Ok, so this is my first BW Team that I have been trying to make it work throughout this summer. Since my DPP era past me while I was still testing gimmicky stuff like Medicham and TR Rampardos, I wanted to try my hands on the suspect Pokemon, Thundurus, to have a true taste of the metagame. For some reason, I wanted the strategy to be passing CMs to Thundurus, so I ended up with Celebi and Espeon in my team. The rest is added to have a sense of unity and to handle most common threats. Ultimately, I've ended up with 2 teams that are quite distinct but more or less equally effective. Choose 1 and rate it!
The team's success is constantly fluctuating. I peaked 17th with 1440 points (so close to reqs!) last week, but recently I've been losing every 2 matches for every match I win (currently in 100th with 1330 points).
Here's the 2 teams at a glance:
Team at a Glance - Capt. Thundurus
Team at a Glance - Capt. Raikou
Notice that the only difference is Jirachi / Thundurus and Espeon / Raikou. The former team has a solid defensive backing in Jirachi, who can also pass the life-saving Wishes. The former is also more Rain-dependent, since half my team are weak to Fire and Jirachi and Thundurus both use Thunder.
My latter team, where I actually replaced Thundurus for what I thought was a more fitting CM recipient, Raikou, is less dependant on Rain - Politoed is merely there to patch up my weakness to Sun teams and to check Excadrill. However, this team is much more committed to the primary strategy of CM passing to Raikou. It is somewhat inflexible in this respect, but if it pulls off, it usually ends in a grand sweep. I'd say Team Raikou is better suited against Stall teams, since Espeon prevents phazing and entry hazards. It is also a much more aggressive team, since it doesn't have the defensive backbone (Jirachi) of Team Thundurus.
Team In-Depth
Love (Jirachi) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 240 SDef / 16 Spe
Careful Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Iron Head
~ Thunder
~ Wish
~ U-turn
Jirachi / Espeon really affects the team's overall structure. Whereas Espeon keeps the BP chain alive, and Magic Mirror even provides some handy protection from status and entry hazards, Jirachi further bolsters the team's defense. For one, it provides a more reliable counter to DragMag and Reuniclus other than Scizor. Furthermore it covers Tornadus and other special threats much more comfortably than Team Raikou. In expense of Magic Mirror, Jirachi grants healing in Wish, giving more mileage to Celebi and Gyarados, somewhat compensating for zero SR / Spikes protection (sometimes it doesn't). Its Rock resistance is another commodity that Team Raikou misses out on, allowing it to better switch-in on CBTars.
I have been using U-turn for a more successful Wish-passing, and to escape from Magnezone. I initially preferred the 100% paralysis insurance of Thunder Wave, but Thunder dents lot of Water Types hard (despite having a -SAtk nature), which sold me.
Leilani (Celebi) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 176 SDef / 40 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
~ Calm Mind
~ Giga Drain
~ Baton Pass
~ Substitute
Liking this set. Initially this was a lone CM Sweeper with Psychic + Recover to counter special threats like Rotom-W, Politoed, Virizion, Thundurus, and Starmie. However, it really felt disjointed from the rest of the team. Celebi is so great for stacking CMs, that it sucks bad losing the boosts when it is forced to switch. Eventually, I scrapped the idea of making Celebi a Special Tank, and instead devoted it to CM Passing.
Thereafter I added Substitute, since 101 Subs are handy. Substitute is a really underrated move that needs more use. Status Protection, and also not being forced out when the opponent U-turns. Substitute combined with Giga Drain, it has no problems setting up on Blissey, recovering damage lost from Substitutes. If I can successfully set up 3 CMs behind a Substitute, it's usually game.
Juvia (Politoed) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SAtk / 184 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Hydro Pump
~ Hypnosis
~ Psychic
Initially I had Conkeldurr to serve as my defensive core with Gyarados, but after few lethal encounter with Sun teams, I quickly realized that Gyarados alone cannot contain the sun-blessed fiery assaults of Fire Sweepers, not to mention it hates taking Wisp from Ninetales. Thus, I ended up adding Scarftoed to better deal with Drought and to still check Excadrill like Conkeldurr.
Hydro Pump is to revenge kill Thundurus and Tornadus among other things. Scald is for accuracy and to hit stuff that Politoed cannot kill anyways. Burn is a nice parting gift. Hypnosis is actually very nifty, putting Politoed's counters, namely Jellicent, Gastrodon, and Rotom-W, to sleep. Putting those things to sleep makes the life of this team easy, since I don't need to deal with the annoying status conditions and Volt-Switching / Taunting nonsense. Scizor can dispatch Jellicent with ease with Pursuit 2HKO (ironic how a Scizor kills its counter), giving way for devastation by Politoed and Gyarados. Gastrodon and Rotom-W is a free set-up bait for Celebi. Psychic is to prevent Toxicroak a free switch.
Stark (Scizor) (F) @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 248 Atk / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ U-turn
~ Bullet Punch
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower
Scizor is important to remove Pokemon that threatens Celebi - Raikou / Thundurus partnership, which is why you see it in both teams. Perish Song Celebi, CM Latias, and Ferrothorn with Gyro Ball greatly hinders Celebi's CM set-up. When these threats switches into Celebi while it Substitutes, then the Celery Fairy passes the Substitute to Scizor, who then Pursuit-kills Celebi / Latias and Superpower Ferrothorn.
Oceanborn (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
~ Waterfall
~ Dragon Tail
~ Taunt
~ Stone Edge
When I played DP, bulky Gyarados was such a great defensive monster that I ended up including this in my BW team, too. With Intimidate it really shuts down a lot of physical threats. Metagross without Zen Headbutt / T-Punch, Scizor, Gliscor, Darmanitan, Infernape, Volcarona, Heatran, Mienshao, Conkeldurr (without Stone-Edge), Bulky Dragonite, Lucario, Landorus, you name it. It can even soak up Excadrill hits and Waterfall it to the range of Mach Punch KO from Conkeldurr.
I used to have Thunder Wave > Stone-Edge (essentially IronBullet's set), but I let it go for better coverage move. Stone-Edge really helps in removing enemy Gyarados quickly, as well as hitting most Water Types hard. Stone-Edge is also handy in taking out Volcorona without the risk of burn. Taunt is essential to prevent opponent from attempting to wall Gyarados and set up hazards. Taunt actually lets Gyarados have an advantage against weakened walls that comes in to heal. Dragon Tail is there b/c phazing is good and Magic Mirror exists (and it also does good damage). Waterfall from Gyarados actually hurts in Rain.
Enel (Thundurus) @ Expert Belt
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Thunder
~ Hidden Power [Ice]
~ Focus Blast
~ Grass Knot
I started out with Lum Nasty Plot Thundurus, but that gets revenged easily, since Celebi's Substitute usually breaks. I tried out Agility Thundurus, but without Focus Blast (I had Grass Knot for Quagsire), it really couldn't break through Excadrill and Ferrothorn, making the whole CM set up rather pointless. Ultimately, I felt that it was silly to make Thundurus so dependant on Celebi's CM, when it can punch holes without any help most of the time. So I went with an all-out attacking Thundurus, so that it can actually dish hits from the get-go. Celebi would simply be there to pass CMs to Thundurus whenever the storm god requires the extra offensive fuel to overwhelm committed Special Walls, such as Jirachi and Blissey.
Major Threats
O wow, my team is so vulnerable to Volt-Switch / U-turn spamming. If it's just Rotom-W / Scizor partnership, then Celebi can switch into Rotom-W on the Volt Switch, and put up a Substitute on Scizor's U-turn, thereby not being forced out. However, add a 3rd U-turner to come in when Scizor breaks the Substitute, and I am forced to switch to Gyarados, and then the cycle continues ad infinitum. Even shitty players can brainlessly Volt Swith and U-turn to victory, it's quite embarassing, and surprisingly hard to stop once it begins.
Not having entry hazards doesn't help, costing the opponent nothing for all the switches. I have tried SR on Jirachi over U-turn, but it still didn't quite ameliorate the issue.
Entry Hazards
Although Espeon is admittedly not a solid answer to entry hazards, it did a relatively good job at preventing certain Spikers, such as Deoxys-S, to fail miserably at its job. With a Substitute from Celebi, it's not afraid to switch into Skarmory and Heatran, either. For Ttars / Ferrothorn, I usually lead with Scizor and Superpower them. Espeon at least helped delay the Spikes-stacking to prevent pokemon like Celebi, Politoed, and Gyarados from quickly wearing out.
I initially justified removing Espeon for Jirachi by believing that Wish would somewhat dampen the effect of entry hazards. However, having SR being set-up with ease really puts a timer on Gyarados and Thundurus, a pivotal defensive and offensive player, respectively. Thundurus doesn't even have Leftovers, and passing Wishes to Thundurus is surprisingly difficult, even with U-turn. I am currently trying to fit a Rapid Spinner / Espeon into this team.
Nozomi (Espeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Baton Pass
~ Calm Mind
~ Psyshock
~ Reflect
I usually don't lead with her, btw. Magic Mirror is why it find its spot in this team. Otherwise, Espeon may probably be dispensable for other mons who can wall-breaking or tanking hits. However, with Magic Mirror, Espeon becomes essential. She is my only protection from entry hazards (although it's not the end of the world if they are laid). She is nifty for throwing status back at the user. Most importantly, however, she keeps the BP chain intact, while being able to stack up more CMs herself.
I don't need Light Clay, because keeping Reflect up is not as important as Espeon's longevity. Max Speed is necessary to check threats, particularly Terrakion. Psyshock comes in handy in clearing Chansey, Blissey, and Latias before baton passing to Raikou.
Leilani (Celebi) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 176 SDef / 40 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
~ Calm Mind
~ Giga Drain
~ Baton Pass
~ Substitute
Liking this set. Initially this was a lone CM Sweeper with Psychic + Recover to counter special threats like Rotom-W, Politoed, Virizion, Thundurus, and Starmie. However, it really felt disjointed from the rest of the team. Celebi is so great for stacking CMs, that it sucks bad losing the boosts when it is forced to switch. Eventually, I scrapped the idea of making Celebi a Special Tank, and instead devoted it to CM Passing.
Thereafter I added Substitute, since 101 Subs are handy. Substitute is a really underrated move that needs more use. Status Protection, and also not being forced out when the opponent U-turns. Substitute combined with Giga Drain, it has no problems setting up on Blissey, recovering damage lost from Substitutes. Combined with Espeon's Magic Mirror, Substitute offers perfect protection from phazers, since it blocks Dragon Tail. If I can successfully set up 3 CMs behind a Substitute, it's usually game.
Juvia (Politoed) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SAtk / 184 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Hydro Pump
~ Hypnosis
~ Psychic
Initially I had Conkeldurr to serve as my defensive core with Gyarados, but after few lethal encounter with Sun teams, I quickly realized that Gyarados alone cannot contain the sun-blessed fiery assaults of Fire Sweepers, not to mention it hates taking Wisp from Ninetales. Thus, I ended up adding Scarftoed to better deal with Drought and to still check Excadrill like Conkeldurr.
Hydro Pump is to revenge kill Thundurus and Tornadus among other things. Scald is for accuracy and to hit stuff that Politoed cannot kill anyways. Burn is a nice parting gift. Hypnosis is actually very nifty, putting Politoed's counters, namely Jellicent, Gastrodon, and Rotom-W, to sleep. Putting those things to sleep makes the life of this team easy, since I don't need to deal with the annoying status conditions and Volt-Switching / Taunting nonsense. Scizor can dispatch Jellicent with ease with Pursuit 2HKO (ironic how a Scizor kills its counter), giving way for devastation by Politoed and Gyarados. Gastrodon and Rotom-W is a free set-up bait for Celebi. Psychic is to prevent Toxicroak a free switch.
Stark (Scizor) (F) @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 248 Atk / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ U-turn
~ Bullet Punch
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower
Scizor is important to remove Pokemon that threatens Celebi - Raikou / Thundurus partnership, which is why you see it in both teams. Perish Song Celebi, CM Latias, and Ferrothorn with Gyro Ball greatly hinders Celebi's CM set-up. When these threats switches into Celebi while it Substitutes, then the Celery Fairy passes the Substitute to Scizor, who then Pursuit-kills Celebi / Latias and Superpower Ferrothorn. In addition to those threats, Scizor has an additional niche in pursuit-trapping / revenge-killing Tornadus, Reuniclus, and Dragons, since I don't have Jirachi.
Oceanborn (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
~ Waterfall
~ Dragon Tail
~ Taunt
~ Stone Edge
When I played DP, bulky Gyarados was such a great defensive monster that I ended up including this in my BW team, too. With Intimidate it really shuts down a lot of physical threats. Metagross without Zen Headbutt / T-Punch, Scizor, Gliscor, Darmanitan, Infernape, Volcarona, Heatran, Mienshao, Conkeldurr (without Stone-Edge), Bulky Dragonite, Lucario, Landorus, you name it. It can even soak up Excadrill hits and Waterfall it to the range of Mach Punch KO from Conkeldurr.
I used to have Thunder Wave > Stone-Edge (essentially IronBullet's set), but I let it go for better coverage move. Stone-Edge really helps in removing enemy Gyarados quickly, as well as hitting most Water Types hard. Stone-Edge is also handy in taking out Volcorona without the risk of burn. Taunt is essential to prevent opponent from attempting to wall Gyarados and set up hazards. Taunt actually lets Gyarados have an advantage against weakened walls that comes in to heal. Dragon Tail is there b/c phazing is good and Magic Mirror exists (and it also does good damage). Waterfall from Gyarados actually hurts in Rain.
Laxus (Raikou) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 116 Def / 140 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Thunderbolt
~ Aura Sphere
~ Hidden Power [Grass]
~ Substitute
I initially had Thundurus, to try out the suspect. However, he wasn't an ideal recipient of CMs, because 111 Speed trolls lots of things, but it also gets trolled by Starmie and other Thundurus; Raikou provides me a much better Speed-tier. Secondly, a Focus Blast miss can ruin all the efforts of setting it up; Raikou's Aura Sphere is much more desirable here. Also Raikou provides me a check to Thundurus, which is really helpful.
I initially had Calm Mind over Aura Sphere, so that it doesn't have to only work with the CMs passed to it - Celebi and Espeon would simply give it a head start. However, facing Excadrill and Tyranitar in sandstorm became a bitch, so I went with Aura Sphere and never looked back.
The spread may look dumb, since I sacrificed lots of Special Attack. The defense EVs allow Raikou to keep its Substitute intact against Jirachi's Body Slam 87-93% of the time. It may seem like a waste, but being able to have an intact Substitute against a common Pokemon such as Jirachi is so much important from getting revenge-killed that it's worth it. Team Preview helps alot in determining how much CMs I need for Raikou to clean the floor.
I had Hidden Power [Ice] for the longest time, but after a handful of nasty encounters with Quagsire, I was pretty much forced to HP Grass if I don't want to forfeit the CM sweep. It's such a shame, though, since now it has a rough time taking out stuff like Gliscor and Latios. And it's really weak without the CM boosts, making Raikou dependant on Celebi, unlike Thundurus.
Major Threats
Espeon (and also Celebi) is a free switch-in for CBTars, and all they have to do is spam Crunches, since Scizor and Gyarados can't take the hits all that well, especially with Sandstream negating Leftovers. Team Thundurus fares better, since Jirachi can pass Wish, and can actually deal with CBTar, too.
Celebi provides a free switch-in to Tornadus, whose Hurricane this team cannot contain, since it doesn't have Jirachi. I do have Raikou, ScarfToed, and Scizor to check it though. It sucks that Scizor doesn't survive a SpecsHurricane, so a mispredict can result in an unscathed Tornadus and maybe even a dead Scizor. Gyarados should be able to take a hit if it has to.
Past / Alternative Members
So here it is - Pass CMs and Sweep. Baton Pass gives me that VoltSwitch-Uturn advantage, so it helps keep me in a favorable position. I've only played this team for a couple of weeks so I am still naive about its weakness, which is why I came to you guys for help. I smoothened a lot of the rough edges, though. Initially it felt pretty disjointed, just a team with 6 Pokemon. It feels much better to play, however, I feel like it can improve. I am open for any feedback, since this is my first team. Hell, you can even tell me to ditch Celebi if you think CM Passing isn't worth it. Thanks for your any help in advance!
The team's success is constantly fluctuating. I peaked 17th with 1440 points (so close to reqs!) last week, but recently I've been losing every 2 matches for every match I win (currently in 100th with 1330 points).
Here's the 2 teams at a glance:
Team at a Glance - Capt. Thundurus
Team at a Glance - Capt. Raikou
Notice that the only difference is Jirachi / Thundurus and Espeon / Raikou. The former team has a solid defensive backing in Jirachi, who can also pass the life-saving Wishes. The former is also more Rain-dependent, since half my team are weak to Fire and Jirachi and Thundurus both use Thunder.
My latter team, where I actually replaced Thundurus for what I thought was a more fitting CM recipient, Raikou, is less dependant on Rain - Politoed is merely there to patch up my weakness to Sun teams and to check Excadrill. However, this team is much more committed to the primary strategy of CM passing to Raikou. It is somewhat inflexible in this respect, but if it pulls off, it usually ends in a grand sweep. I'd say Team Raikou is better suited against Stall teams, since Espeon prevents phazing and entry hazards. It is also a much more aggressive team, since it doesn't have the defensive backbone (Jirachi) of Team Thundurus.
Team In-Depth
Love (Jirachi) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 240 SDef / 16 Spe
Careful Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Iron Head
~ Thunder
~ Wish
~ U-turn
Jirachi / Espeon really affects the team's overall structure. Whereas Espeon keeps the BP chain alive, and Magic Mirror even provides some handy protection from status and entry hazards, Jirachi further bolsters the team's defense. For one, it provides a more reliable counter to DragMag and Reuniclus other than Scizor. Furthermore it covers Tornadus and other special threats much more comfortably than Team Raikou. In expense of Magic Mirror, Jirachi grants healing in Wish, giving more mileage to Celebi and Gyarados, somewhat compensating for zero SR / Spikes protection (sometimes it doesn't). Its Rock resistance is another commodity that Team Raikou misses out on, allowing it to better switch-in on CBTars.
I have been using U-turn for a more successful Wish-passing, and to escape from Magnezone. I initially preferred the 100% paralysis insurance of Thunder Wave, but Thunder dents lot of Water Types hard (despite having a -SAtk nature), which sold me.
Leilani (Celebi) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 176 SDef / 40 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
~ Calm Mind
~ Giga Drain
~ Baton Pass
~ Substitute
Liking this set. Initially this was a lone CM Sweeper with Psychic + Recover to counter special threats like Rotom-W, Politoed, Virizion, Thundurus, and Starmie. However, it really felt disjointed from the rest of the team. Celebi is so great for stacking CMs, that it sucks bad losing the boosts when it is forced to switch. Eventually, I scrapped the idea of making Celebi a Special Tank, and instead devoted it to CM Passing.
Thereafter I added Substitute, since 101 Subs are handy. Substitute is a really underrated move that needs more use. Status Protection, and also not being forced out when the opponent U-turns. Substitute combined with Giga Drain, it has no problems setting up on Blissey, recovering damage lost from Substitutes. If I can successfully set up 3 CMs behind a Substitute, it's usually game.
Juvia (Politoed) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SAtk / 184 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Hydro Pump
~ Hypnosis
~ Psychic
Initially I had Conkeldurr to serve as my defensive core with Gyarados, but after few lethal encounter with Sun teams, I quickly realized that Gyarados alone cannot contain the sun-blessed fiery assaults of Fire Sweepers, not to mention it hates taking Wisp from Ninetales. Thus, I ended up adding Scarftoed to better deal with Drought and to still check Excadrill like Conkeldurr.
Hydro Pump is to revenge kill Thundurus and Tornadus among other things. Scald is for accuracy and to hit stuff that Politoed cannot kill anyways. Burn is a nice parting gift. Hypnosis is actually very nifty, putting Politoed's counters, namely Jellicent, Gastrodon, and Rotom-W, to sleep. Putting those things to sleep makes the life of this team easy, since I don't need to deal with the annoying status conditions and Volt-Switching / Taunting nonsense. Scizor can dispatch Jellicent with ease with Pursuit 2HKO (ironic how a Scizor kills its counter), giving way for devastation by Politoed and Gyarados. Gastrodon and Rotom-W is a free set-up bait for Celebi. Psychic is to prevent Toxicroak a free switch.
Stark (Scizor) (F) @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 248 Atk / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ U-turn
~ Bullet Punch
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower
Scizor is important to remove Pokemon that threatens Celebi - Raikou / Thundurus partnership, which is why you see it in both teams. Perish Song Celebi, CM Latias, and Ferrothorn with Gyro Ball greatly hinders Celebi's CM set-up. When these threats switches into Celebi while it Substitutes, then the Celery Fairy passes the Substitute to Scizor, who then Pursuit-kills Celebi / Latias and Superpower Ferrothorn.
Oceanborn (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
~ Waterfall
~ Dragon Tail
~ Taunt
~ Stone Edge
When I played DP, bulky Gyarados was such a great defensive monster that I ended up including this in my BW team, too. With Intimidate it really shuts down a lot of physical threats. Metagross without Zen Headbutt / T-Punch, Scizor, Gliscor, Darmanitan, Infernape, Volcarona, Heatran, Mienshao, Conkeldurr (without Stone-Edge), Bulky Dragonite, Lucario, Landorus, you name it. It can even soak up Excadrill hits and Waterfall it to the range of Mach Punch KO from Conkeldurr.
I used to have Thunder Wave > Stone-Edge (essentially IronBullet's set), but I let it go for better coverage move. Stone-Edge really helps in removing enemy Gyarados quickly, as well as hitting most Water Types hard. Stone-Edge is also handy in taking out Volcorona without the risk of burn. Taunt is essential to prevent opponent from attempting to wall Gyarados and set up hazards. Taunt actually lets Gyarados have an advantage against weakened walls that comes in to heal. Dragon Tail is there b/c phazing is good and Magic Mirror exists (and it also does good damage). Waterfall from Gyarados actually hurts in Rain.
Enel (Thundurus) @ Expert Belt
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Thunder
~ Hidden Power [Ice]
~ Focus Blast
~ Grass Knot
I started out with Lum Nasty Plot Thundurus, but that gets revenged easily, since Celebi's Substitute usually breaks. I tried out Agility Thundurus, but without Focus Blast (I had Grass Knot for Quagsire), it really couldn't break through Excadrill and Ferrothorn, making the whole CM set up rather pointless. Ultimately, I felt that it was silly to make Thundurus so dependant on Celebi's CM, when it can punch holes without any help most of the time. So I went with an all-out attacking Thundurus, so that it can actually dish hits from the get-go. Celebi would simply be there to pass CMs to Thundurus whenever the storm god requires the extra offensive fuel to overwhelm committed Special Walls, such as Jirachi and Blissey.
Major Threats
O wow, my team is so vulnerable to Volt-Switch / U-turn spamming. If it's just Rotom-W / Scizor partnership, then Celebi can switch into Rotom-W on the Volt Switch, and put up a Substitute on Scizor's U-turn, thereby not being forced out. However, add a 3rd U-turner to come in when Scizor breaks the Substitute, and I am forced to switch to Gyarados, and then the cycle continues ad infinitum. Even shitty players can brainlessly Volt Swith and U-turn to victory, it's quite embarassing, and surprisingly hard to stop once it begins.
Not having entry hazards doesn't help, costing the opponent nothing for all the switches. I have tried SR on Jirachi over U-turn, but it still didn't quite ameliorate the issue.
Entry Hazards
Although Espeon is admittedly not a solid answer to entry hazards, it did a relatively good job at preventing certain Spikers, such as Deoxys-S, to fail miserably at its job. With a Substitute from Celebi, it's not afraid to switch into Skarmory and Heatran, either. For Ttars / Ferrothorn, I usually lead with Scizor and Superpower them. Espeon at least helped delay the Spikes-stacking to prevent pokemon like Celebi, Politoed, and Gyarados from quickly wearing out.
I initially justified removing Espeon for Jirachi by believing that Wish would somewhat dampen the effect of entry hazards. However, having SR being set-up with ease really puts a timer on Gyarados and Thundurus, a pivotal defensive and offensive player, respectively. Thundurus doesn't even have Leftovers, and passing Wishes to Thundurus is surprisingly difficult, even with U-turn. I am currently trying to fit a Rapid Spinner / Espeon into this team.
Nozomi (Espeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Baton Pass
~ Calm Mind
~ Psyshock
~ Reflect
I usually don't lead with her, btw. Magic Mirror is why it find its spot in this team. Otherwise, Espeon may probably be dispensable for other mons who can wall-breaking or tanking hits. However, with Magic Mirror, Espeon becomes essential. She is my only protection from entry hazards (although it's not the end of the world if they are laid). She is nifty for throwing status back at the user. Most importantly, however, she keeps the BP chain intact, while being able to stack up more CMs herself.
I don't need Light Clay, because keeping Reflect up is not as important as Espeon's longevity. Max Speed is necessary to check threats, particularly Terrakion. Psyshock comes in handy in clearing Chansey, Blissey, and Latias before baton passing to Raikou.
Leilani (Celebi) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 176 SDef / 40 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
~ Calm Mind
~ Giga Drain
~ Baton Pass
~ Substitute
Liking this set. Initially this was a lone CM Sweeper with Psychic + Recover to counter special threats like Rotom-W, Politoed, Virizion, Thundurus, and Starmie. However, it really felt disjointed from the rest of the team. Celebi is so great for stacking CMs, that it sucks bad losing the boosts when it is forced to switch. Eventually, I scrapped the idea of making Celebi a Special Tank, and instead devoted it to CM Passing.
Thereafter I added Substitute, since 101 Subs are handy. Substitute is a really underrated move that needs more use. Status Protection, and also not being forced out when the opponent U-turns. Substitute combined with Giga Drain, it has no problems setting up on Blissey, recovering damage lost from Substitutes. Combined with Espeon's Magic Mirror, Substitute offers perfect protection from phazers, since it blocks Dragon Tail. If I can successfully set up 3 CMs behind a Substitute, it's usually game.
Juvia (Politoed) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SAtk / 184 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Hydro Pump
~ Hypnosis
~ Psychic
Initially I had Conkeldurr to serve as my defensive core with Gyarados, but after few lethal encounter with Sun teams, I quickly realized that Gyarados alone cannot contain the sun-blessed fiery assaults of Fire Sweepers, not to mention it hates taking Wisp from Ninetales. Thus, I ended up adding Scarftoed to better deal with Drought and to still check Excadrill like Conkeldurr.
Hydro Pump is to revenge kill Thundurus and Tornadus among other things. Scald is for accuracy and to hit stuff that Politoed cannot kill anyways. Burn is a nice parting gift. Hypnosis is actually very nifty, putting Politoed's counters, namely Jellicent, Gastrodon, and Rotom-W, to sleep. Putting those things to sleep makes the life of this team easy, since I don't need to deal with the annoying status conditions and Volt-Switching / Taunting nonsense. Scizor can dispatch Jellicent with ease with Pursuit 2HKO (ironic how a Scizor kills its counter), giving way for devastation by Politoed and Gyarados. Gastrodon and Rotom-W is a free set-up bait for Celebi. Psychic is to prevent Toxicroak a free switch.
Stark (Scizor) (F) @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 248 Atk / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ U-turn
~ Bullet Punch
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower
Scizor is important to remove Pokemon that threatens Celebi - Raikou / Thundurus partnership, which is why you see it in both teams. Perish Song Celebi, CM Latias, and Ferrothorn with Gyro Ball greatly hinders Celebi's CM set-up. When these threats switches into Celebi while it Substitutes, then the Celery Fairy passes the Substitute to Scizor, who then Pursuit-kills Celebi / Latias and Superpower Ferrothorn. In addition to those threats, Scizor has an additional niche in pursuit-trapping / revenge-killing Tornadus, Reuniclus, and Dragons, since I don't have Jirachi.
Oceanborn (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
~ Waterfall
~ Dragon Tail
~ Taunt
~ Stone Edge
When I played DP, bulky Gyarados was such a great defensive monster that I ended up including this in my BW team, too. With Intimidate it really shuts down a lot of physical threats. Metagross without Zen Headbutt / T-Punch, Scizor, Gliscor, Darmanitan, Infernape, Volcarona, Heatran, Mienshao, Conkeldurr (without Stone-Edge), Bulky Dragonite, Lucario, Landorus, you name it. It can even soak up Excadrill hits and Waterfall it to the range of Mach Punch KO from Conkeldurr.
I used to have Thunder Wave > Stone-Edge (essentially IronBullet's set), but I let it go for better coverage move. Stone-Edge really helps in removing enemy Gyarados quickly, as well as hitting most Water Types hard. Stone-Edge is also handy in taking out Volcorona without the risk of burn. Taunt is essential to prevent opponent from attempting to wall Gyarados and set up hazards. Taunt actually lets Gyarados have an advantage against weakened walls that comes in to heal. Dragon Tail is there b/c phazing is good and Magic Mirror exists (and it also does good damage). Waterfall from Gyarados actually hurts in Rain.
Laxus (Raikou) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 116 Def / 140 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Thunderbolt
~ Aura Sphere
~ Hidden Power [Grass]
~ Substitute
I initially had Thundurus, to try out the suspect. However, he wasn't an ideal recipient of CMs, because 111 Speed trolls lots of things, but it also gets trolled by Starmie and other Thundurus; Raikou provides me a much better Speed-tier. Secondly, a Focus Blast miss can ruin all the efforts of setting it up; Raikou's Aura Sphere is much more desirable here. Also Raikou provides me a check to Thundurus, which is really helpful.
I initially had Calm Mind over Aura Sphere, so that it doesn't have to only work with the CMs passed to it - Celebi and Espeon would simply give it a head start. However, facing Excadrill and Tyranitar in sandstorm became a bitch, so I went with Aura Sphere and never looked back.
The spread may look dumb, since I sacrificed lots of Special Attack. The defense EVs allow Raikou to keep its Substitute intact against Jirachi's Body Slam 87-93% of the time. It may seem like a waste, but being able to have an intact Substitute against a common Pokemon such as Jirachi is so much important from getting revenge-killed that it's worth it. Team Preview helps alot in determining how much CMs I need for Raikou to clean the floor.
I had Hidden Power [Ice] for the longest time, but after a handful of nasty encounters with Quagsire, I was pretty much forced to HP Grass if I don't want to forfeit the CM sweep. It's such a shame, though, since now it has a rough time taking out stuff like Gliscor and Latios. And it's really weak without the CM boosts, making Raikou dependant on Celebi, unlike Thundurus.
Major Threats
Espeon (and also Celebi) is a free switch-in for CBTars, and all they have to do is spam Crunches, since Scizor and Gyarados can't take the hits all that well, especially with Sandstream negating Leftovers. Team Thundurus fares better, since Jirachi can pass Wish, and can actually deal with CBTar, too.
Celebi provides a free switch-in to Tornadus, whose Hurricane this team cannot contain, since it doesn't have Jirachi. I do have Raikou, ScarfToed, and Scizor to check it though. It sucks that Scizor doesn't survive a SpecsHurricane, so a mispredict can result in an unscathed Tornadus and maybe even a dead Scizor. Gyarados should be able to take a hit if it has to.
Past / Alternative Members
Replaced by ScarfToed
Buggy (Conkeldurr) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Guts
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ Drain Punch
~ Bulk Up
~ Mach Punch
~ Payback
I see why this thing is overused, it really packs a punch after a Bulk Up or two. Conkeldurr is a defensive glue for this team, resisting those common Rock and Dark moves, that my team is particularly vulnerable to. I guess other Fighting mons can also fill Conky's role, but Mach Punch is what really sets it apart, providing me a solid revenge-kill against Excadrill, Terrakion, and DDtar. There's Breloom, but it has no bulk.
Bubbles (Azumarill) (F) @ Expert Belt
Trait: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 52 Def / 204 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ Aqua Jet
~ Ice Punch
~ Superpower
~ Toxic
I got sick of poor Conky being walled and worn down by Gliscor, so I replaced it with a Pokemon possessing more wall-breaking potential, while still checking important threats like Excadrill, Terrakion, Landorus, and Cloyster. It also provided me a second check to Volcarona if Gyarados happens to fall. This set is designed to put a hurt on Pokemon that usually switches into Celebi, while the heavenly flower sets up a Substitute. Celebi would then Baton Pass a Substitute to Azumarill. For instance, Ice Punch would put the hurt on Latias, Dragonite, and Celebi; Superpower would punch a hole in Ferrothorn. Toxic would prevent Jellicent and Rotom-W from easily walling Azumarill. I gave it enough Speed to outrun Jellicent, so Azu can toxic before Jellicent taunts.
Unfortunately, it really didn't provide an answer to Drought Teams, which has Ninetales to Wisp Azu and halve Aqua Jet's reveng-killing power. Hence Scarftoed.
Replaced by Raikou / Thundurus
Happy (Mew) @ Lum Berry
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 96 HP / 252 SAtk / 160 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Psyshock
~ Aura Sphere
~ Rock Polish
~ Giga Drain
When I asked Tobes for help, since at the beginning I was having trouble with Quagsire, he suggested Mew, who can keep the Baton Pass chain alive by Baton Passing it to Celebi. It was a really good suggestion, so I gave it a spin. However, instead of Baton Pass, I gave it Giga Drain of its own to deal with Quagsire without needing to Baton Pass out to Celebi. Psyshock was a big advantage it had over the electric recipients, since it has no problems powering through Latias and Blissey / Chansey. It's relatively good bulk allowed it to successfully Rock Polish up, which made it just faster than Excadrill under a sandstorm.
However, the lack of Flamethrower really made it hard setting up on Steel Types, primarily Jirachi, making a sweep difficult at times. Thundurus and Raikou, in the other hand, had a strong STAB to hit Jirachi.
Replaced by Scizor
Skarmory (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
~ Brave Bird
~ Whirlwind
~ Roost
~ Spikes
Elza (Scizor) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 48 Atk / 132 SDef / 80 Spe
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
~ Bug Bite
~ Baton Pass
~ Bullet Punch
~ Swords Dance
This used to be specially defensive Skarmory that sets up Spikes. Thought it would be useful for soaking up hits from Gengar, Latios, Excadrill, Scizor, Haxorus, Jirachi, and Dragonite. However, it wasn't really impressive, and I usually go for the CM sweep, which really didn't need Spikes. I also had trouble with Reunicles, which Skarmory can only phaze.
Reunicles was the main reason why I switched to Scizor. Also, it was such a waste to BPass my CMs to Skarmory, which really can't make much use of it. With Scizor, I can pass it the CMs, and it can then pass the CM boosts later on to the more relevant Special Sweepers. Another plus is setting up Swords Dance for either Scizor or Gyarados / Conkeldurr to have fun with. With a Swords Dance or two it can wipe monsters on its own. Latias without HP Fire or Roar is the ultimate set-up bait for Scizor. This guy has been pretty useful for the most part - maintains the pace of this team.
Replaced by Jirachi / Espeon
Tsunade (Gastrodon) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Ice Beam
~ Recover
~ Toxic
joshe suggested Gastrodon over Espeon to deal with my Thundurus problem, and it really gave me a solid defensive foundation, sponging and recovering special abuse for the team. Scald burns and Toxic poison are icing on a cake. However, Espeon is essential for CM Pass, the primary strategy to be effective, and Magic Mirror has proven useful for protection against entry hazards and status. Ultimately, I ditched Thundurus for Raikou to check opposing Thundurus and brought back Espeon (which was then replaced by Jirachi).
Buggy (Conkeldurr) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Guts
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ Drain Punch
~ Bulk Up
~ Mach Punch
~ Payback
I see why this thing is overused, it really packs a punch after a Bulk Up or two. Conkeldurr is a defensive glue for this team, resisting those common Rock and Dark moves, that my team is particularly vulnerable to. I guess other Fighting mons can also fill Conky's role, but Mach Punch is what really sets it apart, providing me a solid revenge-kill against Excadrill, Terrakion, and DDtar. There's Breloom, but it has no bulk.
Bubbles (Azumarill) (F) @ Expert Belt
Trait: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 52 Def / 204 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
~ Aqua Jet
~ Ice Punch
~ Superpower
~ Toxic
I got sick of poor Conky being walled and worn down by Gliscor, so I replaced it with a Pokemon possessing more wall-breaking potential, while still checking important threats like Excadrill, Terrakion, Landorus, and Cloyster. It also provided me a second check to Volcarona if Gyarados happens to fall. This set is designed to put a hurt on Pokemon that usually switches into Celebi, while the heavenly flower sets up a Substitute. Celebi would then Baton Pass a Substitute to Azumarill. For instance, Ice Punch would put the hurt on Latias, Dragonite, and Celebi; Superpower would punch a hole in Ferrothorn. Toxic would prevent Jellicent and Rotom-W from easily walling Azumarill. I gave it enough Speed to outrun Jellicent, so Azu can toxic before Jellicent taunts.
Unfortunately, it really didn't provide an answer to Drought Teams, which has Ninetales to Wisp Azu and halve Aqua Jet's reveng-killing power. Hence Scarftoed.
Replaced by Raikou / Thundurus
Happy (Mew) @ Lum Berry
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 96 HP / 252 SAtk / 160 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
~ Psyshock
~ Aura Sphere
~ Rock Polish
~ Giga Drain
When I asked Tobes for help, since at the beginning I was having trouble with Quagsire, he suggested Mew, who can keep the Baton Pass chain alive by Baton Passing it to Celebi. It was a really good suggestion, so I gave it a spin. However, instead of Baton Pass, I gave it Giga Drain of its own to deal with Quagsire without needing to Baton Pass out to Celebi. Psyshock was a big advantage it had over the electric recipients, since it has no problems powering through Latias and Blissey / Chansey. It's relatively good bulk allowed it to successfully Rock Polish up, which made it just faster than Excadrill under a sandstorm.
However, the lack of Flamethrower really made it hard setting up on Steel Types, primarily Jirachi, making a sweep difficult at times. Thundurus and Raikou, in the other hand, had a strong STAB to hit Jirachi.
Replaced by Scizor
Skarmory (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
~ Brave Bird
~ Whirlwind
~ Roost
~ Spikes
Elza (Scizor) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 48 Atk / 132 SDef / 80 Spe
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
~ Bug Bite
~ Baton Pass
~ Bullet Punch
~ Swords Dance
This used to be specially defensive Skarmory that sets up Spikes. Thought it would be useful for soaking up hits from Gengar, Latios, Excadrill, Scizor, Haxorus, Jirachi, and Dragonite. However, it wasn't really impressive, and I usually go for the CM sweep, which really didn't need Spikes. I also had trouble with Reunicles, which Skarmory can only phaze.
Reunicles was the main reason why I switched to Scizor. Also, it was such a waste to BPass my CMs to Skarmory, which really can't make much use of it. With Scizor, I can pass it the CMs, and it can then pass the CM boosts later on to the more relevant Special Sweepers. Another plus is setting up Swords Dance for either Scizor or Gyarados / Conkeldurr to have fun with. With a Swords Dance or two it can wipe monsters on its own. Latias without HP Fire or Roar is the ultimate set-up bait for Scizor. This guy has been pretty useful for the most part - maintains the pace of this team.
Replaced by Jirachi / Espeon
Tsunade (Gastrodon) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Ice Beam
~ Recover
~ Toxic
joshe suggested Gastrodon over Espeon to deal with my Thundurus problem, and it really gave me a solid defensive foundation, sponging and recovering special abuse for the team. Scald burns and Toxic poison are icing on a cake. However, Espeon is essential for CM Pass, the primary strategy to be effective, and Magic Mirror has proven useful for protection against entry hazards and status. Ultimately, I ditched Thundurus for Raikou to check opposing Thundurus and brought back Espeon (which was then replaced by Jirachi).
So here it is - Pass CMs and Sweep. Baton Pass gives me that VoltSwitch-Uturn advantage, so it helps keep me in a favorable position. I've only played this team for a couple of weeks so I am still naive about its weakness, which is why I came to you guys for help. I smoothened a lot of the rough edges, though. Initially it felt pretty disjointed, just a team with 6 Pokemon. It feels much better to play, however, I feel like it can improve. I am open for any feedback, since this is my first team. Hell, you can even tell me to ditch Celebi if you think CM Passing isn't worth it. Thanks for your any help in advance!
