Hi everyone :)
Before I get into gen 5 I wanted to post at least one decent full stall team and get some advice, since its not my best play style atm. This team is easily my best stall team ever and has given me a lot of success on PokemonOnline (when I'm not "disconnected from server" which is most of the time =P ). Its named after this game my friend from England came up with, Conkers, which is apparently normally played with chestnuts, but which involves tying string to two plastic Forretress toys and smashing them into each other(that's English people for you).
Anyway, I still have problems with a couple of pokemon which I'd like advice on. In short, then, here's the team:
Pretty standard right? The initial idea of the team was for Rotom to set up screens to allow me to lay down hazards more easily, which, um, didn't work, so Rotom went scarfed to help deal with NP Infernape. I also wanted to try a specially defensive Heatran alongside Forretress and the rest of the team unfolded naturally from there.
Right, so, the individual team members. Hippowdon and Swampert are the two standard leads on full stall, and I've used both, but I always come back to Hippo for a couple of reasons. Most importantly, he gets Slack Off, which is incredibly important. Against offensive and balanced teams, his ability to wall and pp stall almost endlessly is incredibly valuable. He also has a bit of extra bulk over Swampert on the physical side, as well as an equally good typing to Swampert IMO. Sandstream is also really useful against opposing weather teams. \
Edit: Changed to a lead Gliscor
Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Roar
Hippowdon allows me to handle virtually every opposing lead alongside my team mates. Machamp is pretty easy to deal with, since I can safely switch between Hippo and Gyarados to reduce his damage to a pitiable amount. Taunt leads, particularly Azelf, are slightly more complicated and unpredictable. I usually switch to Heatran in anticipation of the Taunt, Lava Plume once while they set up SR, and then switch straight to Rotom-W and hope they Explode. This sequence also acts as a safety net against random LO Azelf with Grass Knot. I can do the same thing against Aerodactyl, but he's less of an issue due to the lack of Explosion. Celebi leads, especially Occa Berry types which are getting more popular, are the only ones which can delay Stealth Rock for any length of time. Most don't have HP Fire, so I can scout with Forretress and Blissey until I'm sure and then use it as set up fodder.
The EV spread is a bit weird but I prefer it (I think it was inspired by Kevin G's Hippowdon lead) to the standard physically defensive set. The only times I find myself missing the defense is against Gallade and Hariyama leads, which I can work around with Gyarados anyway, and the occasional DD Tyranitar (which I'm still safe against if I'm on full HP or it doesn't have Life Orb). Meanwhile, this spread lets me beat threats like SubSplit Gengar comfortably while still giving me a back up pseudohazer for Zapdos and the like. Speaking of pseudohazing, my last couple of defensive teams have all had at least two phazers, and this one has three; Hippowdon, Gyarados, and Heatran. While they're valuable for getting rid of offensive threats, spreading hazard damage and so on, they also prevent stat uppers from setting up on me if I lack a suitable counter.
I'd also like to give props to Hippowdon, alongside Blissey, for winning me the biggest PP stall war I've ever been in: Hippowdon and Blissey vs the other guy's Rotom-A and Blissey, which finally finished when Rotom struggled itself to death on turn 140 :)
Spinblocking is always necessary, which basically equates to Rotom-A being necessary. Like I mentioned at the start, I was originally running a Dual Screen set with Discharge and Shadow Ball, which was okay but not great. In general, the battles where I actually had time to use Screens, then manage to set up a couple of times with Forretress, I was going to win anyway. Plus, Light Screen doesn't make much difference to Forretress when most teams have at least one special Fire attack. Basically, Screens was a bad idea, so Scarf Rotom-A was in to help with Infernape (which as you can probably see could literally sweep the entire team previously with a NPlot + Grass Knot set). He also helps with problematic Dragonite and Starmie more than a defensive set.
Edit: Changed to a RestTalk set with Reflect/Thunderbolt courtesy of Smith
Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Trick
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
Right, so, this isn't the Scarf set from the analysis. Hydro Pump, Thunderbolt and Trick are pretty obvious choices which cover a lot of threats, including helping against opposing stall. HP Ice I consider to be much more useful for this team than Shadow Ball though. Barring unlucky crits or stat lowers, I have Gengar covered pretty well already. What I don't like facing are Dragonite, particularly since both Hippowdon and Forretress run SpDef sets and therefore don't appreciate Outrage, and HP Ice helps mitigate this problem.
Rotom is also valuable for opposing British Gliscor :) and Taunt Gyarados. If I haven't seen a Spinner and its obvious my opponent doesn't have one, I usually feel comfortable using Rotom to eliminate Gyarados. Otherwise, its not usually that difficult to get rid of most Gyarados between my own's Intimidate and Forretress.
The EV's are necessary, and I don't lose any crucial KO's. HP Ice does 74.6-88.1% to 252 HP Dragonite, an easy KO after SR and sandstorm. I'm still assured of an OHKO against LO Starmie, while it's Hydro Pump does 78% max.
This is a stall team, and this is a Blissey. There really isn't any alternative to her, unfortunately. This team handles the few special attackers which can give her trouble pretty effectively between the pseudohazers and hazards, while Blissey provides a number of "services" *whore* in return as well as walling most special threats.
Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Def / 252 SDef / 4 Spe
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Softboiled
- Heal Bell
- Seismic Toss
- Thunder Wave
This is an unusual moveset but its personally my favourite for Blissey to use. The Cleric set leaves stall somewhat exposed in my experience to things like Infernape which you rely largely on Gyarados to defeat, while also simply limiting the survivability of every member. WishBliss can't get rid of status which is unacceptable, so combining Heal Bell and Wish is natural. The only things this negatively impacts against are things like SubPetaya Empoleon and Flash Fire boosted Heatran, however I don't see these as particular threats. Empoleon is easy to phaze depending on its last move, and can't set up against anything on my team bar Forretress (which can Explode if I'm desperate anyway) while the only Fire attack on my team comes from my own SpDef Heatran. Basically, if my Heatran has upwards of 84% HP, its impossible for an opposing 252 SpA Heatran to KO with Earth Power. Choice Specs is ridiculously powerful but very easy to handle, and only LO poses some kind of threat, although if I get really desperate I can PP stall it with Gyarados, Blissey and Heatran (Timid LO Tran's Fire Blast with Flash Fire maxes at 48.7% vs Blissey anyway).
Calm Mind Jirachi, SubCharge Rotom, and SubSplit Gengar are basically the only common special sets which can get past Blissey 1 on 1 if Toxic Spikes are down, all of which are handled pretty comfortably by Hippowdon. Bizarrely enough, I ran into a Sub-NastyPlot Mismagius which is actually pretty difficult to deal with but that's not exactly on every team.
Toxic Spikes are necessary for this team, particularly for Shaymin/Celebi. Roserade doesn’t fill a necessary ‘place’ other than Spiking on stall teams I’ve used, same with Tentacruel apart from beating Infernape, and other options like Cloyster are generally worse, so Forretress was in. He also gives me Rapid Spin to accommodate Gyarados, Explosion, and obviously a strong physical wall combined with Blissey’s Wish support. Forretress’ synergy with Heatran is superb; most of the pokemon he lures in can be dealt with easily by Heatran apart from opposing LO Heatran and Infernape, while Forretress also gives me a last ditch method of removing pokemon which I can’t handle through Explosion.
Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Payback
- Rapid Spin
Forretress is probably the most important member of the team. The set is a basic Specially Defensive Forretress except that I run both Spikes instead of the usual 1 Spikes, Rapid Spin, and two other attacks. The hazard support is completely essential, while Gyarados, who is probably my most important team member in terms of not getting swept, can’t function while SR is down on my side of the field. Max special defense I consider much more important than physical defense simply because against most opponents, they enable me to get a lot more hazards. Forretress is naturally a great physical wall even without EV support, especially with its typing, and equally, most opponents won’t attempt to break down Forretress’ defense with neutral physical attacks because they know a physical Forretress will laugh at them (and it likely won’t be more than a graze on specially defensive Forry’s hard exterior anyway).
Explosion over Payback is a personal choice, but I always prefer to avoid giving the opponent a pile of set up fodder. Beyond that, it makes dealing with most physical threats much easier late game, such as Gyarados. Meanwhile, most of my team can easily deal with Rotom forms, and keeping Forretress healthy is more important than weakening the anti-spinner.
The special defense focus allows Forretress to set up without concern against bulky waters, and my personal favourite, defensive Rotom forms. Barring Rotom-H, most of which don’t run Overheat anyway, non-Specs/LO Rotom is set up fodder for a couple of turns; at the end of which I can switch into Heatran or Blissey and at some point, if needed, bring Forry back to health.
There are a couple of things the defense would be more useful for, although obviously I prefer the benefits of my current EV’s. Dragon’s are the most notable; Dragonite is one of the most significant threats to my team, and CB sets in particular are a huge problem for me to face. Kingdra, too, but Kingdra’s Outrage’s are comparatively weak and I can play him around more easily with Gyarados. Usually I have to switch to Gyarados, forcing the Outrage, and then go to Forretress (I actually often Explode on Dragonite, just to get rid of the threat, unless I have a clear lack of layers, or the other guy has like an Infernape and there’s still SR on my side).
The immunity to Toxic also helps me get around Gliscor, who seems to always carry his stallbreaker set and can be an utter menace if he manages to land Toxic on Rotom. Basically, I have to Intimidate stall it between Gyarados and Forretress until Earthquake’s pp goes, which is decent if I’m at full health, but late in a battle is not always possible.
Like I said at the start , Forretress is ridiculously vital to the team being successful, particularly against other semi-stall / stall teams. I usually have to keep it alive, particularly against spike-stacking teams, but against offensive teams options open up and I normally let it go boom after a decent number of hazards are set up.
I’ve never used Heatran on full stall before, but it is incredibly effective, as well as providing a safety net against Jirachi and Skarmory. It’s a superb Toxic and Burn spreader while forcing a vast number of switches between its good offense and Roar.
Edit: Changed to a ScarfTar
Heatran (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Roar
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Earth Power
This is basically an amazing set and has on many occasions been the MVP. It’s the specially defensive set from the analysis except I use Toxic over Protect, which allows me to spread an absurd amount of poison throughout the opponents team. With no investment Heatran hits 297 attack which is still enough to severely hurt any Steel type, and most neutral switches, meaning that the opponent often has little choice but to switch in waters and risk Toxic / Spikes. Lava Plume > Flamethrower for the burn chance against Rotom, Zapdos, Gyarados, Tyranitar and so on, as well as the substantially higher PP which can be useful. Earth Power is essential, particularly for beating opposing Heatran. I can easily survive unboosted variants Earth Powers and KO back; although Blissey will usually be my first switch in, if they switched in on Lava Plume or I suspect they have Explosion Heatran generally takes them out.
To give you an idea of the extreme special bulk this thing has, Choice Specs Jolteon’s Thunderbolt does 37.3 – 43.8%. That’s just ridiculous. It allows Heatran to act as bait for opposing Shaymin and the like to try and Earth Power you, which even with Life Orb can’t OHKO. Heatran also synergises nicely with Forretress and Gyarados, who can generally handle most of the threats which will force Heatran out.
Finally, we have Gyarados. Intimidate is the most ridiculous ability on Gyarados and this set maximizes physical bulkiness to act as a hard stop, often together with Hippowdon or Forretress, to most physical sweepers.
Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 156 Def / 96 SDef / 8 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Rest
- Waterfall
- Sleep Talk
- Roar
Gyarados handles most of the physical attackers which I have to deal with Intimidate and great typing. Lucario in particular can break stall with its ridiculously powerful attacks but has no chance of hurting Gyarados bar Stone Edge (which is extremely uncommon). I can also get past SD Infernape a lot of the time (without going to Rotom, which is a) risky unless I let something die first, and b), relies on an 80% accurate Hydro Pump if he’s on good HP, and c), means I’ll be Choice locked into a weak attack). I switch in Gyarados and they Swords Dance, then I can go to Hippowdon to take Stone Edge, and alternate with some good / lucky prediction to take it down. Gyarados also makes it possible for me to beat SubDD Kingdra, and Kingdra and Dragonite in general, since at worst I can Intimidate them and force Outrage.
Gyarados also has to handle Breloom, unfortunately. Depending on the stage of the game, I can either take the sleep with it, or with something else and then bring it in, while Blissey makes the sleep temporary. More recently I’ve been using it as my second switch in to Heatran as I’ve lost Blissey a few times to the other guy predicting her switch and Exploding.
Right, so, that’s it. I think this is a pretty solid team but I have huge problems with opposing stall, and most particularly, Rapid Spin Starmie with Recover. Theoretically I can get around it with Rotom and Blissey’s Wish support but whatever comes in on the Choice locked Rotom is going to deal more damage to me every time than I did to it, meaning eventually I’m forced to let it die. The team also has some other problems, such as Leech Seed Shaymin and the like, which I need some help dealing with.
Any suggestions on how to improve the team would be very appreciated :) Just to make it easier for you, here’s the team again so you don’t have to scroll all the way up to the top :)
Before I get into gen 5 I wanted to post at least one decent full stall team and get some advice, since its not my best play style atm. This team is easily my best stall team ever and has given me a lot of success on PokemonOnline (when I'm not "disconnected from server" which is most of the time =P ). Its named after this game my friend from England came up with, Conkers, which is apparently normally played with chestnuts, but which involves tying string to two plastic Forretress toys and smashing them into each other(that's English people for you).
Anyway, I still have problems with a couple of pokemon which I'd like advice on. In short, then, here's the team:
Pretty standard right? The initial idea of the team was for Rotom to set up screens to allow me to lay down hazards more easily, which, um, didn't work, so Rotom went scarfed to help deal with NP Infernape. I also wanted to try a specially defensive Heatran alongside Forretress and the rest of the team unfolded naturally from there.
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Right, so, the individual team members. Hippowdon and Swampert are the two standard leads on full stall, and I've used both, but I always come back to Hippo for a couple of reasons. Most importantly, he gets Slack Off, which is incredibly important. Against offensive and balanced teams, his ability to wall and pp stall almost endlessly is incredibly valuable. He also has a bit of extra bulk over Swampert on the physical side, as well as an equally good typing to Swampert IMO. Sandstream is also really useful against opposing weather teams. \
Edit: Changed to a lead Gliscor
Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Roar
Hippowdon allows me to handle virtually every opposing lead alongside my team mates. Machamp is pretty easy to deal with, since I can safely switch between Hippo and Gyarados to reduce his damage to a pitiable amount. Taunt leads, particularly Azelf, are slightly more complicated and unpredictable. I usually switch to Heatran in anticipation of the Taunt, Lava Plume once while they set up SR, and then switch straight to Rotom-W and hope they Explode. This sequence also acts as a safety net against random LO Azelf with Grass Knot. I can do the same thing against Aerodactyl, but he's less of an issue due to the lack of Explosion. Celebi leads, especially Occa Berry types which are getting more popular, are the only ones which can delay Stealth Rock for any length of time. Most don't have HP Fire, so I can scout with Forretress and Blissey until I'm sure and then use it as set up fodder.
The EV spread is a bit weird but I prefer it (I think it was inspired by Kevin G's Hippowdon lead) to the standard physically defensive set. The only times I find myself missing the defense is against Gallade and Hariyama leads, which I can work around with Gyarados anyway, and the occasional DD Tyranitar (which I'm still safe against if I'm on full HP or it doesn't have Life Orb). Meanwhile, this spread lets me beat threats like SubSplit Gengar comfortably while still giving me a back up pseudohazer for Zapdos and the like. Speaking of pseudohazing, my last couple of defensive teams have all had at least two phazers, and this one has three; Hippowdon, Gyarados, and Heatran. While they're valuable for getting rid of offensive threats, spreading hazard damage and so on, they also prevent stat uppers from setting up on me if I lack a suitable counter.
I'd also like to give props to Hippowdon, alongside Blissey, for winning me the biggest PP stall war I've ever been in: Hippowdon and Blissey vs the other guy's Rotom-A and Blissey, which finally finished when Rotom struggled itself to death on turn 140 :)
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Spinblocking is always necessary, which basically equates to Rotom-A being necessary. Like I mentioned at the start, I was originally running a Dual Screen set with Discharge and Shadow Ball, which was okay but not great. In general, the battles where I actually had time to use Screens, then manage to set up a couple of times with Forretress, I was going to win anyway. Plus, Light Screen doesn't make much difference to Forretress when most teams have at least one special Fire attack. Basically, Screens was a bad idea, so Scarf Rotom-A was in to help with Infernape (which as you can probably see could literally sweep the entire team previously with a NPlot + Grass Knot set). He also helps with problematic Dragonite and Starmie more than a defensive set.
Edit: Changed to a RestTalk set with Reflect/Thunderbolt courtesy of Smith
Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Trick
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
Right, so, this isn't the Scarf set from the analysis. Hydro Pump, Thunderbolt and Trick are pretty obvious choices which cover a lot of threats, including helping against opposing stall. HP Ice I consider to be much more useful for this team than Shadow Ball though. Barring unlucky crits or stat lowers, I have Gengar covered pretty well already. What I don't like facing are Dragonite, particularly since both Hippowdon and Forretress run SpDef sets and therefore don't appreciate Outrage, and HP Ice helps mitigate this problem.
Rotom is also valuable for opposing British Gliscor :) and Taunt Gyarados. If I haven't seen a Spinner and its obvious my opponent doesn't have one, I usually feel comfortable using Rotom to eliminate Gyarados. Otherwise, its not usually that difficult to get rid of most Gyarados between my own's Intimidate and Forretress.
The EV's are necessary, and I don't lose any crucial KO's. HP Ice does 74.6-88.1% to 252 HP Dragonite, an easy KO after SR and sandstorm. I'm still assured of an OHKO against LO Starmie, while it's Hydro Pump does 78% max.
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This is a stall team, and this is a Blissey. There really isn't any alternative to her, unfortunately. This team handles the few special attackers which can give her trouble pretty effectively between the pseudohazers and hazards, while Blissey provides a number of "services" *whore* in return as well as walling most special threats.
Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Def / 252 SDef / 4 Spe
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Softboiled
- Heal Bell
- Seismic Toss
- Thunder Wave
This is an unusual moveset but its personally my favourite for Blissey to use. The Cleric set leaves stall somewhat exposed in my experience to things like Infernape which you rely largely on Gyarados to defeat, while also simply limiting the survivability of every member. WishBliss can't get rid of status which is unacceptable, so combining Heal Bell and Wish is natural. The only things this negatively impacts against are things like SubPetaya Empoleon and Flash Fire boosted Heatran, however I don't see these as particular threats. Empoleon is easy to phaze depending on its last move, and can't set up against anything on my team bar Forretress (which can Explode if I'm desperate anyway) while the only Fire attack on my team comes from my own SpDef Heatran. Basically, if my Heatran has upwards of 84% HP, its impossible for an opposing 252 SpA Heatran to KO with Earth Power. Choice Specs is ridiculously powerful but very easy to handle, and only LO poses some kind of threat, although if I get really desperate I can PP stall it with Gyarados, Blissey and Heatran (Timid LO Tran's Fire Blast with Flash Fire maxes at 48.7% vs Blissey anyway).
Calm Mind Jirachi, SubCharge Rotom, and SubSplit Gengar are basically the only common special sets which can get past Blissey 1 on 1 if Toxic Spikes are down, all of which are handled pretty comfortably by Hippowdon. Bizarrely enough, I ran into a Sub-NastyPlot Mismagius which is actually pretty difficult to deal with but that's not exactly on every team.
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Toxic Spikes are necessary for this team, particularly for Shaymin/Celebi. Roserade doesn’t fill a necessary ‘place’ other than Spiking on stall teams I’ve used, same with Tentacruel apart from beating Infernape, and other options like Cloyster are generally worse, so Forretress was in. He also gives me Rapid Spin to accommodate Gyarados, Explosion, and obviously a strong physical wall combined with Blissey’s Wish support. Forretress’ synergy with Heatran is superb; most of the pokemon he lures in can be dealt with easily by Heatran apart from opposing LO Heatran and Infernape, while Forretress also gives me a last ditch method of removing pokemon which I can’t handle through Explosion.
Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Payback
- Rapid Spin
Forretress is probably the most important member of the team. The set is a basic Specially Defensive Forretress except that I run both Spikes instead of the usual 1 Spikes, Rapid Spin, and two other attacks. The hazard support is completely essential, while Gyarados, who is probably my most important team member in terms of not getting swept, can’t function while SR is down on my side of the field. Max special defense I consider much more important than physical defense simply because against most opponents, they enable me to get a lot more hazards. Forretress is naturally a great physical wall even without EV support, especially with its typing, and equally, most opponents won’t attempt to break down Forretress’ defense with neutral physical attacks because they know a physical Forretress will laugh at them (and it likely won’t be more than a graze on specially defensive Forry’s hard exterior anyway).
Explosion over Payback is a personal choice, but I always prefer to avoid giving the opponent a pile of set up fodder. Beyond that, it makes dealing with most physical threats much easier late game, such as Gyarados. Meanwhile, most of my team can easily deal with Rotom forms, and keeping Forretress healthy is more important than weakening the anti-spinner.
The special defense focus allows Forretress to set up without concern against bulky waters, and my personal favourite, defensive Rotom forms. Barring Rotom-H, most of which don’t run Overheat anyway, non-Specs/LO Rotom is set up fodder for a couple of turns; at the end of which I can switch into Heatran or Blissey and at some point, if needed, bring Forry back to health.
There are a couple of things the defense would be more useful for, although obviously I prefer the benefits of my current EV’s. Dragon’s are the most notable; Dragonite is one of the most significant threats to my team, and CB sets in particular are a huge problem for me to face. Kingdra, too, but Kingdra’s Outrage’s are comparatively weak and I can play him around more easily with Gyarados. Usually I have to switch to Gyarados, forcing the Outrage, and then go to Forretress (I actually often Explode on Dragonite, just to get rid of the threat, unless I have a clear lack of layers, or the other guy has like an Infernape and there’s still SR on my side).
The immunity to Toxic also helps me get around Gliscor, who seems to always carry his stallbreaker set and can be an utter menace if he manages to land Toxic on Rotom. Basically, I have to Intimidate stall it between Gyarados and Forretress until Earthquake’s pp goes, which is decent if I’m at full health, but late in a battle is not always possible.
Like I said at the start , Forretress is ridiculously vital to the team being successful, particularly against other semi-stall / stall teams. I usually have to keep it alive, particularly against spike-stacking teams, but against offensive teams options open up and I normally let it go boom after a decent number of hazards are set up.
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I’ve never used Heatran on full stall before, but it is incredibly effective, as well as providing a safety net against Jirachi and Skarmory. It’s a superb Toxic and Burn spreader while forcing a vast number of switches between its good offense and Roar.
Edit: Changed to a ScarfTar
Heatran (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Roar
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Earth Power
This is basically an amazing set and has on many occasions been the MVP. It’s the specially defensive set from the analysis except I use Toxic over Protect, which allows me to spread an absurd amount of poison throughout the opponents team. With no investment Heatran hits 297 attack which is still enough to severely hurt any Steel type, and most neutral switches, meaning that the opponent often has little choice but to switch in waters and risk Toxic / Spikes. Lava Plume > Flamethrower for the burn chance against Rotom, Zapdos, Gyarados, Tyranitar and so on, as well as the substantially higher PP which can be useful. Earth Power is essential, particularly for beating opposing Heatran. I can easily survive unboosted variants Earth Powers and KO back; although Blissey will usually be my first switch in, if they switched in on Lava Plume or I suspect they have Explosion Heatran generally takes them out.
To give you an idea of the extreme special bulk this thing has, Choice Specs Jolteon’s Thunderbolt does 37.3 – 43.8%. That’s just ridiculous. It allows Heatran to act as bait for opposing Shaymin and the like to try and Earth Power you, which even with Life Orb can’t OHKO. Heatran also synergises nicely with Forretress and Gyarados, who can generally handle most of the threats which will force Heatran out.
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Finally, we have Gyarados. Intimidate is the most ridiculous ability on Gyarados and this set maximizes physical bulkiness to act as a hard stop, often together with Hippowdon or Forretress, to most physical sweepers.
Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 156 Def / 96 SDef / 8 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Rest
- Waterfall
- Sleep Talk
- Roar
Gyarados handles most of the physical attackers which I have to deal with Intimidate and great typing. Lucario in particular can break stall with its ridiculously powerful attacks but has no chance of hurting Gyarados bar Stone Edge (which is extremely uncommon). I can also get past SD Infernape a lot of the time (without going to Rotom, which is a) risky unless I let something die first, and b), relies on an 80% accurate Hydro Pump if he’s on good HP, and c), means I’ll be Choice locked into a weak attack). I switch in Gyarados and they Swords Dance, then I can go to Hippowdon to take Stone Edge, and alternate with some good / lucky prediction to take it down. Gyarados also makes it possible for me to beat SubDD Kingdra, and Kingdra and Dragonite in general, since at worst I can Intimidate them and force Outrage.
Gyarados also has to handle Breloom, unfortunately. Depending on the stage of the game, I can either take the sleep with it, or with something else and then bring it in, while Blissey makes the sleep temporary. More recently I’ve been using it as my second switch in to Heatran as I’ve lost Blissey a few times to the other guy predicting her switch and Exploding.
Right, so, that’s it. I think this is a pretty solid team but I have huge problems with opposing stall, and most particularly, Rapid Spin Starmie with Recover. Theoretically I can get around it with Rotom and Blissey’s Wish support but whatever comes in on the Choice locked Rotom is going to deal more damage to me every time than I did to it, meaning eventually I’m forced to let it die. The team also has some other problems, such as Leech Seed Shaymin and the like, which I need some help dealing with.
Any suggestions on how to improve the team would be very appreciated :) Just to make it easier for you, here’s the team again so you don’t have to scroll all the way up to the top :)
