Elgyem (Analysis) [GP 0/2]




Status: Ready for GP Checks



[Overview]
<p>Elgyem is one of the few Pokemon that work in most forms of teams. On defensive teams, it is a great supportive Pokemon, being able use moves like Dual Screens, Thunder Wave, Trick Room, and Disable, and it has instant recovery in Recover. On Offensive teams, it has a great 85 Special Attack and a great attacking movepool that includes Thunderbolt, Energy Ball, and Shadow Ball, and has access to boosting moves such as Nasty Plot and Calm Mind. It also one of the few offensive Pokemon that can set up Trick Room effectively. It also has a resistance to Fighting-type moves, so that also gives it a unique niche in LC. </p>

<p>But no Pokemon come without downsides, and Elgyem is not an exception. First and foremost, it's Psychic- typing grants it weaknesses to common Dark- and Ghost- type moves. Second, outside of the aforementioned moves, most of his movepool consists of gimmick moves like Wonder Room, Guard Swap, Power Swap, Simple Beam, Guard Split, and Power Split. Third, it's counter list includes a few of the most used Pokemon in LC, consisting of Scraggy, Frillish, and Houndour. Last, it is abysmally slow, with 30 base Speed and no way to boost it and no priority to fix it. Not to mention, it has tough competition with other Psychic- types like Abra and Solosis. All in all, Elgyem is a powerful, bulky Pokemon that is useful in most roles it is put in.</p>

[SET]
name: Trick Room Sweeper
move 1: Trick Room
move 2: Psychic / Nasty Plot
move 3: Hidden Power Fighting
move 4: Shadow Ball
item: Life Orb / Eviolite
nature: Quiet
ability: Synchronize
evs: 236 HP / 236 SAtk
ivs: 3 Spe / 30 Def / 30 SDef / 30 SAtk

[Set Comments]

<p>Probably the most effective set Elgyem can use. Thanks to Elgyem's abmyssal speed, decent defenses and access to Trick Room, Elgyem can turn into both a support Pokemon and an offensive powerhouse at the same time. Psychic is for STAB but Nasty Plot can be used to give Elgyem huge power. Hidden Power Fighting and Shadow Ball have perfect coverage together, and they both hit Elgyem's counters.</p>

[Additional Comments]

<p>The item choice depends on if you want more power or have more staying power. As with Eviolite Hidden Power Fighting will 2HKO Scraggy, sometimes 3HKO +1 Scraggy, and Crunch with 2HKO Elgyem. With Life Orb, Hidden Power Fighting OHKOs Scraggy without Eviolite, but 2HKOs variants with Eviolite, but is OHKOd by Scraggy's Crunch. Timburr is a great teammate for this set, as it's abmyssal Speed can work in Trick Room and it can take out counters like Houndour and Scraggy.</p>

[SET]
name: Bulky CM
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Psychic / Psyshock
move 3: Hidden Power Fighting
move 4: Recover
item: Eviolite
nature: Bold
ability: Synchronize
evs: 236 HP / 236 Def

[Set Comments]

<p> Calm Mind makes Elgyem a great tank with heavy defensive investment. Psychic is for STAB and is the move that Elgyem should be using most of the time. Psyshock is an alternative if you are scared of Munchlax, but Hidden Power Fighting already 2HKOs at +2. Shadow Ball works best alongside of Hidden Power Fighting for neutral coverage on every Pokemon, and hits Misdreavus for good damage.</p>

[Additional Comments]

<p> Psyshock could be used to hit specially defensive Pokemon like Munchlax, but you wan't as much power as possible. Dual Screen support is recommended to make sure that Elgyem gets a free turn of setup, and gives Elgyem an elongated sweep. Stealth Rock is also suggested so Elgyem can get some extra KOs, like with Stealth Rocks Psyshock will OHKO Munchlax.</p>


[Other Options]

<p>A Choice Scarf could be used to give Elgyem an extra boost in Speed, but sadly, Elgyem can't reach a Speed stat of 14, so you'll still be revenged easily by the likes of Elekid and other Choice Scarfed Pokemon. Skill Swap is an interesting choice and could be used with Elgyem's useless ability, Telepathy, to screw up Chinchou locked into Thunderbolt etc. Imprison could be used against other Dual Screen users and Psychic- types, but it is kind of a waste of a moveslot. </p>

[SET]
name: Support
move 1: Recover
move 2: Thunder Wave / Psychic
move 3: Reflect
move 4: Light Screen
item: Eviolite
nature: Bold
ability: Synchronize
evs: 236 HP / 116 Def / 156 SDef

[Set Comments]

<p>While the last set took a more offensive approach to Elgyem, this team is more based around a stall team or one that's based on a frail setup sweeper (Example: Abra). Recover makes sure Elgyem has full health almost all the time. The second slot depends on your team. Thunder Wave can slow down Scarfed Pokemon or setup sweepers, and can sometimes get Elgyem or your teammates a free turn with full paralyses. Reflect and Light Screen give Elgyem's teammates a few extra turns to setup, like making sure that Scraggy takes little to nothing from a Super-Effective attack, making sure that RP Larvitar always gets a free turn, and making sure that Elgyem can almost always live a hit. Psychic can make sure that you aren't Taunt bait, but then you lose out on a support move.</p>

[Additional Comments]

<p>Synchronize is always the preferred ability for Elgyem, as it can also absorb status so stall teams get easily dismantled. Disable could be used to make sure that Scraggy doesn't ruin Elgyem's fun, as it can stop it from setting up, or spamming Crunch. Trick Room could be used as support to a slow, but powerful teammate like Azurill. Good teammates for this set are preferably Choice Pokemon so that they can absorb Taunts and kill off Pokemon who resist Elgyem's STAB. Most notably, Scarfed Mienfoo can work best as a partner to hit Dark- types and to take Taunts, as it will always be running an attack move. Another good teammate is Natu to absorb Taunt, but that makes 2 people on your team have 1 more weakness to Dark- type attacks.<p>


[Checks and Counters]

<p>The problem with countering Elgyem is it's unpredictability. The most common, though, is using TR, and that can be handled easily by priority or Taunt users. Another problem is that the moves listed get super-effective coverage on every type that can kill it off with a super-effective STAB attack. Your best bet is a fast U-Turn user that isn't a Fighting-type, like Meowth. Frillish is also a safe check as long as you shy away from Shadow Ball. Most users of Sucker Punch or Pursuit can kill it off, just beware of Hidden Power Fighting. Pokemon with Sucker Punch, especially ones behind a sub. Barrier could be used to give Elgyem a tankish role, but it just wastes a moveslot. Energy Ball could hit Wooper and Chinchou, but at the expense of not hitting Mantyke. Miracle Eye can make sure that Houndour doesn't wall all of your attacks, but like Barrier and Imprison, it's a waste of a moveslot. As you can see, Elgyem suffers greatly from 4 moveslot syndrome, as if it loses any of the moves mentioned, it loses coverage.</p>

[Dream World]

<p>From Dream World, Elgyem gets the saving grace of Analytic, meaning that if Elgyem goes last, it gets the attack boost equivalent to a Life Orb. This is an amazing ability and should be used for all sets that don't include Trick Room or Support.</p>
 
Does Elgyem have to set up trick room? Maybe consider slashing NP with it Also try Analytic to pack a bigger punch outside of trick room, not as viable as synchronise though.

EDIT: Can NP go with Analytic?
 
@masterful

switched.

@comatthew

put in Overview

@HiipFire

Analytic is currently unreleased, so I can't post it, and yes once a girl DW version is released NP can go with Analytic
 
Double Posting FTW

I love this set:

Riguree (F) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 236 HP / 236 Def / 36 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Psychic
- HP Fighting / Thunderbolt
- Recover
- Calm Mind
Yuniran doesn't have good enough stats to pull of the CM Recover thing like Rankurusu, but this guy can do it pretty well. The Defense EVs are maxed out to be able to take hits from both sides of the spectrum. Just CM, Recover, and tank. The coverage isn't perfect, but it hits most pokemon for neutral. Great if used with Dokkora to make a dual boosting core. It's also a fantastic Meditite counter.
That was posted when Murkrow was still here. Since it isn't...Getting walled by Ferroseed is much worse than being walled by other Psychics, who are pretty nonexistent, 'cept Slowpoke, who you set up all over with Calm Mind and Recover. If it Toxics you...it fucks itself over.
 
There is no way support Elgyem is taking on a Scraggy. It can just set up as you put up screens and ignore T-wave with Shed Skin. Also Scraggy almost always runs Eviolite.

Why would I ever use NP Elgyem over NP Misdreavus?

Choice Specs are bad in LC in general, let alone on a Pokemon that lets Scraggy set up.
 
There is no way support Elgyem is taking on a Scraggy. It can just set up as you put up screens and ignore T-wave with Shed Skin. Also Scraggy almost always runs Eviolite. If QC approves of this, I'll add HP Fighting to the Support moveset to make sure Scraggy doesn't setup in Elgyem's face. Scraggy also runs Choice Scarf alot.

Why would I ever use NP Elgyem over NP Misdreavus? Elgyem can work in TR, and it has Psychic STAB to hit Fighting-types.

Choice Specs are bad in LC in general, let alone on a Pokemon that lets Scraggy set up. It doesn't let Scraggy setup in the slightest, unless it is locked onto Psychic, as HP Fighting will 2HKO.
 
Scarf Scraggy is not run a lot and I don't know where you got that idea. And anyways HP Fighting is barely going to tickle it without investment. Support loses to Scraggy, plain and simple.

When is Elgyem going to get the time to use both Trick Room and Nasty Plot in the same set? And even then, Misdreavus beats most Fighting-types anyway. It only needs a layer of Spikes or LO to beat Scraggy at +2, and no other Fighter can take a +2 Shadow Ball safely.

Scraggy sets up on every move other than HP Fighting on that specs set, and if you're locked into HP Fighting then you're only asking Misdreavus, the 2nd most commonly used mon to set up on you.
 
remove specs, it sucks.

and remove nasty plot too, it's outclassed.

and slash Eviolite on that set.

And at least mention bulky CM?

slash Light Screen on DS set.

Sucker Punchers laugh at it. Especially ones with Substitute like Subniard and Subdour. Stunky is unique in that it doesn't take SE damage from any of its attacks...

without MIRACLE EYE. Miracle Eye is cool.

Mention Energy Ball, which hits Wooper and Chinchou at the expense of Mantyke. And Surskit.

Barrier is cool.

Elgyem actually DOES have good to mediocre attack (55), but ZHB/Rock Slide/Return/filler can't hit Steels, which makes it even worse than it would normally be.

Imprison cockblocks Misdreavus.



[QC 1/2]
 
@Darkamber gave me a good idea, but I don't think it's very good.

Elgyem@Eviolite
evs: 236 HP / 156 SDef / 116 Def
nature: Bold
ability: Synchronize
move 1: Recover
move 2: Nasty Plot
move 3: Miracle Eye
move 4: Psychic

A mono-attacker set, was wondering if it could work.

Anyway, I edited in everything you said except the Light Screen as I have no clue what so ever what a DS set means...
 
Actually, in LC, it kind of...does. It depends on the type. And Psychic is not a very good type.

I don't think there are ANY mono-attackers?

As in, pokemon that try to kill things, as opposed to walls or support pokemon with one attack.
 
Your prose needs some adjusting. You're making Elgyem out to be far better than it is. You should probably comb through the analysis and tone down the praise. Also that bit about support Elgyem vs Scraggy still needs to be removed.
 

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