Tournament The Official OLT XII Discussion Thread

[alkazoth]

Art by ium
​

Welcome to the offical OLT XII Discussion Thread! In the next couple of weeks while this tournament is taking place, players will load up games on the OU ladder and grind to the top in the hopes of reaching the top 8 to qualify for the OLT playoffs. This thread's purpose is to engage in discussion regarding the OLT meta, reoccurring meta trends, and to share teams. This thread will highlight the 8 winners plus contain a long post summarizing all the metagame changes and ladder trends in the OLT meta after each cycle.

Interested in participating? Click here to access the OLT subforum and sign up in the appropriate thread!

 

[alkazoth]

Team archive throughout all 4 cycles of OLT
Hyper Offense









Bulky Offense / Balance




























(Bond)






































Stall



Weather




Trick Room

 

[Storm Zone]

Hello, so this OLT felt less fun than the last 4 ive done so far, mostly because of the Lame stalls, i tried to play with as little good teams as possible, mostly known, teams i made last year, that still works, i wanted to save all the new ones for the playoffs but, i ended up using just 2 anyway, even if i didnt make it i knew i would in future cycles, but mostly i loaded bulky offense i made from last year, here's what i used:

- https://pokepast.es/160864b1c832adaa
This has been one of the most consistent teams i have ever built and used, it has longevity from way back in the archaludon meta, and has withstood the test of time, being consistent for over a year and a half, vk also built a team similar to this with heatran over glowking on his own around the same time, and georgiethefirst made an edit to the original one, and put lando-t with scarf, over enamorus, and that version became one of the most popular teams in sv, super easy to pilot, has training wheels so its easy to learn, good mons, tera ice on physdef av glowking to beat kyurem teams, boots tusk, taunt oger to wear down opposing fat teams, specs raging breaker, scarf modest enamorus, i used to be timid but CTC put me on modest, of course 2 kingambits, because of healing wish haha, but yeah i encourage everyone to use this at one point in their cycle 2/3/4 runs.

- https://pokepast.es/d44ce50df0b71b8f
This was a newer build from earlier this year, the original idea of this team was a veils offense with booster spatk crown, glasses samu + card rocks glim hazard stacking core with a sinistcha to spinblock, and a zama for speed control, the veils version still exists but not as consistent, so i added a banded terablast fairy mamoswine, to take on stuff like gambit/raging bolt/zama, also resisting sucker and teraing from an electric immune into a dragon immune is good vs webs raging bolt. I showed leng the first version with the tales>mamoswine, they liked it alot and decided to make their own version, with their own creative tweaks like speed crown, booster atk tusk, and taunt gmolt, also a really nice version which i hope they post when they eventually qualify in future cycles. I encourage you to not spam this a whole lot, yeah it took me awhile to make another consistent veils given moon's departure, but i eventually came to this idea and its consistent enough to where it meets my threshold for a good consistent team(which has drastically gone up recently), so u can use this if u want, just dont spam it 100+ games, this may not be hard to cteam if ur not careful.

- https://pokepast.es/cad5753b61b3268f
This is a team that i made in January, I remember from my game vs Mako, in SCL last year, i made a new sub kyurem set, with substitute flash cannon ep freeze dry and tera steel, which reverses the matchup vs fairies like fairy garg and clef, and weavile + tera ice mons, while also not being wellspring fodder post tera, it is a very dangerous set that can win matchups off the bat especially vs balance if ur not careful, this was actually an edit of the specs raging bolt team that i posted above, i figured i could run another poison + an av primarina which i run whirlpool on to break stall, traps the pex with tera, force the gliscor tera gradually chip it, you use liquid voice to get psynoise to be ur primary water stab, so u dont have to use surf, which frees a slot for flip turn, so blissey cant chip you, you whirlpool psynoise flip forever, i encourage people to start using this as it is also a good learning team and it won me a game in the wcop qualifiers vs webs, due to tusk being boots, i figure i can run boots on the spinner and helmet on the physical wall(pecharunt), hope it goes well i hope atleast 5 people can qualify using this.

- https://pokepast.es/987976b4edc9d5e8
This was one of the new teams i made that i was supposed to save for the playoffs, but i have been experimenting alot and got really comfortable in the current meta, discovering alot of good teams and new team styles that people dont know about, so it should be fine sending this as its only revealing 1 of like roughly 150 at the moment, its the sub flash cannon kyurem set, on a galarian weezing type build, its only fitting i use a galarian weezing team as i was the first one who really believed it could be a good mon and built alot with it, has an iron defense roar zama, tera dark for psychic resist vs stuff like deoxys speed, standard garg rocks tect, tera steel metal coat gholdengo stallbreaker set, which can beat blissey, scarf lando for extra speed control on top of zama for annoying fat wellspring sets, this is a modification of my av hoopa balance from last olt, with a few anti stall tweaks and updated metagame knowledge. You can use it for a good matchup vs offense + fat, its one of the few archetypes that is good vs both.



- https://pokepast.es/4c775de783d1371b
I know i did not use this team during the cycle but, this team was very successful in tournament play recently in WCOP and in the OLT cycles, and im happy about it because initially, when i built this and tested it pre SPL on the ladder on my alt shikuleo, i wanted to bin it, i put it in the mediocre teams folder, because it did not perform well to my standard, thats probably because i kept losing to moon, but now that its gone, i modified the ting lu set, alongside ogerpon and specs raging, protect whirlwind has proven to be more consistent than rest talk, the ogerpon set is a bit different, im using taunt to prevent fatter structures from wearing the team down, but also taunt spikes u turn cudgel is a very consistent wellspring set on hstack, but what ive noticed is, spikes isnt necessary on a cinderace team, so i added encore to help certain matchups, and ease the pressure on bolt to handle lategame gambit, my standard specs raging bulky set, offensive cind, 3 atk roost corv, gives a very hard to break consistent style of team with good breaking power, initially, i really liked the Blimax team, and his team directly inspired this one, i am using his core, of ting lu glowking corviknight cinderace which is amazing, i wanted a version that had priority with an easier wellspring matchup, so i added ogerpon + raging, big shout out to blimax here for directly inspiring this team, he made like the greatest core in sv with this archetype, i encourage everybody to use it, this is a Blimax type build with a Storm edit, so its bound to be consistent as hell.

Final Thoughts:
If im being honest, yeah i know i did well this generation, yeah i like it more than 8, but i had nowhere near the confidence or playing ability that i did in gen 8, thats mainly because i did not explore it enough when i had the chance, too many suspects, metagame changes, bans, unbans, i could not really keep up, so i feel like i wasnt at my best all generation. But recently, as there hasnt been a metagame change in awhile, ive gotten really comfortable with the state of the current metagame, and kinda gravitated towards it, to where ive explored the current metagame a whole lot, and have loads of new team styles and archetypes that people havent discovered yet, and even mixing some playstyles in a consistent way, i made a folder for good cores, and a folder for teams, whatever 2-3-4 mon cores are good, tested well on ladder 15-2 and up on higher ladder, ill add it to that folder, teams that overperformed, dominant on the ladder, i added to the good teams folder, to have it on standby for whoever in this years olt playoffs and circuit, theres a mid/troll teams folder with like 400 ish teams, and a shit teams folder with the remaining 1k, and the good teams folder is at 164 rn, well 162 unknown ones since i had to use 2 to qual cuz the known teams wasnt enough, these are all distinct team styles, they look different from each other, just kind of stacking them up, that will be increasing over the summer, now that i have the teams down thats great but thats half the work, the second part is my play, throughout most of the generation, my play was garbage, the only time i have ever really played "well" was during OST time last year, every other time period of SV was just me playing very badly, and i wanted to fix that, so i focused hard on it, got my mental right, cuz it was struggling a bit irl, learning to play slower, use my timer more, and learning to make more midgrounds rather than raw predicts, and knowing when to make a play vs what player, thats what i would really be focusing on for this olt, just practicing my play, if im gonna be able to take on the tough competition during this olt, im going to need something that they dont, this will be the experience, probably, im not a believer in metagame changes mid tournament, so i hope that the metagame stays the same throughout the playoffs, even tho i want changes, its unfair to me when people are forced to learn a new meta mid tour, like make changes in between tours if u have to, not during them, anyway, i will be taking things very slow this olt, coming off a crushing smogon tour playoffs loss to soulwind, i was reviewing every single one of my games from start to finish all year, and trying to improve, so you're probably gonna get me at my best this olt during playoffs season, similar form to my 2022 sw/sh, will treat every opponent with the same respect, good prep, good, slow and consistent play, consistent team style, finding their weaknesses, as if they were the best player in the gen, the biggest mistake you can make is underestimating people, thats how you lose, dont believe me, see my match vs kate in spl, underestimated them, played fast, lost, i took that as a lesson, i still have a lot of work to do myself, i will try to keep finding new styles and learning them, while also improving my own play, ive had a weird OLT record, 0-3 in 2020, 3-0 in 2021, tourbanned bc of someone else after i quald in 2022, 3-0 in 2023 , 0-3 in 2024, and hopefully, i pray that this can finally be the year, and if its not, i will be proud of my performance because i know i worked and grinded hard enough for the result, i will push my own limitations here with extremely in depth play, prep, and practice, and hopefully, the grind pays off.

Good luck to all participants in cycles 2/3/4, i hope that these teams will help you qualify.

Shoutout to all my friends Blimax , leng loi , GaijinEagle , fakenagol , lax (for his youtube vids and in game analysis, one of the guys whose games i be studying to get better, alongside empo, blimax, vert and santu), Vert ,
oldspicemike , HYpertonix , @Longestbanana , Shaymin Sky , Duke
hellom , Pokemh , Pinecoishot , AquiIo , @longestbanana (sorry i couldnt find the smogon name lmao), One Last Kiss , Ox the Fox , 3d , z0mOG , Dugtrio Is Broken , or whoever i missed, they all showed support this olt

On an additional note, sinistcha is amazing, i be drinkin that tea, pce.

 

[Nat]

hey, i was asked to make a post so i will, and yes it'll definitely have a further guide on how to qualify for olt, besides my original guide in 2023. this post will firstly have some personal exposition, so i apologize to the uninterested.

if you had told me i was going to play OLT and for the 2nd time in a row finish 1st in the cycle, i'd have not believed you. i truly had no intentions of playing this tournament despite requests & desires from friends, with this rejection mainly being the knowledge of how bad i can get on ladder & telling someone i care about that i wouldn't play. i haven't practiced OU in almost 2 months, with even the NU to the top series I did being recorded in early June. i further haven't made an OU team since SPL, though the biggest thing was that it's been a very emotional, upsetting couple of weeks in my life. So, to make a long story short, I surprisingly found myself in OLT without much hope and with zero preparation. This run started poorly but turned out something I'm proud of, a rare thing in pokemon. I started 60-17, being 1950 elo for the first time. after that, i went 19-1 to 2157 pre-decay. This run had no snipes besides my last game, and I avoided the heinous stall everyone spammed lol. more on that 1 later. i've also had 27 points of decay (6/7/7/7) and would have ended 2177 if I had this run a little more consolidated towards the ending (prolly closer to low 2170s since potential for v slightly less for some wins.)

so yea, great run. no serious blow ups. no loss streak bigger than 2. If you wanna know how to qualify like I did two cycles in a row with 88+ gxe and in 1st place, along with top 3 for the entire cycle, hopefully some things here can help you. I'll try to repeat nothing from my original, still relevant guide. here we go:

1) l2p. no, really. you can follow everything here and still not break 1900. this is the easiest tournament to qualify for playoffs of, besides masters imo. but as a baseline, you need to at least have hands. you'll need to be able to beat good to great players at a moderately consistent level and this comes with a baseline understanding of the game. just practice, and olt is no better place for it. when i need to get up to speed after a few months off, ladder is the only place i go to since it's so unrivaled for practice. with practice and commitment, you will get to where you want to go in this game. maybe not results, but your skill and internal knowledge of how you've gotten better will continue to grow.

2) pay attn to the general /meta/. you can watch games after all, and if you're attentive you'll find that the meta shifts as the week progresses. the first 2 days don't matter for imo for this, though. after that, this particular week went from the fusien lokix team being all the rage (most visible spammed team since he double loaded and was consistently pushing anywhere from top 5 to top 50), to mild waves of NP torn balance really cooking, to everyone spamming stall, to then most people reacting to that. the vast majority of people who stalled in the end days were subsequently removed from 2050+, because they didn't adapt. the exception to this would be people who strictly sniped after having already parked at a high elo, for example ewin. you most likely can't qualify if you aren't paying attention to the trends of what the high elo landscape looks like.

3) have multiple teams. i used 5 teams in my run, storm and vert used a similar amount. if they're good teams, somewhere in those teams will be a good reaction to the ladder trends of the moment. a team i used to climb initially and figured it was ass beyond 1900 was a team i warmed up to using in some of my final final games, including three of my last four games. this change in feeling abt was partially because of the meta trends. so yea, points 2 and 3 are interconnected loosely. just make sure what youre loading is GOOD and suitable for the situation. i saw Raizas downfall begin when he loaded at 2119, using fusien lokix and running into an 1800. he lost and imo the team was a bad call to be using that high, based on the progression of the cycle. it isnt why he missed since he got haxed to shit like 4 times, but it's a good example imo of being savvy with analysis/theory about what's good at what point in a cycle. ofc it isnt absolute, he could have just as easily loaded into a good mu and won. however, it's very possible his opponent also just knew the team by heart since it was one of the most spammed teams of the cycle. which brings us to point 4.

4) watch games. you dont have to study players or w/e. just watch games, it's nice to take a break mentally while still being involved in the space imo. it also helps you be aware of point 2, and maybe even helps point 3 if you see a team you like. the commonly respected builders like vert/storm will often have their teams ripped, for instance. it isn't the coolest thing in the world but it's olt and olt is a shitshow in a lot of metrics, so all is fair.

5) don't get too high too early, don't start too late. build your run progressively and with intent. i made it to a too high elo too quickly. as a result there'd be no way i avoid decay for literally half of the cycle. i had to play multiple more games, with a LOT at stake elo wise since it's like +12 vs -28 if not worse in many instances. on the other end, don't start too late. many talented players like xav, mako, giannis started too late imo and would have benefitted from starting earlier. storm gave himself what felt like an extra day and while many would expect him to qualify (and accept if any of the aforementioned players did) it felt like a nicer experience for him than trying to cram truly last minute. so yea, just set realistic daily elo goals for yourself, but respect your mental wellbeing if you don't break it. it isn't about being 1st place on day 5, or top 8 on day 6. it's about being top 8 when the cycle ends. try to avoid decay.

6) elo tilting is your enemy. personal tilting is acceptable for your run, as long as your elo doesn't take a shit for it. i watched spookyz, lulu, dib, crying, ezra fan, and others all fall 300+ elo after being top 8 and flying too close to the sun. it wasn't the initial loss that killed them imo, it was the 3rd loss, the 5th loss, the 8th loss. it was the progression downward that probably could have been avoided for some by simply taking a break. even worse, you'll find yourself in the highest games played bracket in your attempt to recover from this fall, as all of these players were. none of them qualified, though some of them were definitely close-ish by the end. had the elo tilt not been so dramatic, the odds they qualify rise a fair bit imo.

7) don't get baited by chat shitters. it's just an accepted part of olt, i had one guy trying to bait me in several high elo games and i didn't even see it until i could laugh abt it in the replays i won, since i had spectators off. this sounds easily avoidable but it ties in with #6 - don't give yourself the opportunity to crash your own run and get tilted. i watched one player, who will go unnamed, get targeted by baiters in his ending run when he was in a precarious elo position. he proceeded to fall to low 2ks, and got offline. i don't know if the bait was the cause it, but he did set modchat to + after a point. don't even let it get that far. you're there to play and they're there to shit. realize the ecosystem of this and make it a non-issue.

8) i'm going to reiterate this from the prior post i made in 2023, since it's so important. do not allow yourself to be easily sniped. people like supagmoney, sawwar newnew, ewin, and so on will be eager to take your lunch money in a 130 turn game where you can't do anything. you know what the scariest part of being rank one is? seeing people ranks 5-10 preparing to snipe people ranked 10-20 who don't respect this rule. the ppl getting sniped can farm some normal players, get to a respectable elo, and then give 15 to the people near the top where the elo is truly critical, where they'd like their elo to come as safely as possible. yet another ecosystem to recognize. admittedly for selfish reasons, i literally warned a player abt this who was being scouted to hell and back (pkel) since he was low 2k and people high 2k seemed very eager to snipe him. he then proceeded to be sniped by high 2k stall, and beat the shit out of them and ultimately tilted a player down. do yourself a favor: if you're going to instaload shit at a high elo it's fine but at the least be good vs stall. these are the most prevalent snipers imo.


so yea, that is it. im proud of this runs' ending and wish you gl in your qualifying journeys. it's a nice feeling to qualify, and i hope your hard work pays off. be good to yourself, and have a good day.

 

[Stories]

1) l2p.

fuck

 

[Bloody]

With what felt like two weeks of OLT already, I managed to squeeze myself into the first top 8 of the tournament 1min before the end of cycle 1, in what was a crazy last minute dogfight between 3 people to see who gets the 8th spot. As opposed to the posts above from the qualified, my post will not be showcasing several teams nor inspirational, but rather focused on the one team I built and used to snatch a playoffs spot.

But before diving into it, a bit of lore:

OLT is my favorite tour in this site and by a large margin. It was the tour that introduced me to this site alongside OST in 2016, and I always come back to play it even when I'm not playing this game, like these last 2-3 years. I in fact qualified in 2016 after esteemed user Zamrock decided to click the self-destruct button and retire abruptly from the game, and I was next in the list to get his spot. Playoffs went terribly wrong, so let's keep it there. Two weeks ago I found myself missing the thrill of this game, so I decided it was time to bring back this hobby to my life, starting with OLT and two goals in my mind.

• OLT

I had two goals in mind: I wanted to get first cycle's top 1 spot, and do it by only using teams that I built.
For the spot 1 goal, it didn't go as planned. Why?

Yesterday (last day of cycle 1) at 6AM I was sitting at 1960~ with cutoff looking around 2130. My plan was to ladder throughout the whole day at a moderate speed and comfortably get that top 1 way before the end of the cycle. But I did what I'm best at doing and spent almost the whole day......sleeping. Working in DevOps during summer is a different beast, exhaustion is real. I woke up around midday, played 3-4 games, went out, came back, slept some more, woke up around 8:30ish PM, and with under 3h30 left, climbed while still believing that I still had enough time, but it was naive to think that I could beat the time constraint I put on myself. Lesson here: stick to the plan.

For the second goal, it was a success. I climbed mainly using teams that I built (besides a sun team in midladder, but you don't have that much room for creativity when building sun). On thursday, I built something that immediately gave spectacular results, and so I used it from 1600 until 2127 and never looked at another team.

• Team breakdown​

The team (click on image for the pokepaste):


On Thursday I felt like I still didn't have a team that could comfortably fight against everything that ladder throws at you, so I opened the building lab and started building again. I remembered that during last year's OLT, I built a bulky offense with spin/bulk up/cc/eq Tusk and I was pleasantly surprised with how good it was. So I decided to try again, but this time with a different flavour: taunt instead of spin.

• Great tusk: this set is incredibly busted and I don't understand how its not popular. It wins games from t1, it wins end games, it shuts off stall and bulkier teams, and overall it's incredibly difficult to deal with.
• Ogerpon: since every lando will laugh at my face with tusk's set, it was in my best interest to pair it with oger, and this was the base upon which I built the rest of the team. Adamant to open big holes and help setting up the rest. Stall bully.
• Deoxys: it was initally hazards Deoxys, but was dismissed quickly in favor of np+god's slaps. Turn 1 Psycho boost is nice, but it misses 90% of times. Do with that info what you want.
• Dragonite: saw someone using it and it immediately intrigued me. Best decision I made, it hurts a lot of teams that are mainly prepared for dd.
• Moth: added for its late game sweeping prowesses. Sub to autowin or stall turns against TR/screens.
• Hatterene: hazard control but mainly to give a 2nd life with healing wish. Never found the perfect set, so I decided to go with rocky helmet for chip to put in range some goons, specially late game kingambit trying something funny.

• Strenghts and how to use​

First, let's go over matchups:

• Stall: near the end of the cycle, it was widely understood and accepted that loading stall against me = instant loss. This team has never lost against stall as far as I remember. Oger/Deoxys turn 1 into gliscor will be always extremely strong, and usually you're hurting them a lot until tusk is able to finish the rest. Hatterene is key to heal a toxic'd/low health Ogerpon for a 2nd danse macabre. I have millions of replays against stall and it's a bloodbath.
• Offense: never had big issues against offense, as they struggle to deal with tusk when it's setup. Priority Dnite cleans whatever attempt to sweep, hat nuzzles and heals if needed, and moth is always good into Iron Valiants and mindgames with kingambit.
• Bulky offense: least comfortable mu, but still good if played right. I acknowledged during my run that the first turns against bulky offense cannot be good, so it's fine to just do some clicking and exchange damage. Midgame/lategame you'll have the better position if played right.
• Unconventional teams/troll: no comment, I never win those.

Now into the very important "how to use":

• Plan: when I started playing this team, I quickly understood that it can win against anything, as long as there is a plan. In almost all my games, my timer was always down to 30 second or less. You're spending more time thinking and planning how to win the game than actually playing the game. Make a plan in early game, adapt it if needed during the game, and always stop to understand your current position and plan accordingly.
• Don't brainlessly load: I always see in OLT a pattern in how people use offense: loading several games at once. This will not work witth his team, since it goes against the 1st point: it needs planning and focus. Play one game at a time, finish the game, take notes if needed, and load again after a little pause. It will make everything easier.
• Missplays: this is the biggest weakness of this team: it has no flexibility if missplayed. Usually a missplay either means game over or it's gonna be extremly tough. So again, stay focused and hydrated.

• Wrap up​

Something important that I want to echo from Nat's post is enjoying OLT. I personally avoided getting sniped mainly due to the fact that after every game, I would just go around watching games and enjoying people's comments and the ambiance. And it's also an amazing way to breath and be mentally ready for the next game, which brings me to the next point: every game counts. Play every mid/high ladder game like it's a finals game, use your timer, and don't forfeit.

I advise you to go watch yesterday's Blunder & Lax stream if you have time to kill and in need of laughs. You will also see how I used this team, but also how forfeiting was never in the equation. Even in very dire positions, I found ways to snatch a win, which was crucial to qualify. There is always a way, just think.
Shoutouts to the stream's chat for the crazy reactions and the blood emoji spam during my run, definitely up there in my most amazing memories on this site.

That's it from me, good luck and make it worth it.



PS: some fun teams I used in midladder during the first days and tanked my GXE, but it was fun.

​

 

[Laurel]

What an exciting cycle 1, with the cutoff being 2127 -- that is the highest week 1 number since 2022.

Special shout out to Tace, he continues his 100% qualification rate now qualifying 8 of 8 tries. He is just one below Empo and tied with Soulwind for 2nd most of all time.

Of the 8 round 1 qualifiers, only Heileone has qualified for the first time.