OptiMons [Slate 22: Gen 4] {Voting}

[skies]

OptiMons​

Welcome to OptiMons, a Pet Mod where each Pokemon is optimized to their full extent. Here's the guidelines to define what 'optimized' means:

1. A Pokemon becomes optimized once they have been given all of the necessary tools to be used to their highest ability. Be it a small change, be it a big change: a Pokemon has its limits. Nothing is broken, intentionally at least.
2. No Pokemon will be injured, or de-optimized if you will. No Uber Pokemon will be dropped down with nerfs allowed, as that defeats the entire purpose of optimizing a Pokemon.
3. In order to create an optimization, think of a Pokemon's inherit flaws. Then, work around these flaws by including slight tweaks to turn these flaws into non-issues. That will make a Pokemon fully optimized.
4. Once a Pokemon is optimized, it can be amended if the community decides that a.) the optimization makes the Pokemon too powerful, or b.) the optimization turns out to not be as useful as expected.

Here is an example of an optimized Pokemon:

Primarina [Optimized]
Abilities: Torrent | [HA] Liquid Voice
Stats: 90 HP / 74 Atk / 94 Def / 126 SpA / 126 SpD / 70 Spe
Added Moves: Perish Song, Recover, Whirlpool, Signal Beam, Boomburst
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, +20 Def, +10 SpD, +10 Spe

Primarina's key flaws include too low Speed, a useless ability, a lack of recovery, and inability to stand out as its bulk is simply not up to par with other bulky Special Attackers. However, by adding just a little more bulk and giving it access to Recover, Primarina becomes a much more optimized version of itself. Furthermore, Boomburst access makes Liquid Voice a worthwhile ability since Boomburst is now its most powerful Water-type attack. Perish Song and Whirlpool give Primarina the ability to stallbreak as well, giving it an even more powerful niche. Signal Beam is given to allow it to hit Grass-types such as Celebi, notably, harder than with a simple Ice Beam. Primarina has now become more optimized because it has the ability to break through its common roadblocks, it's more reliable as a defensive Pokemon, and it has just enough Speed to make itself an offensive niche. Primarina's not overpowered since it still suffers from poor Speed, succumbing to offensive pressure, and inability to hit everything it would like to.
​

If you'd like to use the above format, here's the code!

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[IMG]http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/type/type.gif[/IMG][IMG]http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/type/type.gif[/IMG]
[B]pokemon [Optimized][/B]
Abilities:
Stats:
Added Moves:
Summary of Changes:
description

Here's an index of the optimized Pokemon:

Index

​

Primarina [Optimized]
Abilities: Torrent | [HA] Liquid Voice
Stats: 90 HP / 74 Atk / 94 Def / 126 SpA / 126 SpD / 70 Spe
Added Moves: Perish Song, Recover, Whirlpool, Signal Beam, Boomburst
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, +20 Def, +10 SpD, +10 Spe

​

Decidueye [Optimized]
Abilities: Overgrow | [HA] Long Reach
Stats: 88 HP / 112 Atk / 75 Def / 100 SpA / 125 SpD / 80 Spe [BST 580]
Added Moves: Will-o-Wisp, Taunt, Focus Blast, Leaf Storm, Shadow Sneak
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, +5 Atk, +25 SpD, +10 Spe

​

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze / Intimidate (HA)
Stats: 115/125/95/80/90/95
Added Moves: Sucker Punch, Superpower, Wild Charge, Knock Off, Blaze Kick, Power Trip, Haze, Pursuit
Summary of Changes: +20 HP +10 Atk +5 Def +35 Spe

​

Ninjask [Optimized]
Abilities: Speed Boost | [HA] Adaptability
Stats: 61 HP / 109 Atk / 45 Def / 50 SpA / 50 SpD / 175 Spe [BST 485]
Added Moves: Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Acrobatics, Lunge, Knock Off, Taunt
Summary of Changes: +19 Atk, +15 Spe

​

Abilities: Wonder Guard / [HA] Shed Skin
Stats: 1 HP / 100 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 40 Spe [231 BST]
Added Moves: Bulldoze, Destiny Bond, Infestation, Spikes, U-turn
Summary of Changes: +10 Atk, -15 Def

​

Articuno [Optimized]
Abilities: Pressure | [HA] Snow Warning
Stats: 90 HP / 85 Atk / 85 Def / 100 SpA / 95 SpD / 125 Spe (BST: 580)
Added Moves: Calm Mind, Defog (legal with Snow Warning), Aura Sphere(?)
Summary of Changes: Rearranged it's stats

​

Moltres [Optimized]
Abilities: Pressure | [HA] Regenerator
Stats: 90 HP / 100 Atk / 90 Def / 125 SpA / 85 SpD / 90 Spe [BST 580]
Added Moves: Earth Power, Superpower
Summary of Changes: n/a

Wormadam-Plant (optimized)

​

Abilitiy: Filter | Regenerator | Harvest (HA)
Stats: 120 HP | 49 Atk | 95 Def | 109 SpA | 115 SpD | 56 Spe (544 BST)
Added Moves: Rapid Spin, Recover, Sticky Web, Stealth Rock, Leech Seed
Summary of Changes: +60 HP, -10 Atk, +10 Def, +30 SpA, +10 SpD, +20 Spe (+120 BST

Wormadam-Trash (optimized)

​

Abilitiy: Filter | Regenerator | Iron Barbs (HA)
Stats: 80 HP | 109 Atk | 105 Def | 109 SpA | 105 SpD | 36 Spe (544 BST)
Added Moves: Rapid Spin, Recover, Sticky Web, Stealth Rock, Toxic Spikes
Summary of Changes: +20 HP, +40 Atk, +10 Def, +40 SpA, +10 SpD (+120 BST)

​

Mothim [Optimized]
Abilities: Swarm | Simple | [HA] Tinted Lens
Stats: 80 HP / 104 Atk / 50 Def / 104 SpA / 70 SpD / 85 Spe
Added Moves: Hurricane, Fly, Power Whip
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, +10 Atk, +10 SpA, +20 SpD, +19 Spe

​

Type:

Wormadam-Sandy [Optimized]
Abilities: Overcoat | [HA] Prankster
Stats: 90 / 100 / 135 / 70 / 105 / 40 | BST: 540
Added Moves: Rapid Spin, Shore Up, Spikes, Sleep Powder, Poison Powder, Stun Spore, Iron Defense, Harden
Summary of Changes: +30 HP / +21 Atk / +30 Def / +11 SpA / +20 SpD / +4 Spe

​

​

Abilities: Blaze / Iron Fist / Inner Focus
Stats: 50 / 120 / 105 / 35 / 105 / 85 Spe (BST: 500)
Stat Changes: +15 Atk, +26 Def, -5 SpD, +9 Spe
Added moves: Backdraft*, Overclock*, Overheat, Knock Off

Backdraft:

​

80 BP | 16 PP | 100% Accuracy | Physical
Deals damage. If this attack damages a target, the User's Attack rises one stage. If this attack targets a Fire-type Pokemon, the User's Attack rises by two stages.
"The user forcibly steals oxygen from the foe to replenish its fighting stamina. Fire-type enemies are especially vulnerable."

Overclock:

​

40 BP | 8 PP | 100% Accuracy | Physical | Punch | Z-Power: 160
Deals damage. This move's Base Power rises by 40 for every stage the Attack stat is boosted. User recovers 50% of damage dealt.
"The user unleashes its stored energy in a burning frenzy. This release heals it of past damage."

Abilities: Fluid* / Limber / Unburden
Stats: 50 / 140 / 63 / 35 / 112 / 100 (BST: 500)
Stat Changes: +20 Atk, +10 Def, +2 SpD, +13 Spe
Added moves: Syncrekick*, Liquidation, Trop Kick, Knock Off, Surf


Fluid: This Pokemon's Normal-type moves become Water-type. Water-type moves cannot miss and ignore all protection.

Syncrekick:

70 BP | 8 PP | 100% Accuracy | Physical | Contact | Z-Power: 160
Deals damage. This move's Base Power rises by 30 for every kick move executed by this Pokemon since switching in.
"The user exploits its knowledge of the opponent's weak points to unleash a targeted barrage of kicks."

Dragalge [Optimized]
Abilities: Poison Point | Corrosion | [HA] Adaptability
Stats: 100 HP / 65 Atk / 100 Def / 110 SpA / 125 SpD / 70 Spe | BST: 570
Added Moves: Recover, Poison Melt*
Summary of Changes: +35 HP, -10 Atk, +10 Def, +13 SpA, +2 SpD, +26 Spe

Poison Melt:

90 BP | 16 PP | 100% Accuracy |

| Z-Power: 175 BP
This attack hits Steel-types super effectively and has a 30% chance to decrease the target’s SpD by 1 stage.
"The user spits a poison strong enough to dissolve metal."

Clawitzer

Abilitiy: Mega Launcher
Stats: 72 HP | 60 Atk | 96 Def | 120 SpA | 96 SpD | 96 Spe (540 BST)
Added Moves: Origin Pulse, Draco Meteor
Summary of Changes: +1 HP, -13 Atk, +8 Def, +7 SpD, +37 Spe (+40 BST)

Ambipom [Optimized]
Abilities: Scrappy, Technician, Skill Link
Stats: 75/125/76/60/76/115 [BST: 527]
Added Moves: Storm Throw, Close Combat, Flame Wheel, Bulldoze
Summary of Changes: +25 Atk, +10 Def, +10 SpD

Cinccino [Optimized]
Abilities: Skill Link / Technician / Serene Grace
Stats: 85/115/100/65/70/135 (570)
Added Moves: Rapid Spin, Tremors*
Summary of Changes:


*Tremors: Physical Ground move. 25 BP. Hits 2-5 times. 10 PP (max 16)

Here are some common questions which will be asked:

• What are the set limitations / common sense rules?

Although input from the community is obviously the goal, I'd like to reserve the right to have the ultimate decision fall upon me (and a council, if it garners support). Since we don't want anything asinine or something that's just not completely filled with idea behind it, then just having me or a council do it makes most sense to me. I feel like since optimization is tweaking of already existing, addition shouldn't be too much. I feel like it's more of a logical standpoint. Typing, too, but only in specific rare cases. Here's an example. Giving Dunsparce 105 Speed since it's based slightly off a bumble bee, so Ribombee has high speed, so Dunsparce should as well. That is not an optimization, it's a reach and a half. However, making Dunsparce Normal / Poison is logical, as it's based off of a serpent, and does optimize it in that it neutralizes its Fighting-type weakness and gives it a new set of resistances to work with. Obviously more would be added, but the first example is overzealous and not logical to me.

• What actually determines if a Pokemon is to be optimized?

Here's how I see it. Mega Evolutions give Pokemon the ability to be optimized. For example, Charizard wasn't a good Pokemon in OU compared to before it became able to Mega. Becoming OU viable is the goal, or even just make it a tier higher. For example, making Kangaskhan a lot more viable in RU than it might be already. The gap between NU and OU is very rarely going to be fixed. That isn't the point. The goal in my eyes is to make a Pokemon the best version of themselves. A 2.0 if you will. My example, Primarina, is now viable in OU, logical and would be able to hold its own. The way I see it, it's like giving a Pokemon an ability to get the spotlight that Mega Pokemon receive, without making them Mega Evolutions or giving the "vibe" of a Mega. The purpose of this is to optimize a Pokemon so that they've essentially become a 2.0 of themselves, without breaking the Pokemon's identity. Making Primarina very fast and strong while lowering defenses to make up for it erases Primarina's base. I want to see Tyranitar to Tyranitar-Mega: similar concepts, but with one having a unique twist (higher bulk and Speed). I do not want to see a Diancie to Diancie-Mega: exchange defenses with attacking stats to create a whole new concept. The concept should be intertwined with the base Pokemon. This makes it not arbitrary or opinionated as if we went with how Diancie's Mega Evolution did, people could easily argue it wasn't optimized because it lost the base form in itself and became an entirely new object. I want it to be seen as an upgrade, not an evolution.

Have fun!

 

[skies]

For our first slate, to kick us off, let's optimize the rest of the Alola starters!

Slate #1: Decidueye and Incineroar

This slate will last for four days, meaning that we will vote on July 17th. Voting will last for two days. Giving us a six day rotation between different Pokemon. Let's see what you guys can come up with!

 

[skies]

Decidueye [Optimized]
Abilities: Overgrow | [HA] Long Reach
Stats: 78 HP / 117 Atk / 95 Def / 110 SpA / 110 SpD / 85 Spe
Added Moves: Giga Drain, Oblivion Wing
Summary of Changes: +10 Atk, +20 Def, +10 SpA, +10 SpD, +15 Spe

Decidueye has a few flaws that prevent it from being exceptionally good. Firstly, neither its Attack or Special Attack allow it to be very strong. Its main niche is trapping, which it can't do well thanks to its low bulk and low Speed. So, to make up for this, I've added more Attack and bulk, while adding a very small change to Speed. Decidueye, optimized, has better bulk all around, and better attacking stats. This still holds true to what the main point of Decidueye is: being a bit slow, trapping, and being a strong attacker. Now with Giga Drain and Oblivion Wing, Decidueye can run Nasty Plot or Swords Dance sets! What sets this Decidueye apart from its base form is honestly its overall better stats, which enable Decidueye to have a niche in OU, though it still falls short due to its low Speed stat and poor typing. Regardless, Decidueye has been optimized!

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze | [HA] Intimidate
Stats: 95 HP / 115 Atk / 100 Def / 80 SpA / 100 SpD / 85 Spe
Added Moves: Drain Punch, Knock Off, Sucker Punch
Summary of Changes: +20 Def, +20 SpD, +25 Spe

Incineroar's biggest issue is that it doesn't have a good enough Speed stat to make use of its entire moveset, while not being bulky enough to handle the Pokemon it's supposed to be able to check. However, this optimized version of Incineroar fixes all of that! 85 Speed is enough to make good use of a Choice Scarf, while still not slacking without one! I decided not to raise its Attack at all, or else it could be a little too strong. Regardless, I've also added more bulk to let Incineroar become a better pivot. Assault Vest with Intimidate? Sounds slick. Now with access to Knock Off as well, Incineroar can become a real nuisance to face. Incineroar still stays true to its base form in that it's not the fastest, not the bulkiest, and not the strongest, but a jack of all trades instead. I've given it access to Sucker Punch as well to make up for its lacking Speed, another optimization. Overall, Incineroar still suffers from its somewhat poor defensive typing, lack of Speed, and overall "meh" factor, but this version is much more optimized!
​

Here are two examples of optimizations that could be made! Obviously everything is open for interpretation, and I'm excited to see what others come up with for these two!

 

[Ludicrousity]

A few questions:

• What are the limits this slate?
• So, are we allowed to change abilities/add new ones?
• Signature moves are also allowed i presume?
• Can you unban event only moves / Abilities?
• Are you allowed to change types, but only to optimise.
• If there is a trend (say, the starters always having 525-535 bst), do we have to keep it?

Other than these, happy to see this is finally up. :)

Edit: oh, you should probably add the winning Pokemon somewhere too. Not just the name. I can set up a sheet for you I feel you want, although it will have to wait 'til I'm back from Greece

 

[skies]

Ludicrousity – I'm glad you asked!

• What are the limits of this slates?

So, we're going to see what happens without a limit. As long as the Pokemon is optimized, and as long as the Pokemon is not overpowered or broken, then there are no limits! I don't see any blatantly obvious ways to make either of these Pokemon insanely good / broken, so I'm not worried about a limit. However, this is not to say that down the road new limits will be put in place. For better Pokemon which appreciate optimizing, there will be limits. Not yet though!

• Are we allowed to change abilities / add new ones?

Yeah of course! I'd prefer not to change abilities, but make a brand new one. Since it could affect more than one Pokemon, I don't want to change regular abilities. For example, making Intimidate drop Attack by two stages versus one would be great for Incineroar! However, it would also make Landorus-T incredibly hard to face as it's already so excellent. Therefore, a different ability would make the most sense to me so as to not make other Pokemon too powerful. Perhaps if we get a lot of new abilities, I could implement the "coding clause" of Megas For All, but I don't see it as necessary for now.

• Are signature moves allowed?

Yes, as long as they optimize a Pokemon and make sense. Maybe a special version of Spirit Shackle to make Nasty Plot Decidueye? Up to you! You don't have to do that obviously, just a thought I had. But the move has to be logical and actually optimize a Pokemon, while not making absurdly strong for no reason.

• Can you allow moves / abilities?

Yes, I've allowed all the Hidden Abilities to be released for this slate as it optimizes them by having the ability! Therefore, having event-only moves and event-only Abilities would be optimizing. So for all future slates, these will always be allowed since they always could optimize a Pokemon even if they aren't the best, they still aren't making things broken / dumb.

• Can types be changed?

Mhm. But make sure it makes sense! Refer to the end of the title post for my ideas on that. Dunsparce could logically be Normal / Poison as it is a serpent, but Dunsparce couldn't be much else than that without being random, not good, or not optimized. But of course you could change these Pokemon to be whatever type you feel makes sense and makes them more optimized!

 

[Ludicrousity]

Ludicrousity – I'm glad you asked!

• Are we allowed to change abilities / add new ones?

Yeah of course! I'd prefer not to change abilities, but make a brand new one. Since it could affect more than one Pokemon, I don't want to change regular abilities. For example, making Intimidate drop Attack by two stages versus one would be great for Incineroar! However, it would also make Landorus-T incredibly hard to face as it's already so excellent. Therefore, a different ability would make the most sense to me so as to not make other Pokemon too powerful. Perhaps if we get a lot of new abilities, I could implement the "coding clause" of Megas For All, but I don't see it as necessary for now.

I actually meant something like giving Magnezone Levitate, but thanks for such a long and detail answer. And thanks for clearing few things up :)

 

[Squawkerz]

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze/Intimidate
Stats: 95/115/95/80/95/90 [BST: 570]
Added Moves: Wild Charge, Blaze Kick, Knock Off
Summary of Changes: +5 Def, +5 SpD, +30 Spe

One thing that I feel that should never happen in Pokemon is a downgrade in stats upon evolution. Unfortunately, Incineroar is a culprit of this. The evolution of Torracat to Incineroar made it's speed drop by 30 points, making it have speed similar to a Farfetch'd. Optimized Incineroar fixes this, keeping the 90 Base Speed of it's predecessor. If you think this isn't flavorful because of Incineroar's burly body, Primal Groudon, one of the largest and heaviest Pokemon, is as fast as Incineroar. Other than that, it's defensive stats were increased to 95/95/95, and along with Intimidate, Assault Vest, Knock Off, and U-Turn, Incineroar can make a nice pivot. On it's bulkier Assault Vest sets, you wouldn't want to run Flare Blitz without any Leftovers Recovery, so Blaze Kick is a nice Fire STAB to use when Flare Blitz isn't optimal. While these buffs are nice, it does still have some downsides. It has weaknesses to four common offensive types (Ground, Rock, Water, Fighting), and it's speed stat is still not the best when used without a choice scarf. It is still much better than before.

 

[canno]

Decidueye [Optimized]
Abilities: Overgrow | [HA] Long Reach
Stats: 88 HP / 112 Atk / 75 Def / 100 SpA / 125 SpD / 80 Spe [BST 580]
Added Moves: Will-o-Wisp, Taunt, Focus Blast, Leaf Storm, Shadow Sneak
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, +5 Atk, +25 SpD, +10 Spe

I wanted to focus on the versatility "jack of all trades" aspect Decidueye currently has, which is why it has such a wide stat change line-up. With a base HP of 88 and a good 125 SpDef, it can tank hits on the special side and apply pressure back with its ok attacking stats. While its low Defense is an issue, it can mitigate this due to its new access to Will-o-Wisp. Its utility isn't the only thing that got better, however - both of its set-up sets (Nasty Plot and Swords Dance) are also enhanced with either more powerful attacks and coverage, or a flat out power boost respectively.

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze | [HA] Intmidate
Stats: 110 HP / 130 Atk / 95 Def / 80 SpA / 95 SpD / 70 Spe [BST 580]
Added Moves: Sucker Punch, Knock Off, Close Combat, Drain Punch
Summary of Changes: +15 HP, +15 Atk, +5 Def, +5 SpD, +10 Spe

Incineroar has always been seen as a bulky bruiser, although it ultimately fell flat due to not hitting hard enough and not being bulky enough. Its low speed also kept it in check hard. Now in its optimized form, Incineroar has a massive 110 HP which serves 2 purposes; increasing its overall bulk by a decent margin, especially after an intimidate, and buffering Flare Blitz recoil damage. The main thing to note, however, is its massive 130 Attack stat, letting it smash through a fair number of things. It now also has Sucker Punch to make up for its relatively low speed, allowing it to threaten both offensive and defensive teams alike. These changes make Incineroar a huge threat.​

 

[Samtendo09]

( wishes ) This Pet Mod had picked my attention, but before I participate (which I obviously will), in term of Base Stat Total (BST), would it be preferable to not make it too high (something like 680 is obviously too much)? What is the limit you would recommend?

 

[skies]

( wishes ) This Pet Mod had picked my attention, but before I participate (which I obviously will), in term of Base Stat Total (BST), would it be preferable to not make it too high (something like 680 is obviously too much)? What is the limit you would recommend?

I'd not go over +100 total BST, and I think if you go too close to 100, at 100, or over, then your submission may be a little overpowered anyways! So, take that as you will and go ahead and submit! :)

 

[Samtendo09]

I'd not go over +100 total BST, and I think if you go too close to 100, at 100, or over, then your submission may be a little overpowered anyways! So, take that as you will and go ahead and submit! :)

To quote Heavy Weapons Guy, "Very well!"

Decidueye [Optimized]
Abilities: Overgrow / Long Reach (HA)
Stats: 80 / 115 / 80 / 115 / 100 / 90 [BST: 580]
Added Moves: Leaf Storm, Horn Leech, Shadow Sneak, Focus Blast, Leech Seed, Will-o-Wisp
Summary of Changes: +8 Atk, +5 Def, +15 Sp.A, +20 Spe

Competitive Intention: This one will be a jack-of-all-trade, with only the Defense being considered as the lowest non-HP stat. It can go either with Attack or Special Attack sweeping and is able to set-up in both cases. While its Attack and Special Attack are not spectacular considering the current power creep, Decidueye also has recovery for both cases, such as Horn Leech for physical variants and Giga Drain for special variants. What prevent it from getting overpowered is that it still lack support moves other than Leech Seed and Will-o-Wisp, and tend to suffer four-move syndrome to prevent it from pulling full potential.

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze / Taunting Heel (HA)
(Taunting Heel: Lower the opponents' highest non-HP stat by one stage.)
Stats: 95 / 125 / 90 / 80 / 90 / 100 [BST: 580]
Added Moves: Knock Off, Sucker Punch, Hone Claws, Fire Punch, Thunder Punch, Mach Punch, Stone Edge, Rock Slide, Iron Tail, Iron Head, Power-Up Punch, Glare, Bounce, Foul Play, Play Rough
Summary of Changes: +10 Atk, +40 Spe

Competitive Intention: A Fire/Dark fast Physical Sweeper with an interesting Ability to potentially weaken Physical or Special Sweeper, as well as Physical Wall. With Hone Claws, you can set-up and allow moves with lower Accuracy such as Stone Edge, Play Rough, and Bounce, and it can spread paralysis with Glare. Plentiful of coverage which most are seemingly not clean (I mean Play Rough? Foul Play? None of those is proper playing), with Bounce representing the typical body slam attack. It still lacks recovery moves (aside of Leech Life, which is redundant considering the type effectiveness of both Fire and Dark) and while 95 / 90 / 90 is a bit bulky, it could not survive a powerful Super Effective attack.​

 

[Pika Xreme]

Decidueye [Optimized]

Abilities: Overgrow / Analytic (HA)
Stats: 115/110/95/100/100/60 (580)
Added Moves:
Summary of Changes: +37 HP, +3 Attack, +20 Def, -10 Spe

Make no mistake, that speed reduction is not a nerf.
Decidueye here is an excellent tank that can take quite a bit of punishment, and with Analytic, dish out quite a bit of punishment itself.
Lowered speed allows it to use its new Ability against more targets.
Unlike some fully-evolved Alolan starters, Decidueye was never fast at any stage.​

 

[Ludicrousity]

I feel like optimised starters should stay with 2 abilities. Not saying this because of Pikas submission, it just popped into my head when I saw it.

Edit: only just saw this too:
When i said signature moves, I meant using Sacred Fire, Dragon Ascent, Precipice Blades etc, considering they are signature.

 

[skies]

I feel like optimised starters should stay with 2 abilities. Not saying this because of Pikas submission, it just popped into my head when I saw it.

Edit: only just saw this too:
When i said signature moves, I meant using Sacred Fire, Dragon Ascent, Precipice Blades etc, considering they are signature.

I agree. Pika Xreme, could you please either keep it with Analytic as the HA, or keep just Long Reach? Not both please. Thanks!

Yes you can use them, Ludicrousity, but I don't see a Pokemon immediately that would be better by Precipice Blades, as it makes more sense to just give Earthquake to those that need that coverage to me, though I am not opposed. Dragon Ascent may just have to be Brave Bird unless on things like Salamence or Dragonite and such.

 

[lydian]

Decidueye (optimized)

Abilities: Overgrow | Long Reach
Stats: 77 HP | 137 Atk | 75 Def | 87 SpA | 107 SpD | 117 Spe (600 BST)
Added Moves: Taunt, Shadow Sneak
Summary of Changes: -1 HP, +30 Atk, -13 SpA, +7 SpD, +47 Spe (+70 BST)

I might have taken the drastic route, but I still think this is what Decidueye needs to be a great Pokémon in an OU environment. The Attack and Speed buffs reflects the more powerful and speedier Decidueye everyone was expecting when it got revealed. Long Reach gives it a niche of avoiding residual damage from Rocky Helmet, Iron Barbs and Rough Skin, meaning thanks to its above average bulk of 77/75/107 it is quite tough to revenge kill if not being hit Super Effectively. Taunt and Shadow Sneak gives it more options as well; the latter allowing it to make use of its ability and shut down passive Pokémon in conjunction with Spirit Shackle; while the former gives it a method of patching up its base 117 Speed, which is by no means bad, but its not outstanding either.

Sample Sets

Stallbreaker (Decidueye) @ Decidium Z / Leftovers
Ability: Long Reach
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Spirit Shackle
- Taunt
- Swords Dance / U-turn / Shadow Sneak

Bulky Pivot (Decidueye) @ Leftovers / Assault Vest
Ability: Long Reach
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Roost
- Defog / U-turn
- Spirit Shackle
- Taunt / Leaf Blade

Choice Scarf (Decidueye) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Long Reach
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Spirit Shackle
- U-turn
- Brave Bird

All-out Attacker (Decidueye) @ Life Orb / Choice Band
Ability: Long Reach
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Spirit Shackle
- U-turn
- Shadow Sneak

Incineroar (optimized)

Abilities: Blaze | Wrestler (Fighting-type Steelworker clone)
Stats: 95 HP | 130 Atk | 95 Def | 88 SpA | 88 SpD | 104 Spe (600 BST)
Added Moves: Blaze Kick, Knock Off, Close Combat, Wild Charge
Summary of Changes: +15 Atk, +5 Def, + 8 SpA, -2 SpD, +44 Spe (+70 BST)

I don't why Incineroar wasn't given more Speed to begin with, its understandable in certain evolution lines, such as Crabominable's or Golisopod's, but Incineroar doesn't look slow at all. Base 104 Spa allows it to acts as powerful Choice Scarf revenge killer, mainly, just like Garchomp, Keldeo and Terrakion. While 104 is not much, giving it more would make it way too good, at least in my opinion. Wrestler replaces Intimidate, while the former is a very interesting ability, I feel like Wrestler gives it such a cool niche as a fast(ish) Pokémon with Fighting + Dark STAB, which hits lot of Pokémon when coupled with its Fire-type Moves. Additionally, Wild Charge allows it to hit Water-types.

Sample Sets

Choice Scarf (Incineroar) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Long Reach
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- U-turn / Wild Charge

All-Out Attacker (Incineroar) @ Choice Band / Life Orb
Ability: Long Reach
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz / Blaze Kick
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- U-turn / Taunt

 

[Ludicrousity]

Decidueye (optimized)

Abilities: Overgrow | Long Reach
Stats: 77 HP | 137 Atk | 75 Def | 87 SpA | 107 SpD | 117 Spe (600 BST)
Added Moves: Taunt, Shadow Sneak
Summary of Changes: -1 HP, +30 Atk, -13 SpA, +7 SpD, +47 Spe (+70 BST)

I might have taken the drastic route, but I still think this is what Decidueye needs to be a great Pokémon in an OU environment. The Attack and Speed buffs reflects the more powerful and speedier Decidueye everyone was expecting when it got revealed. Long Reach gives it a niche of avoiding recoil...

WIP...​

Long reach doesn't prevent recoil??

 

[Pika Xreme]

I agree. Pika Xreme, could you please either keep it with Analytic as the HA, or keep just Long Reach? Not both please. Thanks!

Yes you can use them, Ludicrousity, but I don't see a Pokemon immediately that would be better by Precipice Blades, as it makes more sense to just give Earthquake to those that need that coverage to me, though I am not opposed. Dragon Ascent may just have to be Brave Bird unless on things like Salamence or Dragonite and such.

Removed Long Reach.

 

[Samtendo09]

Long reach doesn't prevent recoil??

It doesn't do that, but it does avoid contact despite using contact moves themselves, which means free from harm of Rocky Helmet, Iron Barb and Rough Skin for example.

 

[lydian]

Long reach doesn't prevent recoil??

I was gonna reword it but I had to leave it like that, so I posted it anyway as WIP, and I'll finish it now... My bad LOL :)

 

[Speny]

Decidueye [Optimized]

Abilities: Overgrow, Triage | [HA] Long Reach
Stats: 78 HP / 127 Atk / 75 Def / 90 SpA / 110 SpD / 115 Spe
Added Moves: Giga Drain, Oblivion Wing, Shadow Sneak, Spikes, Leech Seed, Parting Shot
Summary of Changes: +20 Atk, -10Spa +10 SpD, +45 Spe

Decidueye is optimized to better fit a supporting role. Decidueye can switch in to set up hazards and gain momentum for the team as well as taking advantage of Triage.


Incineroar [Optimized]

Abilities: Blaze, Unaware | [HA] Intimidate
Stats: 95 HP / 130 Atk / 90 Def / 80 SpA / 100 SpD / 80 Spe
Added Moves: Close Combat, Knock Off, Punishment, Topsy-Turvy, Circle Throw
Summary of Changes: +15Atk +10 Def, +20 SpD, +20 Spe

Incineroar has been optimized to be the ultimate punisher to set up sweepers.

 

[Ludicrousity]

In response to speny, I also think it's kinda weird not having Blaze, Overgrow or Torrent on starters, although it might've just be me.

 

[Pika Xreme]

Edited the type into Decidueye in case it wasn't clear enough.

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze / Intimidate (HA)
Stats: 105/135/100/80/100/60 (580)
Added Moves: Slack Off
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, Def and SpD, +20 Atk
A much better tank, thanks to better bulk, offense, and being able to recover.
​

also, as far as future slates go, can we suggest stuff?

 

[Speny]

In response to speny, I also think it's kinda weird not having Blaze, Overgrow or Torrent on starters, although it might've just be me.

Yeah I just did that cause all starters have only had 2 abilities so far but I don't mind if people want to change that.

 

[Ludicrousity]

Edited the type into Decidueye in case it wasn't clear enough.

Incineroar [Optimized]
Abilities: Blaze / Intimidate (HA)
Stats: 105/135/100/80/100/60 (580)
Added Moves: Slack Off
Summary of Changes: +10 HP, Def and SpD, +20 Atk
A much better tank, thanks to better bulk, offense, and being able to recover.
​

also, as far as future slates go, can we suggest stuff?

Let me guess. Raichu and Wigglytuff will be in your suggestion?

 

[Pika Xreme]

Let me guess. Raichu and Wigglytuff will be in your suggestion?

how do you know me so well

also stunfisk because stunfisk