Gen 3 Whatever, I'm bored.

[dekzeh]

Cloyster (M) @ Leftovers ** Lupe Brown
Trait: Shell Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 16 Def / 104 SAtk / 136 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin
- Spikes
- Surf

Spikes etc.. High SAtk so I can 3HKO most Gyarados seeing as this is my only hope if Gyara taunts.

Dusclops (F) @ Leftovers ** My Friend Jon
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Atk / 32 Def / 108 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Focus Punch
- Rest
- Shadow Ball
- Toxic

I had a reason for this moveset but now I dont remember but yeah does his job at spin blocking.

Salamence (F) @ Leftovers ** A Heady Tale
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 212 HP / 160 Def / 136 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Flamethrower
- Protect
- Toxic
- Wish

Stops hera who is a bitch.

Vaporeon (M) @ Leftovers ** Stragglers Moon
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 124 HP / 252 Def / 132 SDef
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Baton Pass
- Charm
- Protect
- Wish

Realized I didn't need an attack at all and Charm is how I beat Snorlaxen but I might use Haze because CM Celebi annoys the fuck out of me.

Blissey (F) @ Leftovers ** Mistress Mabel
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Def / 16 Spd / 240 SAtk
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Aromatherapy
- Flamethrower
- Softboiled
- Toxic

How fucking boring...

Metagross @ Leftovers ** Shameless
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Meteor Mash
- Rest
- Sleep Talk


My 'TTar counter' :X

 

[Umby]

Needs Taunt or Sand Stream or Magneton or Pursuit or Explosion or a combination of a number of those things so Toxic can actually do more work.

Cloyster is <3

 

[Xenon]

3 Pokemons with Toxic, i don't think is necessary. Earthquake over toxic on Salamence, or, Thunder Wave / Thunderbolt over Toxic on Blissey.

 

[133tSneasel]

Explosion on Cloyster like Umby Said
because when his HP is low he can at least put a dent into some thing or KIll something with low health, and his attack isn't too shabby, so it can do a decent amount of damage.

Tyranitar for Dusclops
In a TSS team, you need something to bring Sandstorm, or atleast plant it in the field. Tyranitar can actualy bring a Sandstorm to the field which helps a lot. Dusclops can not do that and is not immune to it. Tyranitar actually learns a lot of moves that Dusclops learns, expect for Ghost attacks, but Tyranitar can over ghost well with his Crunch, or Pursuit attack. Tyranitar is just the high light of the team, so he is needed.

Swampert drop Vaporeon
Vaporeon would have been good, but Swampert can do it better. He's got power as a Ground type and not a Water type, but it can utilize Water and Ice attacks, and do some damage back other Ground and Rocks. Swamper is more stable then Vaporeon IMO, but that's just me. He is also immune to the Sandstorm, so he can do damage to your opponent and run, or stay in and fight like a man. LOL

Magneton for Metagross
Steel types are good in TSS teams, but Metagross IMO is a attacker not a staller, or support member. Nobody likes to leave a Pokemon out against an electric attack in fear for being paralyzed or poisoned with a Toxic. I just feel Magneton would be better, because he can dish out electric attack for Water Pokemon, and not take any damage from the Sandstorm and then dish out poison or Sub up and attack with whatever Hidden Power is over your choice, when it be Water, Grass, Ice, or Fire.

 

[Lutra]

I think you definitely should try to cover Jirachi which could easily take advantage of Salamence (among others) to calm mind upon. Having Metagross as its only counter is just asking for trouble.

Oh yeah Umby, these pokes need taunt because they are like Deoxys S kind of speed. Yeah and toxic and spikes means TSS TEAM! Even if it is actually a ghost spikes team with toxicers, we love TSS teams. Let's add Tyranitar. Pursuit usually implies that an opponent's poke is actually going to flee from the pursuiter, well there's not exactly major threats in this team. Explosion isn't a bad suggestion as it does need a form of phazing as it is too reliant on resistances.

Xenon, it's not just about how many toxicers a team has, it's about whether toxic is useful on each individual pokemon and whether another move would be more beneficial. They are obviously only certain pokemon which will clash with another pokemon on opposing teams. This is generally how toxic is spread. It's either a toxic predict to the counter or one of equal counterage. Having said that, Earthquake on Salamence is a good idea to help counter Jirachi - so great observation.

Dusclops to Tyranitar? Well surely then you'd be changing a ghost spikes team to a TSS team? Which as you pointed out, would mean more changes would have to be made. Not a good idea to go down this route.

Well as you know, you clearly have a weakness to calm minders. Roar suicune will just nap on you, whilst Jirachi and even more so : Celebi will tear you apart. What I also dislike is the defensive nature of the team yet no phazing or hazing whatsoever. That's got to happen, if it is going to be a successful team. This could also solve the calm mind problem at the same time. But, unfortunately it is going to require change since I don't think you can fit it on any of the pokes easily. I'm wondering why you have toxic on Dusclops when other moves could be useful. Other than that, leave it as it is OR change the team. I'm not going to suggest changes because there are multiple routes you could go down.


Sorry to those raters that I have picked upon. If you think I'm misinterpreting you or just talking shit, then ignore me.

 

[Alpha1]

forgive me for probably sounding noobilicious but wats a TSS team?

 

[Heysup]

i beleive TSS means toxic/sandstorm/spikes.

You have to take into acount that the Spinner on the other team may be able to dent dusclops, such as starmie and donphan.

Im not sure if 2 wishers are really needed, And Salamence is still really easy to take down, it can only take so many heracross rock slides, and if a starmie comes in, And your spin blocker is down/damaged you get spinned and/or ice beamed.

Im sort of tired so ill keep this short, I for one, dislike defensive stall teams because i feel they are boring but this team seems to have very little/no offense at all minus spikes and toxic, which most people are prepared for anyway. So id suggest to take advantage if Salamences crazy attack and speed and make it offensive, or anything else.

If any of this makes no sense then its because im too tired to type.

 

[Alpha1]

sweet thanxs

 

[Thorns]

Explosion on Cloyster like Umby Said
Tyranitar for Dusclops
Swampert drop Vaporeon
Magneton for Metagross

You'll want to put some reasons. Who wants to listen to someone's suggestions that have no backing?

As has already been stated, Taunt is essential for this kind of team. For this I suggest Tauntridos over Vaporeon, as Salamence already carries Wish.

Magneton and Tyranitar's Sand Stream will be extremely useful, but I just can't see where it would fit. You could just dump Metagross for Tyranitar, but that might cause some problems with opposing Tyranitars if they Taunt.

 

[Lutra]

i beleive TSS means toxic/sandstorm/spikes.

You have to take into acount that the Spinner on the other team may be able to dent dusclops, such as starmie and donphan.

Im not sure if 2 wishers are really needed, And Salamence is still really easy to take down, it can only take so many heracross rock slides, and if a starmie comes in, And your spin blocker is down/damaged you get spinned and/or ice beamed.

Im sort of tired so ill keep this short, I for one, dislike defensive stall teams because i feel they are boring but this team seems to have very little/no offense at all minus spikes and toxic, which most people are prepared for anyway. So id suggest to take advantage if Salamences crazy attack and speed and make it offensive, or anything else.

If any of this makes no sense then its because im too tired to type.

This is where Will-o-wisp on it would come in handy to take down Donphan. The attack evs that Dusclops as is meant to hurt Starmie with shadowball. And assuming its eved to not be 3HKOed by Starmie, it can rest pressure stall it and generally make it lose all of its surfs before it gets a crit. If it does get a crit, well he may just have to start spiking again - in the mean time, awakening Dusclops.

Yes 2 wishers are needed, the recovery is abysmal otherwise. And on a defensive team, lack of recovery should never be an issue. Well Salamence has wish and protect so it can easily recover itself. The problem comes when things try to stat up on it. Somehow I think a Dusclops can take an ice beam and it inevitably should take predicted attacks because you are always generally going to switch to Dusclops.

I suggest otherwise...but he does need to make it a non-fail team. It should stay defensive because it was created defensive.

I was tired too when I did my post, well more hyperactive overtired state lol. So maybe I was pretty active.



Oy! Thorns! What the hell are you doing? You can't switch vaporeon for Tauntrados, they are completely different pokemon - besides their type. Vaporeon counters a huge range of attackers that sadly gyarados doesn't. Already carries wish, oh. Are we all in this 1 wish, max 2 toxic fan club? You've seem to have made silly assumptions about how a team works. There is barely any recovery, I reemphasise the need for 2 wishers. And whatever to your changes.

 

[Heysup]

Good Point lutra, i didnt even look at his dusclops moveset, but he still should get wisp for other reasons as well. However, now that i am awake, What is stopping a CM celebi/Jirachi from Cming up on your team? You can skip to the end if you dont want to read this^^

Metagross wouldnt scare them because its sleep talk, dusclops forsure wouldnt scare them, they can just recover toxic/willo/shadowball off.
Vaporeon doesnt hurt them, Toxic wouldnt as they can switch out once it starts ticking for too much and them come right back in(Or heal bell). I suggest Haze/roar for this case over charm.

Also, if SD celebi comes in, you send in vaporeon to charm, Then he BP's to Metagross, now you have an issue because you only have one pokemon to take its earthquake which is salamence, You cant intimidate it or charm, your only hope really is to toxic it and bounce around trying to predict if its going to meteor mash or earthquake, and protect when you can, but again it can switch out when toxic ticks for too much, or Explosion. For this i suggest haze/roar as well. Charm is really only good for a DDmence, or Snorlax/curselax. TTar can taunt both of these and set up since you dont have surf, in fact that vaporeon is taunt bait from gyarados or ttar.

id See how an opposing TTar could mess your team up quite a bit as well, Whether it be CB or DD, Even boah. Taunt spikes. Once they realze your dusclops has focus punch, they can spam rockslide or taunt your toxic/rest. Metagross comes in on a CB ttar rock slide, that works for then, but its a predicting game, that could go horribly wrong. Not to mention the DDTauntrados weak this team has.

This is getting to be a bit too long, but over all i suggest haze or roar on vaporeon to stop statups/abuse spikes. Maybe add willowisp isntead of toxic, just for physical threats. Also, why does Blissey have Flamethrower over Ice beam, when Salamence has Flamethrower as well?

 

[Thorns]

Oy! Thorns! What the hell are you doing? You can't switch vaporeon for Tauntrados, they are completely different pokemon - besides their type. Vaporeon counters a huge range of attackers that sadly gyarados doesn't. Already carries wish, oh. Are we all in this 1 wish, max 2 toxic fan club? You've seem to have made silly assumptions about how a team works. There is barely any recovery, I reemphasise the need for 2 wishers. And whatever to your changes.

Okay, fair enough. It's been a while since I've played ADV, so obviously I'd be a little rusty.

Dekzeh, are you going to reply with what changes you've made?

 

[Lutra]

I've heard he's on vacation or some trip. Well meaning I saw a post on some nb clan (albeit nearly dead) that still exists which relates to the word ancient.

 

[Heysup]

And also, why are we spending so much time rating a stall team....

 

[Ceielo]

You cant intimidate it or charm, your only hope really is to toxic it and bounce around trying to predict if its going to meteor mash or earthquake, and protect when you can, but again it can switch out when toxic ticks for too much, or Explosion. For this i suggest haze/roar as well.

Are you talking about using Toxic on Metagross? Iirc, Toxic doesn't do anything to Steel or Poison types. I can see what you're talking about though.

I personally would go for Haze, so you can take out the Attack and Defense raising parts of Curse users, like Snorlax and sometimes Swampert, and not get hit trying to do it. Roar is also blocked by Soundproof, and is a minus priority move, so Haze seems better here.

 

[Umby]

The only problem with Haze is that vs Snorlax, +0 STABed Body Slam/Return still kinda shits on Vaporeon regardless. Charm can at least push it down to Atk -1 or -2 and give Vappy some breathing room. Can't really say you can go wrong with either one, but it's something to think about.

 

[Heysup]

k i clearly meant willowisp:) But keep in mind, Roar makes the pokemon that comes in take spike damage.

 

[dekzeh]

Ok I'm not home so sorry for not answering.
I'm not gonna bother answering stupid comments so I'll only answer decent ones. And thanks to Lutra for explaining some things for me =)

About my CM weak:
CM Suicune is easily beatable with Vaporeon. If they have Roar it's even better for me. I'll switch Vaporeon, on their CM/Ice Beam/Surf/Whatever and dry Baton Pass. If I go first means they used Roar, so I send anything and get back to Vaporeon and keep repeating that. Cloyster can spin even vs a Suicune with a few Calm Minds so CM Cune + Spikes isnt really a problem either.

CB Jirachi is beatable by Metagross since they usually lack Fire Punch. With CM, Psychic, TB, Wish they lose to Gross. Otherwise I pretty much have to hope for a burn with Blissey and stall it from there. A problem only if they're carring a not-so common moveset so whatever.

CM Celebi.. well Superbi will be Toxic'd by Blissey and isn't a problem. CM BP Celebi.. SUCKS, yeah whatever =)

Hugh TTar cant mess my team at all, first because it CAN'T switch in on anything. Second because Metagross is a very safe switch-in. Also lol @ HeySup if a TTar is gonna keep Sliding when I'm trying to Focus Punch why won't I just Toxic it? Is the opponent always the only one that can think?! Yeah not really.

Lots of dumbs comments and thats why on all my RMTs I always end up saying the same thing.

"WHY DO I KEEP POSTING THINGS HERE"

I'm trying to find a way to use Explosion on Cloyster but the thing is: I really REALLY need all moves. Ice Beam as this is my all round Mence counter and it does an awesome job switching in even on CB Rock Slides if it has to, and like I said, it 3HKOs most Gyarados while they 4HKO after a DD. Surf is a must so I can hit Forry hard and also to mess up with any CB Tar stupid enough to switch-in. Rapid Spin and Spikes I don't need to explain really.

So yeah If anyone can help me with that itd would be cool.

What I might do is use Meteor Mash, EQ, Boom, Rest Metagross.
Or even just use 4 Atks with a bulky spread.. idk.

 

[Heysup]

Well you missed the Point i guess,

For dusclops vs ttar, cb/dd rock slide is a 2hko with your evs, with possible flinch, it can also sub/taunt your toxic (Earthquake can 2hko as well if he overpredicts your metagross switch). Am i missing something?

For Metagross vs ttar... You switch it in on a rockslide...nice job good guess. You "Safely" switch it in on an Earthquake and boom 70% 2hko no matter if cb/dd'd or not, i wouldnt call a near KO a safe switch. To add to this, Your Metagross will not even ohko ttar.

3rd of All, He can send it in on salamence, vaporeon or blissey to name a few. Toxic wont scare off Ttar for a couple turns, and flamethrower would be easy to predict depending on the pokemon he had out anyway(such as forry/skarm) IF he has a heal beller all he has to do is Rinse and repeat. Or maybe he has explosion, or you happen to kill one of his pokemon, then what?

You can LOL @ me all you want. But at least consider these numbers/common situations.

The possible soltuions include making dusclops more bulky and give it willowisp. A Strategy against a CB, use protect if you have it on the pokemon, and then switch to the appropriate immunity/resistance because so many of your pokemon have it, But if it comes in on Dusclops or Blissey you may be in trouble. DDtar, im not sure how you plan to beat that.

P.S. How does sending in cloyster Stop suicune, it can calm mind up, and beat cloyster im 99% sure, fire punch isnt uncommon on jirachi either.

And also with cloyster, You can send in metagross for salamence, since he will usually use rock slide, and that deals with that, Gyarados is harder to counter, you can make blissey carry counter instead of Flamethrower to counter them both if you like, so you can lose ice beam on cloyster and get explosion.