Other Offensive vs. Defensive Project [Round 3]

[The Shellder Smuggler]

Approved by Haunter

Hello everybody, me here, and welcome to the Defensive versus Offensive Project! Which is truly better, offense or defense?

Overview

So basically, we'll be making two different teams - one offensive and one defensive - and we'll be seeing how they face off in the end. There will be a different teams each round consisting of different people, depending on who wants to join which round. Each team will have 14 players (28 players total) , and you can't enter a team until next round. Entering a team would be a pretty easy unless more people want to join. For this reason, just put a brief sentence on why you feel you should be on said team. Signups will be open for a day or two, before that rounds teams are chosen, and the following round goes on for a week. REMEMBER, each round there will be new teams. Even though there are new teams each round, at the end of the project, each participating member will be given a shout-out for their participation and help with the project.

Now, for the actual project, each team will have to create a Pokemon set, one either defensive or offensive, depending on what team they chose. They'll have to work in their team to create five sets and then present both to me as their final decision. A random decision will then be made (random numbers ftw), deciding which one of five sets will be put as the teams first Pokemon choice. This is too make sure that each set that you post actually means shit. THESE SETS ARE BASED ON XY OU.

Offensive Sets

An offensive set would be a set that focuses mostly on power. The only defensive aspect that should be seen on an offensive set would be a recovery move, or HP investment. An offensive set can have a boosting move, but should have maximum attacking investment, to show it isn't a bulky setting up set.

This would count as an offensive set:

Deoxys-S @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
Nature: Naive
EVs: 252 SpA, 176 Atk, 76 Spd
- Superpower
- Psycho Boost
- Focus Blast
- Thunderbolt

Mostly offensive investment, and all offensive moves along with a Life Orb to boost the attacks' power.

This would not count as an offensive set:

Scizor @ Leftovers
Ability: Technician
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 HP, 44 Atk, 208 SpD
- Roost
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Bug Bite

The set sets itself up to be offensive, but there is minimal offensive investment, cutting it from full power. JUST BECAUSE IT HAS A BOOSTING MOVE DOESN'T STOP IT FROM BEING OFFENSIVE. THE FACT THAT IT RELIES MOSTLY ON THAT BOOSTING MOVE WHILE INVESTING IN BULK MAKES IT DEFENSIVE.

Defensive Sets

A defensive set would be where a Pokemon invests in bulk, and can set itself up (like the bulky swords dance scizor above). Most sets can include Stall, recovery, and boosting moves.

This is a defensive set:

Milotic @ Leftovers
Ability: Marvel Scale
Nature: Calm
EVs: 252 HP, 252 SpDef, 4 HP
- Scald/Toxic
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Haze/Protect/Rest

This set is mainly invested in bulk, and focuses mainly on status to wear down its opponent.

This is not a defensive set:

Lucario @ Lucarionite
Ability: Adaptability
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk, 252 Spd, 4 HP
- Swords Dance
- Crunch
- Bullet Punch
- Close Combat

I used this because having a boosting move doesn't make it defensive, if I was unclear earlier. :]

ALL QUESTIONS AND TEAM SIGNUPS SHOULD BE POSTED ON THIS THREAD, AND NOT MESSAGED TO ME. THIS IS TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR NEWER MEMBERS WHO READ THE THREAD

Round One Offensive team

1. Chesnaught
2. Mowtom
3. Waltz01
4. s_aman
5. Blizzardhail
6. AGuyWithPants
7. dbzmariogeno
8. Felony
9. Exeggutive
10. Arhan
11. Hail Magikarp
12. BurningFury101
13. Fr33dom

Round One Defensive Team

1. finncent1
2. Salemance
3. Clair
4. Tomahawk9
5. casey90
6. Entei The Swift
7. Dr. Eyepatch
8. MudcrabDL
9. EtherDrive
10. Rosenfeldius
11. madbadger
12. Stallion
13. moonbase
14. Erick17
15. acam333

Round One Nominations

Defensive team sets:

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Download, Bold Nature
252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SpDef
- Tri Attack
- Recover
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave

Gyarados @ Chesto Berry
Intimidate, Impish Nature
248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
- Waterfall
- Thunder Wave
- Dragon Tail
- Rest

Mega-Venusaur @ Venusaurite
Thick Fat, Bold Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpAtk
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Earthquake
- Synthesis

Quagsire @ Leftovers
Unaware, Relaxed Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpDef
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Recover
- Curse / Scald

Togekiss @ Leftovers
Serene Grace, Calm Nature
248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpDef
- Air Slash
- Thunder Wave
- Roost
- Defog

Offensive team sets:

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 36 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 216 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Outrage
- Swords Dance
- Roost

y.cobano.como.yo (Kyurem-Black) @ Leftovers
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 52 HP / 204 SAtk / 252 Spd
Rash Nature
- Substitute
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Deoxys-Speed @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Mild Nature
- Psycho Boost
- Superpower
- Ice Beam
- Stealth Rock

Bisharp @ Life orb
Abillity: Defiant
Evs: 252Atk 252spd 4 HP
Nature: Adamant
- Pursuit
- Sucker punch
- Knock off
- Iron head

Landorus-I @ Life Orb
nature : Timid
evs : 252 spA /252 spe / 4 spD
- Calm Mind
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast
- Psychic

Round 1 winning sets

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Download, Bold Nature
252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SpDef
- Tri Attack
- Recover
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave

y.cobano.como.yo (Kyurem-Black) @ Leftovers
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 52 HP / 204 SAtk / 252 Spd
Rash Nature
- Substitute
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Round 2 Teams

Defense

1. Salemance
2. EtherDrive
3. finncent1
4. The Fennec Fox
5. Rosenfeldius
6. Albacore
7. moonbase
8. Stallion
9. Entei The Swift
10. lee302
11. Hail Magikarp
12. casey90
13. MudcrabDL
14. Dr. Eyepatch
15. Clair
16.

Offense

1. RotomPoison
2. Memoric
3. s_aman
4. DC-Shadow_Blaze
5. AGuyWithPants
6. dhanush1998
7. Blizzardhail
8. Gennosuke Fujiki
9. Quickbobhero
10. TheZokeShipper
11. Shurtugal
12. biggy330
13. BlackyXD
14. KeldeoJustified
15. Dirty Bum
16.

Round 2 nominations

Offensive team sets

Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SAtk / 168 HP / 88 Spd
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Calm Mind
- Substitute

Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 122 HP / 252 Atk / 136 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Play Rough
- Fire Fang
- Substitute

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Ice Beam
- Fire Blast

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Crabhammer
- Superpower

Pinsir @ Pinsirite
Ability: Hyper Cutter
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Return
- Close Combat
- Earthquake

Defensive Team Sets

Gyarados @ Chesto Berry
Intimidate, Impish Nature
248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
- Waterfall
- Thunder Wave
- Dragon Tail
- Rest

Goodra @ Assault Vest
Gooey, Calm Nature
252 HP / 236 SpDef / 20 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam
- Dragon Pulse

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Sturdy, Impish Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Defog
- Roost
- Whirlwind

Tyranitar @ Assault Vest
Sandstream, Sassy Nature
252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpDef
- Crunch
- Pursuit
- Ice Beam
- Superpower

Krookodile @ Leftovers
Intimidate, Impish Nature
252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
- Knock Off
- Pursuit
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Round 2 winning sets

Offensive

Pinsir @ Pinsirite
Ability: Hyper Cutter
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Return
- Close Combat
- Earthquake

Gyarados @ Chesto Berry
Intimidate, Impish Nature
248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
- Waterfall
- Thunder Wave
- Dragon Tail
- Rest

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

So for instance (putting this here so if people want to reply they'll use this format), the sign ups for a team should look like:

The Shellder Smuggler
Offensive
I would like to take part in the offensive team for round 1 because I believe offense is the key to winning a battle and I have experience using offensive pokemon.

Don't make it as shitty as that, though.

 

[skies]

What about Balanced Offense? Or Balanced Defense.
Anyways,
Chesnaught
Offensive
I'd like to join because I've never truly liked stall and I've never enjoyed fighting it and I'm interested in other offensive teams, so yeah!

 

[Mowtom]

Mowtom
Offensive
I would like to take part in the offensive team for round 1 because I feel more comfortable on offense than defense. I think that defense is too vulnerable to luck such as critical hits. Also, I would like to get to use a variety of offenseive Pokemon I haven't yet used.

 

[Waltz01]

A question: is this like 16 battles, each user on each team having one?

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

A question: is this like 16 battles, each user on each team having one?

No, x amount of volunteers will use their final team against x amount of different volunteers using their final team to determine which approach is better. I still want to decide what amount of volunteers would be needed. :]

 

[Waltz01]

Thanks, alright cool I'll be in then for offense because I'm really bad at defense (?)

 

[Aragorn the King]

Offense rules the metagame. At +2, Mega-Pinsir will pretty much beat everything. That's why I'd like to be on the Defensive team, as in my humble opinion, it's harder. There are scary Pokemon out there, and it's a defensive team's job to beat them all, which sounds fun to me.

PS: The Shellder Smuggler since CroCune is fully invested in defense, cares about Calm Mind's SpD boosts as much as its SA boosts, and uses Scald largely for the burn chance, would you consider it defensive or offensive?

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

Offense rules the metagame. At +2, Mega-Pinsir will pretty much beat everything. That's why I'd like to be on the Defensive team, as in my humble opinion, it's harder. There are scary Pokemon out there, and it's a defensive team's job to beat them all, which sounds fun to me.

PS: The Shellder Smuggler since CroCune is fully invested in speed, cares about Calm Mind's SpD boosts as much as its SA boosts, and uses Scald largely for the burn chance, would you consider it defensive or offensive?

Meh, I think I'll go for defensive on that.

 

[Salemance]

So does the team have to be entirely defensive with no Strong Attack invested pokes or am I able to? I'm trying to figure out as my team has that incorporated in it, and I'd like to know as this seems fun-ish.

EDIT: signing up as
Salemance
Defensive
I would like to join this as my playstyle has always leaned towards a more defensively approach, from taking hits and healing to being able to just make things easier for the rest of the team, making this the ideal category to sign up on.

 

[s_aman]

s_aman
offensive

I want to join because i ONLY know how to make and battle with hyper offensive teams, and i i am quite good at it. I would also like to see other good offensive teams and stall being killed.

 

[Clair]

Clair
Defensive

Well I've got no idea what kind of justification you want, so here goes...I've been almost solely a defensive player since 4th gen. I love the strategy and maneuvering of stall, where each player works to exploit tiny advantages or weaknesses. I've had a lot of success using defensive teams this gen, getting within the top 10 on PS a bunch of times.

I would like to suggest that limiting the defensive team to completely defensive mons is a bad idea. It really is close to impossible to play stall this generation without some kind of major offensive pressure. High on the ladder you see a huge number of Quag/Venu/Chans/Skarm/Tran teams with no real ability to put pressure on the opponent, and without exception they all languish around the 1700-1800 mark because they lose to all the defensive teams which incorporate some kind of offensive strategy (e.g. the current #1's team, which uses a Char-X + Gothitelle core, or mine (currently #9) which uses CB Entei and CB Azumarill).

 

[rachet67]

Clair
Defensive

Well I've got no idea what kind of justification you want, so here goes...I've been almost solely a defensive player since 4th gen. I love the strategy and maneuvering of stall, where each player works to exploit tiny advantages or weaknesses. I've had a lot of success using defensive teams this gen, getting within the top 10 on PS a bunch of times.

I would like to suggest that limiting the defensive team to completely defensive mons is a bad idea. It really is close to impossible to play stall this generation without some kind of major offensive pressure. High on the ladder you see a huge number of Quag/Venu/Chans/Skarm/Tran teams with no real ability to put pressure on the opponent, and without exception they all languish around the 1700-1800 mark because they lose to all the defensive teams which incorporate some kind of offensive strategy (e.g. the current #1's team, which uses a Char-X + Gothitelle core, or mine (currently #9) which uses CB Entei and CB Azumarill).

If anything, the restrictions on offensive teams in this thread (have to run max attacking stats, can't run support mons, can't use bulky set up mons) are even more crippling, though I agree with you that stall can use some offensive presence.

 

[Blizzardhail]

Hello The Shellder Smuggler ( Trying to act professional here)
Blizzardhail
Offensive
I have experience in this field. Most of my teams are HO with peak at 1600+ with one team. It sounds pathetic but I just built that team an week ago and I don't have much time so the time I actually spent laddering is less than two hours

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

I would like to suggest that limiting the defensive team to completely defensive mons is a bad idea. It really is close to impossible to play stall this generation without some kind of major offensive pressure. High on the ladder you see a huge number of Quag/Venu/Chans/Skarm/Tran teams with no real ability to put pressure on the opponent, and without exception they all languish around the 1700-1800 mark because they lose to all the defensive teams which incorporate some kind of offensive strategy (e.g. the current #1's team, which uses a Char-X + Gothitelle core, or mine (currently #9) which uses CB Entei and CB Azumarill).

I apologize because that's the challenge. Defensive don't need to be completely stall, but there shouldn't any pokemon using all damaging moves or having max offensive investment.

Vice versa with offensive.

It's supposed to be challenging, and be a little out of the ordinary. I guess the mons could have some offensive presence, but even then it's a 1/5 chance that I pick it for your final set. I mean come on, do you think anyone in the right mind would give a full team of only defensive mons? :]

 

[Tomahawk]

I'm gonna have to agree with Clair here, with the way it currently would be defensive stands no chance imo. The offensive teams knows it is facing a defensive team, so it can focus completely on using stallbreakers and such which gives them a huge matchup advantage. Stall can't really work around that if all they can use are pure defensive mons (I mean, not even allowing a Scarfer or such really reduces their options).

But I'll try doing defensive, I have some experience with this, 3 generations in (DPP / BW / XY). Also, I have experience with lots of playstyles, full stall as well as semistall or defensively based balanced teams which I think would a better route to go here.

Also, I'm not sure if your system is the best? It seems a little weird, it seems pretty hard to actually build a functional team with that if each member is gonna be randomized among 5 potential options, for offensive I guess this still works but again this hurts the defensive teams since they really rely on defensive synergy.

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

I'm gonna have to agree with Clair here, with the way it currently would be defensive stands no chance imo. The offensive teams knows it is facing a defensive team, so it can focus completely on using stallbreakers and such which gives them a huge matchup advantage. Stall can't really work around that if all they can use are pure defensive mons (I mean, not even allowing a Scarfer or such really reduces their options).


Also, I'm not sure if your system is the best? It seems a little weird, it seems pretty hard to actually build a functional team with that if each member is gonna be randomized among 5 potential options, for offensive I guess this still works but again this hurts the defensive teams since they really rely on defensive synergy.

Like I said, the defensive mons don't need to be completely defensive, but not trying to discreetly pull off an offensive set. I made it 5 options because you guys will have a week, can use different pokemon will potential synergy, and it pushes people to actually make 5 useful sets. Allowing a trick scarfer is totally fine, lol. I'm pretty sure most things people put will be fit the criteria and be awesome.

Thanks for joining Tomahawk9 :]



EDIT: I know I'm unclear as hell, but just ask a question about a viable option for your team in the thread and I'll answer it.

 

[casey90]

First off, I love the idea of this, it sounds like a more fun CCAT. I would personally love to join the Defensive side as I believe defense forces more creativity both in set design and inherent playstyle. Being primarily reactive based, it's fun to make a defensive team that is able to play proactive to outpace an opponent, as opposed to just having answers to everything the opponent has (which it obviously won't).

One question though, will each side know what's picked for the opposite team? Or will it be kept secret until the end when we finally have the (pokemon)showdown?

 

[AGuyWithPants]

I wouldnt mind joining the Offensive side :).

 

[Felony]

Felony
Offensive
I have always been more of an offensive player. I like to be able to put pressure on my opponent with strong moves from powerful mons and personally I believe Offense has been the best playstyle to use these last two generations due to the new tools and sweepers ushering. I also admire speed which is why I have never really been a fan of Stall. I'll go Offensive.

 

[RotomPoison]

Last minute entry for offensive because, in this gen, stall heavily relies on extremely specific Pokemon holding the team together, limiting diversity and any actual fun that could come out of stall, besides the severely underrated Skarm + Gastrodon core.

Also because Swagplay would've counted as defensive and I'm not going near that with my luck.

 

[Entei The Swift]

So for instance (putting this here so if people want to reply they'll use this format), the sign ups for a team should look like:

The Shellder Smuggler
Offensive
I would like to take part in the offensive team for round 1 because I believe offense is the key to winning a battle and I have experience using offensive pokemon.

Don't make it as shitty as that, though.

Entei The Swift
Defensive
With their own priority in the form of prankster any offensive threat can be crippled. Also I hate stall teams so figured I would use what I dislike.
.
Also what is

aegislash classified under
252hp/252spatk/4def

Bulk DD gya
248 hp, 88 atk, 136 spe

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

One question though, will each side know what's picked for the opposite team? Or will it be kept secret until the end when we finally have the (pokemon)showdown?

First off, thanks for joining. Second of all, I would keep it secret but posting helpful sets in the thread would be great.

 

[The Shellder Smuggler]

aegislash classified under
252hp/252spatk/4def

Bulk DD gya
248 hp, 88 atk, 136 spe

First is offensive, second is defensive.

 

[RotomPoison]

In that case I would like to help out a little since I want to see someone improve this core:

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Defog / Spikes
- Taunt / Stealth Rock
- Brave Bird / Toxic

Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 SAtk
Calm Nature
- Recover
- Scald
- Toxic
- Earth Power

They resist or are immune to each others weaknesses, and Gastrodon can absorb the Hydro Pumps and Waterfalls from the common rain offense teams.

Between them they have:

10 resistances (Normal, Flying, Rock, Steel (both), Fire, Bug, Grass, Psychic, Dragon, Fairy)

4 immunities (Poison, Electric, Ground, Water)

leaving just neutralities to Fighting, Ghost, and Dark. Which a Bisharp partner can handle and, if Skarmory does not run Defog, pressure other Defoggers while pressuring Ghosts. Ghost and Fighting resistances are pretty common in the metagame now, so you can easily add one on, especially since Bisharp should not be relied on to take hits, but can if it needs to due to a decent Defense stat.