dude, that's nothing, I've gone 6 hours without a match (studying for exams, yay!). When I'm back in the states, I'll be active again, so I'll battle you then.
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OU Theorymon
- Thread starter alexwolf
- Start date
- Status
Parting Shot Scrafty was only for the month March, as it was a theorymon from February. Right now, the ladder has the theorymons of March and April.
Will update the OP soon.
Jacks0n
formerly grassycow
so the current one is fairy type cress?
No, the current one is
March
+ Flash Fire (Magma)
+ Regenerator (U-Ralph)
+ Poison Heal (Isa Simple)
+ Tough Claws (alexwolf)
+ Fairy typing (Sevifar)
April
+ Poison typing (Pipotchi)
+ Dry Skin (Chou Toshio)
+ Dark typing (escarlata)
+ Gale Wings (Chou Toshio)
+ Snow Warning (Chesnaught)
+ Thick Fat (Magma)
The clearly labelled OU Theorymon Project in the OU forum.
On a separate note, could you consider making a different ladder, with all theorymons implemented? So there'd be the one with the current theorymons, and one with them as permanent changes.
Jacks0n
formerly grassycow
i second that, having all the theorymons on one ladder would be awesome
So I have been playing some games with Triple Bird to test Salamence's effectiveness with the other dominant Flying-type attackers.
My conclusion so far is: Gale Wings Salamence is very effective.
Its support and offensive presence is impressive, and can easily lead to a talonflame or pinsir sweep. Gale Wings mence is almost tailored to work well with them, and break their counters up.
My set:
Salamence
Gale Wings
@ Life Orb
Naughty 252 ATK / 4 DEF / 252 SPE
-Outrage
-Aerial Ace
-Defog
-Fire Blast
This set has been very effective for me, and was built to maximize Salamence's synergy with Pinsir and Talonflame. First, Defog is of course an incredible asset, and priority Defog is very difficult to stop (and even harder to keep rocks up when I got Excadrill too). I went with Outrage instead of Draco Meteor so I could max out the power of both my Dragon STAB and Aerial Ace. Outrage smashes Rotom-W and Zapdos, and leaves huge dents in Lando-T, Gliscor, and specially defensive Hippo. It also severely weakens tyranitar, and can actually let mence WIN against Heatran that lack a super effective attack (no physically defensive heatran!).
Aerial Ace is what NEVER to be estimated-- it's still a Flying-type priority attack that rivals Dragonite's CB Extremespeed in power (and far outclasses Pinsir's Quick Attack). What's different about Salamence (compared to Pinsir/Talonflame) is its bulk and resistances. Salamence has lots of opportunities to switch in and pick off weakened opponents. Weather its a Gyarados Waterfall or a Charizard Flare Blitz, Mence can switch in and pick it off after the damage its taken while setting up (LO Aerial Ace does about 40-60% damage to most set up sweepers). Its type's synergy with the Steel types well suited for Bird teams makes it a real asset. And threats that try to wall Aerial Ace will just be grinded down to be blasted to bits by the following birds.
Finally, Fire Blast lets Mence take apart Skarmory and Ferrothorn, rounding out my bird offense's wall breaking ability.
I find that in actual practice, I only ever get revenge kills with mence, and often mence will be taken out without killing anything. But, this set is just so damn effective at breaking Talonflame/Pinsir counters and keeping SR off the field, by the time mence goes down, I almost always have a perfect chance to sweep with my other birds.
I'd be interested in trying DD and full support sets for other teams, but I think I nailed the formula for bird-support mence the first time.
My conclusion so far is: Gale Wings Salamence is very effective.
Its support and offensive presence is impressive, and can easily lead to a talonflame or pinsir sweep. Gale Wings mence is almost tailored to work well with them, and break their counters up.
My set:
Salamence
Gale Wings
@ Life Orb
Naughty 252 ATK / 4 DEF / 252 SPE
-Outrage
-Aerial Ace
-Defog
-Fire Blast
This set has been very effective for me, and was built to maximize Salamence's synergy with Pinsir and Talonflame. First, Defog is of course an incredible asset, and priority Defog is very difficult to stop (and even harder to keep rocks up when I got Excadrill too). I went with Outrage instead of Draco Meteor so I could max out the power of both my Dragon STAB and Aerial Ace. Outrage smashes Rotom-W and Zapdos, and leaves huge dents in Lando-T, Gliscor, and specially defensive Hippo. It also severely weakens tyranitar, and can actually let mence WIN against Heatran that lack a super effective attack (no physically defensive heatran!).
Aerial Ace is what NEVER to be estimated-- it's still a Flying-type priority attack that rivals Dragonite's CB Extremespeed in power (and far outclasses Pinsir's Quick Attack). What's different about Salamence (compared to Pinsir/Talonflame) is its bulk and resistances. Salamence has lots of opportunities to switch in and pick off weakened opponents. Weather its a Gyarados Waterfall or a Charizard Flare Blitz, Mence can switch in and pick it off after the damage its taken while setting up (LO Aerial Ace does about 40-60% damage to most set up sweepers). Its type's synergy with the Steel types well suited for Bird teams makes it a real asset. And threats that try to wall Aerial Ace will just be grinded down to be blasted to bits by the following birds.
Finally, Fire Blast lets Mence take apart Skarmory and Ferrothorn, rounding out my bird offense's wall breaking ability.
I find that in actual practice, I only ever get revenge kills with mence, and often mence will be taken out without killing anything. But, this set is just so damn effective at breaking Talonflame/Pinsir counters and keeping SR off the field, by the time mence goes down, I almost always have a perfect chance to sweep with my other birds.
I'd be interested in trying DD and full support sets for other teams, but I think I nailed the formula for bird-support mence the first time.
Ok, I've been playing around with Snorlax too-- and it is a freakin' MONSTER.
Replays (none very good, but at least I GOT battles):
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-123533917
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-123537416
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-123531500
As you can see, I wasn't thinking and even used Return instead of Facade in these replays, and Snorlax STILL monsters his way through everything.
Helps that I'm Adamant max attack-- I mean, why not? They won't break me anywayz lol.
@ Toxic Orb
Poison Heal
Adamant 56 HP / 252 ATK / 200 DEF
-Facade
-Crunch
-Earthquake
-Protect
Crunch's coverage is so good this gen, I wouldn't go for Fire Punch (Fire Punch is always kind of an un-optimal attack Normal types use when they don't have the move slots and need to combine Dark + Ground/Fighting coverage into one compromising move slot). Since Snorlax HAS great power (doesn't need Curse or Whirlwind) with just Adamant MAX + Facade, and HAS great survivability (doesn't need Rest/Sleep Talk or Curse), Protect is fine all on its own and Snorlax can deal out the pain with just its 3 best coverage moves unboosted.
Snorlax doesn't die, it puts on the hurt, it fears no status (making bulky water types that rely on Scald lunch), and it can even fish for Crunch hax against really bulky opponents like Mega Venusaur or Suicune-- it's really hard for stall to come out on top of this thing. Offensive teams with lots of priority (like my 3 bird team) capitalize on it really well, since it's not really afraid of the very rare sweeper than might be able to set up lax (notably on predicted protects). Inversely, you could say that a team with good offensive pressure can be more reckless in using Snorlax and Protect less frequently (since you're less worried about losing Snorlax and more able to capitalize on holes he punches in the enemy team).
However, Snorlax is such an effing beast that he can work on a Stall team well too. Unless you NEED support of some type (status/wish/SR/aroma) I'd say Snorlax is a better special wall than Chansey; definitely on a bulky offensive team that'd be the case. A stall team might want to go with more investment in bulk, and use Facade / Fire Punch / Whirlwind / Protect
Replays (none very good, but at least I GOT battles):
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-123533917
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-123537416
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-123531500
As you can see, I wasn't thinking and even used Return instead of Facade in these replays, and Snorlax STILL monsters his way through everything.
Helps that I'm Adamant max attack-- I mean, why not? They won't break me anywayz lol.
@ Toxic Orb
Poison Heal
Adamant 56 HP / 252 ATK / 200 DEF
-Facade
-Crunch
-Earthquake
-Protect
Crunch's coverage is so good this gen, I wouldn't go for Fire Punch (Fire Punch is always kind of an un-optimal attack Normal types use when they don't have the move slots and need to combine Dark + Ground/Fighting coverage into one compromising move slot). Since Snorlax HAS great power (doesn't need Curse or Whirlwind) with just Adamant MAX + Facade, and HAS great survivability (doesn't need Rest/Sleep Talk or Curse), Protect is fine all on its own and Snorlax can deal out the pain with just its 3 best coverage moves unboosted.
Snorlax doesn't die, it puts on the hurt, it fears no status (making bulky water types that rely on Scald lunch), and it can even fish for Crunch hax against really bulky opponents like Mega Venusaur or Suicune-- it's really hard for stall to come out on top of this thing. Offensive teams with lots of priority (like my 3 bird team) capitalize on it really well, since it's not really afraid of the very rare sweeper than might be able to set up lax (notably on predicted protects). Inversely, you could say that a team with good offensive pressure can be more reckless in using Snorlax and Protect less frequently (since you're less worried about losing Snorlax and more able to capitalize on holes he punches in the enemy team).
However, Snorlax is such an effing beast that he can work on a Stall team well too. Unless you NEED support of some type (status/wish/SR/aroma) I'd say Snorlax is a better special wall than Chansey; definitely on a bulky offensive team that'd be the case. A stall team might want to go with more investment in bulk, and use Facade / Fire Punch / Whirlwind / Protect
My showdown is working properly so I haven't actually played on the ladder yet, but have managed to spectate a couple of games and my God. CurseLax is a freaking beast! There have been a couple scenarios where Snorlax has taken out entire teams after grabbing just 1 or 2 curse boosts.
The most common variations I've seen are Facade / Crunch / Curse / Protect and Facade / Earthquake / Fire Punch / Curse.
I think if I could get mine to work I would run:
Snorlax
@ Toxic Orb
Poison Heal
Adamant 56 HP / 200 Atk / 252 Def
-Facade
-Crunch
-Curse
-Protect
Just about nothing can OHKO this thing at +1 Def, and the only thing that can wall it and actually do something in back to Snorlax is Skarmory with Whirlwind. Most other things that wall it are in danger of Crunch defense drops which will eventually screw them over as they can't wear down Snorlax with Poison Heal. Because this is the case I'm thinking that Snorlax would be epic with Magnezone support. With Magnezone to effectively take out Skarmory there is very little that can stop CurseLax from setting up and destroying everything you have ever loved.
The most common variations I've seen are Facade / Crunch / Curse / Protect and Facade / Earthquake / Fire Punch / Curse.
I think if I could get mine to work I would run:
Snorlax
@ Toxic Orb
Poison Heal
Adamant 56 HP / 200 Atk / 252 Def
-Facade
-Crunch
-Curse
-Protect
Just about nothing can OHKO this thing at +1 Def, and the only thing that can wall it and actually do something in back to Snorlax is Skarmory with Whirlwind. Most other things that wall it are in danger of Crunch defense drops which will eventually screw them over as they can't wear down Snorlax with Poison Heal. Because this is the case I'm thinking that Snorlax would be epic with Magnezone support. With Magnezone to effectively take out Skarmory there is very little that can stop CurseLax from setting up and destroying everything you have ever loved.
(Made this while waiting for a match)
I told you all this would happen but nobody listened to me... I have taken to using a coffin just to combat Snorlax I knew this day would come!
Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
Ability: Mummy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Def
Bold Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Pain Split
- Skill Swap / Haze
Its pretty useless except for burn and death fodder other than snorlax but it does that job well so if you need a Snorlax solution here you go.
So, my brother (swagtrollolol) and I have been on testing stuff, and. . .Snorlax. Anything weak to one of it's moves and unable to 2HKO it isn't worth using (still using drapion though, probably out of spite). My go to method for dealing with it is always having a fighting type, kinda like always having a steel type for Mismagius last "month". Right now I'm using air balloon lucario, which proves how centralizing Snorlax is right now.
Salamence is working out good too. I'm not sure if I like it better than other birds, but it certainly has viability with defog and a bit more flexibility with moves than Talonflame or Pinsir. Plus, as usual with Salamence, it's mixed potential really sets it apart.
Togekiss is another one I thought was fun. It's fun to use on stall, and it's nasty plot set is working wonders for me if I don't have to deal with Snorlax.
I was either unimpressed by, or haven't gotten to the others yet, but I'll be back
Salamence is working out good too. I'm not sure if I like it better than other birds, but it certainly has viability with defog and a bit more flexibility with moves than Talonflame or Pinsir. Plus, as usual with Salamence, it's mixed potential really sets it apart.
Togekiss is another one I thought was fun. It's fun to use on stall, and it's nasty plot set is working wonders for me if I don't have to deal with Snorlax.
I was either unimpressed by, or haven't gotten to the others yet, but I'll be back
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/outheorymon-126922753
^Another Replay of Triple Bird + Snorlax (I actually got disconnected near the end which is why I "lost" but you can see that I basically just smashed through with Salamence + Talonflame). Pinsir + Scarf Excadrill would have sealed the deal had the battle continued.
Echoing how ridiculous Snorlax is again. I mean, I have a lot less experience against it that using it, but it's just so damn hard to take down. It's not invincible, but as an offensive pivot it's so good it really trips up enemies of all styles (with that healing, bulk, pressure of its offensive threat, and Protect, it makes predicting ridiculously easy).
^Another Replay of Triple Bird + Snorlax (I actually got disconnected near the end which is why I "lost" but you can see that I basically just smashed through with Salamence + Talonflame). Pinsir + Scarf Excadrill would have sealed the deal had the battle continued.
Echoing how ridiculous Snorlax is again. I mean, I have a lot less experience against it that using it, but it's just so damn hard to take down. It's not invincible, but as an offensive pivot it's so good it really trips up enemies of all styles (with that healing, bulk, pressure of its offensive threat, and Protect, it makes predicting ridiculously easy).
How about we give vaporeon recover? I mean it makes sense, him learning things like acid armor.
This is not the thread to discuss what the other Theorymons will be. That is located in the OU Sub-Forum, however the thread is closed at this moment because of lacking activity and not enough creative and good ideas for new slates. If you still want to help you have to wait until alexwolf (I think) open the thread again.
In other news, I updated the sim with May and June Pokemon.
on the next restart that is
on the next restart that is
What if Mega-Pinsir was rock/bug instead of flying, since in the pinsir/scyther/heracross/scizor gang there is alread a bug/flying pokemon...
Its ability could be maybe... rock head! It is not too op and maybe it could learn a good rock recoil move like head smash...
I would very much like to see that instead of the existing Mega-Pinsir...
Heracross time has been long and over and Scizor ruled for too long, it is even harder to see him dethroned after his mega evolution. What about Pinsir's era??
Waiting for your thoughts:
Its ability could be maybe... rock head! It is not too op and maybe it could learn a good rock recoil move like head smash...
I would very much like to see that instead of the existing Mega-Pinsir...
Heracross time has been long and over and Scizor ruled for too long, it is even harder to see him dethroned after his mega evolution. What about Pinsir's era??
Waiting for your thoughts:
What if a told you it's already Mega Pinsir his time as it is a really good Pokemon right now. Not sure if Mega Scizor is better but both are really good. Also if you are changing him so much you might as well make Sudowoodo Bug Rock type and have similar results.What if Mega-Pinsir was rock/bug instead of flying, since in the pinsir/scyther/heracross/scizor gang there is alread a bug/flying pokemon...
Its ability could be maybe... rock head! It is not too op and maybe it could learn a good rock recoil move like head smash...
I would very much like to see that instead of the existing Mega-Pinsir...
Heracross time has been long and over and Scizor ruled for too long, it is even harder to see him dethroned after his mega evolution. What about Pinsir's era??
Waiting for your thoughts:
But isnt Mega Pinsirs basic point killing things with aerilate boosted Feint/Quick Attack? And base 150 power with stab and no drawbacks is OPWhat if Mega-Pinsir was rock/bug instead of flying, since in the pinsir/scyther/heracross/scizor gang there is alread a bug/flying pokemon...
Its ability could be maybe... rock head! It is not too op and maybe it could learn a good rock recoil move like head smash...
I would very much like to see that instead of the existing Mega-Pinsir...
Heracross time has been long and over and Scizor ruled for too long, it is even harder to see him dethroned after his mega evolution. What about Pinsir's era??
Waiting for your thoughts:
Man, it's like déjà vu.
Kernsy.
Banned deucer.
get the freak
- Status