1.volcanion
2.florgress
3.baxcalibur
4. Golisipod
2.florgress
3.baxcalibur
4. Golisipod
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Pet Mod [Gen 3] Hoenn Echoes | Slate 3 Submissions are now Open!
- Thread starter SEA
- Start date
1. xrn's chesnaught
2. gekokeso's skuntank
3. heatranator's cyclizar
4. sea's meowscarada
2. gekokeso's skuntank
3. heatranator's cyclizar
4. sea's meowscarada
1. Scionicle's Abomasnow
2. Orangesodapop’s Golisopod
3. Monai's Volcanion
4. SEA's Meowscarada
2. Orangesodapop’s Golisopod
3. Monai's Volcanion
4. SEA's Meowscarada
Thank you once again to everybody who voted! We have 6 winners once again from this slate, and they are as follows:
As a small piece of commentary and for people looking to make submissions in the future, specifically regarding the move Knock Off, I would say a submission like Gekokeso's Skuntank is perfect. Knock Off in this tier is very limited in distribution but simultaneously extremely strong, and your Pokemon needs to have some very real flaws if it is going to include the move. Unlike newer gens where Knock Off is an essential piece of coverage for anything hoping to be viable, Knock Off in this tier needs to be spread around very carefully.
The next slate will be up in a little bit!
19 points:
15 points:
Name: Abomasnow
Type: Ice / Grass
Stats: 100 / 85 / 80 / 100 / 110 / 75 (550, all stats increased a bit)
Abilities: Snow Warning
13 points:
Name: Honchkrow
Type: Flying/Dark
Stats: 100 | 125 | 52 | 125(+20) | 52 | 91(+20) - BST 545
Ability: Insomnia/Super Luck
11 points:Name: Chesnaught
Type: Grass/Fighting
Stats: 88/102/127/84/80/64 (+5 Defense, +10 Sp.Attack, +5 Sp.Defense. 550 BST)
Abilities: Overgrow / Thick Fat
10 points:
Name: Dragapult
Type: Dragon / Ghost
Stats: 78 (-10) / 105 (-15) / 75 / 105 (+5) / 75 / 122 (-20) | 560
Abilities: Clear Body
10 points:
Name: Meowscarada
Type: Grass/Dark
Stats: 76/94/75/117/75/123 | 560 BST
Abilities: Overgrow / Limber
Name: Volcanion
Type: Fire/Water
Stats: 80/100(-10)/110(-10)/125(-5)/90/70
Abilities: Water Absorb
As a small piece of commentary and for people looking to make submissions in the future, specifically regarding the move Knock Off, I would say a submission like Gekokeso's Skuntank is perfect. Knock Off in this tier is very limited in distribution but simultaneously extremely strong, and your Pokemon needs to have some very real flaws if it is going to include the move. Unlike newer gens where Knock Off is an essential piece of coverage for anything hoping to be viable, Knock Off in this tier needs to be spread around very carefully.
The next slate will be up in a little bit!
Slate 3: Make Your Move
As mentioned in the slate before, there are certain limitations Pokemon in Generation 3 have, and a really big part of that is their move selection. Secondary effects weren't all that complicated yet: 10% of the time you might inflict a status condition, 20% of the time you might raise a stat of yours, sometimes you might lower one of their stats. Some types completely received the short end of the stick and didn't get moves that were worth using at all! Grass caps out at 70 BP barring Solar Beam? Rock caps out at 75 (we fixed this one!)? Flying types have Drill Peck, which isn't that bad, but in comparison to the special treatment Fire, Ground, or Water get, it feels lacking. Of course, we want things to remain balanced here! Rayquaza is balanced in large part because of its very weak STAB, and that is a good thing. If it had a 120 BP nuclear bomb like it does in any of the generations afterwards, it would destroy the integrity of the tier. The important thing to consider here if submitting a high BP move, or a move with a really powerful secondary effect, is to think about what is going to use it. For the most part, Pokemon that are already really good and have a huge plethora of tools (Latios, Mewtwo, etc.) should not be getting these unless you can really justify it. Generation 3 also has its fair share of existing moves that you could modify too. In this slate, you will either be modifying existing moves or adding completely new ones.Here's a handful things that I want to say for you to consider:
- As said above, consider what Pokemon are getting your moves, but also which Pokemon are going to be taking those attacks. As an example, Steel-types don't have a way to recover their HP in this tier, so having moves that would put a lot of pressure on Steels would need to be very carefully balanced and distributed. On the other hand, its a bit easier to have stronger special attacks considering this tier has all of the Latis, Blissey, and Ho-Oh.
- The goal of this mod is to try and reduce the amount of random chance present in the tier, or to have secondary effects like Flinching have some sort of setup required (see Rock Slide). Try to not include any moves that have any absurd RNG secondary effects. Note: you could submit moves that mirror Rock Slide's effect, or similarly require some other setup to pull off.
- The highest voted Grass-type move will be put into the mod no matter what. To ensure that Grass-types both present and future have a usable STAB that isn't completely stopped by Kyogre switching in vs them, we will be taking a Grass-type move at the end of this slate no matter what happens.
- Please submit things that are not an absolute pain to code. Moves that have effects that draw from other generations are perfectly fine, as we can replicate their effects very easily here, but anything that requires a lot of work to implement may be vetoed on that premise no matter how cool of an idea it is.
- Sleep, Burn, and Freeze are all extremely powerful effects in this tier, if you want to submit something with these it needs to be very well thought out.
- For voting, bulk changes to moves may be grouped at the council's discretion. For example, if you want to make a rework of the elemental punches, in voting these could all be counted as 1 item.
- Additional hazards are an almost guaranteed veto, as Spikes are already extremely powerful in this tier, and a lot of games can come down to positioning correctly both for and against the spin. Adding something that puts more pressure on that interaction would require extremely careful balancing.
- Don't submit any moves that invalidate other purposes in this tier. For instance, a better Rapid Spin that can't be spin blocked because it is Flying-type would instantly invalidate a lot of the interactions and teambuilding that goes on in the tier.
- Pivoting moves as they stand are completely nonexistent in the tier. Generation 3 Ubers has Baton Pass hard banned, and no other form of potential pivoting exists. If you were to add pivoting moves, be very careful about what learns them and the repercussions it might have.
With those out of the way, here are some suggestions I want to offer if you are looking for direction!
- Make Nature Power do something
- A move that interacts with setup options, i.e. Punishment, Clear Smog, or Burning Jealousy
- A move that interacts with healing, i.e. Heal Block or Psychic Noise
- Buff Taunt from 2 turns to 3 turns
- Alternative phasing options, i.e. Dragon Tail or Circle Throw
- A move with an interaction with Hail, which we just added!
One last thing! In between slates, in an effort to modernize the mod a little bit more ahead of the slate, we have made some changes to a few things in the tier!
- Modern Confusion, 1/3 chance to self-hit.
- Partial Trapping Moves (Fire Spin etc.) are now in line with modern implementation, traps 4-5 turns and does 1/8 damage per turn instead of 1/16.
- Sleep is now the modern implementation, 1-3 turns.
- Blizzard now has no accuracy check in Hail.
- Rock Tomb is now 60 Power, 95 Accuracy.
- Gen 3 Starters now have Blast Burn/Hydro Cannon/Frenzy Plant.
Its finally fucking time for me to post this
Hyper Beam
140 Power, Normal Type Move
100% Accuracy
If this move hits, and its target doesn't faint, the user must Recharge next turn. If the target faints, the user does not need to recharge.
RBY Hyper Beam has always been incredibly fun to watch, and I think it would give new life to an otherwise niche/useless move. Fits in very well with the power level of the tier. I nerfed power to account for the new effect, but buffed accuracy.
I would also propose that this happens for Blast Burn, Hydro Cannon, and Frenzy Plant.
Hyper Beam
140 Power, Normal Type Move
100% Accuracy
If this move hits, and its target doesn't faint, the user must Recharge next turn. If the target faints, the user does not need to recharge.
RBY Hyper Beam has always been incredibly fun to watch, and I think it would give new life to an otherwise niche/useless move. Fits in very well with the power level of the tier. I nerfed power to account for the new effect, but buffed accuracy.
I would also propose that this happens for Blast Burn, Hydro Cannon, and Frenzy Plant.
Name: Mist
Type:
Base Power: -
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Sets up a hazard named Mist. On switch-in, deal 8.3% damage(1/12) to the opponent if set on the field, regardless of typing. If the opponent is ungrounded (flying type or levitating) their healing is reduced by half. Cannot be stacked and is removable by rapid spin.
Distribution: Current distribution
+
(and prevos), 
(and prevos), 
, 
(and prevos), 
(and prevos),
, 
, 
, 
(and prevos)
-
Justification: Stealth Rock completely breaks ADV, but hopefully this hazard won't do that much damage in comparison. The idea behind this country is similar to what stealth rock's original intent seemed to be (punish fliers) but without messing up type matchups in the process. Reducing healing makes it harder for the likes of Ho-oh and the lati twins to defensively check stuff as they can't recover spam as efficiently. The move should be balanced by the fact its limited by having to run either an ice type or a water type not named Kyogre, which should hopefully discourage potential superman builds.
Name: First Impression
Type:
Base Power: 90
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: +2 priority, fails if used after the first turn the user is out.
Distribution:
(and prevos), 
(and prevos), 
(and prevos, you know exactly what the plan is), 
(and evos), 
, 
Justification: Half of this list is completely unviable regardless of the move, Pinsir gets a redeeming factor to compete with hera, flygon gets an option to scare the dragons that bully it, you will succumb to big pinch wherever you like it or not.
Type:
Base Power: -
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Sets up a hazard named Mist. On switch-in, deal 8.3% damage(1/12) to the opponent if set on the field, regardless of typing. If the opponent is ungrounded (flying type or levitating) their healing is reduced by half. Cannot be stacked and is removable by rapid spin.
Distribution: Current distribution
+
(and prevos), (and prevos), , (and prevos), (and prevos),, , , (and prevos)-
Justification: Stealth Rock completely breaks ADV, but hopefully this hazard won't do that much damage in comparison. The idea behind this country is similar to what stealth rock's original intent seemed to be (punish fliers) but without messing up type matchups in the process. Reducing healing makes it harder for the likes of Ho-oh and the lati twins to defensively check stuff as they can't recover spam as efficiently. The move should be balanced by the fact its limited by having to run either an ice type or a water type not named Kyogre, which should hopefully discourage potential superman builds.
Name: First Impression
Type:
Base Power: 90
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: +2 priority, fails if used after the first turn the user is out.
Distribution:
(and prevos), (and prevos), (and prevos, you know exactly what the plan is), (and evos), , Justification: Half of this list is completely unviable regardless of the move, Pinsir gets a redeeming factor to compete with hera, flygon gets an option to scare the dragons that bully it, you will succumb to big pinch wherever you like it or not.
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Leaf Storm. That’s it but it’s 140 bp.
Distribution: EVERY grass type
Reasoning: grass types are super ass because they got no bp clicks for their terrible type. This is a bp click move that lets mons like celebi and (maybe) meow jumpscare mons. I had it in my previous gourg submission
Name: Signal Beam
Type:
Base Power: 75
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Clears the opponents stat changes
Distribution: EVERY bug +
Justification: bug stab is kinda good into Ubers, so what if bug stab also jumpscared the main abusers of stat changes while at it. Currently heracross monopolizes bug stab and isn’t good but this can help future bugs have a clear defining role without being too strong at 75 bp. This can definitely limit annoying boosters that can run away with games at the cost on being a weaker type on not great mons
Name: Aurora Beam
Type:
Base Power: 75
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: During Hail, Applies the heal block effect for 3 turns
Distribution: Current +
Justification: brutally powerful move restricted by hail conditions. Might remove from the abomasnow because it’s kinda strong lol. But it synergies with hail by removing leftover blocking hail chip, causing fatter teams to falter vs the playstyle
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Name: punishment
Type: ghost
Power: 60bp +20 for each of the targets stat boosts
PP:16
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: base power increases for each stat boost the target has
Priority: 0
Potential Distribution: Ho-oh, Lugia, absol, houndoom, mawile, sableye, dusclops, slaking, Persian, Primeape, Sneasle, Solrock, mew, gyarados, salamence, ttar, gengar, aggron, banette, Shiftry, cacturn, meowscarada, dragapult, deoxys, aerodactyl
Reason: adds nice counter play to strong cm Pokemon it hits m2 and lati twins for super effective damage but blissey is immune and jirachi, Kyogre, ho-oh are all neutral
Name: freeze dry
Type: ice
Power: 70
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: in hail it becomes super effective vs water type pokemon 10% chance to freeze
Priority: 0
PP: 32
Potential distribution: mew, abomasnow, regice, cloyster, Articuno, jynx, Lapras, Dewgong, walrein, Lunatone.
Reason: gives ice types are reason to use hail
Name: gravity
Type: psychic
Effect: 5 turns, removes ground immunity, moves are 1.67x more accurate
PP: 8
Priority: 0
Potential distribution: Alakazam, Deoxys, metagross, Mewtwo, mew, Medicham, celebi, blissey, Gardevoir, magneton, sableye, jirachi, claydol, dusclops, espeon, exeggutor, forretress, Regirock, Registeel, regice, starmie, Wigglytuff, clefable, Girafarig, porygon 2,
Reason: I just think it would be neat
Type: ghost
Power: 60bp +20 for each of the targets stat boosts
PP:16
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: base power increases for each stat boost the target has
Priority: 0
Potential Distribution: Ho-oh, Lugia, absol, houndoom, mawile, sableye, dusclops, slaking, Persian, Primeape, Sneasle, Solrock, mew, gyarados, salamence, ttar, gengar, aggron, banette, Shiftry, cacturn, meowscarada, dragapult, deoxys, aerodactyl
Reason: adds nice counter play to strong cm Pokemon it hits m2 and lati twins for super effective damage but blissey is immune and jirachi, Kyogre, ho-oh are all neutral
Name: freeze dry
Type: ice
Power: 70
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: in hail it becomes super effective vs water type pokemon 10% chance to freeze
Priority: 0
PP: 32
Potential distribution: mew, abomasnow, regice, cloyster, Articuno, jynx, Lapras, Dewgong, walrein, Lunatone.
Reason: gives ice types are reason to use hail
Name: gravity
Type: psychic
Effect: 5 turns, removes ground immunity, moves are 1.67x more accurate
PP: 8
Priority: 0
Potential distribution: Alakazam, Deoxys, metagross, Mewtwo, mew, Medicham, celebi, blissey, Gardevoir, magneton, sableye, jirachi, claydol, dusclops, espeon, exeggutor, forretress, Regirock, Registeel, regice, starmie, Wigglytuff, clefable, Girafarig, porygon 2,
Reason: I just think it would be neat
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Psyshock
80 Power, Psychic-type move
16 PP
100% Accuracy
This move calculates its damage based off of the target's Defence stat.
Distribution: Mew, Lugia, Jirachi.
why: makes these guys cm sets much more viable than before since they can 1v1 with a bit more ease against the jets
80 Power, Psychic-type move
16 PP
100% Accuracy
This move calculates its damage based off of the target's Defence stat.
Distribution: Mew, Lugia, Jirachi.
why: makes these guys cm sets much more viable than before since they can 1v1 with a bit more ease against the jets
Frostbite Storm
100 Power, Ice-type move
16 PP
80% Accuracy
30% chance to lower target's Sp. Def. by 1. Hail: Can't miss.
Distribution: Abomasnow, Regice, Jynx, Walrein, Articuno, Cloyster.
why: midground between ice beam and blizzard
100 Power, Ice-type move
16 PP
80% Accuracy
30% chance to lower target's Sp. Def. by 1. Hail: Can't miss.
Distribution: Abomasnow, Regice, Jynx, Walrein, Articuno, Cloyster.
why: midground between ice beam and blizzard
Energy Ball
90 Power, Grass-type move
16 PP
100% Accuracy
10% chance to lower target's Sp. Def. by 1.
Distribution: Abomasnow, Celebi, Sceptile, Meganium, Venusaur, Exeggutor,
Cradily, Bellossom, Ludicolo, Shiftry, Victreebel, Vileplume, Cacturne, Breloom, Tropius, Jumpluff, Tangela, Sunflora, Parasect, Roselia
why: usable grass move
90 Power, Grass-type move
16 PP
100% Accuracy
10% chance to lower target's Sp. Def. by 1.
Distribution: Abomasnow, Celebi, Sceptile, Meganium, Venusaur, Exeggutor,
Cradily, Bellossom, Ludicolo, Shiftry, Victreebel, Vileplume, Cacturne, Breloom, Tropius, Jumpluff, Tangela, Sunflora, Parasect, Roselia
why: usable grass move
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Name: Jungle Vines
Type: Grass
Power: 80
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Deals 1/10th of the opponents health per turn. Does not trap the opponent in.
Priority: +0
Potential Distribution: Every Grass type will get this, in addition to:
Blissey, Mew, Armaldo, Altaria, Jirachi (serene grace will not double the secondary effect btw)
Reason: Grass type attacks are ofc bad, but this one gets around the issue of Grass's poor offensive nature by applying a effect similar to the Gmax moves of the Kanto starters+coalossal. This effect would do 4% damage per turn to any leftovers holding Pokemon, which isn't much, but still powerful.
Name: Cloud Seeding
Type: Steel
Power: 100
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Removes any weather condition as well. Does not work if there is no active weather
Priority: +0
Potential Distribution: Every Steel and Flying type will get this, in addition to:
Blissey, Kyogre, Groudon, Mew, Glalie, Gengar, Salamence.
Reason: Weather is a very powerful force in ADV Ubers, so this move can limit it while not being obscenely powerful, as it is not spammable and typically the Pokemon that do have it want other moves just as much.
Name: Embargo
Type: Dark
Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Makes the target's item have no effect for 7 turns
Priority: +1
Potential Distribution: Every Dark type will get this, in addition to:
Aerodactyl, Mewtwo, Mew, Gengar, Lunatone, Solrock, Skarmory, Exeggutor, Dusclops, Swampert, Starmie, Celebi, Jirachi, Milotic,
Reason: Since item removing effects are obviously broken, Embargo I think strikes a nice balance between being powerful, but fair. It primarily is used to weaken the Lati twins, but can also be useful against most Leftover users in the tier. Notably, these Pokemon can simply switch out, which resets it.
Type: Grass
Power: 80
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Deals 1/10th of the opponents health per turn. Does not trap the opponent in.
Priority: +0
Potential Distribution: Every Grass type will get this, in addition to:
Blissey, Mew, Armaldo, Altaria, Jirachi (serene grace will not double the secondary effect btw)
Reason: Grass type attacks are ofc bad, but this one gets around the issue of Grass's poor offensive nature by applying a effect similar to the Gmax moves of the Kanto starters+coalossal. This effect would do 4% damage per turn to any leftovers holding Pokemon, which isn't much, but still powerful.
Name: Cloud Seeding
Type: Steel
Power: 100
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Removes any weather condition as well. Does not work if there is no active weather
Priority: +0
Potential Distribution: Every Steel and Flying type will get this, in addition to:
Blissey, Kyogre, Groudon, Mew, Glalie, Gengar, Salamence.
Reason: Weather is a very powerful force in ADV Ubers, so this move can limit it while not being obscenely powerful, as it is not spammable and typically the Pokemon that do have it want other moves just as much.
Name: Embargo
Type: Dark
Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Makes the target's item have no effect for 7 turns
Priority: +1
Potential Distribution: Every Dark type will get this, in addition to:
Aerodactyl, Mewtwo, Mew, Gengar, Lunatone, Solrock, Skarmory, Exeggutor, Dusclops, Swampert, Starmie, Celebi, Jirachi, Milotic,
Reason: Since item removing effects are obviously broken, Embargo I think strikes a nice balance between being powerful, but fair. It primarily is used to weaken the Lati twins, but can also be useful against most Leftover users in the tier. Notably, these Pokemon can simply switch out, which resets it.
Attachments
Name: Cut
Type: Steel
Power: 60
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Always crits.
Priority: 0
Potential Distribution: Current distribution
Reason: Steel isn't a particularly good attacking type, and Cut has never been a good move, so this kills two birds with one stone. Steel types appreciate the reliable STAB damage, and non-Steel types might appreciate being able to super-effectivly crit Rock types
Type: Steel
Power: 60
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Always crits.
Priority: 0
Potential Distribution: Current distribution
Reason: Steel isn't a particularly good attacking type, and Cut has never been a good move, so this kills two birds with one stone. Steel types appreciate the reliable STAB damage, and non-Steel types might appreciate being able to super-effectivly crit Rock types
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Name: Snowball Smack
Type: Ice
Power: 60
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Gains +1 priority under hail, no other secondary effects..
Priority: +1
Distribution: All Ice types, Metagross, Gengar, Jirachi, Mew
Justification:
Abomasnow is the clear biggest beneficiary of this move, and I think this adds some needed mid/late-game utility to an otherwise slow 'mon with poor defensive typing and a Spikes weakness. While it does allow Abomasnow to pick off top threats like weakened Latis, Groudon, and Deo-A, the move itself isn't particularly strong and can be shrugged off by relevant mons like Metagross, Snorlax, and Forretress, all of which can be extremely punishing given a free-ish switch.
This could also breathe some life into Hail teams, with other Ice-types such as Regice or Jynx becoming quite dangerous given uncontested Hail. I also chose some non-Ice-type mons to give this move to, like Jirachi and Mew, that can utilize Snowball Smack on late-game Calm Mind sweeper sets once the opposing weather setter is taken down.
Despite this buff, hail teams still have to contend with opponents using much stronger weather setters in Kyogre and Groudon, Rayquaza (whose Air Lock negates this move's priority), Steels, and the many specially bulky 'mons in the tier, such as Snorlax, Ho-oh, and Blissey. Even Ice-weak 'mons such as the Latis and Lugia need to be chipped significantly before they risk being picked off by Snowball Smack.
Type: Ice
Power: 60
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Gains +1 priority under hail, no other secondary effects..
Priority: +1
Distribution: All Ice types, Metagross, Gengar, Jirachi, Mew
Justification:
Abomasnow is the clear biggest beneficiary of this move, and I think this adds some needed mid/late-game utility to an otherwise slow 'mon with poor defensive typing and a Spikes weakness. While it does allow Abomasnow to pick off top threats like weakened Latis, Groudon, and Deo-A, the move itself isn't particularly strong and can be shrugged off by relevant mons like Metagross, Snorlax, and Forretress, all of which can be extremely punishing given a free-ish switch.
This could also breathe some life into Hail teams, with other Ice-types such as Regice or Jynx becoming quite dangerous given uncontested Hail. I also chose some non-Ice-type mons to give this move to, like Jirachi and Mew, that can utilize Snowball Smack on late-game Calm Mind sweeper sets once the opposing weather setter is taken down.
Despite this buff, hail teams still have to contend with opponents using much stronger weather setters in Kyogre and Groudon, Rayquaza (whose Air Lock negates this move's priority), Steels, and the many specially bulky 'mons in the tier, such as Snorlax, Ho-oh, and Blissey. Even Ice-weak 'mons such as the Latis and Lugia need to be chipped significantly before they risk being picked off by Snowball Smack.
Name: Doomsday Clock
Type: Dark
Base Power: 110
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Hits after two turns.
Distribution: All pokemon with access to Crunch +
Justification: Pressure tool for a lot of Dark types, especially the new Meowscarada and niche mons like Salamence and Tyranitar. Also can be effective for Gengar as a spin blocker for similar reasons to Will-O-Wisp, as both pressure different mons which can attempt to switch in.
Name: Cryogenics
Type: Ice
Base Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Heals 1/2 HP, 2/3rds in Hail
Distribution: All Ice types + 
Justification: Makes the chip down playstyle promoted by hail even more effective due to boosted healing, especially with users like Abomasnow, new Lunatone, and non Ice types Lugia Mew and Deoxys (for flavor reasons, Deoxys gets it due to how cold space is)
Name: Healing Wish
Type: Psychic
Base Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Faints user, heals replacement 100% and heals any status.
Distribution: Wish's distribution +
Justification: Potent option for offensive leaning teams to support devastating sweepers like Deoxys Attack, Rayquaza, CM Latios and Groudon in the endgame without having to be so fearful of Gengar's wisp or having to use a move slot on Refresh. Due to it's endgame utility is best utilised on teams building around an E-Speed user. Mew and Gengar can consider it over explosion as a tempo gaining option, this can encourage gengar to build around it's good special attack.
Type: Dark
Base Power: 110
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Hits after two turns.
Distribution: All pokemon with access to Crunch +
Justification: Pressure tool for a lot of Dark types, especially the new Meowscarada and niche mons like Salamence and Tyranitar. Also can be effective for Gengar as a spin blocker for similar reasons to Will-O-Wisp, as both pressure different mons which can attempt to switch in.
Name: Cryogenics
Type: Ice
Base Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Heals 1/2 HP, 2/3rds in Hail
Distribution: All Ice types +
Justification: Makes the chip down playstyle promoted by hail even more effective due to boosted healing, especially with users like Abomasnow, new Lunatone, and non Ice types Lugia Mew and Deoxys (for flavor reasons, Deoxys gets it due to how cold space is)
Name: Healing Wish
Type: Psychic
Base Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Faints user, heals replacement 100% and heals any status.
Distribution: Wish's distribution +
Justification: Potent option for offensive leaning teams to support devastating sweepers like Deoxys Attack, Rayquaza, CM Latios and Groudon in the endgame without having to be so fearful of Gengar's wisp or having to use a move slot on Refresh. Due to it's endgame utility is best utilised on teams building around an E-Speed user. Mew and Gengar can consider it over explosion as a tempo gaining option, this can encourage gengar to build around it's good special attack.
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Name: Strength Sap
Type: Grass
Base Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Strength Sap
Distribution: All Grass Type Pokemon + 
I find Stregnth Sap to be an excellent addition to the metagame. It grants Forretress a form of reliable recovery against most pokemon it sits in anyway. The Pokemon it sits on can tend to run HP Fire or Fireblast so Forretress isn't entirely safe regardless. CM Jirachi would loveee Strength Sap however if this is too much I can change it.
Type: Grass
Base Power: 0
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Strength Sap
Distribution: All Grass Type Pokemon +
I find Stregnth Sap to be an excellent addition to the metagame. It grants Forretress a form of reliable recovery against most pokemon it sits in anyway. The Pokemon it sits on can tend to run HP Fire or Fireblast so Forretress isn't entirely safe regardless. CM Jirachi would loveee Strength Sap however if this is too much I can change it.
Name: Soothing Energy
Type: Grass
Base Power: 95 bp
Accuracy: 100%
Power Points: 24 PP
Effect: 30% chance to lower the target's Sp. Atk by 1. Bypass substitute.
Distribution: All grass +
Reasoning: A more consistent spammable move, like flamethrower, ice beam and thunderbolt.
Name: Meteor Dive
Type: Flying
Base Power: 120 BP
Accuracy: 90%
Power Points: 8 PP
Effect: After hits, burn the user and the opponent.
Distribution:
+ all Flying types EXCEPT
Reasoning: Strong like brave bird, with lum berry can be used multiple times. Can also use with Charizard, Swellow to Guts activation and Altaria with Natural cure.
Type: Grass
Base Power: 95 bp
Accuracy: 100%
Power Points: 24 PP
Effect: 30% chance to lower the target's Sp. Atk by 1. Bypass substitute.
Distribution: All grass +
Reasoning: A more consistent spammable move, like flamethrower, ice beam and thunderbolt.
Name: Meteor Dive
Type: Flying
Base Power: 120 BP
Accuracy: 90%
Power Points: 8 PP
Effect: After hits, burn the user and the opponent.
Distribution:
Reasoning: Strong like brave bird, with lum berry can be used multiple times. Can also use with Charizard, Swellow to Guts activation and Altaria with Natural cure.
Name: Encore
Type: Normal.
PP: 8.
Effect: The target repeats its last move for 4 turns.
Distribution: Current Adv distribution and Primeape, Dragonite, Mew, Sableye, Banette, Chimecho, Donphan, Gardevoir, Granbull, Grumpig, Jynx, Ludicolo, Meganium, Ninetales, Poliwrath, Politoed, Volbeat, Illumise, Wigglytuff and Snorlax.
Reasoning: Encore is a very niche move in Adv, with very few users. The most notable of those are Wobbuffet and Victreebel. In vanilla Adv, that is ok, because Encore is pretty devastating and variable, as it can last from 2 to 6 turns. So, my changes make it less RNG, with it now always lasting 4 turns. Apart from that, I included a lot of Mons that learn the move in future Gens (but not all of them, Gengar for example would be too strong). Most of the Mons right now would be bad in a Ubers Metagame, but there are some exceptions:
-Mew can use Encore to help itself use SD when facing some passive team.
-Snorlax can win mirrors vs other Snorlax. Apart from that, not much use for him, but its already a great Mon.
-Banette and Sableye can switch into many Snorlax moves and force it out.
-Ludicolo can switch into all Kyogre moves except TW, Thunder and IB (unless defensive Ludicolo), and lock it into something like CM or Surf.
-Politoed and Poliwrath can switch into slow variants of Kyogre and do the same thing.
-Ninetales can switch into Sacred Fire from Ho-oh and disrupt it too. Its a pretty lackuster Mon otherwise, but this is a real niche.
-Dragonite can switch into Groudon's EQ and force it out.
To sum it up, Encore relevance grows with these changes, but it still won,t be dominant, cause most Mons are mediocre.
Name: Dragon Tail.
Type: Dragon.
Power: 60.
Accuracy: 90
PP: 16.
Effect: Forces the target to switch into a random ally. User moves last.
Distribution: Groudon, Salamence, Charizard, Dragonite, Gyarados, Aggron, Ampharos, Arbok, Dunsparce, Feraligatr, Flygon, Meganium, Milotic, Nidoking, Nidoqueen, Sceptile, Seviper, Steelix, Slowking, Tropius, Rhydon.
Reasoning: Dragon Dance and Dragon Claw are the only Dragon moves that are used in Gen 3. This is a new one, a way to abuse Spikes and prevent set-up. Its different from Roar, since its immune to Taunt and prevents Superman teams/cores from endlessly switching, since it does damage. Main users are going to be Groudon, Salamence, Gyarados and Flygon, but who knows, maybe someone finds a niche for other Mons in the list.
Name: Razor Leaf.
Type: Grass.
Power: 55
Accuracy: 95
Effect: This move always crits.
Distribution: Current Adv distribution, Shiftry, Roselia and Farfetch'd.
Removed from: Abomasnow.
Reasoning: Welcome to RBY! Just like in RBY, this move always crits, though now it does not depend on user's Speed, so Mons like Vileplume can use it too. Vileplume is not the target of the move though, since its still unviable. Targets are the better Grass types: Victreebel and Shiftry now don,t depend on Solar Beam as much (though its still a little stronger), while Ludicolo can ignore opposing Kyogre's CM boosts. The move annoys specifically Kyogre, Groudon and Tyranitar. For this reason, I removed it from Abomasnow, who already checks Kyogre well and removes the other weathers (if used with Dugtrio, Abomasnow can switch into Tyranitar, die and win the weather war). Venusaur, Bellosom (who unlike Victreebel resists Ground and is bulkier than Shiftry) and Tropius might get a small niche for learning the move.
Type: Normal.
PP: 8.
Effect: The target repeats its last move for 4 turns.
Distribution: Current Adv distribution and Primeape, Dragonite, Mew, Sableye, Banette, Chimecho, Donphan, Gardevoir, Granbull, Grumpig, Jynx, Ludicolo, Meganium, Ninetales, Poliwrath, Politoed, Volbeat, Illumise, Wigglytuff and Snorlax.
Reasoning: Encore is a very niche move in Adv, with very few users. The most notable of those are Wobbuffet and Victreebel. In vanilla Adv, that is ok, because Encore is pretty devastating and variable, as it can last from 2 to 6 turns. So, my changes make it less RNG, with it now always lasting 4 turns. Apart from that, I included a lot of Mons that learn the move in future Gens (but not all of them, Gengar for example would be too strong). Most of the Mons right now would be bad in a Ubers Metagame, but there are some exceptions:
-Mew can use Encore to help itself use SD when facing some passive team.
-Snorlax can win mirrors vs other Snorlax. Apart from that, not much use for him, but its already a great Mon.
-Banette and Sableye can switch into many Snorlax moves and force it out.
-Ludicolo can switch into all Kyogre moves except TW, Thunder and IB (unless defensive Ludicolo), and lock it into something like CM or Surf.
-Politoed and Poliwrath can switch into slow variants of Kyogre and do the same thing.
-Ninetales can switch into Sacred Fire from Ho-oh and disrupt it too. Its a pretty lackuster Mon otherwise, but this is a real niche.
-Dragonite can switch into Groudon's EQ and force it out.
To sum it up, Encore relevance grows with these changes, but it still won,t be dominant, cause most Mons are mediocre.
Name: Dragon Tail.
Type: Dragon.
Power: 60.
Accuracy: 90
PP: 16.
Effect: Forces the target to switch into a random ally. User moves last.
Distribution: Groudon, Salamence, Charizard, Dragonite, Gyarados, Aggron, Ampharos, Arbok, Dunsparce, Feraligatr, Flygon, Meganium, Milotic, Nidoking, Nidoqueen, Sceptile, Seviper, Steelix, Slowking, Tropius, Rhydon.
Reasoning: Dragon Dance and Dragon Claw are the only Dragon moves that are used in Gen 3. This is a new one, a way to abuse Spikes and prevent set-up. Its different from Roar, since its immune to Taunt and prevents Superman teams/cores from endlessly switching, since it does damage. Main users are going to be Groudon, Salamence, Gyarados and Flygon, but who knows, maybe someone finds a niche for other Mons in the list.
Name: Razor Leaf.
Type: Grass.
Power: 55
Accuracy: 95
Effect: This move always crits.
Distribution: Current Adv distribution, Shiftry, Roselia and Farfetch'd.
Removed from: Abomasnow.
Reasoning: Welcome to RBY! Just like in RBY, this move always crits, though now it does not depend on user's Speed, so Mons like Vileplume can use it too. Vileplume is not the target of the move though, since its still unviable. Targets are the better Grass types: Victreebel and Shiftry now don,t depend on Solar Beam as much (though its still a little stronger), while Ludicolo can ignore opposing Kyogre's CM boosts. The move annoys specifically Kyogre, Groudon and Tyranitar. For this reason, I removed it from Abomasnow, who already checks Kyogre well and removes the other weathers (if used with Dugtrio, Abomasnow can switch into Tyranitar, die and win the weather war). Venusaur, Bellosom (who unlike Victreebel resists Ground and is bulkier than Shiftry) and Tropius might get a small niche for learning the move.
Name: Taunt
Effect: Lasts 3 turns, otherwise unchanged. (4 turns if target acted first)
Potential Distribution: Base
Reason: Wow! More functional disruption/stallbreaking tool for Deoxys, Mew, Mewtwo, Aerodactyl, Honchkrow, Chesnaught, Meowscarada, Gengar, Skarmory, and Tyranitar
Name: Grass Pledge
Type:
Power: 80
PP: 10 (16)
Accuracy: 100
Effect: Lowers foe's Speed in rain and damages foe by an extra 1/8 of its max HP in sun.
Priority: 0
Potential Distribution: Venusaur, Meganium, Sceptile, Chesnaught, Meowscarada, Mew, Celebi, Abomasnow, Ludicolo, Exeggutor, Sunflora, Castform (and pre-evolutions)
Reason: Gives most relevant Grass-types a more reliable STAB move. Interacts with the strongest weathers to lean into the type's role in Ubers, with the effects being based on the vanilla Pledge combinations.
Name: Fish and Dip
Type:
Power: -
PP: 10 (16)
Accuracy: -
Effect: User switches out. Sets 1 Fishing Token on the user's side of the field.
Priority: 0
Potential Distribution: Rayquaza, Moltres, Ludicolo, Kingler, Chinchou, Lanturn, Feebas, Milotic, Sentret, Furret
Reason: Gives some weaker bulky Pokemon a valuable pivoting tool. CB Rayquaza can use it to gain momentum against defensive teams it may struggle against. Fishing Tokens do nothing... for now.
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