Axdevo
Banned deucer.
i will try if i can get a good idea!
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Ladder Balanced Hackmons
- Thread starter verbatim
- Start date
EV
Banned deucer.
I think this post is pretty easy to interpret even for non-BH players. Someone stuck in a battle could PM a global mod in Other Metas or go find one in the Lobby, show them this post, and that mod could use their discretion to decide.
The framework is already here, it's just a matter of educating non-BH players what to do when the event arises.
Estimating:
Happiness: 10^2
Items: 10^2
Pokemon, with gender: 10^3
Natures: 10^1
Abilities: 10^2
Legal moves: (6*10^2)^4 / 24 = 10^9
Levels: 10^2
IVs: (3*10)^6=(3*3)^3 * 10^6 = 10^9
From these calculations, there are about 10^30 legal Balanced Hackmons sets, give or take. And given that I've cut down Natures, Items, and Happiness by a power of two for this calculation, we can round that up to 10^31, which is about ten nonillion.
As for EVs, only for a fantastically small fraction of possible EV spreads, I think, would anything actually hit the 252 EV cap; thus, we can assume that all 127 effective EVs are distributed randomly among the six stats, giving a starting calculation of 6^127 (while not every 4EV difference is meaningful below level 100, given that the number of stat-affectingly different EV spreads decreases exponentially as you drop below Level 100, they probably don't contribute much to the total). Of course, one does not have to use every EV. The number of EV spreads for any given number of EVs is about 6^x; fortunately, I knew enough calculus to ask Wolfram Alpha the right question to say that the sum for all of 0<=x<=127 is about 4*10^98. This is a very very very rough estimate, but it combines with the above number to give what I'd call about 10^129 legal Balanced Hackmons sets, which is about a fucktillion.
I don't even play this meta I just like math.
MAMP
MAMP!
lmao, thats more than a google. i.e, there are more legal bh sets than there are atoms in the universe
For infinite stall, there's a few things that could be done to limit it.
-Ban Heal Pulse. This is a single's meta and there is literally no reason to try to bounce a pulse of off Magic Bounce, assuming that even works, when you can just use Recover. As such, Heal Pulse has no functional use outside infinite stall.
-Ban Leppa + Fling/Trick/Switcheroo/Bestow or any other move that gives the opponent items. Leppa has some legitimate uses, if a bit dickish sometimes, but there's no legit reason to give your opponent a Leppa Berry except to infinite stall.
-Ban duplicate moves on the same set, assuming this is still allowed. Like, a Pokemon cannot have Tackle/Tackle/Recover/Recycle.
-Force a draw if neither side has hurt each other for a number of turns, like, say, 30+, whether it be direct damage or indirect. Maybe with the added condition that one side needs to be switching constantly during that time. I'm less sure on this one because too many turns is a bit of a pain in the butt to wait out an infinite stall scenario while too few hurts legit PP stall strategies. And, how much switching is enough to warrant a draw?
-Ban Heal Pulse. This is a single's meta and there is literally no reason to try to bounce a pulse of off Magic Bounce, assuming that even works, when you can just use Recover. As such, Heal Pulse has no functional use outside infinite stall.
-Ban Leppa + Fling/Trick/Switcheroo/Bestow or any other move that gives the opponent items. Leppa has some legitimate uses, if a bit dickish sometimes, but there's no legit reason to give your opponent a Leppa Berry except to infinite stall.
-Ban duplicate moves on the same set, assuming this is still allowed. Like, a Pokemon cannot have Tackle/Tackle/Recover/Recycle.
-Force a draw if neither side has hurt each other for a number of turns, like, say, 30+, whether it be direct damage or indirect. Maybe with the added condition that one side needs to be switching constantly during that time. I'm less sure on this one because too many turns is a bit of a pain in the butt to wait out an infinite stall scenario while too few hurts legit PP stall strategies. And, how much switching is enough to warrant a draw?
*googol
sorry i had to :3
To deal with Infinite Stall: Go back in time and kill Adrian Marin .
On a serious note, I think there could be an option wherein if both the players type "/draw" consecutively, one after the other, the match show be drawn. There could even be a prompt to show that one of them is asking for a draw.
It's not unfair since both of the have to agree and do it. Also saves the pain of going out and finding a Mod who can force draws.
Sure, there's a chance of both players being too cocky to draw, in which case it's their own problem because they chose to reject a valid solution.
On a serious note, I think there could be an option wherein if both the players type "/draw" consecutively, one after the other, the match show be drawn. There could even be a prompt to show that one of them is asking for a draw.
It's not unfair since both of the have to agree and do it. Also saves the pain of going out and finding a Mod who can force draws.
Sure, there's a chance of both players being too cocky to draw, in which case it's their own problem because they chose to reject a valid solution.
Kit Kasai
Love colored magic
I like the option of implementing a "draw" option into battles. There is no real downside to it, as both players have to agree on a draw for it to be a draw, so it wont affect most battles anyways. The only issue I see with it is it doesn't reflect in game mechanics, as in there is no "tie" in cartridge games. To me this shouldn't really be an issue, but I've seen people bring it up often so it should be considered.
rortik
Banned deucer.
I don't think it should be just a turn limit. It should be something like:
If after X turns of battle, Y turns of the last KO, and Z turns of a move running out of PP, etc.
The games have a timer to ensure there is no funbro-esque problems. This would merely serve the same purpose.
Balanced Hackmons doesn't reflect the game mechanics, but we still play it.
I am fully in favour of implementing a /draw command in showdown.
Uhm, then why does it have EV limit?
It originally had no EV limit, but then they changed it for some reason.
To follow ingame mechanics as you can't play it on cart with max EVs...
rortik
Banned deucer.
I can hack in a Pokemon with max EVs with no more effort than it takes to hack in a Sturdinja.
I don't think that's why they changed it XD
But you can't use that pokemon in a battle.
MAMP
MAMP!
Basically, the game does not allow you to take a Pokemon with more than 510 EVs into a multiplayer battle (however, it does allow hacked moves, abilities etc.). Max EVs on everything were only allowed previously because the games had not been hacked yet, so we were still playing by Gen V BH mechanics. The EV limit was imposed as soon as this was discovered, with much controversy (which you can read here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/balanced-hackmons.3489849/page-72#post-5673533).
Inb4 they remove cancel button / timer because of you.
But yeah, I agree that a Draw command would be great. Even with it though, if someone is intentionally pursuing an endless battle or extreme (>600 or so turns) stalling with an unidentified end in sight, than a /draw command wouldn't fix it. I would vote of adding /draw while doing other things to help the situation.
This probably isnt worth noting, buut i feel like saying how i feel the /draw command should appear.
If the /draw command is implemented then (regardless of whether or not modchat is up) it should show on the opponents screen something like:
"The opponent is requesting a draw, do you accept?
("Yes" icon or "OK" icon, because a no icon is kinda pointless)"
If the /draw command is implemented then (regardless of whether or not modchat is up) it should show on the opponents screen something like:
"The opponent is requesting a draw, do you accept?
("Yes" icon or "OK" icon, because a no icon is kinda pointless)"
Lcass4919
The Xatu Warrior
well if you think logically, technically there is a way to draw, despite not being able to actually DRAW in the games, many local battlers (you know, wifiers) will draw with eachother if it results in a battle neither can win(without taking like...10000000 turns or something), and although the GAMES count it as a win/loss, the actual players will consider it a "draw" and thus, /draw has justification of implementation. just like the timer buttons purpose(as the actual timer counts down at the start and gives you 10 mins) its just a way to make lives easier and whatnot.
Kit Kasai
Love colored magic
All that's left is to remove the hax *cough cough*
Lcass4919
The Xatu Warrior
*moves pawn 2 steps forward...causes massive explosion causing half the board to wipe out* fucking crit.
Haha, checkmate! *Moves queen piece onto the opponent's king piece*
"The attack missed!"
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
Bruh, that's not how you chess