Deoxys - E : Broadening of the metagame?

I don't see why Wobbuffet is so out of the question. However, that's a different question for a different thread.

Let's first consider Deoxys-S's main forms of offense: Psycho Boost and Superpower. If it uses Superpower, that means it has -1 Attack and -1 Defense. I'll go over the -Def part first, because that's something I've seen mentioned. As soon as you use Superpower, those mediocre defenses (and virtually 0 resistances) become utter garbage. This means several Pokemon now have a OHKO on it, and it's particularly vulnerable to Pursuit (Metagross, anyone?).

The other part of Superpower is more often overlooked, but is likely more important. Superpower isn't Close Combat--you lose Attack. If you try to Superpower Blissey and they switch to a Fighting resist, you suddenly lost your 2HKO on Blissey. If you bring in Blissey on anything but Superpower, Deoxys-S can't safely stay in and go for the 2HKO, anyway. If Blissey uses Wish (with Protect) or Softboiled, you're in trouble because now you can't 2HKO. If it uses Toxic, you're suddenly losing HP to Life Orb, Toxic, and the possible Sandstorm, Stealth Rock, and the like. If it uses Counter, you're dead (which is obviously bad for you). If it uses Thunder Wave, Blissey is now faster and can heal, and your Deoxys-S might as well be dead (this is even worse than if Blissey used Counter, because it gets a turn to recover for free, as long as you don't stay in and Superpower CH).

The same problem applies to Psycho Boost, only magnified. You get -2 Special Attack, and this doesn't just affect Psycho Boost, it also hurts your HP Fire / Ice Beam / Thunderbolt / Shadow Ball. Once it uses Psycho Boost, the amount of counters multiplies. If it lacks Psycho Boost, it loses a major weapon in its arsenal.

There are also more counters than the Steel / Psychic types. Consider Celebi. With 239 Special Defense (12 EVs), it's 3HKOed by +Special Attack, 252 Special Attack EVs, Life Orb Deoxys-S Ice Beam. Celebi, meanwhile, can Thunder Wave you, or, if it switches in on anything but Ice Beam / Shadow Ball, just use Leech Seed and stall. If it wants, it could spam Recover, because you are as likely to kill yourself with Life Orb as you are to get a CH (if Deoxys-S is at absolute max HP, it has a 51% chance to CH Celebi before it runs out of HP thanks to Life Orb. If I wanted, I could do the calculation to be the chance to CH or Freeze until it's in KO range from Celebi's U-turn or Grass Knot).

Blissey, as I mentioned above, can take on Deoxys-S with a bit of prediction. Cresselia can Thunder Wave or Calm Mind up. Any sort of Choice Deoxys-S is highly vulnerable to Pursuit (it's even worse off than Starmie, especially when you consider that its STAB move does 0 damage to the most common Pursuiters, barring Heracross, who can come in on anything but Deoxys-S's STAB move). Paralysis in general screws over Deoxys-S, taking away its one good stat. If it's burned, Superpower isn't so useful, and Toxic limits its staying power.

Bronzong, Metagross, and Jirachi do a good job of stopping it, too.

There's also another factor you are overlooking. Good luck switching Deoxys-S in. It has roughly the same defensive ability as Lucario, except you lose the nice resistances. It's like switching in Azelf, except you don't have Levitate. In other words, it's hard to bring in.



"Slightly" bulkier? It has useful resistances, Intimidate means it can switch in on actual physical attacks, and it even has an immunity to Ground. It's only "slightly" bulkier if Tyranitar is slightly bulkier than Weavile. Your bias is showing.



Interesting you picked Azelf. Deoxys-S is almost identical to Azelf in its ability to take hits (just a fraction of a % different). Unlike Azelf, it doesn't have a trait that lets it come in on one type of move for free.

What's the point in allowing Garchomp? What's the harm in banning it? What's the point in allowing Blissey? What's the harm in banning it? How about Azelf? Skarmory? Weavile? Pineco? The default should be allowing Pokemon, not banning them. It seems to me that your real problem is that you'd have to change your team. The problem with that reasoning is twofold. First, any decent Pokemon would cause changes if it had been banned, and then were allowed. If Blissey were uber, and then was allowed now, you'd be complaining "My Specsmence isn't sweeping everything! Blissey is uber!". Second, eventually the metagame will shift such that your team likely will need changes, anyway.



Mew is far superior to Deoxys-S. Mew has high defensive stats, and it can Baton Pass Nasty Plots (it also has Hypnosis). Imagine the main threats from Togekiss, remove Paraflinch, add sleep and better attacking options, and give it more Defense. I'd also consider Manaphy to be superior to Deoxys-S. The only currently uber Pokemon that I believe to be worse than Deoxys-S is Wobbuffet.


If Deoxys-S were uber, then the top players would have Deoxys-S on their team, meaning it would have a very high weighted rating this rating period. In fact, I'd argue that if an OU Pokemon has a low weighted rating, it is virtually impossible for it to be uber. The reason for this is simple. If the Pokemon is uber, then players who use it will usually beat those who don't. Give a mediocre player a Groudon and he's almost certainly going to sweep even a good player's OU team. For this reason, players who use Deoxys-S will have higher ratings, on the average, than those who don't (ignoring the complete newbies here who'd use stuff like Psychic, Psycho Boost, Zen Headbutt, Dream Eater Deoxys-S or whatever). Moreover, the better players are more likely to recognize how powerful Deoxys-S is, and thus are likely to use it. All the top players will have it, and then all the really weak players will copy them. In other words, it will be shortly obvious that it is, in fact, deserving of being uber.

You can't have a centralizing force that no one uses.

This is not how Deoxys-S has played out, however. I have encountered very few of them. 3 of my Pokemon carry Paralysis moves, so the very few I've seen (I'm trying not to exaggerate here, but it's a pretty rare Pokemon...) haven't done much.

I'm going to take the time to explain why unbanned should be the default, and Pokemon should only be banned after it's known they ought to be, not the other way around. I just asserted it earlier, and here's my support.

If a Pokemon is deserving of being uber and it is put in ubers, then woohoo, we got it right. If a Pokemon is not deserving of being uber and isn't put in ubers, then woohoo we got it right. Both of these scenarios are irrelevant here. If a Pokemon should be uber and we let it in OU, then it becomes immediately apparent. If a Pokemon shouldn't be uber and we put it there anyway, then it's possible to never realize its 'proper' tier.

First of all, let's look at the completely wrong statements.

I'm unaware of what sort of calculator you were running, but unfortunately, Celebi with 252 HP / 12 SP.Def ev's is dealt 56.93% - 67.08% damage with Ice Beam by the set I posted above, which is a) not even max sp.atk and b) a solid 2ko.

Secondly, you pointed out, rightly, that after using Superpower once, Blissey can indeed counter Deoxys-e. This is very true; however having Supoerpower on that set is justified by the existance of Blissey on its own; experienced players do not waste it on anything which does not require it (exceptions is, for instance, Boah). So Blissey is not any sort of solid counter for Deoxys-e. The same goes for Psycho Boost; it isn't wasted on just anything by clever battlers.

Now, you state that "any sort of choice deoxys" is vulnerable to pursuit; while this may be true, I did state mixed deoxys as the most common one to appear in standard play. Also, deducing a choice item on him may not be an easy task unless the damage calculations are telling.

You stated jirachi, metagross, and bronzong as solid counters; So did I, although take note that Metagross can never counter him if he has HP Fire.

Deoxys-E does not need to be switched in. It's a pokemon that you hold back until a relatively advanced phase of your battle; You then proceed to switch it in, and if you have scouted well enough you can finish an entire team with it.

Lastly, and to avoid having to counter any more of your arguments, you misunderstood me. I put this thread up to have him discussed. I have long been an advocator of revolutionary change in the metagame; I am in favour of an Deoxys-E in OU. The purpose of this thread is to get the rest of the doubters to realize on their own that it can be a solid OU pokemon.

The Uber tier is due for some definite change, and Deoxys will not be the last pokemon to be affected by it. As you hinted, Wobbuffet will be moved to OU sometime, and THEN will come the time where people start to truly bitch about change. Manaphy is another very likely OU candidate.
 
yeah, raikou is right. manaphy can only have those 100% recovery and status immune if in the rain. also, he has basically one set, whereas deoxys can have many variations of attacking, and many stalling variations.

Edit: wow, i thought that there would be an equally long reply to that quote. i was sorely disappointed. and i dont see why people are trying to demote ubers. its baffling to me.its always either the lati's, manaphy, ho-oh, ar wobbuffet. but thats discussion for different thread, so, nvm.
 
Deoxys-e can prtty much make a whole in your team unless you bring a specific counter to it like a first attacker for example.
 
It's not immune to status nor does it have a 100% recovery move without rain support which is in short supply in OU, unlike Ubers. So with a 1 turn set up it can have those things for 5-8 turns. Lots of Pokemon become dangerous with a turn of setup (NP Azelf, belly drummers, etc).

And there are other 600ers who can double their attack stat, one which starts at 130 base attack.

Edit: Just did some calcs, my Raikou can switch in on a Manaphy even if rain dance has already been set up and 1hko 252 hp versions with 100% accurate Thunder. If no rain dance, Raikou can live through 2 surfs (or 1 NP surf) and still 1 shot it. Most speedy electrics can do the same. My Sceptile can switch in on any attack, even an ice beam from modest 252 SA, and 1hko. And those are fragile sweepers, not walls..

1. Raikou isn't a fragile sweeper.

2. Not many Raikou's carry thunder.

3. Is your Sceptile example supposed to mean something? Just because a poke can survive a hit from it doesn't mean it's not good. Manaphy has better attack/sp. attack than Deoxys, double the base HP, and better defenses. Let's not even take into account its ability and typing. I fail to see what you've said that proves that Manaphy is worse than Deoxys

Edit: kusaninja, why we're trying to demote Ubers? Because they don't belong there! By adding another(very good) poke to the metagame, you can expand it and make it more fun.
 
people, do not lose sight of what we are discussing about here. If you feel Manaphy should be discussed further, I fully support you, but do it on another thread.

for the sake of completion though, raikou is indeed a counter to manaphy, even without thunder. it switches in on any move, cm's once, and then ohko's.

anyway, I'm waiting on obi's response.
 
1. Raikou isn't a fragile sweeper.

2. Not many Raikou's carry thunder.

3. Is your Sceptile example supposed to mean something? Just because a poke can survive a hit from it doesn't mean it's not good. Manaphy has better attack/sp. attack than Deoxys, double the base HP, and better defenses. Let's not even take into account its ability and typing. I fail to see what you've said that proves that Manaphy is worse than Deoxys

Raikou and Sceptile are off the top of my head because they're on one of my teams. Point being manaphy lacks the firepower without NP to kill fragile things even with SE hits. If you want more solid Manaphy counters, try Ludicolo, Articuno, Zapdos, CM Bliss, Togekiss with roost, anything that can stall out 5-8 turns of rain dance, as well as almost every electric type. There is a much longer list of Manaphy counters than there are Deoxys counters, that's for sure. Should you screw up, you can revenge kill him much more easily than Deoxys because he has base 100 speed, not base faster-than-every-choice-scarfer speed.

Deoxys is better because it can counter its counters with many different unpredictable sets and always go first. Manaphy always has the same limited moveset and absolutely requires setup to do anything.

As for Raikou and Thunder, if rain dance became popular you bet they'd carry it. And like the above poster said he still wins with CM-Thunderbolt.

Sorry to derail, my whole point was that there are less dangerous pokes in Ubers than Deoxys-S and it would be unfair to ignore them while letting Deoxys in to smash people's teams apart.
 
Raikou and Sceptile are off the top of my head because they're on one of my teams. Point being manaphy lacks the firepower without NP to kill fragile things even with SE hits. If you want more solid Manaphy counters, try Ludicolo, Articuno, Zapdos, CM Bliss, Togekiss with roost, anything that can stall out 5-8 turns of rain dance, as well as almost every electric type. There is a much longer list of Manaphy counters than there are Deoxys counters, that's for sure. Should you screw up, you can revenge kill him much more easily than Deoxys because he has base 100 speed, not base faster-than-every-choice-scarfer speed.

Deoxys is better because it can counter its counters with many different unpredictable sets and always go first. Manaphy always has the same limited moveset and absolutely requires setup to do anything.

As for Raikou and Thunder, if rain dance became popular you bet they'd carry it. And like the above poster said he still wins with CM-Thunderbolt.

Sorry to derail, my whole point was that there are less dangerous pokes in Ubers than Deoxys-S and it would be unfair to ignore them while letting Deoxys in to smash people's teams apart.

I completely agree(not necessarily that Deoxys-S is better than Manaphy), but that all of the Ubers that are borderline need to be tested extensively in the D/P metagame. Obi makes an incredibly good point when he says that it would be much better to start everything in OU and then move them up, because there's tons of people like kusaninja who go, "ZOMG but they are teh Uberz1!11one" and don't even think about WHY they are considered Ubers.

I think theorymon can only go so far, and then you have to actually test it, which has been done with Deoxys..and I think in a week or two we should have a definitive answer about Deoxys.
 
First of all, let's look at the completely wrong statements.

I'm unaware of what sort of calculator you were running, but unfortunately, Celebi with 252 HP / 12 SP.Def ev's is dealt 56.93% - 67.08% damage with Ice Beam by the set I posted above, which is a) not even max sp.atk and b) a solid 2ko.

180-214 damage, or 44.55%-52.97% from 317 Special Attack (max + Nature) Deoxys-S Ice Beam to 239 Special Defense, 404 HP Celebi. Perhaps your calculator is off? I used my own calculator, located here.

You stated jirachi, metagross, and bronzong as solid counters; So did I, although take note that Metagross can never counter him if he has HP Fire.

HP Fire from 252 Special Attack, +Special Attack Life Orb Deoxys-S does 148-176 damage, or 40.66%-48.35% to max HP, 0 Special Defense Metagross. Meanwhile, Choice Band Meteor Mash is an easy OHKO, doing 303 damage minimum to a 216 Defense Deoxys-S (Deoxys-S has 304 HP max). Life Orb Meteor Mash does 262 minimum damage (Deoxys-S has 241 without any HP EVs).

Deoxys-E does not need to be switched in. It's a pokemon that you hold back until a relatively advanced phase of your battle; You then proceed to switch it in, and if you have scouted well enough you can finish an entire team with it.

Then you are playing the opening and middle-game with 5 Pokemon to my 6. I'll take that advantage.

the sceptile reference was to show that manaphy wasnt a threat to a pogey that it had a SE move against.

Ice Beam KOs Sceptile if it switches into any other attack, and Sceptile fails to OHKO 0 HP / 0 SpDef Manaphy with 252 Special Attack, Modest Energy Ball. If it gets Overgrow activated, then yeah, it can do some damage with a fairly easy OHKO on such a Manaphy, but I'd hardly say Manaphy isn't a threat to Sceptile.
 
Most special Sceptiles run Leaf Storm. If not they can always sub down to activate berry + Overgrowth or use specs.
 
180-214 damage, or 44.55%-52.97% from 317 Special Attack (max + Nature) Deoxys-S Ice Beam to 239 Special Defense, 404 HP Celebi. Perhaps your calculator is off? I used my own calculator, located here.

Lyfsaho included the Life Orb in his calculations while you didn't.
 
Heh I think you guy's are overrating Deoxys-E. Let's play some theorymon here.

Deoxys-E switches in.
12% Stealth Rock
6% Sandstorm (if end of turn)
Now Deoxys-E attacks.
10% Life Orb
6% Sandstorm.

So assuming you are not 'revenge killing', you have just drained 34% for one attack. Now this isn't even including the attack it would take upon switch in. Now we can go on and argue and argue and argue about Deoxys-E having Recover, but it sure as hell is going to get walled by something else.

I enjoy the whole stalling set as anyone else, but that's just asking to get fucked by hax. I mean sure, you might think it's safe to take 8 Ice Beams, but when you're playing a battle as a whole, 10% doesn't mean that you're not going to get frozen, so yeah by the end of the game, your opponent's going to be "gg" and you're going to be "you got lucky."

In other words, OVERRATED.
 
I agree with broadening the metagame, its more fun with more pokemon :)
but only to an extent, deoxys-e does change the metagame but not any more that garchomp would (like TC said). Where as low-ubers like deoxys (def) IMO would be too devastating to the metagame.
 
It's kind of baffling that on Smogon, of all places, I'm seeing so many people talk about how Deoxys will never carry Taunt lol moveslots. It's true that Deoxys has one of the worse cases of moveslot syndrome, but...

If Tauntable moves frequently cause problems for people using Deoxys, Deoxys will start commonly carrying Taunt. It's fucking fast, and Taunt can be gamebreaking. Why wouldn't it? We're not talking about 8 year-olds who aren't EVing, here.

In reality, we'll probably see a middle ground. Usage of one extreme set, then the other will probably spike (See: CBTar, followed by Boah...; Specsmence, Mixmence...), then a healthy mix. And that, above any offensive ability or stalling ability Deoxys has is why it's dangerous and why quite a few people are a little apprehensive about letting him into OU. We've already got quite a few dangerous customers who, if you switch the wrong 'counter' into them, can proceed to use that opportunity to wreck several of your team, if not most or all: Gengar, Tyranitar, Infernape, Salamence, and more.... I'm all for testing it, and hell, even if I wasn't it's happening anyway, which I think is lost on some people. But it's perfectly reasonable to point out all manner of workable Deoxys sets and wonder if we really need to add another mixed wall--who can also rapid spin and pack Pursuit and not need any status or recovery move.

But who the fuck am I kidding, Deoxys will never run Taunt, so it only has the one set of counters.
 
180-214 damage, or 44.55%-52.97% from 317 Special Attack (max + Nature) Deoxys-S Ice Beam to 239 Special Defense, 404 HP Celebi. Perhaps your calculator is off? I used my own calculator, located here.

Actually I think lyfsaho is right about the calcs. Those percentages look pretty close to the damage you would do if deoxys isn't carrying life orb.
 
Heh I think you guy's are overrating Deoxys-E. Let's play some theorymon here.

Deoxys-E switches in.
12% Stealth Rock
6% Sandstorm (if end of turn)
Now Deoxys-E attacks.
10% Life Orb
6% Sandstorm.

So assuming you are not 'revenge killing', you have just drained 34% for one attack. Now this isn't even including the attack it would take upon switch in. Now we can go on and argue and argue and argue about Deoxys-E having Recover, but it sure as hell is going to get walled by something else.

I enjoy the whole stalling set as anyone else, but that's just asking to get fucked by hax. I mean sure, you might think it's safe to take 8 Ice Beams, but when you're playing a battle as a whole, 10% doesn't mean that you're not going to get frozen, so yeah by the end of the game, your opponent's going to be "gg" and you're going to be "you got lucky."

In other words, OVERRATED.

So because Deoxys-E is not immune/resistant to most forms of residual damage and because Life Orb adds 10% to that wound, it's overrated?
 
I don't think it's too dangerous for the metagame, overrated because it is Deoxys, not for what people are seing the damage it's actually doing, which isn't as much as alot see.

Yes, it has access to BoltBeamSuperPower to get clear hits on everything. Also to add to its arsenal, a 4th move can be implanted into its set. Still, looking at its Base Stats, I see no reason to go running off yet.

Life Orb gave it that boost it needed to do anything. I mean, look at advance, without the boost he wasn't even 2KOing much.

His speed is the reason why it's banned, just to be able to outspeed every other Pokemon. You have fast OU tier Pokemon with Choice Scarf, ie: Gengar, who hurts the metagame just as much as Deoxys can. With access to a wide variety of moves.

That is a quick thing I look at, when seing Deoxys. Oh, and he doesn't even KO much he gets super effective on, too.
 
180-214 damage, or 44.55%-52.97% from 317 Special Attack (max + Nature) Deoxys-S Ice Beam to 239 Special Defense, 404 HP Celebi. Perhaps your calculator is off? I used my own calculator, located here.


I assure you, my calculations are not off. 252 hp / 12 sp.def Celebi will take 58.91% - 69.31% from 252 sp.atk life or Deoxys. Celebi is therefore not a counter to Deoxys. You must've made some mistake, recalculate if you will.

HP Fire from 252 Special Attack, +Special Attack Life Orb Deoxys-S does 148-176 damage, or 40.66%-48.35% to max HP, 0 Special Defense Metagross. Meanwhile, Choice Band Meteor Mash is an easy OHKO, doing 303 damage minimum to a 216 Defense Deoxys-S (Deoxys-S has 304 HP max). Life Orb Meteor Mash does 262 minimum damage (Deoxys-S has 241 without any HP EVs).

Again, your calculations are slightly, but significantly, off. The same Deoxys deals 53.57% - 63.19% to max HP, 0 sp.def Metagross with 70bp HP Fire, which again is a solid 2KO.

Then you are playing the opening and middle-game with 5 Pokemon to my 6. I'll take that advantage.

There are a good number of pokemon with difficulty to be switched in in the metagame, and we all have found ways around this before. Take Alakazam, Dugtrio, or even Heracross, Porygon-z, Staraptor, Weavile to a lesser extent.


It's kind of baffling that on Smogon, of all places, I'm seeing so many people talk about how Deoxys will never carry Taunt lol moveslots. It's true that Deoxys has one of the worse cases of moveslot syndrome, but...

If Tauntable moves frequently cause problems for people using Deoxys, Deoxys will start commonly carrying Taunt. It's fucking fast, and Taunt can be gamebreaking. Why wouldn't it? We're not talking about 8 year-olds who aren't EVing, here.

But who the fuck am I kidding, Deoxys will never run Taunt, so it only has the one set of counters.

You have a point, of course- as time passes, we will see alot of deoxys-e movesets. However, I listed on page 1 what I believe will be the standard one, which thus becomes the most significant one.

If you give it Taunt and still orientate it offensively, you will unavoidably lose alot of coverage from somewhere, so the emergance of a defensive set, somewhere around the taunt / spikes / cosmic power / toxic nature, is also probable.
 
Heh I think you guy's are overrating Deoxys-E. Let's play some theorymon here.

Deoxys-E switches in.
12% Stealth Rock
6% Sandstorm (if end of turn)
Now Deoxys-E attacks.
10% Life Orb
6% Sandstorm.

So assuming you are not 'revenge killing', you have just drained 34% for one attack. Now this isn't even including the attack it would take upon switch in. Now we can go on and argue and argue and argue about Deoxys-E having Recover, but it sure as hell is going to get walled by something else.

I enjoy the whole stalling set as anyone else, but that's just asking to get fucked by hax. I mean sure, you might think it's safe to take 8 Ice Beams, but when you're playing a battle as a whole, 10% doesn't mean that you're not going to get frozen, so yeah by the end of the game, your opponent's going to be "gg" and you're going to be "you got lucky."

In other words, OVERRATED.
The same is said about Deoxys-A. In other words, Deoxys-A is a piece of crap for not being immune to all forms of residual damage. While we're at it, might as well demote Mewtwo and non-Steel Arceus.

This is also completely ignoring the fact that you have access to Recover, and Deoxys-S can be EV'd to survive weaker hits (like Weavile's Pursuit).

Obi said:
I don't see why Wobbuffet is so out of the question. However, that's a different question for a different thread.

Probably because he was already tested in the first Smogon Wifi Tournament.
 
I agree with broadening the metagame, its more fun with more pokemon :)
but only to an extent, deoxys-e does change the metagame but not any more that garchomp would (like TC said). Where as low-ubers like deoxys (def) IMO would be too devastating to the metagame.

A poke named Cresselia another psychic 600 pokes which is defensively better than Deoxy LG is allowed in the game.The truth of matter almost anything that counters Cresse should counter deoxy LG.

Dealing with Deoxy-E, No taunt will people status it and beat it.With Taunt one of the direct counter like Metagross or Dusknoir etc beat it.Simple as that
 
We have to go one Uber at a time here, people. Let's focus on Deo-E first; you can't have two test phases at the same time.
 
Well, I'd say that Sableye, although UU, does just as good of a job at countering Deoxys-S as Spiritomb does.

Check this out:

If I use a 252 HP/212 SDEF +Nature Sableye, look at these calculations from a 252 SAtk +Nature Choice Specs Deoxys-S:

Thunderbolt = 45.07% - 52.96%
Ice Beam = 45.07% - 52.96%

Superpower and Psychic attacks don't affect Sableye, so these are the only two calculations needed.

I put the minimum amount of special defense/HP needed to make those calculations a 2HKO with Leftovers, but more can be used if needed.

Then, what can Sableye do?

Well, let's see. He can Recover off those hits quite easily with his reliable recovery move (something that Spiritomb doesn't have), he can Knock Off Deoxys-S's item to greatly neuter his strength, he can Taunt if it's defensive set, Will-O-Wisp a bander, etc.

There's also the fact that Sableye can learn Payback, and considering that he'll be going last most of the time anyway against Deoxys-S, it will almost certainly be a STAB 100 BP Dark move which annihilates Deoxys-S.

Sableye with 40 atk EVs

Against a 0/0 Deoxys-S:

Full-power Payback: 82.57% - 97.51%

Sableye with 0 atk EVs

0/0 Deoxys-S:

Full-power Payback: 78.84% - 92.53%

Now let's see how much it can do to the stalling set:

40 atk EV Sableye

252 HP/252 Def +Nature Deoxys-S:

Full-power Payback: 46.71% - 54.93%

0 atk EV Sableye

252 HP/252 Def +Nature Deoxys-S:

Full-power Payback: 44.41% - 52.30%

I'm pretty sure that Punishment destroys Deoxys-S if they try to use Cosmic Power too many times as the power of Punishment keeps on rising to stat boosts. Plus Sableye can always Psych Up Deoxys-S's boosts and outstall him. The Calm Minding set gets annihilated.

Even if this guy is UU, it still doesn't change it as a possible counter.
 
The fact that Ice Beam does that much to Sableye makes it not a very good counter. The reason Spiritomb is such a great counter is that it has Pursuit, which Sableye lacks.
 
Ok, but Spiritomb can't really do much if it's fighting the defensive set, because Cosmic Power will greatly lower Pursuit's damage if Deoxys-S just decides to stay in.

Sableye, on the other hand, still has the potential to kill Deoxys-S with Punishment.

Also, keep in mind that those calculations are from a Specs DX-S, which isn't nearly as common as the Life Orb one. Sableye can easily just stall the Life Orb one to death with Recover, which Spiritomb can't do because of Pain Split recovering less and less after Deoxys-S takes more and more recoil.

Deoxys-S also does bad damage if it gets its item Knocked Off, which Sableye won't hesitate to do.

I will agree that Spiritomb is certain death for offensive sets, but Sableye does much better against the defensive DX-S.
 
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