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Hoenn 2.0
- Thread starter Stellar
- Start date
I think IcyMan28 brought this up in his wall o' text, but move Base Power changes will definitely affect some things. I was mostly thinking about the buff to Jump Kick/High Jump Kick to have increased power and accuracy, making them easier to use for your run. Depending on which Pokemon get horde encounters (assuming they'll exist in the games), some Pokemon with great Hidden Abilities will be much better.
Shoormish/Breloom - Technician for Bullet Seed, Force Palm, Mach Punch, and Rock Tomb.
Whismur/Loudred/Exploud - Scrappy Boomburst :D.
Roselia/Roserade - Assuming it's available before the National Dex, it can have Technician for boosted Magical Leafs (more PP than Energy Ball and a big middle finger to Sand Attack/Double Team spammers in-game) and Hidden Powers. It get Magical Leaf at level 19 in X and Y, so you can evolve it immediately for a special attacking nuke early.
Cacnea/Cacturne - Water Absorb in a late-game filled with Water-types would be great, especially in AS where you have all the Aqua Grunts. Sucker Punch also helps with their speed issue.
Corpish/Crawdaunt - Adaptability anything is amazing, but it gets Knock Off and Crabhammer.
Kecleon - Protean would actually make it usable for an in-game run.
Shoormish/Breloom - Technician for Bullet Seed, Force Palm, Mach Punch, and Rock Tomb.
Whismur/Loudred/Exploud - Scrappy Boomburst :D.
Roselia/Roserade - Assuming it's available before the National Dex, it can have Technician for boosted Magical Leafs (more PP than Energy Ball and a big middle finger to Sand Attack/Double Team spammers in-game) and Hidden Powers. It get Magical Leaf at level 19 in X and Y, so you can evolve it immediately for a special attacking nuke early.
Cacnea/Cacturne - Water Absorb in a late-game filled with Water-types would be great, especially in AS where you have all the Aqua Grunts. Sucker Punch also helps with their speed issue.
Corpish/Crawdaunt - Adaptability anything is amazing, but it gets Knock Off and Crabhammer.
Kecleon - Protean would actually make it usable for an in-game run.
Corphish would never appear in a Horde, as you could only fish for it in Routes 102, 117, and in Petalburg City. But I think the physical/special split and Knock Off's huge BP buff will suffice for Crawdaunt. Corphish/Crawdaunt will still be too late to take on Flannery's gym, since you don't get the Good Rod by then, but with the buffed Knock Off and physical Crabhammer it will probably rock Tate & Liza's psychic gym almost by itself up until the gym leaders themselves. (it is a double battle, after all) It should also put a considerable dent in Pheobe's team, especially if Game Freak is cruel enough to give her remaining Dusclops (provided it doesn't get replaced) Eviolite, and maybe prevent her Dusknoir from enjoying a Sitrus Berry since I recall all the gym leaders/Elite Four having their Pokemon hold this or Oran Berry in RS. Suffice to say, we can be all but certain that Corphish/Crawdaunt is no longer dead weight for a playthrough.
That said, Sydney gets to enjoy having a MUCH improved Crawdaunt to sic on us, and will more than likely have the moves on hand to take advantage of its new-found strength.
Bullet seed is an egg move, sadly :\ unless Exeggcute/Hoppip somehow ends up in the hoenn dex that's not realistically available in-game. Also, no Spore, unless you're gonna take on Wallace with a Shroomish, so he's not gonna be used at his full potentail at all. That said, Breloom can still be cool, he was already good as a Fighting-type in the original games, Technician would indeed make those moves better and he can now use his Grass STAB to good effect as well (yay Seed Bomb)
It has been confirmed that Maxie and Archie have mega stones in the new Pokemon Get TV episode
Question is are they new megas (I hope they are) or old ones (i.e., mega gyara on archie), or worst yet are they both getting the same shitty mega (mega mightyena...)?
Time will tell, though it most likely will be what we are speculating, Camerupt and Sharpedo
Fair enough, but on that note how are the magma grunts/leaders/admins going to change you think? I would suspect things like crunch on most of the mightyenas (it has it from level 1 now) and possibly cross poison on crobats/golbats, among other things. I personally hope they get larger teams (especially the leaders). At least they should make him have 4 to match lysandre, but I'm hoping for 5 (Pt Cyrus) or even 6 (N/Ghetsis).
It would be interesting to see them with more intricate movepools then the standard level-up things of the past.
I do believe they will make Maxie and Archie more difficult, besides the addition of a mega to their roster.
Quoting myself because it became relevant again. By just gen shifts, Crobat with Acrobatics is likely and will STING. Sharpedo can also be a monster.
I'm so looking forward to visiting Hoenn due to one factor; the physical / special shift. It's revolutionised the game series and I fully expect ORAS to be the best in the series yet. Platinum & HGSS did it in Gen IV, I'm looking to hold ORAS & the likely Z version to the same standard.
Hopefully tutors come back and I hold faint hope for Apricorns too. I can't wait.
Hopefully tutors come back and I hold faint hope for Apricorns too. I can't wait.
Were Items that weren't mega stones ever considered a factor of in-game tiers? Because I'm just thinking - quite a few item changes have happened since Gen 3. Mystic Water and Charcoal and the like have their boosts upgraded from 1.1X to 1.2X, there are more berries now... that sort of thing. Plus with a compoundeyes user like Nincada in the lead, you're more likely to find Light Balls on Pikachu.
Compoundeyes' field effect has been around since Emerald so that isn't too much of a change.
As for the items, there are certainly more options with things like rocky helmet and upgraded type-boost items. Type-resist berries have also made a comeback; here's hoping that ORAS finally gives us access to gems.
As for the items, there are certainly more options with things like rocky helmet and upgraded type-boost items. Type-resist berries have also made a comeback; here's hoping that ORAS finally gives us access to gems.
The problem with this is every Pokemon gets to employ these items, so I can't see it being a factor. While Pikachu does get the benefit of the Light Ball, (and now doubles both offensive stats) Raichu doesn't and I have my doubts how much anyone would want to put up with Pikachu's pathetic defenses longer than they had to.
Never underestimate the power of nostalgia. Also, there are various challenges that can easily force someone into using Pikachu and not let them evolve it into Raichu.
Or they keep Pikachu around because it is the only pokemon sensible enough to wear clothes now (the outfits revealed a few weeks ago). Scrafty and Scraggy don't count. No shoes, no shirt, NO SERVICE!
Doubt the Pika-cosplays have any major battle effect. Unless they are actually made from life fibers...
To answer kurona's question, the only item I see shaking up the in-game tiers is the evolite. There are a couple Hoenn 'mons that benefit, like Roselia and Dusclops. Vigoroth also becomes more viable for those that don't want to deal with Truant Slaking. I'm kind of grasping at straws here though.
I'm now dreaming of Eviolite Vigoroth.
As long as you don't hold an item you can survive a neutral Knock Off and 2HKO with Confusion, luckily Makihita's speed is even worst than Kirlia's
Unfortunately the e4 will be harder
Sydney was previously a walk through but now has physical STABs for absol and mighteyena. Absol can also hit fighting types with play rough or psycho cut - so no more catching a victory road hariyama and sweeping.
Pheobe has been nerfed a bit now that bannette and dusknior cant use physical shadow ball. I know phantum force is a thing but it is easier to predict and switch into a normal type.
Glacia should now have at least 1 frosslass and hopefully something like mamoswine or abomasnow to make here more of a challenge - Unfortunately walrein could have ice body and frosslass could have snow cloak.
Drake will definately be harder now his mons will either spam draco or have dragon dance boosted outrages. Azumarril should be able to destroy it though
Steven should be harder - but due to common weaknesses still fairly easy. Skarmory can use brave bird, claydol will have the same or similar move set, armaldo now gets x-scissor and stronger stone edge or even rock wrecker. Cradily at least has seed bomb or a buffed bp giga drain, aggron might be able to spam rock head head smashes but will die to one hit, maybe just sturdy + normal gem + explosion? Mega metagross might be hard (unlike mega gardevior) as it now gets more physical moves (psychic STAB and elemental punches).
This e4 wont be as easy as before.
I would also like to mention that the useless butterfly's (masquerain and butterfree) wont be as bad now they both get STAB bug buzz and airslash. Quiver dance can also create a sweep late game (possibly vs sydney). Masquerain gets ice beam and scald (now you can use tm's twice, ice beam wont go to your surfer), whilst beautifly gets psychic, giga drain and shadow ball. Dustox has better moves but still too weak.
This is something i'm really excited for as i used to love going through with shitmons (like masquerain) but due to the lack off movepool / stabs they always fall behind and it turns into a hierachy, with a level 65 blazekin and a bunch of lvl40 pokes. (mega's could still sweep through though - i'm guessing megas will be shown at meteor falls, with the poke being absol or mawile/sableye).
Sydney was previously a walk through but now has physical STABs for absol and mighteyena. Absol can also hit fighting types with play rough or psycho cut - so no more catching a victory road hariyama and sweeping.
Pheobe has been nerfed a bit now that bannette and dusknior cant use physical shadow ball. I know phantum force is a thing but it is easier to predict and switch into a normal type.
Glacia should now have at least 1 frosslass and hopefully something like mamoswine or abomasnow to make here more of a challenge - Unfortunately walrein could have ice body and frosslass could have snow cloak.
Drake will definately be harder now his mons will either spam draco or have dragon dance boosted outrages. Azumarril should be able to destroy it though
Steven should be harder - but due to common weaknesses still fairly easy. Skarmory can use brave bird, claydol will have the same or similar move set, armaldo now gets x-scissor and stronger stone edge or even rock wrecker. Cradily at least has seed bomb or a buffed bp giga drain, aggron might be able to spam rock head head smashes but will die to one hit, maybe just sturdy + normal gem + explosion? Mega metagross might be hard (unlike mega gardevior) as it now gets more physical moves (psychic STAB and elemental punches).
This e4 wont be as easy as before.
I would also like to mention that the useless butterfly's (masquerain and butterfree) wont be as bad now they both get STAB bug buzz and airslash. Quiver dance can also create a sweep late game (possibly vs sydney). Masquerain gets ice beam and scald (now you can use tm's twice, ice beam wont go to your surfer), whilst beautifly gets psychic, giga drain and shadow ball. Dustox has better moves but still too weak.
This is something i'm really excited for as i used to love going through with shitmons (like masquerain) but due to the lack off movepool / stabs they always fall behind and it turns into a hierachy, with a level 65 blazekin and a bunch of lvl40 pokes. (mega's could still sweep through though - i'm guessing megas will be shown at meteor falls, with the poke being absol or mawile/sableye).
Speaking about Azumarill... it finally is good in Hoenn! Physical STAB, a nice secondary typing in a game that had very few Poison types and an improved level up movepool - AquaTail on early 20ies, yeah
As a Pokemon in the fast Experience group it does not need to grind much to take on the Elite 4, in case grinding spots don´t get fixed in ORAS.
I have played Emerald before, but I guess with all those changes ORAS will not feel like a Gen3 remake anymore. That makes it a bit sad.
As a Pokemon in the fast Experience group it does not need to grind much to take on the Elite 4, in case grinding spots don´t get fixed in ORAS.
I have played Emerald before, but I guess with all those changes ORAS will not feel like a Gen3 remake anymore. That makes it a bit sad.
In the last few games (XY and BW2), we've had to deal with Azurill and its happiness evolution before getting to use Marill. Hopefully, they don't decide to replace Marill on the route west of Petalburg with Azurill. Having Marill right of the bat will be a huge boon.
Even with Azurill instead of Marill (which I think we all have to admit is pretty likely) the Soothe Bell is only in Slateport City in these games, so if you haven't got your Azurill evolved by then you could just skip Brawly, head over to Slateport do a bit of grinding on the gym trainers and probably have a Marill ready to take on Brawly. This is earlier than in B2W2 games (where it is rare to get a Marill before the 3rd gym) and the 2nd gym is so far away from the first in XY it's not a fair comparison lol.
True, at least for speed and ease.
But there is a downside, we'd miss out on the three free 31 IV's that come with catching pokemon in the "can't breed" egg group.
West of Petalburg? The soonest one could get Marill is west of Mauville. (Route 117) By then I'd think it would be late enough to get Marill (and/or Roselia who's available on that route and has an awesome evolution in Roserade if one isn't using Treecko or Shroomish) without needing to deal with Azurill. (and/or Budew)