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Metagame SV Doubles Little Cup
- Thread starter Voltix
- Start date
The first DLC survey we have had as a tier has come to an end, and I´m here to show the results; but first of all big thanks to the 21 people that have participate in it!
QUESTION 1
The average of this first question is 3.57. People seems to enjoy the tier, but for many people the actual state of the metagame stops them from actually love and enjoy it at his fullest. We will try to make a change here in the future.
QUESTION 2
Average: 4.00. Looks like the minitour has been a great success, the feedback has been positive and most people really enjoyed this new meta. We will take notes from this.
QUESTION 3
Even if most have had a great time playing the minitour, a 30% of voters think that removing all of the banned pokemon of the minitour (Misdreavus, Stantler and Girafarig) might be too much. We have had some feedback about this, specially about keeping Misdreavus around.
Now is where things gets interesting, let´s talk about the most controversial Pokemon.
QUESTION 4
With an average scoring of 2.90, this one is super tricky. Half the voters think Missy is fine, the other half thinks its unhealthy.
Its really shocking how polarizing into the 1 and 5 this voting was, we will keep an eye into this Pokemon for the future.
QUESTION 5
Here we go, the most controversial Pokemon of all, with an average voting of 3.67 and a lot of feedback about it, most people think Girafarig is just too much for this tier. We will most likely make some actions here.
QUESTION 6
Almost the same votes than Giraf, exchanging some 4 and 5, and averaging a 3.57. Almost the same as Girafarig, people has expressed their disconformity with Stantler being around. While having less raw power than his Normal-type partner, his multiple sets are more annoying and it can be frustrating to play against his perfect coverage.
QUESTION 7
Average of 1.71. We all know Vullaby, it does his job so good it could fit on almost every team, the perfect LC Pokemon for some, but still its far from being unhealthy or broken, just a superb glue for many teams.
QUESTION 8
Our last Pokemon, with an average score of 2.76. I feel like Cutie, just like Missy, is a tricky one, but for other reasons. Looks like people are saying that this Pokemon is really good, but it is a step below the other three. Just like with Misdreavus we will keep a close eye to this little fly in the upcoming metagames.
That is all for today. I´m really happy that we have done this survey, it has been enlightening in some aspects and has really help us out learning what are your thoughts about the tier. Stantler and Girafarig have been the real losers of this survey, we will take this into consideration and make some decisions about it.
We will be back with some news hopefully soon, stay tunned!
QUESTION 1
The average of this first question is 3.57. People seems to enjoy the tier, but for many people the actual state of the metagame stops them from actually love and enjoy it at his fullest. We will try to make a change here in the future.
QUESTION 2
Average: 4.00. Looks like the minitour has been a great success, the feedback has been positive and most people really enjoyed this new meta. We will take notes from this.
QUESTION 3
Even if most have had a great time playing the minitour, a 30% of voters think that removing all of the banned pokemon of the minitour (Misdreavus, Stantler and Girafarig) might be too much. We have had some feedback about this, specially about keeping Misdreavus around.
Now is where things gets interesting, let´s talk about the most controversial Pokemon.
QUESTION 4
With an average scoring of 2.90, this one is super tricky. Half the voters think Missy is fine, the other half thinks its unhealthy.
Its really shocking how polarizing into the 1 and 5 this voting was, we will keep an eye into this Pokemon for the future.
QUESTION 5
Here we go, the most controversial Pokemon of all, with an average voting of 3.67 and a lot of feedback about it, most people think Girafarig is just too much for this tier. We will most likely make some actions here.
QUESTION 6
Almost the same votes than Giraf, exchanging some 4 and 5, and averaging a 3.57. Almost the same as Girafarig, people has expressed their disconformity with Stantler being around. While having less raw power than his Normal-type partner, his multiple sets are more annoying and it can be frustrating to play against his perfect coverage.
QUESTION 7
Average of 1.71. We all know Vullaby, it does his job so good it could fit on almost every team, the perfect LC Pokemon for some, but still its far from being unhealthy or broken, just a superb glue for many teams.
QUESTION 8
Our last Pokemon, with an average score of 2.76. I feel like Cutie, just like Missy, is a tricky one, but for other reasons. Looks like people are saying that this Pokemon is really good, but it is a step below the other three. Just like with Misdreavus we will keep a close eye to this little fly in the upcoming metagames.
That is all for today. I´m really happy that we have done this survey, it has been enlightening in some aspects and has really help us out learning what are your thoughts about the tier. Stantler and Girafarig have been the real losers of this survey, we will take this into consideration and make some decisions about it.
We will be back with some news hopefully soon, stay tunned!
SUSPECT
& 
Yes, your most desired dreams have came true! After a year and a half we are going to have another suspect in Doubles LC, well more exactly two suspects in one.
We have decided to suspect Girafarig and Stantler at the same time after the feedback recieved from the survey and our own personal opinions. Both Pokemon have been ruling the metagame since their release in the SV games, while at first Girafarig wasn´t really popular, they both started to peak when Stantler was released thanks to Home.
While they have some notable differences, we can say that both are Normal-type Pokemon with 19 speed and a powerful and dangerous set-up that allows them to clean games easily if they are in the right spot.
Nasty Plot Girafarig makes the most wrecker Pokemon in the tier spamming powerful STAB Hyper Voices at +2; while Stantler runs CM sets with a perfect coverage thanks to Tera Fairy Tera Blast + Earth Power, making it very difficult to deal with.
While this are his two most prominent and popular sets, both Pokemon are known for his versibility. Both of them are able to carry Physical sets, taking opponents by surprised thanks to a base Atk stat as good as their SpAtk stat. Also, both of them are Screen and Trick Room setters, adding even more possible sets to consider when facing them.
To sum up a bit, two Pokemon with high-sky BST (455 and 465 respectively, too much for being part of Little Cup), useful abilities, and a plethora of sets which made them hard to deal with.
However, it is true that there were ways to deal with them. Both of them were significantly annoyed by the high amount of Knock Off users in the tier, and teams with a solid speed control put a lot of pressure into both of them.
Most of their damage came from the set up, so if they were just not able to boost themselves, they just miss those big KOs and their dangerousness dropped significately. Most games ended up being a battle for finding a save spot for setting up, or denying it applying enough pressure to them.
Since we have no ladder, we are going to give voting reqs based of tournament results. Those who made Top 8 through this year´s tournaments and those who had at least one win in teamtours such as Derby and LPL will have the right to have a vote.
These 26 players will get reqs:
Council Members -> Voltix - PigWarrior19 - Actuarily - Sunrose - Acehunter1 - GasaiYunoSan - John1240
Seasonal Top 8 -> oh the guilt - treeshhhh - Nephtyrix - Iceberg77
Swiss Top 8 -> Cepha - Toadow
Derby Players -> Quinn - Nashrock
Top 8 Minitour -> TheIronPikachu - AIRedzone - xqiht - Fairy Juice Jay
LPL Players -> Frixel - Akaru Kokuyo - mimi - Paraplegic - Valerie - sir jelloton - Toxinalpaca
Seasonal Top 8 -> oh the guilt - treeshhhh - Nephtyrix - Iceberg77
Swiss Top 8 -> Cepha - Toadow
Derby Players -> Quinn - Nashrock
Top 8 Minitour -> TheIronPikachu - AIRedzone - xqiht - Fairy Juice Jay
LPL Players -> Frixel - Akaru Kokuyo - mimi - Paraplegic - Valerie - sir jelloton - Toxinalpaca
There are three options as in every suspect: Ban, Do Not Ban and Abstain.
About the votes, take into account that these are two different suspects, so you cast two different votes, it doesn´t need to be the same for both if your don´t want to. you can even abstain for one and vote for the other if that is your preference.
I would strongly advice to not make random votes, you can always go for Abstain if you dont want to participate or feel like you lack the experience in the tier to make a consistent vote. It would help to keep the tier competitive.
In order to submit your votes, you can DM me on Smogon or on Discord (voltix#2487) before Sunday November 17th 6:00pm(GMT-5). If anyone have not cast his vote by that time I will consider it as an Abstain.
As always, feel free to leave your thoughts here or in the DLC server.
Girafarig Do not ban
Stantler Ban
Stantler Ban
The results of the two suspects are here!
On one hand, with an overwhelming supermajority of 90% of pro-ban votes, Girafarig will now be banned from SV Doubles Little Cup.
On the other hand, Stantler did not get enough votes to be banned, so with a 45% pro-ban votes will remain legal in the tier.
Tagging Marty and dhelmise to update the Girafarig ban. Thank you everyone for participating! We will be following how the tier evolves from here, paying attention specially to controversial Pokemon like Misdreavus.
The results of the suspect are the following:
On one hand, with an overwhelming supermajority of 90% of pro-ban votes, Girafarig will now be banned from SV Doubles Little Cup.
On the other hand, Stantler did not get enough votes to be banned, so with a 45% pro-ban votes will remain legal in the tier.
Tagging Marty and dhelmise to update the Girafarig ban. Thank you everyone for participating! We will be following how the tier evolves from here, paying attention specially to controversial Pokemon like Misdreavus.
The results of the suspect are the following:
Last edited:
Wanted to post a few thoughts about DLC with lpl and DLC cup completed and circuit and LCBC coming up
MVM (Doubles LC Superman)
This cores phenomenal, they synergize beautifully Vull covers knock and medi shenanigans for Misdreavus and Misdreavus is Misdreavus from icy-wind wisp taunt support to XernDon coverage with Muds they do it all literally can't go wrong with this core.
Boring as ever clicks CM and snowballs, or is a mediocre physical attacker my opinion hasn't changed much.
demon birds good (when it lands) it's fast and doesn't have to worry about getting blown up by giraf anymore.
Role compression good. I used this set, in finals, guaranteed pin on tera fairy gleam missy with bray. It's got FO, knock, stabs and a billion utility moves it's not insane or that good even but it's a nice option.
trapping good. Scarf set can take some mons out of the game if you aren't careful and it's got some nice role compression in FO and being a solid TR setter.
needs SD to do any meaningful damage and has trouble setting up with the rise of Mudbray and the loss of giraf I can see this getting better but as of rn I think it's terrible.
/ 
Trappings nice however both of them suck. Pinch can do some stuff on TailRoom teams but it's MU into Missy, Vulla, Grooky and intim in general is insanely bad if you're burnt intimidated or grassy terrains up (forgot to mention it's only useable stabs EQ!) it's dead weight. Pinch ties with foong as the 2nd slowest mon and ties bray as the 2nd strongest so I guess you could do some stuff with LO Sheer force/Hyper cutter on Full-Room? So it's not completely useless but as of rn I think it's terrible.
Now then Diglett, it's very fast has ok coverage and utility however it's got zero bulk and is reliant on LO to get meaningful damage out. Similar to Pinch it's reliant on hard to fit coverage moves like Stone-edge to hit levitating mons it's got throat chop for Missy but that's hard to fit and easily punished by tera fairy plot gleam flutter wannabe sets it's also got gambit and memento so it's not complete dead weight when it's weakened but at that point you'd be playing a 5-6.
Unfortunately these two just can't fill Mudbrays shoes as a ground type it's got inner focus, incredible bulk, amazing reliable coverage that covers not just Missy and Vull which allows it to almost always get value.
Pretend Dig is next to pinch and Aipom is next to foo forgot to add them mb
MVM (Doubles LC Superman)
This cores phenomenal, they synergize beautifully Vull covers knock and medi shenanigans for Misdreavus and Misdreavus is Misdreavus from icy-wind wisp taunt support to XernDon coverage with Muds they do it all literally can't go wrong with this core.
Boring as ever clicks CM and snowballs, or is a mediocre physical attacker my opinion hasn't changed much. demon birds good (when it lands) it's fast and doesn't have to worry about getting blown up by giraf anymore. Role compression good. I used this set, in finals, guaranteed pin on tera fairy gleam missy with bray. It's got FO, knock, stabs and a billion utility moves it's not insane or that good even but it's a nice option. trapping good. Scarf set can take some mons out of the game if you aren't careful and it's got some nice role compression in FO and being a solid TR setter. needs SD to do any meaningful damage and has trouble setting up with the rise of Mudbray and the loss of giraf I can see this getting better but as of rn I think it's terrible. / Trappings nice however both of them suck. Pinch can do some stuff on TailRoom teams but it's MU into Missy, Vulla, Grooky and intim in general is insanely bad if you're burnt intimidated or grassy terrains up (forgot to mention it's only useable stabs EQ!) it's dead weight. Pinch ties with foong as the 2nd slowest mon and ties bray as the 2nd strongest so I guess you could do some stuff with LO Sheer force/Hyper cutter on Full-Room? So it's not completely useless but as of rn I think it's terrible.Now then Diglett, it's very fast has ok coverage and utility however it's got zero bulk and is reliant on LO to get meaningful damage out. Similar to Pinch it's reliant on hard to fit coverage moves like Stone-edge to hit levitating mons it's got throat chop for Missy but that's hard to fit and easily punished by tera fairy plot gleam flutter wannabe sets it's also got gambit and memento so it's not complete dead weight when it's weakened but at that point you'd be playing a 5-6.
Unfortunately these two just can't fill Mudbrays shoes as a ground type it's got inner focus, incredible bulk, amazing reliable coverage that covers not just Missy and Vull which allows it to almost always get value.
Pretend Dig is next to pinch and Aipom is next to foo forgot to add them mb
Last edited:
The Viability Ranking has been updated!
T2 -> T1
T3 -> T2
T3 -> T2
T3 -> T2
T3 -> T2
T4 -> T3
T5 -> T3
T5 -> T4
T5 -> T4
T5 -> T4
T5 -> T4
UR -> T5
UR -> T5
UR -> T5
T1 -> T2
T2 -> T3
T2 -> T3
T3 -> T4
T3 -> T4
T4 -> T5
T4 -> T5
T4 -> T5
T5 -> UR
T5 -> UR
T5 -> UR
T5 -> UR
Also some updates on the council. After being with us from almost the beggining, Acehunter1 will be stepping down as a Council member. One of the best and most important players in the history of Doubles LC, we really thank you for all the work and love you have put into this tier!
Now our latest addition, Cepha joins the council! Being one of the most consolidated players of the moment, his longevity and experience in the tier will be important to help us.
T2 -> T1 T3 -> T2 T3 -> T2 T3 -> T2 T3 -> T2 T4 -> T3 T5 -> T3 T5 -> T4 T5 -> T4 T5 -> T4 T5 -> T4 UR -> T5 UR -> T5 UR -> T5 T1 -> T2 T2 -> T3 T2 -> T3 T3 -> T4 T3 -> T4 T4 -> T5 T4 -> T5 T4 -> T5 T5 -> UR T5 -> UR T5 -> UR T5 -> URAlso some updates on the council. After being with us from almost the beggining, Acehunter1 will be stepping down as a Council member. One of the best and most important players in the history of Doubles LC, we really thank you for all the work and love you have put into this tier!
Now our latest addition, Cepha joins the council! Being one of the most consolidated players of the moment, his longevity and experience in the tier will be important to help us.
Welcome to the 2025 DLC Circuit! This year´s circuit will consist of the following tournaments:
TOURNAMENT SCHEDULE
Doubles LC Winter Seasonal: March 10th
Doubles LC Fall Seasonal: August 4th
Doubles LC Swiss: May 19th
Doubles LC Last Chance: October 13th
Doubles Invitational: December 2025
(spreadsheet coming soon)
- Doubles LC Winter Seasonal
- Doubles LC Swiss
- Doubles LC Fall Seasonal
- Doubles LC Last Chance
TOURNAMENT SCHEDULE
Doubles LC Winter Seasonal: March 10th
Doubles LC Fall Seasonal: August 4th
Doubles LC Swiss: May 19th
Doubles LC Last Chance: October 13th
Doubles Invitational: December 2025
Attachments
Last edited:
Winter Seasonal #4 Usage Stats
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Misdreavus | 128 | 71.11% | 52.34% |
| 2 | Vullaby | 119 | 66.11% | 52.10% |
| 3 | Mudbray | 114 | 63.33% | 50.00% |
| 4 | Stantler | 100 | 55.56% | 57.00% |
| 5 | Foongus | 50 | 27.78% | 44.00% |
| 6 | Growlithe-Hisui | 45 | 25.00% | 44.44% |
| 7 | Grookey | 43 | 23.89% | 58.14% |
| 8 | Litten | 41 | 22.78% | 48.78% |
| 9 | Elekid | 35 | 19.44% | 51.43% |
| 10 | Cutiefly | 27 | 15.00% | 37.04% |
| 11 | Meditite | 26 | 14.44% | 57.69% |
| 12 | Snover | 24 | 13.33% | 58.33% |
| 12 | Wingull | 24 | 13.33% | 41.67% |
| 14 | Glimmet | 22 | 12.22% | 68.18% |
| 15 | Inkay | 19 | 10.56% | 52.63% |
| 16 | Skrelp | 18 | 10.00% | 72.22% |
| 17 | Voltorb-Hisui | 17 | 9.44% | 52.94% |
| 17 | Scraggy | 17 | 9.44% | 23.53% |
| 19 | Porygon | 16 | 8.89% | 62.50% |
| 20 | Chinchou | 13 | 7.22% | 61.54% |
| 20 | Pawniard | 13 | 7.22% | 46.15% |
| 22 | Cranidos | 12 | 6.67% | 33.33% |
| 22 | Stunky | 12 | 6.67% | 25.00% |
| 22 | Tinkatink | 12 | 6.67% | 25.00% |
| 25 | Mienfoo | 11 | 6.11% | 18.18% |
| 26 | Dewpider | 10 | 5.56% | 50.00% |
| 27 | Snivy | 9 | 5.00% | 44.44% |
| 28 | Cyndaquil | 8 | 4.44% | 62.50% |
| 28 | Cubchoo | 8 | 4.44% | 62.50% |
| 28 | Shroodle | 8 | 4.44% | 62.50% |
| 31 | Torchic | 7 | 3.89% | 42.86% |
| 31 | Diglett | 7 | 3.89% | 28.57% |
| 33 | Psyduck | 5 | 2.78% | 80.00% |
| 33 | Corphish | 5 | 2.78% | 60.00% |
| 33 | Fletchling | 5 | 2.78% | 60.00% |
| 36 | Buizel | 4 | 2.22% | 100.00% |
| 36 | Magnemite | 4 | 2.22% | 25.00% |
| 36 | Gothita | 4 | 2.22% | 0.00% |
| 39 | Finneon | 3 | 1.67% | 66.67% |
| 39 | Aipom | 3 | 1.67% | 66.67% |
| 39 | Drifloon | 3 | 1.67% | 0.00% |
| 42 | Clauncher | 2 | 1.11% | 100.00% |
| 42 | Bulbasaur | 2 | 1.11% | 50.00% |
| 42 | Poltchageist | 2 | 1.11% | 50.00% |
| 42 | Squirtle | 2 | 1.11% | 50.00% |
| 42 | Wattrel | 2 | 1.11% | 50.00% |
| 42 | Piplup | 2 | 1.11% | 0.00% |
| 42 | Fomantis | 2 | 1.11% | 0.00% |
| 42 | Popplio | 2 | 1.11% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Riolu | 1 | 0.56% | 100.00% |
| 50 | Grimer-Alola | 1 | 0.56% | 100.00% |
| 50 | Impidimp | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Meowth-Galar | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Dratini | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Surskit | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Croagunk | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Fuecoco | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Seel | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Salandit | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Mankey | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Spoink | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
| 50 | Growlithe | 1 | 0.56% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Misdreavus | 26 | 65.00% | 53.85% |
| 2 | Mudbray | 25 | 62.50% | 52.00% |
| 3 | Stantler | 21 | 52.50% | 61.90% |
| 3 | Vullaby | 21 | 52.50% | 52.38% |
| 5 | Foongus | 13 | 32.50% | 69.23% |
| 5 | Grookey | 13 | 32.50% | 38.46% |
| 7 | Litten | 12 | 30.00% | 50.00% |
| 8 | Elekid | 8 | 20.00% | 37.50% |
| 9 | Cutiefly | 7 | 17.50% | 42.86% |
| 10 | Wingull | 6 | 15.00% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Pawniard | 6 | 15.00% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Cranidos | 6 | 15.00% | 33.33% |
| 13 | Snivy | 5 | 12.50% | 40.00% |
| 13 | Stunky | 5 | 12.50% | 20.00% |
| 15 | Glimmet | 4 | 10.00% | 75.00% |
| 15 | Meditite | 4 | 10.00% | 75.00% |
| 15 | Growlithe-Hisui | 4 | 10.00% | 50.00% |
| 15 | Porygon | 4 | 10.00% | 25.00% |
| 15 | Scraggy | 4 | 10.00% | 25.00% |
| 20 | Snover | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 20 | Torchic | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 20 | Chinchou | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 20 | Diglett | 3 | 7.50% | 33.33% |
| 24 | Inkay | 2 | 5.00% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Finneon | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 24 | Skrelp | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 24 | Shroodle | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 24 | Mienfoo | 2 | 5.00% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Fomantis | 2 | 5.00% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Popplio | 2 | 5.00% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Tinkatink | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Squirtle | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Buizel | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Psyduck | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Poltchageist | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Grimer-Alola | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Fletchling | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Cyndaquil | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Corphish | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Voltorb-Hisui | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 31 | Cubchoo | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Drifloon | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Meowth-Galar | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Dratini | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Surskit | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Croagunk | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Piplup | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Fuecoco | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Gothita | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 31 | Wattrel | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Misdreavus | 27 | 67.50% | 51.85% |
| 2 | Mudbray | 24 | 60.00% | 50.00% |
| 3 | Vullaby | 23 | 57.50% | 47.83% |
| 4 | Stantler | 20 | 50.00% | 55.00% |
| 5 | Foongus | 14 | 35.00% | 42.86% |
| 6 | Growlithe-Hisui | 11 | 27.50% | 45.45% |
| 7 | Cutiefly | 10 | 25.00% | 30.00% |
| 8 | Meditite | 9 | 22.50% | 55.56% |
| 8 | Wingull | 9 | 22.50% | 44.44% |
| 10 | Litten | 8 | 20.00% | 62.50% |
| 11 | Grookey | 7 | 17.50% | 85.71% |
| 12 | Pawniard | 6 | 15.00% | 50.00% |
| 13 | Elekid | 5 | 12.50% | 80.00% |
| 13 | Tinkatink | 5 | 12.50% | 40.00% |
| 13 | Stunky | 5 | 12.50% | 40.00% |
| 13 | Inkay | 5 | 12.50% | 20.00% |
| 17 | Glimmet | 4 | 10.00% | 75.00% |
| 17 | Voltorb-Hisui | 4 | 10.00% | 50.00% |
| 17 | Diglett | 4 | 10.00% | 25.00% |
| 17 | Cranidos | 4 | 10.00% | 25.00% |
| 17 | Scraggy | 4 | 10.00% | 25.00% |
| 22 | Aipom | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 22 | Porygon | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 22 | Snover | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 22 | Skrelp | 3 | 7.50% | 66.67% |
| 26 | Dewpider | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 26 | Chinchou | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 26 | Fletchling | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 26 | Cyndaquil | 2 | 5.00% | 50.00% |
| 30 | Riolu | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 30 | Finneon | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 30 | Shroodle | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 30 | Buizel | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 30 | Psyduck | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 30 | Clauncher | 1 | 2.50% | 100.00% |
| 30 | Gothita | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 30 | Snivy | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 30 | Seel | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 30 | Squirtle | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 30 | Growlithe | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
| 30 | Corphish | 1 | 2.50% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Misdreavus | 10 | 100.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Mudbray | 10 | 100.00% | 50.00% |
| 3 | Vullaby | 8 | 80.00% | 50.00% |
| 4 | Stantler | 5 | 50.00% | 80.00% |
| 5 | Inkay | 4 | 40.00% | 75.00% |
| 6 | Porygon | 3 | 30.00% | 66.67% |
| 7 | Snover | 2 | 20.00% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Litten | 2 | 20.00% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Cubchoo | 2 | 20.00% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Foongus | 2 | 20.00% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Scraggy | 2 | 20.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Glimmet | 1 | 10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12 | Wattrel | 1 | 10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12 | Corphish | 1 | 10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12 | Grookey | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Growlithe-Hisui | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Skrelp | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Torchic | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Elekid | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Salandit | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Voltorb-Hisui | 1 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 13 | 54.17% | 53.85% |
| 1 | Mudbray | 13 | 54.17% | 53.85% |
| 1 | Misdreavus | 13 | 54.17% | 53.85% |
| 4 | Stantler | 12 | 50.00% | 41.67% |
| 5 | Elekid | 8 | 33.33% | 62.50% |
| 5 | Growlithe-Hisui | 8 | 33.33% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Litten | 7 | 29.17% | 42.86% |
| 7 | Foongus | 7 | 29.17% | 14.29% |
| 9 | Grookey | 6 | 25.00% | 66.67% |
| 9 | Wingull | 6 | 25.00% | 33.33% |
| 11 | Scraggy | 4 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 11 | Meditite | 4 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 11 | Skrelp | 4 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Inkay | 3 | 12.50% | 66.67% |
| 14 | Shroodle | 3 | 12.50% | 66.67% |
| 14 | Mienfoo | 3 | 12.50% | 66.67% |
| 14 | Dewpider | 3 | 12.50% | 33.33% |
| 14 | Tinkatink | 3 | 12.50% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Porygon | 2 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 19 | Glimmet | 2 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 19 | Voltorb-Hisui | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 19 | Snover | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 19 | Psyduck | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 19 | Cutiefly | 2 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Cranidos | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Cubchoo | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Snivy | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Buizel | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Magnemite | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Cyndaquil | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Bulbasaur | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Corphish | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Mankey | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Torchic | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Drifloon | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Spoink | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 12 | 85.71% | 41.67% |
| 2 | Misdreavus | 11 | 78.57% | 36.36% |
| 3 | Mudbray | 10 | 71.43% | 50.00% |
| 4 | Stantler | 9 | 64.29% | 55.56% |
| 5 | Growlithe-Hisui | 7 | 50.00% | 57.14% |
| 6 | Foongus | 6 | 42.86% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Grookey | 5 | 35.71% | 60.00% |
| 7 | Elekid | 5 | 35.71% | 60.00% |
| 9 | Skrelp | 2 | 14.29% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Voltorb-Hisui | 2 | 14.29% | 50.00% |
| 11 | Dewpider | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Meditite | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Wingull | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Shroodle | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Buizel | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Psyduck | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Torchic | 1 | 7.14% | 100.00% |
| 11 | Stunky | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Cutiefly | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Chinchou | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Litten | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Tinkatink | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Snover | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Drifloon | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
| 11 | Gothita | 1 | 7.14% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Misdreavus | 14 | 77.78% | 64.29% |
| 1 | Vullaby | 14 | 77.78% | 64.29% |
| 3 | Mudbray | 11 | 61.11% | 45.45% |
| 4 | Stantler | 10 | 55.56% | 60.00% |
| 5 | Grookey | 6 | 33.33% | 66.67% |
| 5 | Growlithe-Hisui | 6 | 33.33% | 33.33% |
| 7 | Litten | 4 | 22.22% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Snover | 4 | 22.22% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Cutiefly | 4 | 22.22% | 25.00% |
| 10 | Skrelp | 3 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 10 | Chinchou | 3 | 16.67% | 66.67% |
| 10 | Glimmet | 3 | 16.67% | 33.33% |
| 13 | Inkay | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 13 | Meditite | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 13 | Voltorb-Hisui | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 13 | Snivy | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 13 | Mienfoo | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 13 | Scraggy | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 13 | Tinkatink | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Cubchoo | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 20 | Porygon | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 20 | Clauncher | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 20 | Elekid | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 20 | Impidimp | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Poltchageist | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Magnemite | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Foongus | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Gothita | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Fletchling | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Cyndaquil | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 20 | Wingull | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 9 | 75.00% | 55.56% |
| 2 | Stantler | 8 | 66.67% | 75.00% |
| 3 | Misdreavus | 7 | 58.33% | 71.43% |
| 3 | Mudbray | 7 | 58.33% | 42.86% |
| 5 | Snover | 4 | 33.33% | 75.00% |
| 5 | Growlithe-Hisui | 4 | 33.33% | 25.00% |
| 7 | Glimmet | 3 | 25.00% | 66.67% |
| 7 | Grookey | 3 | 25.00% | 66.67% |
| 9 | Skrelp | 2 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Chinchou | 2 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Cyndaquil | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 9 | Foongus | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 9 | Magnemite | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Mienfoo | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Litten | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Meditite | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Fletchling | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 17 | Cutiefly | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 17 | Elekid | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 17 | Voltorb-Hisui | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Dewpider | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Shroodle | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Bulbasaur | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Scraggy | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Cubchoo | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Porygon | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 17 | Cranidos | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 11 | 91.67% | 54.55% |
| 1 | Misdreavus | 11 | 91.67% | 45.45% |
| 3 | Stantler | 9 | 75.00% | 33.33% |
| 4 | Mudbray | 7 | 58.33% | 57.14% |
| 5 | Voltorb-Hisui | 4 | 33.33% | 75.00% |
| 5 | Snover | 4 | 33.33% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Meditite | 3 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Growlithe-Hisui | 3 | 25.00% | 66.67% |
| 7 | Dewpider | 3 | 25.00% | 66.67% |
| 7 | Litten | 3 | 25.00% | 33.33% |
| 7 | Foongus | 3 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 12 | Chinchou | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 12 | Glimmet | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 12 | Elekid | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 15 | Cubchoo | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 15 | Porygon | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 15 | Cutiefly | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 15 | Stunky | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 15 | Piplup | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Mudbray | 4 | 100.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Misdreavus | 4 | 100.00% | 50.00% |
| 3 | Vullaby | 3 | 75.00% | 33.33% |
| 3 | Stantler | 3 | 75.00% | 33.33% |
| 5 | Elekid | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 6 | Snover | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 6 | Cubchoo | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 6 | Porygon | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 6 | Litten | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 6 | Foongus | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 6 | Inkay | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 6 | Mienfoo | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 6 | Growlithe-Hisui | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 5 | 83.33% | 60.00% |
| 1 | Misdreavus | 5 | 83.33% | 40.00% |
| 3 | Stantler | 3 | 50.00% | 100.00% |
| 3 | Glimmet | 3 | 50.00% | 66.67% |
| 3 | Mudbray | 3 | 50.00% | 33.33% |
| 6 | Grookey | 2 | 33.33% | 50.00% |
| 6 | Inkay | 2 | 33.33% | 50.00% |
| 6 | Elekid | 2 | 33.33% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Cyndaquil | 1 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Corphish | 1 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Cutiefly | 1 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Litten | 1 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Skrelp | 1 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Mienfoo | 1 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Torchic | 1 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Wingull | 1 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Pawniard | 1 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Meditite | 1 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 9 | Foongus | 1 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
Derby Teamdump
I didn't plan on playing DLC this Derby, but ended up having much more fun than I thought I would. I felt very confident in my prep and in the teams I ended up building. My record was worse than I'd have liked, but each of my losses were a result of a couple of poor turns in the endgame - play better than me and you'll have success with these teams.
(Click on the sprites for the teams and the opponent text for the replay. More details to come in an edit.)
Week 1 (zee vs. John1240) W and Week 2 (vs. Gasai) W
(The Fear of Fear - Spiritbox)This is the strongest team in the format. Missy shuts down opposing Mudbray, Vull, and Foong, allowing broken CM Stant to do broken CM Stant things. This is the standardest balance team that's good into absolutely everything (perhaps its only negative matchup is elekid + pawn) and is featured on the samples (these EVs are slightly better, forgot how or why).
Week 3 (vs. Cepha) L
(Forgot nicknames + played on mobile, guaranteed loss)Setup Scraggy possesses the rare trait of being positive into the two best Pokemon, Stant and Missy. Grookey isn't at the peak of its viability anymore due to its poor matchups into Stant, Vull, Foong, and more, but on this team it patches the Mudbray weakness. Elekid further enables both setup options (broken CM Stant again).
Week 4 (zee vs. HSOWA) L
(I will ask zee where these nicknames came from)Torchic, when positioned right, can overwhelm most teams once Snivy and Stant weaken them. Unfortunately this positioning can be quite difficult to do due to its frailty and the existence of broken Stantler, but the payoff is big.
Week 5 (vs. Necas) W
(Thornhill - BODIES)I copied this off of a voltix replay, replacing mid physical Stant with broken special Stant. Its bulk allows it to reliably set Trick Room while doing respectable damage unboosted. Skrelp + Inkay form a powerful slow mode by covering each other's weaknesses and hitting real hard. Double pivots enable maximum value from TR turns.
Edit: STOP USING PHYSICAL STANTLER IT SUCKS BALLS
Week 6 - Semis (vs. Gasai) L
(Blacklit Canopy) This format lacks real water types, and Corphish (in addition to the aforementioned Skrelp) comes closest to being viable (I despise Wingull due to how inaccurate its moves are, but it's definitely usable as well). Hyper cutter + SD + priority allows it to chunk everything, and Vull + Foong + Litten support put it in the driver's seat.
Week 7 - Finals (vs. Akhant) L
(Static Dress - Rouge Carpet Disaster)This is my favorite team from this tour. Screens Stant is enough of a subversion from Broken CM that it would not have shown up on my scout. At level 5, damage margins play a massive role, and screens swing damage trades firmly in your favor. NP Missy takes full advantage of that, as does Superpower Inkay. Mienfoo has a unique niche in this format - reasonably fast Fake Out that isn't afraid of opposing Fake Out or Intimidate. I initially had coaching on it but dropped it when I put Inkay on the team. U-turn allows you to make better use of screens turns.
Meta thoughts: Stantler is broken and unhealthy for this tier, though I don't know if my replays are great evidence for it. Missy is also broken but not to the same extent, owing to its versatility and annoyingness. These two are on every team of mine during this tour and will likely be on every serious team I build until they are gone. There is absolutely no reason not to use them; any team that does not have them will be made stronger by adding them. They have a chokehold on the tier - with one or both gone, we will be able to build actually interesting teams (there have been actually interesting teams used in the last few tours but all of them would be made better by replacing the interesting element with broken Stantler or Missy).
Vullaby is incredibly good precisely because those two are broken - a very strong Knock Off and Tailwind mean the rest of your team can actually deal with opposing Missy and Stant. Mudbray doesn't feel as "elite" as these three, but is still reliably the best physical attacker in the format. Snow does not seem as strong as it used to, due to the special bulk level being higher.
Other things that are cool and deserve more builder attention: the waters (Corphish, Skrelp, Dewpider, Competitive Piplup), Coaching (Mienfoo), Belly Drum (Cetoddle, Magby).
Shoutouts zee and qsns for inviting me to the most broken Derby team and prepping with me, shoutouts Ice Riders for being broken, and thank you to PigWarrior19 LogIce shadekirby321 sir jelloton eragon for helping me test/build for this funny format!
Last edited:
I agree, I think we should look at suspecting both Stantler & Misdreavus.
The issue with both of these pokemon in my opinion is not only how strong they are (and they both are pretty significantly stronger than most of the rest of the meta), but also their set diversity. How you play against CM Stantler (getting an early knock off or getting in a strong physical attacker, which often requires speed control as well) is drastically different than how you play against TR Stantler, or just three attacks Stantler, and with the speed tiers of LC it can often be impossible to know which set it is until it’s revealed. The same can be said for Misdreavus, the support set is maybe the most oppressive set in the metagame, but then it can also be a great nasty plot sweeper, or even a TR setter.
Most of the rest of the tier has pretty predictable sets, outside of scarfers which exist in every tier. I think there would be a lot more stability with these two oppressive threats gone.
The issue with both of these pokemon in my opinion is not only how strong they are (and they both are pretty significantly stronger than most of the rest of the meta), but also their set diversity. How you play against CM Stantler (getting an early knock off or getting in a strong physical attacker, which often requires speed control as well) is drastically different than how you play against TR Stantler, or just three attacks Stantler, and with the speed tiers of LC it can often be impossible to know which set it is until it’s revealed. The same can be said for Misdreavus, the support set is maybe the most oppressive set in the metagame, but then it can also be a great nasty plot sweeper, or even a TR setter.
Most of the rest of the tier has pretty predictable sets, outside of scarfers which exist in every tier. I think there would be a lot more stability with these two oppressive threats gone.
SUSPECT Welcome to second Misdreavus suspect of the generation! It´s been a long couple years since the first suspect. During this time, Misdreavus has been probably the most prominent Pokemon of the tier. However after that first suspect the meta managed to adapt to it, resulting in a frail balance between Misdreavus and other powerful Pokemon such as Stantler or Girafarig.
Missy has always acted as a scary set up sweeper, being the Nasty Plot/Calm Mind set the most popular one. As any other set up Pokemon, Missy adopted the role of the main wincon in the teams it was present, and his success was usually linked to the amount of support it could get, and how the speed controls of both teams were played.
However, this role changed since the last suspect. With Girafarig gone, Stantler became the main wincon of many teams, and Missy got relegated to a more supportive role.
Misdreavus (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 36 HP / 116 Def / 76 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Icy Wind
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 36 HP / 116 Def / 76 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Icy Wind
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt
When we thought we knew everything about this little ghost, it managed to amazed us once again, dominating and shutting down many teams with the combination of icy wind and taunt, giving some archetypes a hard time to play against.
The main reason why this set is working so well, its due to the rise of CM Stantler. The meta turned more offensive to try to deal with the deer and physical Pokemon like Mudbray, Grookey, Inkay, Vullaby or even the Physical Stantler were more appreciated to try to deal with those SpDef boosts. This is where Missy enter as a superb partner who provides not only speed control, but also spread burns everywhere thanks to Will-O-Wisp. Also don´t forget that it can still act as the main wincon, so we have a bit of "guessing game" when facing a Missy right now.
The way it dominated most of the games from this last Derby Tour, exerting an overwhelming pressure into the enemy teams, has made the council decided to suspect what probably is the most controversial and famous face of Doubles Little Cup.
Like the last suspect we are giving reqs based on the tournaments results. This time we have decided to give reqs to the Top 8 of the last seasonal, and to those who got at least two wins in the LCBC, LPL or Derby.
As always, in order to submit your votes, you can DM me on Smogon or on Discord (voltix#2487) with your decision: Ban, Do Not Ban or Abstain.
I would strongly advice to not make random votes, you can always go for Abstain if you dont want to participate or feel like you lack the experience in the tier to make a consistent vote.
The deadline will be Sunday May 25th.
To close this post, it is the council´s intention to keep a close eye to the remaining Pokemon from the Big 3: Stantler. We will try to have a meta as open as possible for this last year of generation. Thank you all for reading this post!
The results of the suspect are here!
The most controversial Pokemon since the first day of SV DLC is now banned! For the first time in almost 3 years we will have a meta where Misdreavus is going to be illegal.
We expect things to change up a lot throught the following tours and we will keep a close eye to Stantler with the idea of taking actions if necessary.
Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement this ban, thanks!
The most controversial Pokemon since the first day of SV DLC is now banned! For the first time in almost 3 years we will have a meta where Misdreavus is going to be illegal.
We expect things to change up a lot throught the following tours and we will keep a close eye to Stantler with the idea of taking actions if necessary.
Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement this ban, thanks!
Attachments
Swiss #3 Usage Stats
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 70 | 63.64% | 51.43% |
| 2 | Mudbray | 68 | 61.82% | 52.94% |
| 3 | Stantler | 44 | 40.00% | 54.55% |
| 4 | Foongus | 37 | 33.64% | 64.86% |
| 5 | Litten | 29 | 26.36% | 68.97% |
| 6 | Wingull | 28 | 25.45% | 57.14% |
| 7 | Porygon | 24 | 21.82% | 66.67% |
| 8 | Snover | 21 | 19.09% | 61.90% |
| 8 | Cutiefly | 21 | 19.09% | 33.33% |
| 8 | Grookey | 21 | 19.09% | 33.33% |
| 11 | Elekid | 19 | 17.27% | 36.84% |
| 12 | Inkay | 18 | 16.36% | 66.67% |
| 12 | Glimmet | 18 | 16.36% | 33.33% |
| 14 | Growlithe-Hisui | 16 | 14.55% | 37.50% |
| 15 | Mienfoo | 15 | 13.64% | 53.33% |
| 16 | Cubchoo | 14 | 12.73% | 78.57% |
| 16 | Meditite | 14 | 12.73% | 35.71% |
| 18 | Tinkatink | 13 | 11.82% | 15.38% |
| 19 | Scraggy | 12 | 10.91% | 66.67% |
| 19 | Pawniard | 12 | 10.91% | 25.00% |
| 21 | Gastly | 11 | 10.00% | 45.45% |
| 22 | Gothita | 10 | 9.09% | 60.00% |
| 22 | Dewpider | 10 | 9.09% | 50.00% |
| 22 | Cranidos | 10 | 9.09% | 50.00% |
| 22 | Voltorb-Hisui | 10 | 9.09% | 30.00% |
| 26 | Poltchageist | 8 | 7.27% | 62.50% |
| 27 | Stunky | 7 | 6.36% | 42.86% |
| 28 | Torchic | 6 | 5.45% | 50.00% |
| 28 | Drifloon | 6 | 5.45% | 33.33% |
| 30 | Skrelp | 4 | 3.64% | 75.00% |
| 30 | Litwick | 4 | 3.64% | 75.00% |
| 30 | Chinchou | 4 | 3.64% | 50.00% |
| 30 | Psyduck | 4 | 3.64% | 50.00% |
| 30 | Buizel | 4 | 3.64% | 50.00% |
| 30 | Shroodle | 4 | 3.64% | 50.00% |
| 30 | Corphish | 4 | 3.64% | 25.00% |
| 30 | Diglett | 4 | 3.64% | 25.00% |
| 30 | Cyndaquil | 4 | 3.64% | 0.00% |
| 39 | Finneon | 3 | 2.73% | 66.67% |
| 39 | Slowpoke | 3 | 2.73% | 66.67% |
| 39 | Fletchling | 3 | 2.73% | 33.33% |
| 39 | Zorua-Hisui | 3 | 2.73% | 33.33% |
| 43 | Magnemite | 2 | 1.82% | 50.00% |
| 43 | Timburr | 2 | 1.82% | 0.00% |
| 43 | Croagunk | 2 | 1.82% | 0.00% |
| 43 | Snivy | 2 | 1.82% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Numel | 1 | 0.91% | 100.00% |
| 47 | Clauncher | 1 | 0.91% | 100.00% |
| 47 | Fomantis | 1 | 0.91% | 100.00% |
| 47 | Hippopotas | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Drowzee | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Koffing | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Rufflet | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Barboach | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Capsakid | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Riolu | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Grimer-Alola | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
| 47 | Magby | 1 | 0.91% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Mudbray | 22 | 73.33% | 50.00% |
| 2 | Vullaby | 21 | 70.00% | 52.38% |
| 3 | Stantler | 20 | 66.67% | 55.00% |
| 4 | Foongus | 11 | 36.67% | 90.91% |
| 5 | Wingull | 10 | 33.33% | 60.00% |
| 5 | Litten | 10 | 33.33% | 60.00% |
| 7 | Gastly | 7 | 23.33% | 42.86% |
| 7 | Glimmet | 7 | 23.33% | 42.86% |
| 9 | Inkay | 5 | 16.67% | 60.00% |
| 9 | Mienfoo | 5 | 16.67% | 60.00% |
| 9 | Elekid | 5 | 16.67% | 40.00% |
| 9 | Grookey | 5 | 16.67% | 20.00% |
| 13 | Pawniard | 4 | 13.33% | 25.00% |
| 13 | Poltchageist | 4 | 13.33% | 25.00% |
| 13 | Cutiefly | 4 | 13.33% | 0.00% |
| 16 | Snover | 3 | 10.00% | 66.67% |
| 16 | Torchic | 3 | 10.00% | 33.33% |
| 16 | Stunky | 3 | 10.00% | 33.33% |
| 16 | Growlithe-Hisui | 3 | 10.00% | 33.33% |
| 16 | Tinkatink | 3 | 10.00% | 0.00% |
| 21 | Porygon | 2 | 6.67% | 100.00% |
| 21 | Drifloon | 2 | 6.67% | 50.00% |
| 21 | Gothita | 2 | 6.67% | 50.00% |
| 21 | Voltorb-Hisui | 2 | 6.67% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Cubchoo | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Zorua-Hisui | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Dewpider | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Corphish | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Chinchou | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Scraggy | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Meditite | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Litwick | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Fomantis | 1 | 3.33% | 100.00% |
| 25 | Diglett | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Cranidos | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Slowpoke | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Riolu | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Grimer-Alola | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Magnemite | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Timburr | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
| 25 | Magby | 1 | 3.33% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Stantler | 17 | 70.83% | 52.94% |
| 2 | Vullaby | 14 | 58.33% | 57.14% |
| 2 | Mudbray | 14 | 58.33% | 42.86% |
| 4 | Foongus | 7 | 29.17% | 57.14% |
| 4 | Wingull | 7 | 29.17% | 42.86% |
| 4 | Grookey | 7 | 29.17% | 42.86% |
| 4 | Elekid | 7 | 29.17% | 28.57% |
| 8 | Mienfoo | 6 | 25.00% | 50.00% |
| 9 | Snover | 5 | 20.83% | 40.00% |
| 10 | Inkay | 4 | 16.67% | 75.00% |
| 10 | Gothita | 4 | 16.67% | 75.00% |
| 10 | Cutiefly | 4 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Tinkatink | 4 | 16.67% | 25.00% |
| 14 | Meditite | 3 | 12.50% | 66.67% |
| 14 | Cranidos | 3 | 12.50% | 66.67% |
| 14 | Gastly | 3 | 12.50% | 33.33% |
| 14 | Litten | 3 | 12.50% | 33.33% |
| 18 | Porygon | 2 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 18 | Drifloon | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Torchic | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Stunky | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Growlithe-Hisui | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Skrelp | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Glimmet | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Scraggy | 2 | 8.33% | 50.00% |
| 18 | Pawniard | 2 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Voltorb-Hisui | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Dewpider | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Cubchoo | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Shroodle | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Buizel | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Psyduck | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Litwick | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Poltchageist | 1 | 4.17% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Diglett | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Fletchling | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Cyndaquil | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Corphish | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Snivy | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Croagunk | 1 | 4.17% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Mudbray | 13 | 72.22% | 53.85% |
| 1 | Vullaby | 13 | 72.22% | 46.15% |
| 3 | Foongus | 9 | 50.00% | 66.67% |
| 4 | Stantler | 7 | 38.89% | 57.14% |
| 5 | Mienfoo | 4 | 22.22% | 50.00% |
| 5 | Growlithe-Hisui | 4 | 22.22% | 25.00% |
| 5 | Glimmet | 4 | 22.22% | 25.00% |
| 5 | Meditite | 4 | 22.22% | 25.00% |
| 9 | Inkay | 3 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Wingull | 3 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 9 | Porygon | 3 | 16.67% | 66.67% |
| 9 | Elekid | 3 | 16.67% | 66.67% |
| 9 | Cutiefly | 3 | 16.67% | 33.33% |
| 14 | Scraggy | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Dewpider | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Snover | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Cubchoo | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Grookey | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Litten | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 14 | Voltorb-Hisui | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 14 | Cyndaquil | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 14 | Tinkatink | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 14 | Drifloon | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Slowpoke | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Numel | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Clauncher | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Litwick | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Gastly | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Gothita | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Cranidos | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Torchic | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Pawniard | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 24 | Rufflet | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Barboach | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Chinchou | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Capsakid | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Shroodle | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 24 | Zorua-Hisui | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Vullaby | 11 | 61.11% | 45.45% |
| 2 | Porygon | 8 | 44.44% | 62.50% |
| 3 | Mudbray | 7 | 38.89% | 71.43% |
| 4 | Snover | 6 | 33.33% | 83.33% |
| 4 | Cubchoo | 6 | 33.33% | 83.33% |
| 6 | Litten | 5 | 27.78% | 100.00% |
| 6 | Wingull | 5 | 27.78% | 40.00% |
| 8 | Grookey | 4 | 22.22% | 25.00% |
| 8 | Cutiefly | 4 | 22.22% | 25.00% |
| 10 | Cranidos | 3 | 16.67% | 66.67% |
| 10 | Pawniard | 3 | 16.67% | 33.33% |
| 10 | Elekid | 3 | 16.67% | 33.33% |
| 10 | Dewpider | 3 | 16.67% | 33.33% |
| 10 | Foongus | 3 | 16.67% | 33.33% |
| 10 | Meditite | 3 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 16 | Scraggy | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Voltorb-Hisui | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Tinkatink | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Diglett | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Stunky | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Inkay | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Shroodle | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Buizel | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Psyduck | 2 | 11.11% | 50.00% |
| 16 | Glimmet | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 16 | Growlithe-Hisui | 2 | 11.11% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Chinchou | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Fletchling | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Gothita | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Poltchageist | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Slowpoke | 1 | 5.56% | 100.00% |
| 27 | Finneon | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Snivy | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Koffing | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Zorua-Hisui | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Litwick | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Cyndaquil | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
| 27 | Corphish | 1 | 5.56% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Mudbray | 7 | 58.33% | 71.43% |
| 1 | Litten | 7 | 58.33% | 71.43% |
| 1 | Vullaby | 7 | 58.33% | 57.14% |
| 4 | Porygon | 5 | 41.67% | 60.00% |
| 5 | Snover | 4 | 33.33% | 75.00% |
| 5 | Cubchoo | 4 | 33.33% | 75.00% |
| 7 | Wingull | 3 | 25.00% | 66.67% |
| 7 | Voltorb-Hisui | 3 | 25.00% | 33.33% |
| 7 | Foongus | 3 | 25.00% | 33.33% |
| 10 | Scraggy | 2 | 16.67% | 100.00% |
| 10 | Grookey | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Dewpider | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Growlithe-Hisui | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Glimmet | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Cutiefly | 2 | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| 10 | Gothita | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 10 | Pawniard | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 10 | Cranidos | 2 | 16.67% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Meditite | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 19 | Magnemite | 1 | 8.33% | 100.00% |
| 19 | Elekid | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Psyduck | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Buizel | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Hippopotas | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Timburr | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Drowzee | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Croagunk | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Fletchling | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
| 19 | Tinkatink | 1 | 8.33% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Cutiefly | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Growlithe-Hisui | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Mudbray | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Scraggy | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Inkay | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 1 | Porygon | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Finneon | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Foongus | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Litten | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Poltchageist | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Skrelp | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Vullaby | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Dewpider | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Meditite | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Snover | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Glimmet | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Grookey | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Chinchou | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokémon | Use | Usage % | Win % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1 | Mudbray | 3 | 75.00% | 33.33% |
| 1 | Foongus | 3 | 75.00% | 33.33% |
| 1 | Vullaby | 3 | 75.00% | 33.33% |
| 4 | Cutiefly | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 4 | Porygon | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 4 | Inkay | 2 | 50.00% | 50.00% |
| 7 | Growlithe-Hisui | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Finneon | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Scraggy | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Litten | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Poltchageist | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Skrelp | 1 | 25.00% | 100.00% |
| 7 | Corphish | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Meditite | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
| 7 | Tinkatink | 1 | 25.00% | 0.00% |
SUSPECT
Once known as the Big 3, Stantler, alongside Misdreavus and Girafarig, formed a fragile balance of power that served as the foundation of this tier. Following Giraf's ban, that balance was disrupted, triggering a domino effect that ultimately led to the inevitable suspect tests of the remaining two.
This is not the first Stantler suspect we are hosting in this tier, if we take a look at the 2024 suspect we can see that the pro-ban reasons have not changed at all. Great BST, perfect coverage, 3-4 different viable sets... After the loss of his main chec, the CM set has proven to be too problematic, if it wasn´t already. The rest of the story is well known by everyone.
Since there have not been other tours since the Misdreavus suspect, we will keep the list of voting players untouched.
As always, in order to submit your votes, you can DM me on Smogon or on Discord (voltix#2487) with your decision: Ban, Do Not Ban or Abstain.
I would strongly advice to not make random votes, you can always go for Abstain if you dont want to participate or feel like you lack the experience in the tier to make a consistent vote.
The deadline will be Sunday June 15th.
Pings:As promised, the next (and hopefully last) suspect is here. After the suspect and ban of Misdreavus, it was clear for eveyone that Stantler needed to follow the steps of his ghostly friend.
Once known as the Big 3, Stantler, alongside Misdreavus and Girafarig, formed a fragile balance of power that served as the foundation of this tier. Following Giraf's ban, that balance was disrupted, triggering a domino effect that ultimately led to the inevitable suspect tests of the remaining two.
This is not the first Stantler suspect we are hosting in this tier, if we take a look at the 2024 suspect we can see that the pro-ban reasons have not changed at all. Great BST, perfect coverage, 3-4 different viable sets... After the loss of his main chec, the CM set has proven to be too problematic, if it wasn´t already. The rest of the story is well known by everyone.
Since there have not been other tours since the Misdreavus suspect, we will keep the list of voting players untouched.
As always, in order to submit your votes, you can DM me on Smogon or on Discord (voltix#2487) with your decision: Ban, Do Not Ban or Abstain.
I would strongly advice to not make random votes, you can always go for Abstain if you dont want to participate or feel like you lack the experience in the tier to make a consistent vote.
The deadline will be Sunday June 15th.
That was quick, the results are here!
The end of an era has arrived, Stantler joins his "Big 3" teammates and is now banned from SV Doubles LC. The players have unanimously voted ban, showing their disconform with Stantler after the Misdreavus ban.
The remaining votes won´t affect the final result, but feel free to keep sending them to me, I will update the image. Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement the ban, thanks!
As we enter into a new meta, we expect things to move up a lot, new Pokemon to take the spotlight and maybe some comebacks. Feel free to leave your thoughts here or in the discord!
The end of an era has arrived, Stantler joins his "Big 3" teammates and is now banned from SV Doubles LC. The players have unanimously voted ban, showing their disconform with Stantler after the Misdreavus ban.
The remaining votes won´t affect the final result, but feel free to keep sending them to me, I will update the image. Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement the ban, thanks!
As we enter into a new meta, we expect things to move up a lot, new Pokemon to take the spotlight and maybe some comebacks. Feel free to leave your thoughts here or in the discord!
With the new meta coming many things will change, so I would like to talk about those that might get benefit from the latest bans. Take into account that these are just some predicts of mine, they might end up being true or not.
Probably the closest to becoming the next top tier Pokemon. The 19-speed tier, once crowded with powerful options, is gonna be run by this little fly with few to none opposition (Wingull still exists). Cutiefly has an amazing versatility, with multiple options such as Tailwind, Screens. Webs, QD, Stun Spore, Fake Tears and a very powerful STAB attacks. While this Pokemon will most likely have 3-4 different viable sets, it will be more straightforward than Missy or Stantler. The speed control that it can provide in this meta will be unmatched.
The natural replacemente for Missy.
Careful now, this will not be like his fellow ghost, it will hit harder and die faster. A glass-cannon attacker that might have a huge impact on this new meta, depending of how the meta adapt to take its hits.
This poor doggo was having a hard time lately. Stantler was a nightmare with Intimidate+Earth Power, and it was unable to blast through Missy´s bulk if it was intimidated. Now that both are gone, there are few things that can stop Growlithe apart from Mudbray and the very rare Fighting mons.
I personally believe these three will mark the new offensive level of the tier. All of them are able to do an absurd amount of damage to most of the tier, but there should not be alive in the game for a lot of turns. We will see how the meta adapts to them, but there will be the top-tier threats that need to be considered when building.
Same perfect Pokemon as always. I just want to point out that it will be a perfect partner for Cutiefly, making the perfect coverage of Fairy+Ground a real threat (Stantler vibes intensifies). If Cutiefly may end up being a problem, Mudbray will be one of the reasons why. Some of you might consider it at the same level at the three above, and that is completely fair.
Probably the natural replacement of Stantler.
This Pokemon has always been fantastic, but it was outclassed by Stantler. I expect it to be used a lot more now. His Trick Room will have a decent value to neutralize the speed control provided by Cutiefly and Vulla.
I never got to talked about it, but this might be one of the biggest winners from the Missy ban. People might start exploring this thing again, hopefully Shadow Tag wont be a big issue...
Ah yes, the Fighting Pokemon. They have suffered a lot this generation, specially Mienfoo. Tera Fairy Misdreavus/Stantler made his life a living hell. Its true that you might think Cutiefly is gonna prolong their agony, but Cutie doesnt have Intimidate or Will-O-Wisp like the other two, and its more frail at least. Special mention to Meditite, it will enjoy not having Missy around for sure, it could be one of the best rises.
I love this little guy! He will be back to check Cutie and Gastly. Amazing type combination but it might suffer against Mudbray and Fire types, if the the latter rises to stop Cutie.
Careful with these two, we already know them... Snow will still be a top tier archetype and without Missy and Stantler to take several Blizzards, Cubchoo will be able to punch holes thought unprepared teams easily.
Water mon have been almost non-existant this generation sadly. They might back to check Mudbray and Growlithe, considering how dangerous both of them look right now.
The Trick Room teams have actually been nerfed. With the bans of Missy and Stantler, we have lost the best two TR setters.
However, and this is one of my predicts, if the meta end up being too offensive and too dependant of the speed control provided by Cutie, Elekid or H-Orb; TR users will have a great value as part of semi-TR cores. If this happens at will be important to consider TR setters in regular builds, purely as a method of speed control.
Porygon, Inkay and Gothita might be the best TR setter of the meta, but Slowpoke and Poltcha might also become decent options.
I will always believe this things will eventually come back. Will they dissapoint me one more time? Most likely.
------------
Even with all the predicts above, we can get an idea of how the new meta, after the "Big 3" bans, will be. Those builds centered around a single wincon will no longer be viable, there are no mons that has the bulk and offensive presence to gather a team around to support it , like Missy and Stantler did. I expect the meta to be similar to the one we had in Gen 8 (for those of you who played it), where teams have several options to play around.
The power creep level of the tier has been reduced significantly, which means there is less risk in playing Pokemon that are low on the VR. You will be less punished by the meta when using unsual things like, for example, Scarf Cyndaquil or LO Cranidos. Teambuilding will be less restrictive (hopefully), but that doesn´t mean you don´t need to build around the main threats of the tier and try to answer them accordingly.
Overall, I am specially excited for this new chapter of the tier!
Probably the closest to becoming the next top tier Pokemon. The 19-speed tier, once crowded with powerful options, is gonna be run by this little fly with few to none opposition (Wingull still exists). Cutiefly has an amazing versatility, with multiple options such as Tailwind, Screens. Webs, QD, Stun Spore, Fake Tears and a very powerful STAB attacks. While this Pokemon will most likely have 3-4 different viable sets, it will be more straightforward than Missy or Stantler. The speed control that it can provide in this meta will be unmatched.
The natural replacemente for Missy.
Careful now, this will not be like his fellow ghost, it will hit harder and die faster. A glass-cannon attacker that might have a huge impact on this new meta, depending of how the meta adapt to take its hits.
This poor doggo was having a hard time lately. Stantler was a nightmare with Intimidate+Earth Power, and it was unable to blast through Missy´s bulk if it was intimidated. Now that both are gone, there are few things that can stop Growlithe apart from Mudbray and the very rare Fighting mons.
I personally believe these three will mark the new offensive level of the tier. All of them are able to do an absurd amount of damage to most of the tier, but there should not be alive in the game for a lot of turns. We will see how the meta adapts to them, but there will be the top-tier threats that need to be considered when building.
Same perfect Pokemon as always. I just want to point out that it will be a perfect partner for Cutiefly, making the perfect coverage of Fairy+Ground a real threat (Stantler vibes intensifies). If Cutiefly may end up being a problem, Mudbray will be one of the reasons why. Some of you might consider it at the same level at the three above, and that is completely fair.
Probably the natural replacement of Stantler.
This Pokemon has always been fantastic, but it was outclassed by Stantler. I expect it to be used a lot more now. His Trick Room will have a decent value to neutralize the speed control provided by Cutiefly and Vulla.
I never got to talked about it, but this might be one of the biggest winners from the Missy ban. People might start exploring this thing again, hopefully Shadow Tag wont be a big issue...
Ah yes, the Fighting Pokemon. They have suffered a lot this generation, specially Mienfoo. Tera Fairy Misdreavus/Stantler made his life a living hell. Its true that you might think Cutiefly is gonna prolong their agony, but Cutie doesnt have Intimidate or Will-O-Wisp like the other two, and its more frail at least. Special mention to Meditite, it will enjoy not having Missy around for sure, it could be one of the best rises.
I love this little guy! He will be back to check Cutie and Gastly. Amazing type combination but it might suffer against Mudbray and Fire types, if the the latter rises to stop Cutie.
Careful with these two, we already know them... Snow will still be a top tier archetype and without Missy and Stantler to take several Blizzards, Cubchoo will be able to punch holes thought unprepared teams easily.
Water mon have been almost non-existant this generation sadly. They might back to check Mudbray and Growlithe, considering how dangerous both of them look right now.
The Trick Room teams have actually been nerfed. With the bans of Missy and Stantler, we have lost the best two TR setters.
However, and this is one of my predicts, if the meta end up being too offensive and too dependant of the speed control provided by Cutie, Elekid or H-Orb; TR users will have a great value as part of semi-TR cores. If this happens at will be important to consider TR setters in regular builds, purely as a method of speed control.
Porygon, Inkay and Gothita might be the best TR setter of the meta, but Slowpoke and Poltcha might also become decent options.
I will always believe this things will eventually come back. Will they dissapoint me one more time? Most likely.
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Even with all the predicts above, we can get an idea of how the new meta, after the "Big 3" bans, will be. Those builds centered around a single wincon will no longer be viable, there are no mons that has the bulk and offensive presence to gather a team around to support it , like Missy and Stantler did. I expect the meta to be similar to the one we had in Gen 8 (for those of you who played it), where teams have several options to play around.
The power creep level of the tier has been reduced significantly, which means there is less risk in playing Pokemon that are low on the VR. You will be less punished by the meta when using unsual things like, for example, Scarf Cyndaquil or LO Cranidos. Teambuilding will be less restrictive (hopefully), but that doesn´t mean you don´t need to build around the main threats of the tier and try to answer them accordingly.
Overall, I am specially excited for this new chapter of the tier!
Thanks for your feedback, this is helpful!With the new meta coming many things will change, so I would like to talk about those that might get benefit from the latest bans. Take into account that these are just some predicts of mine, they might end up being true or not.
Probably the closest to becoming the next top tier Pokemon. The 19-speed tier, once crowded with powerful options, is gonna be run by this little fly with few to none opposition (Wingull still exists). Cutiefly has an amazing versatility, with multiple options such as Tailwind, Screens. Webs, QD, Stun Spore, Fake Tears and a very powerful STAB attacks. While this Pokemon will most likely have 3-4 different viable sets, it will be more straightforward than Missy or Stantler. The speed control that it can provide in this meta will be unmatched.
The natural replacemente for Missy.
Careful now, this will not be like his fellow ghost, it will hit harder and die faster. A glass-cannon attacker that might have a huge impact on this new meta, depending of how the meta adapt to take its hits.
This poor doggo was having a hard time lately. Stantler was a nightmare with Intimidate+Earth Power, and it was unable to blast through Missy´s bulk if it was intimidated. Now that both are gone, there are few things that can stop Growlithe apart from Mudbray and the very rare Fighting mons.
I personally believe these three will mark the new offensive level of the tier. All of them are able to do an absurd amount of damage to most of the tier, but there should not be alive in the game for a lot of turns. We will see how the meta adapts to them, but there will be the top-tier threats that need to be considered when building.
Same perfect Pokemon as always. I just want to point out that it will be a perfect partner for Cutiefly, making the perfect coverage of Fairy+Ground a real threat (Stantler vibes intensifies). If Cutiefly may end up being a problem, Mudbray will be one of the reasons why. Some of you might consider it at the same level at the three above, and that is completely fair.
Probably the natural replacement of Stantler.
This Pokemon has always been fantastic, but it was outclassed by Stantler. I expect it to be used a lot more now. His Trick Room will have a decent value to neutralize the speed control provided by Cutiefly and Vulla.
I never got to talked about it, but this might be one of the biggest winners from the Missy ban. People might start exploring this thing again, hopefully Shadow Tag wont be a big issue...
Ah yes, the Fighting Pokemon. They have suffered a lot this generation, specially Mienfoo. Tera Fairy Misdreavus/Stantler made his life a living hell. Its true that you might think Cutiefly is gonna prolong their agony, but Cutie doesnt have Intimidate or Will-O-Wisp like the other two, and its more frail at least. Special mention to Meditite, it will enjoy not having Missy around for sure, it could be one of the best rises.
I love this little guy! He will be back to check Cutie and Gastly. Amazing type combination but it might suffer against Mudbray and Fire types, if the the latter rises to stop Cutie.
Careful with these two, we already know them... Snow will still be a top tier archetype and without Missy and Stantler to take several Blizzards, Cubchoo will be able to punch holes thought unprepared teams easily.
Water mon have been almost non-existant this generation sadly. They might back to check Mudbray and Growlithe, considering how dangerous both of them look right now.
The Trick Room teams have actually been nerfed. With the bans of Missy and Stantler, we have lost the best two TR setters.
However, and this is one of my predicts, if the meta end up being too offensive and too dependant of the speed control provided by Cutie, Elekid or H-Orb; TR users will have a great value as part of semi-TR cores. If this happens at will be important to consider TR setters in regular builds, purely as a method of speed control.
Porygon, Inkay and Gothita might be the best TR setter of the meta, but Slowpoke and Poltcha might also become decent options.
I will always believe this things will eventually come back. Will they dissapoint me one more time? Most likely.
------------
Even with all the predicts above, we can get an idea of how the new meta, after the "Big 3" bans, will be. Those builds centered around a single wincon will no longer be viable, there are no mons that has the bulk and offensive presence to gather a team around to support it , like Missy and Stantler did. I expect the meta to be similar to the one we had in Gen 8 (for those of you who played it), where teams have several options to play around.
The power creep level of the tier has been reduced significantly, which means there is less risk in playing Pokemon that are low on the VR. You will be less punished by the meta when using unsual things like, for example, Scarf Cyndaquil or LO Cranidos. Teambuilding will be less restrictive (hopefully), but that doesn´t mean you don´t need to build around the main threats of the tier and try to answer them accordingly.
Overall, I am specially excited for this new chapter of the tier!
Will the sample teams be updated this summer following Misdreavus and Stantler being banned?
Yes! We started updating the resources with the announcement of the new tour, they will be ready for this week.