Greninja + Rare Candy Clarification

[Its_A_Random]

If you are not a council member, I would recommend against posting in this thread.

deadfox081 Glacier Knight Its_A_Random Mowtom Texas Cloverleaf

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3555833/ - Discussion thread if you want to have a gander over it before voting.

Anyhow three slates, all will be voted on simultaneously. The slates are:

How should we hit Greninja?
Adjust Rare Candy so it only boosts the Pokémon's original type
Raise the EC of type changing through Protean by three (3)
Make it so Rare Candy Boosts is checked before changing types
Make it so the STAB check for Protean (without Color Change) is performed before the type change (and by extension, Rare Candy)
Do nothing

#1 was the Dogfish suggestion in feedback. #2 is Gerard's proposal. #3 is the Rare Candy rewording that I had proposed. #4 is Frosty's amendments to what I proposed (which I agree is a much cleaner way to do what I proposed). Do nothing is... do nothing.

Do we make it official that people are allowed to sub for a Pokémon (not) being a specific typing?
Yes
No

I am not even sure the subs for mon being some typing (and by extension, not being a specific typing) is legal so I guess this makes that fully legal and in writing?

Do we change Rare Candy so that Pokémon with two or more typings have all STAB's boosted by one (1)?
Yes
No

Simple clarification, really. Just deals with Forest's Curse/Trick or Treat scenarios if anything and we might as well deal with this while we are at it.

For the first slate, just vote one to whatever with the first option listed in the vote being first preference etc. For the latter two slates, just vote yes or no.

I will probably vote a little bit later, but yeah. Time to put this issue to bed (hopefully) for good?

 

[Mowtom]

How should we hit Greninja?

Make it so Rare Candy Boosts is checked before changing types
Raise the EC of type changing through Protean by three (3)
Make it so the STAB check for Protean (without Color Change) is performed before the type change (and by extension, Rare Candy)
Do nothing
Adjust Rare Candy so it only boosts the Pokémon's original type

Do we make it official that people are allowed to sub for a Pokémon (not) being a specific typing?

Yes

Do we change Rare Candy so that Pokémon with two or more typings have all STAB's boosted by one (1)?

Yes

 

[Glacier Knight]

How should we hit Greninja?

Make it so the STAB check for Protean (without Color Change) is performed before the type change (and by extension, Rare Candy)
Raise the EC of type changing through Protean by three (3)
Make it so Rare Candy Boosts is checked before changing types
Adjust Rare Candy so it only boosts the Pokémon's original type
Do nothing

Do we make it official that people are allowed to sub for a Pokémon (not) being a specific typing?

Yes

Do we change Rare Candy so that Pokémon with two or more typings have all STAB's boosted by one (1)?

Yes

 

[deadfox081]

How should we hit Greninja?

Adjust Rare Candy so it only boosts the Pokémon's original type
Make it so Rare Candy Boosts is checked before changing types
Make it so the STAB check for Protean (without Color Change) is performed before the type change (and by extension, Rare Candy)
Raise the EC of type changing through Protean by three (3)
Do nothing

Do we make it official that people are allowed to sub for a Pokémon (not) being a specific typing?

Yes

Do we change Rare Candy so that Pokémon with two or more typings have all STAB's boosted by one (1)?

Yes

 

[Texas Cloverleaf]

Latter two are majority

Make it so Rare Candy boosts is checked before changing types
Adjust Rare Candy so it only boosts original type
Some STAB check stuff
Do nothing
Raise the EC of type changing through Protean by 3*

Due to glaciers ranking, deadfox's first option can no longer win, resulting in a majority (my first, mowtoms first, deadfoxs second)

 

[Its_A_Random]

Yeah okay, I'll get around to implementing all this when I am at a computer and not on a tablet. Thanks for voting.

I was going to vote the Protean STAB check alteration first fwiw.

 

[Its_A_Random]

Or not yet because Mowtom apparently wants to change his mind but I am going to need to tag Frosty here to see if he is allowed to change his mind after the vote was called and before the whole thing was implemented.

 

[Frosty]

Vote called is called. In no democratic system we allow "change of mind". Like with any balance change, the option called will be implemented and tested and if mowtom (and other councilmembers) still feel that Greninja is too good, just bump the discussion thread and we will resume from where we left off.

For the record I was rooting for RC only for Original STABs option. And for Protean changing type after the move is used in second place. So this isn't a partial ruling as I really doubt this nerf will be enough (and it is clunky as hell). But oh well.

 

[Its_A_Random]

Frosty has spoken. Mowtom I said this to you in IRC yesterday so I will reiterate to you—and the rest of the council—that if you are not certain that you want to vote for something, do not vote until you are absolutely certain.

(Finally) Implementing.