It was probably too complicated(for whatever reason) to ban just the formes since they share the same dex number. So they just banned base rotom along with the formes.
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Halloween Party Competition
- Thread starter Age of Kings
- Start date
EnGarde
Not Dead Yet
Battle spot doesn't make distinctions between forms when banning: they just ban the whole pokemon outright. That is, if one form is banned, all forms are banned.
EDIT: You know it's too late to be foruming when you reply to a question that was already answered on the next page. T_T
Rotom is banned because it's Formes share the same PokeDex Number so it's better off Rotom being banned entirely.
252+ SpA Mega Gengar Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Spiritomb: 78-92 (49.6 - 58.5%) -- 98.4% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Spiritomb Sucker Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 144-170 (105.8 - 125%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Not to mention Spiritomb has Infiltrator so Substitute is useless.
I'm trying to figure out way to beat this thing. Burning is the only thing I've come up with right now.
EDIT: Imprison Mega Banette guys! Give it Sucker Punch, Shadow Sneak and Phantom Force and it'll go to town.
OK it has to be careful of Special offensive Spiritombs though. And Spiritomb also gets Imprison too so if it gets that up, you're screwed.
252 SpA Mega Gengar Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Spiritomb: 70-84 (44.5 - 53.5%) -- 27.7% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Mega Gengar Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Spiritomb: 78-92 (49.6 - 58.5%) -- 98.4% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Spiritomb Sucker Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 144-170 (105.8 - 125%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Not to mention Spiritomb has Infiltrator so Substitute is useless.
I'm trying to figure out way to beat this thing. Burning is the only thing I've come up with right now.
EDIT: Imprison Mega Banette guys! Give it Sucker Punch, Shadow Sneak and Phantom Force and it'll go to town.
OK it has to be careful of Special offensive Spiritombs though. And Spiritomb also gets Imprison too so if it gets that up, you're screwed.
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EnGarde
Not Dead Yet
Hey guys, don't forget to take into account the relevant super-effective damage reducing berries, which in this case are Kasib Berries (Ghost Type) and Colbur Berries (Dark Type).
If you need to collect these berries in your game, these are wild encounter berries that you can find on route 20 (Kasib Berry) or on route 18 (Colbur Berry). They both grow on trees with purple berries on them.
What is a wild encounter berry? Sometimes, when you're doing a wild pokemon battle, trees will appear in the background. You can collect berries from those trees! Just have a pokemon that knows either twister, blizzard, or air cutter use that move against the opposing pokemon, and you'll find the berry at the end of the battle when you faint or catch the wild pokemon.
Need help finding a pokemon that knows one of those moves? One option is horsea, which learns twister at level 26. You can catch one at level 25 by using a good rod in Cyllage City or Ambrette Town. They have a 30% encounter rate, so you'll need to be a bit patient!
Also, blizzard is TM14, available for purchase for 70,000 poke-dollars in Anistar City Poke Mart.
If you need to collect these berries in your game, these are wild encounter berries that you can find on route 20 (Kasib Berry) or on route 18 (Colbur Berry). They both grow on trees with purple berries on them.
What is a wild encounter berry? Sometimes, when you're doing a wild pokemon battle, trees will appear in the background. You can collect berries from those trees! Just have a pokemon that knows either twister, blizzard, or air cutter use that move against the opposing pokemon, and you'll find the berry at the end of the battle when you faint or catch the wild pokemon.
Need help finding a pokemon that knows one of those moves? One option is horsea, which learns twister at level 26. You can catch one at level 25 by using a good rod in Cyllage City or Ambrette Town. They have a 30% encounter rate, so you'll need to be a bit patient!
Also, blizzard is TM14, available for purchase for 70,000 poke-dollars in Anistar City Poke Mart.
My comment was in response to Mismagius having Dazzling Gleam, I said it was not really much of a niche because Gengar also gets Dazzling Gleam. Spiritomb OHKO's Mismagius with Sucker Punch too, so really it's bad for both:
252+ Atk Spiritomb Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mismagius: 176-210 (130.3 - 155.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
They're still decent against Sableye but eh
Burning really does hurt, which is why I'm thinking Chandelure will be a good teammate to take those Will-o-Wisps. Sableye can take most of Spiritomb's attacks pretty well and its Knock Off does a lot to Chandelure if you catch it on the switch.
http://veekun.com/dex/pokemon/search?move=dazzling+gleam&type=ghost
here is a list of all ghost-types that can learn dazzling gleam
here is a list of all ghost-types that can learn dazzling gleam
Dazzling Gleam only hits Sableye and Spiritomb harder (and Spiritomb will come out on top with Sucker Punch, as the above calcs demonstrate) so I still say honestly I don't think it's worth it. Also, aside from Gengar and Mismagius none of those ghosts are serious special attackers. I don't think any of them can 2HKO Spiritomb or Sableye.
Chandelure can OHKO Spiritomb, but Spiritomb needs to be burned if it wants to survive a boosted Sucker Punch
252+ SpA Life Orb Chandelure Overheat vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Spiritomb: 161-191 (102.5 - 121.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Chandelure Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Spiritomb: 157-186 (100 - 118.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Spiritomb Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Chandelure: 132-156 (79 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
I've been thinking about running Substitute on my Spiritomb to try to avoid all the will-o-wisps that'll be coming it's way. Send Spiritomb in on something that doesn't carry it then Sub while they switch into Sableye or something.
Just hard switching out to chandelure works too but I feel like that's very predictable and easy to act upon in this tourney by just attacking instead of wisping. Which is probably something everyone should keep in mind when playing against Chandy teams that have some physical attackers.
edit: Lum spiritomb could be cool too, but you lose the power of band/black glasses.
Just hard switching out to chandelure works too but I feel like that's very predictable and easy to act upon in this tourney by just attacking instead of wisping. Which is probably something everyone should keep in mind when playing against Chandy teams that have some physical attackers.
edit: Lum spiritomb could be cool too, but you lose the power of band/black glasses.
I prefer Expert Belt over Black Glasses. Everything except Spiritomb and Sableye are weak to Dark anyways, and Expert Belt also boosts Shoadow Sneak
Oh yeah, that's definitely a better idea. My thoughts on sets are stuck on when I played with it in NU.
You get a weaker matchup against opposing Spiritomb but you don't have a great matchup to begin with because they'll most likely just wisp you anyways. So expert belt is definitely a great item choice.
EnGarde
Not Dead Yet
Something that I've always thought was fun about ghost types is how many trickster moves are available. A lot of us are looking at straight-up power, but I think there is a lot of merit to using disruptors, and every team should be prepared to deal with them.
Here are some notable disruption moves (in no particular order) with at least decent distribution to ghost types:
Destiny Bond
Memento
Grudge - Fully deplete PP of last used move when target knocks your pokemon out
Spite - Remove 4 PP from target's last used move - Great counter to sucker punch!
Curse - Remember you're a ghost type!
Disable
Perish Song
Nasty Plot
Pain Split
Will-o-wisp
Taunt
Imprison
Skill Swap
Trick
Also, many ghost types have fun trickster abilities as well.
Mummy - Cofagrigus
Cursed body - Jellicent, Froslass, Regular Bannette
Prankster - Sableye, Mega Bannette
Aftermath/Flare boost - Drifblim
Infiltrator - Spiritomb, Chandelure
Flash Fire/Flame Body - Chandelure
No Guard - Golurk, Doublade
Harvest - Trevenant
Levitate - Practically every other ghost type
Here are some notable disruption moves (in no particular order) with at least decent distribution to ghost types:
Destiny Bond
Memento
Grudge - Fully deplete PP of last used move when target knocks your pokemon out
Spite - Remove 4 PP from target's last used move - Great counter to sucker punch!
Curse - Remember you're a ghost type!
Disable
Perish Song
Nasty Plot
Pain Split
Will-o-wisp
Taunt
Imprison
Skill Swap
Trick
Also, many ghost types have fun trickster abilities as well.
Mummy - Cofagrigus
Cursed body - Jellicent, Froslass, Regular Bannette
Prankster - Sableye, Mega Bannette
Aftermath/Flare boost - Drifblim
Infiltrator - Spiritomb, Chandelure
Flash Fire/Flame Body - Chandelure
No Guard - Golurk, Doublade
Harvest - Trevenant
Levitate - Practically every other ghost type
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Chandelure does seem pretty interesting. Would those 90 base defenses be high enough for a Calm mind and weakness policy setup or would that Hp make it too fragile? I imagine the speed may be a downer too. I was thinking of something like switching it in on a predicted will-o-wisp and using a calm mind on the switch, but if it'd get hit it could still potentially get a boost. (And a Will-o-wisp of its own against physical attackers)
EnGarde
Not Dead Yet
Chandelure is too frail for setup like that, especially in a metagame where everything can hit it for SE damage.
The battle spot standard for singles is 3v3, and has been since the beginning. When 6v6 is introduced in battle spot, it is as the novelty to be explored in itself (such as during the previous special rated season), and is unlikely to be paired with other novelties like ghost only, or be used in most other specialty competitions.
6v6 is primarily a Smogon-only format (unless you're playing triples), and as Smogon is not affiliated with official Nintendo regulations, it is highly unlikely you'll see it regularly on battle spot.
Even with SE damage, Sableye is pretty weak offensively. Not sure how viable that'll be.
EnGarde
Not Dead Yet
Had some time during lunch, so I sat down and figured out the speed tiers for this competition. I tried to make these as comprehensive as possible, and took into consideration common scarfed pokemon, pokemon that can boost their speed (golurk--rock polish, aegislash/doublade--autotomize, and drifblim--tailwind), and I considered pretty much all pokemon with trick room spreads (yes, even mega gengar and mismagius), since so many pokemon can use trick room in this format.
Here is a link to the spreadsheet. :)
Let me know if I've made any mistakes!
EDIT: Please note that all trick room spreads with a speed- nature were considered with a 0 speed IV. All other entries (speed+ and neutral natures) were considered with a 31 IV.
Here is a link to the spreadsheet. :)
Let me know if I've made any mistakes!
EDIT: Please note that all trick room spreads with a speed- nature were considered with a 0 speed IV. All other entries (speed+ and neutral natures) were considered with a 31 IV.
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TR isn't that great because of how widespread Shadow Sneak and Sucker Punch are. Since everything has super effective STAB against everything else, it's also much harder to set up TR
I saw that jellicent has a good especial defense, and know TR and with 252 spe. Def and 252 Def and with assault vest maybe it could survive a sucker punch or a shadow sneak. Or am i wrong ?
Jellicent can take a hit and set it up, but the problem is that the reversed speed won't really matter since there are Sucker Punches and Shadow Sneaks flying around. The Pokemon you use in Trick Room will find it hard to switch in, and even after they do, they can be taken out by priority before they move, since that ignores Trick Room. Your selection of sweepers is kind of limited too.
EnGarde
Not Dead Yet
That looks like a really good giveaway! Kasib berries will reduce the damage from 1 ghost attack on most ghost types, so it'll definitely help out anyone who needs help collecting it. :)Hi everyone!
If you are looking for a Honedge to train and use in this competition, you can get one for FREE in my Wi-Fi Giveaway here -><click
It also includes a free Kasib berry.
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Xado Valzy Hulavuta
I'm actually going to disagree here, and say that Trick Room is viable. I'd say spiritomb has a decent chance of being one of the heavy hitters in this comp, and it would definitely enjoy being in trick room, since it has a base speed of 35. It would also give it the advantage in priority vs. priority matchups. With so many viable TR users, something like dusclops or cofagrigus could set up TR and memento out, making room for spiritomb to sweep.
(Edit: Factual Error: Spiritomb doesn't get trick room)
I also see 2 strong counters to sucker punch: burn and spite (remove 4 pp from last used move). Both will cause SP to fail, and both will punish the SP'er for using SP.
Also, there are a lot of strong defensive pokemon on the slower end of the scale that could eat a shadow sneak and would love the benefit of trick room. For example, eviolite doublade looks pretty viable in this metagame, and with swords dance, its shadow sneak will definitely hurt. It just needs someone to help set up trick room for it. It can also be incredibly unpredictable, since it also has autotomize, and could try to set up for a speedster set instead (you can't necessarily tell in this metagame just from team preview).
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What advantages does Spiritomb in TR have? All of it's best STABs are priority moves already anyway. If you want a better priority vs. priority matchup you can just run some speed EVs to creep other Spiritomb because that's the only other priority sucker punch you'll really have to worry about aside from Banette. If you just run speed to outspeed other tombs you won't have to dedicate a moveslot on your other pokemon. Also regarding this, "Spiritomb could set up TR for itself", it can't.
I just don't see enough mons that can perform in TR well compared to mons that do well without TR. Jellicent, Cofag, Spiritomb, Golurk, Dusknoir and Doublade are the only really viable options for TR imo. Compared to Banette, Gengar, Aegislash, Chandelure, Sableye, and Spiritomb who don't need TR to do well and are arguably much better pokemon in general. I think fast offense will dominate this competition personally. Wasting turns to set up TR when every mon will have a SE move against you doesn't seem like a good idea to me at all, especially considering there are a lot of fast taunters that are really good like Gengar and Sableye.