Announcement VGC Winter League Format Discussion

[zee]

Hi everyone, by popular demand Smogon VGC has decided to run a second team tour following an incredibly successful first edition of VGCPL. However, we'd like to reach out to the community more on determining what slots are featured in this tournament. Because we want this to be a bit shorter than VGCPL, only 6 teams will be featured, and we'll be starting with 6 slots only. If we reach a high number of signups this number will be bumped to 8, so don't worry. Anyways, here's the formats that are up for discussion in table form:

Slot	Format 1	Format 2	Format 3	Format 4
Slot 1 - Series 11	Series 11	X	X	X
Slot 2 - Series 11	Series 11	X	X	X
Slot 3 - Gen 8	Series 8/11	Series 9	Series 10	No Dynamax Series 9
Slot 4 - Gen 8	Series 8/11	Series 9	Series 10	No Dynamax Series 9
Slot 5 - Past Format - Gen 7	VGC 2017	VGC 2018	VGC 2019 Ultra Series	X
Slot 6 - Past Format - Gen 6	VGC 2014	VGC 2015	VGC 2016	X

If you're posting in the thread, feel free to list your favorite choices for one or all slots. We'd appreciate a bit of reasoning as to why if you're going to make the effort to post.

If you're in a rush, we also have a google form where you can vote. ​

 

[Zeal]

For one of the gen 8 slots, I’d like to see no max for one of the slots. I think there is enough of an interest in no max as a format for people to sign up for it. The Eevee series had over 200 participants, so I think that shows enough of an interest. It was a money tour, but if people didn’t want to play no max and we’re just in it for money I doubt they would’ve gone through the trouble of building a team and getting it in game.

As for past gens, I don’t feel very strongly as long as it’s not restricted metas since a lot of matches come down to matchups. It really just depends on which format people wanna play more.

 

[InkVGC]

I think that perhaps a rotating set of formats for those that aren't the current could work, somewhat similar to what WWT did minus all the uh, joke formats and the like. That said I also would think that No Dmax S9 is a bad idea imo because of just its non-official status.

 

[Grandmas Cookin]

i like the idea of a rotating format slot(s), as it encourages drafting players that have played for a long time for those old gen slots. while also not taking away from having multiple gen 8 slots to allow for newer players to shine as well. if possible i would like to see some gen 5 formats as well, even if they aren’t a regular thing. otherwise getting lots of those nat dex formats that most of the community enjoys across the generations would be nice

 

[Evelyie]

I think that perhaps a rotating set of formats for those that aren't the current could work, somewhat similar to what WWT did minus all the uh, joke formats and the like. That said I also would think that No Dmax S9 is a bad idea imo because of just its non-official status.

I agree with Ink's take on no-Dynamax S9, except if we actually get some smaller VR's and discussion + more Eevee Series or other tournament results. Resuming, if the format solidifies itself more then I think it's a good pick, else, no. I thinkbwe could also get some even older formats like Series 1-5

 

[Namuko Pro]

For gen 8 I like the idea of doing one Series 9 and one Series 10 slot along with the two Series 11 slots. That would let there be a variety of formats for people who have a definite preference for one of those in particular. I think putting in one or two extra S11 slots there is fine too, just shouldn't be two Series 9 or two Series 10 since there's no real reason to have a bias towards one or the other.

The only thing I'm really opposed to is putting in Series 9 No Dynamax. Having an unofficial non-VGC format taking up one or two of only six slots really doesn't feel right, especially when it's something that doesn't have a significant track record beyond a few online tournaments. Beyond that, Series 10 has exposed how dangerous stuff like Urshifu, Regieleki, Rillaboom, etc can be without dynamax, and no Restricteds would just further exacerbate the issue. Series 9 No Max tournaments also had to ban stuff like Urshifu outright, and having to deal with potential bans, or a format that is potentially just not any fun to play, seems like a really bad idea.

For Gen 6, I think my preferred format would be 2015. That's typically what most people who played back then consider the best of the Gen 6 formats, and feels like the quintessential Gen 6 format with the Megas and tutor moves that were introduced in ORAS being allowed. 2014 is a fine format too. It just shouldn't be 2016 because almost everyone who played back then hates that format. I wish I had a better reason to say we shouldn't do it but it's really just because it's a terrible format.

I don't care what the Gen 7 format is since I didn't play any of them seriously except for Ultra in NPA so no reason for me to weigh in there.

I think the idea of alternating formats is cool; something else I think might be interesting is letting whichever team is nominally the "home team" in each match being able to choose which Gen 6 and Gen 7 format are being played in their match each week. Both of those could create logistical challenges though, so not sure how much they're worth considering.

 

[Aldrich]

Rotating set of formats actually is a very creative idea, I am down for rotating formats on both old Gens.
Agreed on the No Dynamax Series 9, since there never really is an official format I am not really too keen on that because of the never been official status, and we are gaming in vgc which unlike other smogon formats we follow official formats. I would vote for 2 Series 11 , 1 Series 10 and 1 Series 9 ,2 Rotating Old Gens Format OR have the managers decide to ban 1 format during the week to play the old gen format which is for example

A vs B

A bans 2019 Ultra Series
B bans 2017

so the format played will be 2018 at the week.

Same thing for Gen 6!

 

[Helios of Sun]

My take on this:

The baseline idea of having 2 slots for Series 11 is something I like a lot, though I might bump it up to 3 slots. I think having the 4th slot as Series 10 would be good, as it seems like a lot of people have enjoyed the nice change of pace series 10 brought.

For past formats, I think the way Aldrich talks it through would be very interesting. It would certainly create some logistical challenges that may need to be overcome.

So my idea:

Series 11
Series 11
Series 11
Series 10
2 banned pick 1 (Gen 7)
2 banned pick 1 (Gen 6)

 

[Cobalte]

This is my preference:

• Current format x3
• Series 7/9
• VGC17
• VGC15

Only two slots of the current format feel too little.

Series 7/9 being one concrete slot is for a few reasons. I don't think we should be adding non-official variety formats at this stage of the league, maybe later down the line after a few it'll be worth looking at. As much as I would like it, I don't think it should be S10 either. Yes it has been widely popular and is an official format, but also it's in that weird in-between spot where it's never had an official event use it either. 7/9 is prob the next best

VGC17 and 15 fit a generation format each, while also being one a region dex format and one a national dex. The ones I picked are just what I thought would be best while following that kinda mix. I excluded restricted formats on the basis of S11 is restricted.

Despite playing since gen 5 and finding my own fun in it, seems pointless to include it in any old gen format whatever you decide. There are very few players left that have had experience in it and are still active, so it'd be rough for teams to figure out how to fit that in with draft picks. It's also very mechanically different to the gens following.

I know the awkward thing about these ideas, is it basically functions on the whole league including finals being done by 1st Feb (S12). Seems easy but I know you guys have stuff to set up and that takes time. Best solution there is probably changing the 3 current formats to S12 and the 7/9 slot into 8/11 I'd say.

 

[TheKingVillager]

Personally agree with earlier posts stating we should have rotating formats for the older slots. Love all 3 of the Gen 7 formats but would prefer to play them all across the weeks instead of just one. Would be interested to see No Max No Ursh as a format who cares that its not official lol.

 

[Coam]

For Gen 8 I think two Series 11, a series 10, and a Series 9 slot would be most representative of this generation's metagames. No dynamax max s9 is too untested at the moment and might end up quickly becoming unbalanced and stale.

I'm not as familiar with the past Gen formats, but the idea of rotating them sounds like a good idea if it's not too hard too implement.

 

[zee]

Thanks to everyone who gave input in this thread or the form. Since discussion has died down, we're pretty comfortable that the formats will be as follows:

2x VGC Series 11
1x VGC Series 10
1x VGC Series 9
1x VGC 17/18/19 rotation
1x VGC 14/15/16 rotation

we'll be opening manager signups next monday to give everyone 2 weeks to sign up.