Metagame BDSP PU (Tier shifts @ Post #79)

Now that BDSPPL is over i would like to make some posts about the current state of the meta with as many replays as possible to back it up.

General Overview:

This meta is actually pretty great, with a few minor caveats which will be explained throughout the post.

Why is the meta "great"?

If i could summarize this concept in one word it would be flexibility. Throught BDSPPL we saw a wide array of different team comps, here are a few of my favorite replays as examples

Offense:
Sticky Webs by 5dots and myself
Trick Room by myself
Offense by somalia

Balance:
Bulky Offense by Somalia
Balance (probably the most prominent style) by plznostep

Stall:
Semi stall by Somalia
Stall by Larry

As we can see, there is quite a lot of flexibility in the teams you can build that can be viable picks in tournament settings making BDSP PU a surprisingly fun yet competitive tier with a good amount of freedom for creative teambuilding while retaining competitive viability. However, this does not mean the metagame is completely balanced and there are a few points i would like to touch on that were brought to my attention during this tournament.

Meta defining mons:

1. Kadabra :kadabra:

I would say this is the most meta defining mon in the tier without a doubt. Kadabra holds the 2nd highest spA in the tier (10 spA behind glaceon) with a staggering base 105 speed making it the 9th fastest mon in the tier. Kadabra usually holds the Life orb + Magic Guard combo further boosting its special attack without the drawback of being choiced locked into a single move and without receiving recoil due to its ability.
There are quite a few factors that contribute to Kadabra's dominance in the tier.

- Lack of Steel types:
The tier's steel types are reduced to Probopass :Probopass:, Mawile, Bastiodon and Wormadam Trash with Probo being the dominant steel in the tier (more on Mario later) and the other three have big flaws in fulfilling their role as a steel type or they are simply heavily outclassed by Probopass.

-Lack of Dark types:
There are no viable dark types.

-Lack of Priority moves:
Besides arbok and mawile there is not much access to priority. Other notable mons with priority such as purugly, dugtrio and persian already outspeed kadabra naturally.

While some form of counterplay is available to Kadabra (mainly in the form of Probopass or running a lot of Bulky mons) its dominance is heavily asserted by its ability to 2h KO almost every mon in the tier bar the steel types. To make matters worse, the Kadabra-Probopass interaction can be heavily abused by Future Sight as showcased in this game, which honestly might be what pushes kadabra over the edge for me and i do believe Kadabra to be a problematic force in the tier that could require some tiering action.

2. Chatot :Chatot:

A little more manageable however still extremely punishing for unprepared teams. Even tought it only has a base 92 spA it has access to the move Boomburst. With the context of there being basically no ghosts in the tier, it is pretty much a better boomburst spammer than Exploud. As if not enough, chatot has access to two of the better pivot moves in u turn and parting shot to get out of unfavorable Matchups (basically only Probopass or spdef Rock type). Usually, chatot will just click boomburst if its out and heavily dent unprepared teams and click pivot move if the opponent has a Probopass. Chatot is a little more manageable because of its rock weakness and lower speed tier making it revengeable by mons such as leafeon, kadabra, manetric. However, base 91 speed is still a very respectable speed tier.

3. Probopass :Probopass:

Meta defining only basically because the last two mons force it on every team that is not HO or Offense. Even if there was no Kadabra or Chatot in the tier, Probopass would still be finding itself in most teams because of its supportive capabilities mainly throught moves like Stealth Rock, Thunder Wave and Volt Switch. Probopass also has some good offensive power due to the unwallable combo of rock + ground move making it not as passive for a defensive mon.

Other Mentions:

Lumineon: One of the best defoggers in the tier that holds respectable bulk, gives the team a water immunity via Storm Drain and can pivot out with u-turn and makes progress with scald. This mon is quite good and i find myself slotting it on a lot of my teams.

Monferno: Very good choiced mon. Access to u- turn and the strong fire/fight combo with high BP moves to back it up. Immensily strong when rocks are up as it forces its checks such as Altaria and Pelipper to take rocks damage. Althought rarer, monferno has other roles such as dedicated lead and sd sweeper.

Tangela: We all know what Tangrowth does and what Tangela does. Despite the lack of eviolite in this meta, it still holds its position as one of the premier physical walls in the tier. Also able to make progress via sleep powder, knock off and making good use of a base 100 spA.

Gabite: Quite to my surprise, gabite is a fantastic physical attacker that also has access to rocks. Very good at making progress vs teams that lack tangela mainly. While its speed tier and bulk is nothing stellar, ground and dragon makes for a fantastic combo.

Conclusion:

Personally, i would like to see future action on either Kadabra or Chatot leaning more towards Kadabra. While the counterplay is there, it is not much and its not difficult to chip down its checks. Despite this, this meta is a very fun one and i can see it becoming even better with a few more developments.
 
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With the conclusion of BDSPPL III I wanna announce two new additions to the council! Welcome plznostep and Scarf Kricketune !!! Both have been constant and recurrent top players in the tier and I'm sure they'll help contribute even further as council now. And with that said:

Council will be holding a vote on the majority of Pokemon in current PUBL, as well as recent problems addressed in SK post such as Kadabra and Chatot. With this slate coming hopefully at the end of the week. I've invited igiveuponaname and SOMALIA for their performance in PU open and BDSPPL respectively.

Stay tuned!
 
Results are up!

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chimecho.gif

With a variety of mons to vote on and checking potential threats, I'm glad that we covered most PUBL for a re-evaluation as said before. With 50% + 1 for a decision, Chimecho is now freed on BDSP PU!

Chimecho was originally banned for its scary snowball potential in Stored Power sets since the lack of defensive counterplay to Psychic types in the tier, of course we'll keep an eye on how this develops on the tier, as well as Kadabra who got 4/8 votes in the near future!

What are your thoughts on Psychic types in PU, and the overall slate votes? Also the NU webs ban and how it affects PU! Will like to hear your thoughts!

Edit: Wanna thank SOMALIA and igiveuponaname for their contribution to the votes in this slate!

Tagging Tbolt the new Marty
 
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And finally, we, us. At the bottom of the barrel. End the viability tiering shifts. With all said, we only have to cutoff from latest NU viability rankings for our wins and loses. We decided B- would be the drop cutoff. Meaning that rank and below would be PU, and B and above, NU.

The changes itself are the following:

Rises:

:pmd/abomasnow: PUBL -> NU
:pmd/kangaskhan: PUBL -> NU
:pmd/ludicolo: PUBL -> NU
:pmd/smeargle: PUBL -> NU
:pmd/sneasel: PUBL -> NU
:pmd/gorebyss: PUBL -> NU

:pmd/glaceon: PU -> NU
:pmd/porygon2: PU -> NU
:pmd/poliwrath: PU -> NU
:pmd/leafeon: PU -> NU
:pmd/whiscash: PU -> NU
:pmd/weezing: PU -> NU
:pmd/bellossom: PU -> NU (sad)
:pmd/kadabra: PU -> NU
:pmd/victreebel: PU -> NU

Drops:

:pmd/drifblim: NU -> PU
:pmd/ditto: NU -> PU
:pmd/rhydon: NU -> PU
:pmd/shiftry: NU -> PU
:pmd/jolteon: NU -> PU
:pmd/torkoal: NU -> PU
:pmd/sandslash: NU -> PU

Edit: forgot torkoal and sandslash
(HELP)
Tagging Tbolt to implement these changes. <3

Since a big voting on PUBL was made not so long ago, we're not retesting anything until games are performed, with such big of a meta change. This would be a big shift on viability anyway. See ya o/
 
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I see Rhydon dropping and I genuinely wonder what that means, if anything, for Golem's viability. Not just that but Sandslash too. I do know back in regular DPP the three co-existed just fine, but that was when Explosion halved Defense.

Otherwise I think the list of newcomers seem quite neat. More hazard control, a neat (albeit limited movepool) fast Attacker in Jolteon, and Ditto in case you need it for something.
 
Little theorycrafting

Winners:

:dugtrio: - Pretty obvious, lost 5 checks and its main counter in weezing, very hard to switch into, Tangela suffers from Sludge bomb and Solrock/Lunatone arent easy to fit, Chimecho does well into it tho.

:tangela: Kept as the few good grass and its clearly the best, great into rhydon, phys shiftry, sandslash and general pivot, great slot no matter what

:chatot: Probopass is less needed as both Glaceon, p2 and kadabra left. Means this could find less probo on its way to get loud

:pelipper: Sandslash appearance makes for a great synergy with peli, making it free defog for hurricane, and suddenly this guy is very hard to switch into while being defensive.

:manectric: Yeah it struggles with Rhydon now but it lost whiscash, bello and other grass which forces it to overheat whereas Tangela just takes too much. Also better than Jolteon still

:floatzel: No poliwrath no bello and lumineon is less needed cuz sandslash can remove hazards, this thing looks great as special breaker now

:glalie: & :lapras: No glaceon and freeze dry goes free into most of the tier, both punish probo and spikes still good, lapras has better typing.

:meganium: Lowkey decent now that theres no grass types and if u want a better check to dugtrio while also the rest of ground types

:girafarig: Why is this not used I think because Kadabra just hit better without boosting but it has a bunch of cool tools and great ability.

:dusclops: Can make a comeback as a Duggy + chatot check. I can see it doing better

Losers:

:probopass: Technically less needed, doesnt do great into sandslash. But its healthy this guy isnt pseudo-mandatory now and it goes from SSS to A+

:muk: Really falls down, struggles with sandslash rhydon and drifblim, and harder to justify now that Bello and company are gone. You can try do AoA with giga drain a la lgpe I guess

:arbok: Same deal but less heavy, sandslash just makes this have a hard time but its more offensive and can defend with eq or crunch into his new checks

:lumineon: Less mandatory, same as probo with sandslash now.

:golem: Has his brother making competition

:dodrio: Another fly and normal resistance, still decently good

:vibrava: Sounds harder to justify now with sandslash and I think this was legit good before because of role compression, I guess still walls dugtrio + manectric so I might be wrong.

:rapidash: +2 aint killing neither of the new ground types, struggles to setup

:armaldo: this shit was always bad now it can be forever forgotten we have sandslash now

Count the times I mentioned sandslash in this post its kinda funny o7
 
I generally agree with what you said about who won and who lost with the recent tier shifts, but imo you're underselling Lapras extremely hard here. At least for the time being (it is still relatively early in this meta after all), from the games I've played and teams I've built, Lapras is a top 5 mon in the tier at minimum.

Lapras has been finding its way onto many of my teams since it is so unbelievably bulky with 130/80/95 bulk, a partial Water-typing, Water Absorb as an ability, and an amazing STAB combo with Surf/Hydro Pump and Freeze Dry with good coverage too. That's like, basic dex info, but I think it was worth going over it real quick to understand why I think Lapras is so good. Because Lapras has such insane bulk it can afford to fully invest into its respectable spatk stat and still have a bunch of leftover EVs to invest into its bulk and speed which makes it insanely good at trading positively with nearly the entire metagame. In a tier such as this with lots of good offensive threats but fewer truly good defensive pieces, being able to consistently tank hits and dish out damage in return is extremely useful, especially on more offensive teams. That being said I find Lapras's ability to trade extremely well to be useful on basically any non HO or stall team.

Another good trait I think is worth mentioning is Lapras's ability to take advantage of nearly every form of hazard removal in the tier since it hits literally all of them for super effective damage with its STAB moves and the vast majority can do little if anything in return to it. This can basically put opponents into a catch-22 where if they try and remove hazards they let Lapras in for free but if they try and punish the Lapras switch they're likely to have hazards stay up on their end of the field.

Some other quick bullet points I can't really find ways to elaborate on much
  • SubTect is probably my favourite set since Lapras's STABs are good enough on their own and you can really take advantage of more passive mons and/or switches to set up a subsititute
  • Protect in general I really like on Lapras as it lets it scout choice locks from the likes of Manectric or Monferno while also letting Lapras accumulate more Leftovers recovery
  • Rocks weakness matters less than I thought it would since once again, Lapras is so bulky it can usually trade favourably regardless
  • Lapras as a whole is just really good at punishing passive plays from the opponent (that is not to say though that defensive teams can't handle Lapras)
  • Tier shifts caused a bunch of good Lapras checks to leave the tier which is another reason why I think it's so good now compared to pre-shifts

I was originally planning on waiting until the tour was done to showcase some teams but since I'm on the topic of Lapras I figured I might as well share some. I used these in round 1.
:dodrio: :dugtrio: :lapras: :arbok: :golem: :hypno: https://pokepast.es/38f07fc7db9d2fe3 (Lapras is EV'd to have 101 HP substitutes, always live specs Boomburst from Chatot after rocks or a sub, along with having enough speed to outspeed Jolly Rhydon)

:chatot: :gabite: :lapras: :lunatone: :arbok: :shiftry: https://pokepast.es/532f4e59c2222191 (Lapras is EV'd to always live specs Thunderbolt from Manectric from full and outspeed uninvested base 70s)

so yea

:ss/lapras:
 
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Hello BDSPUers!

After the PU post-shifts tour, council decided to vote on the problematic Pokemon we saw were popping out too much. The impactful tier changes, with multiple Pokemon leaving the tier left big changes. With all that, I gotta announce that Chatot and Drifblim are banned from the PU tier!


Captura de pantalla 2025-07-12 165054.png


Chatot was always on the radar since Boomburst is incredibly oppresive and skilless, in teambuilding it forces Probopass or a combination between a Spdef Rock type + Ghost type like Drifblim or Misdreavus, which could get heavily hindered by a single Chatter, its also fast enough to come and revenge kill and make holes on a team. Its oppresive nature was always an issue, and now Probopass is indirectly less needed due to Glaceon, Kadabra and P2 leaving.

Drifblim main set that made it be on the chopping block was its CM unburden that was simply unhealthy for the tier, Strength Sap is a broken move and STAB Shadow Ball + Tbolt hits everything not named Shiftry neutrally. It has a Volcarona effect which is very restricting when playing, it can not be able to perform its sweep sometimes, but when you get it right one turn, it can demolish and 6-0 without problem. Making it simply too much

Other threats like Shiftry weren't banned and just proposed as problems, as well as Dugtrio that was mentioned. We'll keep an eye on those for the future for sure. See ya ^^

My boi Tbolt for changes
 
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