Sacred Sword is always worth a consideration on Aegislash, after all, it is your best way around Bisharp. And defensive sets for Aegislash exist, he is EXTREMELY flexible.
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np: ORAS OU Suspect Process, Round 3 - Wandering Ghosts [Aegislash remains in Ubers]
- Thread starter McMeghan
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an aegislash meant to lure mega bunny? lmao. and no, nothing is, but you act like every 1v1 between a mega bunny and aegislash will play out the same. matter of the fact is, Mega Bunnys predictions go both for and against Mega Bunny. Aegislash isn't FORCED to go for kings shield as that first Pokemon switches out, etc. etc...
Ok thanks. I never got to use StallSlash in XY before it got banned.
Can we please stop talking about prediction? It is already stated: prediction goes BOTH WAYS, so don't use it as an argument.
Every persons has a different mindset, and as such you cannot hope to predict their intention, doing so you rely not on yourself, but on your opponent skills.
Every persons has a different mindset, and as such you cannot hope to predict their intention, doing so you rely not on yourself, but on your opponent skills.
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I know. That's also what I'm trying to same. Prediction makes and breaks your battle. But if you do correctly predict a KS and get that matchup, it does but you at an advantage.
Shadow Ball+Shadow Sneak+ Stealth Rocks 2hkoes landorus-incarnate (with no boosting items like Spooky Plate and life orb), also, Air Baloon was a common-ish item back in XY for Aegislash.
SketchUp
Don't let your memes be dreams
One of the most common arguments for Aegislash' ban back in XY was that it was very centralising. I think it is good to consider this post and this post when talking about a pokemon which is so overcentralising as Aegislash is. The kind of centralisation Aegislash brings is not from a offensive point of view, such as pokemon like Kyurem-White will be if they would ever be retested, but from a defensive point of view. Aegislash checks so many pokemon that are viable at the moment (the complete list of pokemon that will drop 3 subranks in viability is already posted a few times) which makes it a perfect glue on almost every team, mainly because it can run different sets to work on different archetypes.
There are two important questions regarding Aegislash' centralisaton which are: do we want this centralisation and is this centralisation healthy?
The first questions can be answered by the posts I mentioned earlier in my post whether we want a diverse, match-up based one or if we want a centralised, battle-centric one. I prefer the former, because it rewards teambuilding and while there are some matches that are decided by matchup (which is often exaggerated btw) the matches that are not decided this way are still slightly in the advantage of the better teambuilder, while still giving the one with the worse matchup a very good chance of winning the match. In most cases, the better your team is, the lesser amount of matches are decided by matchup. Teambuilding this way is more difficult, but the options of viable pokemon is a lot bigger because without Aegislash you can pick a Jirachi, Starmie or Celebi if you want. With a centralised metagame this will be more difficult because you can't easily put a Jirachi on your team because it gives the Aegislash very much momentum (not saying Jirachi is unviable in an Aegi metagame, but it will cost a lot of momentum if you use it)
The second question is if the centralisation Aegislash gives is healthy or unhealthy. I am a huge supporter of a Landorus suspect and with a reintroduction of Aegislash this problem will only get worse. Albacore described this issue earlier in the topic in this post. This is not the only negative effect of the centralisation of Aegislash. The most threatening pokemon in the current metagame (Keldeo, Landorus, Sableye) will profit from the return of Aegislash, while some pokemon that are currently very healthy for the metagame, such as Slowbro and Starmie, will be a lot worse with Aegislash around. While there are definitely some top tier threats that are defeated by Aegislash (Metagross without EQ, Mega Altaria, Clefable) these pokemon are already in a stage where the metagame adapted to them with pokemon such as Slowbro, Hippowdon and Scizor who are all gaining enormous popularity.
With Aegislash in the metagame, the metagame would not only be centralised, but will also be filled with many (potentially) broken pokemon which puts the same pressure on teambuilding as they do now. The OU Metagame would be a lot better with Landorus (and maybe some other big threats) gone, rather than reintroducing a defensively centralising pokemon. It can be argued that having a centralising force in the metagame will be great to lower the matchup problem but Aegislash doesn't fix this problem because the best pokemon (plural) in the current metagame still wreck the whole tier while the only thing Aegislash brings is more centralisation amongst these threats. As a supporter of a diverse metagame and a supporter of a metagame where broken mons doesn't check broken mons but broken mons are just banned I want Aegislash to stay in ubers.
There are two important questions regarding Aegislash' centralisaton which are: do we want this centralisation and is this centralisation healthy?
The first questions can be answered by the posts I mentioned earlier in my post whether we want a diverse, match-up based one or if we want a centralised, battle-centric one. I prefer the former, because it rewards teambuilding and while there are some matches that are decided by matchup (which is often exaggerated btw) the matches that are not decided this way are still slightly in the advantage of the better teambuilder, while still giving the one with the worse matchup a very good chance of winning the match. In most cases, the better your team is, the lesser amount of matches are decided by matchup. Teambuilding this way is more difficult, but the options of viable pokemon is a lot bigger because without Aegislash you can pick a Jirachi, Starmie or Celebi if you want. With a centralised metagame this will be more difficult because you can't easily put a Jirachi on your team because it gives the Aegislash very much momentum (not saying Jirachi is unviable in an Aegi metagame, but it will cost a lot of momentum if you use it)
The second question is if the centralisation Aegislash gives is healthy or unhealthy. I am a huge supporter of a Landorus suspect and with a reintroduction of Aegislash this problem will only get worse. Albacore described this issue earlier in the topic in this post. This is not the only negative effect of the centralisation of Aegislash. The most threatening pokemon in the current metagame (Keldeo, Landorus, Sableye) will profit from the return of Aegislash, while some pokemon that are currently very healthy for the metagame, such as Slowbro and Starmie, will be a lot worse with Aegislash around. While there are definitely some top tier threats that are defeated by Aegislash (Metagross without EQ, Mega Altaria, Clefable) these pokemon are already in a stage where the metagame adapted to them with pokemon such as Slowbro, Hippowdon and Scizor who are all gaining enormous popularity.
With Aegislash in the metagame, the metagame would not only be centralised, but will also be filled with many (potentially) broken pokemon which puts the same pressure on teambuilding as they do now. The OU Metagame would be a lot better with Landorus (and maybe some other big threats) gone, rather than reintroducing a defensively centralising pokemon. It can be argued that having a centralising force in the metagame will be great to lower the matchup problem but Aegislash doesn't fix this problem because the best pokemon (plural) in the current metagame still wreck the whole tier while the only thing Aegislash brings is more centralisation amongst these threats. As a supporter of a diverse metagame and a supporter of a metagame where broken mons doesn't check broken mons but broken mons are just banned I want Aegislash to stay in ubers.
Sebberball
formerly BoXeD
well im back to preach more about aegislash... i noticed that Aegislash both benefits and dies to rain teams, mostly depending on the pokemon... on the rain team. if you are using Aegislash on a rain team, it's 2 biggest threats got neutralized, ground and fire, but when it's on a rain team, it really falls to pokemon like swampert-m and HP fire manaphy. also im not sure if it has been said, but aegislash is killed by mega-lopunny as long as it isnt defensive.... but other than that our new almost addition will be counter easier than it was in X/Y... PLUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUS if it is added to our little tier, it will be a threat and it will be threatened, mostly by some of the new mega, i also found that it fell to HP Ground + Heat Wave Pidgeot. so as i said it will be a threat and will be threatened... so on that note...
#FREEAEGISLASH2015
My example was to show that Loppuny wasn't a reliable way around Aegislash. I am not saying the Aegislash will always predict the other player right, he won't, but the other player won't always predict right either, like a lot of anti-ban people (Not saying just in this test, just in general. Thank god the forums here are 893804230 times better than most places) always seem to think. Hell, the number of times I have seen someone consider a shaky check a hard counter is mind boggling.
Anyhow, on to more productive things. Aegislash just has shaky checks for the most part, with really the only reliable ones coming to mind is Manibuzz (Still not fools proof) and Sp. Defensive Amonguss.
Also to the Hydragon being uncounterable in 5th gen, so Aegislash is not broken Arguement...Hy is a hella is lot easier to check and to revenge kill.
Well then, it was expected since the april's fool.
What to say, XY players must know how this pokémon is really centralizing and powerful.
Back in times I was against its ban but now things are changed.
Firstly, let's take an in-depth glance at it:
1- "potential" 720 BST considering its dual form that gives it (almost all times) extreme power when it attacks (150 atk/spatk) and extreme bulk when it receives an attack, due to its quite slow speed (60 Base stat) in an extreme fast tier as OU. Note that it can anyway outspeed several threats that would be dangerous for it, for example adamant Bisharp if you run max speed+ (240 vs 239).
2- god-tier typing, both in a offensive and defensive point of view. Ghost type has only 1 immunity and 1 resistance, both weak to Fight (and Aegi almost always run Sacred Sword for this reason), and also Steel type helps vs bulky fairies, that otherwise could in some way tank hits and statup (clefable) or do stuff (sylveon). About its defensive utility, Aegislash was one of the really few pokemon able to get off the meta a huge amount of really powerful mons as fights (medicham/heracross), fairies (gardevoir), ghosts (gengar), psychics (celebi/mew/slowbro/starmie/jirachi), dragons, flyings (pinsir forced to run EQ).
3- really optimal movepool, that can allows it to run several sets, with totally different features, as Mixed pivot (bulky lefties set or faster orb set, or also pursuiter; it can run also spooky plate or weakness policy), Sword Dancer, SubToxic or the rare autotomizer. It's necessary to be said that several counters of a certain set are blasted by others. As example: Chesnaught, wall of mixed pivot due to BProof, will lose vs SubToxic. SDef Heatran or Bisharp, "counters" of Subtoxic, are blasted by Pivot set. Sylveon, that can tank mixed w/out steel move and subtoxic (if runs HBell), is devastated by SDancer.
4- 50/50 argument. Damn guys this will be so toxic for the metagame, nothing else to say about it.
5- it limits teambuilding. I know this is usually a "ban" argument but, in order to have a "more skilled" metagame we have to reduce the matchup reliability in games. Aegislash, if reintroduced, will push out of usage several known as powerful threats such MegaAltaria, MegaMetagross, MegaDiancie, Latwins, Celebi, Starmie, Slowbro ecc. so the meta will be somehow restricted, so the matchup issue would be "fixed". teambuilding also will have negative downsides like, putting 2-3 ways to deal with Aegislash (for every potential set it should run)
im tired of writing so in short:
there's some reasons to say Aegi would be helpful for current OU tier, but there are also more reasons to say no. That's my thought atm, however I will ladder to clear my head on this
as I said for Giratina (even if that was a joke suspect), current metagame IMO doesn't need unbans but bans. We have a lot of threats to deal with for teambuilding, adding other ones, even if they restrict others, won't be as helpful as banning cancerous ones (e.g. Landorus-I, Mega Metagross, maybe more like Lopunny that will be overpowered by Aegi unban cuz no more solid counters viable lulz and some fairies)
What to say, XY players must know how this pokémon is really centralizing and powerful.
Back in times I was against its ban but now things are changed.
Firstly, let's take an in-depth glance at it:
1- "potential" 720 BST considering its dual form that gives it (almost all times) extreme power when it attacks (150 atk/spatk) and extreme bulk when it receives an attack, due to its quite slow speed (60 Base stat) in an extreme fast tier as OU. Note that it can anyway outspeed several threats that would be dangerous for it, for example adamant Bisharp if you run max speed+ (240 vs 239).
2- god-tier typing, both in a offensive and defensive point of view. Ghost type has only 1 immunity and 1 resistance, both weak to Fight (and Aegi almost always run Sacred Sword for this reason), and also Steel type helps vs bulky fairies, that otherwise could in some way tank hits and statup (clefable) or do stuff (sylveon). About its defensive utility, Aegislash was one of the really few pokemon able to get off the meta a huge amount of really powerful mons as fights (medicham/heracross), fairies (gardevoir), ghosts (gengar), psychics (celebi/mew/slowbro/starmie/jirachi), dragons, flyings (pinsir forced to run EQ).
3- really optimal movepool, that can allows it to run several sets, with totally different features, as Mixed pivot (bulky lefties set or faster orb set, or also pursuiter; it can run also spooky plate or weakness policy), Sword Dancer, SubToxic or the rare autotomizer. It's necessary to be said that several counters of a certain set are blasted by others. As example: Chesnaught, wall of mixed pivot due to BProof, will lose vs SubToxic. SDef Heatran or Bisharp, "counters" of Subtoxic, are blasted by Pivot set. Sylveon, that can tank mixed w/out steel move and subtoxic (if runs HBell), is devastated by SDancer.
4- 50/50 argument. Damn guys this will be so toxic for the metagame, nothing else to say about it.
5- it limits teambuilding. I know this is usually a "ban" argument but, in order to have a "more skilled" metagame we have to reduce the matchup reliability in games. Aegislash, if reintroduced, will push out of usage several known as powerful threats such MegaAltaria, MegaMetagross, MegaDiancie, Latwins, Celebi, Starmie, Slowbro ecc. so the meta will be somehow restricted, so the matchup issue would be "fixed". teambuilding also will have negative downsides like, putting 2-3 ways to deal with Aegislash (for every potential set it should run)
im tired of writing so in short:
there's some reasons to say Aegi would be helpful for current OU tier, but there are also more reasons to say no. That's my thought atm, however I will ladder to clear my head on this
as I said for Giratina (even if that was a joke suspect), current metagame IMO doesn't need unbans but bans. We have a lot of threats to deal with for teambuilding, adding other ones, even if they restrict others, won't be as helpful as banning cancerous ones (e.g. Landorus-I, Mega Metagross, maybe more like Lopunny that will be overpowered by Aegi unban cuz no more solid counters viable lulz and some fairies)
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I know, I meant that mostly to BobGary, who was talking about predict in all his posts, as a matter of fact I agree with you, Mega Lopunny is a shaky as fuck check against Aegislash.
I haven't played suspect yet, but at least on paper Aegislash seems a lot like Gira-O: It just blanket checks too much, has far too much versatility for such a good mon, and is stupidly easy to slap on a team and make it better. Just like that. I'll post thoughts after suspect laddering, but in what way would a stupidly good blanket check with amazing synergy with the best mon in the tier be healthy?
Anyway, I came here to ask all the people who think 50/50s is a BS argument to ask them why. It clearly causes far more 50/50 ish situations than anything else in addition to being stupidly good, so why not being that up as one facet of Slash's potential brokenness? I will agree that "omg 720 bst" is a waste of space though.
Anyway, I came here to ask all the people who think 50/50s is a BS argument to ask them why. It clearly causes far more 50/50 ish situations than anything else in addition to being stupidly good, so why not being that up as one facet of Slash's potential brokenness? I will agree that "omg 720 bst" is a waste of space though.
TY for being informative <3
I never said hydreigon = uncounterable therefore Aegi isn't broken. I just see the aegi = uncounterable therefore aegi= broken as a sole argument way too much. It just doesn't work
Sole argument? A majority of people that aren't coming in here with "50/50 OP" "based prediction" bull know that aegi's problem is not an offensive one. Having no counters is not aegi's problem. Aegi's problem is being centralizing as all fuck, destroying teambuilding, and just all in all, being way too damn easy to slap on a team and make it 80% better than it was before. It's unhealthy as all hell, that is its problem.
Despite this being my first post, I have played in the OU tier for over a year now; so i know what I'm talking about when I say this:
Aegislash is overcentralizing. He was back in XY, and he would be even more so in the current meta.
This meta , while stale , is the most balanced form of the OU metagame I have played. So many more things in the past couple months have been moving into the OU tier since ORAS started (Like Jirachi and Starmie) as well as non-OU Pokemon gaining viability in the current meta. Most of the notable threats in the tier now don't centralize teambuilding nearly as much as they did back in XY, so team diversity has been much better in this meta.
Now If Aegislash were to be unbanned, all of this balance would go away, since Aegislash checks half the tier. Since a majority of things in OU are either A. Weak to ghost(Gallade, The Latis, Gengar, Starmie, and Metagross) or B. Weak to steel(Gardevoir, Kyurem-B, Diancie, Altaria, Clefable), Aegislash would make so that only a handful of pokemon are even viable in the tier and would make it so that Ground-Types are a necessity on any team that doesn't want to get blow away by a psychotic sword and shield.
Basically, keep this thing in ubers please
Aegislash is overcentralizing. He was back in XY, and he would be even more so in the current meta.
This meta , while stale , is the most balanced form of the OU metagame I have played. So many more things in the past couple months have been moving into the OU tier since ORAS started (Like Jirachi and Starmie) as well as non-OU Pokemon gaining viability in the current meta. Most of the notable threats in the tier now don't centralize teambuilding nearly as much as they did back in XY, so team diversity has been much better in this meta.
Now If Aegislash were to be unbanned, all of this balance would go away, since Aegislash checks half the tier. Since a majority of things in OU are either A. Weak to ghost(Gallade, The Latis, Gengar, Starmie, and Metagross) or B. Weak to steel(Gardevoir, Kyurem-B, Diancie, Altaria, Clefable), Aegislash would make so that only a handful of pokemon are even viable in the tier and would make it so that Ground-Types are a necessity on any team that doesn't want to get blow away by a psychotic sword and shield.
Basically, keep this thing in ubers please
Laddered for a while and I can say I sure don't want Aegislash around in the OU tier.
As many people stated, Aegislash is a blanket check. Yeah it doesn't sweep teams or beat every Pokemon it sees, but it's a supportive glue that helps make already good Pokemon (Keldeo, Lando-I, Mega Sableye, etc.) better by covering the Pokemon that can beat them. With Aegislash, he'll just make a lot of Pokemon become hard to even put into a team without tons of support such as Mega Gardevoir and Diancie.
Aegislash has a variety in sets from Sub Aegislash, to Mix, or even Stall. Not all of them have the same moves (Minus obvious King's Shield) which makes it harder to be fully prepared when you run into it. What happens if you have a Pokemon who can't touch Aegislash or is losing Attack from King's Shield? You give Aegislash free chances to do whatever it needs to win from setting up Swords Dance or just getting a Sub.
His typing is pretty good too as he resists nine types that include Fairy (that sooo many people complain about..) and is immune to three which helps out with any of the good Pokemon who are weak to those types.
I don't know anything overcentralizing, but I do know if a Pokemon like Aegi can have a big enough influence to make most Pokemon drop or just flat out not be used at all in OU is a problem especially when a lot of the current OU Pokes can handle the top threats (I don't know about Lando-I, but that's for a future topic, right?) and I don't think bringing it back will help anybody.
But is there anything I'm missing or you got a good enough reason to want him back? Please tell me, I wanna know I'm open to opinions! :D
As many people stated, Aegislash is a blanket check. Yeah it doesn't sweep teams or beat every Pokemon it sees, but it's a supportive glue that helps make already good Pokemon (Keldeo, Lando-I, Mega Sableye, etc.) better by covering the Pokemon that can beat them. With Aegislash, he'll just make a lot of Pokemon become hard to even put into a team without tons of support such as Mega Gardevoir and Diancie.
Aegislash has a variety in sets from Sub Aegislash, to Mix, or even Stall. Not all of them have the same moves (Minus obvious King's Shield) which makes it harder to be fully prepared when you run into it. What happens if you have a Pokemon who can't touch Aegislash or is losing Attack from King's Shield? You give Aegislash free chances to do whatever it needs to win from setting up Swords Dance or just getting a Sub.
His typing is pretty good too as he resists nine types that include Fairy (that sooo many people complain about..) and is immune to three which helps out with any of the good Pokemon who are weak to those types.
I don't know anything overcentralizing, but I do know if a Pokemon like Aegi can have a big enough influence to make most Pokemon drop or just flat out not be used at all in OU is a problem especially when a lot of the current OU Pokes can handle the top threats (I don't know about Lando-I, but that's for a future topic, right?) and I don't think bringing it back will help anybody.
But is there anything I'm missing or you got a good enough reason to want him back? Please tell me, I wanna know I'm open to opinions! :D
Revenge killing Aegislash isn't the problem, since Ground and Dark-type attacks are everywhere in OU. The issue is Aegislash's versatility in tandem with the limitations it forced in team building due to preparing for all of its different sets. Mandibuzz is not a surefire counter to Aegislash because it loses to SubToxic, as well as Swords Dance + Head Smash. It will beat some sets, but it is not a surefire counter. Any other check, such as Bisharp, Gliscor, or Hippowdon, is guaranteed to lose to some Aegislash variant.
I have played a few ladder games and to be honest, I do not think aegislash will be as centralizing in the current meta. Yes, it would be a top threat just like landorus-i but not over-centralizing like in XY pre-aegi meta. And I believe "It forces many 50-50s" is simply not a valid argument, because set-up pokemon (in hands of decent players) will simply abuse the "click kingshield/press attack next turn" strategy. It is as tough for the aegislash user as the opponent if skill is equal.
Now, lets see how many pokemons it can switch into reliably (By reliably it means not get 2hkoed or crippled to the point it wont play much role afterwards)
It CAN NOT switch in into Lando-i, mega-meta (eq), mega-alt (eq/fireblast sets) or keldeo (specs) without compromising it's offensive powers or it can not switch in into all of their sets. It can not even switch into serperior (2 leaf storms + hp fire kills aegi while it needs 2 shadowballs to ko back) or diancie. It does force a lot of 50-50s vs lopunny-mega, but as I mentioned above, playing as a aegi player is as tough as playing as against a aegi player. It can not switch into lando-t, manectric-mega, bisharp, talonflame (all sets except banded set locked into bb), offensive and mega-garchomp etc etc.
In short, it has to be careful switching into HO teams and find the right moment, just like any other premier offensive pokemon. So, HO teams can not just slap an aegislash and expect to win everytime.
Now, lets check it offensive output. It has access to primarily 5 move-types i.e, steel, ghost, fighting, dark (pursuit), rock (head smash). It can not run all its coverage moves at the same time and may not even have the coverage. Its attacks come from 438 base fully invested (without LO) which is definitely huge. But most of those hits have neutral coverage against most of the common pokemon in OU. And add its below-par speed, it definitely will hit a turn less. Plus the metagame already coped up with mega-metagross being in OU and fire type moves, ground type moves and dark type moves are pretty common just to counter the then most dominating pokemon in the metagame. And it's unlikely that in case of aegislash-retest the scenario will be any different.
Plus, all aegi sets hate para/burn. Jirachi/clefable are rather decent t-wavers and wish-passers and it could be worth sacrificing 1 pokemon to know the set so it can be dealt accordingly. It's just like any other top pokemon and share the same traits a top pokemon like megagross or lando-i. So, I do not think there's going to be a drastic change in the metagame and there's any need to be.
Now, lets see how many pokemons it can switch into reliably (By reliably it means not get 2hkoed or crippled to the point it wont play much role afterwards)
It CAN NOT switch in into Lando-i, mega-meta (eq), mega-alt (eq/fireblast sets) or keldeo (specs) without compromising it's offensive powers or it can not switch in into all of their sets. It can not even switch into serperior (2 leaf storms + hp fire kills aegi while it needs 2 shadowballs to ko back) or diancie. It does force a lot of 50-50s vs lopunny-mega, but as I mentioned above, playing as a aegi player is as tough as playing as against a aegi player. It can not switch into lando-t, manectric-mega, bisharp, talonflame (all sets except banded set locked into bb), offensive and mega-garchomp etc etc.
In short, it has to be careful switching into HO teams and find the right moment, just like any other premier offensive pokemon. So, HO teams can not just slap an aegislash and expect to win everytime.
Now, lets check it offensive output. It has access to primarily 5 move-types i.e, steel, ghost, fighting, dark (pursuit), rock (head smash). It can not run all its coverage moves at the same time and may not even have the coverage. Its attacks come from 438 base fully invested (without LO) which is definitely huge. But most of those hits have neutral coverage against most of the common pokemon in OU. And add its below-par speed, it definitely will hit a turn less. Plus the metagame already coped up with mega-metagross being in OU and fire type moves, ground type moves and dark type moves are pretty common just to counter the then most dominating pokemon in the metagame. And it's unlikely that in case of aegislash-retest the scenario will be any different.
Plus, all aegi sets hate para/burn. Jirachi/clefable are rather decent t-wavers and wish-passers and it could be worth sacrificing 1 pokemon to know the set so it can be dealt accordingly. It's just like any other top pokemon and share the same traits a top pokemon like megagross or lando-i. So, I do not think there's going to be a drastic change in the metagame and there's any need to be.
I see a lot of people assuming that the meta will automatically reverse course and suddenly turn back into the early XY Aegi meta if this gets unbanned when that really isn't true. Meta progress doesn't just reverse course like that. Aegi was a limiting factor in the development of the metagame for sure but reintroducing it doesn't have to be bad unless you go in with the mentality that it is going to bad/cancer/toxic. The initial Aegi ban and potential subsequent unbanning may end up just being a form of quantitative easing on meta development (pretty accurate comparison imo). I also don't think the suspect ladder will be a great showing for the first few days, mostly because people will find some archive Aegi team and just use that and that will lead to a less than accurate showing of a potential ORAS Aegi meta. Finally, I wouldn't exactly make the assumption that "fun and diverse meta" = "most competitive meta possible" when the opposite is more true when you get down to what "competitive" really is.
RichieTheGarchomp
Banned deucer.
lol at the quintuple post
besides i think aegi will be even more broken then last time: it has more checks, but it also has more things it checks itself. Choice locked Secret Sword Keldeo is an example, MMeta, MDiancie (if balloon) seriously one of the only reliable counters to this thing is msab, and he probably takes a good amount on shadow ball
at this point, 100% keep in ubers.
besides i think aegi will be even more broken then last time: it has more checks, but it also has more things it checks itself. Choice locked Secret Sword Keldeo is an example, MMeta, MDiancie (if balloon) seriously one of the only reliable counters to this thing is msab, and he probably takes a good amount on shadow ball
at this point, 100% keep in ubers.
just outplay the coinflip imo
I agree on the new toy syndrome and the staple aegislash teams for the first days. However the strain put on team building is already noticeable. And that will be present on the staple stage of Lando I and Keldeo + aegislash aftermath of that while it stabilizes. And honestly a meta can reverse if you add a cancerous element to it if it proves to be able to be spammed without any visible drawbacks as aegislash superglue abilities point at.
Aegislash forcing 50 / 50's was actually one of the reason Aegislash was considered for a suspect test in XY. Only beginners will use the "King's Shield and then attack" strategy, and any good player will mix up his patterns making it hard for the opponent to guess and predict correctly. Yeah aegislash isn't a hard counter to any of the threats you mentioned, but it checks all of them which is good enough. You can't really expect aegislash to switch in on all 4 S rank pokemon; it's a blanket check to a good portion of the meta, that doesn't mean it has to counter all of them. Also serperior actually loses as shadow ball + life orb recoil + shadow sneak takes it out. Aegislash can easily switch in on diancie if it goes diamond storm or moon blast, and even then, earth power does not even 2HKO aegislash if you factor in lefties and king's shield recovery. Just because aegislash cannot switch into the pokemon you mentioned does not mean it's not overcentralizing lol. Aegislash isn't supposed to counter everything. Aegislash's speed may be subpar, but it hits extremely hard and even has priority shadow sneak. Many pokemon don't enjoy taking a LO shadow ball / flash cannon followed by a shadow sneak. Tbh, not all aegi sets hate burns. Fully special aegislash or even subtoxic variants do not care too much about burn. Besides, which pokemon besides stuff like conkeldurr and magic guard clefable actually enjoy status?
You're post is making it seem like "I can kill aegislash with earth power from lando-I it sucks, and it can't even counter all 4 S rank pokemon this won't create a drastic change" and that's not true; aegislash blanket checks like half the meta and restricts teambuilding a lot.
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