fairy and fight type which are very present in little cup. As the usage proof it
[3 | Foongus | 31.73511% | 16616 | 12.868% | 13527 | 13.263%] Foongus is a mons whom we need to be prepared.
-Mareanie should be A- or B+rank : Mareanie lost a lot of utility in this metagame because of the Volturn team's with Trapper like Dig.
Futhermore, Mareanie don't help players to keep momentum, that is very important atm in this meta

Excuse me for my bad english i hope peoples will understand the main part.
 
I see more prominent users above me discussing more pressing little cup matters, like the potential rise of Foongus to S rank, so if my shitmon nomination is inappropriate, I can remove it. Smoochum, while nearly wholly outclassed by Abra, has a very strong matchup vs a huge number of threats in the current metagame. Smoochum's flaws are immediately apparent; a barely sufficient speed tier, awful defenses, a huge vulnerability to choice scarf users, a near useless abillity, and the abillity to be pursuit and arena trapped. Smoochum's niche lies in its positive matchup vs the ever present diglett/mienfoo/vullaby/foongus core and highly adequate special attack. Here are some damage calcs.
240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Psychic vs. 156 HP / 196 SpD Eviolite Mienfoo: 23-31 (100 - 134.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Psychic vs. 124 HP / 160 SpD Eviolite Foongus: 23-31 (92 - 124%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Ice Beam vs. 124 HP / 160 SpD Eviolite Foongus: 23-31 (92 - 124%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Ice Beam vs. 116 HP / 76 SpD Eviolite Vullaby: 23-31 (92 - 124%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Ice Beam vs. 116 HP / 76 SpD Eviolite Vullaby: 23-31 (92 - 124%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Psychic vs. 196 HP / 100+ SpD Eviolite Mareanie: 23-31 (95.8 - 129.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
(you're not seeing much of mareanie due to diglett, just figured I would include this calculation)
240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Hidden Power Fire vs. 84 HP / 228 SpD Eviolite Ferroseed: 21-26 (95.4 - 118.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

240 SpA Life Orb Smoochum Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 76 SpD Eviolite Onix: 26-34 (130 - 170%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Not that anyone wondered if onix was able to tank an ice beam, just wanted to emphasize Smoochum's great matchup against an incredibly common core in diglett/foo/vull/onix)

A life orb attacker boasting an 81 percent chance to kill common threats doesn't initially seem too crazy, but I find it very important. With any chip at all, or with having stealth rocks up, smoochum's 80% chance of killing some of the most relevant mons in the tier becomes 100%. Note that while life orb abra is able to KO many of these same threats, it suffers from many of the same issues should it choose to run life orb; like weakness to scarfers and trapping vulnerability. Smoochum also synergizes well with (arguably!) the best mon in the tier, mienfoo. A slow mienfoo set, which is growing in popularity, allows mienfoo to pivot in smoochum and often secure a kill. If vullaby or wingull share a team slot with smoochum, they may run tailwind should a move slot be available. This allows smoochum to clean mid or late game. I'll include the set I've been using, which is pretty much its only set barring the option of running hp fire for ferroseed. I also suppose protect could be ran to guard against fake outs, though that's hardly worth mentioning.

Smoochum @ Life Orb
Ability: Forewarn
Level: 5
EVs: 240 SpA / 240 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 1 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Substitute
 

dcae

Tournament Banned
is a Tiering Contributor
I'm bringing you the update that has been long awaited.

RISES:

Foongus up to S

Since everyone began using Synthesis on Foongus early this year this became the most common Fighting resist and general glue mon defensively on every team for a long time, giving rise to many of the most common cores in LC. Furthermore, the sheer dominance of Foongus contributed heavily to the return of Ferroseed as a top viable mon and resulted in Foongus wars in many high level LC games.

Wingull up to A+

Long overdue move, but Wingull has been one of the most dominant mons in LC for a while now. Considering the very low Chinchou usage, its STAB moves are unresisted and Scald is able to bypass the majority of its would-be checks. Wingull's versatility also allows it to pick and choose its answers, with Z Flying as the most common set but both BJ and Z Water having very real niches. Furthermore, Wingull takes advantage of the common Foo/Foon/Onix core and is one of the major reasons behind the return of Ferrospritz cores. Its influence on the meta is undeniable and worthy of an A+ mon.

Ferroseed up to A

Ferro initially saw its jump in usage once more due to it being a hard stop to the Synth Foongus set that abused that ability to switch in to spread paralysis and hazards highly effectively, but has also become a glue check to an increasing number of major LC threats such as Wingull, Clamperl, and NP Spritzee. It is currently one of the most highly used mons in Snake and is once again forcing an increasing usage of HP Fire, as seen on mons such as Gastly.

Spritzee up to A

Spritzee has become much more splashable due its unique ability to check the majority of the top mons in the meta via its bulk alone while also proving to be one of the most threatening mons in the meta thanks to its offensive Nasty Plot set. This versatility along with the drastic increase of Ferrospritz as a core in high level LC play means Spritzee is one of the more influential mons in the meta.

Trapinch up to B+

Trapinch's niche has been fully explored since the last viability ranking and has become a viable alternative to Diglett due to its ability to reliably trap and remove Onix and Tirt, the two most common Rock mons in the meta, enabling a more free usage of mons such as Vullaby, Wingull, and Ponyta. Furthermore, its ability to be tailored to trap Magnemite more reliably than Diglett provides it with a distinct place in the meta.

Meowth up to B

This was a meme mon for a while but its increased viability is reflected by successful tour showings by multiple top players. It remains in B due to a lack of splashability but its niche as a revenge killer for the increasing number of LC setup threats as well as the ability to hit top meta mons such as Vullaby after WA drop as well as Foongus, Mienfoo, and Pawn via the appropriate coverage move warrants a move up.

Chespin up to B

It has continued to prove it is not just a 1 month wonder but a consistent mon that has a legitimate niche in the metagame.

Clamperl up to B

It has proven to be a real threat by exploiting current LC build compositions and was a common sight throughout LC Open. It is only in B due to the substantial team support required to succeed with it.

Stunky up to C-

It has developed a unique niche as an 18 speed attacker that can threaten several of the top mons in LC with its coverage moves and priority.


DROPS:

Mareanie down to A

Despite being a superb mon with thorough high level LC usage, Mareanie is simply not as splashable as other A+ mons.

Staryu down to A-

Staryu's fall from grace continues, with defensive spin sets being almost completely invalidated by the existence of pivot defog Vullaby and superior defensive mons such as Mareanie while offensive sets must compete with Wingull, which boasts much better resistances/immunities and thus is a more consistent offensive threat. In short, Staryu suffers from Elekid syndrome, where its offensive sets have difficulty switching into anything and can only 2HKO mons rather than OHKO them.

Doduo down to B+

The constant usage of WA Onix makes Doduo less spammable than during the BJ Onix era, while SD sets, the most useful in the current meta, still find it difficult to fit into teams over Vullaby and Wingull, which provide more 2 way utility. Doduo's spot on birdspam teams has been lost to Wingull and its limited versatility has stunted its effectiveness.

Skrelp, Houndour, Mankey, Darumaka, Stufful, Tentacool down to Unranked

The viability council has continued its overhaul of the rankings system. We have decided to make the line for C- more stringent and thus all these mons have been deemed mostly unviable in the current meta. Either their niche is no longer relevant or their niche is simply too small to warrant noting.
 
This might be a controversial nom, and considering im new and the only thing I’m remotely known for is a string of autocorrect related mishaps involving budew and cranidos, but can someone explain to me why Elekid is so high and salandit is so low?
Elekid has never been a problem for me, every time it comes in, it’s easy to switch into diglett or trappinch and get a free ko, no momentum, no nothing. But the handful of times I’ve run into salandit, I’ve had to go through a long hard slog to kill the purple bandit and I’ve come to really respect it. So I’m nomming raise salandit and drop elekid. Like I said, I know pretty much nothing but this really confuses me.


Edit: completely unrelated but how do you get the sentence under your profile?
 
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Altariel von Sweep

Yoooo Mista!
is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Top Smogon Media Contributor
This might be a controversial nom, and considering im new and the only thing I’m remotely known for is a string of autocorrect related mishaps involving budew and cranidos, but can someone explain to me why Elekid is so high and salandit is so low?
Elekid has never been a problem for me, every time it comes in, it’s easy to switch into diglett or trappinch and get a free ko, no momentum, no nothing. But the handful of times I’ve run into salandit, I’ve had to go through a long hard slog to kill the purple bandit and I’ve come to really respect it. So I’m nomming raise salandit and drop elekid. Like I said, I know pretty much nothing but this really confuses me.


Edit: completely unrelated but how do you get the sentence under your profile?
Elekid is one of those Pokemon that can threaten many teams, but aren't able to reach certain KOs on Pokémon such as Vullaby and Foongus. This said, it requires a minimal of prediction game at least to be threatening, and even so, there are bulkier threats able to take it on. Moreover, the commonality of Diglett and other Ground-types is a annoyance for it, as it either risks Speed tie or gets trapped by Scarf sets. On Salandit's hand, while it's able to break the most common defensive, Ferroseed + Spritzee, it lacks of inmediate power without Life Orb, despite being able to use ZMoves, and has the same case of Elekid, threatens to many teams, but lacks of power to actually do so, and on top, its weakness to Diglett and Stealth Rock are big problems which draw it back to be higher in the rankings. However, there has been seen Scarf Sleep Talk sets to take advantage of its coverage and Speed while facing Foongus. I hope it helps.
 
Elekid is one of those Pokemon that can threaten many teams, but aren't able to reach certain KOs on Pokémon such as Vullaby and Foongus. This said, it requires a minimal of prediction game at least to be threatening, and even so, there are bulkier threats able to take it on. Moreover, the commonality of Diglett and other Ground-types is a annoyance for it, as it either risks Speed tie or gets trapped by Scarf sets. On Salandit's hand, while it's able to break the most common defensive, Ferroseed + Spritzee, it lacks of inmediate power without Life Orb, despite being able to use ZMoves, and has the same case of Elekid, threatens to many teams, but lacks of power to actually do so, and on top, its weakness to Diglett and Stealth Rock are big problems which draw it back to be higher in the rankings. However, there has been seen Scarf Sleep Talk sets to take advantage of its coverage and Speed while facing Foongus. I hope it helps.
Thanks, and the other thing? We could be spooktober buddies
 

Merritt

literally the textbook definition of a tsundere
is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Moderator
Thanks, and the other thing? We could be spooktober buddies
This thread has a lot of general forum FAQs, including the answer to this question.

Q: What is a "CT"?
A: "CT" is an abbreviation for "custom title", the term the Smogon forum uses to identify the text underneath a member's username and avatar in their postbit. Regular members don't have the ability to edit their CT, but once becoming a badgeholder (a member that's been awarded a badge for their on-site contributions), a member can freely edit their CT. There are some cases in which non-badgeholders have a CT, such as if a member gets a username change and the CT is "formerly [their old username]".
To get back on track, I do think a case could be made for dropping Elekid a subrank. The increased usage of Trapinch is pretty unpleasant for Elekid, since unlike Diglett it doesn't have to risk a tie in order to remove Elekid. I personally think it's still on par with the other B+ ranks, but if I had to make an argument for Elekid to drop it'd be centered around Trapinch.
 
I probably should have learned from my last train wreck of a post, but here goes.
Budew to C+/B-
now this thing is no foongus, I get that (it did have to be beaten into me though) but I still believe it isn’t meant to be. It can take a u-turn from mienfoo, most snivy run hp ground now (for reasons I don’t understand) and the forced switches let you get up spikes (it’s free real estate) it outspeeds foongus and beats it one on one and when I saw it on C I was really confused, he has a lot going for him, is only scared of pony and vulla (but seriously who isn’t scared of the nappy bird now) and has the advantage of being unprepared for, so why isn’t he higher?

Edit: number of times auto correct has turned budew into Budweiser is now uncountable
 
Clamperl B > B+
It's an absurd set up sweeper that is terrifying and stupid strong before it even sets up. It's seen a surge of usage recently and for good reason. Not only is it deadly (often game ending) when it sets up, it doesn't even have to be set up to threaten to nearly ohko common tankier mons such as timburr, and foongus/ferroseed (ice beam/hp fire dependent. Ohkoes both after rocks) as well as doing 60-70% raw to things like spritzee, grimer-a and spdef tirtouga. Sure it needs some support but the support is very limited like using a trapper or volt turn that you should be using anyway and is well worth it for such a powerful pokemon.

Larvesta B+ > B
This meta is not kind to Larvesta. 2 of the 3 premier rockers hard counter it and some of the most terrifying offensive presences such as diglett, vullaby and wingull absolutely destroy it. It generally feels like a handicap cause you're so focused on and have to spend so much time making sure rocks are off if you want to use it reliably or at all well which is hard to do and not worth the spot on a team generally. It's defensive utility is almost non existent checking things like snivy and fighters but only when rocks are off the field and with other checks to those like foongus, vullaby, spritzee, gastly, the list goes on being SO prevalent and being metagame staples it hurts Larvesta. There are numerous far better fighting and grass answers and an offensive fire type with u-turn is not enough of a niche to have it sitting at B+

Deerling should rise to C too but that's not very important.

I'd like to see opinions and/or discussion on Trapinch to A- as that was another nom I was considering making and I'm curious how others feel. It traps bulky things like chipped spritzee, foongus and ferroseed fine just like diglett but switching hard into onix, pawniard and a-grimer and trapping diglett is super duper big. There are obviously downsides, not nearly as fast, no pursuit, no memento/final gambit support, no rocks potential, etc but it's become common consistently and established it's very very solid niche to convince me personally it deserves A-
 

Altariel von Sweep

Yoooo Mista!
is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Top Smogon Media Contributor
Doing some opinions and proposals for VR changes.

B -> B+ Disagree

Despite having Protect, Clamperl is very reliant on its item and requires more than VoltTurn to be threatening, on top of still being threatened by common priority forms (Sucker Punch mindgames with Pawniard are 50/50). It still needs support to setup, leading to use Diglett to provide trapping and Memento, and Spritzee as Knock Off absorber so it doesn't lose Deep Sea Tooth. While I do agree that it's a big threat if it manages to setup, the amount of support it needs supposes a strain on its viability, and thus shouldn't rise.

C -> C+/B- Disagree

Worse Chespin, suffers from 4MSS wanting to use Synthesis, HP Fire or Giga Drain, and does nothing that Foongus can't do. Keep it.

B+ -> B Agree

Very reliant on hazard removal to act as a decent pivot, while it can get cheeky burns while facing threats such as Mienfoo and Pawniard, common threats in the metagame like Onix, Tirtouga or Wingull can beat it, and afte getting Knock Off'd, it's prone to get killed by many things. Drop it.

B+ -> A- Agree

Trapinch has clearly solidified its niche throughout Snake Smogon Draft as an alternative trapper to Diglett that can remove Onix, Tirtouga and Alolan Grimer from the game thanks to its bulk, which can be tailored to either trap Magnemite or Pawniard. Definitely deserves it.

And now, time for a shot of noms:

B+ -> B

Based on LudiCola's suposition, I think there are many reasons why Elekid should drop. The first and foremost, its lack of inmediate power, which is shown by common Pokémon avoiding OHKO from some coverage moves it runs such as Psychic against Foongus, which means it must do pretty correct predictions to be at least threatening. Secondly, the rise of usage in Trapinch has severly affected it, which shrugs off any damage dealt at it and gets trapped. Thirdly, its frail bulk makes it take too much damage from common priority forms such as Fake Out Mienfoo and Sucker Punch Pawniard, and it's unable to enter the field unless it's via slow momentum. Due to this, it's not an efficient check to Flying-types either. Fourth and last, Diglett's presence makes it risk 50/50 on Speed tie or actually being Choice Scarf sets, which is bad.

B- -> B

Despite the rise of Trapinch as a trapper and Diglett's presence coupled with weakness to Stealth Rock, Salandit manages to beat Ferroseed + Spritzee which has been on the rise thanks to its offensive typing, and despite its lack of power, it can run Flame Charge + ZMove sets which nuke the opponent with appropiate support or Scarf Sleep Talk sets which allow to improve Foongus matchup and surprise Diglett in the spot. Definitely a nomination that shouldn't be ignored and taken in mind.

That should make it, have a good day, guys.
 
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Budweiser is not a worse chespin, yes, he is a defensive grass type who sets spikes, but chespin is primarily a foongus counter who can hold his own against fighters. That is not what budew does, what budew does is punish physical attackers with poison point and set spikes with the many free turns it creates, he is a compromise of both foongus and chespin, he does both thier jobs. He is a foongus that can set spikes and a chespin with poison coverage.

Sorry if I am being rude and please let me know if I am completely wrong, but just saying that he is a worse foon/chespin is wrong, because he is a compromise between them.

Edit: don’t mean to toot my own horn but it was me who recommended the Elekid drop.
 

Ereshkigal

MERCI LES MAGICIENS
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
ok so this will be my first nom ever so, i hope it won't be that bad.

I think we should consider tirtouga to A. Indeed it's one of the best flying resist in lc if not the best with onix able to check vullaby and to an extent wingull while also being able to set rocks consistently. Tirtouga is also bless with the ability solid rock which let him set rocks on the like of ferroseed. A thing which must also be considered is that the cute turtle is not trap by diglett thanks to ist access to aqua jet which let him ko diglett from full when the others flying resist are all ohko by tectonic rage.
 
Zigzagoon B to A-/A
“I fear no man, but this thing. It scares me”
Heavy weapons guy.
Honestly, this thing is terrifying, the power to switch in after a ko and sweep is ridiculous. +6 extreme speed is death in a nutshell, the ONLY thing this fears is Mach punch, which can only be used by timburr (who I have seen once, because mienfoo) and shroomish (who I forgot even existed) so you know. No counters + perfect coverage for everything but steel is stupid, put it up for the shear power this Trash Rabbit has.

Edit: forget this post exists, I was really angry after coming off a bad losing streak and wrote this poorly sorry for wasting the time of whomever reads this.
 
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Ereshkigal

MERCI LES MAGICIENS
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Zigzagoon to A/A- disagree : While this Pokémon is undoubtely one of the most threatening setup sweepers in the tier if not the most threatening it requires a lot of support such as aurora veil and/or memento. Furthermore it relies a lot on his berry juice which means that if it got knocked off he is pretty much a deadweight. I would also add that he must choose between seed bomb and protect which let him either walled by onix and tirtouga or be weak to fake out users, particularly meowth. Lastly while he has the coverage to hit ghost types it failed to touch the most common in gastly due to his mediocre speed.

So, while it is a really threatening sweepers, it needs to have too much support and has to much flaws to be rank this high imo
 

Ninjadog13

levi of the year
is a Tiering Contributor
Frillish B to B+ (or maybe even A-)

I'm surprised Frillish hasn't been nominated yet, the defensive set has been receiving decent usage recently, most notably in Snake (and by people like jake even before that), and is able to check a number of threats, A- might be a stretch but I think it's definitely better than most of the stuff currently in B+ rank.

It has very good 25/21/24 bulk, and a strong ability in Cursed Body which it can now comfortably run over Water Absorb due to the decrease in usage of offensive water types like Staryu and Corphish. Will-o-Wisp/Scald allow it to cripple common switch-ins like Pawniard or Vullaby, and burns in conjunction with Cursed Body allow Frillish to potentially beat or force out even Pokemon it has a distinct type disadvantage against, whilst Hex becomes a very strong 130BP move if the opponent is burnt.

Frillish is also one of the few viable mons that can consistently beat Wingull, with Wingull requiring a 1/16 roll on either Supersonic Skystrike or Hurricane even if Frillish is switching in.

236 SpA Wingull Supersonic Skystrike (185 BP) vs. 236 HP / 76 SpD Eviolite Frillish: 13-16 (52 - 64%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
236 SpA Wingull Hurricane vs. 236 HP / 76 SpD Eviolite Frillish: 7-10 (28 - 40%) -- 98.9% chance to 3HKO

Frillish's strong special bulk also allows it to beat Abra if it isn't running Energy Ball, and if rocks aren't up lives LO Gastly's Shadow Ball 15/16 times and OHKOs back with Hex. It is also unable to be trapped by Diglett (unless it's running pursuit) thanks to its Ghost typing. Access to both Cursed Body and Recover also allows Frillish to spam recover until the opponent's strongest move gets disabled, which can also be very useful. Frilllish also comfortably lives Clamperl's Surf at +2.

Overall I think Frillish is a very versatile Pokemon especially defensively, and is certainly better than its current B ranking.
 
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