BSS Community Create A Team

[cant say]

Yeah gonna have to call you out on most of that post:

It does need a lot of support, but like I said earlier Rotom-H and Azumarill are fantastic support for it and we already settled on those. lol.

I sort of agree with them being fine teammates, but those are really the only two you're bringing with Metagross, Ferrothorn is never getting picked with it and Porygon2 is questionable. I think we'd have a lot of trouble breaking through Blaziken / Zapdos / Ferrothorn cores tbh

Yeah, it wants Hydreigon as a partner too but Mence is by far the next best choice. We're better off against Heracross with MegaMence + MegaGross too and that was very much a need. Hydra loses to Scarf Heracross in almost any scenario (SR + Fire Blast Scarf Hydra, only way you win) and Mega Heracross can stomach a LO Flamethrower with a tad of bulk. Even uninvested it's a 31% chance to KO.

this might just be poor wording on your part, but Mega Metagross and Mega Salamence can literally never be "partners" due to us only being able to bring one of them. They do not work together apart from team preview mindgames, perhaps deterring the use of Heracross (even though Heatran + Cresselia still pressure both Salamence and Metagross enough to be able to still use Heracross imo).

I'm also not really worried about the 2% of Heracross running around with a Scarf tbh since Salamence sets up for free on them anyway.

And no one uses Life Orb + Flamethrower on Hydreigon.

Metagross gives no fuck about what set + coverage it is; it wins. Also adds an extra Fairy check since Rotom-H simply does not counter Fairy types at all, aside from Mawile/Klefki.

Ferrothorn is literally our Sylveon / Gardevoir check. Why do we want a second Steel-type to do that? You also forgot that Rotom-H beats Togekiss.

Rotom-H would actually be my go-to for Heatran. Immune to its life and can spam Volt Switch / Thunderbolt all day. If you do Trick it a Scarf, intended or otherwise, Azumarill clobbers it and Mence gets a free switch / setup.

Our Rotom does not fair well at all against Heatran, all we have is a weak Volt Switch which means we have to keep bringing Rotom in to do damage, which risks copping a Toxic or Magmar Storm on the switch. In the long run, Heatran wins. The Specs sets are even worse since we're 2HKOed by both Magmar Storm and Overheat, so not exactly "immune" by any means.

Honestly, Mega Gengar is more of a threat than Heatran imo.

I can't believe how many times I've explained that Mega Gengar is not a threat. It's the reason we're using SpD Salamence in the first place.

 

[ProjectTitan313]

Yeah gonna have to call you out on most of that post:

I sort of agree with them being fine teammates, but those are really the only two you're bringing with Metagross, Ferrothorn is never getting picked with it and Porygon2 is questionable. I think we'd have a lot of trouble breaking through Blaziken / Zapdos / Ferrothorn cores tbh


this might just be poor wording on your part, but Mega Metagross and Mega Salamence can literally never be "partners" due to us only being able to bring one of them. They do not work together apart from team preview mindgames, perhaps deterring the use of Heracross (even though Heatran + Cresselia still pressure both Salamence and Metagross enough to be able to still use Heracross imo).

I'm also not really worried about the 2% of Heracross running around with a Scarf tbh since Salamence sets up for free on them anyway.

And no one uses Life Orb + Flamethrower on Hydreigon.


Ferrothorn is literally our Sylveon / Gardevoir check. Why do we want a second Steel-type to do that? You also forgot that Rotom-H beats Togekiss.


Our Rotom does not fair well at all against Heatran, all we have is a weak Volt Switch which means we have to keep bringing Rotom in to do damage, which risks copping a Toxic or Magmar Storm on the switch. In the long run, Heatran wins. The Specs sets are even worse since we're 2HKOed by both Magmar Storm and Overheat, so not exactly "immune" by any means.


I can't believe how many times I've explained that Mega Gengar is not a threat. It's the reason we're using SpD Salamence in the first place.

I hate multiquotes :P
Blaziken + Zapdos + Ferro nails Gross + Azumarill + Rotom-H, yes. I wouldn't suggest bringing that trio in that case; that's what mence and P2 are good at.

No, not partners with Mence / Meta; that was bad wording. You could do Mega Mence + non-mega Metagross, but I can't think of a reason why you'd run it unless you're fighting a mono fighting team or something. "partner" was mostly referring to Metagross/Hydreigon.

That was the point on Heracross; it loses, hard, even with obscure sets to Metagross; I thought we needed that?

Oh, yes, there is Kiss. Ferro does have to be careful around Togekiss too; Air Slash is trolling all day, and it does have Fire / Fighting coverage (rare, but possible). So yeah Rotom-H is good there.
Hydra doesn't use LO Flamethrower, I know. Misses too many KOs. Fire Blast or bust on every set man.

Heatran, if Specs, is probably not spamming Toxic. If it's the fast SubTran set, it can't touch Mence at all and is not going to stomach CB Aqua Jet for long. Can't eat EQ (either Mega) without a Sub. If it's an offensive Shuca set that eats Metagross (if we even bring it), its still screwed by Azumarill and useless against Mega Mence if we bring that, and gets tormented by Rotom-W walling Fire+Ice+Ground while getting momentum.

But in terms of sylveon/gardevoir check, we have:

- Aegislash. Beats both. Performance against Heracross has already been discussed. Never did try Aegis + Azumarill, sounds fun. Also does a lot of things Ferrothorn does.
- Mega Gengar. Also beats both. Not sure how it does on Heracross.
- Mega Beedrill. Checks both. Does absolutely nothing to Heracross, other than give it a free kill.
- Mega Gardevoir. Whoever hits first wins. Really iffy non-mega but not entirely useless either. I like it though. Can't switch into Heracross unless it's CC, but does check it if we have enough Speed; 36 EVs and Modest gets demolished by Jolly Hera but eh that can be fixed and the Hera player needs serious balls to try it, so its not really a worry imo.
- Sylveon. Maybe better since it doesn't eat the Mega but Azumarill is good at the slow nuclear fairy gig. I'm fine with it though; works differently than Azumarill. Cannot take two hits from Heracross at all and is slower.
- Hydreigon. Dies to a lot of the same things Mence does, including Fairies, but slightly better against bulky Waters with Ice Beam. Does help a ton against Zapdos / Ferrothorn, Blaziken can't switch in. Cannot switch into Heracross at all, but can check with LO/Specs Fire Blast.
- Metagross. Also kills Sylveon/Gardevoir, most Dragons, etc. Iffy non-Mega, but can still smash Garchomp on a switch and things like that. Gives no fucks about Heracross unless you switch it into a max Speed one and eat CC + EQ and generally play really bad.

Most of the things nommed, beat Sylveon/Gardevoir too, doesn't make them entirely redundant.

Mega Gengar, I know, its not that big of an issue, but I don't think Heatran is that bad either. Between Mence, Azumarill, and Rotom we should be fine.

It's not the best, I know, but its not absolute shit either. Could work. Team does have support for it. All I'm saying. :P

 

[Omastar68]

Metagross is epic, and I always did want to see a good MetaMence team <3
For Aegislash, yeah, all I would change is a bulkier spread; maybe Sitrus / Lefties if all else fails. Big fan of Sub Aegis but I haven't used it in Singles yet, just Doubles/Rotation. Fucking disgusting in both metas, but anyway.

So I'mma steal it:

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Jolly, 252 Atk, 4 Def, 252 Speed
Ability: Clear Body (Tough Claws)

- Iron Head
- Bullet Punch / Earthquake
- Ice Punch
- Zen Headbutt

Standard spread right out of the dex, not much need to vary it. Covers us against Zapdos and Thundurus in a pinch if Rotom-H is down, and Ferrothorn can cover basically every non-Mega need.
Even if Non-Mega, still handles Heracross. Max Speed Jolly Hera outruns, but is beaten by Zen headbutt + Bullet Punch from 100% HP. Bulkier, slower sets simply eat Zen Headbutt + Iron Head. Non-crit EQ will not KO after SR.
Metagross + Azumarill + Rotom-H is a fantastic core I've been using for a while now too; they cover a ton, so Metagross fits right in. Zen Headbutt mauls Fighting types if we can't spam Mence for whatever reason.
Heracross has literally no hope if Metagross goes Mega unless it gets a crit EQ. We have 2 Ground immunes so EQ spam is questionable.
Can sweep teams weakened by Azumarill / Rotom-H / Porygon-2. All weaknesses covered by remainder of team.
Also supports P2 with a Toxic immune and massive anti-Fighting pressure. Not sure how we kill Khan though, and EQ + Rough Skin from ScarfChomp will usually drop Metagross in a way that loses the tiebreaker.

tl;dr its a flying fucking battering ram, you cannot go wrong with a 2078 pound flying battering ram when you want to kill shit.

edit: 4 Def stops 252+ Mega Heracross from KOing non-Mega Metagross with EQ; 4 HP has a 6.3% chance to die.

Well I can't leave well enuff alone, so I looked for an alternate spread and found 60 HP/ 188 Atk/ 4 Def/ 4 SpD/ 252 +Spe

This is enough bulk to always live Scarf Excadrill's EQ, which I think is big. Lots of other stuff too. Good chance to live Scarf Landog's EQ, never dies to EQ and Ice Shard from Jolly Mamo and has some chance with Adamant, never dies to max atk Kang's EQ, lower chance to die to 252 LO Gren's Dark Pulse, doesn't die to special Lucario's Focus Blast, and can sometimes even live offensive Gengar's Shadow Ball. Running more Def and less HP or the opposite seems to hurt bulk. I don't get it but yea.

I was looking to reduce atk a lot to make Gross bulkier. I found 140 atk as a benchmark since it always ohkos Timid Thund, but since 60/4/4 seemed sufficient bulk I decided to throw the rest in atk. If more bulk is wanted less atk could be run, like the least necessary to beat Thund with one Ice Punch from full 87.5% of the time.

 

[6tennis]

The more that I think about it, the more adding a mon like the Ethan special makes sense. We're using a specially defensive lure in the form of Salamence. By the same token, using physdef Aegislash as a lure makes perfect sense, as off the top of my head, I can't think of many wallbreakers, even wallbreaker cores, that can take out this pairing. Except Heracressheat. That core is stupid good, but that's aside the point. For both of these mons, one might need very specialized threats to take one out. These specialized threats might take out one of these mons, but not the other. Why not just use physdef Aegislash over Metagross? That seems like a logical choice even disregarding our team, bc it's stupid good L M A O

 

[Omastar68]

Isn't Charizard pretty bad for this team? X can take an EQ from Mence and ohko back, Ferro can't do much even if it manages to live a turn(unboosted Flame Charge,) Rotom-H is easy set up fodder, and even Azu falls to +2 Thunderpunch and has to tread lightly besides with such high power moves. P2 does good, but is susceptible to crits, and also Zard X that have set up before/ as it comes in. Plus Zard Y gives it some trouble(this is a good argument for having t-wave tho since that mostly cripples Zard Y if the oppo doesn't have LD Cress or a cleric.

This is a big strike against Aegi and Metagross imo. I wouldn't want anything bad against these two...tho that's kinda everything that's been mentioned so far as a possibility for the last slot. Beedrill can't even ohko Y with Jolly, forget about X. Gengar doesn't ohko either and is endangered by both of them. Best variant to try to take them would be HypGar, but that's no good if they're boosted Spe or it misses. Plus sleep turns.

Sylveon only 2hkos Zard Y with Specs Psyshock, anything else is quite bad, and ofc is 2hkod first unless Zard switches in. Can't take a Flare Blitz from X with normal investment. Gardevoir plainly loses to both. Hydreigon is hopeless vs X if it's slower,, and only so-so against y. Only way to kinda cover both would be Scarf Hydra.

 

[6tennis]

and even Azu falls to +2 Thunderpunch

I'm sorry what

Like actually send me replays of someone using tpunch zard I must see this

But here's the thing with Zard. Sure, a lot of our current and potential mons have trouble with one variant of Zard. However, between Zard X checks and Zard Y checks, we have our bases covered. SpDef Mence can eat stuff from Zard Y, and Rotom-H forces it out. Azumarill can bop Zard X really hard, and P2 is balk. I don't think we need a specialized counter for it.

 

[Omastar68]

I'm sorry what

Like actually send me replays of someone using tpunch zard I must see this

But here's the thing with Zard. Sure, a lot of our current and potential mons have trouble with one variant of Zard. However, between Zard X checks and Zard Y checks, we have our bases covered. SpDef Mence can eat stuff from Zard Y, and Rotom-H forces it out. Azumarill can bop Zard X really hard, and P2 is balk. I don't think we need a specialized counter for it.

T-Punch is 8.7% of Zard, not a ton but not negligible. And that wasn't really the main point-+2 anything stronger than Flame Charge from Zard X hurts a lot, and some do run wow(8%.)

I don't think we need a specialized counter for Zard(not even sure what that'd be with two forms,) but the last thing really shouldn't be bad against either form I don't think. Somethng that can at least damage them quite a bit before going down. Aegi mind games can maybe accomplish this against X, tho there is EQ, but no dice with Y, so I'm not crazy about that. Heatran has been mentioned too, and even Cress can make things a little akward with t-wave and then switch.

Ideas of what to use...not really sure. Gren is a sort of catch all mon and outspeeds Zards. Kinda awful against Hera, but maye Acrobatics could be used with a sash? too bad gems are gone. Gren can hurt Cress a lot and beat Heatran with a sash intact, so that's good for Hera cores.

 

[a0161613]

6tennis it's happened to me on PS a couple of times. Of course Char is wrecked by Aqua Jet so it's a case of beating the switch & stopping the set up.

But would Char carry Thunder Punch on cart?

I've been thinking about nominating a Ground type - I'd like to get Mamo in but not sure on what the set should be.

 

[6tennis]

a#, our team right now is mostly bulky offense. If we're gonna nom a Mamo, AV would fit the bill. It works similarly to SpDef Mence in that it lures stuff and murders things, but the Ground/Ice STAB provides us with a bit more coverage than Flying.

Oh speaking of nomming things I totally forgot to reserve the Ethan special. in a rush so can't find the spread yet tho, but Reserving Physically Defensive Aegislash

 

[a0161613]

Nomination #1

Kangaskhan-Mega (F) @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Parental Bond
Level: 50
EVs: 164 HP / 228 Atk / 116 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Secret Power/Return
- Substitute
- Sucker Punch
- Fire Punch / Ice Punch

This gave me some trouble on the ladder. I've slashed in Ice Punch for dragons and ground types which appear troublesome and Return because it's not Double Edge. I took it from the sample teams thread so I'm happy that there is room for customisation, I've assumed that this is the bulky Kang spread.

Nomination #2

Mamoswine @ Assault Vest
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 44 HP / 156 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpD / 52 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Spear/Icicle Crash
- Fissure/Rock Tomb/Knock Off/Superpower

I've added additional slashes but this is the AV set from the analysis. It's what I had been thinking of before 6tennis confirmed it. It fits the nature of the team. Both of these sets give much needed priority and a mix of coverage and power.

I'm going to extend the deadline for this to this time tomorrow.

 

[Omastar68]

Hope i'm actually onto something this time. Prolly shoulda thot of this one sooner.

I think Mega Altaria would be nearly perfect for the last slot. She's one of the few things to take hits somewhat comfortably from Zard X(and ohko with Draco Meteor,) while Cloud Nine pre-Mega removes Zard Y's sun and she can still do very good with sun up. Hera and Heatran are beat(Tran can possibly take EQ from uninvested neutral atk, might need some evs there. 252/0 MAlt can take a 252 +SpA Tran's Flash Cannon from full,) tho sadly Cress is not. Even Greninja which has been mentioned and is still a bit threatening is far from a sure thing against MAlt-even just 252/0 can take standard Gren's Ice Beam a little over half the time, and many Gren will be less SpA or even not LO. Another realy important thing is the ability to bypass Sub with Hyper Voice. This takes Gliscor out of the picture unless it gets very lucky with Guillotine(we don't wanna bring Mence if we see Gliscor most likely,) and is also relevant for a few other subbers like Thund(unfortunately many subbers resist fairy, but you can't win 'em all.) We also have Ferro, Rotom-h, and P2-the #1, 5, and 18 teammates for MAlt, respectively.

There are still some problems with MAlt tho. For one, a -Spe nature is necessary to do much with EQ and to likely kill standard Tran with it in one hit. Another is a bit of overlap with Mence-she is immune to dragon instead of weak to it tho, and mainly special(one i'm thinking anyways,) instead of physical. Much nicer vs. Rotoms since she reists STAB combos of both relevant ones. HP Ice really doesn't matter much, unlike with Mence(I mean it'll take them, but theycount for a lot more against Mence, particularly if it's parad.) Not beating Cress is kind of unfortunate, altho i'm actually not even sure that's TRUE since Roost has more PP than Moonlight. Still, status kinda makes it a bad matchup.

So if someone else would nom MAlt that'd b cool. I'd want this to win over my own Sylveon...but i'd b fine with whoever taking the credit lol.

 

[a0161613]

Hope i'm actually onto something this time. Prolly shoulda thot of this one sooner.

I think Mega Altaria would be nearly perfect for the last slot. She's one of the few things to take hits somewhat comfortably from Zard X(and ohko with Draco Meteor,) while Cloud Nine pre-Mega removes Zard Y's sun and she can still do very good with sun up. Hera and Heatran are beat(Tran can possibly take EQ from uninvested neutral atk, might need some evs there. 252/0 MAlt can take a 252 +SpA Tran's Flash Cannon from full,) tho sadly Cress is not. Even Greninja which has been mentioned and is still a bit threatening is far from a sure thing against MAlt-even just 252/0 can take standard Gren's Ice Beam a little over half the time, and many Gren will be less SpA or even not LO. Another realy important thing is the ability to bypass Sub with Hyper Voice. This takes Gliscor out of the picture unless it gets very lucky with Guillotine(we don't wanna bring Mence if we see Gliscor most likely,) and is also relevant for a few other subbers like Thund(unfortunately many subbers resist fairy, but you can't win 'em all.) We also have Ferro, Rotom-h, and P2-the #1, 5, and 18 teammates for MAlt, respectively.

There are still some problems with MAlt tho. For one, a -Spe nature is necessary to do much with EQ and to likely kill standard Tran with it in one hit. Another is a bit of overlap with Mence-she is immune to dragon instead of weak to it tho, and mainly special(one i'm thinking anyways,) instead of physical. Much nicer vs. Rotoms since she reists STAB combos of both relevant ones. HP Ice really doesn't matter much, unlike with Mence(I mean it'll take them, but theycount for a lot more against Mence, particularly if it's parad.) Not beating Cress is kind of unfortunate, altho i'm actually not even sure that's TRUE since Roost has more PP than Moonlight. Still, status kinda makes it a bad matchup.

So if someone else would nom MAlt that'd b cool. I'd want this to win over my own Sylveon...but i'd b fine with whoever taking the credit lol.

You could nominate it. Two per round.

 

[Omastar68]

You could nominate it. Two per round.

Thanks, didn't figure it out even tho other people have done two^^ I guess cuz everyone else who's nommed two put them in one post.

Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Cloud Nine/ Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP/ 12 Atk/ 164 SpA/ 80 SpD
Quiet Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Toxic/ Dragon Pulse
- Roost
- Earthquake

EVs might seem a bit complicated, but didn't take too long to find considering the few specific threats mentioned and the set that comes up when you start typing Altaria is fairly close. 156 +SpA would be enough to ohko standard Hera and non-bulky Char X 93.8% of the time, but had 8 leftover EVs. Atk slightly increases chance to ohko 252/0 Tran-81.3% instead of 68.8. Not too much for bulk and cuz stuff like how Tran can't switch in. SpD stops standard Gren from ohkoing from full-it'd need Specs(as if) to ever really do that.

Dragon Pulse is a little weird, but there's like no reason for DM with fairy STAB, especially when non-bulky Zard X is already ohkod 93.8% of the time-always with recoil ofc. DM isn't any good vs Y, while DP at least 3hkos non-bulky ones. Considering how specialized the use of Dragon STAB is here, I'm leaning towards Toxic for Cress and those types of things. Ability I was immediately drawn to Cloud Nine for Char Y, but even in sun Fire Blast is virtually incapable of 2hkoing, and nothing else will. I guess it's still an ok option, but Natural Cure is great for Toxic and T-Wave especially(important for Cress.) It's also important to note that MAlt lives DE from max Atk Kang even without any Def, and is a full stop to Chomp.

 

[6tennis]

a#, make these comps faster in the future. Wanna start pumping out somewhat regular streams.

 

[a0161613]

a#, make these comps faster in the future. Wanna start pumping out somewhat regular streams.

Yes it will need to have set days for each bit. But I'm not sure if I want to do more than this one before Sun & Moon. I'll take a quick when we've started testing.

I'm fairly happy with the speed of this one though. It's going to be tough to do one per month I think.

We'll see.

 

[6tennis]

1 per month sounds reasonable. I can do bimonthly streams or something idk.

 

[a0161613]

OK final voting round:

ethan06
Life Orb Weavile

Omastar68
Choice Specs Sylveon
Mega Altaria

6tennis
Ethan Special Aegislash (Phys Def)

cant say
Mega Gengar
Mega Beedrill
Life Orb Sylveon
Mega Gardevoir
Hydreigon

CoolStoryBrobat
WP Aegislash

ProjectTitan313
Mega Metagross

@Numbers
Mega Kangaskhan
AV Mamoswine

I know cant say has five noms but I had been tempted to revoke the two nom rule for this round anyway and he's made great picks anyway.

I'm looking to round this up quickly so deadline will be Saturday. I'm going to breed the team on Saturday so I should be able to start distributing around this time next week to those who would like to take part in one cart testing.

 

[ethan06]

6tennis you forgot to nom ethan special D: oh well, voting CSB's WP Aegislash instead. Physically defensive does the job for this team a lot better though imo

6tennis' Physically Defensive Aegislash

 

[Nelson Tangela]

can not say's Mega Gengar

 

[a0161613]

6tennis you forgot to nom ethan special D: oh well, voting CSB's WP Aegislash instead. Physically defensive does the job for this team a lot better though imo

I'll edit it in. I've done it a couple of times previously. You can edit your post if you want.

If the full set could be posted or edited in that would be excellent :)

 

[cant say]

There was a 2-nom limit? Whoops lol. I was just throwing out ideas anyway

I think we should hold off on breeding it just yet, usually these CCaT's have a reviewing period for any tweaks / optimisations we think we should do. Just like you'd do when building your own team, you wouldn't just stop after adding the last mon!

 

[6tennis]

someone wanna give me a capture card lol

else i'll have to PS! it

 

[ProjectTitan313]

It's all breedables... and I have Mence / Azu / Rotom-H / Ferro just laying around in boxes

 

[a0161613]

Yeah I'm not fussed about the breeding work, not that I'd turn away the help.

Getting fodder to trade for clones may be the hardest part lol

 

[Omastar68]

6tennis' Phys Def Aegi