Pet Mod VaporeMons - Randbats Set Submissions Open

Yoshiblaze

ye
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
Moderator
Voting is now open!

The following submissions CANNOT be voted for:
Attract

In each category, you may vote for 6 submissions, with 2 self-votes in each category (so you can vote for 24 submissions with 8 total self-votes). Please specify which votes are self-votes. You don't have to list who made the submission unless someone else subbed something with the same name/species. The order you put it in does not matter, every vote is worth 1 point
Moves
Blaze Kick (SV)
Aura Sphere (SV)
Liquidation
Triple Axel
Tail Slap
Thunderbolt

Items
Eviolite (SV)
Black Belt (SV)
Life Orb
Metronome
King's Rock
Choice Specs

Abilities
Speed Boost (SV)
Justified (SV)
Sheer Force
Pressure
Skill Link
Volt Absorb

Adjustments
Combusken (SV)
Lucario (SV)
Feraligatr
Weavile
Cinccino
Jolteon
For the sake of making vote counting easier, PLEASE use the same exact format listed in the spoiler box above


Voting will end in 24 hours!
 
Moves
Heal Bell
Meteor Beam / Skull Bash
Vital Throw
Dire Claw / Ceaseless Edge / Stone Axe (SV)
Dream Eater / Nightmare / Wake-Up Slap / Smelling Salts
Rock Smash

Items
Big Root
Tera Shard (SV)
Throat Spray / Punching Glove (SV)
Star Shards (Ema Skye)

Abilities
Cute Charm
Overcoat (SV)
Good as Gold (DuoM2)
Proto- and Drives (Gravity Monkey)
Hivemind

Adjustments
Revavroom
Sandy Shocks (SV)
Crabominable
Scream Tail
Houndstone (Ema Skye)
Overqwil
 
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PalpitoadChamp

Chaos Chaos Chaos
is a Pre-Contributor
Moves
Meteor Beam/Skull Bash (Yoshiblaze)
Rest (DenebStargazer)
Rage Fist (Beaf Cultist)
Play Rough (SV)
Dragon Claw/Dragon Pulse (SV)
Shelter (G-Luke)

Items
Throat Spray/Punching Glove (Z-nogyroP)
Tuffy-Tuff (Samtendo09)
Blue Helmet (DuoM2)
Segin Star Shard/Schedar Star Shard/Navi Star Shard/Ruchbah Star Shard/Caph Star Shard (Ema Skye)
Salt Lick (The Damned)
Punching Glove (ViZar)

Abilities
Counteract (Yoshiblaze)
Regenerator (Gekokeso)
Good as Gold (SV)
Good as Gold (DuoM2)
Photon Drive / Neuron Drive / Rune Drive (Gravity Monkey)
Protosmosis / Protocrysalis / Protostasis (Gravity Monkey)

Note: If Gravity Monkey's 2 subs are voted together, which it doesn't look like, then I also vote for Zero to Hero (ViZar)

Adjustments
Sandy Shocks (Z-nogyroP)
Scyther (Beaf Cultist)
Meloetta (Beaf Cultist)
Articuno-Galar (Beaf Cultist)
Bombirdier (Mintly)
Vespiquen (PQRDG)
 
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G-Luke

Sugar, Spice and One For All
is a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Moves
Shelter (SV)
Recharge (SV)
Dire Claw / Ceaseless Edge / Stone Axe
Life Dew (Rasdanation)
Fillet Away

Items
Gold Bottle Cap
Punching Glove (ViZar)

Abilities
Healer
Counteract
Sower Seed
Immolate
Punk Rock
Beads of Ruin / Swords of Ruin

Adjustments
Crabominable (SV)
Scream Tail (zxgzxg)
Revraroom
Pyroar
Houndstone (Ema Skye)
Magearna

Revamps defensive counterplay in the wake of being super nerfed, but in more creative ways than 10 PP Recover again. Adds a lot of strong defensive and offensive stuff into the tier in general, bringing more variety to alot more playstyles and hopefully making future mons more balanced.

Items are hard to get right, and I'm not interested in voting for stuff to fill slots. SylveMons is notorious for being choke filled with a bunch of random items, JolteMons kinda corrected that but barely, and leaned REALLY hard into sigs. Hopefully Vapormons corrects itself.
 
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lots of good stuff this slate. had to leave a lot of very respectable subs by the wayside since I just didn’t have enough space, though there was also a lot of overlap between subs (probably unavoidable when there were this many lol). looking forward to another fruitful sylve meta!

Moves
Rage Fist (SV)
Meteor Beam/Skull Bash (Yoshiblaze)
Electroweb (flareth13)
Dire Claw/Ceaseless Edge/Stone Axe (Z-nogyroP)
Shelter (G-Luke)
Healing Stones (Mintly)

Items
Big Root (Yoshiblaze)
Malicious Armor (anaconja)
Dubious Disc (flareth13)
Tera Shard (Z-nogyroP)
Tuffy-Tuff (Samtendo09)
Blue Helmet (DuoM2)

Abilities
Cute Charm (Yoshiblaze)
Bug Zapper (Gekokeso)
Healer (chemicalmines)
Good as Gold (DuoM2)
Disguise (PQRDG)
Zero to Hero (ViZar)

Adjustments
Scyther (SV)
Meloetta (SV)
Electrode/Electrode-Hisui (Z-nogyroP)
Houndstone (Turtlek)
Crabominable (G-Luke)
Toxapex (zxgzxg)
 

Ema Skye

Work!
Moves
Vital Throw
Rage Fist / Last Respects (Z-NogyroP)
Healing Stones
Rock Smash
Meditation (SV)
Jet Punch (SV)

Items
Star Shards (SV)
Revolution Ring (SV)
Big Root
Dooh Hood
Salt Lick
Hisui's Blessing

Abilities
Power of Alchemy / Many Headed
Cute Charm
Cud Chew / Harvest (SV)
Surges (SV)
Regenerator (Gekokeso)
Justified

Adjustments
Revavroom
Sandy Shocks
Toxapex
Scream Tail (zxgzxg)
Altaria (SV)
Overqwil (SV)
 
Moves
Snowdrift (SV)
Dragon Claw (SV)
Retaliate (Squawkerz)
Fillet Away (Mintly)
Mountain Gale (Ema Skye)
Stone Fangs (The Damned)

Items
Lagging Tail (SV)
Big Root (Yoshiblaze)
Whetstone (Rasdanation)
Adrenaline Orb (anaconja)

Abilities
Healer (SV)
Iron Fist (Totally_Odette)
Overcoat (Z-nogyroP)
Good as Gold (PalpitoadChamp)
Aftermath (PQRDG)
Zero to Hero (ViZar)

Adjustments
Pyroar (SV)
Avalugg-H (SV)
Wugtrio (Xrn)
Lechonk line (Yoshiblaze)
Lake Guardians (G-Luke)
Tauros (The Damned)
 
Moves:

Heal Bell (Yoshiblaze)
Belch (SV)
Electroweb (SV)
Mystical Fire | Chilling Water (Z-nogyroP)
Play Rough (PalpitoadChamp)
Jet Punch (Ema Skye)

Items:

Memory Stick (dex)
Whetstone (Rasdanation)
Hisui's Blessing (PQRDG)
Gold Bottle Cap (Squawkerz)
Auspicious Armor (anaconja)
Dubious Disc (SV)

Abilities:

Power of Alchemy | Many-Headed (Z-nogyroP)
Run Away (SV)
Immolate (SV)
Martyr (Beaf Cultist)
Bug Zapper (Gekokeso)
Pride (Lysion)

Adjustments:

Crabominable (G-Luke)
Gardevoir (SV)
Mabosstiff (SV)
Flutter Mane (Z-nogyroP)
Sandy Shocks (Z-nogyroP)
Scream Tail (zxgzxg)
 

Gekokeso

Mind the bad garmmar.
is a Pre-Contributor
Moves
Dire Claw / Ceaseless Edge / Stone Axe
Dream Eater / Nightmare / Wake-Up Slap / Smelling Salts
Rest
Mystical Fire | Chilling Water
Life Dew (Ema Skye)
Healing Stones

Items
Gold Bottle Cap
Tera Shard (Z-nogyrop)
Memory Stick
Tuffy Tuff
Time Machine / Chrono Crystal
Big Root

Abilities
Immolate
Bug Zapper (SV)
Regenerator (SV)
Gravity Monkey's Paradox Abilities (Both sets)
Overcoat

Adjustments
Glastrier (SV)
Scream Tail (Zxgzxg)
Pyroar
Avalugg-Hisui (G-luke)
Bombirdier
Revavroom
 
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My dumb self apparently missed the fact that Defog isn't a Wind move by default like I thought it was, though maybe that's for the best right now with the ease of hazards even if it lowers my opinion of Game Freak even further. At least I remembered the link yesterday after forgetting that. Yay for low standards. Anyway, here are my votes even though I wish we had (a lot) more room, especially on the move side:

1. Rising Voltage
2. Hotwire
3. Dire Claw | Ceaseless Edge | Stone Axe
4. Shelter
5. Life Dew (Rasdanation)
6. Stone Fangs (SV)


1. Salt Cube
2. Body Armor
3. Tuffy-Tuff
4. Lagging Tail
5. Revavroom Shards (a.k.a. Segin Star Shard & co.)
6. Safety Goggles (SV)


1. Cute Charm
2. Friend Guard
3. Iron Fist
4. Bug Zapper
5. Cloud Nine
6. The Damned's Wind Power | Wind Rider (SV)


1. The Noble House of Lechonk
2. Meloetta
3. Rotom (All Forms)
4. Crabominable
5. Scream Tail
6. Wugtrio | Dugtrio | Dugtrio-Alola (SV)
 
Moves
Rest
Mystical Fire | Chilling Water
Dream Eater | Nightmare | Wake-Up Slap | Smelling Salts
Healing Stones
Life Dew (AquaticPanic)
Stone Fangs

Items
Star Shards (Ema Skye)
Tuffy Tuff
Spectral Cape
Safety Goggles
Time Machine | Chrono Crystal
Punching Glove (ViZar)

Abilities
Grass Pelt (SV)
Paradox abilities past (Gravity Monkey)
Paradox abilities future (Gravity Monkey)
Pride (SV)
Good as Gold (DuoM2)
Zero to Hero

Adjustments
Magearna (SV)
Scyther
Glastrier
Wugtrio
Toxapex
Scream Tail
 
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Moves
Spicy Extract
Tidy Up
Electroweb
Brick Break/Psychic Fangs/Raging Bull

Items
Gold Bottle Cap
Augmented Lens (SV)
Big Root
Whetstone

Abilities
Anticipation (SV)
Rivalry (SV)
Zero To Hero
Cute Charm
Iron Fist
Thermal Exchange

Adjustments
Scream Tail
Wattrel Line
Crabominable
 
Moves -
Meteor Beam / Skull Bash (Yoshiblaze)
Vital Throw (anaconja)
Dire Claw / Ceaseless Edge / Stone Axe (Z-nogyrop)
Trash Talk (Z-nogyrop)
Rock Wrecker (Rasdanation)
Dream Eater / Nightmare / Wake-up Slap / Smelling Salts (zxgzxg)

Items -
Dubious Disc (flareth13)
Training Weight (Z-nogyrop)
Throat Spray / Punching Glove (Z-nogyrop)
Whetstone (Rasdanation)
Hisui's Blessing (PQRDG)
Revolution Ring (Ema Skye)

Abilities -
Overcoat (Z-nogyrop)
Hivemind (Beaf Cultist)
Good as Gold (PalpitoadChamp)
Sticky Hold (MegaFlareon)
Mycelium Might (The Damned)

Adjustments -
Tsareena (Yoshiblaze)
Revavroom (anaconja)
Flutter Mane (Z-nogyrop)
Galarian Articuno (Beaf Cultist)
Glaceon (Beebos, sv)
Toxapex (zxgzxg)

:cradily::iron treads: I looooove Meteor Beam, and the Skull Bash buff is also really cool as a powerful alternative to Iron Head for Steels or anti-Fairy coverage.
:hariyama: Not much to say about this, just a really cool move idea for bulky mons
:sneasler::samurott-hisui::kleavor: Competitive Dire Claw, better accuracy, and near perfect redistribution... yeah this is an easy vote
:gengar: Cool move from Joltemons that I'd like to see make a return
:iron-thorns: Rock Wrecker is a cool move and this is a cool rework. A lot of the mons that get it appreciate the strong physical Rock option (and also Tinkaton).
:hatterene: :hydreigon: :iron-hands: :tyranitar: Great rework to these moves to make them less gimmicky and more splashable. Seeing viable Wake-up Slap and Smelling Salts would be very based

:dubious-disc: Buffs tr teamstyles without strengthening Ursaluna further (since it doesn't want to give up Flame Orb activating Guts), while still having applications for slow attackers that don't mind the speed drop. Great sub
:macho-brace: Interesting buff to mons with only lackluster/niche abilities. Also Slaking supremacy!!!
:kleavor::throat-spray: Luvdiscs are red, Horseas are blue, Throat Spray is epic, and this item is too. Could be problematic on Sharpness mons tho
:throat-spray:
As stated above, Throat Spray is pretty based, and Punching Glove deserves some love. This would make mons that run these items pose a threat throughout the game, rather than just once.
:wyrdeer::eviolite: Cool idea to buff the mid and low-tier Hisui mons, though I have NO idea how much it would impact their viability.
:lucarionite: Very slept-on sub imo: every applicable mon appreciates the minor omniboost, from the low-tiers to the meta staples that unfortunately fell from OU in recent gens.

:armarouge: :enamorus-therian: Overcoat blocking hazards is a HUGE buff that ranges from helping offensive mons like the armor twins get on the field to blocking chip damage for defensive mons like Hisuian Goodra and Enamorous-Therian. What if Avalugg had a good ability? Haha just kidding... unless...?
:sandy-shocks: :kingambit: Could have been an OP ability but the distribution is really good, giving low-tier mons some love and turing Sandy Shocks into a menace.
:gholdengo: I hate Gholdengo, I ha- wait, I don't actually hate Gholdengo's role as a status/hazard blocker as much as others. That being said, it does deserve the nerf, and losing np + recover would make it less splashable on teams.
:swalot: Interesting buff in terms of both Anti-Knock/Trick and speed control. The distribution is also really nice, helping mons like Swalot and Tinktaton.
:toedscruel::brute-bonnet: Best take on a Mycelium Might rework, because it also makes Spore users more offensively viable. Brute Bonnet and Toedscruel appreciate the big power boost, and Breloom gets a niche third option

:tsareena: Overall great sub. Bulky Grass/Fairy is an initial turn-off for me (prob because of the quad poison weakness), but I think it has a good place in the SV meta, the movepool got a massive improvement, and a super mid-tier mon like Tsareena deserves a buff of this caliber.
:revavroom: Giving all this coverage to a mon of Revaroom's power level wouldn't be overbearing, and this adjustment isn't as complicated/gimmicky as Ema Skye's
:flutter-mane: Nerfing the OP STAB combo is a good change, let's free Flutter Mane!
:articuno-galar: Opportunist on a non-toxic mon is cool and garticuno deserves the buff
:glaceon: tbh I didn't cook at all this slate... except for this guy. I'm going to keep resubbing and advocating for this until the day I die, Glaceon gang rise up!!!
:toxapex: Very cool, more offensive-oriented take on Toxapex. Water/Dark is a cool typing, and as stated in the sub it helps distinguish it as a regen mon from glowking. Toxapex deserves some redemption after the many crimes it committed in the prior 2 gens and subsequent nerfs this gen.

There were a lot of good move subs this slate! Here are my thoughts on moves I liked but didn't have room to vote for:
:honchkrow: Yoshiblaze's Beat up: Good buff that gives lackluster physical darks a powerful option without letting Knock Off run wild. Dark-type Skill Link mon when? (I know it doesn't affect Beat Up but w/e)
:grimmsnarl: flareth13's Belch: Solid buff but kinda overshadowed by Trash Talk
:annihilape: :houndstone: Z-nogyrop's Rage Fist / Last Respects: Pretty obvious nerfs, but I like that you also distributed the moves to more mons
:florges: Z-nogyrop's Mystical Fire / Chilling Water: Chilling water buff is greatly appreciated, fulfulling its purpose as a less toxic version of Scald
:bellibolt: G-Luke's Recharge: Interesting take on a recovery move that would make bulky electric-types more prevalent. Deserves a resub
:carbink: Mintly's Healing Stones: Cool take on an entry hazard that additionally disincentivises using the common hazard removal
:snorlax: DenebStargazer's Rest: Completely forgot about this sub when voting lol. Let's bring gen 2 rest back baby!!!
:glimmora: ViZar's Glass Shimmer: Strong special rock move that's more splashable than Meteor Beam, sign me up!
:tinkaton: Sigilyph Bro's Ricochet: Cool take on an anti-screens move and a physical rock move with perfect acc. Worth a resub
:palafin-hero: Ema Skye's Jet Punch: Water Pursuit is a good direction for this move and the distribution is p good (other than maybe Azumarill)

Thoughts on other move subs:
:toxapex: anaconja's Recover and Scald: Erm... what the scallop
:scovillain: Beaf Cultist's Spicy Extract: Being able to quadruple damage output with a single click is pretty overkill, reduce either the Attack raise or Defense drop by +1/-1 respectively.
:abomasnow: chemicalmines' Snowdrift: Giving better recovery to the infamous defensive ices is a good boon, but it doesn't fix most of their issues and isn't an important thing to address atm
:goodra-hisui: G-Luke's Shelter More anti-hazards is nice and all, but this is a little OP imo. Defog gained the ability to remove hazards and instantly shot up in viability. This Shelter rework is basically that but also buffs Defense and can't be blocked by Gholdengo. Even though it doesn't remove all hazards, if Hisuian Goodra got both this and Z-nogyrop's Overcoat buff it would be too overbearing in the hazards game.
:machamp: G-Luke's Wild Charge, Take Down, and Submission: Wild Charge buff is obvious but necessary, viable Submission is nice, and Take Down is also there. High confusion chance for an offensive move is a little uncompetitive tho, that plus the aforementioned tight fit for votes made this sub just short of my vote.
:gigalith: PQRDG's Stealth Rock: After a lot of thinking, this is a ok sub (it's at least a better change than my stealth rock sub lol). Ability to set multiple layers is cool, and it removes the properties that invalidate most fire, bug, and ice mons while keeping some mons' selling points (e.g. Lando-T and Corviknight being rock-neutral). Volcorona being rock neutral is pretty terrifying tho... I'd suggest fine-tuning this and resubbing in a later slate
:medicham: Ema Skye's Meditate: Kinda just a better Bulk Up, but could be a really nice tool for the more low-tier bulky mons to simultaneously set up and stay in the game.
:sandy-shocks: The Damned's Sand Blaster: Interesting move idea as a sidegrade to Earth Power, trading base power for speed control, but both restrictions are a little overboard.
:hitmontop: NANI?!'s Triple Kick and Triple Dive: Water and Fighting already have p strong move options such as Wave Crash and Close Combat respectively, they don't really need another good attack

Lightning Round for moves with too minor changes to compete with the other great subs of this slate:
  • :soothe-bell: Yoshiblaze's Heal Bell
  • :light-clay: Fragmented's Brick Break, Psychic Fangs, and Raging Bull
  • :draco-plate: PalpitoadChamp's Dragon Claw and Dragon Pulse
  • :poke-doll: PalpitoadChamp's Play Rough
  • :slowpoke-tail: Mintly's Fillet Away
  • :expert belt: The Damned's Stone Fangs, Elegant Punch, and Ominous Wind
Thought on items:
:big-root: (Yoshiblaze) Ehhh not a big fan of this one, seems like it would incentivize scummy strategies, especially with Leech Seed and Strength Sap, more than anything.
(anaconja) Another anti-knock tool, but I prefer MegaFlareon's Sticky Hold because the holder doesn't get much value using Malicious Armor, sacrificing the item slot to prevent... losing an item. Would be viable on pivoters to protect teammates tho
(anaconja) As someone who prefers Armarouge over Ceruledge I'm completely down for this change. Haha Armor Cannon go brrrr
:leek: (flareth13) Cure Stick's only application is shutting down Ursaluna, which it doesn't even do well: only way to permanently remove burn is to use knock + this item, which involves luna's sky-high physical walling capabilities. You're pretty much sacrificing a mon to weaken luna, which can still function as an okay bulky attacker without Guts.

Regarding the controversial Regenerator nerf by Gekokeso, I originally voted for it but decided to cull it last minute. It's not that the ability is necessarily overpowered (though it is pretty strong), but that it's really splashable. Wanting Regenerator's healing down to 1/4 is just a kneejerk prevention tactic against having yet another meta with regenerator cores. Now I'm going to go against that statement of not adding too many Regenerator mons and say that :typhlosion-hisui: Hisuian Typhlosion and :eelektross: Eelektross getting Regernerator (proposed by Gekokeso and anaconja respectively) would be p cool lol, I'm more open to offensive regens
:crabominable: (G-Luke) Solid buffs all around but it's not as interesting compared to other subs, and also Crabominable is ugly af LOL
:bombirdier: (Mintly) P ok sub, prankster spam is at least better than its current role as a mid-tier attacker, and it gets a lot of utility to work with.
:maushold: (IceLevelIncarnate) Wow this Maushold rework is crazy! I never want to see it again! :D
:tauros-paldea-combat: (The Damned) Solid buff to this guy to fill in the vacant role of Dark/Fighting mon

Will edit this with more thoughts throughout today, even after voting closes
 
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Voting is now open!

The following submissions CANNOT be voted for:
Attract

In each category, you may vote for 6 submissions, with 2 self-votes in each category (so you can vote for 24 submissions with 8 total self-votes). Please specify which votes are self-votes. You don't have to list who made the submission unless someone else subbed something with the same name/species. The order you put it in does not matter, every vote is worth 1 point
Moves
Blaze Kick (SV)
Aura Sphere (SV)
Liquidation
Triple Axel
Tail Slap
Thunderbolt

Items
Eviolite (SV)
Black Belt (SV)
Life Orb
Metronome
King's Rock
Choice Specs

Abilities
Speed Boost (SV)
Justified (SV)
Sheer Force
Pressure
Skill Link
Volt Absorb

Adjustments
Combusken (SV)
Lucario (SV)
Feraligatr
Weavile
Cinccino
Jolteon
For the sake of making vote counting easier, PLEASE use the same exact format listed in the spoiler box above


Voting will end in 24 hours!
Moves
Rage Fist (Beaf)
Meteor Beam/Skull Bash (Yoshiblaze)
Electroweb (flareth13)
Dire Claw/Ceaseless Edge/Stone Axe (Z-nogyroP)
Shelter (G-Luke)
Healing Stones (Mintly)

Items
Big Root (Yoshiblaze)
Malicious Armor (anaconja)
Dubious Disc (flareth13)
Tera Shard (Z-nogyroP)
Tuffy-Tuff (Samtendo09)
Blue Helmet (DuoM2)

Abilities
Cute Charm (Yoshiblaze)
Bug Zapper (Gekokeso)
Overcoat
Good as Gold (DuoM2)
Disguise (PQRDG)
Zero to Hero (ViZar)

Adjustments
Scyther (Beaf)
Meloetta (Bead)
Revavroom
Houndstone (Turtlek)
Crabominable (G-Luke)
Toxapex (zxgzxg
 
This was really tough, there are a lot of good submissions, a lot of great submissions, and a lot of terrible submissions that I would want to use anyways.

Moves
Electroweb (flareth13)
Spicy Extract (Beaf Cultist)
Snowdrift (chemicalmines)
Shelter (G-Luke)
Life Dew (Rasdanation)
Iron Tail/Dragon Rush (PQRDG [SV])

Items
Body Armor (flareth13)
Tera Shard (Z-nogyroP)
Miracle Lens (Fragmented)
Broken Timepiece (PQRDG [SV])
Hisui's Blessing (PQRDG [SV])
Team Star Shards (Ema Skye)

Abilities
Power of Alchemy/Many-Headed (Z-nogryoP)
Regenerator (Gekokeso)
Beads/Sword of Ruin (Xrn)
Healer (chemicalmines)
Aftermath (PQRDG [SV])
Cud Chew/Harvest (Ema Skye)

Adjustments
Electrode Twins (Z-nogyroP)
Eelektross (chemicalmines)
The Lake Trio (G-Luke)
Vespiquen (PQRDG [SV])
Altaria (Ema Skye)
Tauros Family (The Damned)
 

anaconja

long day at job
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
heal bell
meteor beam/skull bash
dire claw/ceaseless edge/stone axe
mystical fire/chilling water
swift
shelter

big root
tera shard (z-nogyrop)
memory stick

counteract
regenerator (anaconja)
overcoat
iron fist
ghoul presence
immolate

lechonk
revavroom
toxapex
crabominable
uxie/mesprit/azelf
scream tail

if geko regen wins im swearing off this mod forever
 
Moves
Life Dew (Rasdanation, SV)
Rock Wrecker (Rasdanation, SV)
Heal Bell (Yoshiblaze)
Electroweb (flareth13)
Dire Claw / Ceaseless Edge / Stone Axe (Z-nogyroP)
Iron Tail / Dragon Rush (PQRDG)

Items
Whetstone (Rasdanation, SV)
Big Root (Yoshiblaze)
Punching Glove (ViZar)
Lagging Tail (chemicalmines)
Blue Helmet (DuoM2)
Salt Lick (The Damned)

Abilities
Healer (chemicalmines)
Proto’s (Gravity Monkey)
Drive’s (Gravity Monkey)
Rain Dish / Ice Body / Magic Veil (DuoM2)
Seed Sower (Xrn)
Wind Rider / Wind Power (Z-nogyroP)

Adjustments
Lechonk (Yoshiblaze)
Articuno-Galar (Beaf Cult)
Scream Tail (zxgzxg)
Altaria (Ema Skye)
 

Yoshiblaze

ye
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
Moderator
Moves
Meteor Beam / Skull Bash (SV)
Beat Up (SV)
Rock Smash
Electroweb
Rage Fist (Beaf Cultist)
Hotwire

Items
Big Root (SV)
Salt Cube (SV)
Spectral Cape
Bag of Legos
Blue Helmet

Abilities
Birds of a Feather (SV)
Cute Charm (SV)
Zero to Hero
Cloud Nine
Seed Sower
Healer

Adjustments
Lechonk line (SV)
Iron Jugulis (SV)
Chi-Yu/Chien-Pao
Pyroar
Revavroom
Toxapex

Voting is now closed! Winners will be posted shortly!
 

Yoshiblaze

ye
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
Moderator
Time to reveal the first winners of VaporeMons, the foundation by which we will build our metagame on!

For the sake of the first slate and the high turnout (thank you for that btw), we changed the rules on what gets in slightly, putting a cut-off point at 6, where everything at 6+ points made it in (though spoiler alert, this only ended up mattering for Adjustments. Even so, we may continue using a system like this for winners from now on for big turnout slates like this)
Moves:
Dire Claw and co. (Z-P) - 9
Electroweb - 7
Meteor Beam / Skull Bash - 7
Shelter - 7

Healing Stones - 5
Rage Fist - 5
Dream Eater and co. - 4
Heal Bell - 4
Life Dew (R) - 4
Mystical Fire / Chilling Water - 4
Stone Fangs - 4
Rest - 3
Rock Smash - 3
Vital Throw - 3
Hotwire - 2
Fillet Away - 2
Iron Tail / Dragon Rush - 2
Jet Punch - 2
Play Rough - 2
Rock Wrecker - 2
Snowdrift - 2
Spicy Extract - 2
Belch - 1
Beat Up - 1
Brick Break and co. - 1
Dragon Claw - 1
Dragon Claw / Dragon Pulse - 1
Life Dew (AP) - 1
Life Dew (ES) - 1
Meditation - 1
Mountain Gale - 1
Rage Fist / Last Respects - 1
Recharge - 1
Retaliate - 1
Rising Voltage - 1
Swift - 1
Tidy Up - 1
Trash Talk - 1

Items:
Big Root - 10
Star Shards - 6
Tera Shard - 6
Tuffy-Tuff - 6

Blue Helmet - 5
Whetstone - 5
Dubious Disc - 4
Gold Bottle Cap - 4
Hisui's Blessing - 4
Punching Glove (V) - 4
Lagging Tail - 3
Memory Stick - 3
Salt Lick - 3
Throat Spray / Punching Glove - 3
Body Armor - 2
Malicious Armor - 2
Revolution Ring - 2
Safety Goggles - 2
Salt Cube - 2
Spectral Cape - 2
Time Machine / Chrono Crystal - 2
Adrenaline Orb - 1
Augmented Lens - 1
Bag of Legos - 1
Broken Timepiece - 1
Dooh Hood - 1
Miracle Lens - 1
Training Weight - 1

Abilities:
Cute Charm - 7
Healer - 6
Overcoat - 6
Zero to Hero - 6

Bug Zapper - 5
Paradox Drives - 5
Paradox Protos - 5
Good as Gold (D) - 5
Immolate - 4
Iron Fist - 4
Regenerator (G) - 4
Counteract - 3
Good as Gold (PC) - 3
PoA / Many-Minded - 3
Seed Sower - 3
Aftermath - 2
Beads / Sword of Ruin - 2
Cloud Nine - 2
Disguise - 2
Cud Chew / Harvest - 2
Hivemind - 2
Pride - 2
Anticipation - 1
Birds of a Feather - 1
Friend Guard - 1
Ghoul Presence - 1
Grass Pelt - 1
Justified - 1
Martyr - 1
Mycelium Might - 1
Punk Rock - 1
Rain Dish and co. - 1
Regenerator (a) - 1
Rivalry - 1
Run Away - 1
Sticky Hold - 1
Surges - 1
Thermal Exchange - 1
Wind Rider / Wind Power (TD) - 1
Wind Rider / Wind Power (Z-P) - 1

Adjustments:
Scream Tail - 10
Crabominable - 8
Revavroom - 8
Toxapex - 7

Lechonk line - 5
Meloetta - 4
Pyroar - 4
Sandy Shocks - 4
Scyther - 4
Altaria - 3
Articuno-Galar - 3
Lake Trio - 3
Electrodes - 2
Flutter Mane - 2
Glastrier - 2
Houndstone (ES) - 2
Houndstone (T) - 2
Magearna - 2
Overqwil - 2
Tauros - 2
Vespiquen - 2
Wugtrio (Xrn) - 2
Avalugg-H (c) - 1
Avalugg-H (G) - 1
Bombirdier - 1
Chi-Yu / Chien-Pao - 1
Eelektross - 1
Gardevoir - 1
Iron Jugulis - 1
Mabosstiff - 1
Rotom - 1
Tsareena - 1
Wattrel line - 1
Wugtrio (TD) - 1


WINNERS
Name: Dire Claw | Ceaseless Edge | Stone Axe
Power: 65
Accuracy: 100%
PP: 15
Category: Physical
Type: Poison | Dark | Rock
Effect: Sets a layer of Toxic Spikes | Spikes | Stealth Rock on the opposing side. This effect is blocked by Covert Cloak and Shield Dust.
Priority: 0
Flags: Unchanged
Potential Pokémon With This Move: :skuntank: :sneasler: :grafaiai: | :weavile: :samurott-hisui: :lokix: | :drednaw: :kleavor: :klawf:
Justification: Look, Dire Claw is dumb, we all know Dire Claw is dumb, so here it is in less dumb form, along with its buddies. The Covert Cloak thing was from waaay back when mechanics were still being figured out, and adds some counterplay so they aren't the freest moves in existence. Without Sharpness, they're still pretty weak, so they're more utility than anything. I was gonna give Ceaseless Edge to Bisharp but Kingambit doesn't need the help, so Weavile "upgrades" from Night Slash instead.
Name: Electroweb
Power: 65
Accuracy: Unchanged
PP: Unchanged
Category: Special
Type: Electric
Effect: Sets Sticky Web on the opposing side.
Priority: 0
Flags: Protect, Mirror
Potential Pokémon With This Move: All current users+

Justification: Turned into Sticky Web Ceaseless Edge/Stone Axe Clone.
Name: Meteor Beam / Skull Bash
Power: 120
Accuracy: 90
PP: 10
Category:
(MB) /
(SB)
Type:
(MB) /
(SB)
Effect: Raises user's Sp. Atk (MB) / Atk (SB) by 1 on turn 1. Hits turn 2
Priority: 0
Flags (ex: Contact, Sound): Protect, Mirror, Contact (SB)
Potential Pokémon With This Move::carbink::delphox::diancie::glimmora::sandy shocks::coalossal::stonjourner::mismagius::espeon::rabsca::bronzong::grumpig::rayquaza::eternatus: / :corviknight::iron treads::forretress::orthworm::copperajah::klefki::revavroom::perrserker::sudowoodo::drednaw::hawlucha::tauros::tauros-paldea-combat::tauros-paldea-blaze::tauros-paldea-aqua::sandaconda::bergmite::dugtrio-alola::dialga:
Justification: I have no original ideas and this move was sick, bring it back. Also sneak in Skull Bash, too, but make it good. Notable users of Meteor Beam would be Glimmore and Sandy Shocks mainly, with Magician Delphox in the background, while Iron Treads and Hawlucha would be best Skull Bashers.
Name: Shelter
Power: -
Accuracy: -
PP: 15
Category:

Type:

Effect: Removes Spikes and Stealth Rock from off the field. For every type of hazards removed, the user's defense is raised by one stage.
Priority: 0
Flags: Snatch
Potential Pokémon With This Move: :sliggoo-hisui::Cloyster:
Justification: Easy way to introduce some fun form of hazard removal while bolstering he viability of everyone's precious Pseudo Legendary Goodra-Hisui. Probably do not vote for this with Overcoat buff that might get real troublesome to fight.
Name: Big Root
Effect: Boosts the power of draining moves and Bitter Blade by 30% and boosts the heal from Leech Seed/Strength Sap/Ingrain/Aqua Ring by 30%.
Can Be Knocked Off (Yes or No): Yes
Ignored by Klutz (Yes or No): Yes
Fling Power & Effect: 10 BP
Justification: A slight adjustment to Big Root's effect to make it more appealing to draining move users like Hatterene, Bellibolt, or a potentially unbanned in the future Annihlape. Draining moves still technically heal 30% more damage, since doing 30% more damage is gonna net you 30% more draining (unless you KO the foe ig), so the power boost is just a nice cherry-on-top, especially when it's such a high power boost as well.
:revavroom:
Name: Segin Star Shard/Schedar Star Shard/Navi Star Shard/Ruchbah Star Shard/Caph Star Shard
Effect: When held by Revavroom, the user becomes a Dark/Fire/Poison/Fairy/Fighting type, its ability becomes Intimidate/Speed Boost/Toxic Debris/Misty Surge/Stamina and the move 'Spin Out' is replaced by Wicked Torque/Blazing Torque/Noxious Torque/Magical Torque/Combat Torque. The user's Steel, Poison and moves of the added type are boosted by 1.2x.
Can Be Knocked Off (Yes or No): No if held by Revavroom. Yes, otherwise.
Ignored by Klutz (Yes or No): No
Fling Power & Effect: 20bp and effects of Torque move. Cannot be flung by Revavroom.
Justification: This achieves a few roles in the meta. For starters, it provides some Knock Off absorption with three of the five 'formes' resisting the move as well. Revavroom's kit is also initially okay, with Shift Gear or Parting Shot being useful for various offensive and defensive sets. Its new move (mechanically this works like Zacian/Zamazenta crowned moves) provides some coverage, though these don't overlap to give it too much coverage; Blazing and Combat particularly provide some value offensively with Steel coverage.
Name: Tera Shard
Effect: After switching in or on gaining the item, user's type is replaced with its Tera type. No additional benefits of Tera are conferred (boost to STAB moves, retaining previous STABs, etc). If the item is suppressed (via Embargo or Magic Room or whatever), type change reverts. The type change happens with the same priority as Imposter (after hazards damage). Tera Blast is unaffected by this item (remains Normal).
Can Be Knocked Off: No
Ignored by Klutz: Yes
Fling Power & Effect: 20, none
Justification: Tera is banned? Nah. This is a niche item, but it maintains what is in my opinion the coolest and most balanced use of Tera, which is defensive Tera. The fact that STAB moves aren't boosted AND you lose your original STABs makes it a hard sell on offensive Pokémon (it's more akin to being hit with Soak than anything), and you can't use it to evade hazard damage, but it means Tera Fairy Garganacl and Skeledirge get to keep existing... sort of. You also can't spring the Tera as a surprise, since it happens immediately on switching in.
Name: Tuffy-Tuff
Effect: Only works if the holder is Igglybuff, Jigglypuff or Wigglytuff. Doubles their Defense and Special Defense.
Can Be Knocked Off (Yes or No): No if holder is part of the Igglybuff line, yes otherwise
Ignored by Klutz (Yes or No): No if holder is part of the Igglybuff line, yes otherwise
Fling Power & Effect: 10 BP - Target have -3 Speed on hit
Justification: We tried to buff Wigglytuff a lot back in Jolteons… and it still didn’t managed to get a niche anywhere but the lowest tiers. The biggest problem is it’s awful stat distribution combined with paltry 435 BST by Stone Evolution standards, so, as a throwback to the signature items to a few Gen 1 Pokémon and Clamperl, the first thing to is to introduce an item that help out with it’s poor stats.

This item will help patch Wigglytuff’s awful Defense and Special Defense and turn it into either a mixed wall that can set up Stealth Rock, a cleric with Wish, or even a set-up wallbreaker / tank with access of Nasty Plot and Calm Mind when combining with Competitive, especially in Doubles formats such as VGC. It competes with Scream Tail as that one is faster and doesn’t rely on an item, but Wigglytuff still have a higher base Special Attack in comparison and becomes much bulkier.

As for Igglybuff in LC, since Tuffy-Tuff works like a Igglybuff-line-only superior Eviolite that cannot be knocked off, it can tank hits even better and do what niche it used to have in LC much better than before.
Name: Cute Charm
Effect: This Pokémon takes 50% damage from moves that share its typing.
Permanent (Yes or No): No
Mold Breaker (Yes or No): Yes
Potential Pokémon With This Ability: Old Distribution + :mismagius::vespiquen::scream tail::tatsugiri::arboliva:
Justification: Wanted to get rid of Cute Charm as I don't really like gender being competitively relevant now since Calm Mind Enamorus sets don't have a better ability, plus the ability has always been kinda cringe. With this new version, you remove that bit of RNG while giving a cool defensive ability to Pokemon that don't resist their own types (which applies to all 3 pre-existing Cute Charm mons actually), with Enamorus being an amazing example of that as it doesn't resist either of them. Also, while still worse than Seed Sower, Arboliva with Cute Charm would be one of a select few mons that resist Ursaluna's dual STAB while actually being able to hit it for big damage at that, making it a great check (until you get Fire Punched).
Name: Healer
Effect: If the user faints by an attack, the next ally to switch in receives 33% of their max HP back.
Permanent (Yes or No): No
Mold Breaker (Yes or No): No
Potential Pokémon With This Ability: og distribution + :wigglytuff:(replace frisk),:chansey::blissey:(replace healer), :oranguru: (replace telepathy),:tinkatink::tinkatuff::tinkaton: (replace pickpocket), :scream-tail:
Justification: basically a built in wish, but it can only be used once unless u revive whoever has this ability. mostly given to either caretakers, cute pink things, or mons whose preevos had them before
Name: Overcoat
Effect: Grants immunity to sandstorm damage, powder moves, and entry hazards.
Permanent: No
Mold Breaker: Yes
Potential Pokémon With This Ability: Current distribution + :donphan: :vespiquen::armarouge: :ceruledge: :goodra-hisui: :avalugg:
Justification: Listen, Overcoat has never been a great Ability, but it's more dire now than ever with hail replaced by snow. So many of its users are already immune to one or the other, so here's a universal buff that everyone can get behind. The biggest winner is probably Enamorus-T, but Armarouge and Ceruledge like it too, Avalugg has a real Ability now, and if we get Mandibuzz back in DLCs that's a huge win.
Name: Zero to Hero
Effect: If this Pokemon is Palafin, transforms into Palafin-Hero when KOing a Pokemon.
Permanent: Yes
Mold Breaker: No
Potential Pokémon With This Ability: -
Justification: Significantly worse Palafin. KOing a Pokemon is hard for regular Palafin, so it should have a hard time transforming.
:sv/scream tail:
Pokemon: Scream Tail
Type:

Ability: Protosynthesis
Added Moves: Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse, Knock Off, Nasty Plot, Outrage, Super Fang

Description: Physical defense Fairy wahoo. Got rid of the Psychic typing so it can actually be a Dark resist. Gave it some stuff like Nasty Plot and Super Fang so it's not a passive blob.
:ss/crabominable:
Name: Crabominable
Type:

Abilities: Fur Coat / Iron Fist | HA: Anger Point
New Moves: Jet Punch, Bullet Punch, Mach Punch, Hammer Arm, Knock Off, Slack Off, Swords Dance
Justification: Crabominable is now the defacto physical wall of the metagame look at him take all of your measly physical attacks for pitiful damage. Or you can run Swords Dance and be goated with Iron Fist. Lastly, Iron Fist Belly Drum for the HO kings and queens.
:sm/revavroom:

Name: Revavroom
New Moves: Magical Torque, Wicked Torque, Blazing Torque, Combat Torque, Noxious Torque, High Horsepower
Justification: makes shift gear sets good
:sv/toxapex:
Pokemon: Toxapex
Type:

Ability: Immunity / Merciless / Regenerator
Added Moves: Body Press, Dark Pulse, Crunch, Knock Off, Nasty Plot, Super Fang, Taunt

Description: I think Slowking-Galar wins the battle of Regen Poison so I retyped Toxapex! Now better checks Kingambit, Dragapult, Roaring Moon.
Gave it some stuff like Nasty Plot and Super Fang so it's not a passive blob.


With that, we can begin a 24 hour discussion phase as council discusses the distribution of the winning moves and abilities. You can talk about the metagame impacts you think all the winners will have, give distribution suggestions (though remember that this isn't a distribution phase like the Sylve and JolteMons of old), and prepare submissions for the upcoming Slate 2.

That's all for now, see you tomorrow!
 
my ass was too busy cramming for overdue project so i didn't get to vote :psycry: at least i can talk about the winners at least, note that i am not #metagamepro so take this with a huge bag of salt

Dire Claw, Ceaseless Edge, Stone Axe, Electroweb: I'm putting these guys together because they do the same thing anyway. First of all, love the change on Dire Claw. The distribution also lets those who are mainly attackers give some utility as well, though to be honest— I only see a few getting success with this. In any case though, funny Regieleki sets web. hazard removal is going to be a pain in the ass

Meteor Beam, Skull Bash: they really are something. i dont have strong opinions lmao it's just good

Shelter: amen to my favourite pokemon, Goodra-H supremacy (unbiased)

Big Root: um. drain punches you. real talk this is straightforward and fun, love to see it :]

Segin Shard, Revavroom: I'm putting these two together because er. Segin Shard seems super fun and all but if Spin Out is gonna turn into one of those torque moves, what's the Revavroom adjustment gonna be then? I'm gonna assume it'll just get High Horsepower but I wanted to make sure.

Tera Shard: it sure is something

Cute Charm: yeah. it's not that i'm Not a fan of it, but the only mons who'll actually use this ability is either Enamorous (or maybe its gonna stick to Contrary who knows), Wigglytuff and Scream Tail (hard maybe). So yeah

Healer: it sure is something. I'm not gonna lie, i do not believe the mons who are given this distribution will use this when they have better options. Like, the only Pokemon i'd see using this is Oranguru and Mayhaps non-utility Tinkaton(?????). It's not a bad ability it's just not worth it when you think about it :psycry: i could be wrong though

Zero to Hero: when the hero has to work for glory fr (it is good)

Crabominable: i can't wait for what this guy has in store tbh. Good typing, great attack, i'm hoping for success for this guy

Toxapex: the name doesn't match anymore :( /j this is very cool! It having Knock Off and Taunt just makes it even better, very approved

Scream Tail: There's a reason I made this guy and the guy below last. Somehow this pink blob got a lot of buffs, which is funny to me lmao. We already know that Fairy/Dragon is a stupidly good typing, and now it gets more moves in stuff like Knock Off and Super Fang. Then we move onto abilities because it gets both Cute Charm AND Healer. Though to be fair, its already immune to Dragon moves, but taking only 50% damage from Fairy moves is already a plus. Healer is also an option, since you can get a guaranteed heal for another teammate if the pink blob dies. Either way, congrats to Scream Tail

Wigglytuff: This guy though, this guy for real. Not only does it have Healer and Cute Charm too, it gets its own item that doubles its own defenses via Tuffy-Tuff. The people Want this guys to be a fat wall fr. Nothing wrong, I just think its funny. Hell I wouldn't be surprised if Wigglytuff becomes an actual OU wall, but we'll have to see if that's the case

overall, we got two pink blobs buffed to heaven, and a lot of cool stuff as well! looking forward to what's coming next :]

edit: i forgot to talk about Overcoat. immunity to hazards ftw especially with the new distrib of hazard setting moves
 
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DuoM2

whao
is a Community Contributoris a Community Leader Alumnus
will also post my thoughts on subs. super exhausted and not looking too deep into any of these so take w grain of salt and don't put me in your cringe compilations please

Ceaseless Edge / Stone Axe / Dire Claw / Electroweb - I'm already tired of seeing people talk about these former two moves in standard and it's already been plopped in here huh... I don't think hazards should be getting buffs of any kind in a meta based around Gen 9 OU, I really don't enjoy how few removal options there are in the game as is and either nothing relevant gets these or they're just going to make that existing problem even worse. More mons may end up stuck into Boots, and hazard stacking offense might become more prominent. I've said in the Discord before that I think the hazard meta is the one thing we should toy with from how Gen 9 was focused, leaving things like Recover nerfed and Knock Off undistributed. This was my one stated exception, that Defog should be added back. Not happy with this but there's a chance nothing ends up happening and we might just be fine.

Meteor Beam / Skull Bash - Meteor Beam is a cool move and making another one that's Steel and physical is definitely not going to push it into being broken. Should open up some cool stuff for some new mons, happy with this. Not much to say.

Shelter - Cool hazard removal option, I don't think I need to reiterate that I want more removal options and this is a pretty nice take there. Nice.

Big Root - Interesting. I see mons that run CM + Draining Kiss sets enjoying this, and potentially some random Strength Sap user even if Leftovers would still sorely be missed, but can't think of much else off the top of my head. Might be a bit low-impact but that's not something I'd be overly disappointed with for an item sub, especially since I can definitely see the place this has.

Revavroom Shards - Do want to talk about these but there's a bit more to bring up later...

Tera Shard - I'm unsure how I feel about as many Pokemon as you want getting access to this, but this is otherwise a pretty interesting approach to a tera nerf. There are still Pokemon like Garganacl and Kingambit that have next to no opportunity cost to running this and don't care about Tera Blast being gone which is where the big question mark lies, I think it could end up pretty uncompetitive on the latter case in particular. Kingambit is already a really borderline Pokemon as is and I wouldn't miss it if it were the one Pokemon to rise up as a problem from this, but the immediate chance for any Pokemon at any time to be revealed to have a Tera Shard and just change into a type that flips its matchup spread might still prove problematic. Even if it ends up being bad though, it's very much worth testing, since I really think this idea could end up working out fine in the end, or at least fine enough to build a reasonable meta around.

Tuffy-Tuff - Doubled defenses is a lot more than people first realized, I think. So the Sp. Def spread on the calc goes up from 140/45/50 to approx. 140/109/150, which I think goes without saying is pretty massive. Scream Tail was already very much OU-viable with a near directly downgraded defensive profile from this. I could easily see this ending up stuffing out stuff too easily to be deemed healthy, and at worst it's not going to be very fun to play against or even end up broken with boosting sets or something. Not a big fan of this sub winning if I'm being honest.

Cute Charm - Another simple and harmless but fun ability. Not really much to complain about.

Healer - Big fan of this one, I've always liked abilities that add new ways to heal stuff since they tend to be really simple support that's fun to use. I'll take this any day over my HP abilities.

Overcoat - Hazard immunity, cool. Should push more mons away from being forced into boots or could just be a nice perk for mons to have in general. Once again, not really much to complain about.

Zero to Hero - It was mentioned on Discord that the big deal breaker for this one is how much base form Palafin would get carried by rain, and I have to agree. It still seems extremely difficult for this to get off the ground against balance which is where Hero form is meant to excel, its coverage is still largely limited to Water-type moves which the water resists of this meta will stuff out way better than before, although a Rain-boosted Jet Punch still would be a super big tool against offense and it might be easier to get set up there. I imagine Rain teams may want a more consistent option that plays decently into both archetypes but we'll have to wait and see.

Scream Tail - Love this typing for it, Dragon's always been a pretty cool but underutilized defensive type that I haven't even seen too many Pet Mods explore to great depth yet. It's cool but not the best thing out there which I think suits a Pokemon like this perfectly while still leagues above its original typing. Knock Off is the only move I see making a huge impact here but even that might compete too hard with its other moves for a slot. I don't really think this is the kind of Pokemon that needs more moves except for maybe phasing so I'll 100% take this.

Crabominable - So there was a giant argument over this thing being too broken on the Discord. I think it's definitely very strong, potentially nerfworthy, but I'm fine with it teetering that line if it means we'll adequately be able to nerf it and get a good Crabominable like this later down the line. For the time being though, this thing might play really similar to Melmetal but with actual priority and an offensive presence that's way harder to stop. Slowking, Amoonguss, and the new Scream Tail all exist as prominent checks for balance but they all would fall to a coverage option this has, and this says nothing about all of the offensive Pokemon this would soft check and get easy opportunities with. I may be overreacting on the impact of Fur Coat in particular but we saw how much Wigglytuff gets boosted by its item doubling its Defense stat.

Revavroom - So let's talk about all of the buffs Revavroom got. I find it really funny that Spin Out was meant to be its gateway into getting one of five Torque moves only for this to end up getting all of them in the end, plus Ground coverage just for good measure. Shift Gear sets do indeed potentially look strong now, but I think its stats are bad enough to keep this in check and its coverage does miss some pretty important blind spots. Not especially fond of how it'll play but I still do like the concept of the Revavrooms being playable like this so I'm fine with this ultimately.

Toxapex - TOXAPEX


A lot of interesting ideas that should be fun, cool first slate
 
I think all of these new entries are going to be interesting for sure. Tera Shards are probably going to be the most niche use of all the things here, but there could be some interesting use for them. I suspect forcing someone to be stuck with a specific type could actually be a surprisingly viable strategy, such as using a fast Trick user to make your opponent's defensive wall become an Ice type, or making a Normal type Psychic to no longer be immune to Rage Fist / Last Respects (currently illegal but I suspect a nerfed version of these moves will be making their way around soon). Defensive Tera will be a lot more niche, namely because you are sacrificing your item slot for the type change, but Pokemon with common 4x weaknesses (Tyranitar, Revavroom) might still use those to their advantage. (Edit: I thought the Tera Shards were the typed Tera Shards from the games, not an item just called "Tera Shard", hence my confusion.)

Revavroom's own unique Star Shards are interesting, though I suspect they would not have gotten the votes if this had been introduced a slate later. Considering the number of new tools in its kit, I do wonder how much better the Star Shards are for it than a regular shard would be, thanks to it getting two big buffs in the improved Overcoat and an expanded movepool. If it hadn't been given the Torque moves regularly, the Star Shards would probably have been a really cool bit of flavour, but I don't know how much that overlap will impact the playstyle.

Apart from that, the buffs to lower tier Pokemon are really nice. Wigglytuff, Revavroom, and Crabominable now potentially being good enough for OU is a surprise to be sure, but a welcome one. I cannot wait to see what you all will come up with when using these Pokemon in battle.

The nerf to Zero to Hero is well-deserved, Palafin-Hero is a scary Pokemon, but its base form is not that intimidating. I do suspect it will still be effective on the right teams, as either a Banded Jet Punch or Scarfed Wave Crash could be a way for it to get the kill it needs to become strong. Luckily this way, it requires a lot more team support to start its success.

As for the rest, I currently do not have much to say about it. I think all of the actions taken were reasonable, and I would need to see them in action before reaching a verdict on how good or bad these changes are.

See you all in the next slate!
 
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That feeling when you can resubmit your entire post for Slate 2 and not have to change anything and Sand still sucks in Gen 9. :psycry:

I'll post my thoughts here due to still being unable to use Discord without this latest laptop exploding even for attempting it I imagine:

Slate 01 Winning Moves:
01. Dire Claw | Ceaseless Edge | Stone Axe: I will be entirely truthful here: I voted for this not because I like the latter two, though Ceaseless Edge is easily the more annoying of the two, but because of how stupid official Dire Claw currently is; I have to wonder how many other people voted for the same reasons. It says a lot that making Dire Claw "free" Toxic Spikes is a huge downgrade for it, though of the three moves it is the only one with an innate type immunity that can block it, so Toxic Spikes still somehow stay losing--lol.

02. Electroweb: Gods this feels like like a massive mistake. I'm not going to complain (more) though (yet). We'll how it works out, and I would like to be wrong, but even with a type immunity built in this still seems doomed to be obnoxious. (I hope that if it needs to be removed later than that whatever was runner up can be put in its place instead of just wasting a spot since that's happened before.)

03. Meteor Beam | Skull Bash: I look forward to these though. R.I.P. Nihilego.

04. Shelter: As someone who voted for it, I'm hoping that it can withstand Electroweb winning since it wasn't designed to remove those too. It would be darkly funny if we automatically obviated a winning move because of another winning move in the same Slate.

Slate 01 Winning Items:
05. Big Root: I have no strong feelings one way or other here presently, though I imagine that no one uses Aqua Ring or especially Ingrain still.

06. Revavroom Shards: Gods, even with the the Starmobile page on Bublapedia these forms are still going to take some getting used to (remembering), though I find it hilarious that due to how different the Starmobile forms actually are, we technically didn't buff base Revavroom with this item at all, which gets more from Tera Shard (Steel) than it does any of these just because technically it doesn't exist with them on. [/irony] The pure-Fairy one is the most interesting to me since it means we have Misty Surge back despite both :weezing-galar: Gweezing and :tapu fini: Tapu Fini being gone, and the pure-Dark one might be interesting just to have a good mono-Dark type that isn't named :umbreon: "Umbreon" for once even if it probably ends up the least powerful one at this rate. The pure-Fire and pure-Poison ones could be annoying though, and I don't know what to think about the pure-Fighting one right now.

07. Tera Shard: In theory I'm glad to have it, but in before the necessary :regieleki: Regieleki rebanning, especially since Transistor gets around the "you now lack your original STAB(s)" thing somewhat.

08. Tuffy-Tuff: Even as someone who voted for it, I agree with DuoM2 that this likely will need to be reined in a bit in the future due to how obnoxiously fat it actually makes :wigglytuff: Wigglytuff even before the ability buffs Sir Wiggles also just got. Still, it will be nice to see Wigglytuff be actually usable for once given not even Geomancy and a bunch of other buffs back in JolteMons helped with that. A mon that innately tells :dragapult: Dragapult to go to Hell and (re)die without being (as) overpowered is definitely fine with me.

Slate 01 Winning Abilities:
09. Cute Charm: Like Fairy needed more buffs. [/says the person who voted for it] (Calm Mind) :enamorous: Enamorous feels like the biggest winner here by far, though Wigglytuff becoming the first Normal mon to resist Normal is somewhat novel (even if it doesn't mean as much with Normal/Ghost already in existence now). Of the potential mons in the sub, I feel like poor :vespiquen: Vespiquen benefits least, though I guess she would get the very small niche of taking 1/8th damage from U-Turn. Yay?

10. Healer: The one I'm most indifferent to and reserving my judgment about currently.

11. Overcoat: I'm hoping this won't be obnoxious even if all the free hazards in Gen 9 are decidedly more obnoxious. A bit funny how we already made Sand arguably even worse than it already was well as the fact that both this and Shelter won.

12. Zero to Hero: Easily the thing I like winning the least, if only because I feel like it's such an all-or-nothing affair that there's very little room for this to be actually balanced. Either :palafin: Palafin can find some reliable way(s) to easily get KOs, which effectively negates the attempted restriction, or Palafin more or less never gets KOs, meaning it's a weak mon stuck with an ability that almost never does anything and that might as well still be banned anyway due to not seeing any use. This just seems very lose-lose even before having to look at Palafin-Hero's disgusting design, though again, like with Electroweb and other judgments, I accept that I could be wrong.

Slate 01 Winning Mons:
13. :scream tail: Scream Tail: All forms of :jigglypuff: Jigglypuff won big this slate, and it's nice to have the Fairy/Dragon typing back, especially since it doesn't take up your (non-existent) Mega slot. Guess we'll see how annoying Knock Off, Nasty Plot, and/or Super Fang on it are though.

14. :crabominable: Crabominable: Agreed (again) with DuoM2 that The Crab Boy might need be nerfed a bit later, especially since Fur Coat is a hell of a drug, but I'm currently glad to see him actually worth using even if, yeah, it feels weird for him to not be Ice. Oh well.

15. :revavroom: Revavaroom: Given my laugh at the Revavroom Shards not buffing the base mon, I'm actually...tepid about this, just because some of the Torques seem somewhat annoying--specifically Combat Torque--and now all six forms have access to them all the time. I also wish that it had gotten a third ability even if Overcoat actually does something for it now with Filter instead now becoming the largely ignored ability. Again, oh well.

16. :toxapex: Toxapex: Easily the change I like the least flavor-wise given the name and now not being Poison, but outside of that and giving yet another thing Knock Off (and a Regenerator mon with STAB on it at that) already, it's probably...fine. Shrug. It's funny that it can die to Toxic (Spikes) now though since I don't see anyone ever using Immunity at present, meaning Baneful Bunker will probably be most annoying against itself in Knock Off wars. Fun.
 
I suspect forcing someone to be stuck with a specific type could actually be a surprisingly viable strategy, such as using a fast Trick user to make your opponent's defensive wall become an Ice type, or making a Normal type Psychic to no longer be immune to Rage Fist / Last Respects (currently illegal but I suspect a nerfed version of these moves will be making their way around soon)
they’re not removable btw. can’t believe i voted in unkoffable tera garg

edit:
Tera Shard: In theory I'm glad to have it, but in before the necessary :regieleki: Regieleki rebanning, especially since Transistor gets around the "you now lack your original STAB(s)" thing somewhat.
also tera shard doesn’t affect the type of tera blast. have fun turning into a normal type lol
 
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