Greninja

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Overview
########

Greninja is a potent threat in the CAP Metagame thanks to its high Speed and diverse movepool. It has an impressive base 122 Speed, allowing it to outspeed some of the fastest CAP Pokemon, such as Syclant and Cawmodore. Its ability Protean is one of the best in the game, giving Greninja a STAB boost on all of its attacks. Furthermore, its diverse physical and special movepool allows it to hit a wide array of Pokemon for super effective damage. Despite its positive attributes, foes can easily OHKO Greninja, especially with priority moves, due to its low defenses. This doesn't stop Greninja from being an effective Pokemon though, as it still makes for an excellent revenge killer and late-game cleaner.

Life Orb
########
name: Life Orb
move 1: Ice Beam
move 2: Hydro Pump / Low Kick
move 3: Extrasensory / Dark Pulse
move 4: Gunk Shot
ability: Protean
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Naive

Moves
========

Ice Beam functions as Greninja's most reliable and spammable attack thanks to Protean, and it hits plenty of common CAP Pokemon, such as Tomohawk, Colossoil, and Cyclohm, for massive damage. Hydro Pump provides excellent coverage alongside Ice Beam and hits anything that doesn't resist it or have a lot of special bulk incredibly hard. Low Kick is usable over Hydro Pump, still hitting Pokemon such as Tyranitar and Heatran for a lot of damage while also providing coverage versus Chansey and Ferrothorn. Extrasensory provides important coverage versus Mega Venusaur and Mollux, which could otherwise hard wall Greninja. Extrasensory also provides a guaranteed super effective hit on Tomohawk, which could otherwise stall turns with Roost and Leftovers. Dark Pulse hits Mega Metagross and Mega Slowbro hard. Gunk Shot allows Greninja to OHKO Mega Gardevoir and 2HKO several common Fairy-types, such as Clefable.

Set Details
========

Life Orb maximizes Greninja's damage output while still retaining the ability to switch moves. The given EV spread and nature maximize Greninja's Speed and Special Attack. A Naive nature is used to ensure that Greninja outspeeds threats such as Syclant. Greninja can also opt to invest more in its Attack to give Gunk Shot and Low Kick more power. 40 EVs in Attack allow Greninja to OHKO Assault Vest Azumarill with Gunk Shot, while 92 EVs in Attack lets it OHKO specially defensive Heatran with Low Kick after Stealth Rock damage. Finally, 124 Attack EVs let Greninja OHKO physically defensive Sylveon with Gunk Shot after Stealth Rock damage.

Usage Tips
========

Greninja's high Speed stat coupled with Protean and Life Orb-boosted attacks means it can OHKO several offensive threats or weakened defensive Pokemon. As such, it can be brought in mid-game to revenge kill or saved for late-game to clean up the opposition. However, its frailty means it should not switch directly into attacks, and it only should be brought in after a teammate has fainted or via a slow U-turn or Volt Switch. Additionally, it has trouble OHKOing bulky Pokemon, such as Clefable and Mega Charizard X, so a different Pokemon should be switched in to weaken the threat, allowing Greninja to clean up late-game.

Team Options
========

Greninja is powerful and often forces switches. To capitalize on this, entry hazards users, such as Tomohawk, Mollux, and Garchomp, make for good teammates. Greninja's ability to hit a majority of the metagame hard and high Speed means that it fits in well with the VoltTurn playstyle, so slower Volt Switch or U-turn users, such as Rotom-W and Colossoil, make for good teammates, as they can ensure that Greninja is brought in safely.

Other Options
########

Spikes gives Greninja a way of racking up residual damage on the opponent's team and can be used as the foe switches out; however, by running it, Greninja will be sacrificing important coverage. U-turn is an option to scout the foe and switch out to a Pokemon better equipped to handle the situation, but, again, Greninja loses out on important coverage and some of its late-game cleaning potential. Hidden Power Fire is an option to OHKO Ferrothorn, and Hidden Power Grass can be used to hit Rotom-W and Krilowatt harder than Greninja's other moves.

Checks & Counters
########

**Specially Defensive Pokemon**: Specially bulky Pokemon such as Chansey and Porygon2 are near counters to Greninja, as they can stomach its hits and slowly wear it down.
**Bulky Attackers**: Greninja has a hard time taking hits due to its low defenses, so Pokemon that can take a hit and KO it back, such as Tomohawk, Mega Venusaur, and Krilowatt, can be used to check it.
**Faster Attackers**: Greninja is easily checked and forced out by Choice Scarf users such as Keldeo and Mollux. In addition, Pokemon that are naturally faster than Greninja, such as Stratagem and Mega Manectric, can revenge kill it, but they shouldn't switch directly into Greninja.
 
Last edited:
Obviously a WIP in progress, so I'll leave you to it. That said, for items I really like Expert Belt on Greninja. It does need all the power Life Orb provides, but having tried it a couple of times (especially with U-turn where you're switching a lot) I got really frustrated with all the HP I was losing. Of note, between hazards and LO recoil, a couple of threats can stall you out just by playing it safe and spamming recovery. No fun.
 

Tadasuke

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Just a few things to add. I would take off Extrasensory and replace it with Dark Pulse. I know you have Tomohawk under consideration, but Ice Beam does the exact same job without a Roost happening, and better no less. I wouldn't have Hydro Pump slashed as it's Gren's hardest hitting special move. Also, I see absolutely no reason why HP Grass should be considered. One user's team and two other pokes only half-assedly used shouldn't be major considerations when determining one of your moves, especially a Hidden Power. I see Fire or Ground being infinitely more helpful than that. Lastly, since physical sets are becoming more and more possible (or rather non Timid/Modest sets), Shadow Sneak may become a decent priority move to take into consideration.

The EV's I see the most (literally aim's spread) on this are 252+ Spe / 252 SpA / 4 Atk. Being Naive or Hasty doesn't matter too very much since the thing's about as defensively sound as Zimbabwe's dollar. Life Orb is a great choice for item, since it has a high speed tier for OU, and almost inherently thereof an extremely high speed tier in CAP. The only other items I can think of to use would be Sash for a Spike lead or Choice Scarf to outspeed Mega Salamence and other speed-boosting megas until a ban occurs.
 

aim

pokeaimMD
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I'd put extrasensory in other options honestly. with mega mence running around, we havent seen much venusaur. Dark pulse/hp fire are great for that spot. dark pulse helps vs mew as well as gar etc etc

edit: just saw this wasnt ou LOL
 

Tadasuke

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I'd put extrasensory in other options honestly. with mega mence running around, we havent seen much venusaur. Dark pulse/hp fire are great for that spot. dark pulse helps vs mew as well as gar etc etc

edit: just saw this wasnt ou LOL
Mega Mence will probably be running around just as much. Only with more EQ.
 
Guys, this is very much WIP still; I stated that I'd be going more in depth with this on the weekend.

That being said, Extrasensory is a must for Greninja in CAP (CAP =/= OU), or else it gets hard walled by Mollux (much more common than Mew), while retaining fine coverage on Mega Venusaur and the OHKO on Gengar. As for Hydro Pump, Low Kick hits many of the same targets (Heatran, Tyranitar, and Colossoil) for higher damage, while also providing better coverage vs. Chansey+Ferrothorn. HP Fire... you know I actually explained most of this stuff in set/move details... just read that.
 

Tadasuke

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Guys, this is very much WIP still; I stated that I'd be going more in depth with this on the weekend.

That being said, Extrasensory is a must for Greninja in CAP (CAP =/= OU), or else it gets hard walled by Mollux (much more common than Mew), while retaining fine coverage on Mega Venusaur and the OHKO on Gengar. As for Hydro Pump, Low Kick hits many of the same targets (Heatran, Tyranitar, and Colossoil) for higher damage, while also providing better coverage vs. Chansey+Ferrothorn. HP Fire... you know I actually explained most of this stuff in set/move details... just read that.
I personally believe that Mega Venusaur won't be as much of a common threat as it was over the summer when stall reigned supreme overlord of all CAP. It's gone down in usage along with stall, and the inclusion of so many new megas isn't going to help it rise in popularity. While still being a menacing poke, it won't be as omnipresent in competitive play. I see the point you give for both Extrasensory and Low Kick, and agree with them, but Gren has the worst fucking case of 4MSS out of all GameFreak pokes.

Again, I think you should just list the vanilla EV spreads, no need to get fancy or calc anything. Upon a further glance, I noticed that there's a good slot in C&C reserved for faster pokes, especially the monsters the project has produced. Sash Syclant, while not outspeeding, can easily OHKO with Bug Buzz after being brought down to its sash. Stratagem threatens the normal variant with, well, everything, and the scarf variant with a delicious nutritious SE Technician boosted Vacuum Wave.

Overall, just elaborate on all the one-lined sections.
 
Alright, now that I've had a chance to actually write stuff, I'll remove the WIP label. Ready for QC/thoughts/whatever.
 

HeaLnDeaL

Let's Keep Fighting
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I really think extrasensory should be run before dark pulse. Ice beam isn't particularly reliable on tomo... Extrasensory also beats up Plasmanta, Beedrill, and Lopunny better than ninja's other options.
 
I really think extrasensory should be run before dark pulse. Ice beam isn't particularly reliable on tomo... Extrasensory also beats up Plasmanta, Beedrill, and Lopunny better than ninja's other options.
Gotcha, switched the two moves around. I also added a mention of Tomohawk+Roost potentially stalling it out.
 

HeaLnDeaL

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Looking good. At this point, just super minor quirks and then I'll give QC.

  • 92 Atk EVs lets it OHKO Heatran after rocks with Low Kick.
  • 124 Atk EVs lets it OHKO Sylveon after rocks with Gunk Shot.
Please specify which Heatran and Sylveon sets these beat, since both mons have multiple EV spreads themselves.
 

Winry

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I will GP this ^_^
Overview
########

Greninja is a potent threat in the CAP Metagame thanks to its high Speed and diverse movepool. It has an impressive base 122 Speed, allowing it to outspeed some of the fastest CAP Pokemon, such as Syclant and Cawmodore. Its ability, Protean, is one of the best in the game, giving Greninja STAB on all of its attacks. Furthermore, its diverse physical and special movepool allows it to hit a wide array of Pokemon for super- (remove hyphen) effective damage. Despite its positive attributes, it finds itself easily OHKO'd OHKOed and vulnerable to priority due to its low defenses. This doesn't stop Greninja from being an effective Pokemon though, as it still makes for an excellent revenge killer and late-game (add hyphen) cleaner.

Life Orb
########
name: Life Orb
move 1: Ice Beam
move 2: Hydro Pump / Low Kick
move 3: Extrasensory / Dark Pulse
move 4: Gunk Shot
ability: Protean
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Naive

Moves
========

Ice Beam functions as Greninja's most reliable and spammable attack thanks to Protean, and it hits plenty of common CAP Pokemon like Tomohawk, Colossoil, and Cyclohm for massive damage. Hydro Pump provides excellent coverage alongside Ice Beam, (RC) and hits anything that doesn't without a resist it or have a lot of special bulk incredibly hard. Low Kick is usable over Hydro Pump, still hitting Pokemon such as like Tyranitar and Heatran for high a lot of damage while also providing coverage versus Chansey and Ferrothorn. Extrasensory provides important coverage versus Mega Venusaur and Mollux, who could which otherwise hard wall Greninja. Extrasensory also provides a guaranteed super effective hit on Tomohawk, who which could otherwise stall turns with Roost and Leftovers. Dark Pulse can be used to hit Mega Metagross and Mega Slowbro hard. Gunk Shot allows Greninja to OHKO Mega Gardevoir, (RC) while also 2HKOing and 2HKO several common Fairy-types such as Clefable.

Set Details
========

Life Orb is used to maximize Greninja's damage output while still retaining the ability to switch moves. The given EV spread and nature maximizes Greninja's Speed and Special Attack. A Naive nature is used to ensure that Greninja outspeeds threats such as Syclant. Greninja can also opt to invest more in its Attack to give Gunk Shot and Low Kick more power. 40 EVs in Attack allows Greninja to OHKO Assault Vest Azumarill with Gunk Shot., (period -> comma) while 92 EVs in Attack lets it OHKO Specially Defensive Heatran after Stealth Rock with Low Kick. And Finally, 124 Atk Attack EVs lets it Greninja OHKO Physically Defensive Sylveon after Stealth Rock with Gunk Shot.

Usage Tips
========

Greninja's high Speed stat coupled with Protean and Life Orb-boosted (add hyphen) attacks means it can OHKO several offensive threats or weakened defensive Pokemon. As such, it can be brought in mid-game to revenge kill, (RC) or saved for late-game to clean up the opposition. However, its frailty means it should not switch directly into attacks, and it only should be brought in after a teammate has fainted, (RC) or via a slow U-turn or Volt Switch. Additionally, it has trouble OHKOing bulky Pokemon at full health, such as Clefable and Mega Charizard-X, so a different Pokemon should be switched in to weaken the threat, allowing Greninja to clean up late-game.

Team Options
========

Greninja is powerful and often forces switches. To capitalize on this, Pokemon that can set up entry hazards make for good teammates, such as Tomohawk, Mollux, and Garchomp. Its ability to hit a majority of the metagame hard and high Speed means that Greninja fits in well with the VoltTurn playstyle, so slower Volt Switch or U-turn users such as Rotom-W and Colssoil make for good teammates, as they can ensure that Greninja is brought in safely.

Other Options
########

Spikes gives Greninja a way of racking up residual damage on the opponent's team and can be used as the opponent foe switches out.; (period -> semi) however, by running it, (AC) Greninja will be sacrificing important coverage. U-turn is an option to scout the opponent foe and switch out to a Pokemon better equipped to handle the situation, but again, (AC) Greninja loses out on important coverage, (RC) and loses some of its late-game cleaning potential. Hidden Power Fire is an option to OHKO Ferrothorn, and Hidden Power Grass can be used to hit Rotom-W and Krillowatt Krilowatt harder than Greninja's other moves.

Checks & Counters
########

**Specially Defensive Pokemon**: Pokemon with high Special Defense bulk such as Chansey and Porygon2 are near counters, (AC) as they can stomach Greninja's hits and eventually wear it down.

**Bulky Attackers**: Greninja has a hard time taking hits due to its low defenses, (AC) so Pokemon that can take a hit from Greninja and KO it back can be used to check Greninja, such as Tomohawk, Mega Venusaur, and Krilowatt, (AC) can be used to check it. (added the first part because this seemed a little vague/bare. I don't play VGC so I can't add much anyway)

**Faster Attackers**: Greninja is easily checked and forced out by Choice Scarf users such as Keldeo and Mollux. Also In addition, Pokemon that are naturally faster than Greninja, such as Stratagem and Mega Manectric, can revenge kill it, but shouldn't switch directly into Greninja.


1/2
 
Last edited:

Weebl

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Overview
########

Greninja is a potent threat in the CAP Metagame thanks to its high Speed and diverse movepool. It has an impressive base 122 Speed, allowing it to outspeed some of the fastest CAP Pokemon, such as Syclant and Cawmodore. Its ability, (RC) Protean, (RC) is one of the best in the game, giving Greninja a STAB boost on all of its attacks. Furthermore, its diverse physical and special movepool allows it to hit a wide array of Pokemon for super effective damage. Despite its positive attributes, it finds itself easily OHKOed foes can easily OHKO Greninja, especially with priority moves, and vulnerable to priority due to its low defenses. This doesn't stop Greninja from being an effective Pokemon though, as it still makes for an excellent revenge killer and late-game cleaner.

Life Orb
########
name: Life Orb
move 1: Ice Beam
move 2: Hydro Pump / Low Kick
move 3: Extrasensory / Dark Pulse
move 4: Gunk Shot
ability: Protean
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Naive

Moves
========

Ice Beam functions as Greninja's most reliable and spammable attack thanks to Protean, and it hits plenty of common CAP Pokemon, such as like Tomohawk, Colossoil, and Cyclohm, (AC) for massive damage. Hydro Pump provides excellent coverage alongside Ice Beam and hits anything that doesn't resist it or have a lot of special bulk incredibly hard. Low Kick is usable over Hydro Pump, still hitting Pokemon such as Tyranitar and Heatran for a lot of damage while also providing coverage versus Chansey and Ferrothorn. Extrasensory provides important coverage versus Mega Venusaur and Mollux, which could otherwise hard wall Greninja. Extrasensory also provides a guaranteed super effective hit on Tomohawk, which could otherwise stall turns with Roost and Leftovers. Dark Pulse can be used to hits Mega Metagross and Mega Slowbro hard. Gunk Shot allows Greninja to OHKO Mega Gardevoir and 2HKO several common Fairy-types, (AC) such as Clefable.

Set Details
========

Life Orb is used to maximizes Greninja's damage output while still retaining the ability to switch moves. The given EV spread and nature maximize Greninja's Speed and Special Attack. A Naive nature is used to ensure that Greninja outspeeds threats such as Syclant. Greninja can also opt to invest more in its Attack to give Gunk Shot and Low Kick more power. 40 EVs in Attack allow Greninja to OHKO Assault Vest Azumarill with Gunk Shot, while 92 EVs in Attack lets it OHKO specially defensive Heatran after Stealth Rock with Low Kick after Stealth Rock damage. Finally, 124 Attack EVs let Greninja OHKO physically defensive Sylveon after Stealth Rock with Gunk Shot after Stealth Rock damage.

Usage Tips
========

Greninja's high Speed stat coupled with Protean and Life Orb-boosted attacks means it can OHKO several offensive threats or weakened defensive Pokemon. As such, it can be brought in mid-game to revenge kill or saved for late-game to clean up the opposition. However, its frailty means it should not switch directly into attacks, and it only should be brought in after a teammate has fainted or via a slow U-turn or Volt Switch. Additionally, it has trouble OHKOing bulky Pokemon at full health, such as Clefable and Mega Charizard-X (remove hyphen), so a different Pokemon should be switched in to weaken the threat, allowing Greninja to clean up late-game.

Team Options
========

Greninja is powerful and often forces switches. To capitalize on this, Pokemon that can set up entry hazard users, (AC) such as Tomohawk, Mollux, and Garchomp, make for good teammates, such as Tomohawk, Mollux, and Garchomp. Its Greninja's ability to hit a majority of the metagame hard and high Speed means that Greninja it fits in well with the VoltTurn playstyle, so slower Volt Switch or U-turn users, (AC) such as Rotom-W and Colssoil, (AC) make for good teammates, as they can ensure that Greninja is brought in safely.

Other Options
########

Spikes gives Greninja a way of racking up residual damage on the opponent's team and can be used as the foe switches out; however, by running it, Greninja will be sacrificing important coverage. U-turn is an option to scout the foe and switch out to a Pokemon better equipped to handle the situation, but, (AC) again, Greninja loses out on important coverage and some of its late-game cleaning potential. Hidden Power Fire is an option to OHKO Ferrothorn, and Hidden Power Grass can be used to hit Rotom-W and Krilowatt harder than Greninja's other moves.

Checks & Counters
########

**Specially Defensive Pokemon**: Pokemon with high Special Defense Specially bulky Pokemon such as Chansey and Porygon2 are near counters to Greninja, as they can stomach Greninja's its hits and eventually slowly wear it down.
(remove empty line)
**Bulky Attackers**: Greninja has a hard time taking hits due to its low defenses, so Pokemon that can take a hit and KO it back, such as Tomohawk, Mega Venusaur, and Krilowatt, can be used to check it.
(remove empty line)
**Faster Attackers**: Greninja is easily checked and forced out by Choice Scarf users such as Keldeo and Mollux. In addition, Pokemon that are naturally faster than Greninja, such as Stratagem and Mega Manectric, can revenge kill it, but they shouldn't switch directly into Greninja.

GP 2/2
 
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