Most Generation PRNG Help / Information

[ΩDonut]

So this is method j? In method J do you have to scent a pokemon at all?
If not, can someone point me to the right directions. Thanks.

That's one set of directions. There are other ways of accomplishing basically the same thing. I just prefer scenting first over this method

Can anyone list the steps, simplified, of what you do in method J?

Method J isn't the process of targeting particular Pokemon. It's the method the game uses to generate Pokemon, like Methods 1, 2, and 3.

 

[RCrayons]

So yeah, I want to finish my BP Shiny, but keep getting taps I cant count. Has anyone found a method to make this easier? This would be insanely helpful.

 

[Tase]

So yeah, I want to finish my BP Shiny, but keep getting taps I cant count. Has anyone found a method to make this easier? This would be insanely helpful.

mingot may have a spread sheet (or something of the like) to help when he updates RNG Reporter. Like what he did for Method J kind of.

Trust me I know it sucks, I've been at it for 3 days >.<

 

[LightningFusion]

Omega, a question on your targeting method J frames. So you scent a pokemon, then get the seed and make the list. Then following this part:

target frame - (offset + 8)

Will get you the target frame? Because me and several other people have found that the offset jumps after you catch one pokemon. If you sweet scent twice in a row, the next pokemon is not always the next one. Ex
First SS Frame - Second SS Frame
7 - 19
7 - 69
7 - 75

Have you actually tested your method to get a target frame on a wild pokemon?

 

[Mario With Lasers]

It's probably easier to just kill it the first time around and then catch it in Turnback Cave.

May be, but I prefer to advance 12 by 12 in Distortion World than 2 by 2 with the Journal.

Additionally, can Zapdos appear anywhere there's tall grass, or only on numbered routes? Because Valley Windworks Zapdos would be oh so cool.

I've seen the birds on Valley Windworks and Fuego Ironrworks at the map, but never managed to catch them there. And it's a pity that there's no non-route cool place for Articuno =(


Anyway, what I found interesting with O-Tina is that it advances as much frames as it has by default (12). If roaming pokémon increase the default frame by 1, what would happen if all five were released? 6 as frame? And maybe changing maps as I did would increase by 6 every time? I must test it... Once I catch O-Tina and beat the E4.

 

[Pokerealm]

It's probably easier to just kill it the first time around and then catch it in Turnback Cave.

Also, what's the trick for hunting down and catching Cresselia? I seem to have forgotten how to do it.
Additionally, can Zapdos appear anywhere there's tall grass, or only on numbered routes? Because Valley Windworks Zapdos would be oh so cool.

-Save in front of her, reset and release her.
-Have a lvl 15-49 Pokemon with you.
-Have some Repels.
-Fly to Floaroma and open the marking map.
-Bike between Route 205 (South) and Valley Windworks, untill it appears on the route you're on.
-Have the 15-49 poke in front of your team, use a repel, and there you go :p

 

[General Tso]

Alright so I found a pretty decent Shiny Azelf spread with offset 249. I've been reading the OP and the thread and from what I understand, I'd do this:

249-1 = 248

I could walk 31744 steps or go to a journal page 62 times.

Btw, the RNG only advances if I turn to the page with the "caught pokemon" right? I would turn it to that page, turn to another page without "caught pokemon" and turn it back to the former page again?

 

[LightningFusion]

Alright so I found a pretty decent Shiny Azelf spread with offset 249. I've been reading the OP and the thread and from what I understand, I'd do this:

249-1 = 248

I could walk 31744 steps or go to a journal page 62 times.

Btw, the RNG only advances if I turn to the page with the "caught pokemon" right? I would turn it to that page, turn to another page without "caught pokemon" and turn it back to the former page again?

how did you get 62 for the journal? It should be 248/2 which is 124. Every time you see caught pokemon, that is +2. If you get to pages in a row with caught pokemon, that is better because you can do it faster.

 

[General Tso]

how did you get 62 for the journal? It should be 248/2 which is 124. Every time you see caught pokemon, that is +2. If you get to pages in a row with caught pokemon, that is better because you can do it faster.

Woops, my bad, I divided by 4, but that's the general thing right? I'm gonna go test it

 

[The Giritina-man]

Is the Journal important? Yes or no? Cause when I do the mad tapping when I start the game after turning the DS off (somehow hit gets me 620's everytime), I'm supposed to let the Journal show?

 

[ΩDonut]

Omega, a question on your targeting method J frames. So you scent a pokemon, then get the seed and make the list. Then following this part:

target frame - (offset + 8)

Will get you the target frame? Because me and several other people have found that the offset jumps after you catch one pokemon. If you sweet scent twice in a row, the next pokemon is not always the next one. Ex
First SS Frame - Second SS Frame
7 - 19
7 - 69
7 - 75

Have you actually tested your method to get a target frame on a wild pokemon?

Hm. Maybe I should have said "Get the offset from the Seed Finder", to avoid confusing people. Yeah, sorry everyone - I forgot to mention that really important part. >.>

58140262 is the seed that contains a shiny Azelf I've been trying for. When I Scent outside its cave, a Psyduck appears. This Psyduck, for me, always is the one in frame 3. Yet, if you enter its IVs in the Seed Finder, it will tell you the offset is 8. This is the offset I'm referring to.

If the seed is slightly different - say, 57140262 - the offset listed in the Seed Finder for that seed's frame 3 Psyduck is 4.

 

[Shelcario]

OmegaDonut could you explain to me how to use method j to find a shiny legend spread?

 

[LightningFusion]

Hm. Maybe I should have said "Get the offset from the Seed Finder", to avoid confusing people.

58140262 is the seed that contains a shiny Azelf I've been trying for. When I Scent outside its cave, a Psyduck appears. This Psyduck, for me, always is the one in frame 3. Yet, if you enter its IVs in the Seed Finder, it will tell you the offset is 8. This is the offset I'm referring to.

Yeah, sorry everyone - I forgot to mention that really important part. >.>

Ok, so that's interesting. So, when you get that psyduck, you get that shiny azelf. Where do you scent for it? In a patch/on a water, because wouldn't walking to the cave advance the seed or do you account for that already?

 

[ΩDonut]

Ok, so that's interesting. So, when you get that psyduck, you get that shiny azelf. Where do you scent for it? In a patch/on a water, because wouldn't walking to the cave advance the seed or do you account for that already?

That's what the +8 is for. I didn't count up the steps, though; I just tested it by catching a Psyduck, finding the offset and then walking directly to Azelf's cave. That's when I noticed the Azelf's frames were always equal to the Psyduck's offset + 8.

OmegaDonut could you explain to me how to use method j to find a shiny legend spread?

I'm working on a guide for this at the moment, just killing time before I go see the Star Trek movie.

 

[mingot]

Heh.

MEMO - What you get in the initial seed finder is called the offset. What you get when you generate is called a frame. I used these terms interchangeably (because they ARE related) in the past both here in the OP and in RNG Reporter. I have updated the OP to call the offset the Frame and have done the same for RNG Reporter. Hopefully it catches on so we can avoid the mass confusion going forward.

The state of confusion up to this point is my fault, hopefully I can "fix" it.

Now ... It's bizarre that the psyduck always has an offset of 8 in the seed finder. Or do you mean it's only 8 if you perfectly hit your seed? It should really vary wildly as the offset is the measure of RNG calls between seed and capture. The reason this varies is because of the way method J gets an RNG result and then calculates a nature and then seeks forward looking for a matching Method 1 Frame. Anyway, it's always 8 when you perfectly hit your target right?

Now the next thing that is curious is that you're getting what our initial research indicated. That is, that the RNG is rewound after a battle so that the effect of scenting should be +8 to the RNG. Enough people tested this later and said that it was not true that I've been pretty confused about what is going on. I guess I will have to check into it some and see if I can figure out what is going on if you guys don't work it out amongst yourselves.

^^ me being dumb above :)

 

[TDS]

Sorry for the confusion mingot, but I was only asking about offset because I can never hit the frame i want, I can hit the seconds and delay at will

 

[ΩDonut]

I think what's even more bizarre is that this offset (of the Scented Psyduck) changes from seed to seed. In my shiny Azelf seed it's 8, one second prior it's 4, and if I hit the delay just slightly late it's 84.

I should also clarify: no matter what seed I hit, the Psyduck's stats are always that of frame 3. For now. It might change if I resave again.

 

[mingot]

Sorry for the confusion mingot, but I was only asking about offset because I can never hit the frame i want, I can hit the seconds and delay at will

It's not your fault it's mine for not having a proper naming convention and sorta letting "offset" sneak in as a synonym for "frame".

I think what's even more bizarre is that this offset (of the Scented Psyduck) changes from seed to seed. In my shiny Azelf seed it's 8, one second prior it's 4, and if I hit the delay just slightly late it's 84.

I should also clarify: no matter what seed I hit, the Psyduck's stats are always that of frame 3. For now. It might change if I resave again.

It all actually makes good sense.

Offset != frame (kinda is, but...).

Offset is the number of raw RNG calls between seed and the PID/IV RNG calls.

Frame is the Method J frame.

For Method J here is how a sequence of RNG calls might go in pseudo code:

rng(1): hey what nature should we give the user? adamant!
rng(2): hey, is that adamant? nah it's timid, keep looking.
rng(3): hey, is that adamant? nah it's modest, keep looking.
rng(4): hey, is that adamant? nah it's bashful, keep looking.
rng(5): hey, is that adamant? nah it's naughty, keep looking.
rng(6): hey, is that adamant? nah it's timid, keep looking.
rng(7): hey, is that adamant? nah it's jolly, keep looking.
rng(8): hey, is that adamant? nah it's rash, keep looking.
rng(9): hey, is that adamant? nah it's mild, keep looking.
rng(10): hey, is that adamant? YES!

SO the initial seed finder shows an offset of 10.
Generated Method J shows frame 1.

This is why the offset can jump all over the place, but your frame number should be steady.

EDIT: AH. Understand why what you are doing works well and what I was doing wrong when giving research tasks on this. Short version is yay, we'll be able to use scenting to rapidly advance the RNG. I will explain what is at work and how we can use subsequent scentings to keep going tommorow after I have had some sleep. Been a long day.

 

[TDS]

So the time finder uses the frame? Is there anyway to find the frame or attempt to manipulate it?

 

[LightningFusion]

Just want to say that the guide is great omega. It works perfectly.

 

[RCrayons]

So yeah, I'm going to try this Calibration thing. For the record, I sent my friend a text that screams "I'MA FIRIN MAH LAZAR" for the heck of it. :D But yeah, if I can get this thing down, it would be amazing, cause then I could breed stuff better than I can now and actually get my showdown team (not that I'd be going)

EDIT: I love Excel. I'm putting together a page that will help me with calibration. It averages all my numbers for me so I have to do nothing at all math-wise. Hoorah!

EDIT2: LOL I just caught a 31/26/30/27/29/3 Banette! This would be awesome for a TR Wall if it didnt have such sucky defenses.

 

[Syberia]

Do journal taps not work with Cresselia? Because I just did enough of them to get to offset 330, and wound up with offset 6.

EDIT: Hmm, apparently viewing a journal page that says I got DITTO in a wifi trade, even though it shows DITTO, does not advance my seed. But the page saying WOBBUFFET was caught does.

 

[VileTung]

Do journal taps not work with Cresselia? Because I just did enough of them to get to offset 330, and wound up with offset 6.

EDIT: Hmm, apparently viewing a journal page that says I got DITTO in a wifi trade, even though it shows DITTO, does not advance my seed. But the page saying WOBBUFFET was caught does. I had the same problem. I think you haven't saw my post about this in this thread =P

 

[Supe]

I need some quick help. I'm saved in the Heatran room. I SR'ed and used Syberia's coin flip trick and have now verified that I have hit the right seed. So here's my situation:

• I have the right syncher in the lead
• I have 5 pokes in my party
• My Offset is 922

I really don't wanna mess this up, so here are my questions:

1. Switching to the step counter will NOT affect anything right?
2. If I open my journal and there is a poke listed on the first page that comes up, does that count as a "flip"?
3. Since my offset is even, I have to walk 128 steps to advance my frame by 5 (the number of pokes in my party)?
4. Soooo...this my calculation:
   • Offset = 922
   • Walking = -5
   • Heatran = -1
   • 922 - 5 - 1 = 916
   • Divide by 2 to get journal flips:
   • 916 / 2 = 458 flips?

 

[LightningFusion]

Do journal taps not work with Cresselia? Because I just did enough of them to get to offset 330, and wound up with offset 6.

EDIT: Hmm, apparently viewing a journal page that says I got DITTO in a wifi trade, even though it shows DITTO, does not advance my seed. But the page saying WOBBUFFET was caught does.

Yeah, it's only pokemon caught that advances it. Nothing else is known to.