Bulky Water a-gogo! Lapras Discussion.

ADH

#131 Lapras (Water / Ice)
Base Stats: 130 HP / 85 Atk / 80 Def / 85 SAtk / 95 SDef / 60 Spd
Ability 1: Water Absorb
Ability 2: Shell Armor

http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-dp/131.shtml

Notable Physical Moves
Ice Pebble
Snow Slide
Waterfall
Body Slam

Notable Special Moves
Ice Beam
Blizzard
Surf
Tide
Hydro Pump
Thunderbolt
Thunder
Psychic
Dragon Pulse
Ancientpower
Hidden Power (duh)

Notable Support Moves
Sing
Tickle
Safeguard
Roar
Protect
Sleep Talk
Dragon Dance
Curse
Rest
Toxic

Lapras seems to have a lot of potential as an OU in D/P. That base HP and otherwise good stat distribution (outside of speed) seems to be quite nice. There seems to be a lot of possibilities for this Pokemon, perhaps even as a Garchomp counter. Gyarados doesn't shut it down like it does to most bulky waters as well, since Lapras has Thunderbolt / Thunder to play with.

Lapras @ Leftovers
Nature: Modest (+SAtk -Atk)
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 60 HP / 252 Def / 196 SAtk
-Ice Beam
-Thunderbolt
-Surf / Hydro Pump
-Protect

STAB Ice Beam OHKOs Garchomp and does a good amount of damage to anything that doesn't resist it outside of Blissey. Thunderbolt makes for the second part of boltbeam and counters the heck out of Gyarados. This Lapras can take Stone Edge from Garchomp and Gyarados and OHKO them with the respective moves. Surf and Hydro Pump gives you a second good STAB to play with. Protect may seem odd, but with 130 base HP Lapras loves free Leftovers healing, and it pays to test for strange Hidden Powers and possible Stone Edges from the likes of Heracross and company.

Lapras @ Leftovers
Nature: Quiet (+SAtk -Spd)
Trait: Shell Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 60 SAtk / 196 SDef
-Curse
-Snow Slide
-Thunderbolt
-Waterfall / Rest

Curse with Shell Armor can't be broken by critical hits, allowing you to curse up against most physical attackers. Snow Slide will OHKO most things that attack you after two Curses while you have Thunderbolt to keep Gyarados from Taunting you and DDing up. Waterfall or Rest pans out the moveset. Waterfall keeps TTar away, it should be noted, but you may want to heal and remove status.

Lapras @ Leftovers
Nature: Adamant (+Atk -SAtk)
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 132HP / 100 Atk / 176 Spd / 100 SAtk
-Dragon Dance
-Ice Beam / Ice Pebble
-Waterfall
-Thunderbolt

Water Absorb gives you free switch-ins against things like Suicune and Vaporeon. Dragon Dance once and you're faster than all base 100 Pokemon that don't run a +spd nature. DD twice and you're faster than everything in the metagame. Ice Beam deals more damage than Ice Pebble prior to the second DD probably, and Thunderbolt, as always, scares off Skarmory and Gyarados. Waterfall STAB is your main physical attack, as Ice Pebble is rather situational (mainly against DDing dragons).
 
If there's anything cool about Lapras, it's his ability to counter Waterfall/Ice Fang Gyarados with Thunderbolt...with some Defense he should be able to withstand Earthquakes as well. The gay part of course is where Stealth Rock is down and Lapras eats 25% damage every time. The even gayer part is where Gyarados used Stone Edge and shuts down Lapras completely.

I wish Lapras had a reliable recovery move like, well, Recover. Its best option to stay alive is Rest/Sleep Talk, and while it's good at that, its versatility is still hurt badly. With Sing it really tends to become a bad Milotic of sorts.
 
Mekkah said:
If there's anything cool about Lapras, it's his ability to counter Waterfall/Ice Fang Gyarados with Thunderbolt...with some Defense he should be able to withstand Earthquakes as well. The gay part of course is where Stealth Rock is down and Lapras eats 25% damage every time. The even gayer part is where Gyarados used Stone Edge and shuts down Lapras completely.

I wish Lapras had a reliable recovery move like, well, Recover. Its best option to stay alive is Rest/Sleep Talk, and while it's good at that, its versatility is still hurt badly. With Sing it really tends to become a bad Milotic of sorts.
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Just pair Lapras with some sexy rock-resisting Poke to switch to and have a Rapid Spinner on the team. I don't see Stealth Rock weakness as game-breaking to it since it can switch into water attacks with Water Absorb to get back the HP it loses from it. Donphan being paired with it goes a long way to helping it out too since he resists Stealth Rock and Stone Edge and can take on Gyarados without Waterfall without too much trouble. You could also pair Lapras with Rhysuperior, but it has a 2.66x weakness to Waterfall Gyarados with its super-effective lowering ability.

All you really need to do is abuse Water Absorb, since Pokes like Swampert and Milotic do shit damage against it and Lapras gobbles up HP for free. Lapras is the anti-bulky water bulky water.

So eh, to each his own.
 
Never really saw Lapras as a bulky water in the same vein as Swampert, Milotic, etc. Like you said he's an anti-water type, but he's got a bit of competition from Empoleon now.

Countering both Garchomp and Gyarados with one Pokemon is cool though. Until Stealth Rock happens to appear or one of them uses Stone Edge. Another good theory ruined.
 
Umm, is it just me, or is Shell Armor for the first set a mistake? I think Water Absorb would be cool for a bulky water.

I really hate Lapras' Rock and Fighting weaknesses. Otherwise, it's quite a cool Pokemon.
 
Phuquoph said:
Never really saw Lapras as a bulky water in the same vein as Swampert, Milotic, etc. Like you said he's an anti-water type, but he's got a bit of competition from Empoleon now.

Countering both Garchomp and Gyarados with one Pokemon is cool though. Until Stealth Rock happens to appear or one of them uses Stone Edge. Another good theory ruined.
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That's why you have something that resists rock on your team, switch in who you think can best take the hit. All it takes is some prediction.

X-Act said:
Umm, is it just me, or is Shell Armor for the first set a mistake? I think Water Absorb would be cool for a bulky water.

I really hate Lapras' Rock and Fighting weaknesses. Otherwise, it's quite a cool Pokemon.
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It was a mistake, fixed.
 
That works for Stone Edge, not for Stealth Rock. It ruins Lapras' chances of countering Garchomp, he can still take most Gyarados though.
 
Phuquoph said:
That works for Stone Edge, not for Stealth Rock. It ruins Lapras' chances of countering Garchomp, he can still take most Gyarados though.
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Having Donphan on the team serves both purposes, as it can Rapid Spin away those annoying spikes and then you can switch to Lapras after getting rid of them. Only a few Stealth Rock Pokemon don't mind taking Surf / Ice Beam, namely Registeel, Metagross, Bronzong, and I'm probably forgetting somebody.
 
Rapid Spinning off Stealth Rock is annoying, Pokemon like Donphan, Rhysuperior, Skarmory and Swampert come in so easily to put it back in place at once. You simply cannot take them off all the time with Rapid Spin. More effort than it's worth.
 
Whirlpool Lapras has returned!

Lapras @ Quick Claw/Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
Bold Nature (+Def., -Atk.) OR Calm Nature (+SD, -Atk.)
252 HP / 6 SA / 252 SD

Whirlpool
Ice Beam/Confuse Ray
Perish Song
Protect/Confuse Ray

- We all remember when Lapras was able to Whirlpool & Perish Song in Pokemon Stadium 2. It now can do it again. Quick Claw allows Lapras to possibly move first to set up Whirlpool in case anyone tries to switch, but Leftovers can also be an option. Ice Beam is there for the filler. Confuse Ray can possibly replace either move, but I personally think Ice Beam & Protect are fine without Confuse Ray.
 
lol Quick Claw.
I think of Lapras as being a strange combination of Mantine, Regice, and Milotic- and it can work as all three, but in a sub-par way.
 
Seeing as Garchomp will almost never run Stone Edge, that point is null and void. Gyarados running it is a viable threat and will probably be the DP Standard after a while.

359 Attack Garchomp EQ on Max/Max Neutral Nature Lapras:
33~38%, 58~63% after Stealth Rock
359 Attack Garchomp EQ on Max/Max Beneficial Nature Lapras:
30~35%, 55~60% after Stealth Rock
Swords Danced 359 Attack Garchomp EQ on Max/Max Neutral Nature Lapras:
65~76%, 90~101% after Stealth Rock
Swords Danced 359 Attack Garchomp EQ on Max/Max Beneficial Nature Lapras:
59~69%, 84~94% after Stealth Rock

Lapras has an obvious OHKO with Ice Beam because of STAB.

Gyarados' EQ will be significantly weaker due to lack of STAB and the fact that Dragon Dance is only a +1 Attack boost. Once again, Lapras dies easily to a Stone Edge Gyarados.
 
If a T-tar carries both Crunch and Stone Edge, its already lowered its coverage ability quite a bit. UU Lapras will be fun to use with DD.

I'm considering Sing/Dragon Dance/Waterfall/Body Slam. When a Wall or Hazer comes in, Sing it to sleep and Start DDing.
 
CoolTrainer20 said:
If a T-tar carries both Crunch and Stone Edge, its already lowered its coverage ability quite a bit. UU Lapras will be fun to use with DD.

I'm considering Sing/Dragon Dance/Waterfall/Body Slam. When a Wall or Hazer comes in, Sing it to sleep and Start DDing.
Click to expand...

CBTar, which is really the only TTar worth caring about. Curse Lapras would be better in UU anyways.
 
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