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Defining the NU Tier
- Thread starter Age of Kings
- Start date
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ignoring the last 3 pages of arguing, is phione allowed in this?
Yes it is. ^_^
I didn't even look at the last few pages, so. Let's just drop the whole "flawed" debate and keep this organized and civil.
We're hosting it off-site, so it's still going on.
It'll be fixed as soon as the ladder is up and there's lots of cycles and stuff, but don't direct those questions here.
I apologize for bumping this thread, but it's important. There's a news section now!
djkhdjhuiewhejkh I've been so busy with school and everything. This is letting everyone know that sign-ups are extended to Wednesday, September 23rd. I apologize to everyone who's been excited and anticipating tomorrow! However, come hail or high water, that Thursday, Round 1 pairings will be assigned. So that's the definite day.
Once again, sorry, and good luck to everyone!
djkhdjhuiewhejkh I've been so busy with school and everything. This is letting everyone know that sign-ups are extended to Wednesday, September 23rd. I apologize to everyone who's been excited and anticipating tomorrow! However, come hail or high water, that Thursday, Round 1 pairings will be assigned. So that's the definite day.
Once again, sorry, and good luck to everyone!
But Skiddle, we have a calendar and a news section D:
I think your opponent will PM you, though xD
I think your opponent will PM you, though xD
Ha, Magikarp could even be in UU/Bl. Just give it a Focus Sash and Flail.
I have a quick question though, what is Limbo?
Pokemon that should definetly be NU
NU List
Ariados
Banette
Bastiodon
Beedrill
Butterfree
Castform
Chatot
Cherrim
Chimecho
Corsola
Delcatty
Delibird
Ditto
Dustox
Electrode
Farfetch'd
Fearow
Furret
Girafarig
Huntail
Kricketune
Ledian
Linoone
Lumineon
Luvdisc
Magcargo
Masquerain
Mawile
Mightyena
Mothim
Minun
Parasect
Pachirisu
Purugly
Raticate
Seaking
Spinda
Stantler
Sunflora
Swalot
Torkoal
Unown
Volbeat
Whiscash
Wigglytuff
Wormadam
NU List
Ariados
Banette
Bastiodon
Beedrill
Butterfree
Castform
Chatot
Cherrim
Chimecho
Corsola
Delcatty
Delibird
Ditto
Dustox
Electrode
Farfetch'd
Fearow
Furret
Girafarig
Huntail
Kricketune
Ledian
Linoone
Lumineon
Luvdisc
Magcargo
Masquerain
Mawile
Mightyena
Mothim
Minun
Parasect
Pachirisu
Purugly
Raticate
Seaking
Spinda
Stantler
Sunflora
Swalot
Torkoal
Unown
Volbeat
Whiscash
Wigglytuff
Wormadam
Yes to both.
Responding to the other posts in a moment...
@Ryu: Limbo is the proposed tier between UU and NU, which functions as a NU BL. All Pokemon who do not fall in the top 75% of UU, but considered too overpowered for NU, will fall into Limbo.
@Roserade Raider: At this time, we're just using everything outside of UU's top 75%....we will ban as necessary until we come up with a good list.
Electrode is UU according to the stats, so... =/ I don't see how it could be "NU".
Minun but not Plusle. Why?
You want to define the NU tier? Okay.
The NU tier is a list of all Pokemon that are not in the Uber, OU, BL and UU tiers. If a ban list for NU is created, then NU would not have the Pokemon in this ban list as well.
So really, the question is not how to define the NU tier, but how to define all the other tiers. NU would then have the simplest definition of all: it'll be the remaining Pokemon.
OU and UU would be defined in the same way as per usage statistics. Their size is the only subjective thing about them (the "how rare is rare?" problem), but, other than that, they're completely objective tiers.
What aren't settled are the Uber tier, BL tier and, if it's going to exist, the ban list for NU. These take much longer to settle as they're not mostly objective, like OU and UU, but mostly subjective. I've been researching for a long time to try to objectify these tiers as much as possible, but I'll be the first person to state (with objective proof) that this is impossible to do completely. The Base Stats Ratings and the average damage that all the types take are a start in this direction, but, in the end, someone must take a definitive stance at some point and say "these Pokemon are Uber/BL/(banned from NU), and you must accept these tiers no questions asked". Yes, either that will happen, or else these tiers will never be stable.
The NU tier is a list of all Pokemon that are not in the Uber, OU, BL and UU tiers. If a ban list for NU is created, then NU would not have the Pokemon in this ban list as well.
So really, the question is not how to define the NU tier, but how to define all the other tiers. NU would then have the simplest definition of all: it'll be the remaining Pokemon.
OU and UU would be defined in the same way as per usage statistics. Their size is the only subjective thing about them (the "how rare is rare?" problem), but, other than that, they're completely objective tiers.
What aren't settled are the Uber tier, BL tier and, if it's going to exist, the ban list for NU. These take much longer to settle as they're not mostly objective, like OU and UU, but mostly subjective. I've been researching for a long time to try to objectify these tiers as much as possible, but I'll be the first person to state (with objective proof) that this is impossible to do completely. The Base Stats Ratings and the average damage that all the types take are a start in this direction, but, in the end, someone must take a definitive stance at some point and say "these Pokemon are Uber/BL/(banned from NU), and you must accept these tiers no questions asked". Yes, either that will happen, or else these tiers will never be stable.
Generaly, I agreed with the list, exepting Agrron, and articuno.
Yeah, cuno has a 4x weakness, and sucky movepools. But, it can make awesomness from what little it has.
Amazing GARCHOMP FREAKING COUNTER. Survives hits and hits with ice shard. Think suicune with roost.
Aggron. Metal burst, nuff said.
Yeah, cuno has a 4x weakness, and sucky movepools. But, it can make awesomness from what little it has.
Amazing GARCHOMP FREAKING COUNTER. Survives hits and hits with ice shard. Think suicune with roost.
Aggron. Metal burst, nuff said.
Just saw my post after a couple of days...
Pika 25- meant to put plusle down, kinda forgot...
Everyone else- sorry if my post was a waste of space :( I'm not very experienced at pokemon in general.
Pika 25- meant to put plusle down, kinda forgot...
Everyone else- sorry if my post was a waste of space :( I'm not very experienced at pokemon in general.
For one, Garchomp is uber, so let's not beat that dead horse again, shall we? Anyways, if Articuno and Aggron were so awesome, wouldn't they be used more? The whole point of usage based tiers is to objectify what in the past was a subjective listing. If Aggron and Articuno aren't used enough to be OU or UU, they must not be as good as you say they are, or else they would be used more. The problem may not even be that, it could be that they're completely outclassed in tiers. As a physical tank, Gliscor outclasses Aggron by a mile in typing, stats, and movepool. As for Articuno, it's typing hinders it, and Pokemon like Cresselia, Celebi, and Zapdos do it's job better. In UU, Steelix outclasses Aggron even more now because of Curse and Gyro Ball; Altaria has much better typing and movepool than Articuno. So how can you say these Pokemon deserve to be higher than NU/NU Banlist when they aren't used enough to prove it?
First of all, the fact that Garchomp is uber and that Articuno is a great counter is what his original point was (not that I agree with it). Secondly, we will be banning certain Pokemon from NU for being too powerful, so saying that "if it's not used enough in UU it HAS to be NU!" is completely pointless and undermines the entire point of this thread.
Yeah seriously, who would want to play Pokemon "for fun" rofl.Aldaron said:
Go look at UU for a second and how broken it is, tennisace, or how much "arbitrary fixing" had to be done to OU before it was even playable. Usage-based tiering is still a fallacy this place needs to drop.
Anyway, we were talking about that NU list, which is flat-out junk. Just look at some of the matchups the pokemon on it will completely define.
Banette:What that isn't a Normal type in NU can take a STAB hit from this? Mightyena after an Intimidate?
Bastiodon: Oh HELL NO. This thing sees plenty of play in UU, and what's ever going to break it in NU?
Huntail: Swift swim, tons of attacking power, physically bulky. Honestly, what more do you NEED? Okay, it can't take hits on the special side, but if it's built right it won't need to very often, as it can set up on the switch, outspeed, and kill a lot of NU's special attackers.
Torkoal: You want to put the Heatran of UU into NU? O_o This guy sees a lot of play; he's no Camerupt but he has his role. For one thing, spinning.
For once, I agree with X-Act, he's actually making sense: the higher tiers' designs need to be finalized. Or at least started. :p
Anyway, we were talking about that NU list, which is flat-out junk. Just look at some of the matchups the pokemon on it will completely define.
Banette:What that isn't a Normal type in NU can take a STAB hit from this? Mightyena after an Intimidate?
Bastiodon: Oh HELL NO. This thing sees plenty of play in UU, and what's ever going to break it in NU?
Huntail: Swift swim, tons of attacking power, physically bulky. Honestly, what more do you NEED? Okay, it can't take hits on the special side, but if it's built right it won't need to very often, as it can set up on the switch, outspeed, and kill a lot of NU's special attackers.
Torkoal: You want to put the Heatran of UU into NU? O_o This guy sees a lot of play; he's no Camerupt but he has his role. For one thing, spinning.
For once, I agree with X-Act, he's actually making sense: the higher tiers' designs need to be finalized. Or at least started. :p
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