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We've explored six generations of Pokémon, and we're now entering a seventh. We've made the monocolor journey through Kanto, fought with legendary dogs in Johto, surfed the many seas of Hoenn, become distorted in Sinnoh, almost froze to death in Unova, and walked the same road as a king in Kalos.
To celebrate the six regions, I've put together a bunch of panelists to discuss the most similar regions. Kanto and Johto, Hoenn and Kalos, and Sinnoh and Unova will all be compared in a friendly debate.
This week we've got Hoenn and Kalos. Please welcome DHR-107, Codraroll, Steven Stone, Kris, and skylight.
Codraroll | DHR-107 | Kris | skylight | Steven Stone |
Click on the images to read their thoughts! |
Codraroll
The overall plot of all Pokémon games stays strikingly similar between versions. Defeating the eight Gyms and the Elite Four, and stopping the evil plans of Team Whatever on your way. In Hoenn, you battle misguided eco-terrorists, and in Kalos you battle... uhh, brainwashed fashionistas? It's never really clear why Team Flare do what they do, as Lysandre seems to be the one doing all the thinking and making all decisions. The grunts seem convinced that they're on the winning team, but it was never quite clear to me why they would believe that. At least Teams Aqua and Magma had an ideology for the grunts to get behind.
Hoenn's plot also showed the Teams' efforts to find and awaken the relevant legendary Pokémon, and its subsequent rampage (Emerald even had the two battle), hammering in the point that nature is too big and powerful for humans to mess with. In Kalos, the legendary Pokémon appears sort of out of the blue; when you first see it it is already wrapped up and ready to battle you in Team Flare's lair. How did it get there? What does it do? Some flavor texts and backstories reveal something about life and destruction, but it's a much less engaging story than the titans of Hoenn waking from eternal slumber.
There's also the small fact that both games use a "villainous team using powerful legendaries to threaten the world" plot. Hoenn was the first region to use that plot, as previously Team Rocket had never threatened the world, and they hadn't bothered with legendary Pokémon. The inclusion of a villainous team was nothing new even back then, but the integration of legendary Pokémon into the plot was a slightly original touch. It's sad, then, that the three subsequent generations proceeded to use the exact same plot. You may blame Hoenn for starting that tradition, but it's inexcusable for Kalos to have continued it with only minor variations, for the fourth time in a row. That streak racks up a whole bucket of unoriginality points.
Codraroll
It may just be that I played the Hoenn games more than I did the Kalos ones, but overall I remember the Hoennese NPCs a lot better than those of Kalos. Kalos leaned heavily on your group of friends setting out, giving each of them a little quirk and, arguably, a bit more personality than Brendan or May as a main character. Lysandre, Emma, and Xerosic were also a little more expressive than their Hoenn counterparts as far as villains go, at least until the latter characters were fleshed out more in ORAS. I also find it a neat detail that the Mom in Kalos is a famous Rhyhorn racer; they make sure to give her a little more personality than the parents in Hoenn. Sorry to say, but I find Norman a rather bland guy. Overall it seems like the major characters of Kalos are a little more interesting than those of Hoenn.
But the minor characters of Hoenn is where that region really shines. Mr. Briney, retired sailor who lives in a seaside cottage with his wife and darling Peeko. The residents of Dewford Town, always obsessing over the latest trends. The kids playing on the beach south of Slateport. The Trick Master and his fancy labyrinthine puzzles. Steven Stone, Champion and heir to the Devon Corporation. The Winstrate family. The guy who tries to complete the Rusturf Tunnel by digging by hand. The (huff-puff) glass blower of Route 113 and his apprentice. Rydel, the Bike Shop owner who gives you a bike with his logo all over it for promotion. The old lady who keeps healing your Pokémon until you explicitly tell her not to. The Berry Master and his wife. The Mimic circle. Hoenn has so many memorable minor characters that I can't help but siding with that region here.
Codraroll
As much as I love Hoenn, I can readily admit that its Pokémon selection is one of its greatest flaws. Kalos keeps throwing tons of different Pokémon at you, whereas Hoenn has a rather limited selection. That's all that needs to be said about the selection. For elaboration, I urge you to look up Hoenn's number of water routes and the variety of Pokémon found in them when surfing.
However, I feel the question was intended to be about the new Pokémon introduced with each region, which is a slightly more interesting question. Not counting Mega Evolutions and various other Pokémon formes, Hoenn introduced roughly twice as many Pokémon as Kalos did. However, there's a lot of "Dex filler" Pokémon among Hoenn's 135 new additions. Pokémon such as Barboach, Grumpig, Delcatty, Claydol, Swalot, and Masquerain have very few fans and see little use in any competitive format. Before Mega Evolution and hidden abilities patched things up, it used to be even worse, as there was little use in Pokémon like Manectric, Altaria, Crawdaunt, and Banette. There are many good and memorable Hoenn Pokémon, but there were—and still remain—many forgettable ones too.
By contrast, Kalos seems to go for quality over quantity. The modest 72 additions to the Pokédex brought on by Generation 6 mostly seem to be notable in some way, whether by unique typing, interesting abilities, quirky design, or other little things. The early-route bugs, birds, and rodents of Kalos could easily have followed the same cookie-cutter fomula as their previous generation counterparts, but the designers at Game Freak managed to break the norms in new and inventive ways. Kalos added no more Pokémon than it had to, and I think we're all the better for it. There is no need to create generic fish, bugs, or birds if they bring nothing new to the table, and the design time appears to have been spent well on the Pokémon that actually made the cut instead.
DHR-107
These two games have slight differences in their overarching plotline. Granted, they still deal with the whole "End of the World" story which is becoming a major part of the franchise (every story since Generation 3 has been "the end of the world"). Hoenn takes a look at the Pokémon world and semi-parallels the real world and the dangers we face with global warming. In Hoenn we see what the extremes of weather will do (either heat or rain) and how people and places can be lost due to these. Kalos is referring back to an ancient war which tore Kalos apart before peace was created by the use of the ultimate weapon. The plot for Kalos definitely interests me more than the one for Hoenn purely because it delves into Kalos's history and lore a lot more.
Things for Team Aqua and Magma start off fairly innocuous, but they rapidly spiral out of control, and it becomes obvious who the bad guys are. On the other hand in Kalos, we are introduced to Lysandre early on as a Kalosian leader and friend of the professor. It's only much later where we see the cracks start to appear that Lysandre reveals himself as "the big bad". It might not come as a shock, but it's certainly an interesting twist that you probably wouldn't expect. It also gives us more questions, like why is the professor friends with such a crazy person? We get the traditional "7th badge escalation" too, where both stories suddenly get a lot more interesting and the player has to dive head first (quite literally in this instance) into resolving the conflicts. Kalos roped me in more because of the backstory and the information that AZ gives you about his own history (and accidental immortality), whereas Hoenn just rolls on with the similar "oh my god the world is going to end" shtick that was new when it first happened (and wasn't exactly improved on in ORAS either). Kalos has a cool resolution, and while ORAS gives a better resolution than the original games, I still think Kalos has the better plot.
DHR-107
This is a hard one, as both Kalos and Hoenn have great characters. With ORAS expanding the admins into being four separate characters and building those up to be very different, and Kalos introducing Lysandre and his squad of minions, a bunch of cool people have arrived. I was especially shocked to see how stoked Malva gets talking to the player after they manage to disband Team Flare... The Gym Leaders in both are fairly different, but you meet half of them outside of their Gyms actually doing something. Grant, Korrina, Clemont, and Wulfric all pop up ahead of your Gym matches (albeit briefly apart from Korrina). While Hoenn has your Dad, Wattson, and Wallace appear outside of their gyms too. Wallace especially helps out with some important plot movements later on...
Outside of those characters, both of the Professors actually have decent screen time and personalities. Birch being his mostly mocked bumbling self, while Sycamore proves to be an adept trainer in a battle with the player. Both games introduce interesting "side characters", whether it be the Winstrates (or Gabby and Ty!) or the snobby owner of Parfum Palace who alludes to dealings with Shabboneau Castle.
With the upgrade to ORAS, I think Hoenn gets the edge here, but Kalos has some brilliant new characters who are believable and interesting too.
DHR-107
I have been a big fan of the Kalos Pokémon since their inception. The only issue is that I don't think enough Pokémon were introduced in Kalos! I understand that a lot of Megas were designed for XY that likely cut into the "total Pokémon cap", but most Mega designs are... extensions of already existing designs. Kalos has some great designs, but when there are so few it's much easier to pick out the bad ones as well. While I'm not a fan of Diggersby's huge hand ears, or Binacle's "angry muffin heads", I find the quality to be better than that of Hoenn. Hoenn gave us a lot of trash Pokémon. Volbeat, Illumise, Luvdisc, Delcatty, Mawile, Sableye, and Nosepass (before the latter three got Megas and an evolution) are more than a handful of Pokémon that would rarely see the light of day even for the most hardcore of fans.
Let's not even get started on Pokémon encounter tables in each of the games (including ORAS)... let's just say that's a very one-sided argument that GameFreak could have rectified and didn't. Kalos has one brief Surfing interlude (three separate species in about ten squares, plus another seven from Rods), while half of Hoenn's map is water and we find... three species (two from the same family) from Surfing and four more with Rods. Things get even more exciting in caves, when they add the ubiquitous Zubat/Golbat to the tables too...
This one deservedly goes to Kalos.
Kris
Both Hoenn and Kalos had great plots, but I personally think Hoenn's better. Don't get me wrong, Kalos introduced a TON of new things into the storyline, but those just don't appeal to me as much as Hoenn's original plot. I'm writing this based off of Ruby / Sapphire / Emerald because those were my favorite iterations of Generation 3.
Anyways, I just loved Hoenn's plot. I find it hilarious how the main character starts off in a moving truck, and believe it or not, I can actually relate to this, mostly because I'm constantly in the back of my parents' cars when there's important stuff back there, because it's my duty to make sure nothing breaks. Back on topic though, I also love just the idea of getting a starter, the trainers, the way of gaining badges, and just the general storyline. All of this just introduces a new sense of adventure that gives me that one feeling to want to keep playing. I love how there are unique items to discover new Pokémon such as Kecleon, and how there are two different bikes to access different parts of the map. It's almost like using a magnifying glass to find little bugs under rocks when I was little and constantly getting new bikes to go on new adventures with my family.
Kris
I'm at a loss here. Both Hoenn and Kalos are very similar in my opinion, as they both have rivals that do similar things, a lot of various companions, similar Gym Leaders, and a lot more. However, I'd probably go with Kalos on this one. Not only does Kalos have more than one rival for the player to battle, you can also battle the Professor! Even after that, I feel like Team Flare's entire plot is way more in depth and descriptive than Team Magma/Aqua's, the way you interact with your rivals is closer than it was with May, the way you battle the Elite Four is more admiring, and just in general the character plot is outstanding..... So I guess I'm not at a loss?
Kris
Again, going with Kalos. Yeah, Kalos introduced the lowest number of Pokémon in any game so far with only 72 new ones, but they also introduced the most influential change in mechanics—Mega Evolution. In general, Kalos has my favorite Pokémon, Noibat, as well as many other cool Pokémon like Diancie, Greninja, Hoopa-U, Xerneas, and Yveltal. Hoenn is cool with its many uniquely designed Pokémon like Solrock and Lunatone, but it just doesn't have that same feel to it as Kalos. Not to mention some Mega Evolutions like Mega Blastoise and Gyarados, as well as some other simplistic and just silly designs like Mega Kangaskhan and Mega Heracross, respectively. But yeah, Kalos.
skylight
Ok, compare a villain trying to wipe out the human race to a team of misguided people trying to remove either the sea or the land. Yeah. There's not much to compare.
In Kalos you're trying to stop Lysandre from unleashing the ultimate weapon—you just don't know it yet. Whereas in Hoenn, you know the good guys and you know the bad guys. You pretty much know what direction the games are heading by the time you explore Petalburg Woods for the first time. However in Kalos it's not so obvious, which I think enhances the plot. You know Lysandre is a bad guy, but your character has no reason to suspect him until its too late. Hoenn did redeem itself in the Delta Episode. When playing through the games you couldn't really tell if Zinnia was good, but with a motive, or bad and as crazy as Lysandre. Turns out she was a bit of both. What a plot twist!
skylight
If Hoenn hadn't have gotten a remake, I would consider this question really unfair (despite writing all the questions). Kalos had an advantage, though. By Generation 6, characters in all games were more fleshed out than their earlier counterparts. Hoenn really brought its characters to life in ORAS. Zinnia, as mentioned in the previous paragraph, is the crazy motivated good girl who you want to support. Steven, despite being the champion of the region, finally got some character and some balls... which he used to give you a Beldum. Despite that, Kalos has to take the win. ORAS couldn't stray too far from the originals, whereas Kalos has free reign. One flaw is that Dianthia, the supposed champion, doesn't seem to appear much, and when she does... she just doesn't matter. By the end of the game, you're given the impression that Korrina is the champion by how often she appears in the game. Hey, if Z ever happens, you just know that's going to happen.
skylight
Let's start off by comparing the number of Pokémon added, 135 and 72. Huge difference, but the question that comes to mind is how much substance was actually included in each Pokedex. Starting at the basics—the starters. Hoenn's starters are definitely inspired. A gecko, a creature that lives in mud, and a fire chick. Now, compare that to those of Kalos—a spiky armadillo, a fire fox, and a frog that blows bubbles. In terms of creativity, we already have a line full of lizards, did we really need a gecko? Oh and Vulpix and Politoed appear to have gained long-lost cousins. Both Hoenn and Kalos missed the creativity mark here.
Legendaries appear to roam the Hoenn region, with Regice, Regirock, Registeel, Jirachi, Deoxys, Rayquaza, Kyogre, and Groudon. You're probably bound to run into a legendary at one point; you can't avoid it. Kalos, up until earlier this month only had access to five legendaries (one of which has one of the ugliest formes in any Pokémon game). Hoenn also has a lot of dex fillers, and although Kalos has questionable designs, it certainly has some of the most unique Pokémon designs in any game.
Steven Stone
From a Hoenn lover and a person that liked the Kalos games, I have got to say that both plots are REALLY weak. Both evil teams (if you could even call them "evil") lack a goal that actually makes sense (because naturally, giving the region with the most sea more water is not something IGN would like. Also, making the world more "beautiful" sounds really subjective) and have leaders that lack a real backstory of why they decided to do what they do in their respective games (especially Archie and Maxie). The main characters also have these friend-like rivals that aren't nearly as relevant as Blue or Hugh, which makes their plot a bit worse than other games. However, between OR/AS's Delta Episode and X/Y's story, I have to pick X/Y, because it has a boss that actually lost their mind. The other bosses looked more like they were trying to accomplish childish dreams.
Steven Stone
Given my previous answer, one would assume I'd say Kalos has them, but I have to give this one to Hoenn. Hoenn features multiple characters that have unique qualities that the previous characters didn't have. First of all, we have Professor Birch. Besides being a caring father, Birch is a Pokémon Professor who actually LOVES field work. You can see him in Ruby and Sapphire often doing research in Route 101. These qualities weren't seen in either Professor Oak, who forgets his own grandson's name, and Elm, which you guys already know. Then we have May/Brendan, who doesn't really care much about their own goals and is happy just helping their father and the protagonist.
Then we have Wally, who is possibly the best character from Hoenn. You know him as a very weak and sickly boy. You help him (more like watch him but the people in the game INSIST that you helped him) catch his first Pokémon, and then he disappears for a bit. Next thing you know, he is trying to challenge the Mauville City Gym because he is confident enough, but his uncle then asks you to show the boy how the real world is. You proceed to beat him, and instead of starting crying, he takes it as a message that he has to become stronger, stronger than even you. That's the last you know of him for quite a while. The last time you see Wally is in Victory Road, and if the music that sounds in OR/AS wasn't convincing enough, he is ready to face you, to defeat you. From a very weak kid to the strong boy you meet at Victory Road, Wally is, in my opinion, the most changed character in all of Pokémon's history, and Wally alone allows me to take this choice. I could keep going on with characters like Wallace, Zinnia, Maxie, Archie, Norman, and even myself, but Wally alone proves that Hoenn has the most interesting characters.
Steven Stone
Is that a serious question? Hoenn by far. Not only it introduced like, a lot of more new Pokémon than Kalos ever did, but also their Pokémon were kind of cool and memorable. Iconic Pokémon of the region such as Flygon, Gardevoir, Milotic, Swellow, Salamence, Metagross, and some others, they didn't get in the memory of the players because of how good competitive-wise they are, like many of the iconic Kalos Pokémon (Aegislash, Talonflame, to name a few), but because they were so attractive design-wise that they just attracted a lot of kids to having them in their team. Sure, Kalos introduced Mega Evolved Pokémon, but so did OR/AS. Hoenn Pokémon are deep in the memory of many players of any ages, and I remember them every day I play Pokémon.
Join us soon for Sinnoh vs. Unova!
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