OU DPP OU Viability Ranking [updated May 2025]

[robertshortgrass]

threaten Clef so easily even with a CM

An early game Modest lum Cune is very threatening to Clefable and a lot of teams in general. It obviously has its downsides, but I think it is more consistent than a bulky RD Cune. If you go down the bulky route, you should use Sub to really mess with Clef. Roar Suicune is also pretty cool, 'cause you can deal with DD Tar and Gyara and phaze a bunch of other things.

Ttar's sand being a metagame defining feature is something you forgot to talk about. Would love to hear what you have to say about that.

 

[Jhall99]

An early game Modest lum Cune is very threatening to Clefable and a lot of teams in general. It obviously has its downsides, but I think it is more consistent than a bulky RD Cune. If you go down the bulky route, you should use Sub to really mess with Clef. Roar Suicune is also pretty cool, 'cause you can deal with DD Tar and Gyara and phaze a bunch of other things.

Ttar's sand being a metagame defining feature is something you forgot to talk about. Would love to hear what you have to say about that.

I've seen SFG use those teams before along with Infernape, I was fiddling around teambuilder & wanted a nice weather clear option since weather clear teams do exist in both ADV & DPP. Tar's sand is both a given & a curse, where sometimes I love it for the sake of Tar checking special attackers, but hate it bc it does limit certain mons such as Raikou.

 

[UltraSword]

I saw that someone posted their tier list and decided to update mine. I will list some of my more notable changes below.

Tyranitar has always been my pick for 3rd best pokemon in DPP OU, but I never really thought of it as being S until recently. Permanent sand is pretty good as you would expect but it is just such a meta defining pokemon in many other ways. Choice scarf is easily the best set in my opinion as it allows you to outspeed and snipe Latias and Starmie which is very important, but it can also run bulky sets, dd sets, choice band, etc. Tyranitar has a lot of versatility, and it can genuinely fit on almost any team. I still kind of hesitate to put it in S tier as it has some serious competition in Hippowdon and arguably Abomasnow but I think it deserves it at this point.

Nothing actually changed with Clefable I just wanted to mention that nothing else in the tier really feels like it is on the same level of viability as Clefable. It is a really strange pokemon and definitely an enigma in more ways than one.

As much as I love Gengar I am not really sure what I was smoking when I originally put it between Azelf and Metagross. Where it is now feels much better to me.

It was originally between Skarmory and Bronzong and while I think the lead set is the best lead in DPP, that is the only thing it really has going for Aerodactyl and it does not deserve to be quite that high.

I will be honest I forgot where I put this guy before. I know I put him pretty high in B+ but I don't remember where. Either way though, I put him a bit lower because while having that extra speed is nothing to scoff at, I think Magnezone being slightly stronger and definitely bulkier pushes it over the edge. Magneton still has that great niche but I think in the long run it is worse and that is why I lowered it.

Rhyperior was originally at the very bottom of B+ but it is definitely better than most of the other B+ pokemon. It may be slow, and it may have that horrid type combo but when neither of those matter it is a strong and bulky pokemon that has proven itself quite good in many high-level settings.

This is a new addition to my list, and I think it is alright. I don't feel comfortable with saying it is better than Forretress yet, let alone moving Forretress down to B tier but I think Hitmontop has a lot of potentially useful tools. It has intimidate, is great against Tyranitar, and has foresight for Rotom if it switches in.

This is another new addition to my tier list (well actually it was originally part of the Not Sure tier but still) and I think it is the second worst Rotom Appliance. I think Blizzard is a more useful signature than Leaf Storm as boltbeam is solid and it doesn't cause a drop in special attack when it is used. Having the best Swampert matchup is cool I guess but I feel like it is just overall slightly worse than Rotom Frost.

Finally, I want to give a special shout out to my boy Donphan the GOAT himself. He was originally below Blissey but he moved up one spot because he is definitely a bit more viable by this point. I would not be surprised if Donphan rises further in the future because it is just so good in ways Starmie just isn't. Donphan is great against Tyranitar, is a ground type, has knock off (people don't talk about this part enough lol), and it even has solid attack. I think Donphan is just really good and deserves all the attention it gets.

 

[steve22]

This is my honest take on the absolute state of gen 4 ou. Some of my more notable hot takes below.

Donphan is the pokemon whose placement on the official VR feels most perplexing to me. While I wouldn't put it ahead of any of the classic high tiers (suicune, gyara, flygon, rotom), it sems like it is getting an absolute ton of use in high-level play. Probably more than HO as an entire style. I also love using it. It works on a number of team structures, running the spectrum from offensive to defensive, usually paired with celebi or sometimes defensive lati. Its merits are obvious, so I won't go too deeply into them.

Infernape is, in my opinion, rarely worth bringing in the current meta. While it is still threatening, it has pretty severe four moveslot syndrome. You have to drop gk or mach punch, and you really can't afford to drop either. It doesn't really need heavy accounting for in the builder. Usually, mons that you would already bring for their own merits (starmie, latias, swampert) do the trick. It isn't horrible, but it feels decidedly niche, rather than the top threat it used to be.

You would think the rise in tspikes would make milotic much worse but, in my opinion, it has had the opposite effect. Milotic provides a longevity against dders and insurance against calm mind users with haze that most mons cannot hope to match. It's stats, movepool, and typing make it intrsinsically good. It was a top choice in the battle tower, has been a member of some legendary teams, and will continue to be a threat in dpp ou as long as people play the tier.

I am not really sure what is going on with gengar in the official VR. This mon is good, but relatively uncommon in high-level play. (I mean, 2 tiers above magneton, suicune, and celebi???) This is maybe the mon with the biggest discrepancy in terms of how much you should bring it, versus how threatening it is to plan for in team-builder. (I.e. not very much, extremely threatening.)

Clefable is pretty inconsistent right now, in my opinion. If you bring it, you need to be okay with giving loom a consistent entry point, essentially ceding momentum repeatedly. Ttar is also spamming superpower nowadays. It is amazing in most other matchups, but it feels like the loom matchup is problematic enough to drop it below the other top threats for me. Calm mind clef is good as it has been since the dug ban, though.

Magneton is the only mon in the tier that can provide speed control and check stall. It is, I think, thoroghly better than magnezone and the rankings should reflect this. Note: it isn't better in every matchup, which is why magnezone belongs on the VR (unlike venusaur which is plenty good to use but inferior to other options).

Suicune follows my general pattern of thinking waters are underrated in the current meta (except empoleon). CM, Crocune, scarf, specs, take your pick. This guy has fantastic stats, a fantastic type, and the best coverage trio in the game.

I am begging you, try offensive tentacruel.

One of the more underutilized mons in the current meta. Clears weather, counters breloom, kills waters, threatens zap. The only issue is that it is not slappable. You really need to dig to find mons that shine with it. But good aboma teams are almost always great.

As for the fighters, it feels to me like someone needs to innovate something with them. Something in this meta needs to switch into ttar and take advantage. Right now, that is breloom, but teams are becoming increasingly wired into countering it (Celebi and zapdos are everywhere).

In general, it's probably obvious from my rankings that I think Zap/gyara phan and Bulky offense are the best styles right now. Interestingly enough, I think the meta is extremely diifferent after the machamp ban. It is a relatively small change, but the increase in ttar and breloom usage is having a massive ripple effect through the tier. In my opinion, the meta is still absorbing this change. It will be interesting to see whether any new team concepts become dominant, or if we will stabalize around a bulky offense/zapmie centered metagame.

 

[UltraSword]

Donphan is the pokemon whose placement on the official VR feels most perplexing to me. While I wouldn't put it ahead of any of the classic high tiers (suicune, gyara, flygon, rotom), it sems like it is getting an absolute ton of use in high-level play. Probably more than HO as an entire style. I also love using it. It works on a number of team structures, running the spectrum from offensive to defensive, usually paired with celebi or sometimes defensive lati. Its merits are obvious, so I won't go too deeply into them.

While I can't comfortably put it above B+ on my own list yet, it definitely deserves higher than it is officially. I won't say my full thoughts on Donphan again here, but it is still the second-best spinner in the tier and one of the best ground types in general.

Magneton is the only mon in the tier that can provide speed control and check stall. It is, I think, thoroghly better than magnezone and the rankings should reflect this. Note: it isn't better in every matchup, which is why magnezone belongs on the VR (unlike venusaur which is plenty good to use but inferior to other options).

I disagree with the idea that Magneton is the only speed control option that can check stall in the tier. Rotom is literally right there and it can pretty easily neuter stall by tricking choice scarf on something.

In general, it's probably obvious from my rankings that I think Zap/gyara phan and Bulky offense are the best styles right now. Interestingly enough, I think the meta is extremely diifferent after the machamp ban. It is a relatively small change, but the increase in ttar and breloom usage is having a massive ripple effect through the tier. In my opinion, the meta is still absorbing this change. It will be interesting to see whether any new team concepts become dominant, or if we will stabalize around a bulky offense/zapmie centered metagame.

It is pretty obvious to me that a lot of people (especially on the pro ban side) underestimated the impact of a Machamp ban. Tyranitar having one less fighting type to deal with is huge and because of that Breloom is being used even more. The chain reaction of these 2 threats rising can't be understated as it is allowing things like Zapdos and Donphan to become better and things like Starmie and Clefable to become worse.

 

[mackie]

Pokemon stronger than before:
Bronzong teams used to struggle dealing with Machamp and instead prioritized Jirachi, a pokemon that both did not invite Machamp in and could revenge kill it.

There isn't as much emphasis on spinbock which makes Starmie more valuable. Probably just a temporary spike though.

Rising alongside Starmie, and it also benefits from Tyranitar being more popular now.

Less stall/semi-stall around makes Celebi better — it checks opposing Ttar and beats Rapid Spin Starmie. It might fall off again if stall teams come back.

Always meta-dependent. It's great against FWG (Fire-Water-Grass) core teams, but struggles against fast Dragon/Steel builds.

got a boost with Machamp gone - curse sets are more viable, as well as the general utility lum set, anyone else notice more of these on the ladder recently?

he's still very low tier, but champ was arguably the fighter he despised the most

 

[Blåhaj Blast]

I did one of those tier list things and i wanted to share some of my thoughts about the meta.

Sometimes i feel like dpp is "solved" because we already know what the most consistent teams are. But at the same time, with how many good viable mons, sets, spreads, items and cores there are, i think there's still a lot of room for innovation and creativity.

And now some explanation about my rankings:

S+ :

- I have tar at #1 because it pretty much does something valuable no mather the team you or your opponent are playing (except against physical offense but i dont think it's particularly a good style). It traps consistently the mons you need to trap, hits so hard with cb, dd is always a menace to defensive teams and sand is broken.

- I put rachi at 2 just because the wish protect set is so hard to break. Besides that, it can do anything: Provide utility with rocks, u-turn and paralysis, sweep with cm, revenge kill with scarf, fish for para-flinches with sub, and pretty much it can run any coverage it wants.

- I would've had lati at 2 because not a lot of things can break the defensive set with twave and reflect, but cb tar and rachi are everywhere at the moment so i think 3 is fair. More offensive sets like scarf, specs or life orb are very good but i dont consider them broken.



S- :

- This mon its amazing. Bulky, strong, great typing and it can learn some of the best moves in the game such as rocks, explosion, wisp and taunt. With lefties it's the best rachi counter, sub protect is deadly with tspikes, idk its just a great breaker with a ton of defensive utility.

- Im not as high on loom as i once was. Sure it restricts the builder a lot and the focus + mach set has very limited answers for defensive/balanced teams, but i think good teams have adapted to the annoyances of free sleep and 130 attack. The defensive set is a contender for the most annoying set in dpp ou.

- Obviously reliable spin enables very powerful stuff like zapdos or lefties gyara, and the fantastic speed makes it a very useful mon to answer frail attackers like infernape or gengar. Also, the bulk it has with max hp and twave is enough to break through mons it shouldn't beat like metagross. Offensive sets are really good vs offense.

A+ :

These 4 guys put a lot of strain in the teambuilding process for me, without the right tools they are so hard to take down (or to withstand in the case of gyara).

- I think special attackers have adapted to clef's walling capabilities. It's still very oppresive and with the right move (twave, encore, protect) it will counter what it needs. Clef + lati is and always will be an amazing defensive combo and knock will always force progress against everything besides loom.

- This thing is so fat it can solo a lot of teams once rocks are off. Pretty much beats every ground type that isn't pert or rhyperior, and even then it usually pairs with loom/celebi so it's no problem. Bold zap with twave is the best set in my opinion, but other moves like uturn, toxic or heat wave are also great. It's also one of the best iron head jirachi answers so i'm glad it exists. Spdef or offensive sets can be good too.

- I've seen people put gyara as high as #3. I think as long as you have multiple answers it will rarely get away with the game. Anyways, gyarados is still an incredible mon. Strong, great typing, great ability, twave on a water type is insane, waterfall flinch always has the potential to rob games, what else is to say?

- Spikes are broken, i can't rank skarm any lower just because of that. The thing is, it's hard to build something decent with skarm that isn't stall or hazard stack offense. The meta isn't very kind to skarmory right now; the mags are very common, starmie is everywhere, and twave gyara can more reliably break shed shell or spdef skarm than one would expect. On top of that, special attackers have risen in usage. I think offensive skarm with a resist berry should be used more.

A-:

This next 4 mons are in my opinion great glue for any team, even though they are not as powerful as the above.

- Great scarfer and mixgon is a menace for a lot of teams. My personal favorite is band: it can switch into celebi's twave and uturn for 80-90%, and surprise kill bold zap at under 64% with stone edge or under 57% with outrage.

- Another great scarfer. Decent spinblocker, the defensive set walls physival rachi well enough and nothing besides tran and clef can take both tbolt and wisp. Other sets can be good too since fighting immunes are rare.

- Traps what it needs very consistently. It's very customizable too: Twave, protect, magnet rise, explosion, toxic, sub, hp ice, fire, grass, or even ground paired with a choice scarf. Can be ev'd to be either fast, powerful, bulky (spdef zone is one of my favorites) or a combination of those 3. Plus, with leftovers it gets rid of wish tect rachi for free which is amazing.

- Gliscor is one of those mons you don't think much about until you face it and your team can't kill it. The classic eq roost taunt ice fang set is great but it can successfully run other utility moves such as taunt, rocks, uturn and knock. Sd sets can clean games quite nicely with the right support and i think a lot of experimentation can be done with it's coverage: ice fang, thunder fang, sky attack, stone edge, roost, taunt, uturn, knock, i've even seen night slash for rotom.

B:


- Everybody knows suicune is great vs offense but struggles vs defense and honestly i don't think so. The modest lum lead punishes stall very consistently, with sub you can get a free cm the turn clef or rachi tries to twave (or knock in clef's case), protect scouts trick attempts, rest can give you an opportunity to sweep later after winning a 1v1, roar is very nice with spikes, and honestly, forcing clef, mie, lati or cele to recover can be good enough with the right team composition.

- This hurts me because i used to believe so much in gross. I just don't like all the free tempo it gives to skarm, defensive rotom and zapdos. I know trick iron ball exists but then you forgo eq, mash or boom. It also struggles to keep up rocks vs defensive starmie without tpunch (same problem as before). Right now i believe lefties are almost mandatory on utility sets since you want to consistently beat wish tect rachi. Nevertheless, meta is crazy strong and bulky so it could never be bad. Some sets i like are full spdef (which can live non specs heatran fire blast), rocks eq mash boom with a custap berry, agility eq zen mash or eq zen ice punch and 4 attacks with tpunch.

- Having wisp + taunt is amazing, being ground and fighting immune is great, it's one of the best offensive switches into scizor's cb uturn, almost nothing can take on the sub split life orb set, its great at negating donphan spin, very good pivot into loom with a lum berry, amazing traits all around. On top of that, it can run other cool moves like destiny bond, explosion, trick holding a black sludge or even sucker punch for opposing offense.

- Honestly i don't have much experience using swampert, i don't like the free turn it gives to loom when it clicks rocks/eq, and even when you predict the loom switch later in the game you often don't kill it so you have to do it twice, which is a guessing game i don't like getting into. Aside from that its a fantastic pokemon: Very hard to kill for non-loom offense, best at keeping rocks vs starmie, and more importantly, great against zapdos, tyranitar and jirachi.

- I'm tired of pretending celebi isn't a top 20 pokemon. This thing is so hard to kill without heatran or scizor. Very annoying twave user, great rocker since mie can't click spin for free, very consistent gyara check, best sub passer and it also gets a bunch of good moves like uturn, trick, heal bell, leech seed and setup moves. Speaking of, nasty plot or just plain offensive 3 attacks rocks/twave can be very good. I'm sure someone could make use of moves like healing wish or perish song.

- Strongest mon in the tier. I'm a fan of the dd life orb set with fire punch, outrage and espeed. Mixnite or regular lum dd are very good too.

- Solid all around. Great rocker (not in the lead position imo). The sub petaya set is one of the best wincons. On the other hand, spdef sets are quite versatile even though they are not very slappable.

- I like that people are experimenting more with ape now. In the past i felt the only real set was cc fb/oh uturn + filler with either an expert belt or life orb. I think band is good, sd or nasty plot have plenty of options to mess up with, a lot of cool utility moves like wisp, taunt, slack off and rocks, items like fist plate or charcoal; Overall a lot of potential for customization.

- With the rise of starmie and celebi i find myself using scizor more. Traps some mons better than tar or sometimes you don't want your trapper to setup sand. Sd sets have a lot of roadblocks but they can be great sweepers with the right support. I'm not a fan of occa sd since there's a 25% chance you get burned or critted by jirachi's fire punch.

- Solid rocker. I believe hippo offense could be done but it's hard to build. I think toxic hippo should be used more.

- I don't think the early momentum of rocks + explosion is that good compared to playing a regular 6v6. Still, some teams really value getting up early rocks and preventing the opponent from doing the same, and zelf is the best at doing that. Band can catch off guard some leads. I don't think much of sets outside the lead slot.

C:

- Not as good at spinning as mie and assurance doesn't do enough to rotom on the switch. However, the elephant has other strengths: It's a decent rocker, a great ddtar answer, and packs not very common moves like ice shard, knock or head smash. Good bulky ground all around.

- Pretty much can answer every special attacker that doesn't pack tspikes support. It's also surprisingly bulky on the defensive side (survives +2 gyara waterfall after rocks). Much better rocker than clef. Needs spin but that isn't too bad. Cm or more offensive spreads should be tried more.

- I don't use zong very much. Offensive rocks + 3 attacks has problems keeping up rocks vs mie, it's too weak vs wish tect rachi and doesn't do anything vs defensive teams. Trick Room is an amazing offense killer but the best it can do against stall is to boom on skarm. Having said that, i like the defensive set paired with a different rocker, that way, you can improve your survivability running something like toxic + protect or rest talk.

- I think roserade it's pretty bad, but tspikes are good and rose is the best at setting them so it ends up here. Sleep is great 75% of the time.

- Specs is great, both inside and outside rain. Other sets can be good but i think they are too fishy: Kingdra just isn't bulky or strong enoug. Some cool ways i've seen people use kingdra are SoS's rain dance + yawn in the lead slot and Dridri's sub dd disable.

- I don't think magneton is very good compared to zone. Sure, it role compresses trapping skarm and revenge killing dders, but it's just too frail and not very strong. What i like about magneton is that it can absorb trick in stall compositions.

- With paralysis support this thing is a beast. Sub 3 attacks, sub sd or plain sd 3 attacks are very good sets. It's super bulky too so sometimes your opponent will waste one of their rhyperior answers just to break the sub. You can ev it so standard zapdos hp ice never breaks the sub, then either zap dies or loom dies. In that sense it also can be used to check ddtar since it will take 50'ish% from +1 eq.

- In a way nidoqueen is a better mon with more defensive utility than roserade, but it is a worse tspike setter since mie will spin more easily on it. Despite that, "I crawled" is an amazing team so i need to put some respect on the queen.

- I love the beagle. Just by clicking spore and rocks you are already at a big advantage so i see the spikes as a bonus. 273 speed gets the jump on other offensive leads like skarm so the speed is fine. Other times you get screwed by lum lead guessing games (or uturn into lum pokemon) but that's what you get for playing such aggresive mon.

- Hard to last mon sweep with in today's meta but great as a wallbreaker. With pursuit / spikes support (or both) scarf cc can be very good too. I think it's worth messing with occa, shuca or maybe even lum.

- With machamp's ban i dont find myself using uxie very much. There are a couple of good uxie teams out there so i can't rank it any lower.

- Barely does what it needs to but has one amazing feat: being the best counter to sub twave gyara. Water immunity can be clutch in the structures it fits. I'm not very high on quag but it's good for sure.

- Goated mon at walling offense but complete dead weight vs stall. Offensive milo can be amazing against some teams.

- I don't have much experience using gastro, but from what I've seen it can be quite good. I've seen it take 60% from ape's grass knot and then proceed to sweep with curse, since nothing could break it and it can't be tricked. I've also seen it hit surprisingly hard with special attack investment.

- Awkward to fit, however zf's aboma tar team is pretty good. I'm still waiting for the offensive hail revolution.

- You use this thing pretty much as a worse zong but with twave so it finds itself in defensive paraspam structures. Still, a steel type with that much bulk can never be bad.

- I don't like the high variance it brings to the tier and i can't say for certain how good it is so it stays in the cheese tier for now.

I'm not interested in writing about the guys below, they are very usable but i just don't care enough for them. There are also a couple of mons i still don't know what to think about, i need to see more successful teams using them.

Many thanks if you read everything, i tried to keep it short but i couldn't do it in less words. I've been playing dpp for 3 years now and no matter how annoyed i am at this tier, i always keep coming back. :)