Y'know, I noticed that too and entirely forgot last week. I was actually going to remove it the same day I made D tier but entirely forgot! The following changes will be Implemented because obvious and deserving:
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Resource VGC 2018 Viability Rankings
- Thread starter Netherious
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Thank you, I didn't know that
Thundurus has a small niche as fast knock off user, also having Lightning stab
Might need to elaborate more given that Raichu is also a fast Electric-type stab user with Knock Off. And it doesn't typically use Knock Off. Unfortunately Thundurus doesn't have Defiant in VGC18, so it isn't a good Knock Off user either. It also no top cuts as far as I'm aware and has a measly 150CP. Shame I thought it would have been better than this, but oh well, it's deserving of the unrank.
Yeah, Thundurus-I is simply terrible now. Prankster got nerfed in two major ways: 1) Dark-type Pokemon are now immune to Prankster-boosted status moves *COUGH COUGH* Tyranitar and Incineroar, and 2) Psychic and Misty Terrains (the former directly blocking any Prankster-boosted status on any grounded Pokemon, the latter blocking the ones Thundurus specifically uses). There's also the fact that Swagger and Thunder Wave both got nerfed in Gen VII. In terms of an offensive Electric-type, Thundurus has to compete with Tapu Koko, Zapdos, and its own Therian forme, which at least boasts Volt Absorb and a higher Special Attack stat.
Thundurus-I would be able to carve itself a niche... If it had access to Defiant in this metagame. However, seeing as that isn't the case, and seeing that the most annoying thing it did in VGC15 (Prankster Swagger + T-Wave) got nerfed into complete non-viability, there's absolutely no reason to use Thundurus-I on any team in VGC18.
Thundurus-I would be able to carve itself a niche... If it had access to Defiant in this metagame. However, seeing as that isn't the case, and seeing that the most annoying thing it did in VGC15 (Prankster Swagger + T-Wave) got nerfed into complete non-viability, there's absolutely no reason to use Thundurus-I on any team in VGC18.
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If it had access to Heat Wave it would have a pretty decent niche in having an option to OHKO Mega Metagross with Firium Z as well as a even better check to Kartana but, it doesn't. RIP double genie days.
Adamant Scarf Kingler outspeeds base 120s and OHKOs bulky Landorus and Incineroar, while Jolly outspeeds base 130s but can't OHKO bulky Incineroar. Superpower and Rock Slide OHKO Tyranitar and Char-Y respectively. Overall there are definitely better options but you could make it work if you really wanted to.
Mega Manectric should move to B+ because based on VGCstats.com it has more cp post-Incineroar than all but one mon in B (Gardevoir-M) and the only mons in B+ With more are Aegi, Cele, and ludicolo. It even has more than kang and heatran. I haven’t looked into it’s results much, but based just on this it deserves to be a bit higher.
Following on from Japanese Nationals, I'm thinking of the following:
- Mega Salamence back up rom B+ to A-. It was the most dominant Mega in the top 8 with 3 MMence, including both 1st and 2nd. It is likely benefiting from the rise of MKang, Heatran, and Kartana
- Porygon2 down from A to A-. It's still a great Pokemon, but it's no longer on equal success as Cresselia whom shares a competiting TR user slot. The Porygon2 / Araquanid combo that was responsible for the peak of Porygon'2 success has dwindled in success
- Nidoking down from C- to D. It had one notable moment of success in coming 2nd in internationals and that was in the pre-Incineroar metagame. Since then it hasn't had nearly the same success, with only 304 CP. It's concept works well of providing strong anti-metagame coverage, but it requires heavy support to carry it out effectively, and similar coverage is being used instead by Nihlegio who despite lacking Sheer Force and Ice Beam (resorting to HP Ice), requires relatively less team-support, better Speed, and actually has good special bulk.
- On the note of Nidoking down to D, also placing Nidoqueen to D. Whilst Nidoqueen has a measley 100 CP on the list, that does not include its recent 1st place in Japanese Nationals. It does exactly the same thing as Nidoking, just exchanging some power and Speed for bulk. I'm hesitant to raise it higher on account of this being it's one major moment of success, but 1st place in Japanese Nats show that the extra bulk can pay-off and warrant its use over Nidoking which is also ranked. Both have the same role, and replacing one with the other shouldn't make too much of a difference.
- Scizor from unranked to C-. It's inferior to Mega Scizor, but it's there for the same reason as Blaziken - when you can't use its mega form. And unlike Blaziken, it actually has some CP to boot for its success though (1062) compared to 362. FYI Mega Blaziken is 1918 and Mega Scizor is 2216 CP, noting that Scizor is relatively not as worse compared to its Mega form compared to Blaziken and Mega Blaziken
- Mudsdale from unranked to C-. Generally I don't consider ranking things unless they have at least two top cuts in tournies of good-enough standard. Mudsdale got top 2 in Madisons regional and top 8 in Japanese Nationals, both on a team with MMence / TR user / Incineroar / Fini / Grass-type. But notably the Mudsdale set varied on both teams (the former ran a "standard" Figy Berry set with Stamina, the latter a CB Inner Focus set to better combat Incineroar). The uses of Mudsdale over Lando-T are the lack of Intimidate for better Competitive/Defiant match-ups (these teams already have Salamence and Incineroar), for TR use, and single-targetting Ground-type attack.
The rankings also take into account recent success and performance. Kang and Heatran have been doing well recently, where as MManetric success has dipped lately.
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Beat me over the fence; Was just about to work on a lot of these changes already! I've also got some bigger ones not mentioned here but:
Incineroar S --> A+
Landorus-T S --> A+
The reign is over. Landorus has taken the lead and with the rise in Heatran, Kartana, and Kang it's gotten a lot harder for these Pokemon to be consistently dominant. If anyone could stay in S it would be Landorus-T right now, but I'll leave discussion to decide that fate. Here's the rest:
Mega Metagross A+ --> A
Major decline in use due to struggling to get past the newfound love for Kartana among many other things.
Cresselia A --> A+
A pretty drastic increase in usage and CP from previous months launched Cresselia up to the top 6!
Mega Gengar A --> A-
Thanks, AV Kartana. The slicey UB among pokemen slays another Mega.
Tapu Bulu A --> B+
Boneless Kartana. This + Kommo has taken a serious fall from grace as the poor typing has become harder to justify being on a team in a metagame where poison steel and fire all come common.
Amoonguss A- --> A
Good matchups against Tapu's not named Lele and walling Kartana is nice, but must run Hidden Power fire to stay relevant for the ladder.
Kommo-o A- --> B+
Milotic A- --> B+
Celesteela B+ --> A-
Mega Charizard X B+ --> B-
Mega Salamence B+ --> A-
Ferrothorn B --> B+
Gastrodon B --> A-
Rotom-H C --> C+
Thundurus-T C --> C+
Nidoking C- --> D
Blaziken C- --> Unranked
Mega Blastoise D --> C-
Scizor Unranked --> C
Mudsdale Unranked --> C
Nidoqueen Unranked --> D
This should do it for now! Let's talk about it! Thanks everyone!
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I really feel like Gothitelle and Mega Mawile could move up to B+ for sure and maybe even A- once we see the full results from Sheffield regionals. As stated by many, a team with these two is pretty much an auto win against new chalk as well as serving as really good anti tapu tech, easy Kommo-o kill, and more. If you're feeling spicy you can run hyper cutter and rock slide for better match ups against incineroar and char y respectively, which makes char y + nihilego offense teams a pretty winnable match up even if they get rid of your rain.
I agree with this entirely. Any metagame where Kangaskhan is good, Mawile will be there to counter it. EDIT:
Here's the additional moves I'll be making:
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I think vivilion should be ranked c as it has a lot of utility. A 75% accurate sleep move which can stop most tr users, shield dust to prevent fake out to stop tr or, compound eyes to make sleep powder 90-something percent I forgot, also friend guard is there for memes I guess lol, it get tw support, rage powder if you need it, can be a threat even with taunt cause it get access to endeavour and is frail so focus sash is commonly on so it have to be focus fired or it get a tw into endeavour / sleep powder spam. Its naturally fast so it can outspeed a variety of the meta mainly any non-scarf lando under 244+ spe investment, modest zard, literally all zapdos, slow kangs etc
Usually, many things good in theory are completely dunked on in practice. Vivillion cannot take any hits, and it’s speed just isn’t good enough. There are probably many better support Pokemon than it as well, like whimsicott which is faster and has prankster making it far better than vivillion ever will be. It makes it kind of redundant.
Hey everyone!
It's been a bit slow tournaments wise this past week and not many changes have been drastic enough to merit change. I expect the meta to be pretty clear and for the most part set in stone after NAIC. Here's the changes!
Tapu Lele A+ --> A
Mega Kangaskhan A- --> A
That's it!
If you see anything that seems out of place, let me know and we can discuss it!
It's been a bit slow tournaments wise this past week and not many changes have been drastic enough to merit change. I expect the meta to be pretty clear and for the most part set in stone after NAIC. Here's the changes!
Tapu Lele A+ --> A
Mega Kangaskhan A- --> A
That's it!
If you see anything that seems out of place, let me know and we can discuss it!
Im a little curious why Lando T wouldnt remain/be S given its near unanimous presence. Every Mon has counters even the historically s ranked Mons of the past, and I wouldn't really say its debatable that he is currently an omnipresent threat. Great typing keeps him favorable for so many popular combinations. Some pokes can be determined to at least be somewhat useful by sheer virtue of having intimidate alone. He's clearly a very appreciated Pokémon that sits head and shoulders in usage above the rest. I mean just look at his CP lead...
Either way I'm open to the discussion on this.
Either way I'm open to the discussion on this.
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Hi! I have been a few months inactive but now that I don't have school I will be more active around here.
I suppose we've seen NAIC with all its results and new Pokémon that have appeared, so it's clear that the VR should change with it. Here are a few noms:
So this is the team that won NAIC. Really surprising but not so much in the same time. I think this team was pretty much a very good metacall as I can't think of anything that can stop it with ease in the actual metagame. Lele Gross is a broken core, and if you pair it with a really fast tailwind setter as Drifblim and a really good Pokémon in the actual meta as Rotom-Heat this team is going to win. Also, I just wanted to mention that Chuppa also piloted the same team but didn't get such a good result btw.
So, having this team in mind, the nomination will be the following:
Landorus-T from A+ to S.
I really don't know what the fuck happened here so that Lando isn't in S rank. I don't think that it's the best Pokemon in the metagame, but I have to say that it does its role like the best.
For example, Rotom-Heat won because everyone slept on Lando-T. Landorus (and Swampert) are the only two pokes that can hit hard Rotom-H and without getting KOed back. Gastrodon doesn't count as it normally packs Ice Beam and EP which can't hit Rotom. But I will talk about Rotom-H later.
So, being a good ground-type, having a lot of versatility, Intimidate, and really good stats, make it so that Lando-T has to be S rank.
Incineroar from A+ to S.
.
Mega Metagross from A to S/A+.
Metagross is the best mega Pokemon in the metagame. Don't try to change my mind. If you try to look for something that resists all IH, Zen, Ice and Stomping Tantrum, the only Pokémon is Shedinja LOL. Yes, you can't have'em all, but you have to fear all of them.
The ability to not mega evolve just to keep Clear Body is really good for Metagross, as Intimidate is really popular, and it isn't a counter for Metagross thanks to this.
I think that Metagross dropped because of Kartana, but you don't have to win vs every Pokémon for just being a good Pokémon. For example, Incineroar can't beat Fini but it doesn't mean Incineroar is bad or something. We should keep in mind that Metagross has teammates, like Incineroar, Rotom-H, Tapu Koko... that can hit both Kartana and Fini.
I'd like to see more people talking about this one because I think it is something that should be talked about.
Mega Gengar from A- to A/A+
This Pokémon is scary af. Yes, it's weak, but its offensive presence is so threatening that you can't attack him without fearing to be heavily damaged. It has the perfect coverage + really good support moves: Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, Icy Wind, Taunt, Disable...
You can argue about Lele + Tailwind being really popular nowadays, and that's really threatening for Mega Gengar. It's also walled by AV Lando if it doesn't have Icy Wind
Rotom-Heat from C+ to B/B+
This Pokémon is really damn good in the format rn, Won't talk about Ally Switch but about its typing and offensive moves.
It's typing + levitate is one of the best ones in the format. You only fear water types, like Fini (but having Z Tbolt is really good for it), Psychic spam (Gross kills Rotom with Zen in Psychic terrain unless it's really bulky) and Rock types (where?? haha)
Rotom struggles a little bit against AV lando but, as always, it has teammates that can hit lando very hard, and Drifblim can burn it.
Other mentions that I won't extend too much with are:
Tapu Lele from A to A+
Snorlax from A+ to A (although I'm not really sure about this one)
I suppose we've seen NAIC with all its results and new Pokémon that have appeared, so it's clear that the VR should change with it. Here are a few noms:
So this is the team that won NAIC. Really surprising but not so much in the same time. I think this team was pretty much a very good metacall as I can't think of anything that can stop it with ease in the actual metagame. Lele Gross is a broken core, and if you pair it with a really fast tailwind setter as Drifblim and a really good Pokémon in the actual meta as Rotom-Heat this team is going to win. Also, I just wanted to mention that Chuppa also piloted the same team but didn't get such a good result btw.
So, having this team in mind, the nomination will be the following:
I really don't know what the fuck happened here so that Lando isn't in S rank. I don't think that it's the best Pokemon in the metagame, but I have to say that it does its role like the best.
For example, Rotom-Heat won because everyone slept on Lando-T. Landorus (and Swampert) are the only two pokes that can hit hard Rotom-H and without getting KOed back. Gastrodon doesn't count as it normally packs Ice Beam and EP which can't hit Rotom. But I will talk about Rotom-H later.
So, being a good ground-type, having a lot of versatility, Intimidate, and really good stats, make it so that Lando-T has to be S rank.
.
Metagross is the best mega Pokemon in the metagame. Don't try to change my mind. If you try to look for something that resists all IH, Zen, Ice and Stomping Tantrum, the only Pokémon is Shedinja LOL. Yes, you can't have'em all, but you have to fear all of them.
The ability to not mega evolve just to keep Clear Body is really good for Metagross, as Intimidate is really popular, and it isn't a counter for Metagross thanks to this.
I think that Metagross dropped because of Kartana, but you don't have to win vs every Pokémon for just being a good Pokémon. For example, Incineroar can't beat Fini but it doesn't mean Incineroar is bad or something. We should keep in mind that Metagross has teammates, like Incineroar, Rotom-H, Tapu Koko... that can hit both Kartana and Fini.
I'd like to see more people talking about this one because I think it is something that should be talked about.
This Pokémon is scary af. Yes, it's weak, but its offensive presence is so threatening that you can't attack him without fearing to be heavily damaged. It has the perfect coverage + really good support moves: Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, Icy Wind, Taunt, Disable...
You can argue about Lele + Tailwind being really popular nowadays, and that's really threatening for Mega Gengar. It's also walled by AV Lando if it doesn't have Icy Wind
This Pokémon is really damn good in the format rn, Won't talk about Ally Switch but about its typing and offensive moves.
It's typing + levitate is one of the best ones in the format. You only fear water types, like Fini (but having Z Tbolt is really good for it), Psychic spam (Gross kills Rotom with Zen in Psychic terrain unless it's really bulky) and Rock types (where?? haha)
Rotom struggles a little bit against AV lando but, as always, it has teammates that can hit lando very hard, and Drifblim can burn it.
Other mentions that I won't extend too much with are:
I basically used that team all the way from day 1 but with zapdos lol. Agree with everything, 'specially rotom-H, I wrote the analysis. It's a really underrated mon. Keep in mind though that it's bulk is fake. Neutral hits take Rotom down way faster than you'd think.Hi! I have been a few months inactive but now that I don't have school I will be more active around here.
I suppose we've seen NAIC with all its results and new Pokémon that have appeared, so it's clear that the VR should change with it. Here are a few noms:
So this is the team that won NAIC. Really surprising but not so much in the same time. I think this team was pretty much a very good metacall as I can't think of anything that can stop it with ease in the actual metagame. Lele Gross is a broken core, and if you pair it with a really fast tailwind setter as Drifblim and a really good Pokémon in the actual meta as Rotom-Heat this team is going to win. Also, I just wanted to mention that Chuppa also piloted the same team but didn't get such a good result btw.
So, having this team in mind, the nomination will be the following:
Landorus-T from A+ to S.
I really don't know what the fuck happened here so that Lando isn't in S rank. I don't think that it's the best Pokemon in the metagame, but I have to say that it does its role like the best.
For example, Rotom-Heat won because everyone slept on Lando-T. Landorus (and Swampert) are the only two pokes that can hit hard Rotom-H and without getting KOed back. Gastrodon doesn't count as it normally packs Ice Beam and EP which can't hit Rotom. But I will talk about Rotom-H later.
So, being a good ground-type, having a lot of versatility, Intimidate, and really good stats, make it so that Lando-T has to be S rank.
Incineroar from A+ to S.
.
Mega Metagross from A to S/A+.
Metagross is the best mega Pokemon in the metagame. Don't try to change my mind. If you try to look for something that resists all IH, Zen, Ice and Stomping Tantrum, the only Pokémon is Shedinja LOL. Yes, you can't have'em all, but you have to fear all of them.
The ability to not mega evolve just to keep Clear Body is really good for Metagross, as Intimidate is really popular, and it isn't a counter for Metagross thanks to this.
I think that Metagross dropped because of Kartana, but you don't have to win vs every Pokémon for just being a good Pokémon. For example, Incineroar can't beat Fini but it doesn't mean Incineroar is bad or something. We should keep in mind that Metagross has teammates, like Incineroar, Rotom-H, Tapu Koko... that can hit both Kartana and Fini.
I'd like to see more people talking about this one because I think it is something that should be talked about.
Mega Gengar from A- to A/A+
This Pokémon is scary af. Yes, it's weak, but its offensive presence is so threatening that you can't attack him without fearing to be heavily damaged. It has the perfect coverage + really good support moves: Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, Icy Wind, Taunt, Disable...
You can argue about Lele + Tailwind being really popular nowadays, and that's really threatening for Mega Gengar. It's also walled by AV Lando if it doesn't have Icy Wind
Rotom-Heat from C+ to B/B+
This Pokémon is really damn good in the format rn, Won't talk about Ally Switch but about its typing and offensive moves.
It's typing + levitate is one of the best ones in the format. You only fear water types, like Fini (but having Z Tbolt is really good for it), Psychic spam (Gross kills Rotom with Zen in Psychic terrain unless it's really bulky) and Rock types (where?? haha)
Rotom struggles a little bit against AV lando but, as always, it has teammates that can hit lando very hard, and Drifblim can burn it.
Other mentions that I won't extend too much with are:
Tapu Lele from A to A+
Snorlax from A+ to A (although I'm not really sure about this one)
My thoughts following from North America. As a general trend, I noticed that many different team archetypes did well and were included in top 32, including many old favourites with the exception of no Kommo-O teams
- Drifblim up from C to B-. Not just from the top cut in North America, but it has gathered good results and top cuts in other tournaments before this too. It's had more success recently than Accelgor which is B-, and both fill in the role as dedicated support alongside Tapu Lele. It's been proven time and time again that Driblim does its supporting role very reliably. It's also had more consistent success than Rotom-Heat, so if Rotom-Heat rises, Drilfbim should be at least in the same rank
- MGross back up to A+ from A (but not S). It was the top performing mega in North America, reclaiming its role from Mega Kang which still saw success in North America but not as much.
- Lando-T and Incineroar back to S from A+. Their usage, success, and dominating impact on the metagame exceeds that of the other A+ rank Pokemon, with most teams having one of the two. Most of those who didn't in the top 32 had MMence, another Intimidate use but whose usage, success and impact isn't close to their level. A ranking trick commonly used for Smash Bros tiers is graphing each player's votes / scores against each other, and then creating separate ranks where there are large gaps. Using this trick for CP in the post-Incineroar metagame, Lando-T and Incineroar sit at 63154 and 58089, with a very large gap from #3 Tapu Fini (40693).
- Braviary up to B+ and Bisharp down to B rank. In recent tournaments, including this IC, Braviary has outperformed Bisharp as a Defiant user. Bisharp is still good, but it's no longer the best Defiant user, where as Braviary has even outperformed Milotic recently.
- Nidoqueen up from D to C-. It won Japanese Nationals, it top cut NZ Regionals, and it got top 32 in IC. It's gotten enough results for me to feel that it should be separated from the rest of the D pack
- Phermosa up from D to C-. It also has enough results that I feel it shouldn't be with the rest of the D pack. Its ability to OHKO a wide range of top Pokemon is also particularly useful in the current metagame - Ice Beam (Lando-T, MMence), and Fighting-STAB in particular All-Out Pummeling (OHKOing Incineroar, Kartana, Snorlax, Mega Kang, Heatran, Pory2, Ttar, even 4 HP / 0 SpD MGross ). Even if Phermosa often leads to exchanges, the user can take advantage of removing the exchanged threat, or sometimes choosing which threat is exchanged.
- Mega Abomasnow to D rank. I personally think it's a bad Pokemon, but it has had its share of results , getting top 8 in Japanese Nationals and 23rd in this IC. It fills in the roles of a semi-TR sweeper and Grass-type for the team. Definitely worse than other Grass-types like Bulu and Mega Ven for semi-TR teams, and there are more reliable TR sweepers, but it gets the job done and Snow Warning and Blizzard do give it some niches for sweeping.
- Unsure about MGeng from A- to A, so won't comment. Disagree to A+.
- Indifferent for Rotom-Heat up from C+ to B-. This was its one major success recently, but it's a great one to boost about. So I could see it moving up to B-, but not higher. And not higher than Driflbim
- Rotom-Wash down from B- to C+ or C. It's most recent success was on a Kommo-O team, but it's faded away, and Kommo-O is also less common and successful than what it used to be. Furthermore Gastrodon is increasing in usage as an alternate non-Fini Water-type
- Blacephon down from C to C- or D rank. I haven't seen success from it for a long time and has definitely underperformed compare to its C even C- rank commrades . It's reliant on Choice Scarf for Speed due to its abysmal bulk, and whilst it has great offence / STABs, they're similar to Incineroar's STABs who provides far more consistency and team support. It's tricky to justify on a team, and I couldn't see it being used on a team that isn't hyper offence.
- Scrafty down from C rank to C- rank. Haven't seen this in forever, but all the other C ranks sans for Blacephon I have. It's got a really bad case of "Incineroar is better, and even though Scrafty has some perks over Incineroar, you should still use Incineroar even if you really need those perks." It just doesn't make enough of those match-ups where it's better than Incineroar to compensate for Incineroar's many other advantages.
- I'm against Snorlax moving down as it is the uncontested best TR sweeper beating every other competition for the role, and also acts as a strong deterrant for your opponent in setting up TR (i.e. they set up, and may regret it). Am not veto against it
- Indifferent to Tapu Lele rising back up to A+. MGross outperformed it this tournament, but it still did well. I think it's either the best of the A ranks or the worse of the A+ ranks.
- Stakataka up from C to C+. 3 of the top 32 in IC had it. It's been dropping in usage and success gradually over the metagame, but it has started to increase again slowly since slightly before IC
- Agree with Exacdrill in B-. It's been doing better recently, definitely more so than that of other C+ rank Pokemon.
- I feel that Gyarados should get no higher than D rank given that its recent top cut is the only major success of it I've seen in a long time. But I don't know if I would rank it solely on the basis of one performance (I've always used two as my cut off, and we didn't rank Tsareena following Oceania IC). It's CP is comparable to that of other D rank Pokemon (617 post-Incineroar metagame including IC).
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Can't disprove math.
Can we move excadrill up now? 2 of them made day 2 (and one cut) and we saw one come t8 Madison, t8 Mexico City, and one won Melbourne in the weeks leading up to Nats. I think that's at least B- level.
Also Gyarados should probably be ranked given that it cut NAIC. It's an intimidator that scares both other common intimidators, which is definitely a niche, and in all honesty it's probably better than it's mega version right now.
Also Gyarados should probably be ranked given that it cut NAIC. It's an intimidator that scares both other common intimidators, which is definitely a niche, and in all honesty it's probably better than it's mega version right now.
Big VR Shuffle incoming:
There likely won't be much movement here until Worlds unless there is a large online shift in the meta. Feel free to discuss anything you disagree with or see merit to change. After Worlds I will do one last large update and will continue to monitor until new rules are announced! Thank you all for your contribution and helping me to make this is a reliable resource!
I'm so happy that Incineroar got into S tier! He was always one of my favorites ever since the Sun and Moon starters were revealed!Big VR Shuffle incoming:
Incineroar A+ --> S
Landorus-T A+ --> S
Mega Metagross A --> A+
Bisharp B+ --> B
Braviary B --> B+
Rotom-W B- --> C
Excadrill C+ --> B-
Rotom-H C+ --> B-
Blacephalon C --> D
Drifblim C --> B-
Stakataka C --> C+
Scrafty C --> C-
Pheromosa D --> C
Mega Latias D --> C
Nidoking D --> C-
Nidoqueen D --> C-
Gyarados Unranked --> C+
There likely won't be much movement here until Worlds unless there is a large online shift in the meta. Feel free to discuss anything you disagree with or see merit to change. After Worlds I will do one last large update and will continue to monitor until new rules are announced! Thank you all for your contribution and helping me to make this is a reliable resource!
Can anyone tell me why Accelgor is B-? What does it do that makes it equal to Tyranitar? I didn't see it in NA internationals.
I do agree with your point as being outspeed by stuff like lele and metagross koko is a pain. I do still believe it should be in c / d range as it have a multitude of unique niches that "justifies it to be in some teams". On top of that D has a lot of franky worst pokemon, ninetales for example has the niche of having aurora veil which btw dosnt last long due to its need to run focus sash unless you want it to get one shot by metagross. Ninetales is too fast to get it weather v other weather and most popular weather pokemon shut it down i.e tyranitar, zard. Vivi on the other hand can redirect for tr, outspeed adamant lando and sleep them ( a niche smeargle lacks) , endeavour as a huge threat to those, tw for speed control. Also with the multitude of levitating or flying pokemon tapu koko and tapu fini arnt completely muting vivilion sleep spam. Whim also cant have that sleep pressure as it has a very inaccurate move and have the poteintial of being shut down by tapu lele making it so the team needs it. Also whim as reliable as a endeavour as it being so tanky and is completely shut down for a turn when fake out is a thing. Vivi outspeed the two most common fake outer being kang/incin (kang generally being bulkier you do get outspeed by faster varients but that's beside the point) and because of shield dust isn't fake out essentially shutting down those pokemon. Though vivi isn't the best pick I do see it having a ton of niche on certain teams.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7vgc2018-769484097
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7vgc2018-773198025 (couldn't find a higher rated or better game to show vivilion vs blaziken sharp I could of won here but due to flinch couldn't note: I did miss played I should of rage powder eq instead of sleep powder protect)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7vgc2018-765411618
Edit: I do believe ninetales (and possibly arcanine as it has the unfortunate position of being in a mid speed teir lower bulk than incin) should be removed for the reason listed above its niche is too weak to condone using it and so far it seem no one have seen any success with it.
https://imgur.co m/a/ST6dfGm for those say my games are low ladder this team did reach 1700 but not by me
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The VGC viability ranking lists are meant to be a reflection of both how good the Pokemon is and the success of the Pokemon in the irl VGC metagame. Vivi has no success in the metagame - I don't recall ever seeing it in a top cut, and its measly 287 CP total post Incineroar reflects that.
Many viable irl teams are also equipped to handle Vivi without trying to. Vivi fails easily to any two Pokemon faster than it. Teams without two Pokemon faster than it often still have ways to deal with it, for example, slower CHALK teams with only Scard Lando-T outspeeding it still have bulky AV Kartana who can finish it off without caring for Sleep Powder / Rage Powder (and I'd happily let Lando-T sleep if it means KOing a Pokemon - Lando-T can still Intimidate stuff). On that note, in general, a Pokemon isn't worth if it only thing it does is sac itself to sleep something, and that is often what Vivi will at best acheive.
With your replays:
1st one: Your opponent did not have a good team in general. Besides having issues with Vivi, he's weak to fast strong threats in general as he seems to lack speed control on a relatively slow team. He's also way too Lando-T weak.
2nd one. Vivi fainted in order to sleep Snorlax. Didn't change the outcome of the match. On the other hand, if you brought your Cress instead of Vivi, you would have been more prepared for that MBlaz
3rd one. Your opponent forgot about Shield Dust. Also considering that his Zard Y is not max speed, he should have really brought his Scarf Lando-T as a lead. It's good against your team in general and is a fairly safe lead against your team.
Accelgor is commmonly paired with Tapu Lele, holding a Pyschic Seed to activate its Unburden. It is an extremely fast support with useful support moves, including Encore, Acid Spray, Struggle Bug and Final Gambit. You also can't dick it with priority thanks to Psychic Terrain.
There were also just as many Accelgor in top 32 for NA than non-Mega Tyranitar (0).