Resource NU Viability Rankings

[Phantomistix]

Back again, this time with a full slate to represent the meta after the new toys have simmered for a while and the meta settled following the Mienshao suspect (and Sensu ban). We'll be voting on any noms as they come in from now onwards so make sure to post those here in the thread. As always, you can find the full slate here.

New Additions

Flamigo UR -> B+ Following Mienshao's ban, it's natural to start exploring other options to fill its place. Flamigo has always seen use, but previously there was too much opportunity cost to ever justify a high ranking on the VR since using it meant dropping Mienshao. While not as strong and centralizing as Mienshao was, it's still a solid option with a better Amoonguss matchup too.
Scovillain UR -> C Manual sun has seen some usage, and Scovillian is a key part of any successful variation of the archetype.

Rises

Avalugg A -> A+ Has solidified itself as a core part of balance structures as a huge benefactor of Snow's omnipresence, one of the only pokemon with a consistent matchup into Cetitan.
Basculegion A -> A+ As Rabia said, sub Basculegion is cheating.
Ninetales-Alola A -> A+ Veil HO has picked up heavy steam, and A9 has solidified itself outside that playstyle on more traditional offense and balance builds with its deep movepool and versatility.
Cinccino A- -> A+ Core pokemon on virtually every single non-terrain HO (and even some terrain HOs too). Extremely good at keeping hazards off and chipping down teams for its partners.
Amoonguss A- -> A It's a fighting check that no longer loses the the best fighting type in the tier now that Mienshao is gone.
Cetitan A- -> A This mon is always a threat. While it does need many things to go right to truly sweep teams, it still forces opponents to play by its rules to avoid a sweep. Even then, it's capable of trading itself for one or more key pieces.
Chandelure A- -> A There is NOTHING in the tier that can switch into this mon with full confidence, whether that be due to fearing a Trick or just massive damage. Held back from being truly insane by its mediocre speed tier and weakness to hazards.
Registeel A- -> A
Gastrodon B+ -> A Extremely positive Toxicroak matchup, very good role compression and flexibility with 2 amazing abilities and a deep supportive movepool.
B+ -> A- Better snow matchup than Wetbull, better offensive typing and profile, wisp is an amazing tool to have.
Altaria B -> B+ No longer has to fear Mienshao's Triple Axel. Best Amoonguss switchin in the tier.
Porygon2 B -> B+ Was underranked in our previous slate, has established itself as a very consistent and flexible defensive tool.
Sandslash-Alola B -> B+ Provides great flexiblity and role compression to Snow teams as it can set hazards, remove them and also act as an abuser.
Scrafty B -> B+ As the meta slows down post Mienshao ban, Scrafty gets more freedom to beat up on slower builds.
Ditto B- -> B+ HO gaining more use = ditto gets better.
Infernape B- -> B An option that has seen a lot more exploration as a replacement to Mienshao. Has some flexibility with support moves like Stealth Rock, Switcheroo and others.
Duraludon C -> B- An option that has seen more usage due to its very positive matchup into Cinccino and Terrain HO. Provides some very decent role compression.

Drops

Incineroar A+ -> A Options like Sticky Hold Gastro, the intimidate immune Flamigo and others are popping up. Not the same catch all spdef check it once was, but still a very solid, top option.
Tauros-Paldea-Aqua A+ -> A More people are considering dropping it for its Fiery brother. While it does have a better defensive typing in Water, it's only a very slight improvement. Wisp is often a much better 4th move than Aqua Jet. Also very stinky into A9. See you in A- next slate buddy!
Toxicroak A -> A- Gastrodon picking up steam hurts it massively. Very susceptible to chip and despite having a good defensive typing, has extremely fake bulk.
Milotic A- -> B+ Gastrodon and Vaporeon have established themselves as the premier options, leaving Milo in the dust.
Swampert A- -> B+ I honestly have no idea why this dropped. If anything, this mon has only gotten better recently. Btw use spdef sets they're great!
Sylveon A- -> B+ Much less popular compared to other special breakers, new fairy type competiton in A9.
Typhlosion-Hisui A- -> B Go use Chandelure.
Breloom B+ -> B Amoonguss sends his regards.
Tentacruel B+ -> B Vileplume has disappeared from the meta, other hazard removal options are also much better and more consistent.
Torterra B+ -> B One trick pony that's outsped by scarf Flygon at +2. Maybe when the Drey77 set picks up it will see more usage.
Dragalge B -> B- 3 months late ngl, this mon is so bad it makes Danny's hairline look pristine.
Galvantula B -> B- Cinccino is this thing's worst nightmare.
Kingdra B -> B- It's the winter, it's snowing not raining.
Ludicolo B -> B- ^
Vileplume B -> C Go use Amoonguss.
Abomasnow B- -> UR Go use A9.
Dudunsparce B- -> C
Whimsicott B- -> C Go use Amoonguss.
Wo-Chien B- -> C
Coalossal C -> UR
Grimmsnarl C -> UR
Rotom-Mow C -> UR Hasn't seen usage since SS was cg.
Sandaconda C -> UR
Sceptile C -> UR Can you believe Tuthur voted for this trash to stay ranked lol. Shameful behaviour.

 

[Oofhixd]

After the new slate, im just gonna share my opinions

C -> D (UR)
Why is this mon still ranked. I know psychics are lacking but there are still so many better psychics (bronzong, melo, glowbro, scream tail, indeedee, guno and uxie.) The only thing this mon does is essentially what hattrem does, and alot of stronger players can just completely stop this mon from removing. This mon is alsohindering by hazards not being too great as cinccino is so common rn. There just isnt enough going to keep this ranked. (Also unranking this might get ladder to stop using it)

C -> UR
Amoongus exists, idt there is much of a reason to use this mon. Yeah thats literally all i have to say. Just go use amoongus.

A-/A -> A/A-
Ok so these 2 mons should be in the same tier. These mons fill similar roles, but not entirely the same. Raging bull breaks aveil on snow teams, and redbull is just better into the broken snow in general. Also redbull has a better MU into the ever-present amoongus. imo wetbull actually feels slightly worse than redbull rn surprisingly.

Ok im gonna go into something slightly different here, beong the discussion of a C+ tier. I believe this would be beneficial to the meta due to there being a high number of mons in both B- and C. If you think this is irrelevant, think about how different in viability the C mons are. Like, look at espeon and try telling me that its as good as bombirdier, indeedee and houndstone. Here are some mons that i think would be C+:



Alright thats all for now! Ty for reading my (shitty) takes!

 

[Heatranator]

UR -> C
I've been using zoroark in some of my latest NU SSNL games, and I gotta say, this mon is pretty good. Zoroark's main niche is its ability illusion, which can allow it to disguise itself as a teammate in order to hit a wall extremely hard on there weaker side. This is great for wallbreaking, but even once they know what pokemon zoroark is disguised as, it can still be very effective due to its high speed and power. It speed ties scyther, which means it outspeeds the base 100 crowd of flygon, staraptor and the bulls.

Zoroark @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Illusion
Tera Type: Grass/Poison
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- U-turn
- Focus Blast
- Grass Knot/Sludge Bomb
This is the set I've been using. Dark pulse is a good stab option, u-turn allows it to fake out opponents by disguising itself as a pokemon such as Staraptor much more effectively while letting it get out of sticky situations. Focus Blast hits steels and Incineroar really hard. Grass knot can nail the water types of the tier, while Sludge Bomb hits the fairy types and can spread poison if it gets lucky. Heavy Duty Boots I think is necessary unless you have superb hazard control in order to not break its disguise via hazard damage.

Some alternate sets I could see is nasty plot to go for all out sweeping, though it can sometimes struggle to set up and choice scarf to utilitse that good speed alongside trick in order to outspeed most of the meta. However, I think HDB is the best set on this mon.

Replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9nu-816351?p2 Here it comes in on low health sylveon, and while this one didn't have sludge, it was still able to u-turn out of the matchup. It then comes in endgame on avalugg, and is able to nail the focus blast on the tera steel flygon for the win.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9nu-817994 This game zoroark didn't do a whole lot, but it still was necessary for the win. It unfortunately lets in vaporeon, and misses the first focus blast against registeel, but is then able to do enough damage with the second to allow Flygon+Staraptor to force out regi and then win the game from there.

Overall, I think that zoroark has nice niche in the tier that can be used on certain teams in order to gain victories.

B- -> B
I've utlised this mon alongside Zoroark with a HDB set, and man is it so good. Staraptor already hits pretty fucking hard, so idt choice band is needed as much as unless they have something like an avalugg, you probably are going to be 3hit ko'ing or 2hit ko'ing every pokemon you face. And being able to switch in without worrying about rocks or being able to switch up moves is massive. Registeel might think it can easily set up rocks on you as it takes brave bird, but now its CC'd and is basically dead now. Much better then B- rn I think.

B -> B+
Raikou is honestly a pretty decent mon in the tier. It can either use a pivot set which is deceptively hard to stop with scald in its arsenal and its coverage options with aura sphere and extrasensory, while CM sets pair great on snow with weather ball to annihilate the grass types that might try to stop it. Seems just like a good mon that should rise up.

B- -> C
I... just can't see what palossand is doing in the tier. Sure, its a decent fighting answer and specifically croak answer, but that seems just kinda it. Flygon can take shadow ball decently well to get to +2 and 2hit ko it, basculegion deals a butt ton of damage unless it teras, cetitan does the same, cincinno can't do a whole lot but can use knock off and lock it into shore up, wauros just wave crashes it, scyther can easily take shadow ball and 2hit ko it with +2 dual wingbeat, lots of the physical meta simply just beats it rn. To me it seems like palossand is just a remnent of an older meta when mienshao was here and toxicroak was better. IDT its horrible enough for UR, but it most certainly doesn't seem like a B- mon.

 

[emikatana]

B+ -> A+ This mon is amazing. It was overshadowed for so long by offensive metas, as well as stronger breakers like Gallade, Mienshao, and others before that. Now with those banned and the offense meta starting to die down (especially after Snow tiering action), Flamigo finally has a chance to shine. Simply put, there are no switch-ins to this thing. Scrappy means that Ghost types cannot switch into Close Combat, meaning the only mons that resist both stabs are Kilowattrel and Toxtricity, both of whom are so frail they do not want to switch into even Scarfed sets. Houndstone with it's Fluffy ability is the only thing that can safely switch into it pre-Tera, and even it needs to Tera against SD sets and loses to Tera Blast sets. Flamigo is also very resistent to hazards, being a Flying type that's neutral to Rock, and can carry Roost even on choiced sets to heal off recoil and chip damage, since it doesn't need to carry coverage moves due to it's Stab combination. All in all, this is probably the best physical breaker in the tier right now, with multiple different sets and an unstoppable Stab combo that can tear through almost any balance team.

UR -> B- Golurk is a solid physical breaker. A stab combo of Poltergeist and Earthquake is difficult to switch into, and it carries the dangerous No Guard Dynamic Punch, which can allow it to hax through almost anything. Coverage such as Stone Edge and Ice Punch or Trick can round out the set. Additionally, Ghost/Ground is a solid defensive typing with useful immunities, walling things like Toxtricity. It is severely held back by it's poor speed stat however.

252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Dynamic Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 160-190 (40.6 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Registeel: 366-432 (100.5 - 118.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Amoonguss: 258-304 (59.8 - 70.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Eviolite Gligar: 139-165 (41.6 - 49.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Overqwil: 360-426 (96.2 - 113.9%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

UR -> B- If Naclstack deserves to be here, then so does fellow Eviolite abuser Dipplin. With Sticky Hold, it is impossible to remove the Eviolite, making it the best Knock absorber in the tier. It has comparable physical bulk to Avalugg, with a much better typing and great special bulk as well. It also is not very passive compared to other walls, being able to run a Growth moveset that can sweep entire teams if left alone. With Dragon Tail to phase out other setup sweepers, it is very hard to abuse Dipplin in any way, making it a very safe and solid defensive option for fat teams. Also, has great synergy with other defensive mons like Porygon2 and Avalugg, who love Dipplin's ability to absorb Knocks and CCs. I have especially had great success with a P2 Avalugg Dipplin core, which is extremely difficult to break through.

252 Atk Choice Band Flamigo Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Dipplin: 121-144 (33.2 - 39.5%) -- 99.9% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Incineroar Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Dipplin: 73-87 (20 - 23.9%) -- guaranteed 5HKO
4 Atk Muk-Alola Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Dipplin: 51-60 (14 - 16.4%) -- possible 7HKO
252+ Atk Mystic Water Adaptability Basculegion Wave Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Dipplin: 35-41 (9.6 - 11.2%) -- possible 9HKO
252 Atk Flygon Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Dipplin: 150-176 (41.2 - 48.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
0 SpA Gastrodon Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Dipplin: 196-232 (53.8 - 63.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (live a hit and heal with Giga Drain)
252 SpA Choice Specs Inteleon Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Dipplin: 52-62 (14.2 - 17%) -- possible 6HKO

UR -> C Piloswine is a surprisingly good mon, with decent bulk further boosted by Eviolite and a great offensive typing allowing it to hit most things in the tier. Definitely has a niche in the NU tier, especially as a Ground type that resists Ice (due to Thick Fat), which is especially useful in the current Snow meta.

B- -> B+ Braviary-Hisui is an excellent special breaker that was criminally underranked in the last slate. While I do agree that it has issues with accuracy, so do other higher ranked mons like Articuno-H, Kilowattrel, and Torn, who all rely on Hurricane as a special Flying stab. Other than that, Braviary is an absolute monster, with Sheer Force Life Orb being very difficult to switch into. While it is very slow, Agility allows Braviary to boost it's speed if it is ever given a free turn, which is not uncommon due to the pressure it exerts and a large HP stat of 110 allowing to absorb hits fairly well. Also, Braviary's typing allows it to find opportunities to switch in on common moves like Close Combat and Earthquake. If that wasn't enough, Braviary has an often overlooked hidden ability Tinted Lens, which lets it turn the tables on would-be checks and shred them instead. I have especially had success with Specs sets, with Braviary-H's signature move Esper Wing allowing it to take over games if given even a single turn to hit. Here's some silly calcs:

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tinted Lens Braviary-Hisui Hurricane vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzong: 174-204 (51.4 - 60.3%) -- 90.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tinted Lens Braviary-Hisui Hurricane vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Registeel: 144-170 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

A- -> B Sorry Glowbro, but you just aren't good anymore. This thing sees very little usage on ladder and doesn't really do anything that other mons don't do better. We have a better Regenerator mon, better Poison types that aren't weak to Knock, and better CM sweepers. It's time for Glowbro to go away.

Other than these, I agree with people above, Firebull does indeed seem better than Waterbull right now and Zoroark probably deserves to be ranked. Also, the VR is very bloated right now with mons that probably shouldn't be on it at all, such as the sun sweepers, Goodra, Florges, Torterra, and Grafaiai, and others. Thanks for reading lmao.

 

[Phantomistix]

It's good to see more activity in the thread, and while we appreciate all of you making your thoughts known, we'd like to remind everyone that when nominating a previously unranked pokemon to the VR, you MUST add supporting replays to your post, and preferably any notable calcs too. Simply stating the mon's use cases and benefits is not enough.

We're still debating internally how often we'll be doing the intermediate voting slates, but we'll be sure to let you know.

 

[Phantomistix]

Swampert B+ to A
While going up two subranks might seem like a big jump, I still maintain the opinion that Swampert dropping out of A- was a mistake. The two most direct competitors are Gligar and Gastrodon, and pert has some very considerable upsides in comparison.

What I think is the big separator between Swampert and Gligar is the matchup against the common removal in the tier. Gligar can still toxic, knock and u-turn on Avalugg, but it can never stay in on it. While most Swampert don't have meaningful ways of forcing progress against Avalugg beyond knocking its boots, it can still stay in and tank hits. Swampert can also tech Earth Power to beat Avalugg. The Altaria matchup is even more Swampert skewed since pert has a slower pivot, and can also tech Ice Beam (not a great option but still an option regardless).

Gastrodon is a much closer mon to Swampert, both in terms of viability and similarities. I do think Gastro is slightly better and more flexible, but the difference isn't big. The 2 big benefits to pert over Gastro are of course Knock-Off and Flip Turn, and I think those lend themselves much better to more offensive builds. With the decline of Wetbull and other water types, there also isn't a big need to have a water immunity. There's also the fact that Gastrodon is a lot less bulky (111/68/82 vs 100/90/90), and much of its staying power is tied to Recover, a move that is VERY punishable by many top threats.

Meloetta B to A-
Another mon I want going up 2 subranks. There's been a very noticeable upsurge in Steel Overwhelm builds, and an option I've recently started using a lot more is Meloetta. It fits very nicely on those builds, and helps a lot to avoid stacking weaknesses, something which the more common Munkidori suffers from. Hyper Voice is also a much more spammable move than Sludge Bomb/Wave. That being said, there are some very notable downsides compared to Munki, namely the lack of an ability vs an insane ability. Munkidori also has a much better defensive profile with that 4x fighting resist, and the speed difference is also a big factor.

All of that being said, I think Meloetta is still a very good, underexplored threat that more people should consider (especially if its 100% wr across NUCL and SSNL last week continues). It has 3 very solid sets (Choice Item, Throat Spray, AV), and can provide some very good utility too with options like Knock Off and Trick.

 

[emikatana]

Here's replays for my noms:

Flamigo exerts immense offensive pressure, subbing on a wall and taking out two key mons, breaking open the balance core: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2293648786
Flamigo comes in on Gligar and KOs an Avalugg in snow: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2294227483
Flamigo wins from team preview: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2294393123?p2

Golurk does massive damage with Poltergeist and Dipplin helps out too: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2287324853
Golurk takes multiple KOs with correct predictions, while Dipplin eats a +2 Rhydon Stone Edge crit into Fire Punch to Dragon Tail it out: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2287347491
Golurk takes multiple KOs with it's great typing and power while Dipplin eats hits from Incineroar and Brambleghast: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2287439574?p2
Dipplin eats Knocks while a Burned Golurk still one-shots Brambleghast and 2tkos Flygon: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2287522573
Golurk breaks through an entire fat balance team after an unfortunate incident with Bronzong: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2294254888?p2

Dipplin sweeping through 5 mons over 30 turns: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2287542659
Dipplin easily eats supereffective attacks and does huge damage with Giga Drain and Dragon Tail: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2287320524?p2
Dipplin eats powerful hits from +1 Brambleghast and Specs Toxtricity: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2286653715
Dipplin tanks +1 Stone Edges and a Tera Fire Fire Blast from Typhlosion: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2286760030
Dipplin prevents Cetitan from BDing and 1v1s a Flygon despite being Tera Steel: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2286763808
Dipplin takes less than half from a Pawmot Ice Punch and walls a Guts Bulk Up Ursaring, despite being burned by Vaporeon: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2286817572
Dipplin takes on TyphlosionH, Tauros, and Cinccino all in a row: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2286830581
Dipplin eats a supereffective BraviaryH Heat Wave to DTail it out and heal up: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2286934245?p2

Piloswine eats two supereffective hits and takes out two mons: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2292560199?p2
Don't have a lot of replays saved with Piloswine since I was using it mostly a couple weeks ago but the pile of swine is in some of the other replays.

 

[emikatana]

Also I just realized that Ambipom is not ranked, which is just criminal.

UR -> B Ambipom is an often hated, but nonetheless good, speed control option in NU. With a powerful Stab Technician Fake Out, it can revenge kill many offensive mons, and use it's amazing speed stat to outspeed and Knock/kill things that switch into Fake Out. Ghost types that are usually immune to Fake Out need to risk switching into a Knock Off, and none of them will outspeed Ambipom after they are Knocked. Ambipom struggles into the tier's physical walls but most of them do not want to get Knocked. For example, our steels rely on Lefties for recovery, and Avalugg requires Boots to switch in safely, and if Ambipom Knocks them, it's partners can wear down and break through these walls much easier. UTurn also allows Ambipom to pivot. People often worry about Ambipom's low damage, but I have found that with a Silk Scarf set, Ambipom's Fake Out and Double Hit does a massive amount of damage. Boots is not required at all since the offense teams that Ambipom is most effective against often do not use hazards at all, making it rather useless.

252 Atk Silk Scarf Technician Ambipom Double Hit (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Galvantula: 260-308 (92.5 - 109.6%) -- approx. 56.3% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Silk Scarf Technician Ambipom Double Hit (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Cinccino: 260-308 (89.3 - 105.8%) -- approx. 31.3% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Ambipom Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Chandelure: 192-228 (73.5 - 87.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

These are the most important calcs IMO, but most offense mons die to a Fake Out + Double Hit, and Tera Normal allows Fake Out to revenge kill sweepers from around 70%, while letting it 2tko most non-resists with Fake Out + Double Hit. All in all, very solid speed control option that can be a very potent breaker if Normal resists are removed. Definitely deserves to be ranked, I would say B+ but with balance becoming more common, it should probably be B or B- in the post-snow meta.

Some replays:
A turn 1 Knock on Gligar sets up Ambipom for a 2tko the next time it switches in, allowing it to take over the game, preventing a Cetitan sweep and cleaning up with Double Hit: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2282345140
Ambipom crucially stops a potential Toxicroak sweep: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2282336588?p2
Tera Normal Ambipom basically wins the game by itself: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2283004177?p2
Ambipom clutches up a lost game: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2283531168?p2
Ambipom wins the game once the only steel Klefki is weakened: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2283621757
Ambipom preventing a Hitmonlee sweep in NU seasonal: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2288123694-ygeol6ukm7gkrvevrttj2fb30qgtf7zpw

 

[Ac1D]

Been a minute since I made a VR post, just gonna give quick thoughts on a few mons:

A -> A+
I know this mon just moved up but I would move it up again, STABs + Energy Ball is devastating. Plenty of great sets between Specs, Scarf, Calm Mind, 3 attacks with utility move (Will-O-Wisp, Taunt, Pain Split etc.). Trick utility with Choice item is really nice to cripple setup sweepers. Just a really good mon.

A -> A-
Great ability and good Choice Scarf user but this thing gets literally beaten by all the Steel types along with Alolan Muk; all of which are very good. Can often get turned into a U-turn bot in a lot of games, which is not ideal.

A -> A+ andA+ -> A
I am probably in the minority but I think Registeel is far better than Bronzong. The bulk difference really feels astronomical at times and Bronzong's Dark/Ghost weakness is a real hindrance. Registeel is also much better as an Iron Defense + Body Press anti HO answer due to it's superior Defense and also because it matches up better into some of the HO staples such as Cinccino which folds Bronzong after a boost and some chip. Registeel just feels much more sturdy as a special wall relative to Bronzong and although Bronzong has some neat tricks like Psychic Noise, it's not enough to justify it over Registeel for me.

A -> A-
Just feels far too weak a lot of the time. It gives nice compression with an Electric/Ground immunity and speed control, but can oftentimes fail to generate significant offensive pressure as it relies on Air Slash flinches or Hurricane landing to break things. Skill issue maybe.

B- -> B
Haven't used it but honestly has looked pretty solid from what I have seen in tournaments. Scarf set is a good revenge killer and CB has limited switch-ins. Of course still has pretty big issues with longevity but seems to be pretty solid in current meta.

There are a bunch of other things that should go down the VR like Alolan Sandslash, Orthworm etc. but I'm sure you guys know that already. Maybe I will make a follow up when the inevitable Cinccino suspect test happens.

 

[Rabia]

I personally still view Bronzong ahead of Registeel, but the drop of Amoonguss certainly helps Registeel out wrt Flygon and possibly is enough to convince me that a reliable Ground-immune Pokemon isn't as necessary as it had been for months past. I'm not overly opposed to Bronzong and Registeel being in the same subrank, but I really don't think Klefki should be below them? Maybe they're all A+ or A? I'd like to see more discussion on this.

Other random things that I think are worth talking about or implementing:

Rise please. Always necessary on hyper offense for the mirrors and it's so easy to support it with Scyther/Cinccino/Alolan Ninetales/etc. Only detriment I think worth speaking about is it requiring good team support to sweep, but I think what it offers in general to HO is invaluable.

It should drop at this point. Yeah the Taunt sets are good and whatnot, but this guy hasn't been present in the metagame for some time now and I don't see a reason for that to change. Choice Scarf sets are cool in theory because of how common offense is, but then you simply become the worst Pokemon ever in any matchup! I think this is the big negative for it; neither of its best sets are really consistent at all in general.

Possibly higher? Grassy Terrain is amazing and Thwackey is as mandatory a piece to it as can be.

Some discussion on these two goobers should be had, mostly about which is better. I think weirdly enough Pa'u has a notable niche for being better at Kee Berry and Grassy Seed sets thanks to the lack of a 4x Rock weakness, but Baile has some similarity to our banned bird friends in that Fire / Flying is generally just a better defensive typing (Pom-Pom) and it can make use of Revelation Dance far more easily (Sensu).

 

[Pokeslice]

Swampert B+ to A

Just wanted to pop in and reply to this, Swampert is the perfect definition of a B+ mon. Viable, niche, and not so splashable with direct competition. Leave it as is.

a reliable Ground-immune Pokemon isn't as necessary as it had been for months past.

I do think it’s about time to have the argument that Flygon might be A+ and not S. The drop of Tales and Amoonguss have done a lot to help building around Flygon, Scarf isn’t so great despite being splashable, and the Volt immune isn’t really needed currently until you roll into a Kilo. I do still think DD Flygon is insane and has a million ways to tech for answers and we’re probably ignoring it. I expected a fat team with a new teched out Flygon set from Elias by the next tournament.

 

[LessThanThreeMan]

Avalugg A+ -> A-
Good mon but I just think A+ was an overrate and with the cetitan ban it is less of a requirement now. Still the best spinner currently but it is abusable as it always has been.

Bronzong A+ -> A
Great mon, checks half the meta, but gets overwhelmed. As Rabia was saying above things like amoonguss do help the flygon matchup so i think Registeel and Bronzong should be the same sub rank, but I think that sub rank should be A. I could see klefki one below, but i've really been enjoying balloon keys recently. Could prove to be less useful post cetitan ban which is why i don't want to give an opinion on keys too early.

Kilowattrel A -> A-
I think this is just a bit overrated too. Fast, good stabs, but boots lacks power and life orb/specs really only fits on cincc HO. I think if cincc eventually leaves the boots set belongs more in the B+ range. Its just not a wallbreaker and boots kilo balances are usually lacking in firepower because of it.

Diancie A- -> A
Spdef is decent, but OTR is amazing both on HO and as anti-HO. Walled by bronzong but this meta is well prepared to pressure bronzong. Also on a side note tera fairy is really good on OTR. The weaknesses you want to lose are usually due the rock typing, diancie is bulky enough to eat the neutral hit usually, and it gives moonblast the bhoost. Other defensive teras are still valid of course, but I think fairy is the best tera there.

Inteleon A- -> B+
Agreed that its time for this to drop a little. Good and strong mon but we have so many good water immunes it can be tough to use (or requires running grass blast which is expensive.) Hard to get this thing in too since its so frail. Really feels like it either dominates a matchup or is a u turn bot.

Scream Tail A- -> A
I just think we have this underrated. CM booster scream has become a HO staple and it feels like it always gets a kill or two or at least makes important progress. Sometimes you may not want to run this alongside diancie, but i dont think there is anything wrong with running both either honestly.

Porygon2 B+ -> A-
Honestly kind of hate this thing lol. Very bulky, gets a ton of mileage out of trace, and i can't think of anything that breaks this well and also isn't massively screwed over by t wave (flygon doesn't count since it can catch an ice beam.)

Tornadus B+ > A
Big torn believer here. BU acro is really strong on HO (and defiant punishing intimidate is still relevant), nasty plot is very strong if you can hit some bleakwind storms (shoutouts big tony!) It has some great options as a mixed attacker as well with things like acro + knock + heat wave to hit lugg/steels too. Which set is it? Guess and hope you went to the right check! Not to mention the speed tier is phenomenal only slower than a couple mons in the meta.

I was going to nominate fire tauros up a rank to stand beside its wet counterpart, but part of that was due to its matchup into snow. I still think they are likely same sub-rank worthy, but I'd want to give it a little more time before making a nomination. Similarily I could see alotales dropping a touch post cetitan, but we will have to see how things develop in a nu without the ice whale with legs.

 

[Oofhixd]

I personally still view Bronzong ahead of Registeel, but the drop of Amoonguss certainly helps Registeel out wrt Flygon and possibly is enough to convince me that a reliable Ground-immune Pokemon isn't as necessary as it had been for months past. I'm not overly opposed to Bronzong and Registeel being in the same subrank, but I really don't think Klefki should be below them? Maybe they're all A+ or A? I'd like to see more discussion on this.

Other random things that I think are worth talking about or implementing:

Rise please. Always necessary on hyper offense for the mirrors and it's so easy to support it with Scyther/Cinccino/Alolan Ninetales/etc. Only detriment I think worth speaking about is it requiring good team support to sweep, but I think what it offers in general to HO is invaluable.

It should drop at this point. Yeah the Taunt sets are good and whatnot, but this guy hasn't been present in the metagame for some time now and I don't see a reason for that to change. Choice Scarf sets are cool in theory because of how common offense is, but then you simply become the worst Pokemon ever in any matchup! I think this is the big negative for it; neither of its best sets are really consistent at all in general.

Possibly higher? Grassy Terrain is amazing and Thwackey is as mandatory a piece to it as can be.

Some discussion on these two goobers should be had, mostly about which is better. I think weirdly enough Pa'u has a notable niche for being better at Kee Berry and Grassy Seed sets thanks to the lack of a 4x Rock weakness, but Baile has some similarity to our banned bird friends in that Fire / Flying is generally just a better defensive typing (Pom-Pom) and it can make use of Revelation Dance far more easily (Sensu).

i posted recently, but that was pre cet ban so im gonna drop my thoughts on these takes. Since a letter wasnt given, ill give one. A-. now this sounds absolutely insane, but gterrain is so amazing and this mon is essentially the whole team archetype unless you wanna use the unmon arboliva. there are the oris which are super nice on terrain, and some p big terrain abusers. semi-terrain also works as an archetype and a gain, thwackey is the mon you wanna use for it.

The birds. now neither of these birds are on the same level as sensu let alone pompom, but they are doing the same thing as sensu, running gseed, going tera steel, taunting the other mon and setting up. i believe that baile is the better forme due to the typing, and the fact it can spam
rev dance more effectively. pa’u still has its niches though! its nice into toxt, and doesnt have the x4 sr weakness, that being said, baile has super effective STAB into 3 of the top 6 mons, whilst pa’u has none. i personally like running these mons on terrain with gseed and cinccino to make up for the lack of boots. its a fun archetype, so with that being said, i would rank baile in A- and pa’u in B.

im gonna touch on something here, in my eyes, there are no S ranked mons in NU, sure cetitan is banned which helps flygon, but if you look in PU at the likes of arcanine and florges or in RU with the likes of slowbro and zapdos-galar. flygon doesnt reach that effect on the meta game, it is definitely the best A+ mon, but i just dont think it reaches S. (on another note if you have the criteria for an S tier mon lower, cinccino could fit into S alongside flygon)

alright thats all, feeling lousy some im not gonna do noms

 

[Serviperhater]

A+ -> A-
while it is our best form of hazard removal, it is also heavily abusable and is no longer needed on every team to combat cetitan. still a great mon but just not A+ levels of great.
A- -> A/A+
diancie is fairing extremely well for itself in this offense meta with its trick room offensive set; and despite being checked by bronzong, it can afford to be because bronzong is overwhelmed commonly in this meta. spdef also exsist and is good.
A- -> A it should be in the same tier as wetbull it’s just as good as wetbull is rn
B+ -> A-
flamigo has been doing really well on ladder and in tournaments. it’s one of the hardest mons to safely switch into with it’s amazing stab combo and scrappy. also with scarf has a good speed tier. best new scarf fighter.
UR -> B-/C
arcanine has been seeing use on cinncino hazard less ho for a while on ladder and in tournaments and is great priority for those teams definitely deserves to be on the vr
UR -> B-
hello Oricorio number 3. does the exact same things with a worse typing. can’t use revelation dance sets well like sensu could; but isn’t four times week to rock like baile so it can run an item like kee berry or grassy seed.
UR -> C
hello Oricorio number 4. much better typing + can run rev dance sets. extremely held back by rock weakness ;thus, reliance on boots. but cinncino can help remedy this weakness.

 

[Phantomistix]

Back with another update, the intermediate slate will go up 24 hours from this post. Make sure to post any nominations you want included before then, making sure to add replays for previously unranked pokemon.

Going forward, we'll aim to do these intermediate slates every 2 weeks or so, depending on how many nominations we get. Full slates will only happen after significant changes in the tier (a completely new archetype emerging, something getting banned, rises and drops, etc).

 

[Django]

Nomming Beartic (Beatrice)

With Cetitan gone, there's a free slot open on Snow HO teams. Beartic isn't as immediately threatening nor does it end games on the spot like Cetitan does, but it is an absurdly strong wallbreaker which busts open common defensive cores (e.g. Gligar / Vap / Steel type). With Veil support from Ninetales and removal from Cinccino it finds many opportunities to set up. It also can find alternative setup opportunities compared to Cetitan because it can afford to run Lum Berry, meaning it can easily switch into Thunder Wave and Scald and the like. The biggest downside is you actually get revenged killed by any Scarf mon, even under Snow.

I'd put Beartrice in a similar spot to Sandslash, maybe slightly lower. It needs multiple teammates to support it, and it's only role is on very HO. Would go B or B-.

Beartrice (Beartic) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Slush Rush
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 224 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Icicle Crash
- Close Combat
- Earthquake

This spread means you outspeed Kilo aka the entire tier unboosted. No need to run Jolly, so Adamant gives a lot of power and Lum let's you get +2 much more often. After +2 you're breaking through everything:

Vaporeon:
+2 252+ Atk Beartic Earthquake (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 235-277 (50.6 - 59.6%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ Atk Beartic Close Combat (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 282-332 (60.7 - 71.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Avalugg (Tera Ground and getting to +4 is normally the play here, depends how much chip you've taken whether you want to eat -1 Body Press):
+4 252+ Atk Beartic Close Combat (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg in Snow: 264-312 (67 - 79.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Swampert:
+2 252+ Atk Beartic Icicle Crash (85 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Swampert: 235-277 (58.1 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Bronzong:
+2 252+ Atk Beartic Close Combat (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Bronzong: 187-220 (55.3 - 65%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Registeel:
+2 252+ Atk Beartic Close Combat (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Registeel: 404-476 (110.9 - 130.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Tauros:
+1 252+ Atk Beartic Close Combat (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros-Paldea-Aqua: 207-244 (71.1 - 83.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Under Veil and Snow it also tanks so much stuff:
4 Atk Registeel Heavy Slam (40 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 28-34 (8.2 - 10%)
0 Def Registeel Body Press (80 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 66-78 (19.4 - 23%) -- possible 5HKO
0 SpA Vaporeon Scald (80 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 SpD Beartic with an ally's Aurora Veil: 56-66 (16.5 - 19.4%) -- possible 6HKO
252+ Def Avalugg Body Press (80 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 101-119 (29.7 - 35.1%) -- 16.4% chance to 3HKO
252+ Def Bronzong Body Press (80 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 72-85 (21.2 - 25%) -- 0.1% chance to 4HKO
0 Atk Bronzong Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 118-139 (34.8 - 41%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tauros-Paldea-Aqua Close Combat (120 BP) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 210-247 (61.9 - 72.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Technician Cinccino Tail Slap (185 BP) (5 hits) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Beartic in Snow with an ally's Aurora Veil: 100-120 (29.4 - 35.3%) -- approx. 9% chance to 3HKO

Replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2294128198-h3awoqh9s7015d24quu6sfmt3lyc1y3pw - beats klefki lugg
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2294325480-3etyyp5r9glwsgfci7gndq0kf9ai91wpw - breaks through plume and zong
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2294542538-pb65rs3fdiln4i9x0d72gkpktmvmd0upw - Breaks through zong lugg gastro
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2298028906-u4u7ki27n65px0kobr9ac13muv8us8jpw - Early game wall breaking
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2298558380-qnynxp6y4qoosnu5kwvoixd3jx8hsjapw - Beatrice opens up a defensive core
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2298769452-e4nwha9q6xbm9b9ij618p2q7vanve5gpw - Beatrice goes ham (and gets haxed)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2298976164-bb9g2ucay1r9xxmc8d6wnq5cw4hb7efpw - vs other offense

 

[lax]

Was surprised that my NUPL builds ended up working bc they were extremely vibes-based and generally under-appreciated mons in the tier given the VR

Hariyama should be A- at minimum and I’m shocked it wasn’t really used prior. Basically a hard counter to Vaporeon builds and being impossible to one shot besides Brave Birding which isn’t that common it seems.. In a 1 vs. 1 it can take on every mon from S - A- barring a couple (Tauros, Scyther) which is pretty wild. Its addition of Drain Punch is amazing and the 4th move after DrainKnockIce can be tailored to what’s a bigger threat to your team and what coverage you need. I never revealed Heavy Slam, but obviously it destroys all the Fairy types easily and can also EQ Globros after knocking their boots off. Knock is the best move in lower tiers since SWSH began, being the main way to dismantle bulkier teams and Yama is one of the best users in NU for sure.

Very surprised my boy isn’t ranked at all, but he is undefeated in NUPL while always putting in extreme work. Slap an AV and it becomes one of the best 1v1ers in the whole tier

Another standout for me is Duraladon, especially during the Hail rage, but apparently Cetitan is gone now so maybe that playstyle isn’t really relevant anymore. Regardless, being an amazing rocker vs Avalugg who’s somehow become the best hazard control (dex cuts really messing lower tiers up) and being an incredible tank with Eviolite while also having extremely powerful moves to spam makes it a lot more viable than it might seem initially. Mans can face tank a Flygon EQ like it’s nothing and its typing is clearly primo. It can prob go up a couple or a few placements

Last mon that deserves a mention is Cramorant. I don’t think it’s amazing like my usage with it suggests, but the niche it filled was amazing for me. The Tauroboys are incredible threats, and rarely have moveslots teched for Wild Charging the poor Cramorant. It definitely has a tiny bit of a niche in being obnoxious to deal with, but was def better when Shao was still around. Still, it’s absolutely worth just ranking it bc if you see one on the enemy team, it’s not a mon you can write off. You might be pissed that your BU Tauros ran into a nightmare MU lmao

All in all, I’m very surprised by how much fun I had playing NU! It’s my first time since very early SS and obv SM that I built my own teams consistently and I had a great time.

PLS use Yama more NUers.

 

[Rabia]

Agree on Duraludon rise despite Cetitan's ban. It still is one of offense's better answers to Cinccino and otherwise smokes every common removal option (Altaria, Avalugg, fuck Tentacruel too really).

Beartic should be ranked. It's kinda shit but in a cool way. Mostly just like Django said is a coverage demon and well, turns out Veil + snow is pretty helpful! I'd probably put it about B- because I do rate snowslash at least marginally higher than it.

Hariyama idk where the hell to put. It should be ranked but I'm not as sold on something like A- yet. I did like Belly Drum from my uses of it, definitely sucked running into 50 Steel-resistant mons tho... but AV is certainly legit. It at least should be on the VR.

 

[Heatranator]

UR -> C
Forgor about this one, but cramorant has been brought three times in NUCL, and has won all games. Combines gulp missile+rocky helmet to put out insane passive damage, while also being able to defog away hazards. At least, that's what I could tell from the replays.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9nu-813656
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9nu-814310
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9nu-815268

 

[Phantomistix]

Back again, this time with the intermediate slate, voting on everyone's noms. As always, you can find the slate here.

New Additions

Oricorio-Pa'u UR -> A- That bird that I hate tokyo drift.
Oricorio UR -> B That bird that I hate part IV.
Hariyama UR -> B- Has seen use as a generic spdef sponge with AV, can also act as a status absorber or setup sweeper.
Beartic UR -> B- Cetitan Lite.
Cramorant UR -> C Has seen some use as an answer to either of the Paldean Tauros forms that can also defog.
Dipplin UR -> C Niche option for stall.
Golurk UR -> C He can break and stealth rock ig.

Rises

Munkidori A -> A+ By far the best scarfer in the tier, very flexible pokemon that partners very well with lots of other top threats.
Registeel A -> A+ Established as the best steel with great flexibility in EVs and coverage. Setup sets (ID+BP, Curse) are popping up a lot more.
Diancie A- -> A+ OTR can completely invalidate a lot of offense structures, defensive sets are seeing more use.
Scream Tail A- -> A One of the few defensive tools that can check all the fighting types, offensive sets are still very threatening, especially with Cetitan's ban freeing up a spot on HO.
Flamigo B+ -> A- Solidifying its place as other fighting types (Wetbull, Toxicroak) fall out of favor.
Swampert B+ -> A- Correcting the mistakes of last slate, I am accepting apologies on behalf of Swampert.
Duraludon B- -> B Very good anti HO tool with great disrupting options and very good bulk with eviolite, while still dealing respectable damage.

Drops

Avalugg A+ -> A Not as important now that Cetitan is gone, still a very respectable option and our best removal.
Bronzong A+ -> A Everyone and their moms is building to beat Bronzong.
Inteleon A- -> B+ He U-Turned out of A- to B+ (U-Turn bot).
Tornadus B+ -> B Rain hasn't been seen in a while, has seen some use outside rain as a niche option on offense.
Palossand B- -> UR No one has used this thing since July.
Espeon C -> UR Most HO default to Cinccino as their hazard control option, psychic terrain hasn't seen usage since Ladder Tour.
Whimsicott C -> UR

 

[Lucario]

The current VR feels very bloated, so I will be nomming several Pokemon down a few tiers, if not UR. There are also some Pokemon in higher tiers that aren't high enough. We might be speedrunning these...
First, we do the drops:
--> UR
Let's be real, manual weather teams have not been real since Alolan Ninetales dropped. Psychic Terrain is not worthy of a ranking at all due to Grassy Terrain's dominance in that department. Minior is just... okay? Idk why you'd use it over Drednaw or Scyther. You're not using Vileplume anymore. The only people that are using Vileplume are using outdated sample teams. I'm the biggest Wo-Chien hater of all time. He is a momentum sink that loses to the mention of U-turn. He also just sucks in this offensive meta, especially into teams with Alolan Ninetales.

--> C
Orthworm sees a niche once every 3 months. Unfortunately, its niche was banned a few weeks ago, rip to our wormy boy, we will see you again in April or May. Tentacruel is a really good Pokemon that suffers from being NU a gen too late... Maybe if it could fit on more teams it would be better, or if Vileplume existed. Again, let's be real, you are not using Dragalge. Slow pivot is great but like, why would you use it as a Poison-type over the abundance of other ones? I want someone to prove me wrong on Dragalge though. Webs aren't great rn, we are seeing more and more Cinc HO, Snow, Terrain, and even Froslass HO, Galv is just not him anymore. Rotom-H in a way is like Dragalge, I want it to be good, it should be good, but it sees very little use. Just like Vileplume, you are only using Tsareena if you are loading Shengineer's Croak Stack team, which again, is outdated. Tsareena wants to run both bulky and offensive at the same time, as well as 50 moves at once. Avalugg is a better spinner while some Defog users are slightly better.

--> B-
I wanted to add Infernape to this list but I know I'd get 10 responses saying it's good and that I should trust y'all. There are a lot of Fighting-types that are good atm, Breloom is not one of them. He's too slow to do anything meaningful and can't switch into anything without taking Spikes damage + 40% from everything else. Chandelure is such a beat of a mon that Hisuian Typh wishes it could be. Hisuian Typhlosion isn't bulky enough to do SubCM stuff, isn't fast enough to outspeed much else, and isn't strong enough to break through resists, it also lacks a good ability. Florges could be really good right now, but it lacks usage to prove anything. Besides, defensive Fairy-types aren't great when the things they are supposed to check checks them.

--> B
I have one thing to say about all 4 of these Pokemon. They might be decent in the meta right now, but they are not on the same level as the rest of the Pokemon in B+. They all require a lot of support or are outclassed too heavily.

The rest of the ranks are good enough, so now onto the rises:
--> S
You have seen what I have to say about this Pokemon before. Cinccino defines HO like Slowbro once defined Balance. Cinccino is such a great and splashable Pokemon, it isn't a one-trick pony. Cincinno enables so many Pokemon like Scyther, Alolan Ninetales, Kee Berry Oricorio-P/F, Weakness Policy Incineroar, Tornadus, and so much more. I'd argue that the rise of Diancie has a lot to do with Cincinno. Give this mon the recognition it deserves.

--> A+
Amoonguss is such a great wall that pairs well with most defensive staples. Taking on most, if not all physical wallbreakers is a great feat for something as flexible as Amoonguss. Not to mention Stun Spore is broken. Idk why Bronzong fell, it's arguably a top 3 Pokemon and the best Steel-type Pokemon. Sure, teams are prepping for it hard right now, but teams are also prepping hard for Flygon and Munkidori, yet they're still high up. Chandelure and Porygon-Z are some broken mfs that are very hard to wall and support balance and offense structures very nicely. The rise of SubCM Chandelure and Bulky Porygon-Z allows these mons to adapt to whatever changes may happen, whether its Gastrodon or Vaporeon, they'll find ways to break through everything. Gastrodon is also a very great defensive staple right now. Spikes are broken and being able set them up and not lose to Water-types is very nice. Flamigo is an odd one, if it isn't A+ worthy then it belongs in A for sure. Choice Scarf is very great, clicking Close Combat with no immunity is insane, especially when your other STAB breaks through your supposed-to-be check Amoonguss.

--> A-
Porygon2 is a fantastic wall that never dies. Copying abilities and walling Pokemon like Chandelure, Toxtricity, and Amoonguss is very useful. The only issue with it is it's weird to fit on teams because it's a Normal-type. Thwackey and his Grassy Terrain enabling The Stupid Birds That I Hate should not be alongside Infernape in B or below Inteleon in B+.

--> Higher
Dudunsparce suffers the same issue as Porygon2, it's hard to fit on a team. However, once it is on a team it does really well. Having Stealth Rock, Glare, AND recovery all while tanking hits from Chandelure and other special wallbreakers is crazy. Houndstone is also weird to put on teams, but having a bulky Ghost-type that sits on Cinccino and several other HO mons is really nice. Denying Rapid Spin in a meta which only has 2 Spinners is niche, but very great.

 

[LessThanThreeMan]

Back again, this time with a full slate to represent the meta after the new toys have simmered for a while and the meta settled following the Mienshao suspect (and Sensu ban). We'll be voting on any noms as they come in from now onwards so make sure to post those here in the thread. As always, you can find the full slate here.

New Additions

Flamigo UR -> B+ Following Mienshao's ban, it's natural to start exploring other options to fill its place. Flamigo has always seen use, but previously there was too much opportunity cost to ever justify a high ranking on the VR since using it meant dropping Mienshao. While not as strong and centralizing as Mienshao was, it's still a solid option with a better Amoonguss matchup too.
Scovillain UR -> C Manual sun has seen some usage, and Scovillian is a key part of any successful variation of the archetype.

Rises

Avalugg A -> A+ Has solidified itself as a core part of balance structures as a huge benefactor of Snow's omnipresence, one of the only pokemon with a consistent matchup into Cetitan.
Basculegion A -> A+ As Rabia said, sub Basculegion is cheating.
Ninetales-Alola A -> A+ Veil HO has picked up heavy steam, and A9 has solidified itself outside that playstyle on more traditional offense and balance builds with its deep movepool and versatility.
Cinccino A- -> A+ Core pokemon on virtually every single non-terrain HO (and even some terrain HOs too). Extremely good at keeping hazards off and chipping down teams for its partners.
Amoonguss A- -> A It's a fighting check that no longer loses the the best fighting type in the tier now that Mienshao is gone.
Cetitan A- -> A This mon is always a threat. While it does need many things to go right to truly sweep teams, it still forces opponents to play by its rules to avoid a sweep. Even then, it's capable of trading itself for one or more key pieces.
Chandelure A- -> A There is NOTHING in the tier that can switch into this mon with full confidence, whether that be due to fearing a Trick or just massive damage. Held back from being truly insane by its mediocre speed tier and weakness to hazards.
Registeel A- -> A
Gastrodon B+ -> A Extremely positive Toxicroak matchup, very good role compression and flexibility with 2 amazing abilities and a deep supportive movepool.
B+ -> A- Better snow matchup than Wetbull, better offensive typing and profile, wisp is an amazing tool to have.
Altaria B -> B+ No longer has to fear Mienshao's Triple Axel. Best Amoonguss switchin in the tier.
Porygon2 B -> B+ Was underranked in our previous slate, has established itself as a very consistent and flexible defensive tool.
Sandslash-Alola B -> B+ Provides great flexiblity and role compression to Snow teams as it can set hazards, remove them and also act as an abuser.
Scrafty B -> B+ As the meta slows down post Mienshao ban, Scrafty gets more freedom to beat up on slower builds.
Ditto B- -> B+ HO gaining more use = ditto gets better.
Infernape B- -> B An option that has seen a lot more exploration as a replacement to Mienshao. Has some flexibility with support moves like Stealth Rock, Switcheroo and others.
Duraludon C -> B- An option that has seen more usage due to its very positive matchup into Cinccino and Terrain HO. Provides some very decent role compression.

Drops

Incineroar A+ -> A Options like Sticky Hold Gastro, the intimidate immune Flamigo and others are popping up. Not the same catch all spdef check it once was, but still a very solid, top option.
Tauros-Paldea-Aqua A+ -> A More people are considering dropping it for its Fiery brother. While it does have a better defensive typing in Water, it's only a very slight improvement. Wisp is often a much better 4th move than Aqua Jet. Also very stinky into A9. See you in A- next slate buddy!
Toxicroak A -> A- Gastrodon picking up steam hurts it massively. Very susceptible to chip and despite having a good defensive typing, has extremely fake bulk.
Milotic A- -> B+ Gastrodon and Vaporeon have established themselves as the premier options, leaving Milo in the dust.
Swampert A- -> B+ I honestly have no idea why this dropped. If anything, this mon has only gotten better recently. Btw use spdef sets they're great!
Sylveon A- -> B+ Much less popular compared to other special breakers, new fairy type competiton in A9.
Typhlosion-Hisui A- -> B Go use Chandelure.
Breloom B+ -> B Amoonguss sends his regards.
Tentacruel B+ -> B Vileplume has disappeared from the meta, other hazard removal options are also much better and more consistent.
Torterra B+ -> B One trick pony that's outsped by scarf Flygon at +2. Maybe when the Drey77 set picks up it will see more usage.
Dragalge B -> B- 3 months late ngl, this mon is so bad it makes Danny's hairline look pristine.
Galvantula B -> B- Cinccino is this thing's worst nightmare.
Kingdra B -> B- It's the winter, it's snowing not raining.
Ludicolo B -> B- ^
Vileplume B -> C Go use Amoonguss.
Abomasnow B- -> UR Go use A9.
Dudunsparce B- -> C
Whimsicott B- -> C Go use Amoonguss.
Wo-Chien B- -> C
Coalossal C -> UR
Grimmsnarl C -> UR
Rotom-Mow C -> UR Hasn't seen usage since SS was cg.
Sandaconda C -> UR
Sceptile C -> UR Can you believe Tuthur voted for this trash to stay ranked lol. Shameful behaviour.

I think we forgot to remove Oricorio-Sensu, it is still listed in B- even though it's currently NUBL of course

 

[Rabia]

Idk why Bronzong fell

Bronzong fell in my eyes because Registeel and Klefki just aren't worse enough than it to justify it being higher on the VR. Part of this is because the tier has adapted to Bronzong's presence, which naturally leads to its competition seeing more use if they aren't so vulnerable to what the tier techs to beat it. Biggest example I can think of is Cinccino, though, given its just far more prevalent than anything else in the tier right now and beats Bronzong far more successfully than it does Klefki and Registeel. e: Porygon-Z is also major here lol.

It's worth mentioning too Registeel's superior bulk is getting a lot more appreciation now. I think I covered it in a video but the bulk difference is something wack like .75:1 as a ratio between Bronzong and Registeel. With Flygon's slight dropoff too the Ground weakness just isn't as big a deal anymore. I think Bronzong is clearly still amazing; it's just not anywhere close to the best Steel-type anymore. In the VR chat I mentioned how I'd be fine if Klefki and Registeel had just risen to A+ themselves too; so long as all three are in the same subrank, it's fine imo.

 

[emikatana]

Hi it's me Emi! Here are the latest gems I have pulled out of the heap of low tier shitmons, and why I believe they should be ranked on the VR. Sorry for writing an essay, you don't need to read the whole thing lmao. Also, I agree with a lot of what Lucario said, except I do disagree about unranking weather mons. I think they still have a niche, and Sun/Rain is still a viable archetype, thus the weather sweepers should remain ranked. In fact, I actually think semi-Sun is quite underrated, as the tier is not at all prepared for the sun sweepers and Alolatales hates switching into their Fire-type moves. I've found success on ladder with a team of one sun setter combined with two abusers, in my case Venusaur and Scovillain. The tier is really not prepared to deal with their Fire/Grass attacks, since nothing else in the meta has that sort of coverage.

C -> B+

Golurk is an extremely lethal wallbreaker in the NU tier and definitely deserves to be at least B+ on the VR. A good defensive type combination in Ghost/Ground gives it three immunities to common attacking types, and lets Golurk entirely wall Toxtricity. It also resists Stealth Rocks, which many other wallbreakers such as Staraptor are weak to. However, Golurk's offensive capabilities are where it shines, with powerful Stabs in Poltergeist and Earthquake, and strong coverage such as Dynamic Punch, Stone Edge, and Ice Punch. These moves, empowered by Golurk's high Attack stat and a Choice Band, make Golurk nigh impossible to reliably switch into, meaning that whenever Golurk comes into the field, it is extremely dangerous. Golurk's typing allows it many opportunities to switch in, whether it be on Choice locked Fighting types such as Flamigo and the Tauros formes, Volt Switches from Electric pivots, or Thunder Wave/Body Press from various walls and supports. Golurk is definitely slow, but it has enough speed with some investment to outspeed most walls and slow pivots, such as Vaporeon, Incineroar, and Registeel. I personally prefer 132 Speed EVs, which lets Golurk outspeed base 65s such as Vapo and Alolaslash, even if they are speed creeping. However, Golurk can definitely run more EVs to outspeed stuff like uninvested Tsareena and Klefki. 244 Speed EVs is the most you'll likely need, as this allows Golurk to outspeed uninvested Gligar, the fastest relevant wall in NU. Even the bulkiest physical wall in NU, Avalugg, still takes nearly half from Dynamic Punch pre-Tera, meaning with a little chip, even Avalugg cannot switch into Golurk reliably. All in all, Golurk is a very threatening wallbreaker with amazing typing and coverage moves, that definitely deserves to be ranked in the same tiers as other wallbreakers, such as Porygon-Z, Copperajah, Breloom, and Heracross.

Golurk calcs

252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Eviolite Gligar: 139-165 (41.6 - 49.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Amoonguss: 258-304 (59.7 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Registeel: 366-432 (100.5 - 118.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Bronzong: 504-594 (149.1 - 175.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Dynamic Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 160-190 (40.6 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Diancie: 366-432 (120.3 - 142.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Incineroar: 380-450 (96.6 - 114.5%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 280-331 (60.3 - 71.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Scream Tail: 576-680 (132.7 - 156.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Golurk Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Bellibolt: 398-470 (94.3 - 111.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

Golurk-specific replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2305030425-4iym3t6io4y29i1xp7jueeo685nv0ljpw?p2

Golurk forces KOs whenever it comes in

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2305616880-h3ibhg4uowwwkkvabkta4hh7432ggbjpw?p2

Golurk kinda just 6-0s

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2306221715?p2

Golurk nails Gligar with an Ice Punch on turn 6, breaking the defensive core

B- -> A-

Rotom-Heat is a very solid mon in NU. Despite many people saying it is a remnant of an outdated meta, it is actually a very good anti-meta pick in the current NU tier. With it's 4x weakness to Ground nullified by Levitate, it's Electric/Fire typing becomes a very good defensive type. Additionally, it is one of the only Volt Switchers that Ground types do not want to switch in to. There are around 6 viable Ground types in NU, and none of them want to switch into Rotom-Heat. Flygon, Swampert, Golurk, and Rhydon do not want to get Burned by Will-o-Wisp, especially since Rotom-Heat outspeeds all of them except for Flygon. Gligar cannot effectively threaten Rotom-Heat and just gets chipped by Overheat, and Gastrodon almost never runs a Water move, and thus most sets cannot threaten Rotom-Heat. While it is forced to run Boots, it can slot Pain Split for some longevity, or can also fit Nasty Plot to be a threatening wallbreaker, doing massive damage to even resists like Flygon or physically defensive Swampert. Rotom-Heat's unique typing and mixed bulk allows it to wall many NU staples, such as Diancie once it has used Power Herb, Alolan Ninetales, Kilowattrel, Copperajah, Scyther, and others. All in all, Rotom-Heat is a very good anti-meta mon, serving both a defensive and offensive role, while being a very consistent pivot with little counterplay, making it worthy of a higher ranking.

Rotom-Heat calcs against Ground-type "checks"

+2 252+ SpA Rotom-Heat Overheat vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Flygon: 240-282 (79.7 - 93.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ SpA Rotom-Heat Overheat vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Swampert: 219-258 (54.2 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ SpA Rotom-Heat Overheat vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Gligar: 381-448 (114 - 134.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

UR -> C

Whimsicott did not deserve to get unranked. It has several viable niches in NU that definitely warrant a place on the VR. Firstly, it is the best Tailwind setter for Tailwind teams, with Prankster Tailwind and good pivot moves with UTurn and Memento. More importantly, it has a niche as a physically defensive support on balance teams. Whimsicott's unique typing of Grass/Fairy gives it a very useful defensive profile, resisting common Dark, Water, Ground, and Fighting type attacks, and being immune to Flygon's threatening Dragon-type attacks. It has a versatile support movepool, with Prankster Taunt, Encore, Leech Seed, Switcheroo, and Stun Spore, letting it perform several roles such as speed control, checking setup sweepers, and crippling walls. It checks important physical threats in the meta, such as many Flygon sets, Basculegion, Breloom, non-Guts Heracross, Raikou, Specs Inteleon, Swampert, and the Tauros formes. It also has the rare Fairy typing, doing decent damage with Moonblast to Fighting- and Dragon-types. Additionally, a Specs set can be run, since Whimsicott, unlike other Fairy-type attackers like Alolatales and Sylveon, it has Switcheroo and Uturn, giving it better utility and letting it keep momentum on offensive teams. All in all, Whimsicott is a versatile Pokemon with multiple niches and viable sets, making it very much deserving of a spot on the VR.

UR -> B-

Jolteon is often hated on in NU, with many saying it's a worse version of Raikou and Kilo. However, I believe that Jolteon is a very underrated mon. People always look at Jolteon and see Volt Absorb and CM Electric type and stuff, the same stuff that Kilo and Raikou do. But what people fail to see is what Jolteon has that they don't. Namely, Quick Feet. Quick Feet Flame Orb Jolteon is extremely threatening, being both an incredibly fast pivot and speed control, but also being a dangerous setup sweeper and cleaner. Quick Feet Jolteon is able to run Modest, which provides it more raw power than both other Electric options, making it better at revenge killing. However, it certaintly has downsides, namely the severe lack of coverage forcing it to run Tera Blast Ice to be an effective sweeper. I feel, though, that this is a small price to pay for what Jolteon provides, namely amazing role compression with fast speed control and cleaning power. While skeptics might be concerned about the Burn from Flame Orb dealing residual damage, Jolteon often only clicks Volt Switch, meaning it takes no damage from the Burn on that turn. Additionally, the Burn is very valuable, preventing Jolteon from getting Paralysed and crippled when Tera'd, which other sweepers are vulnerable to. It is incredibly difficult to stop Jolteon from running circles around your team, especially if you lack Spdef Gastro or Swampert.

UR -> B

Hisuian Avalugg is a premier lead option for HO, especially as an anti-lead to the most common lead, Cinccino. Unlike Cinccino, Hisuian Avalugg can set hazards as well as removing them. This fixes the main weakness of Cinccino, that being a lack of hazards on the opponent's side as well, which means Cinccino teams lose out on entry hazard damage that HO teams need to break Sashes and chip walls for easier KOs. While HAvalugg is very slow, it has great physical bulk, which makes it impossible for Cinccino to break through it, as well as a built-in Focus Sash in Sturdy, allowing it to always live a hit to get hazards up, as well as run Custap Berry to outspeed once it gets low. HAvalugg also has amazing raw power, using Mountain Gale for massive damage against any offensive mons switching in, while Rock Blast lets it OHKO opposing Focus Sash leads such as Galvantula and Froslass. While it has a terrible defensive typing in Ice/Rock, with Sturdy and a Custap Berry, HAvalugg can consistently get a hazard advantage even when faced with super effective attacks. This niche as a great HO counter-lead make

Replays

Most replays feature multiple mons.

Replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2303868677-vwk3aipcywmg79ux54d5sj87eyygk08pw

Jolteon pivots early and cleans up with Tera lategame.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2303858839-oxuv5n7fbbpug42fx2a8msaifjrg6y8pw

Golurk does 67% to Milotic and comes in repeatedly for free on Registeel. The threat of Jolteon's Ice Blast means Flygon cannot risk staying in against it, meaning Jolteon repeatedly gets free chip damage on Registeel.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2304447875?p2

Whimsicott's utility with Prankster Encore and UTurn is vital in preventing sweeps from Heracross, Raikou, and Cinccino.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2305103501-kh3ofy9da68f3emc8ucb8g81cv334hmpw

Golurk has no switch ins when it predicts correctly

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2306036831-d9d8ff3wrllmcxtgk8qba8mgpb9qr1jpw

Golurk gets multiple kills on opposing walls, while Whimsicott is crucial in letting it get in (also checks Banded Waterbull) and Jolteon is really annoying

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2306298133-ea4bcthyo4w62y79x9178q4rqgs1v2qpw

Golurk KOs Houndstone from full, while Whimsicott helps break through a Toxic stall Salazzle, and Jolteon cleans up with Calm Mind

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2306396461

Rotom-Heat just bullies Swampert, a mon that on paper is meant to check it, leaving the opposing team with no Electric switch-in.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2306400135

Rotom-Heat checks a Curse AMuk at +3, while Golurk hard counters a Specs Toxtricity and has no switch ins.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nu-2306404274

Rotom-Heat checks 5/6 mons on the opposing team, and is a massive pain with Pain Split. Whimsicott checks Flygon and gets an emergency Stun Spore on Alolan Ninetales.

 

[Kin+ak (✧∇✧)]

lets Golurk entirely wall Toxtricity

Actually Toxtricity can use Snarl and 2HKO or smt like that with throat spray or specs.

The HAvalugg nom is heat tho

-> B-
I feel like dudun has the merit of being extremely deadly if you make as much as one single mistake Because it's so Bulky ans threatening with CM and STAB Boomburst