Resource USUM OU ULTRA Viability Ranking Thread

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M-Latios from A to A-: disagree

Saying it's outclassed by Zam kinda misses the point of using the mon, I feel. You use Lati because of its typing and incredible bulk, in addition to the fact that it's immune to all forms of hazards except rocks. That last point in particular in makes it a boon for spike stacking teams as it's one of the few offensive mons in the tier that requires absolutely no defog support whatsoever, not even for webs. And as another post said it can 2HKO AV Mag as well as check Gliscor, Lando, Bulu, Kartana, Pinsir, Zygarde, and even take a +1 Thousand Arrows and revenge kill with Ice Beam or Draco, all of which Zam can't do. It's generally just a great defensive pivot and offensive threat outside of simply checking Heatran.
 
Good afternoon everyone, today I bring you another nom from the deep. It took me a while to get this one right but I assure you, after some fucking around, I found the hidden fire and it's so fun to use. I am nominating Shiftry from UR -> C.
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Now at first glance this hidden leaf village mon might seem a little iffy; And I get it on paper at a glance it doesnt have anything that is super in your face. For reference here are it's stats:
HP 90
Atk100
Def 60
SpA 90
SpD 60
Spe 80
Now that we have that out the way let's go what made this mon interesting to me: it's downright incredible movepool and the ability chlorophyll.
For those that don't know it's movepool consists of moves like: solar beam, leaf storm, nasty plot, growth, hurricane, extrasensory, explosion, focus blast, rock slide, icy wind, low kick, & more. This was very, very interesting to me especially since I can run it in sun and i already had some major success running sun venu; shit was amazing. So i did, and what I found was pretty amazing, a lot of mons are straight up afraid of shiftry due to typing alone and a lot are just bopped by its attacks. In fact running z shiftry got me up the the 1800s and it was the star of the show a lot of the time. When it's in you're almost guaranteed at least 2 kills - at least with my set. Shits so amazing oml and fun. Now what was my set?

Shiftry @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Chlorophyll
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Growth
- Knock Off
- Hurricane
- Solar Beam
Now some of you may laugh at this "mixed" set but like to be completely honest this shit was lit as hell fam. I ran knock off b/c its a really good move and when you growth ur at +2 attack anyway so ur gucci (even though it could be hp fire or rock slide or whatever u want there really, or you could just straight up run physical.. I really like z rock slide or z dark.) And what does this give you? A hard AF hitting mon. Just for starters. +2 z hurricane okos HELLA shit dude like omfg lmao or does enough where im satisfied.
- torn okoed.
- av bulu - okoed
- grass types in general okoed
- mega scizor okoed
- lando obviously okoed but like solar beam does as well
- +1 volc obviously okoed lol
- latios okoed as well
- ferro takes 90%
And its one of the fwe mons that can do this. So just to give perspective I treat this game like it's war b/c it kind of is. One amazing thing about growth is that they straight up don't know if ur physical or special so it puts you in a very unique situation to fuck shit all the way up. bluff phys with the knock off and solar beam that lando fam. SHIFTRY FOR RANKED.
Why not use other sun sweepers? Only comparable is mega houndoom, use another mega and the other is venu (i used both on my team actually).
Maybe like uuhhhhhhhhh leafeon ? LOL Whatever here are the fabulous replays and I am pumped to talk about this fresher than clean mon

It puts in work each game im happily flabbergasted like shit actually works :)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-810624661
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-809012668
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-809006217
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-808863881 - it won the game for me here essentially
LOL swept - https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-808858793
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-808727540
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-808664171
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-809189013
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-810644742
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-809076562
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-811140326



edit: honestly, thank you for the support on this. I get a lot of hate for the shit i do but silent support in the dms and it actually gives me joy that no one is hating on me for this and actually reading and what not. Gives me hope for the future- fr fr. For those that dont know i get a lot of hate like a lot. esp in the chats or in my dms

edit2 For the haters bc my posts is likely gettign deleted:​
"Also at this point, according to ur logic I shouldn't have been able to get up the the 1900s with shiftry doing work most of the time with a squad of pu and ru mons. In fact - those actually put in more work than the designated ou mon bulu. like id rather have the turtle over zard y. So really we have a dilemma here, your underlying assumptions of what's viable are wrong,or, I'm just so damn amazing at this game that these peasant guidelines you have in place and don't apply to me. So which is it? lmk fam if you're designating me as a goat"


 
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Mega Venusaur from B to B+
Mega Venu is one of the best mons for checking Mawile and CM Mag if not the best. Both of these mons have risen in usage. SD bulu is also a major threat so venu has more potent to be used. It also can check heatran if you're running eq.
Mega venu pairs really well with wish support pokemon. I was using wish jirachi with venu and it did amazing.
 
Hurricane looks like it's mostly a lure+answer to rain/hail switch in, but I won't lie they would likly raw double switch in that event

But knock off should hit big char-u answers like Chaney

But it being unranked might be fine

I think currently...

It's just a really short lived niche in top ladder meta

I don't think it would have a use in a tournament or 3 ranking adjustments ago

That said I'm working on a mega beedrill agruement I might have ready in 3 weeks
 
A serious problems to Shiftry's viability is it needs another Pokemon to set up Sun, a fairly niche type of weather already. So you need a Charizard-Y, a mega slot, to seriously make use of it. Then on top of that, once Supersonic Strike is used, Hurricane's accuracy is only 50% in the Sun.
"A serious problems to Shiftry's viability is it needs another Pokemon to set up Sun, a fairly niche type of weather already. "
I mean that's fine, it's part of of the playstyle... same with rain........ and tbh zard y wasnt even the best setter. The turtle was far better even though I ran both just for the hell of it. Actually theres a guy, i think he goes by fire lord azai or something, he runs a sun team fairly well and uses the turtle to set it up. Zard y is not needed.

"once Supersonic Strike is used, Hurricane's accuracy is only 50% in the Sun." - Thats fine. Did you watch the replays at all? I only need to use it once.




Hurricane looks like it's mostly a lure+answer to rain/hail switch in, but I won't lie they would likly raw double switch in that event

But knock off should hit big char-u answers like Chaney

But it being unranked might be fine

I think currently...

It's just a really short lived niche in top ladder meta

I don't think it would have a use in a tournament or 3 ranking adjustments ago

That said I'm working on a mega beedrill agruement I might have ready in 3 weeks
Im going to be honest its like you're talking in haikus or something what are you talking about? Anyway ill address the "Hurricane looks like it's mostly a lure+answer to rain/hail switch in, but I won't lie they would likly raw double switch in that event". Its another option to hit its answers. And it just so happens that it works well in rain.
And this:
"It's just a really short lived niche in top ladder meta" - I actually ran this shit from the 1300s and got to the mid 1800s so ok.
 
I'm just not really feeling the Shiftry-ranked argument. I mean, you'd basically have to use Zard-Y, a Pokémon that itself requires a lot of support, in order to use that. And before you say "oh, I don't use Zard-Y, I use Ninetales/Torkoal/whatever" then you have to prove THAT is viable before trying to rank Shiftry.

Basically, the point is sun is already a super niche playstyle as it is, and trying to fit a Pokémon with mediocre stats that needs a boost to be threatening and provides little defensive utility is just a very questionable decision considering all of the support you need to fit for weather setters, hazards, hazard removal, rain countermeasures, et cetera. It may have seen some success, but it just requires an insane amount of support with too little payoff. If it did get ranked, it would probably be unranked in a matter of weeks as people learn how to beat the very specific builds Shiftry finds itself on.
 
Zard Y: B- --> B

I feel that zard is really a good mon rn with a lot of teams droppin pex as well as latis dropping off a bit. plus, it just smashes pexless and latiless balances, which are gettin somewhat common again. also, it was used by bro kappa in olt playoffs which showed what happens if u have a bad zard matchup. it also works well with torn, who defogs well as well as sp def drill, which as become p good again. and bein a fire type is nice in a meta so cluttered with steels. it can even check non z fire tran to a degree. it can even play the mind games with mawile.
 
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hi guys I'm new (sort of I've been on PS for a few years) and since you guys just had a lengthy disscussion on an unranked mon should I wait a bit on my own unranked nomination or should I just go for it.

Only post an unranked nom if you have a handful of solid high ladder or tour replays + solid logic to support it, and make sure to read the rules in the first post before posting. Besides that, go ahead.
 
hi guys I'm new (sort of I've been on PS for a few years) and since you guys just had a lengthy disscussion on an unranked mon should I wait a bit on my own unranked nomination or should I just go for it.
Also--not to speak over a moderator, since GMars is correct--if you have an underused/niche mon you feel is working for you, feel free to use the Metagame Discussion Thread to share your thoughts. It's a great way to share thoughts and solicit feedback without/before the formalized (and often contentious) nature of a VR nomination.

GMars Edit: Makes sure to read the rules for that thread carefully before posting, as it's heavily moderated.
 
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Tapu Fini: B- --> B
This thing is really underrated imo. it has such amazing bulk with the ability to stallbreak with whirlpool and taunt and even defog for teammates. it loves ash gren being around so much and the same goes for zyg, which it checks. it even beats the latis. its shown its worth in the current meta.

Alakazam: C to UR
This thing is useless. u know what itll do with the counter set and LO is so outclassed by mega zam its not even funny. this thing is even more worthless than some of the TR setters and dnite. this thing is a waste.

Mod Edit: Just so you're aware, it is frowned upon to inflate your post count through double posting simply to get a name change as stated in the rules. I'll be sure to let the admins know ahead of time for your foolish mistake so you can wear that name proudly for a long time.
 
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Don't think Fini is bad right now, but it can be a liability against a team with serp or a team that can set rocks number of times and fini is questionable on stall and must run moonblast to not get trolled by mega sabeye which still gets its knock off

I think it's still great for a team looking to avoid status and might want non trap heatran(which I feel can be the better stall breaker with manga strom taunt)

Fini is a better pivot than defogger, most teams have a way to abuse fini defogging

Ash-Greninja has stayed basically the same since the start of the Meta, idk how greninja usage has changed outside protean funk shot/u-turn is still around
 
Yes, fini loses to serp. However, terrain allows other mons that couldnt beat it in a 1v1 otherwise to win as glare isnt there crippling them for the whole game. It can trap non z tran p ok from what ive found. Ash gren is as good as ever and havin a mon that can check it and zyg in one slot is something i find undervalued atm (ferro isnt a zyg check). Even tang has issues like tran beating it and u cant always fit a grass and fini is toxic immune and can defog. Sure, some current top trends are a bit annoyin but i think B- is underselling it by a lot.
 
Don't think Fini is bad right now, but it can be a liability against a team with serp or a team that can set rocks number of times and fini is questionable on stall and must run moonblast to not get trolled by mega sabeye which still gets its knock off
So I don't have an opinion on this, but fini can beat stall 100%. It needs a little sp atk investment, but with moonblast, taunt, nature madness it can put a huge dent in stall and allow its teammates to clean up as the fini switch ins will be at half health.
 
Mega Gyarados: B+ —> B
I feel as if this mon has less going for it with zam running timid again to outspeed at +1, bulu being better than ever, tang being common, and helmet torn being an absolute bitch for it. Also, HO dropping in favor of BO and balance again. It’s not bad at all, just not what it was before imo.

Toxapex: A+—> A
I feel pex is losing a bit of its luster in this psychic infested meta that also has ground types better than ever as zyg is zyg and drill has picked back up a bit. Also, with what it checks seeming to drop in use while things it coulda checked before like kart have adapted for it. Good mon and i hate fighting it, but A is fair imo.

Gengar: B —> B- or C+
I dont think anyone can disagree with me on this nom. This mon has seen barely if any use in the past few months due to things like pex, ash gren, and rocks megatar. Blace also outclasses it as the ghost that annoys stall. Blace in general is better at what gengar does, speed not withstanding.
 
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Magearna back to A+

Gonna echo LL on this one because set-up Magearna sets are back and proving that they are still very dangerous. He already talked about Magearna's versatility here, so I'll try and avoid repeating that. Calm Mind with or without SG has shown that Magearna is capable of taking care of bulkier teams after wearing down its few switch ins, most of which don't have recovery outside of Leftovers or Leech Seed (Heatran, Ferro, Celesteela, Magnezone). Toxapex and Chansey are still around, but +1 Thunderbolt is able to pressure Toxapex pretty well (especially if rocks and/or spikes are up), and then Chansey has to worry about Calm Mind + Pain Split, which puts in mad work against bulkier teams.

It also helps that a lot of bulky offense teams use some form of Grass-type (Tang/Bulu/Ferro) / Heatran or another steel / Lando or another ground + 3 others, with the remaining 3 usually being offensive mons like Greninja, Mega Mawile or Mega Zam. In terms of setting up, Magearna can set up against a Bulu that's not at +2 Atk, EQ users while Grassy Terrain is up and/or if you have a Shuca Berry (Lando, Mega Latios, Tyranitar, Tangrowth, Gliscor), Torn-T (especially if you get Magearna in as they Defog), Ash Ninja locked into Dark Pulse or Spikes, or while forcing out foes that are unable to KO you back or are in range of being KO'd).

Finally, going off of the last point from the previous paragraph, Magearna's natural bulk usually feels underestimated because when you consider how Grassy Terrain from Bulu, intimidate users like Lando and Mawile, and then Shuca Berry, besides Fire types like Heatran, Volcarona and Zard Y, it's actually kind of hard to 1HKO this thing. Revenge killing it after it has set up isn't easy either, because it resists Extremespeed, Quick Attack (Pinsir), Sucker Punch, and then it's usually capable of tanking Water Shuriken from Ash Ninja. Scarf Lando being the most common choice scarf user means Magearna is most likely outspeeding everything after a Shift Gear barring Scarf Kartana or Excadrill in Sand (both of which aren't super common). Then there's also the fact that whatever you do plan on revenge killing Magearna with has to not only be able to tank a hit from a +1 Magearna in some cases, but also be able to KO back.

I have some replays from OLT to prove how Magearna's able to set up and apply a ton of pressure:

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-396486

Starting from around Turn 20, once Clefable was able to set up rocks, Magearna was able to set up while forcing out Tapu Bulu and then thanks to the Z move, it hit +1 SpA quickly. From there, you can see how because of Fleur Cannon, Mawile was forced to go in to revenge kill Magearna, but because of Magearna's bulk, was unable to do so, and from there Magearna continued to snowball until it missed.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-397450

Starting as early as Turn 5, you can see how Calm Mind Magearna was able to apply a ton of pressure to a team that had multiple answers in Toxapex, Celesteela, Excadrill and Reuniclus (Z Fleur Cannon beats Reuniclus, but outside of that, Reuniclus is able to manage Magearna as it did here). After 1 Calm Mind, switching into a Magearna with Thunderbolt + Fleur Cannon wasn't easy and generally speaking, besides Reuniclus and Celesteela, most mons will have to deal with chip from hazards in addition to taking damage from Magearna itself, which makes switching into it a lot more difficult. If you want the specific turn numbers, here you go: 5-8, 19-21, 33-36, and 44-48 (Reuniclus won either way since the Magearna wasn't Z Fleur Cannon, but you can still see how ridiculously hard it hits without it).

Edit: Got one more thanks to The Hallows

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-395746

Magearna was able to provide defensive utility while helping out offensively without Calm Mind, and then was able to set up against Torn-T for a late game sweep.

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Tangrowth to A+

Besides Magearna, Tangrowth is probably one mon that could also go up. Tangrowth and Bulu both have advantages that the other doesn't have, and for Tangrowth, that includes being a more reliable Zygarde answer, having better longevity thanks to regenerator (has to worry less about hazards), being able to switch in and force out Celesteela with Knock Off, act as a better Kartana answer, and in some cases it is able to force out Mega Zam. Bulu on the other hand has more offensive pressure, provides a Dark resist, and provides Grassy terrain, which can be really helpful for mons like Heatran, Mawile and Magearna. In terms of defensive utility, outside of tanking Dark type attacks mainly from Ash Greninja, Tangrowth does a better job with tanking hits and having regenerator to heal off. Bulu can be prone to being worn down by switching in + hazards, and is usually forced to use Protect just to heal up sometimes, but Tangrowth can switch in, force something out, and heal up with regenerator without worrying too much about chip/residual damage. It's kind of hard to say, but I don't feel like one is worse than the other by the degree of a whole subrank because despite being very similar, they both have different advantages that are valuable to any team.

Toxapex: A+—> A+
I feel pex is losing a bit of its luster in this psychic infested meta that also has ground types better than ever as zyg is zyg and drill has picked back up a bit. Also, with what it checks seeming to drop in use while things it coulda checked before like kart have adapted for it. Good mon and i hate fighting it, but A is fair imo.

I don't wanna make this post too long, but I disagree with a Toxapex drop. The combination of Toxic/Toxic Spikes + Scald can actually be hard to deal with, especially for Defog mons, including Torn-T, Scarf Lando-T, Zapdos, Koko, Fini and basically everything except Gliscor. Scald burns and poison from toxic spikes or toxic can help wear down or cripple whatever attempts to switch in, and again, unless you have Gliscor, or Taunt Torn-T, it's not easy to click Defog/Rapid Spin in front of a Toxapex. Ash Ninja is still really common, and as mentioned earlier with Tangrowth, the advantage of having regenerator helps a lot when having to deal with hazard stack because it helps them from getting worn down as quickly as most other mons would. Even if you pack multiple mons that can KO it, if you're unable to bring them in safely, then you're not getting off that easy against it.
 
Gengar: B —> B- or C+
I dont think anyone can disagree with me on this nom. This mon has seen barely if any use in the past few months due to things like pex, ash gren, and rocks megatar. Blace also outclasses it as the ghost that annoys stall. Blace in general is better at what gengar does, speed not withstanding.

Alright, I think ur not understanding what gar really does for a team. I think gar can annoy stall more cause of better move pool and ability to run taunt. In order for blaceph to beat stall, it needs to predict right between pyuk and chancey. However, gar can taunt both preventing them from doing a thing to gar (i know blaceph can sub, but it can get stalled out by cm unaware clef and pyuk if there isnt spdef drops and plays right with chance and pyuk). Also ttar has a harder tine pursuit trapping gar cause it learns focus blast. Blaceph doesn't outclass gar, They are 2 different pokemon anf have different roles on teams. People never compare blaceph to zard even tho they are both fire typesand are similar in viability. They have 2 different roles on a team. Blaceph is a better sweeper while gar is a better wall/stallbreaker. Hitting 110 base speed shouldnt be swept under the rug as as it can outspeed kart,keldro, terra, speed tie lati@s. Pex isn't a perfect counter. Gar can beat it 1v1 with shadow ball and taunt. While yes, the pex is just gonna switch out, it can annoy pex and chip it. Also Ash gren beats both blaceph and gar 1v1, but gren can switch into blaceph in a pinch while gren cant safely switch into gar unless it uses shadow ball. While I want to keep Gar B, I can understand it dropping if ash gren and the fact that it is hard to put on teams is enough for it to drop(there are other reasons, but those were the legitimate ones u mentioned). Just dont put it lower than blaceph.

Tl; DR
Gengar has some better qualities than blacepheon making it so its not outclassed. So if does drop, it should only go to B- where blaceph is.

Also M gyara is a agree (although reluctant cause its a staple for HO and screens so they don't get 60ed by stall)
and pex is an agree too
Edit: jordy changed my mind about pex
 
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I feel pex is losing a bit of its luster in this psychic infested meta that also has ground types better than ever as zyg is zyg and drill has picked back up a bit. Also, with what it checks seeming to drop in use while things it coulda checked before like kart have adapted for it. Good mon and i hate fighting it, but A is fair imo.
I quite frankly don't understand this nomination, honestly, this just looks like a nom for the sake of making a nom. We're actually shifting away from the Psychic-type meta, which is only good for Toxapex. While Zygarde's influence does hurt Toxapex, this has literally never stopped it from being A+, and even S rank at one point. I think you're severely overstating Excadrill's prevalance as well. While it has made a bit of a comeback, I just don't see it being big enough to drop Toxapex. It's not like Excadrill can infinitely fuck over Toxapex anyways because it doesn't like switching into Scald at all. Toxapex hasn't been able to check Kartana, for like a solid 7-8(?) months when it stopped running Defense investment. Also, I just want to add that fat Volcarona and FleurFocus Magearna have picked up a lot in usage, and Toxapex just completely fucks these over. Toxic Spikes have also gotten a lot better these past 2 to 3 months back when Toxic Spikes immune teams were actually quite common, which just isn't the case anymore. While I usually don't just respond to nominations, I really wanted to respond to this one because it just isn't right at all.

TL;DR; I think Toxapex should stay A+ because it still does Toxapex things as effectively as it's always done.

I also agree with raising Magearna back to A+.
 
Alright, I think ur not understanding what gar really does for a team. I think gar can annoy stall more cause of better move pool and ability to run taunt. In order for blaceph to beat stall, it needs to predict right between pyuk and chancey. However, gar can taunt both preventing them from doing a thing to gar (i know blaceph can sub, but it can get stalled out by cm unaware clef and pyuk if there isnt spdef drops and plays right with chance and pyuk). Also ttar has a harder tine pursuit trapping gar cause it learns focus blast. Blaceph doesn't outclass gar, They are 2 different pokemon anf have different roles on teams. People never compare blaceph to zard even tho they are both fire typesand are similar in viability. They have 2 different roles on a team. Blaceph is a better sweeper while gar is a better wall/stallbreaker. Hitting 110 base speed shouldnt be swept under the rug as as it can outspeed kart,keldro, terra, speed tie lati@s. Pex isn't a perfect counter. Gar can beat it 1v1 with shadow ball and taunt. While yes, the pex is just gonna switch out, it can annoy pex and chip it. Also Ash gren beats both blaceph and gar 1v1, but gren can switch into blaceph in a pinch while gren cant safely switch into gar unless it uses shadow ball. While I want to keep Gar B, I can understand it dropping if ash gren and the fact that it is hard to put on teams is enough for it to drop(there are other reasons, but those were the legitimate ones u mentioned). Just dont put it lower than blaceph.

Tl; DR
Gengar has some better qualities than blacepheon making it so its not outclassed. So if does drop, it should only go to B- where blaceph is.

Also M gyara is a agree (although reluctant cause its a staple for HO and screens so they don't get 60ed by stall)
and pex is an agree too.
You are absolutely right. blace is really only projected value is really just a huge hypetrain and obviously gengar does what the premiere set does hella better. Not to mention Gengar has a much better movepool, isnt trash, and isnt some sad attempt to make it relevant. Id even predict a late season gengar rise as it's been fairly obvious of people's flat out refusal to run ghost resists on their teams other than greninja
 
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Mega Gyarados: B+ —> B
I feel as if this mon has less going for it with zam running timid again to outspeed at +1, bulu being better than ever, tang being common, and helmet torn being an absolute bitch for it. Also, HO dropping in favor of BO and balance again. It’s not bad at all, just not what it was before imo.

Toxapex: A+—> A
I feel pex is losing a bit of its luster in this psychic infested meta that also has ground types better than ever as zyg is zyg and drill has picked back up a bit. Also, with what it checks seeming to drop in use while things it coulda checked before like kart have adapted for it. Good mon and i hate fighting it, but A is fair imo.
I absolutely disagree with both of these nominations.

Mega Gyarados falls hard to bulky grasses, but you are way underestimating this thing. One Dragon Dance and it will potentially sweep your entire team if the grasses are gone. Landorus-T does not like getting Intimidated back and getting hit either with Waterfall or Ice Fang, especially Ice Fang. Heatran falls hard to sets with Earthquake or even Waterfall for that matter. I do not think it should be in the same tier as mediocre water Pokémon in the B tier like Kingdra and Suicune. Plus, the slight decrease in usage of Clefable and Celesteela really helps Mega Gyarados too. Also, Mega Alakazam's only way of truly killing Gyarados is Focus Blast, and Focus Blast is a very hit and miss type of move, because if Mega Alakazam misses, than MZam will most likely die from it.

Keep Mega Gyarados in the B+ rank.

Toxapex may of not been what it once was during the early days of USUM, but I feel like Toxapex is still a huge threat that deserves to stay in A+. Like Jordy said, the decrease of Psychic types in the meta really helps Toxapex a lot, and even you stated that psychic types are getting "worse". Plus Toxic Spikes are something that everyone hates if your team does not have or loses its defogger and poison type. Zygarde does hit Toxapex hard, but it is curtains for Zygarde if Zygarde switches in to a scald and gets burned ( Unless you have a Heal Bell Pokemon which I love Heal Bell, but Heal Bell is not that common. ) Same scald problem with every physical attacker that is not a fire type. I feel like Bulu being the most dominant Bulu actually helps Toxapex out, because Toxapex does not take super effective damage from grasses and Tapu Koko being less dominant helps Toxapex a lot. It is dangerous to switch against Toxapex. I think the meta is slowly getting better for Toxapex, actually. Especially when Mega Latios is seeing slightly less usage.

Keep Toxapex in the A+ rank.

To keep this post from being an essay of the same thing that users have already stated, I will just put the nominations that I agree with.
Magearna from A to A+
Tangrowth from A to A+
Garchomp from B- to A-
( I made a post about the Garchomp nomination before. )
 
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Tangrowth to A+: Not sure
I feel Tang to A+ is a weird nom to talk about for me. I think beating zyg, gliscor, and other things is insanely valuable rn and regen is amazing. these qualities are very valuable. however, with z tran being the most common tran as well as zard y (imo) being good again, and mega venu becomin p good again which beats it and gives competition isnt helpin it. Overall, idk how to feel yet.

Magearna to A+: Agree
This thing is such an insane threat rn and i love using it. Shift gear is insanely scary for any team either lacking toxapex (if z fleur), celesteela (if z fleur) and mega venu (for both sets). Its also broken on screens (even if theyve dropped a little in use). Also, OTR is scary as well and has a great offense MU and fucks with a lot of would be counters. Even AV can still be good on BO teams even if not as good as before. Raise this thing.

Garchomp to A-: Agree
This thing is so nice rn imo. Z outrage is a very strong set that can force a kill and get rocks on almost anything while also being a decent tran switch in. Helmet is an amazing tran switch in as well as switchin in to zyg and punishing u turn hard. On top of that, rocks+dtail is nice chip. Raise this too.

Now for my own noms (sorry for this long ass post):

Crawdaunt: C to B-
I feel putting crawdaunt in the same league as mons like base zam and mega camerupt as well as below terrakion and thundurus is very much sad. Crawdaunt is getting better with all the balance coming back as well as being one of the most punishing things to switch into. Priority is also very nice with lele starting to regress with the swing of psychics starting to regress. Also can still work on TR (for whatever thats worth)

Mega Slowbro: C+ to B
I feel megabro is very much being diserviced being put with things like terrak and azu. This thing is one of the best ground type counters around and has great bulk in general. Its also a reliable medicham switch in and even walls standard non ash grens. It can even act as a soft check to certain special attackers like torn or even latios. Ik this is an old topic, but i feel this raise is overdue.

Nidoking: C to C+
This mon is p aight imo, especially with the psychic spam finally starting to decline as well as balance being back to being the best style. Nido can tear through a lot of cookie cutter balances like pex+clef+celesteela. It also beats tang. It can also beat non boosted gear. Its not amazing and some threats still smash it. But this thing can do some work.

Sorry for such a long post but ive had lots of thoughts on some stuff in this meta. Also, i no longer agree with my previous stance on pex.
 
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