Gen VII: Pokemon Sun and Moon Discussion MKII

[Kilgrave]

Well nobody saw these coming.

Alola forms pretty much confirm that Game Freak have scrapped Mega Evolutions. I'm just gonna give my opinions on all the new stuff.

Exeggutor lel

Alolan Exeggutor:

Jesus Christ. It looks like it ate a lampost. Although Grass/Dragon is interesting, Ice Shard is gonna blow it back XD. I like how GF tried to make it look like an actual palm tree, I guess it could be worse. Doesn't change the fact that it is ugly. Will there be an Alolan Exeggcute???

Alolan Vulpix/Ninetales:

I really love Vulpix and Ninetales, and these look even more beautiful than the originals. I am getting an Alolan Ninetales on my team.

Aolan Sandshrew/Sandslash:

They are basically just white. I like them though, and Ice/Steel is an interesting typing.

Oricorio:

It's a bird that dances. Really like it. That ability is going to screw over half of the setup sweepers in the game.

Minior:

When I first saw it, I was like 'ew'. Then I saw the middle and died. Dem eyes doe.

Gumshoos:

DONALD TRUMP. If you thought that Yungoos looked like him say hello to the exact copy.

Fomantis and Lurantis:

Looks cool. Shame its got a crappy ability.

Mudbray:

The cutest donkey I have seen in my life.

Z Moves:

Rip Mega Evolution (I'm gonna cry myself to sleep tonight). The poses are stupid. And seriously, the grass type one is called BLOOM DOOM.

 

[TheMantyke]

In other news: Alolan Exeggutor's fourth head is... kind of cute?

As cute as a decapitated Noki spliced with a Gulpin can get I suppose.

In all seriousness, I love the new Exeggutor so much and makes me eager to see what other Pokemon get regional make overs. Can't really even express how much I love the trailer.

 

[Count Bleck]

...Hmm Guys? Here's another thing I found. The 4 dancing birds confirmed the rumor of the legendary hawaain legends.

Each type of bird lives on a different island. their type changes depend on the nectar of the flowers they drink. They are Fire, Ghost, Psychic, and Electric types. Didnt the rumor also say the remaining legens would also be these types?

 

[Karxrida]

Can we shut up with the ludicrous assumption that Megas have been scrapped? The worst that's probably happening is that they're postgame only.

Also, another news dump confirmed to be happening on the 12th.

http://nintendoeverything.com/next-pokemon-sunmoon-news-update-coming-on-august-12/

 

[zferolie]

Ok all this info was pretty amazing. I came in just expecting some new pokemon and got a whole lot more.

New forms: They all look pretty cool, and I love the idea... I don't know how it too so long for something like this to happen though. Why wouldn't have this happened in other regions as well? Maybe they were still pretty close? Who knows. I do wonder if they do Remalke Gen 4(which given the track record they will), if that will expand on new forms, since that Gen did kinda start it with Shellos. My favorite in Ninetails, it looks so beautiful. The Exeggutor looks hilarious.

The New pokemon: Love the idea of the birds. About time we had something reference the Darwin finches on Galapagos. That Mini death star pokemon could be interesting, and a new version of Daruma pretty much, but its the opposite ability. Mule looks adorable, and that Flower manties is quite cute. That new attack looks rediculous. And Gumshoos looks like trump.

Z moves. Curious how they will effect the meta. In game it will be quite strong. it all depends on how the activate, and if they could miss or be blocked. I don't think this will remove megas, but the idea of having to choose one or the other I like. Do you want a 1 time move that will effectivly OHKO almost any pokemon instantly, or do you want a pokemon that can help turn a full battle around?

The idea of island challenges and stuff reminds me of the orange islands arc in pokemon anime. I like it, and it changes it up. Still hope there is and E4 type thing.

I love the idea of riding pokemon, and it seems to negate the use of some HM's, which could be useful. Being able to call forth a pokemon to ride at any time without having to bring an HM slave around is good. I wonder if they will have someone to use cut with?

One thing I wanted to add. If new forms can only be hatched in the new region, and if the only way to get the old forms is via pokebank, then that should confirm that the VGC will allow old version pokemon, otherwise the original forms will never be allowed.

 

[Martin]

Z-flying Talonflame with Acrobatics anyone? Assuming it gets consumed

 

[The Squash]

love this mon

Agreed, it's nice to finally have a mon based on a mantis. It's also possible that it evolves by friendship because of it's dex entry: "Lurantis draws opponents near to itself with its flowerlike appearance and aroma—and then it takes them down. It’s said to be the most gorgeous of all Grass-type Pokémon, due to its brilliant coloration and elegant moves. Lurantis’s appearance is maintained through detailed grooming. It will trust a Trainer who does a good job of caring for it, but it will apparently have a difficult time growing closer to a lazy Trainer." Although it is a pokedex entry, which also says Escavalier flies around at high speeds with its base speed of 20.

 

[PsychicAcademic]

Oh sweet, I'm waiting for my mermaid idol now.

Ahem... looks like this will have little different concepts. I don't know what will happen with the gym leaders, but hey, the idea of each island's bosses sound good.
The new Pokemon this time looks nice. We have another Deerling/Furfrou and it'll be gimmick, but I like it anyway; Sensu style looks nice.
The mantis is gorgeous, although I feel like it's somewhat similar archetype to Hahakomori/Leavanny(?). Still....
And... Zen mode gimmick again ._.

And I'll ride Latias again!!... I hope....

Z-Crystal and attacks... now I'm curious if it is even related to Ash-Greninja's synchro or anything, or Ash's is really a unique one and completely unrelated, but the anime is now XY&Z and maybe there'll be things to see....



... but ugh, in Go I just hatched something I eternally hate that I sacrificed ten people in Battle House to Giratina to calm myself, and now that thing gets the spotlight too?! Good thing I'll transfer my Fennekin clan so I can now burn that thing to oblivion!! Or drown it with my Seal3 if it's not!!

 

[gyarayquaza]

Would be neat if other pokemon besides the eeveelutions used those. Maybe Exeggutor will shake things up and use the moss rock instead?

Speaking of: Does the fact that it used a physical move any indicator that Alola forms may have differing Base Stats compared to previous gens? They'll already have different movepools, so who knows.

Also: Did Gumshoos use Hyper Fang, Super Fang, or another bite move? I wanna know how excited to be about that.

Edit:

Is it me, or does that Tauros look a little different?

Since it's a form change, varying the stats on the new ones would make sense. I'm gonna say it's safe to assume we can catch regular exeggutor, etc. and see their stats as usual. (EDIT: actually this is pretty obvious because Pokemon can be transferred)

Looks like Super Fang, iirc.

Tauros is wearing a saddle, but otherwise it's the same. All the PokeRide mons seem to have saddles.

 

[Taistelu]

Can we shut up with the ludicrous assumption that Megas have been scrapped?

Also, another news dump confirmed to be happening on the 12th. http://nintendoeverything.com/next-pokemon-sunmoon-news-update-coming-on-august-12/

Wait so soon? They are bombarding us with information with no release. The new trailer will hardly sink in by the time the new one comes out.

 

[Count Bleck]

• Level up by icy rock most likely

  Nah. These "alolan" pokemon will evolve naturally into thier Alolan forms. If you want their orignal forms, you're going to have to transfer them. You can see this in the JP footage.
  

 

[sin(pi)]

hype hype hype hype

maths guy here with some base HP stats! (credit to smogon's calculator for helping me with this)


Minior (Rock/Flying) has 55-72 base HP
Fomantis (Grass) has 25-42 base HP
Lurantis (Grass, evo of ^) has 55-71 base HP
long Eggy - normally 95 base HP, now 91-107
Vulpix - normally 38, now 27-43
Ninetails - normally 73, now 63-78
^all of those are in range of the normal base HP

tl;dr - Alolan forms most likely have the same base stats as their regular forms.*

*obviously this is speculation

 

[PsychicAcademic]

love this mon

Strangely it isn't part bug. Florges again? ._.

Not that I mind it. Double weak to Fire is nasty and she's already beautiful anyway.

 

[QuickBH]

Can you only find one gem and it's universal, or are there some specific? It would be cool if some Pokemon like the starters of all regions have specific gems that can buff stats as well. If megas are really scrapped it can actually provide some really nice compensation.

 

[WaveBomber_]

hype hype hype hype

maths guy here with some base HP stats! (credit to smogon's calculator for helping me with this)


Minior (Rock/Flying) has 55-72 base HP
Fomantis (Grass) has 25-42 base HP
Lurantis (Grass, evo of ^) has 55-71 base HP
long Eggy - normally 95 base HP, now 91-107
Vulpix - normally 38, now 27-43
Ninetails - normally 73, now 63-78
^all of those are in range of the normal base HP

tl;dr - Alolan forms most likely have the same base stats as their regular forms.

Actually...

HP is probably the same, but their other stats will differ.

 

[HyperP0TI0N]

Would be neat if other pokemon besides the eeveelutions used those. Maybe Exeggutor will shake things up and use the moss rock instead?

Speaking of: Does the fact that it used a physical move any indicator that Alola forms may have differing Base Stats compared to previous gens? They'll already have different movepools, so who knows.

Also: Did Gumshoos use Hyper Fang, Super Fang, or another bite move? I wanna know how excited to be about that.

Edit:

Is it me, or does that Tauros look a little different?

It has white hair

 

[Sirya]

I dont know how someone who have been playing Pokémon since its begining can asume megas are scraped. What?

I have a new theory: abilities are scraped too, so is the special split between SpD. and SpA. Pokémon can no longer hold items. What more, what more... Oh, yes: Shinies are not visible (again). Feel free to add things to the list.

 

[gyarayquaza]

• 
  Nah. These "alolan" pokemon will evolve naturally into thier Alolan forms. If you want their orignal forms, you're going to have to transfer them. You can see this in the JP footage.

Footage doesn't confirm or deny any method of evolution. It just shows the evolution itself happening.

EDIT: Oh I might know what you mean now. I didn't mean fire vulpix by icy rock gets ice ninetails. Just that ice vulpix by icy rock might get ice ninetails.

 

[Bice]

shaped like a friend

Also Alola Ninetales is fucking awesome. Definitely my second favorite of the Alolan 'mons.

 

[Prof. Almeida]

I think this is the end of HMs.

 

[Taistelu]

I dont know how someone who have been playing Pokémon since its begining can asume megas are scraped. What?

I have a new theory: abilities are scraped too, so is the special split between SpD. and SpA. Pokémon can no longer hold items. What more, what more... Oh, yes: Shinies are not visible (again). Feel free to add things to the list.

And...? It is not absurd to assume Megas are going to be scrapped given that we've not seen any. Honestly the second part of this post really annoys me.

 

[Don Honchkrorleone]

Well... Probably kinda early to affirm but I think I'm going to hate these games.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a genwunner (heck I started on Gen II when IV was already out). I actually like the new "retcons" with the exception of Ice/Steel Snow Cloak Sandslash even though the design of all seem cool. I absolutely love Oricorio and probably will use it on my future team. And I'm still, unless they embargo Brazil, going to import Pokémon Sun.

But the change of the basic Pokémon game formula seems to... sudden. I guess the introduction of mega evolutions were received well enough to allow GF to think about taking bigger steps, but this seems too radical. Bear in mind I'm not talking about the "retcons" here (although I kinda dislike they're doing the same thing Digimon, Yo-Kai Watch and other -mon RPGs did). The chinese rumor being true means no gyms somewhat takes out the goal of the game for me. Island Trials seems so stupid, "RPG-esque" stuff (as a friend told me on discord and I totally agree); find stuff, fight a boss mon, spot differences... They're making Pokémon like its knock-offs in my opinion as far as what I've seen so far. Honestly, I won't be surprised if SM goes full Undertale and add another way of battling that isn't using moves at this point. Again, I'm not against changes in a game franchise, I liked megas, but heck, take me out to a fancy dinner first before going full anal. I don't know if these risks are going to pay off well, not in means of capitalism oh no they sure will, but on a way that will respect people who were both down for and against radical changes.

Does that mean I won't buy SM? No. As I said I'm going to give it a chance. It's my duty as a fan and I'm still trying to keep an open mind. But I can say for sure that I won't be surprised if Pokémon Sun and Moon are the most disappointing thing since my son, not living up to the hype it's creating. My opinion though, so feel free to disagree and call me a sexist/racist/homophobic.

On a more positive note,

This (better, these) is the best Bird mon ever since Honchkrow and I'll prob use all four, Ariel the Popplio and maybe Salandit as my full team, that is if I even need to have a full team at the end of the game. Fuck Minion Meteor tho.

 

[Martin]

I'm p. sure the gems won't be consumable now that I think about it considering they interract with a bracelet. That said though I still think Talonflame would be one of the better users of it because it isn't particularly dependent on it's item anyway.

 

[BandedBlissey]

One thing that nobody has pointed out: the description states that, to use a Z-Move, the Pokémon is required to know a move of that type and hold the corresponding Z-Crystal. It doesn't say that the Pokémon must be of that type. So you can use coverage Z-Moves.

 

[Sirya]

And...? It is not absurd to assume Megas are going to be scrapped given that we've not seen any. Honestly the second part of this post really annoys me.

I think it is. Maybe "absurd" has a different connotation in my language than yours, but if you ask me, I think it's pretty absurd to believe that a mechanic that, by itself, represents the 99% of the gameplay mechanics of the franchise, a total success in terms of gameplay and marketing... is going to dissapear like its nothing. We have been playing Pokémon with megaevolutions since 2013, can you imagine all of that, all the primal forms and mega-evolution and its impact in the games dissapearing because potato? Me not.