I'm sweeping in the rain (OU Rain Dance Team)

Kikosaurus

Hello guys !

Here is a Over Used Rain Dance team that I use on Shoddy Battle. It works pretty well, but I still have some problems. So, let's introduce the team with...

Can someone take those papers on my hair ?
jirachi.png


Jirachi @Damp Rock
Serene Grace
Bold Nature
EVs: 252 HP/80 Def/176 SpD
- Rain Dance
- Thunder
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock

This guy is just perfect as a lead. Set up RD, then SR, and let's make some hax with Thunder or switch with U-turn. Thunder has 60% chance of paralysing the opponent, it helps a lot to cripple the other lead. With this spread, Jirachi is bulky enough to resist to Azelf's or Heatran's Fire Blast without the rain. I have some problems with faster Taunt leads, but since I OHKO or 2HKO most of them (Azelf, Crobat, Aerodactyl) with Thunder...

The most surprisingly Pokemon of all times... Hey, I'm joking.
scizor.png

Scizor @Damp Rock
Technician
Adamant Nature
EVs : 248 HP, 216 SpD, 44 Atk
- Rain Dance
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Roost

My first rain supporter. With his numerous resistances, I can place him very easily, and let's go for an other RD. I can also hit with Bullet Punch STAB and Technician, and can survive many turns with Roost.. Finally, I can gain a free switch with U-turn. His only weakeness is decreased under the rain, and with this spread, he is able to stand up many turns.

I can restore your computer's battery !
zapdos.png

Zapdos @Damp Rock
Pressure
Bold Nature
EVs : 252 HP/220 Def/36 Spe
- Rain Dance
- Roost
- Thunder
- HP Grass

First, I played with him, but later I replaced Zappy by Rotom-W. It was a HUGE mistake. I called back Zapdos quickly, since I realize he saved me sooo many times. This guy is a perfect supporter for me : he can set up the rain, sweep with Thunder (180 Base Power and 100% accuracy... sweet), say hello to Ground-types with HP Grass (I'm watching you, Swampert) and restore his health with Roost.

*yawn* Darn, I created a tornado.
kingdra.png

Kingdra @Life Orb
Swift Swim
Naughty Nature
EVs : 252 Atk / 240 SpA / 16 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Waterfall
- Hydro Pump
- Outrage

Is this really a surprise ? Kingdra is almost indispensable in an OU Rain Dance team. I decided to run with the so-classic Mixed set, and I'm really proud of this guy. Under the rain, he comes and chains OHKO. Draco Meteor to kill the other dragons, Hydro Pump as a primary stab (300 Base Power under the rain... sweet) and Waterfall to not be stopped after a Draco Meteor. Outrage is very useful, sicne I have a Dragon STAB which doesn't destroy my SpA.

In Mexico, ducks learn dancing in grade school.
ludicolo.png

Ludicolo @Life Orb
Swift Swim
Adamant Nature
EVs : 60 HP / 252 SpA / 196 Spe
- Leech Seed
- Ice Beam
- Surf
- Energy Ball

Finally, I took again the classic special sweeper set, but thanks to Nocturne.lullaby, I changed it slightly : now I play with Leech Seed. I can surprise the special walls like Blissey, reduce their health, and restore my own health. For the rest, it's the classic Grass/Water/Ice combo that no one resist (except Shedinja :p) : Surf is stabbed and boosted by the rain, Energy Ball sweeps those jerks named Vaporeon, Suicune, Swampert ; Ice Beam iss here for Dragonite, Flygon, Staraptor, etc.

Pokemon Scissorhands
kabutops.png

Kabutops @Life Orb
Swift Swim
Adamant Nature
EVs : 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- X-Scissor

My physical sweeper. Since Ludicolo was a special sweeper, I used it ; but now, Ludicolo is a physical attacker, and I lack of special moves. So, I ask someone to suggest me a good special sweeper under the rain.

Well, this team has some problems. After two DD, Dragonite destroys my team. Flygon Scarfer is an other difficulty. Vaporeon is a problem, since I can't OHKO him, Wish + Protect my stall rain turns. Blissey is also tricky ; he cripples me with Thunder Wave and I have difficulties to beat him.

Thank you for red all this. Please rate my team, help me with my difficulties, and suggest me solutions.
 
5 pokemon that use rain dance is overkill. drop it on kingdra and ludicolo. the point of your damp rock pokes is that your sweepers dont have to waste moveslots and turns setting up. you could try one of the dragon dance variants of Kingdra if bliss is giving you trouble. also, why the hell is kingdra impish? that defense does you nothing and the -sp atk drop hurts alot.
 
Sorry, I made a mistake. Kingdra is naughty, obviously.

Well, what do I should put over RD on Ludicolo and Kingdra. And what do you globally thinks of my team ?

Thx for answers.
 
Hello there! Though it never has been an uncommon tactic, I'm glad to see another rain dance team to an extent. Especially since it runs ridiculously similar to mine (and in many cases similar to many others due to some RD key pokemon). In fact, the only difference between our teams are Rotom and Kabutops. Which, through trial and error, might help me help you!
First. Your Ludicolo, you could run something similar to what I have below.

ludicolo.png

Ludicolo @Life Orb
Swift Swim
Modest Nature
EVs : 60 HP / 252 SpA / 196 Spe
- Surf
- Energy Ball
- Ice Beam
- Leech Seed/Toxic

Yes, there is only a slight move set change, but either of these moves allow you to either force out a troublesome Blissey, or if she's the last pokemon on your opponents team you can effectively let the poison kill her, or leech seed her to death, gaining well sized chunks of HP back thanks to her massive 600+ health bar.

-----

Now, for Kingdra I'm more or less drawing a blank as I use the same exact move set on mine, but don't force nearly as many pokemon to carry RD on my team. I suppose you could swap out Rain Dance for Outrage, giving you a dragon move alternate that doesn't crush your special attack to pieces.

kingdra.png

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Swift Swim
Naive/Mild Nature
EVs : 80 Atk / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Waterfall
- Hydro Pump
- Outrage

Wish I could be of more help here, but I've not run into the scenarios you're having difficulty with. I suppose that the Outrage will help against Dragonite, as you now have a super effective move to hit it with while it DD's without having to hit it weaker and weaker each turn, instead watching it Roost away whatever damage you've caused it.

-----

Two things I wanted to comment on, as I've had difficulties in the past concerning two pokemon, are your current Scizor as well as enemy Lapras.

While you do run a slightly different moveset on your Scizor than I do (I sacrifice Superpower for Roost), out EV's differ. I would consider going with a more defensive EV spread, as he is taking the role of a supportive pokemon instead of his usual role of being a pure revenge killer or sweeper. I'll be editing this message as soon as I can get to my DS and snag my Scizor's EV spread as I think it may help bulk up your little bug friend so it can live on to do it's duty: making sure rain never leaves the field.

With Lapras, I honestly had one sweep my RD team. It was pitiful, to say the least. At the time I ran a Kabutops exactly the same as yours, and two Stone Edge misses later, I had nothing to fend the floppy creature off with. Now, I run a physical Ludicolo more often than a special, which catches plenty of people off guard, which I can usually Swords Dance once when they switch in a special wall, again when they send in either a physical wall or the Lapras, and then hammer it +4 STAB neutral Seed Bombs till it falls over, finally dead.. but it was this Ludicolo that replaced Kabutops.. which I don't know if you would want to try, as Kabutops is truly fun to play with in the rain.
​
I hope what I've offered is helpful enough to your team, as well as it's all viewed as constructive criticism. I'll be sure to dig out my Scizor EV's if you do indeed want to try it out, and I'm sorry that I couldn't have been too much more help.
 
My tip

I'd go for a CHESTO REST kingdra instead - This thing decimates enemy teams


Kingdra (M) @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 144 HP/160 Atk/164 Spd/42 SDef
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Outrage
- Rest


best kingdra set IMO.


Edit:

Oh and look into SubPetaya Empoleon, i use him on my Rain Dance team and that thing is AWESOME. OHKOs most enemies even without rain. only problem is if its outspeeded :P.
 
Nocturne.lullaby :

Thank you very much for your great help. I'm really interested to know this magical spread on Scizor xD So, I must change Superpower to Roost, right ?

Well, I will probably take Leech Seed. But I have 2 questions : 1) Is the regained life affected by the opponent's type ? I mean, if I seed a Swampert, will I gain more life than if I seed a Blissey ? 2) If the answer to the 1st question is no, how much will I regain each turn ?

Oh, and what do you prefer : Leech Seed or Toxik ?

For Kingdra, I will make the change. Outrage seems to be a good option, since it doesn't destroy my SpA.

Again, thank you much. You really helped me a lot. And does anyone have anything more to say ?
 
Glad to know I helped! I'd also give the Chesto Rest set a try, as I was less sure of the Kingdra change than the Ludicolo. But yes, the spread I use on my Scizor is different than yours, but not as much as I'd thought.

Typically I run:

248 HP, 216 SpD, 44 Atk​
I'd love to hear how yours holds up, as its really just a change to add more HP and a less SpD. With that spread, and rain up, and roost, I've survived multiple predicted fire attacks, as it takes the 4x weakness and turns it 2x with rain, and then makes it a neutrality with Roost. So feel free to try the spread if you want.

Concerning Leech Seed, the move gives you 1/8th of a pokemon's overall HP per turn. Which means on really HP heavy targets like Blissey who can run 714 HP you will be regaining 89(.25) health a turn. With Blissey often running Ice Beam/Thunderbolt/Flamethrower or Seismic Toss for her attack it means that you'll be neutral to any special attacks, and almost completely heal her 100 damage Seismic Toss's each turn. Combine that with your assaults and her needing to Wish/Softboiled and you're basically going to be at full health before her next attack. Letting you either try and stall her out (real pain if she has wish and softboiled...) or eventually drain her healing skills PP before moving something else in to KO her. And the choice between Toxic and Leech Seed is really all preference. If you're using Ludicolo to combat Blissey threats, which often switch in against it, I'd stick with Leech Seed as you can continually heal yourself while with Toxic she can switch out, Natural cure, and then the damage counter is reset. Basically, Toxic does more damage over time, but Leech Seed does more damage initially and heals you. So I'd go Leech Seed (and since I run a physical Ludicolo, this set up I'm talking about is making me want to change my special Ludicolo... heh).
 
Well, my Scizor is very bulky with the spread I use, since he resists to
Heatran's Choice Specs Fire Blast under the rain. But you're right, he lacks of recovery, and as a supporter, that's not a good thing. I will try your spread and Roost over Superpower.

I will also put Outrage on Kingdra. I red a lot about the SD Ludicolo and it really seems fun to play. I really want to try it. Nocturne.lullaby, could you please explain to me how do I have to play it ?

But if I have Ludicolo as a physical sweeper, Kabutops becomes quite redundant. Does anyone have a good special sweeper to replace Ludicolo, please.
 
Yeah, the EV spread that I use was one given to me, and I've loved it. So again, there may not be that big of a difference between mine and yours, and if you do end up testing both I'd love to hear which you find to have more bulk, even though it'll be a close comparison.

For SD Ludicolo you basically are playing a slight mind game with your opponent. Set up rain dance with one of your supporters and send Ludicolo in on something it will force out. As the opponent switches, most likely moving to a special wall, you swords dance. If this is against Blissey you're in luck because she'll flee immediately. You use that moment to SD again, putting you at +4 Attack. Then its just common sense, use Seed Bomb, Waterfall, and Ice Punch to hammer whatever comes your way.

If you can set up early on, this can be rather vicious, given that you have five or so turns to sweep their team. I usually get two, maybe three kills in a row with him. But yeah, it's the reason I'm not using a Kabutops myself.

I've been toying with a Zapdos, using stab 100% accurate Thunders and Pressure + Roost to stall out enemies I typically can't counter directly. However, despite the fact that it's saved my bum a good many times, I want to put something else in it's place.. I had an Omastar that did well for a time, but I wasn't too keen on it either.
 
Well, I played with a Zapdos before, but I replaced him with Rotom-W. The problem is that Rotom never really showed me his supposed power under the rain, and I was thinking of bring back Zappy.

I played the legendary bird like this :

Zapdos @ Damp Rock
Bold Nature
Pressure
EVs 252 Hp, 220 Def, 36 Speed
Rain Dance
Thunder
Roost
HP Grass

Rain Dance is here because Zapdos is a supporter, Thunder for a STAB (180 Base Power and 100% accuracy... sweet), Roost for stall and HP Grass for that Swampert who would have the good idea to place on Zappy.

I remember this spread made a bulky monster, only 3HKO by Machamp Ice Punch and 2HKO by Dugtrio Stone Edge (with SR damages !).

So, do you think bringing back Zappy would be a good idea (I will probably do it, because it helped me soooo many times) ? And do you think of a powerful special sweeper who can fit in my RD team ?

Thx for answers.
 
That's a much more defensive version of the Zapdos I'm running, who acts as a special LO sweeper with Roost.

But if you would prefer Zapdos to support, you could always try Omastar? Not the most stellar pokemon, but I have one that I sub in myself. But really that's the same problem I run into. If I don't use the Kingdra, Ludicolo, Kabutops triangle then I'm left with scrambling to find a replacement sweeper. Honestly, you could try keeping the team's pokemon what they are, put both a physical Kabutops and Ludicolo, and rely on Kingdra and Rotom to hit from the special side of things.
 
Okay, let's make a summary.

Rotom is definitively too frail, so I took back Zapdos, this bulky beast that saved me a looot of times.
Kingdra with Outrage is definitively a beast, he is able to 2HKO that damn Vaporeon without destroy my SpA.
Scizor is now with Roost and a more defensive spread ; he is bulkier than before (if it's possible :D).
I tried the classic special Ludicolo, but with Leech Seed : boy, it works better than the Swords Dancer IMO.

Now I will edit my first post, if you want to say anything...
 
Well, I'm glad that the changes to Scizor, Kingdra, and the suggestion of leech seed helped. Though I'm far from an expert at competitive battling, weather teams are my specialty.. and I usually am fairly good at them, so if you end up getting stuck somewhere else, lemme know and I can try and help? >.<
 
Arikado : Zapdos isn't suppose to sweep. He is rather a supporter, even if he has Thunder. To defeat Breloom, it's kinda tricky : I personally use Ludicolo's Ice Beam or Kingdra's Outrage ; itdoesn't work everytime, but often. In any case, Breloom can't OHKO Zapdos with Focus Punch, so you're at least able to replenish the rain.

Nocturne.lullaby : I tested the team on SB, and it works now very well. Blissey is not such a problem anymore, because Leech Seed helps me a lot. Vaporeon is now easier to counter, with Kingdra's Outrage. With the new spread, Scizor can come easily on Dragonite and 3HKO him with Bullet Punch, without being killed under the rain (after a Dragonite's Draco Meteor and two Dragon Dance, and after SR damages). Thank you again a lot.
 
Well, if you lack a Special Sweeper, Omastar can take Kabutops' spot (since Ludicolo will take the Physical Set (if I am looking at this rate correctly that is). It has the same typing, has better Def stats, but is quite a bit slower without any rain. However, it looks like you have a decent chance in getting rain up, so you could try using this.

Thus:

Omastar @ Choice Specs
Timid
Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP/252 SpAtk/252 Spe
Moves:
-Surf/Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Ancient Power
-Hidden Power Grass

This set is probably one of the most powerful Special Sweeper sets when it comes to Rain Dance Sweepers.
 
Acklow said:
Well, if you lack a Special Sweeper, Omastar can take Kabutops' spot (since Ludicolo will take the Physical Set (if I am looking at this rate correctly that is). It has the same typing, has better Def stats, but is quite a bit slower without any rain. However, it looks like you have a decent chance in getting rain up, so you could try using this.

Thus:

Omastar @ Choice Specs
Timid
Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP/252 SpAtk/252 Spe
Moves:
-Surf/Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Ancient Power
-Hidden Power Grass

This set is probably one of the most powerful Special Sweeper sets when it comes to Rain Dance Sweepers.
Click to expand...
It's better to run with Life Orb as I used to run specs but then your opponent sends out a dragonite or vaporeon and you're stuck in Surf...
 
Shortyute said:
It's better to run with Life Orb as I used to run specs but then your opponent sends out a dragonite or vaporeon and you're stuck in Surf...
Click to expand...

True, but remember, this would act as a late game sweeper, after Blissey, Vaporeon, and any other Special Defensive threats have been removed. This shouldn't be to difficult with Kingdra and a few others in play to get rid of them.
 
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