Terminology

Chou Toshio

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(Relatively) Recently, in another thread I had a disagreement with another member here in Policy Review that was found to be, after a bit of back-and-forth, nothing more than a misunderstanding based on words alone. Considering that the vast majority of policy is in regards to tiering, a process that in and of itself is connected to defining various elements of the game to this or that tier/treatment, I think it is important that we have very well defined word usage.

While genuinely good, I think that here and there Smogon has issues with Terminoligy, and that we sometimes (especially trickling to lower discussions) throw around words that either do not have a specifically allocated meaning, or surprisingly have different meanings for different people. We definitely have words that have different meaning depending on usage, and it can be confusing. I also think there is room for words to define concepts that we use a lot but don't have terminology for.

Examples:

"OU" of UU: Is a phrase being used to describe X-Act's inevitable usage list for the new UU tier (which will hopefully give birth to a future NU tier). The pain meaning hear is X-Act's usage tier-- I suggest we have a word for this seeing as it will soon be a concept excercised over more tiers than OU.

Example Proposal: "Standard."

This word would be defined as "Those pokemon that define their tier based on the usage list." Thus if we were to say "OU Standard," it would refer to the OU List, "UU Standard" and "NU standard having the same meaning for their respective tiers.

This would have the added benefit of making the phrase "OU" refer specifically to the metagame as a whole (which includes lower tier pokemon) rather than just those OU pokemon of the usage list. Right now "OU" has both meanings in it and it has to be taken from context what meaning is implied.

Suspect

The english word suspect refers to all parties that are under scrutiny in regards to guilt over a crime. However, in our metagame it is not just suspect pokemon, but all pokemon that are under constant monitering by the players. If someone developed a killer, game-breaking set for Salamence, it would come under scrutiny just as Garchomp did. Thus I think the phrase needs greater specificity.

example definition: "A pokemon that has come under scrutiny such that it requires its own testing in a metagame independent of other suspects. Occurs in the case of 1 of 2 cases:
1- A pokemon that is moving from a "Pseudo-Tier" to a lower "Balanced Tier." (ie. a pokemon moving from BL to UU)
2- A pokemon whose strength in the metagame has aroused attention from the players to a degree that it must be designated as a suspect. (ie. a case like Garchomp)


Ultimately, I would like to propose a thread (if not this one), containing updates to accepted terminology as needed. As discussion continues, I think it inevitable that we will come across many needed cases of ammendments to current terminology, or words to define new concepts that arise with new issues. Basically a thread where we can suggest alterations or additions to accepted smogon terminology.

"The problem is just syntax," people say-- but Syntax can really bite you in the ass.
 

Chou Toshio

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Well, just like I said-- I think it would be a good idea for us to have a place to address semantical issues. I find a lot of people having to repeat/re-specify what they mean regarding the same words over and over in discussion.

Plus, as we refine the tiering process new concepts do make it onto the stage. I pointed out "the application of x-act's usage list" over multiple tiers, or as I put it much more simply "standard list" for multple tiers, as an example of a concept that is relatively new and could use a better terminology.

I am sure there are many more examples of this, and developing better universally understood terminology would greatly aid discussion I think.

Not that we should be actively going out and making up new words, but if in the midst of discussion, if one of us finds that there is difficulty describing something, or some word use becomes confusing, one could come and report it here and we could decide how to/if to ammend terminology.
 
Interesting idea. Upon looking in http://www.smogon.com/dp/articles/ there really isn't a list for terminology, so perhaps it would be better to have a mini dictionary of terms there? After seeing "What is Suspect?" asked in the chat many times it might be time-saving to just point them in the direction of a dictionary of terms and it would allow for easier debate and discussion here too.
 

Chou Toshio

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If we were to have an official index of terminology, I think it should be extensive and include terminology that is already well established and used commonly. Here in this thread, we'd probably discuss only more current Terminology issues.
 

X-Act

np: Biffy Clyro - Shock Shock
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I'm bumping this up because I feel that this requires tackling.

I'm finding people who post an "OU team" which has Pokemon that are not in the OU tier (say Yanmega or Porygon2). While this is, of course, allowed, it usually spawns certain posts like "Yanmega/Porygon2 isn't OU". Which is why defining a clear terminology is important, so that people may then link the correct terminology to the offenders.

The unfortunate thing is that we usually refer to the tier and to the metagame by the same name. Consider the following sentence:

"Porygon2 isn't OU but is allowed in OU."

We may be able to understand this clearly, but the new player might ask: "How can Porygon2 not be in OU and be in OU at the same time?" I really wouldn't blame a rookie player for posing such questions, because this, admittedly, is confusing.

I would thus suggest the following terminology:
  • "<Pokemon> is <Uber/OU/BL/UU/NU>" - the Pokemon is in that particular tier. For example, "Porygon2 is UU", "Gastrodon isn't OU", "Mew is Uber" are all acceptable, whereas "Meganium is OU" is not.
  • "<Pokemon> is allowed in the <Uber/OU/UU/NU/Suspect> metagame" - the Pokemon is allowed in that particular metagame. For example, "Meganium is allowed in the OU metagame", "Hariyama isn't allowed in the NU metagame", "Staraptor isn't allowed in the UU metagame" are all valid, whereas "Luvdisc is not allowed in the Suspect metagame" is not.
Notice that BL is allowed to be mentioned only in the former sentence, while Suspect is allowed to be mentioned only in the latter.
 

Syberia

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I've always taken it this way:

OU is a "guideline" or list of "recommended" pokemon that are effective in the standard metagame. It's by no means inclusive, and if there's something not on the list that works in your specific team, by all means use it.

UU would follow the same logic, now that there's an NU tier below it.
 

Seven Deadly Sins

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I usually go with the basic one:

"Pokemon may be used in their own tier or any tier above it."

This means that an OU Pokemon can only be used in OU and Ubers, a BL Pokemon can be used in BL (doesn't exist), OU, and Ubers. A UU Pokemon can be used in UU, BL (if it existed), OU, and Ubers, and so on down the line.
 

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