I believe ToxicJet and Shock Jet suffer a damage penalty since they involve a priority move. It should be 2 and 11 damage respectively, I think.
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Data Combination Testing Thread
- Thread starter Deck Knight
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I'm not sure this is the best place to ask about this, but I figure it pertains mainly to combinations so I will ask here: How does Torment affect combination usage?
In a battle I am reffing (don't look at it if you think it will bias you?), one combatant used Waterfall in the previous round, and is attempting to use a combo of Aqua Jet/Waterfall in the current round... HOWEVER, earlier in the current round the opponent is using Torment.
How should the combo be reffed? I can see sides for reffing it lots of different ways, allowing the combo (as a combo makes a new move), splitting the combo and just doing Aqua Jet, splitting the combo and just doing Aqua Jet with the whole combo's energy, or having the whole combo fail (because each piece is integral to its success), but I am neutral to all of them.
In a battle I am reffing (don't look at it if you think it will bias you?), one combatant used Waterfall in the previous round, and is attempting to use a combo of Aqua Jet/Waterfall in the current round... HOWEVER, earlier in the current round the opponent is using Torment.
How should the combo be reffed? I can see sides for reffing it lots of different ways, allowing the combo (as a combo makes a new move), splitting the combo and just doing Aqua Jet, splitting the combo and just doing Aqua Jet with the whole combo's energy, or having the whole combo fail (because each piece is integral to its success), but I am neutral to all of them.
Let's see if I can get non-attacking moves right. Both of these crack me up a bit.
Swagger + Attract
Combination: The Pokémon flaunts their style, impressing opposite-gender foes and leaving them in a tizzy with their mad flair. The target foe is left both infatuated and confused; with a two-stage boost in Attack.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 95% | Energy Cost: 19 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: -2 | CT: Passive
Teeter Dance + Attract
Combination: The Pokémon bewilders opposite-gender opponents and allies; drawing all attention to itself with a mystifying dance. The dance leaves targets dumbstruck; confusing them all and infatuating those of opposite gender.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 17 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: -2 | CT: Passive
Swagger + Attract
Swagger: The Pokemon intimidatingly taunts the opponent, increasing their Attack by two (2) stages but confusing them as well.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 90% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attract: The Pokemon flirts with an opponent, releasing pink hearts from its body. It causes opponents of the opposite gender to be infatuated with the Pokemon and reduces their chance of attacking or otherwise using their attacks productively.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 90% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attract: The Pokemon flirts with an opponent, releasing pink hearts from its body. It causes opponents of the opposite gender to be infatuated with the Pokemon and reduces their chance of attacking or otherwise using their attacks productively.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 95% | Energy Cost: 19 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: -2 | CT: Passive
Teeter Dance + Attract
Teeter Dance: The Pokemon starts dancing a popular, captivating underground dance that includes spinning. The Pokemon spins so quickly it leaves an afterimage. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 5 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attract: The Pokemon flirts with an opponent, releasing pink hearts from its body. It causes opponents of the opposite gender to be infatuated with the Pokemon and reduces their chance of attacking or otherwise using their attacks productively.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 5 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attract: The Pokemon flirts with an opponent, releasing pink hearts from its body. It causes opponents of the opposite gender to be infatuated with the Pokemon and reduces their chance of attacking or otherwise using their attacks productively.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 17 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: -2 | CT: Passive
Toxic + Explosion
So, if this is a vaild combo, it's a 25 BP normal-type move with 95% accuracy, -2 priority, an energy cost of 40.5 (round to 41) and it hits all adjacent mons and inflicts toxic poison on all adjacent mons and the user faints after use. Is that right?
EDIT: Psyshock + Psybeam:
So its BP is 15, its accuracy is 100%, its EC is 16.5 (round to 17), its typing is Psychic, its priority is -2 and it calculates damage with the opponent's defence stat instead of special defence and has a 10% chance of confusion, correct?
Toxic: The Pokemon lets out a dark purple gas at the opponent. The gas enters the opponent’s body through the pores and poisons the opponent. Over time the Toxic damage will gradually increase each round from 1 HP per action to 5 HP per action. Toxic damage resets if the Pokemon switches out.
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 90% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Poison | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Explosion: The Pokemon mechanically, through the mixing of noxious gases, or simply by release of pent up pressure, creates a massive explosion, fainting itself and causing massive damage to the opponent. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: 25 (user faints) | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 20 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Force
Attack Power: -- | Accuracy: 90% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Other | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Poison | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Explosion: The Pokemon mechanically, through the mixing of noxious gases, or simply by release of pent up pressure, creates a massive explosion, fainting itself and causing massive damage to the opponent. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: 25 (user faints) | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 20 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 0 | CT: Force
So, if this is a vaild combo, it's a 25 BP normal-type move with 95% accuracy, -2 priority, an energy cost of 40.5 (round to 41) and it hits all adjacent mons and inflicts toxic poison on all adjacent mons and the user faints after use. Is that right?
EDIT: Psyshock + Psybeam:
Psyshock: The Pokemon materializes its brain waves and sends them crashing into the opponent, hitting their Defense instead of their Special Defense.
Attack Power: 8 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Psychic | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Psybeam: The Pokemon fires a shifting beam of mental energy at the opponent. The disorienting waves can confuse the opponent.
Attack Power: 7 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 5 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% | Typing: Psychic | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Attack Power: 8 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Psychic | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Psybeam: The Pokemon fires a shifting beam of mental energy at the opponent. The disorienting waves can confuse the opponent.
Attack Power: 7 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 5 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% | Typing: Psychic | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
So its BP is 15, its accuracy is 100%, its EC is 16.5 (round to 17), its typing is Psychic, its priority is -2 and it calculates damage with the opponent's defence stat instead of special defence and has a 10% chance of confusion, correct?
Surf+Iron Tail
20 BP (half special, half physical)
21 EN
30% Flinch
87.5% Accuracy
-2 Priority
Water Type
Super Extremespeed
18 BP (it says nothing about a >0 prio move with another >0 prio move)
32 EN
+4 Priority
100% Accuracy
Normal Type
Fire Blast+Fire Blast
27 BP
56 EN
10% Burn
85% Accuracy
-2 Priority
Fire Type
Earthquake+Focus Punch
25 BP
24 EN
Focus must be maintained.
100% Accuracy
Charge: +6 Priority, Attack: -5 Priority
Ground Type
Earthquake+Megahorn
22 BP
22.5 EN
92.5% Accuracy
-2 Priority
Ground Type
Earthquake+Smack Down
15 BP
16.5 EN
Target crashes to the ground
-2 Priority
Ground Type
Surf: The Pokemon summons a huge wave and rides it, crashing it down on the opponent. When Surf strikes a Pokemon in the middle of a Dive, it's Base Attack Power is 15 instead of 10. A water source such as a lake or ocean is necessary. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Water | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Iron Tail: The Pokemon coats its tail in iron and sweeps it into the opponent. It can lower the opponent's defense by one (1) stage.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 75% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 30% | Typing: Steel | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Water | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Iron Tail: The Pokemon coats its tail in iron and sweeps it into the opponent. It can lower the opponent's defense by one (1) stage.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 75% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 30% | Typing: Steel | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
20 BP (half special, half physical)
21 EN
30% Flinch
87.5% Accuracy
-2 Priority
Water Type
Super Extremespeed
ExtremeSpeed: The Pokemon tackles the opponent with blinding speed. The attack is so blindingly fast it strikes even before other priority attacks. Only Fake Out can strike more quickly.
Attack Power: 8 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 2 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: 8 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 6 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Normal | Priority: 2 | CT: Passive
18 BP (it says nothing about a >0 prio move with another >0 prio move)
32 EN
+4 Priority
100% Accuracy
Normal Type
Fire Blast+Fire Blast
Fire Blast: The Pokémon summons a massive blast of fire that takes the shape of the Kanji. It has a chance to burn the opponent.
Attack Power: 12 | Accuracy: 85% | Energy Cost: 8 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% | Typing: Fire | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Attack Power: 12 | Accuracy: 85% | Energy Cost: 8 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% | Typing: Fire | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
27 BP
56 EN
10% Burn
85% Accuracy
-2 Priority
Fire Type
Earthquake+Focus Punch
Earthquake: The Pokemon uses it mighty heft or inherent knowledge of tectonic manipulation to trigger an earthquake. The splitting earth and sudden impact causes major internal and external damage to the target. Trainers are encouraged to exercise caution and common sense when using this attack in certain structures. When Earthquake strikes a Pokemon in the middle of Dig, its Base Attack Power is 15 instead of 10. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Ground | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Focus Punch: The Pokémon’s fist glows white, gathering a massive amount of energy. While charging, the Pokemon must maintain absolute focus, or else the attack will fail.
Attack Power: 15 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 9 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Fighting | Priority: Charge: 6, Attack: -3. | CT: Passive
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Ground | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Focus Punch: The Pokémon’s fist glows white, gathering a massive amount of energy. While charging, the Pokemon must maintain absolute focus, or else the attack will fail.
Attack Power: 15 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 9 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Fighting | Priority: Charge: 6, Attack: -3. | CT: Passive
25 BP
24 EN
Focus must be maintained.
100% Accuracy
Charge: +6 Priority, Attack: -5 Priority
Ground Type
Earthquake+Megahorn
Earthquake: The Pokemon uses it mighty heft or inherent knowledge of tectonic manipulation to trigger an earthquake. The splitting earth and sudden impact causes major internal and external damage to the target. Trainers are encouraged to exercise caution and common sense when using this attack in certain structures. When Earthquake strikes a Pokemon in the middle of Dig, its Base Attack Power is 15 instead of 10. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Ground | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Megahorn: The Pokémon’s horn glows with a white sheen and rams it straight into the opponent.
Attack Power: 12 | Accuracy: 85% | Energy Cost: 8 | Attack Type: Physical: | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Bug | Priority: 0 | CT: Force
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Ground | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Megahorn: The Pokémon’s horn glows with a white sheen and rams it straight into the opponent.
Attack Power: 12 | Accuracy: 85% | Energy Cost: 8 | Attack Type: Physical: | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Bug | Priority: 0 | CT: Force
22 BP
22.5 EN
92.5% Accuracy
-2 Priority
Ground Type
Earthquake+Smack Down
Earthquake: The Pokemon uses it mighty heft or inherent knowledge of tectonic manipulation to trigger an earthquake. The splitting earth and sudden impact causes major internal and external damage to the target. Trainers are encouraged to exercise caution and common sense when using this attack in certain structures. When Earthquake strikes a Pokemon in the middle of Dig, its Base Attack Power is 15 instead of 10. This attack hits all adjacent Pokemon.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Ground | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Smack Down: The Pokemon hurls an energized rock or other natural materials at its opponent. The energized field disrupts an opponent's flight or levitating capabilities and they come crashing to the ground for six (6) actions. They will be unable to fly or evade Ground-type attacks until the effect wears off. With some effort they can use electromagnetic or ballast capabilities to hover and move; however, they will be stuck low enough to the ground to be effected until Smack Down's effect wears off. Smack Down's effect does not apply to the opponent if it is behind a Substitute or if it is using Roost on the turn that Smack Down is used.
Attack Power: 5 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 4 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Rock | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Ground | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
Smack Down: The Pokemon hurls an energized rock or other natural materials at its opponent. The energized field disrupts an opponent's flight or levitating capabilities and they come crashing to the ground for six (6) actions. They will be unable to fly or evade Ground-type attacks until the effect wears off. With some effort they can use electromagnetic or ballast capabilities to hover and move; however, they will be stuck low enough to the ground to be effected until Smack Down's effect wears off. Smack Down's effect does not apply to the opponent if it is behind a Substitute or if it is using Roost on the turn that Smack Down is used.
Attack Power: 5 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 4 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Rock | Priority: 0 | CT: Set
15 BP
16.5 EN
Target crashes to the ground
-2 Priority
Ground Type
Couple of questions:
Why in the Extremespeed + Bullet Punch example is there no BP halved for Extremespeed as well as bullet punch?
And how does priority power loss work in a combo of 2 identical priority moves - Mach Punch + Mach Punch, for example.
Also, am I the only person who finds 2*same move EN costs ridiculously high? Assumming E = Combo EN Cost and X = Base EN cost of the move, the formula is:
E = 4X + 8
Which is ridiculous. An 8 EN move costs 40 EN to combo, a 10 EN move costs 48 EN. There is something obscenely high here.
Why in the Extremespeed + Bullet Punch example is there no BP halved for Extremespeed as well as bullet punch?
And how does priority power loss work in a combo of 2 identical priority moves - Mach Punch + Mach Punch, for example.
Also, am I the only person who finds 2*same move EN costs ridiculously high? Assumming E = Combo EN Cost and X = Base EN cost of the move, the formula is:
E = 4X + 8
Which is ridiculous. An 8 EN move costs 40 EN to combo, a 10 EN move costs 48 EN. There is something obscenely high here.
Because ExtremeSpeed is the primary power move. You don't halve all priority moves, only supporting ones. So in the case of Earthquake + Mach Punch, Mach Punch is halved, just like in the case of ExtremeSpeed + Mach Punch. If you were doing something like Earthquake + ExtremeSpeed, ExtremeSpeed's BAP would be halved because it's the supporting move in such a case.dogfish44 said:
Also, those energy costs are intentionally prohibitive. Same-move combos shouldn't get used often to both encourage diversity and creativity.
Here's something I wanted to try out in a battle against Albinoloon. Great combo imo.
A Stratagem line exclusive move, but still an interesting combo!
Basicly, a defensive take on Rebble / Boulderdash / Stratagem. A high chance of burn or an attack drop (30% total) allows you to potentially cripple the foe, while this combination provides for a powerful Fire type attack outside of the average Flamethrower.
Paleo Wave: The Pokemon fires a beam of ancient energy that can disrupt the opponent's offensive power, lowering their Attack by one (1) stage.
Attack Power: 9 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 20% | Typing: Rock | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Attack Power: 9 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 20% | Typing: Rock | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Flamethrower: The Pokémon emits a stream of flames from its mouth. It has a chance to burn.
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% | Typing: Fire | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
Attack Power: 10 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 7 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% | Typing: Fire | Priority: 0 | CT: Elemental
A Stratagem line exclusive move, but still an interesting combo!
Magma Surge: The pokemon fires a destructive stream of magma from it's mouth; drawing energy from it's core. It's intensity has a chance to burn the opponent, or cause it's Attack to fall one (1) stage.
Attack Power: 19 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 21 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% Burn; 20% Special Defense drop | Typing: Fire | Priority: -2 | CT: Elemental
Attack Power: 19 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 21 | Attack Type: Special | Effect Chance: 10% Burn; 20% Special Defense drop | Typing: Fire | Priority: -2 | CT: Elemental
Basicly, a defensive take on Rebble / Boulderdash / Stratagem. A high chance of burn or an attack drop (30% total) allows you to potentially cripple the foe, while this combination provides for a powerful Fire type attack outside of the average Flamethrower.
I think it would be more of a "Magma Stream" coming from Stratagem's "mouth."
Fixed.
I am not sure how stuff like this would work for Scizor, since he has Technician and Light Metal. So, here is what I think it would look like.
I am not sure if Light Metal and Technician should come in after the combo, but I sure hope not! I would like a second opinion on this, as with my Scizor (and even Metagross) I would love to use combos mixing up Bullet Punch, Rock Smash, Pursuit, Fury Cutter, and possibly even other moves.
Bullet Punch: The Pokemon energizes their fist with a steely glow then delivers a lightning-quick strike on the opponent, outpacing their attack.
Attack Power: 4 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 3 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Steel | Priority: 1 | CT: Elemental
After Technician and Light Metal come in:
Bullet Punch: The Pokemon energizes their fist with a steely glow then delivers a lightning-quick strike on the opponent, outpacing their attack.
Attack Power: 6 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 4 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Steel | Priority: 2 | CT: Elemental
Attack Power: 4 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 3 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Steel | Priority: 1 | CT: Elemental
After Technician and Light Metal come in:
Bullet Punch: The Pokemon energizes their fist with a steely glow then delivers a lightning-quick strike on the opponent, outpacing their attack.
Attack Power: 6 | Accuracy: 100% | Energy Cost: 4 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: -- | Typing: Steel | Priority: 2 | CT: Elemental
Rock Smash: The Pokemon smashes the ground or a free-standing boulder near the opponent, shattering it to pieces. The quick impact of the rocks can lower the opponent's Defense by one (1) stage.
Attack Power: 4 | Accuracy: -- | Energy Cost: 3 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 50% | Typing: Fighting | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Rock Smash: The Pokemon smashes the ground or a free-standing boulder near the opponent, shattering it to pieces. The quick impact of the rocks can lower the opponent's Defense by one (1) stage. The user outpaces the opponents attacks.
Attack Power: 6 | Accuracy: -- | Energy Cost: 4 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 50% | Typing: Fighting | Priority: 1 | CT: Passive
Attack Power: 4 | Accuracy: -- | Energy Cost: 3 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 50% | Typing: Fighting | Priority: 0 | CT: Passive
Rock Smash: The Pokemon smashes the ground or a free-standing boulder near the opponent, shattering it to pieces. The quick impact of the rocks can lower the opponent's Defense by one (1) stage. The user outpaces the opponents attacks.
Attack Power: 6 | Accuracy: -- | Energy Cost: 4 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 50% | Typing: Fighting | Priority: 1 | CT: Passive
Bullet Smash: The Pokemon energizes their fist with a steely glow then delivers a lightning-quick smash to the ground or a free-standing boulder near the opponent, shattering it to pieces and outpacing the opponent. The quick impact of the rocks can lower the opponent's Defense by one (1) stage.
Attack Power: 9 | Accuracy: -- | Energy Cost: 12 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 50% | Typing: Steel | Priority: 3
Attack Power: 9 | Accuracy: -- | Energy Cost: 12 | Attack Type: Physical | Effect Chance: 50% | Typing: Steel | Priority: 3
I am not sure if Light Metal and Technician should come in after the combo, but I sure hope not! I would like a second opinion on this, as with my Scizor (and even Metagross) I would love to use combos mixing up Bullet Punch, Rock Smash, Pursuit, Fury Cutter, and possibly even other moves.
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