Metagame Frantic Fusions | Survey @ Post #484!

[Tankey6ia]

+
Stats: 105/164/96/80/126/144
Without Priority, this can be very, VERY annoying with Body Slam paralysis and Iron Heads. There is Earthquake for the Steel Type resists and Dragon Dance to boost power and speed. It could probably be a good paralysis spreader as it can paralyze Ground Types which No Guard Zapdos can not. You can substitute Iron head for Outrage for tons of damage in exchange for not hitting fairies as well.

Flinch hax Roaring Moon set

Jirachi (Roaring Moon) @ Aguav Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Earthquake

+
Stats: 79/145/102/138/96/122
Basically Galvanize Thrash go BRRR. This has a pretty high attack stat of 145 which can be boosted by a Bulk Up. There is also the Zap Plate to boost the power of your thrashes. This needs maybe a lot of team support before it can sweep, but it does pretty high damage. Some other moves are Brick Break for coverage and beating Goodra-Hisui, Knock off for utility, Electric Terrain to support Quark Drive teammates, U-turn for pivoting, and Grass knot to beat ground types. 138 special attack's nothing to scoff at.

Thrashing Thundurus Set

Golem-Alola (Thundurus) @ Zap Plate
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Bulk Up
- Thrash
- Brick Break
- Grass Knot

+
Stats: 150/125/152/90/102/46
Yeah, having 150/152/102 defenses makes Dondozo very great as an Unaware wall, and it can shrug off physical attacks pretty easily and recover with Rest. Resttalk Dondozo fused with Diancie might encourage physical sweepers to use Mold Breaker in exchange for weaker defenses which can be beat with Technician priority moves. I think this is going to be pretty centralizing.

The Premier Physical Wall

Diancie (Dondozo) @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
Evs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Curse
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Liquidation/Aqua Tail/Wave Crash

You can use Liquidation for 100% accuracy but only 85 BP, Aqua Tail for 90 BP but a chance to miss, or Wave crash for 120 BP but recoil. Your choice!

 

[Glory]

this is complete bs.

Almost every high level game of Frantic Fusion ends in a draw due to the unbreakability of dual regen core. The only time you actually break the core is when the regen core player makes a fatal mistake (e.g, they switch in Goodra-Hisui onto your Great Tusk and you actually predict that.)




a lot of which got banned or are directly countered by the regen core mons themselves? weavile, bax, shaymin sky, stakeout, weather rocks, and enamorus have all gotten removed literally because they damaged defensive gameplay too much. So while we do have some decent offensive options, they do all get hard countered by the various regen cores. And while yes, thEOReTiCaLlY you could run some bull like Choice Band Adaptability Landorus-Therian to beat Goodra-H (for example), that set doesn't do you any favors against the other 4 members of the regen-cores team. And again, that's literally just relying on your opponent making a mistake (leaving Goodra in against your hypothetical Lando)

I guess you could run a mixed attack of some sort, but you have to beat VERY high defenses in both categories, and have unresisted stab combinations in both categories in order to stand a chance, assuming you don't get outsped/resisted anyways and ohko'd right back (there aren't any real bulky mixed attackers).




So, MBounce is unbanned is often on Regen Core teams. Furthermore, HDBs exist. Now, fortunately, since you've made this post, the distribution for Koff has increased, but at the same time, the amount of viable regen sets has also gone up. If you try to Koff a GTusk, you'll just die. Alolomola doesn't care about hazards at all. Hell, you could run bulky cinderace (I've seen it) and literally flip this "counter" on it's head.

The problem is that regen corerequires you play *their* game, rather than the game itself. The regen core user completely mandates the entire match and can easily force a draw (unless they are an idiot, in which case they lose even slower then a normal idiot)






Weavile is banned, Unburden is banned, Volc insta dies to rocks, Dnite can't actually threaten out any of the common Phys defensive regen core users (even with Super effective hits), need I continue?

In our attempt to make the meta game playable by removing (rightfully) broken stuff, we've inadvertently made Regen Spam uncounterable. any real smart player playing regen core cannot lose unless they suffer from a brain annuyreism for 150 seconds or make multiple consecutive mistakes.

solution: add 1ac or ban regen

This is so wrong in so many ways it was painful to read.

weavile, bax, shaymin sky, stakeout, weather rocks, and enamorus have all gotten removed literally because they damaged defensive gameplay too much. So while we do have some decent offensive options, they do all get hard countered by the various regen cores.

This is just straight up false. All of the things you mentioned that got banned were detrimental to more than just defensive play, they were just flat-out broken and made building/playing far too restrictive.

Saying that we don't have any offensive options that can break through regen cores is just lying. CB Zapdos-G and CB/LO Sneasler are incredible breakers that can break regen with support (and no, just because they need support does not mean that they don't work). The brand new Ogerpon (Hearthflame especially) and the recently unbanned Ursaluna are also stupid breakers that Regen doesn't help against.

More breakers that are very beneficial against regenspam include: MGLO Heatran, CB Libero Dragonite (saying it doesn't do anything is false), Mixed LO Garchomp, MGLO Gholdengo (see below), Tough Claws Infernape, Adaptability Meowscarada, Roaring Moon (Technician, Adaptability, or Tough Claws), SFLO Thundurus-Therian, SD Ceruledge, SD Haxorus, Tough Claws Zarude, MGLO Lucario, and Tinted Lens Slither Wing.

Spoiler

+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Gholdengo [Clefable] Focus Blast vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey [Slowking]: 434-512 (66.5 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO, +2 252+ SpA Life Orb Gholdengo Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra-Hisui [Slowking]: 270-320 (74.1 - 87.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Of course, none of these are complete counters, nor did I ever claimed them as such. However with good play and positioning, all of these will help you win.

So, MBounce is unbanned is often on Regen Core teams. Furthermore, HDBs exist. Now, fortunately, since you've made this post, the distribution for Koff has increased, but at the same time, the amount of viable regen sets has also gone up. If you try to Koff a GTusk, you'll just die. Alolomola doesn't care about hazards at all. Hell, you could run bulky cinderace (I've seen it) and literally flip this "counter" on it's head.

Awfully convenient that hazard control ceases to exist when the hazards are on your side, isn't it? Even then, you're claiming that Magic Bounce is a catch-all for hazards—which it absolutely isn't—unless you somehow have a mon that beats every single hazard setter (there are none) as well as being able to consistently prevent Samurott-Hisui from setting Spikes (you can't).

If you try to Koff a GTusk, you'll just die. Alolomola doesn't care about hazards at all.

Both of these are just straight-up wrong and I shouldn't have to explain why, but since you seem to not understand, I will anyway. Great Tusk is tasked with switching into a lot of mons, and some of them, like Roaring Moon or opposing Great Tusk, do have Knock Off. Also, getting hit by Knock on the switch is incredibly common, I have no clue what you mean by "you'll just die." Alomomola cares a great deal about hazards, as they limit the amount of healing it can get from Regenerator, as well as increasing the number of wallbreakers that can 2HKO it.

The problem is that regen corerequires you play *their* game, rather than the game itself. The regen core user completely mandates the entire match and can easily force a draw (unless they are an idiot, in which case they lose even slower then a normal idiot)

This just isn't true. It's not difficult to apply pressure against Regenerator spam, nor are you "forced to play their game," unless your team is bad and gives them too much breathing room. There is absolutely nothing wrong with games being long; in fact long games typically tend to have results that are more representative of who is the better player, as luck is less of a factor.

There are more issues with this but I've gone on for long enough, and I don't particularly care to type this out for the next hour.

 

[mattawesome]

Toxic Chain is not shared properly in this format. It works in Partners In Crime.

 

[Orig Stall Guy]

Now that Sky, Darkrai, and NGas got banned (agree with bans, but loved to abuse), been playing with some new things.
SF Gengar has not let me down in AAA and Inheritance and its still a solid choice. its not darkrai good, but still solid.

GF decided to try and "balance" the kusoge that is Pokemon. And councils want to promote a healthy and skillful competitive metagame.
But Im a Gorilla who tends to not care about trifling things like "thinking" and "skill". And FF council banned Weevil so I can't mash beat up like I did in CE (RIP Sneloom your tyranny won't be forgotten).

Anyway, this lead me to realizing GF attempt to nerf glide could be exploited via technician. Terrain Tech Glide BP is 107. So I tried to build a team around that. https://pokepast.es/2b841e641adf49e0
Zarude might be better than meow due to higher atk? And can't think of good rilla fusion atm. Oger is fun to mess with even with terra ban.

EDIT: Welp team is dead its back to regen spam for me. Loving me some some quality salt.

 

[Tankey6ia]

+
Will snorlax rise to the top of this tier as it did in generations 1 and 2 OU? Let's see...
Stats fused with Diancie: 160/135/102/90/147/42
Snorlax could actually make a living as a special wall, better than Florges and Hisuian Goodra! It also has access to Resttalk. You could preform Rest+Recycle+Chesto Berry sets to make rest reliable, though it requires two moves and your item slot.

Snorlax+Diancie set

Diancie (Snorlax) @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 196 Def / 52 SpD
- Rest
- Recycle
- Curse
- Body Slam/Crunch

Calcs

Just kidding both of the calcs are blocked for me. the PS calc and the Github calc

 

[Catzzadilla]

+
Will snorlax rise to the top of this tier as it did in generations 1 and 2 OU? Let's see...
Stats fused with Diancie: 160/135/102/90/147/42
Snorlax could actually make a living as a special wall, better than Florges and Hisuian Goodra! It also has access to Resttalk. You could preform Rest+Recycle+Chesto Berry sets to make rest reliable, though it requires two moves and your item slot.

Snorlax+Diancie set

Diancie (Snorlax) @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Immunity
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 196 Def / 52 SpD
- Rest
- Recycle
- Curse
- Body Slam

Calcs

Just kidding both of the calcs are blocked for me. the PS calc and the Github calc

Could switch Immunity for thick fat if you’re gonna be resting off status anyway. I wish it had a good option to not be walled by ghost types (does it still get darkest lariat?) but other than that looks solid and bulky

 

[Tankey6ia]

Could switch Immunity for thick fat if you’re gonna be resting off status anyway. I wish it had a good option to not be walled by ghost types (does it still get darkest lariat?) but other than that looks solid and bulky

It has crunch, so I made these changes: Added Thick Fat and crunch.

 

[Fracterra]

I’ve seen no one talk about Diancie, So, i’ll take a gander at it
Diancie seems to have stats ripe for defense and trick room offense

View attachment 546687

Quagsire Is Unaware Of Such BS

First is Quagsire
50/121/171/116/166/58/682
Useful Abilities: Unaware and Water Absorb
Unaware Diancie is a showdown replay “omg so op” montage ready to happen.
With Diamond Storm, Body Press, Calm Mind, And Draining Kiss, this would be incredibly hard to break through with either Unaware (No Stat Boosts?) or Water Absorb (fuck rain teams).

TLDR: The funny mudfish gives funny defensive capabilities

Hoopa Go Brrrrrr

Next is Hoopa Confined Form
50/127/165/137/182/67/716
Calm Mind Diancie will be ridiculous with these stat changes. Calm Mind, Earth Power, Draining Kiss, and Diamond Storm make her even tankier than before, so yeah.

TLDR: Your soul has been claimed by Shantae: Pokemon Fusions edition

We Are (Bascu)Legion, For We Are Many

Oh Boy, The Adaptable
50/123/167/125/168/69/702
Useful Abilities: Adaptability, Mold Breaker
It’s funny fish time. Calm Mind, Moonblast/Draining Kiss, Earth Power, And Power Gem

TLDR: The funny fish leads to funny moments

Another Pokemon I’ve seen not mentioned that much is Meloetta, so lets go over her.

View attachment 546695

The Return Of (Bascu)Legion

Its the return of the funny fish.
100/100/94/153/146/109/702

The Return Of (Bascu)Legion

Useful Abilities: Adaptability, Mold Breaker.
Meloetta already has cracked stats, but with Adaptability boosting Hyper Voice and Psychic/Psyshock to brutal levels of power, Meloetta is even more threatening. You can run Calm Mind, Choice Specs, Assault Vest, It Gets Rediculous

TLDR: sings with such force it can topple gods

Did anyone happen to kill a red spy on the way here?

Greninja time booooooiiiiiiiiiis
100/100/94/153/145/129/711
A blazing speed of 129, Choice Specs/Scarf with Protean is very funny, with and the buff to bulk is worth it.

TLDR: the singer is also a ninja

Greninja Time my boys
View attachment 546697

Watery Soul Blade

Basculegions Male Variant is here
72/123/84/128/89/141/632
Useful Abilities: Adaptability/Mold Breaker
This fusion can be run pretty much any offensive way.

Let the waves engulf your spirit

Female Basculegion time
72/118/84/133/89/141/632
Useful Abilities: Adaptability/Mold Breaker
Like male but more special attack inclined

TLDR: The funny ghost fishes allows a lot of stuff with greninja
Also, I wish ash greninja was back.

Volcarona time my dudes
View attachment 546700

Ultimate Water-Based Soul Lamp

Basculegion-F
85/83/83/160/123/119/652
Useful Abilities: Adaptability/Mold Breaker
A powerful quiver dance user that is disgusting after just 1 quiver dance. Use Adaptability for even more power or mold breaker to break through Heatran.

TLDR: Haha quiver dance go brrrrrr

A dance of fire

The pure gen 5 fusion
85/79/84/167/137/122/674
Useful Abilities: Serene Grace
Game plan: Quiver dance 1 or 2 times, click Fiery Dance, Air Slash, and your choice of coverage move.

TLDR: this dance sets the stage ablaze

The Return of The King

I’m Da Biggest Bord

An Absolute Beast with Unaware
84/111/116/127/117/68
Useful Abilities: Unaware
This Bird is very hard to kill, and has a lot of tools.

TLDR: The Wide Bird is funny

 

[Schpoonman]

I’ve seen no one talk about Diancie, So, i’ll take a gander at it
Diancie seems to have stats ripe for defense and trick room offense

View attachment 546687

Quagsire Is Unaware Of Such BS

First is Quagsire
50/121/171/116/166/58/682
Useful Abilities: Unaware and Water Absorb
Unaware Diancie is a showdown replay “omg so op” montage ready to happen.
With Diamond Storm, Body Press, Calm Mind, And Draining Kiss, this would be incredibly hard to break through with either Unaware (No Stat Boosts?) or Water Absorb (fuck rain teams).

TLDR: The funny mudfish gives funny defensive capabilities

Hoopa Go Brrrrrr

Next is Hoopa Confined Form
50/127/165/137/182/67/716
Calm Mind Diancie will be ridiculous with these stat changes. Calm Mind, Earth Power, Draining Kiss, and Diamond Storm make her even tankier than before, so yeah.

TLDR: Your soul has been claimed by Shantae: Pokemon Fusions edition

We Are (Bascu)Legion, For We Are Many

Oh Boy, The Adaptable
50/123/167/125/168/69/702
Useful Abilities: Adaptability, Mold Breaker
It’s funny fish time. Calm Mind, Moonblast/Draining Kiss, Earth Power, And Power Gem

TLDR: The funny fish leads to funny moments

Another Pokemon I’ve seen not mentioned that much is Meloetta, so lets go over her.

View attachment 546695

The Return Of (Bascu)Legion

Its the return of the funny fish.
100/100/94/153/146/109/702

The Return Of (Bascu)Legion

Useful Abilities: Adaptability, Mold Breaker.
Meloetta already has cracked stats, but with Adaptability boosting Hyper Voice and Psychic/Psyshock to brutal levels of power, Meloetta is even more threatening. You can run Calm Mind, Choice Specs, Assault Vest, It Gets Rediculous

TLDR: sings with such force it can topple gods

Did anyone happen to kill a red spy on the way here?

Greninja time booooooiiiiiiiiiis
100/100/94/153/145/129/711
A blazing speed of 129, Choice Specs/Scarf with Protean is very funny, with and the buff to bulk is worth it.

TLDR: the singer is also a ninja

Greninja Time my boys
View attachment 546697

YEET THE CHILD!!!

Dragapult is a a good fusion
72/125/85/133/88/157/656

YEET THE CHILD!!!

Greninja with 157 Speed makes him incredibly fast, with 125 Attack and 133 Special Attack, you can run Special Battle Bond, Banded, Specs, Scarfed, Swords Dance, etc. run it as you wish.

TLDR: NinjaPult is very funny and versatile

Watery Soul Blade

Basculegions Male Variant is here
72/123/84/128/89/141/632
Useful Abilities: Adaptability/Mold Breaker
This fusion can be run pretty much any offensive way.

Let the waves engulf your spirit

Female Basculegion time
72/118/84/133/89/141/632
Useful Abilities: Adaptability/Mold Breaker
Like male but more special attack inclined

TLDR: The funny ghost fishes allows a lot of stuff with greninja
Also, I wish ash greninja was back.

Volcarona time my dudes
View attachment 546700

Ultimate Water-Based Soul Lamp

Basculegion-F
85/83/83/160/123/119/652
Useful Abilities: Adaptability/Mold Breaker
A powerful quiver dance user that is disgusting after just 1 quiver dance. Use Adaptability for even more power or mold breaker to break through Heatran.

TLDR: Haha quiver dance go brrrrrr

A dance of fire

The pure gen 5 fusion
85/79/84/167/137/122/674
Useful Abilities: Serene Grace
Game plan: Quiver dance 1 or 2 times, click Fiery Dance, Air Slash, and your choice of coverage move.

TLDR: this dance sets the stage ablaze

View attachment 555420
The Return of The King

I’m Da Biggest Bord

An Absolute Beast with Unaware
84/111/116/127/117/68
Useful Abilities: Unaware
This Bird is very hard to kill, and has a lot of tools.

TLDR: The Wide Bird is funny

I hate to do this to you, but Dragapult is banned.

 

[Flexpikachu]

Both are walled by + , at least the sets you described

No Brother, the amount of attack boost is enough to kill both

 

[Jrdn]

Figured I'd drop my favourite team of the last little bit. Got me to #2 and I think I could get #1 with it, but I change teams too much

 

[Hiusi guy]

Beeg Slate	Hidin	Zastra	Orangex	Hiusi guy	TaxFraud	Result
Manaphy	Ban	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	3-0-2 BANNED
Hearthflame Mask	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	5-0-0 BANNED
Sneasler	DNB	Ban	Ban	Ban	DNB	3-2-0 BANNED
Walking Wake	Ban	Ban	DNB	Abstain	Ban	3-1-1 BANNED
Iron Moth	Ban	Ban	Ban	DNB	DNB	3-2-0 BANNED
Gholdengo	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	DNB	2-1-2 BANNED
Cresselia	Ban	DNB	Abstain	DNB	Abstain	1-2-2 NOT BANNED
Regenerator	Abstain	DNB	DNB	DNB	DNB	0-4-1 NO BAN
Single Ability Clause	DNImplement	Abstain	DNImplement	DNImplement	DNImplement	0-4-1 NO IMPLEMNTAION

Going out of the omotm with a bang.
MANAPHY, HEARTHFLAME MASK, SNEASLER, WALKING WAKE, IRON MOTH, AND GHOLDENGO HAVE ALL BEEN BANNED​

I'll give my brief explanations on these bans tho whenever TaxFraud gets on I'll let them do a better explanation for the fact that they know more and are way better than me

My quirky but not fully wrong takes

The blue demon, this thing came back and brought not only tail glow sweeper sets but also defensive regenvester sets and take heart sweeping sets and now it can gain more stats beyond base 100 everything and a new ability?!?!?!? Yeah no it makes sense on why we banned it, though for specifically me I personally though it was walled pretty easily by unaware but then again you could just take games after taking down the unaware mon.

Known by many as the "Dracovish of gen 9" oger is pretty flexible in terms of what it can use being either self sufficient with hax or an adapt fuse or it can be a deadly sun sweeper with sd and chloro to basically just win some games immediately, basically mon went to crazy too many times

Surprising that having a dummy attack stat with dummy speed to outspeed almost every relevent mon whilst ohko/2hkoing a good amount of defensive "checks" gets you banned, what makes it worse is that it also now gets new abilites beyond just ptouch and speed redundency but instead it gets tclaws or even tlens if you're crazy enough. Basically just clicks buttons and you can't do much except for pray that you could get your check in safely.

From what I here it was the main adversary to ogerpon and it's sunny shenanigans and it makes pretty good sense. Water/Dragon/Fire coverage still has limited counterplay besides things that would be bad in literally any other mu like wabs fairies or azumarill, what then makes it harder to deal with is the fact that now it also has knock off and flip turn allowing it to remove av from regenvesters and pivot around to physical teammates that may benefit from the sun it spawns to then push through any of it's checks.

252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Iron Moth(Braviary-H) Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey(Clodsire) in Sun: 312-368 (43.6 - 51.5%) -- 8.2% chance to 2HKO Chi-yu part two, this calc is more to show how stupid moth can be seeing how you need to have max spd just to survive with blissey, obvi chansey tanks it better but still gets worn down by hazards. Though I voted DNB mainly because it dies instantly to a faster retaliation and it being a one trick pony with good enough counterplay like resists and immune ablilties.

Cheese Stick. I myself havent ran into ghold nor have I used it much so this is mostly assuming. I assume that it used sets similar to pre dlc where it fuses with uxie or azelf to get levitate and either a good amount of bulk or a good amount of spa and spe, but now it can also use MGLO sets with steel beam which is dangerously powerful, as well it was the only mon to pass gag which has very nasty hazard stacking potential that was abused earlier on and still used to great success just having less usage.

Putting cress and regen together because I feel the same about them. They are both balanced, and unless truly shown to be needed we will prob not vote on regen again .

(They all have blaze, idk what else to do besides an ability theme) Single ability clause is interesting until you realize that most people that want it are mainly trying to step around just banning regen and that there is no real need for 1ac because most abilities have smaller list of mons that have it or are bad when spammed.

Tagging Kris to implement if you want to, because it is kinda almost the end of this being challengable on PS! for now.

 

[Tankey6ia]

Professor Porygon2 is here to post some sets! Hopefully these were not thought of, but if they were, then i'm sorry for bloat.
Cloyster
As a sweeper
+
Stats: 50/131/202/100/62/94
I think this fused with focus sash (if you are scared by special attackers) could make for a good sweeper with Mold Breaker. Of course it is pretty slow before a shell smash, but its amazing defense generally allows it to live a physical hit and then smash, boosting its attack, special attack, and speed.
Possible Items: Focus Sash, Loaded Dice, White Herb
Disclaimer: Don't go Skill Link + Loaded Dice, it is redundant.

Shell Smash Sweeper

Hax! or us? (Cloyster) @ White Herb/Loaded Dice
Ability: Mold Breaker/Skill Link
EVs: 196 HP / 60 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Rock Blast
- Razor Shell (yes it gets that)

Checks and Counters
/+
These have literally 250 and 255 HP respectively and pretty decent defenses. They could cripple Cloyster with Thunder Wave while Cloyster Shell Smashes, then they could wear cloyster down with Seismic toss. However, if the Chansey/Blissey is at around 25%, then it will die to an Icicle Spear.

Unaware pokemon could stop a physical sweeper like Cloyster pretty easily if it doesn't have mold breaker, as they could negate the attack boosts and deal damage back or simply set up and break through Cloyster. However, if Cloyster does have Mold Breaker, then the unaware pokemon has to get an Ability Shield to keep blocking the stat boosts.
As support
+
Stats: 50/120/217/110/82/82
Cloyster could also work as a support role, lowering attack with Chilling Water and using protect to get more Leftovers Recovery. It also can set up Spikes for hazard stacking. It has its own form of speed control with Mud Shot or Icy Wind, and Life Dew to recover itself, even though it only gives 25%. Alternatively, you can have Aqua Ring to restore 1/16th of your HP each turn, and when combined with Leftovers and Protect, is the same as a Poison Heal... heal.

Support Set

Diancie (Cloyster) @ Leftovers
Ability: Shell Armor
IVs: 0 Atk
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Protect
- Aqua Ring
- Mud Shot/Icy Wind
- Spikes

Hoopa
+
Stats: 80/133/105/171/141/87
Instead of increasing its offensive potential, this fusion tries to increase the defensive potential with Cloyster! The special defense of Hoopa is already pretty good, so it is the normal defense we need to bolster. For support, it has dual screens, sunny day to activate Protosynthesis and other sun-related abilities, Thunder Wave for speed control, Trick Room, and trick itself. For offense, it has Drain Punch to recover HP, Gunk Shot, Hyperspace Hole to break through protect stallers, Shadow Ball, Thunderbolt, Knock Off, and Energy Ball.

Dual Screens

Cloyster (Hoopa) @ Light Clay
Ability: Shell Armor
IVs: 0 Atk
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Bold Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen/Sunny Day
- Psychic
- Thunder Wave

Yes, it does suffer from no pivot move, but it enables teammates to set up and sweep, or faint mons at low HP if it needs to.

 

[OmastarOmastar]

Tauros (Gengar) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Thunderbolt


Gengar,Tauros is a Pokemon that excels at dishing out Fast hard hitting Special Attacks, its good Speed stat and it's good Special attack pairing with Sheer Force Life Orb makes it excel towards Mid-Late game when everything is Chipped down so it can just spam Shadow balls and Focus blasts, and to boost its Special attack it can use Nasty plot if you want more F amage, it can run a variety of Coverage moves like Thunderbolt to hit Corviknight, Focus Blast to hit dark types like Ting Lu and hit Steel Types like Goodra-Hisui, and Energy Ball for a more accurate move against Ting-Lu and to Hit the Ground types but Energy Ball sets struggle against Goodra-Hisui so it's a bit niche, its can also use Taunt to disrupt Pokemon who would want to Recover on it or Pokemon that want to Set up on it.

 

[Fracterra]

Beeg Slate	Hidin	Zastra	Orangex	Hiusi guy	TaxFraud	Result
Manaphy	Ban	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	3-0-2 BANNED
Hearthflame Mask	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	5-0-0 BANNED
Sneasler	DNB	Ban	Ban	Ban	DNB	3-2-0 BANNED
Walking Wake	Ban	Ban	DNB	Abstain	Ban	3-1-1 BANNED
Iron Moth	Ban	Ban	Ban	DNB	DNB	3-2-0 BANNED
Gholdengo	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	DNB	2-1-2 BANNED
Cresselia	Ban	DNB	Abstain	DNB	Abstain	1-2-2 NOT BANNED
Regenerator	Abstain	DNB	DNB	DNB	DNB	0-4-1 NO BAN
Single Ability Clause	DNImplement	Abstain	DNImplement	DNImplement	DNImplement	0-4-1 NO IMPLEMNTAION

Going out of the omotm with a bang.
MANAPHY, HEARTHFLAME MASK, SNEASLER, WALKING WAKE, IRON MOTH, AND GHOLDENGO HAVE ALL BEEN BANNED​

I'll give my brief explanations on these bans tho whenever TaxFraud gets on I'll let them do a better explanation for the fact that they know more and are way better than me

My quirky but not fully wrong takes

The blue demon, this thing came back and brought not only tail glow sweeper sets but also defensive regenvester sets and take heart sweeping sets and now it can gain more stats beyond base 100 everything and a new ability?!?!?!? Yeah no it makes sense on why we banned it, though for specifically me I personally though it was walled pretty easily by unaware but then again you could just take games after taking down the unaware mon.

Known by many as the "Dracovish of gen 9" oger is pretty flexible in terms of what it can use being either self sufficient with hax or an adapt fuse or it can be a deadly sun sweeper with sd and chloro to basically just win some games immediately, basically mon went to crazy too many times

Surprising that having a dummy attack stat with dummy speed to outspeed almost every relevent mon whilst ohko/2hkoing a good amount of defensive "checks" gets you banned, what makes it worse is that it also now gets new abilites beyond just ptouch and speed redundency but instead it gets tclaws or even tlens if you're crazy enough. Basically just clicks buttons and you can't do much except for pray that you could get your check in safely.

From what I here it was the main adversary to ogerpon and it's sunny shenanigans and it makes pretty good sense. Water/Dragon/Fire coverage still has limited counterplay besides things that would be bad in literally any other mu like wabs fairies or azumarill, what then makes it harder to deal with is the fact that now it also has knock off and flip turn allowing it to remove av from regenvesters and pivot around to physical teammates that may benefit from the sun it spawns to then push through any of it's checks.

252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Iron Moth(Braviary-H) Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey(Clodsire) in Sun: 312-368 (43.6 - 51.5%) -- 8.2% chance to 2HKO Chi-yu part two, this calc is more to show how stupid moth can be seeing how you need to have max spd just to survive with blissey, obvi chansey tanks it better but still gets worn down by hazards. Though I voted DNB mainly because it dies instantly to a faster retaliation and it being a one trick pony with good enough counterplay like resists and immune ablilties.

Cheese Stick. I myself havent ran into ghold nor have I used it much so this is mostly assuming. I assume that it used sets similar to pre dlc where it fuses with uxie or azelf to get levitate and either a good amount of bulk or a good amount of spa and spe, but now it can also use MGLO sets with steel beam which is dangerously powerful, as well it was the only mon to pass gag which has very nasty hazard stacking potential that was abused earlier on and still used to great success just having less usage.

Putting cress and regen together because I feel the same about them. They are both balanced, and unless truly shown to be needed we will prob not vote on regen again .

(They all have blaze, idk what else to do besides an ability theme) Single ability clause is interesting until you realize that most people that want it are mainly trying to step around just banning regen and that there is no real need for 1ac because most abilities have smaller list of mons that have it or are bad when spammed.

Tagging Kris to implement if you want to, because it is kinda almost the end of this being challengable on PS! for now.

Wowwww, love the saturation of offensive mons bans, making play less creative, making stall even less challengable than before, and making the meta less fun. Because this meta had to be more defense based. To address the decisions, my opinions
Sneasler is wise, as well as Ogerpon-H.
Prehaps Manaphy as well, but we will see.
Cress, SAC, and Regenerator should have been banned and implemented, respectively.
Walking wake should have not been banned.
Gholdengo I agree with.
Iron Moth I also agree with.
This meta does not seem to be balanced, which needs to change.

oh woah another ban list where we don't touch the oppressive defensive mons of the tier but instead ban all of the offensive checks to said mons

can't wait for every fucking game to turn into 1000 turn draws thanks to regen spam being the only unrestricted thing in the meta

Agreed, I get hit with stall teams almost every game at this point, and Cress getting Regenerator from Glowking is not fun. At least Toxapex is banned… never mind, if I have to say, “at least Toxapex is banned, that’s an upside”, and that is the only upside I can think of off the top of my head, it’s not healthy.

I hate to do this to you, but Dragapult is banned.

Well, that is an upside, then they stayed on the spree of banning (mostly) offense mons.

Final Opinion: This meta needs fixing, and it’s even more broken then before Pult’s ban. At least Pult had priority weaknesses to give it (admittedly limited) counterplay. Stall is much harder to take down, and is just generally unfun and not engaging to play against it it’s current state.
TLDR: What was broken got broken even more.

 

[Billl21]

Stall is definitely not broken right now. It is very much beatable. There are still many strong wallbreakers in the tier that can break stall with proper play, even after the bans. Once I get home, I'll do some testing and make a longer post discussing some ways to beat stall.

 

[abemaster5]

The Streets were saying Sneasler was broken? I only found it mildly annoying at times with serene grace but nothing too serious, its dummy fast and hits hard but I never found it as oppressive as the other pokemon that was banned, It wasn't on my mind when buliding a team i just happen to have a mon to handle it. But understandable, I can how could be pushed over the edge.

For the rest though? Good Riddance, iron moth was a top opp and was just as broken as enamorus, it had recovery and hit way harder. I was hoping Good as Gold would get banned instead of Gholdengo but a win is a win, those hazard stacking teams can be laid to rest now. Wake and the FIre mask dude was super broken, did yall know the ability shield exists? Saw it on a flash fire corv once time and was shocked. However it gets knocked off very easily and now ogrepon goes stupid.

I wonder why a 1 ability clause wasn't added, these pokemon were the best wall breakers around and stall lowkey got super good now they don't need to handle these mons, but its the end of the month anyway so.. good luck with those who stay

 

[CW1999]

Stats:
75 159 97 73 125 114
Roaring Moon (Ceruledge) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bitter Blade
- Close Combat
- Poltergeist
- Solar Blade
I have discovered Cereledge to quite good on sun, basically get a sun boost with photosynthesis and hit hard. Helps that its got solar blade for resisted targets.

 

[Tankey6ia]

Quaquaval
Adaptable Duck
+
Stats: 85/148/96/105/93/104
Adaptability sure lets a lot of mons be viable... Anyways, Quaquaval has the unique move Aqua step, which makes the duck go faster and faster until it is a fighter jet. Combine this with a good stab of Fighting and you have a sweeper on your hands. This can break through Goodra-Hisui as well as Ting-lu with Close Combat. For the third and fourth moves... You can have Swords Dance and either Facade to get through burn, or a pivot move such as Flip Turn/U-turn.

Adaptability Sweeper

Basculegion (Quaquaval) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Step
- Close Combat
- Swords Dance
- Facade

 

[zezaktest]

all the people saying regen stall is busted are either making bad teams, or are running teams with the same kind of power as regen. you can very easily get past regen, it is really good but it isn't unbreakable. phys def regen mons can't run anything to boost their effective defense without using a move, like intimidate or an item. spdef mons have the same situation (no unaware) but they can run AV, but many have weaknesses: hoodra has a ground and fighting weakness while having a lower phsydef, a-muk, meloetta, and roaring moon (I haven't seen much of regenvest moon) have a low physdef. regenvesters like tusk have to invest heavily into spdef because of their very low spdef stat, because its so low it makes them effectively less specially bulky than other regenvesters. in turn they have better physdef.

 

[abemaster5]

all the people saying regen stall is busted are either making bad teams, or are running teams with the same kind of power as regen. you can very easily get past regen, it is really good but it isn't unbreakable. phys def regen mons can't run anything to boost their effective defense without using a move, like intimidate or an item. spdef mons have the same situation (no unaware) but they can run AV, but many have weaknesses: hoodra has a ground and fighting weakness while having a lower phsydef, a-muk, meloetta, and roaring moon (I haven't seen much of regenvest moon) have a low physdef. regenvesters like tusk have to invest heavily into spdef because of their very low spdef stat, because its so low it makes them effectively less specially bulky than other regenvesters. in turn they have better physdef.

You're out of your mind if you don't think the regen spam is oppressive.. theres multiple regen mons you can run, what beats goodra doesn't always beat melotta or muk. phys def regen mons can easily be stacked with each other, great tusk, mola, corvi, and sometimes dozo. A common stall core would have 2 or more regenvest mons and anything in between for the rest. The regen mons also have moves to handle set up.. mola has scald/chilling water, great tusk can knock off + bulk up, hoodra has dragon tail and heavy slam for fairies and Dondozo as a whole invalidates most set up sweepers, blissey can run calm mind if its not unaware (which it very commonly does). Makes it extremely difficult to take down a stall team, the only breaker i've used is guts ursaluna with wish support that does very well agaisnt it, Aside from that, stall is increibly oppressive in this metagame now that most of the breakers are gone.

 

[Schpoonman]

I have noticed that a number of the ladder peaking teams have two Regens. For sake of posterity, someone at a computer want to see how many of these teams are using an Ability more than once?

Salty scrub edit incoming.

I could be blind, but I found four posts with peaks, one of which was during the NGas blip on the ladder, so I'll toss that team (it was running two NGas, evil). Don Vascus's 4 Regen stall, TaxFraud's Weavile Beat Up Offense and SFLO Volc Screens, and Jrdn's Sniper Hydreigon Offense. Of the four teams pasted in the above links, only TaxFraud's screens team has less than two Regenerators, and in fact has none.

I don't think stall has a stranglehold on the tier at all, the multiple offensive teams peaking the ladder is proof of that, but Regen is, if not problematic, clearly head-and-shoulders above most other Abilities in terms of strength and viability.

 

[Raoul Sanchez]

Thank god for these bans, I'm glad people realized how cheap ogerpon hearthflame mask was. I literally just fused it with regular ogerpon (yes that works) and it would easily sweep teams who thought unaware was their answer to sweepers.

 

[Billl21]

wait, 8 of them just got banned, we banned weavile, zama was banned from start, same with urshifu, Iron Valiant and Iron Hands are both banned, Bax is banned, Anni-ape is banned, Stakeout and Unburden are banned. When everything just gets +30 to their defenses and regen/other great abilities, standard "wall breakers" won't cut it (especially considering we also banned weather comps for being "too offensively strong" e.g, it broke regen cores)

I'm teambuilding chill out for a second lol

 

[Tankey6ia]

Honestly, walled by GTusk and Dozo, and Alolomola for that matter

I can literally post for any "offensive set" on this page, and guarenteed it's either been banned or doesn't actually break the Regen core

252+ Atk Adaptability Basculegion (Quaquaval) Aqua Step vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tornadus-T (Great Tusk): 296-352 (79.7 - 94.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
I don't think being 2HKOing by something qualifies as a wall for that something...

252+ Atk Adaptability Basculegion (Quaquaval) Aqua Step vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tornadus-T (Great Tusk): 228-272 (52.5 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Even Max defense won't save you!


252+ Atk Adaptability Basculegion (Quaquaval) Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowking (Dondozo): 186-220 (36.9 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
This is BEFORE a Swords Dance, and max defense. Let's see about after...

+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Basculegion (Quaquaval) Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowking (Dondozo): 370-436 (73.4 - 86.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Dozo needs to switch out before it gets 2HKO'd, and the Quaquaval can SD again for even more power.


252+ Atk Adaptability Basculegion (Quaquaval) Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Diancie (Alomomola): 204-242 (38.2 - 45.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Similar calcs for Dondozo and Alomomola, but Alomomola has less attack so Quaquaval can freely set up and then sweep.

In short, the things you mentioned are not true walls.