Ultra Sun & Ultra Moon Omnibus Thread

JJayyFeather · Nov 13, 2017

WIP, just posting this so it is started.

This probably should've been made earlier, but eh, better late than never.

DISCUSSION TOPICS

1) Ultra Burst
Ultra Burst is a new mechanic sort of like Primal Reversion was in ORAS. The only real point of discussion here regarding Ultra Burst is that in-game, it prevents Ultra Necrozma from using Light That Burns The Sky (Z-Move that requires Ultranecronium Z to perform) on the action that the trainer commands Necrozma to Ultra Burst. Do we plan to just do away with that altogether here or actually implement a period of time in which this cannot be used?

OMNIBUS INFORMATION GATHERING BEGINS HERE

MECHANICS

Ultra Burst

That new mechanic that comes with Ultra Necrozma. It's kind of like Primal Reversion. It's only accessible while Necrozma is holding an Ultranecronium Z. This action has to be commanded and occurs at the beginning of the round with the same timing as a Mega Evolution. Ultra Necrozma cannot use Light That Burns The Sky the round it transforms.

DATA

Stats

Abilities

Neuroforce - Passive | Mold Breaker: No | This Pokémon is an efficient attacker, boosting the BAP of Super Effective moves this Pokémon uses by two (2).

Damp - Passive | Mold Breaker: Yes | Description: This Pokemon releases a damp mist upon entry into battle that short circuits the opponent's ability to use Self-Destruct, Explosion, or Mind Blown.
Iron Fist - Passive | Mold Breaker: No | Description: The Base Attack Power of this Pokemon's "Punch" attacks is increased by two (2). (Known attacks affected: Bullet Punch, Comet Punch, Dizzy Punch, Drain Punch, Dynamic Punch, Fire Punch, Focus Punch, Hammer Arm, Ice Hammer, Ice Punch, Mach Punch, Mega Punch, Meteor Mash, Plasma Fists, Shadow Punch, Sky Uppercut, Thunder Punch, Power-Up Punch)
Soundproof - Passive | Mold Breaker: Yes | Description: Pokemon with this ability emit their own powerful electrostatic or sound-dampening field, making them immune to sound-based moves other than an ally's or their own Heal Bell. (Known sound moves: Boomburst, Bug Buzz, Chatter, Clanging Scales, Clangorous Soulblaze, Disarming Voice, Echoed Voice, Grass Whistle, Growl, Heal Bell, Hyper Voice, Metal Sound, Perish Song, Relic Song, Roar, Round, Screech, Sing, Snarl, Snore, Sparkling Aria, Supersonic, Uproar.)

JJayyFeather · Nov 15, 2017

Moves

JJayyFeather · Nov 15, 2017

Items (New)

Dusk Mane | Item Type: Attachment | Cost: N/A | Affected Pokemon: Necrozma | Max Uses Per Match: - | Trigger: N/A | Nat. Gift Type: N/A | Nat. Gift BAP: N/A
A Necrozma attached with this item automatically transforms into Necrozma-DM. Grants Necrozma-DM access to the move Sunsteel Strike.
Dawn Wings | Item Type: Attachment | Cost: N/A | Affected Pokemon: Necrozma | Max Uses Per Match: - | Trigger: N/A | Nat. Gift Type: N/A | Nat. Gift BAP: N/A
A Necrozma attached with this item automatically transforms into Necrozma-DW. Grants Necrozma-DW access to the move Moongeist Beam.

Dragon Venom | Item Type: Signature | Cost: N/A | Affected Pokemon: Poipole, Naganadel | Max Uses Per Match: - | Trigger: N/A | Nat. Gift Type: N/A | Nat. Gift BAP: N/A
Increases the Pokemon's highest true base stat (e.g. 130 Atk) of Attack, Defense, Special Attack, and Special Defense by one (1) Rank if their Base Rank Total is 23 or less. If the highest true base stat is tied, each Rank is raised. Triggers Beast Boost once on sendout. Boosts the BAP of Dragon Pulse by three (3).
Twilight Ray | Item Type: Signature | Cost: N/A | Affected Pokemon: Rockruff-Du, Lycanroc-Du | Max Uses Per Match: - | Trigger: N/A | Nat. Gift Type: N/A | Nat. Gift BAP: N/A
Increases the Pokemon's highest true base stat (e.g. 130 Atk) of Attack, Defense, Special Attack, and Special Defense by one (1) Rank if their Base Rank Total is 23 or less. If the highest true base stat is tied, each Rank is raised. Tough Claws now applies to Rock-typed moves that do not make contact. Increase the BAP of contact moves used by this Pokemon by 2 BAP.

Items (Updated)

Electirizer | Item Type: Signature | Cost: 8 CC | Affected Pokemon: Electabuzz, Electivire | Max Uses Per Match: - | Trigger: N/A | Nat. Gift Type: N/A | Nat. Gift BAP: N/A
Increases the Pokemon's Attack and Special Attack by one (1) rank each. The Base Attack Power of this Pokemon's "Punch" attacks is increased by one (1). (Check Iron Fist for the list of affected moves.)
Magmarizer | Item Type: Signature | Cost: 8 CC | Affected Pokemon: Magmar, Magmortar | Max Uses Per Match: - | Trigger: N/A | Nat. Gift Type: N/A | Nat. Gift BAP: N/A
This Pokemon is immune to Fire-type attacks after the effects of abilities. Increases the Pokemon's Attack and Special Attack by one (1) rank each. The Base Attack Power of this Pokemon's "Punch" attacks is increased by one (1). (Check Iron Fist for the list of affected moves.)

Other Things

Protective Moves: Protect, Detect, King's Shield, Spiky Shield, Mat Block, Baneful Bunker
Evasive Moves: Agility [Evasive], Teleport [Evasive]
Protective / Evasive Move: Protect, Detect, King's Shield, Spiky Shield, Mat Block, Baneful Bunker, Agility [Evasive], Teleport [Evasive]
Damaging Evasive Moves: Dig, Fly, Dive, Bounce, Shadow Force, Phantom Force
Damaging Priority Moves: Accelerock, Aqua Jet, Bullet Punch, Extreme Speed, Fake Out, Feint, First Impression, Ice Shard, Mach Punch, Quick Attack, Shadow Sneak, Sucker Punch, Vacuum Wave, Water Shuriken
Multi-Hit Moves: Arm Thrust, Barrage, Bone Rush, Bullet Seed, Comet Punch, Double Slap, Fury Attack, Fury Swipes, Icicle Spear, Pin Missile, Rock Blast, Spike Cannon, Tail Slap, Bonemerang, Double Hit, Double Kick, Dual Chop, Gear Grind, Twineedle, Triple Kick, Water Shuriken
Damaging [Type] Moves: Covers all of Flamethrower, Lava Plume, Fire Blast, Ember, etc. under the umbrella of "Damaging Fire-type Move." Covers all of Psychic, Psyshock, Confusion, Dream Eater, etc. under the umbrella of "Damaging Psychic-type Move." This also applies to moves which deal Fixed Damage, such as Mirror Coat, Seismic Toss and Night Shade. NOTE: This Substitution applies to all attacks of a certain type that have a BAP, so moves like Rapid Spin and Knock off will trigger "Damaging Normal-type Move" and "Damaging Dark-type Move," respectively. This does NOT apply for suspended Damaging-Evasive moves, as they don't have a BAP when suspended. This includes Z-Moves.
Damaging [Type] Combinations: All combinations that are of [Type] will activate the substitution. NOTE: A damaging [Type] combination activates a substitution for damaging [Type] moves.
Damaging [Type] Z-Move: All Z-Moves that are of [Type] will activate the substitution.
Burn-Inflicting Moves: Will-O-Wisp, Inferno
Paralysis-Inflicting Moves: Thunder Wave, Glare, Stun Spore, Nuzzle, Zap Cannon
Poison-Inflicting Moves: Poison Gas, Poison Powder, Toxic, Toxic Thread
Sleep-Inflicting Moves: Spore, Hypnosis, Sleep Powder, Sing, Grasswhistle, Lovely Kiss, Dark Void, Yawn
Confusion-Inflicting Moves: Confuse Ray, Supersonic, Sweet Kiss, Teeter Dance, Swagger, Flatter, Chatter
Switch-Preventing Moves: Block, Mean Look, Spider Web, Fairy Lock, Thousand Waves, Spirit Shackle, Anchor Shot
Trapping Moves: Fire Spin, Sand Tomb, Whirlpool, Magma Storm, Bind, Wrap, Clamp, Infestation
Switch-Forcing Moves: Whirlwind, Roar, Circle Throw, Dragon Tail
Self-Switching Moves: U-Turn, Volt Switch, Teleport (Switch), Parting Shot, Baton Pass (Switch)
Healing Moves: Roost, Slack Off, Recover, Moonlight, Synthesis, Morning Sun, Softboiled, Heal Order, Milk Drink, Swallow, Shore Up, Strength Sap
Status-Healing Moves: Aromatherapy, Heal Bell, Refresh, Purify
Lock-On Moves: Lock-On, Mind Reader
Attack-Reducing Moves: Growl, Charm, Feather Dance, Memento, Baby-Doll Eyes, Noble Roar, Parting Shot, Play Nice, Venom Drench, Tickle, Lunge, Strength Sap, Tearful Look, Trop Kick
Defense-Reducing Moves: Leer, Tail Whip, Screech, Tickle, Fire Lash
Special Attack-Reducing Moves: Captivate, Memento, Confide, Eerie Impulse, Mystical Fire, Snarl, Struggle Bug, Noble Roar, Parting Shot, Venom Drench, Tearful Look
Special Defense-Reducing Moves: Acid Spray, Fake Tears, Metal Sound
Speed-Reducing Moves: String Shot, Cotton Spore, Scary Face, Bulldoze, Icy Wind, Mud Shot, Rock Tomb, Electroweb, Glaciate, Low Sweep, Venom Drench
Accuracy-Reducing Moves: Flash, Kinesis, Sand-Attack, Smokescreen, Mud-Slap
Evasion-Reducing Moves: Sweet Scent
Attack-Increasing Moves: All Z-Status moves that increase the user's Attack, Bulk Up, Clangorous Soulblaze, Coil, Dragon Dance, Growth, Hone Claws, Howl, Meditate, Power-Up Punch, Rototiller, Sharpen, Shift Gear, Swords Dance, Work Up, Gear Up
Defense-Increasing Moves: All Z-Status moves that increase the user's Defense, Acid Armour, Barrier, Bulk Up, Clangorous Soulblaze, Coil, Cosmic Power, Cotton Guard, Defend Order, Defense Curl, Flower Shield, Harden, Iron Defense, Magnetic Flux, Withdraw
Special Attack-Increasing Moves: All Z-Status moves that increase the user's Special Attack, Calm Mind, Clangorous Soulblaze, Geomancy, Growth, Nasty Plot, Quiver Dance, Rototiller, Tail Glow, Work Up, Gear Up
Special Defense-Increasing Moves: All Z-Status moves that increase the user's Special Defense, Amnesia, Aromatic Mist, Calm Mind, Charge, Clangorous Soulblaze, Cosmic Power, Defend Order, Geomancy, Magnetic Flux, Quiver Dance
Speed-Increasing Moves: All Z-Status moves that increase the user's Speed, Agility, Autotomize, Clangorous Soulblaze, Dragon Dance, Flame Charge, Geomancy, Quiver Dance, Rock Polish, Shift Gear
Accuracy-Increasing Moves: Coil, Hone Claws
Evasion-Increasing Moves: Minimize
Self-KOing moves: Explosion, Final Gambit, Healing Wish, Lunar Dance, Memento, Self-Destruct
Hazard-Setting moves: Spikes, Stealth Rock, Sticky Web, Toxic Spikes
OHKO Moves: Fissure, Guillotine, Horn Drill, Sheer Cold

Syclar, Syclant: Laser Focus
Revenankh: Throat Chop
Embirch, Flarelm, Pyroak: Throat Chop, Stomping Tantrum
Breezi: Laser Focus
Fidgit: Throat Chop, Stomping Tantrum, Laser Focus
Rebble, Bolderdash, Stratgem: Laser Focus (D)
Privatyke, Arghonaut: Liquidation (D), Throat Chop
Kitsunoh: Defog (D), Throat Chop, Laser Focus
Monohm, Duclohm, Cyclohm: Stomping Tantrum
Colosshale: Liquidation
Colossoil: Liquidation, Throat Chop, Stomping Tantrum, Laser Focus
Protowatt, Krilowatt: Liquidation (D)
Voodoll, Voodoom: Throat Chop
Tomohawk: Defog
Brattler, Malaconda: Stomping Tantrum, Laser Focus
Cawmodore: Defog
Volkritter, Volkraken: Laser Focus
Floatoy, Caimanoe, Naviathan: Liquidation (D), Stomping Tantrum
Snugglow, Plasmanta: Telekinesis
Crucibelle: Telekinesis
Kerfluffle: Throat Chop, Stomping Tantrum

P2X7 · Nov 17, 2017

Hey, sorry if I'm not supposed to post here yet, but I'd like to voice some rough thoughts concerning a couple parts of this update that seem odd to me before we move ahead with implementation of USUM.

First, I would like to urge the head(s) of this project to reconsider the amount of recoil Blacephalon takes when using Mind Blown. In a game in which Belly Drum and Curse cut max HP by 30%, High Jump Kick deals recoil damage based on BAP and WC, Super Fang and Nature's Madness deal 20% of the target's maximum HP, and recovery moves restore a fixed amount of HP, it is frankly absurd to expect Mind Blown to be the exception and cleave to a sky-high recoil percentage. Furthermore, because of the increased difficulty involved in dealing over 40% of a Pokemon's HP in ASB, Blacephalon will likely never be able to deal enough damage with Mind Blown to make up for 45 HP it loses in the process, meaning that Mind Blown is tantamount to suicide. I suggest toning down the recoil to something similar to High Jump Kick's; I feel that (BAP + SpA Rank) (22 for most Blacephalon) would be a sufficient amount of self-inflicted damage, as it maintains Mind Blown's status as the most self-damaging recoil attack (that leaves the user alive afterwards—I'm looking at you, Explosion/Self-Destruct) and ensures that Blacephalon doesn't automatically lose any matchup for using its signature move, while keeping a hefty enough amount of recoil to disincentive reckless use of the move.
-----------

On another topic, would someone please explain to me why one can't purchase a Rockruff that evolves into Lycanroc-Du? I know that we limit access to Pokemon distributed via event, but Lycantoc-Du appears to be coded to evolve from Rockruff with a certain Ability rather than evolving from the event Rockruff only, and the event Rockruff is treated as a regular Pokemon in practically every way, even being able to breed and produce offspring that may not even have Own Tempo. I think this situation could be better solved by giving Own Tempo to all Rockruff as a fourth Ability and allowing Rockruff to evolve into any Lycanroc Forme its owner chooses, as this would more adequately represent Lycanroc-Du's ubiquity and mundanity compared to other event Pokemon.

JJayyFeather · Nov 17, 2017

No worries, I probably should've posted saying that thoughts can be added here.

1) I'm almost entirely fine with leaving Mind Blown at its current percentage. While it is incredibly cringy to think about taking that type of recoil for using a move, I just likened Mind Blown is a slightly lower power Self-Destruct that has a lower cost to the user and has the ability to hit super-effectively. The reality of Mind Blown is that it will never be a good singles move, as recoil moves literally only see use if the recoil is negated, or you just need that little bit of BAP to eke out a kill. With Mind Blown having a fixed cost, unless we make it incredibly low, the move will always just be a suicide move due to the fact that it would be hard to use Mind Blown and not be outpaced, even at 22 recoil. It's more reasonable to balance it around the power in doubles+ as an incredibly high power Fire-typed spread move (23.75 DMG w/ Charcoal on an R3 neutral target in doubles+) and as a typed suicide bomb in singles.

2) The specific Rockruff that Lycanroc-Du evolves from isn't catchable in-game, the source is only the event, as per the site. Also, from the data I've seen, Lycanroc-Du only breeds to create more Rockruff-Du (Rockruff (Dusk) w/ Own Tempo), so as far as I can see, the original Rockruff/Lycanroc only are connected to these Dusk formes by dex number and the fact that they can both access Lycanium Z, which means it should remain event-locked.

JJayyFeather · Nov 17, 2017

Update: The data collection is almost complete, there's just a couple things I want to find confirmation on still.

In the meantime:

1) Photon Geyser is a weird-ass move. It's the only move to date that switches its damage stat based on the higher one, but Burn is unable to factor in, while stage changes do factor in. Currently, I have if doing damage based on whichever stat currently has the higher rank, but that doesn't catch stage boosts at all. Any suggestions on how to include them, or should we just not include them?
2) Input on the things in the posts above from me and P2 would also be welcomed to get that settled.

If there's any data I forgot or data that I incorrectly copied over, please let me know so that I may correct this error.
Also, for all of you trying to figure out what sub things changed, Clangorous Soulblaze was added to the stat-boosting categories.

EDIT: Changed Photon Geyser to choose based on the sum of the bonuses from stages and ranks.

P2X7 · Nov 18, 2017

1. Ehhh...you bring up some pretty good points, jay, but I'm still not entirely convinced that such a high recoil percentage is necessary. Even in larger formats, though, the gap in damage spreads between Mind Blown and Blacephalon's other spread moves is pretty shocking; ignoring damage inflicted by Blacephalon's partner and enemies and using the conditions you described (Charcoal Blacephalon vs two Fire-neutral opponents with Rank 3 Special Defense), Mind Blown currently nets a HP advantage of +3.75 HP (or less if you factor in damage to Blacephalon's partner), while Heat Wave results in a HP advantage of +40, and that seems just a bit off, even with the higher damage inflicted to each opponent in mind. At any rate, though, I think it would be best if I wait until Blacephalon is available to ASB and Mind Blown's performance can be measured in an actual match before I push this issue any further.

2. I am completely aware that one cannot catch a Rockruff-Du in-game, and I thought I made that clear in my post... >.> That being said, though, I double-checked my sources and found that I was misinformed about breeding Lycanroc-Du, which was basically the foundation of my argument, so I can no longer object to its CC cost or lack thereof.

As long as I'm here, though, I have some more thoughts I'd like to voice.

3. I'd like to stick to the cartridge's precedent when handling the Ultra Burst mechanic. Thus, restricting access to Light That Burns The Sky until either one action or one round has passed from the time of Ultra Burst would be an ideal solution.

4. Given that Poipole and Rockruff-Du can't be obtained using CC, I don't like the idea of Dragon Venom and Twilight Ray having the same level of availability as most other signature items. There's a bit of an optics problem here, as it doesn't look quite right to allow players to buy the signature item of a Pokemon that cannot, itself, be purchased and that won't be available at all until a tournament or TLR is written with said Pokemon as a reward. I think a better way to distribute these items would be to place them in a TLR written for their respective user (like how we handled Gracidea, Diacinite, and Mewtwonite X/Y) or to award them as bonus prizes to any player who wins the item's affected Pokemon in a tournament.

JJayyFeather · Nov 18, 2017

1. Good call actually, can always be addressed later
2. lol it happens :D

3. I'm in agreement there, I was thinking one round, but I'm not really certain.

2. I didn't actually think about that when I priced the sig items for those two, that has been fixed. :D

JJayyFeather · Nov 25, 2017

Alright, after much ado:

Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon has been implemented!

CAP Tutor Gains are in a new hide tag in the data set, go wild!

As a note for those of you that use Veekun, it definitely isn't up to date yet, so if you want up-to-date information, check out Serebii or Bulbapedia. :D

Ultra Sun & Ultra Moon Omnibus Thread

JJayyFeather

Drifting~

JJayyFeather

Drifting~

JJayyFeather

Drifting~

P2X7

JJayyFeather

Drifting~

JJayyFeather

Drifting~

P2X7

JJayyFeather

Drifting~

JJayyFeather

Drifting~