Ladder ORAS 1v1 [3v3 Team Preview]

[ScorrchingTheaph]

Here is an interesting set I developed:
rof (Giratina/Arceus/Lugia/Registeel/Shuckle/whatever u need to cteam ppl) @ Griseous Orb/Lum Berry/Sitrus Berry/whatever u need to cteam ppl
Ability: Prankster/Magic Bounce/Soundproof/whatever you need to cteam ppl
Shiny: Maybe
EVs/Nature/IVs: whatever u need to cteam ppl
- Transform
- Imprison
- Struggle
- Skill Swap/Substitute/Magic Coat/King's Shield/Spiky Shield/whatever u need to cteam ppl (dont run something that will kill urself)

It's a classic imprisonform set with a twist. If you run struggle you wont lose to faster imprisonformers because it will say "rof can't use its sealed Struggle!" By running different sets, you can also beat Soundproof Psong, either with Skill Swap, Soundproof, etc. Griseous Orb makes you Trick/Switcheroo proof, which is nice. You can also beat Imposter by spamming moves until your opponent eventually clicks Imprison. You lose to pokemon that run Struggle, pokemon that succeed in taunting you, or offense that can kill you before or after you have transformed. Take note that you can run Struggle on any set that can not kill itself and you immediately become Imprison+Transform proof. Now if you guys could just go and ban Perish Song, that would be great.

EDIT: rip my strats

 

[jbtc10]

Just put Perish Song on your own set if you don't want to lose to it. Imprison/Transform/Perish Song/Filler @Mental Herb/Lum Berry works wonders. Having P-Song on the set also lets you beat faster Imprison users if you go for the Perish Song on the turn they go for Imprison or waste a turn using Spore/Taunt if you have the appropriate item.

 

[ScorrchingTheaph]

Just put Perish Song on your own set if you don't want to lose to it. Imprison/Transform/Perish Song/Filler @Mental Herb/Lum Berry works wonders. Having P-Song on the set also lets you beat faster Imprison users if you go for the Perish Song on the turn they go for Imprison or waste a turn using Spore/Taunt if you have the appropriate item.

If they transform its an uncompetitive 50/50 speed tie unless someone is running macho brace or scarf, or unless you are running soundproof, which is only useful for psong.

 

[Phione]

Here is an interesting set I developed:
rof (Giratina/Arceus/Lugia/Registeel/Shuckle/whatever u need to cteam ppl) @ Griseous Orb/Lum Berry/Sitrus Berry/whatever u need to cteam ppl
Ability: Prankster/Magic Bounce/Soundproof/whatever you need to cteam ppl
Shiny: Maybe
EVs/Nature/IVs: whatever u need to cteam ppl
- Transform
- Imprison
- Struggle
- Skill Swap/Substitute/Magic Coat/King's Shield/Spiky Shield/whatever u need to cteam ppl (dont run something that will kill urself)

It's a classic imprisonform set with a twist. If you run struggle you wont lose to faster imprisonformers because it will say "rof can't use its sealed Struggle!" By running different sets, you can also beat Soundproof Psong, either with Skill Swap, Soundproof, etc. Griseous Orb makes you Trick/Switcheroo proof, which is nice. You can also beat Imposter by spamming moves until your opponent eventually clicks Imprison. You lose to pokemon that run Struggle, pokemon that succeed in taunting you, or offense that can kill you before or after you have transformed. Take note that you can run Struggle on any set that can not kill itself and you immediately become Imprison+Transform proof. Now if you guys could just go and ban Perish Song, that would be great.

AFAIK you cannot select Struggle in the teambuilder, nor can it ever be on the moveset of a Pokémon, so this would not work.

 

[Uselesscrab]

AFAIK you cannot select Struggle in the teambuilder, nor can it ever be on the moveset of a Pokémon, so this would not work.

It's usable in BH, I believe. I remember it being used rarely in CH in the past for its ability to bypass Wonder Guard.

 

[Feebas4ubers]

So I came back after a long break to see 1v1 hackmons, not bad. I'll definitely play quite a bit while I can.
As for bans, I believe it defeats the entire purpose of the meta, and I see no point in doing so. Things like prankster substitute beats most transform-imprison sets I've encountered, and as for perish song, it may be worth to sacrifice one moveslot for an unexpected trick room. Besides, I've yet to see perish song shuckle beat a huge power, especially choice trick set... or beat prankster taunt for that matter (they never run magic coat/bounce from what I've seen so far, though I'll admit I haven't played that much yet). Huge power is generally a risky choice in a meta filled with priority, sturdy shedinja and things like that. I tried fur coat as well, and it does do a pretty nice job. Overall I'm pretty sure any bans will result in something else being equally powerful, considering you can literally use any combination of pokemon/moves/abilities.

 

[IanTheCat]

Guys! I found a nice moveset for Aggron Mega.
Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 248 HP/252 Atk/8 Spa
Adamant Nature
-Earthquake
-Double Edge
-Iron Head
-Subsitute/Counter
Whether you want to be behind a substitute or counter-attacking physical attackers, Aggron will not fail you. Only issue is ghost types like Gengar...

Ok...here is my ultimate Pokemon. I win every time.
Serperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 Spa/252 Spe/4 HP
Hasty Nature
-Dragon Ascent
-Draco Meteor
-Leaf Storm
-Wrap
So...you want a powerful moveset, without those horrid effects that lower your stats. Well then, contrary is right for you. And, just to make fun of the advantage you get, 3 of the moves normally give you a negative effect, but now, they give you amazing stat boosts! This is the most useful Pokemon, if you ask me (although, since it's hackmons, you could transfer this to any Pokemon, and you could try to tease an opponent by using a pikachu or dwebble or another usually weak Pokemon to beat them).

 

[IanTheCat]

Shuckle @ leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 Def/252 Spd/4 HP
Calm Nature
-Dragon Ascent (believe it out not, this replaces shell smash)
-Infestation
-Toxic
-Rest
My OP OU shuckle, but a small change.

 

[xfix]

Take note that you can run Struggle on any set that can not kill itself and you immediately become Imprison+Transform proof.

That was Showdown bug, now should be fixed (it doesn't work that way in actual game). You cannot use Struggle to become Imprison+Transform proof, as Imprison cannot block Struggle.

 

[The Immortal]

Suspecting Imprison + Transform in Hackmons 1v1. This is going to be a quick test, for a few days only, and you don't have to make a new alt. Requirements to vote are 1500 ELO with a minimum GXE of 70.

Post a screenshot of reqs + vote in here.

 

[Uselesscrab]

ok

nooby h team

hehe get it like "new bh team"

anyway i'll edit in my vote soon if that's ok

edit: ban seems like the right choice

 

[Robertodole]

nooby h team

no ban unless we want to ban psong as well, since its so much harder to counter yet no one other than me seems to complain about it :-\

 

[thesecondbest]

put ps on your imprison user ;)

 

[tegrof19]

Whether or not you think something is is more broken than the current suspect shouldn't have any bearing on your vote. It should be solely based whether or not the current suspect is broken.

 

[LeapsFrog]

I already voted but I feel like the suspect has been going on for a while. I am surprised that Imprison is not banned yet. It is the extremely overly centralizing. You can literally win any battle even just with Spore+Imprison with Prankster against almost everything viable in this metagame. It is easy to trick people by running random pokemon who you think have OTHER sets which are more common. Teams that were once #1 have fallen due to Imprison. Imprison is extremely uncompetitive because it can be almost impossible to predict before a match starts.
I am disappointed that a ladder with no Imprison did not exist for the 1 month we had a ladder for this metagame. I hope we get nominated again in the future so we can see a meta which Imprison and even Perish Song banned. Or this could just become a official ladder. Or receive the same fate as 2v2 Doubles.

 

[The Immortal]

I guess it isn't banned since the vote is at 1-1. Might as well give you until the ladder is removed.

 

[Stockpile Snorlax]

kk no ban.

 

[The Immortal]

Not banned then. We now return to our regularly scheduled ORAS 1v1 discussion.

 

[LeapsFrog]

I know we are back to 1v1 but really quick.
I am confused how Imprison remains unbanned. Almost everyone said they wanted banned when it was 1st mentioned. Most metas who win a monthly ladder see a sudden decrease throughout the month and the users who said no ban were a big majority of the leavers, or did not make ELO requirement which is a different problem. I feel like it is unfair that something is staying unbanned because almost all the users who said no ban did not show up for the vote. I know you confirmed the vote as 2-1 but I feel like 3 people is too small for this to be judged on. We saw WAY more than 3 people argue for banning it earlier. Way more than 3 people liked my previous post even. The voting sample for this suspect was too small.


Also during my previous post I assumed all the conversation from earlier was part of the vote and I was wrong, so my vote did not count. Plus I am not sure how my ELO requirements work since I was above 1500 before but was not during the time of my previous post though.

 

[The Immortal]

The voting sample for this suspect was too small.

I was going for quality instead of quantity this time round. Like, my expectation was that 5/6 people would vote, equivalent to the number of people some metagames have on their council.

 

[Adrian Marin]

Mega Pokemon aren't a sufficient form of counterplay because we can spot a mega Pokemon in team preview, offering no downsides to Pokemon with Trick.

To achieve consistency in a metagame that contradicts that very notion, Trick + Choice or Trick alone must have some sort of limitation in order to promote the use of setup moves, Recovery, Taunt, and various status moves that keep this metagame interesting.

With no switching, do we really want our setup Pokemon to be redundant against said Trick Pokemon? Do we all not realise why mentioning a few counters to Trick Pokemon is pointless? In 1v1, we are limited to choosing only three Pokemon—three Pokemon that must be chosen with fundamentally limited knowledge about whether a Pokemon has Trick or not. A Trick suspect is not only healthy for the metagame, it's also feasible, as almost every Pokemon with Trick also has a Choice item. Please understand why Trick or Trick + Choice must be limited for the sake of diversifying the 1v1 metagame.

 

[dusk raimon]

Mega Pokemon aren't a sufficient form of counterplay because it is extremely obvious to spot a mega Pokemon in team preview, offering no downsides to Pokemon with Trick.

To achieve consistency in a metagame that contradicts that very notion, Trick + Choice or Trick alone must have some sort of limitation in order to promote the use of setup moves, Recovery, Taunt, and various status moves that keep this metagame interesting.

With no switching, do we really want our setup Pokemon to be redundant against said Trick Pokemon? Do we all not realise why mentioning a few counters to Trick Pokemon is pointless? In 1v1, we are limited to choosing only three Pokemon—three Pokemon that must be chosen with fundamentally limited knowledge about whether a Pokemon has Trick or not. For the sake of diversity, a Trick suspect is not only healthy for the metagame, it's also feasible, as almost every Pokemon with Trick also has a Choice item. Please understand why Trick or Trick + Choice must be limited for the sake of diversifying the 1v1 metagame.

Adrian, trick only really afects stall, run a balanced team with stall and trick counter, or even a prankster taunt user and said trick user is immediately ruined.

 

[Rumplestiltskin]

Adrian, trick only really afects stall, run a balanced team with stall and trick counter, or even a prankster taunt user and said trick user is immediately ruined.

Here we go again with using the term "team" for 1v1. Once you pick your poke at team preview, that poke is now your "team", and you're talking about the team preview aspect. So it doesn't matter if you run a "balanced team" i.e. a collection of 3 different pokes of various archetypes, because you can only use 1 of them. And that's not really a solution, that's just a game of rock paper scissors or a coinflip at best. And that same logic can be applied to any threat pokemon or set, "just put a Bronzong on your team to counter Xerneas". See my point here? Xerneas is deemed too strong for 1v1 and yet has a simple counter like Bronzong.

And regarding using a prankster taunt, why would the TrickChoice user use trick against such a poke, while they could most likely KO it easily.
You make the point to use a "trick counter", but there is like only 1 poke that can beat all the different TrickChoice pokes.

 

[DoW]

Here we go again with using the term "team" for 1v1. Once you pick your poke at team preview, that poke is now your "team", and you're talking about the team preview aspect. So it doesn't matter if you run a "balanced team" i.e. a collection of 3 different pokes of various archetypes, because you can only use 1 of them. And that's not really a solution, that's just a game of rock paper scissors or a coinflip at best. And that same logic can be applied to any threat pokemon or set, "just put a Bronzong on your team to counter Xerneas". See my point here? Xerneas is deemed too strong for 1v1 and yet has a simple counter like Bronzong.

And regarding using a prankster taunt, why would the TrickChoice user use trick against such a poke, while they could most likely KO it easily.
You make the point to use a "trick counter", but there is like only 1 poke that can beat all the different TrickChoice pokes.

I have to say I disagree with this analysis of what a team is. In my eyes a team is a group of pokemon all of which you bring to a game at once, which attempt to cover one anothers' weaknesses. In 1v1 this is done in a different manner, sure, but I would still say that all three pokemon together make up the team.
Moreover, I disagree with your example of Xerneas. The problem with Xerneas isn't that it destroys stall, but rather that it destroys all pokemon outside of a very small number. Trick + Choice, in contrast, beats a certain amount of the metagame, but it doesn't win 99.8% of matchups, nor does it completely destroy any one playstyle, even if it makes life harder for stall.
Because of this, I'd consider a much fairer comparison with OU to be Gothitelle. It's a relevant pokemon in the metagame that's particularly good against Stall, however it's still beatable by stall and it loses to a lot of hard-hitters. I certainly wouldn't say it is broken.

 

[dusk raimon]

Here we go again with using the term "team" for 1v1. Once you pick your poke at team preview, that poke is now your "team", and you're talking about the team preview aspect. So it doesn't matter if you run a "balanced team" i.e. a collection of 3 different pokes of various archetypes, because you can only use 1 of them. And that's not really a solution, that's just a game of rock paper scissors or a coinflip at best. And that same logic can be applied to any threat pokemon or set, "just put a Bronzong on your team to counter Xerneas". See my point here? Xerneas is deemed too strong for 1v1 and yet has a simple counter like Bronzong.

And regarding using a prankster taunt, why would the TrickChoice user use trick against such a poke, while they could most likely KO it easily.
You make the point to use a "trick counter", but there is like only 1 poke that can beat all the different TrickChoice pokes.

Like U said u can only have 3 mons on a "team" not all the trick users .-.