Metagame 4v4 Doubles UU (Evasion Abilities Banned, Articuno freed!)

[merrypasta]

My Reg F UU (Shift 2) VR

Too lazy to write notes for each one, might eventually. If everything seems a little high I apologise, I hate the idea of an S- tier but I'm conforming so the ranking might be weird.

S
S-
A+
A
A-
B+
B
B-
C+
C

 

[merrypasta]

OK, so the tournament has just wrapped up. Here are the top teams.

View attachment 807553

I'm Foghorn. My team did pretty well, although I would definitely drop Excadrill, it was pretty bad in most of the fights. Tyranitar was my MVP, I bought it to almost every match and came in clutch against Ursaluna-BM which I faced 3 times. Smeargle was also strong too, while I only got to Spore 1 thing the threat of it forced a lot of Protects which allowed me to give something a Decorate boost. I only bought Kommo-o twice but both times it did quite well. 1st time it would've swept clean, but my Smeargle got put to sleep for the full 3 turns and it got Encored into Protect. My opponent made a brave choice to bring Brute Bonnet against a team with 2 Overcoat mons and a Grass type, but it paid off. Enamours did well too. I was both the benefactor of hax and on the receiving end too, so...karma?

Most common Pokemon was Sinistcha with 7 players bringing it. Surprise of the tournament though was the Iron Valiant sets. Both the ones I faced where choice Specs with Expanding Force. And they weren't even Tera Psychic! Ursluna-BM is very scary, I faced 1 Calm Mind version and 2 Life Orb sets. One was min speed for Trick Room, the other was fast.

Overall was great fun, look forward to the one at the end of the month! I'll have a better team next time (hopefully).

Glad you had fun, though on the Iron Valiant note I think this might be a funny thing to discover for new players of the format. Iron Valiant is by far the best Expanding Force user, and it's not even STAB. The main reason is because there just aren't very many alternatives. Hatterene loves the redirection and Helping Hand from Indeedee-F, so in a format without it, it's much more niche. Armarouge is fine but it's considerably slower and again, would really like some redirection. Gardevoir is in a similar spot. Scarf sets aren't unusable, but you go a bit faster than Iron Valiant only to do 2% more with Expanding Force, it's not worth it.

The reason they aren't Tera Psychic is simply because Tera Fairy Moonblast is addictive, lol. However your team really caught me off guard and while I did win I think it was an interesting meta call. Good job, and play again.

 

[Sugarbear]

Glad you had fun, though on the Iron Valiant note I think this might be a funny thing to discover for new players of the format. Iron Valiant is by far the best Expanding Force user, and it's not even STAB. The main reason is because there just aren't very many alternatives. Hatterene loves the redirection and Helping Hand from Indeedee-F, so in a format without it, it's much more niche. Armarouge is fine but it's considerably slower and again, would really like some redirection. Gardevoir is in a similar spot. Scarf sets aren't unusable, but you go a bit faster than Iron Valiant only to do 2% more with Expanding Force, it's not worth it.

The reason they aren't Tera Psychic is simply because Tera Fairy Moonblast is addictive, lol. However your team really caught me off guard and while I did win I think it was an interesting meta call. Good job, and play again.

Thanks for the explanation, that does really help. While I’d love to say I was making an anti meta call, really I just wanted to build a team with Enamorus-T as I have a hunch it’ll be good in Champions once IVs are gone.

 

[merrypasta]

Since it's a new tier shift, I've made 3 new set boxes for the format, including some developments within shift 1. This should cover most common sets in the format, and I made sure most if not all Pokemon featured in sample teams were included.

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3

EDIT: I forgot to nickname the Bulk Up set for Okidogi, so it'll just be Okidogi. That is Okidogi's true form.

Given Articuno got unbanned I took the opportunity to add a 4th, complete with new sets for already covered mons and of course the addition of Articuno, Torracat, Glastrier and some others.
https://pokepast.es/50a95dbd4be0c2a3

 

[gephicka]

Introducing: 4v4 DUU Classic

hey y'all! i just wanted to announce that regardless of the possible release of Pokemon Champions, in April we will be hosting a special month-long tournament in four parts: 4v4 DUU Classic! Each week we will be hosting a tournament for each of our legacy formats (G, I, H, & J), with the finalists of each tour qualifying for Classic Playoffs. Playoffs will be 3 Best of 3s, with each player banning a Regulation (Regulation F Shift 1 will be included as a playable tier for playoffs) & the higher seed picking the first tier played. Seeding will be determined by placements in all of the qualifying tours (so it's encouraged to play all of them even if you already qualified for one!).

i'll make more metagame posts as we get closer to the actual event to give some context for prior regulations & even some of my own predictions + ideas about what is underexplored in those formats that i think could use some fleshing out.

Regulation I

i'm gonna start this off with a post about specifically Regulation I, one of the most beloved of our formats— notably a double restricted format, with threats like Groudon, Zacian-H, and the Necrozma formes.

this format left off pretty dominated by Tailwind Offense, with Talonflame being one of the best support mons in the tier. Brute Bonnet is also extremely notable due to how uncontested its Spore is & the ubiquity of Groudon giving it free Protosynthesis boosts in a lot of games just means that it's able to live a lot of things it just shouldn't.
for example:
+1 252 Atk Choice Band Zacian Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Brute Bonnet: 182-216 (83.4 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
76+ Atk Tera Fire Groudon Heat Crash (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Brute Bonnet in Sun: 188-224 (86.2 - 102.7%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

here's a quick snapshot of the teams brought to the last major Reg I event to illustrate my point a bit:

teams

notably a very Groudon-dominated event. post Sleep-Powder ban there was a significant amount of Groudon development— as the dominant Groudon structure pre-ban was no longer really usable— and people started to realize how strong Brute Bonnet was, especially into the aforementioned new Groudon teams.

I would like to highlight a few of the things I think should get explored a bit more for the Regulation I tour.

Roaring Moon
this guy fell off really hard after Sleep Powder Jumpluff & Talonflame really took off, and now that Jumpluff is honestly kind of fraudulent I think there's a lot of room for it to come back. i'm honestly not the biggest fan of talonflame generally in this tier, it generally feels like it just gets out-statted in the vast majority of games & doesn't get a whole lot of value outside of just setting up Tailwind. meanwhile, Moon is the exact opposite— with a really good BST, a dark typing that allows it to excel against both Necrozma formes, good support options besides Tailwind like Breaking Swipe and Taunt. generally this guy just feels really underexplored for how statted it is & I think there are a lot more teams that should be using it over Talonflame.

Kyurem-W
this guy was basically unexplored for the vast majority of the format— a vocal minority of players would, in fact, slander its name and talk about how it was a dogshit mon and shouldn't be used. I heard all of this and decided to make an entire video featuring Kyurem-W and multiple possible sets for it, resulting in 3 teams:
1. Scarf
2. AV
3. Specs
would really like to see some additional exploration for it, as all 3 of these teams performed pretty well in tests & it seems really strong into the Groudon-infested metagame.

Zekrom
this guy got a lot of exporation in Regulation J, making it all the way to finals of a major tournament— and despite having a really bad Groudon & Zacian matchup I think this guy is still pretty underexplored in this tier. even in Reg J with Zacian-C & the Arceus formes legal this guy was able to carve out a niche & i think the same could be true for it in I.

i hope you're as excited to return to some of these formats as i am!!!
posts about G, H, and J will be coming within the next few weeks

 

[gephicka]

Regulation F Viability Rankings

VR delivery for... 4v4 DUU

 

[merrypasta]

Introducing: 4v4 DUU Classic

hey y'all! i just wanted to announce that regardless of the possible release of Pokemon Champions, in April we will be hosting a special month-long tournament in four parts: 4v4 DUU Classic! Each week we will be hosting a tournament for each of our legacy formats (G, I, H, & J), with the finalists of each tour qualifying for Classic Playoffs. Playoffs will be 3 Best of 3s, with each player banning a Regulation (Regulation F Shift 1 will be included as a playable tier for playoffs) & the higher seed picking the first tier played. Seeding will be determined by placements in all of the qualifying tours (so it's encouraged to play all of them even if you already qualified for one!).

i'll make more metagame posts as we get closer to the actual event to give some context for prior regulations & even some of my own predictions + ideas about what is underexplored in those formats that i think could use some fleshing out.

Regulation I

i'm gonna start this off with a post about specifically Regulation I, one of the most beloved of our formats— notably a double restricted format, with threats like Groudon, Zacian-H, and the Necrozma formes.

this format left off pretty dominated by Tailwind Offense, with Talonflame being one of the best support mons in the tier. Brute Bonnet is also extremely notable due to how uncontested its Spore is & the ubiquity of Groudon giving it free Protosynthesis boosts in a lot of games just means that it's able to live a lot of things it just shouldn't.
for example:
+1 252 Atk Choice Band Zacian Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Brute Bonnet: 182-216 (83.4 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
76+ Atk Tera Fire Groudon Heat Crash (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Brute Bonnet in Sun: 188-224 (86.2 - 102.7%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

here's a quick snapshot of the teams brought to the last major Reg I event to illustrate my point a bit:

teams

View attachment 810222

notably a very Groudon-dominated event. post Sleep-Powder ban there was a significant amount of Groudon development— as the dominant Groudon structure pre-ban was no longer really usable— and people started to realize how strong Brute Bonnet was, especially into the aforementioned new Groudon teams.

I would like to highlight a few of the things I think should get explored a bit more for the Regulation I tour.

Roaring Moon
this guy fell off really hard after Sleep Powder Jumpluff & Talonflame really took off, and now that Jumpluff is honestly kind of fraudulent I think there's a lot of room for it to come back. i'm honestly not the biggest fan of talonflame generally in this tier, it generally feels like it just gets out-statted in the vast majority of games & doesn't get a whole lot of value outside of just setting up Tailwind. meanwhile, Moon is the exact opposite— with a really good BST, a dark typing that allows it to excel against both Necrozma formes, good support options besides Tailwind like Breaking Swipe and Taunt. generally this guy just feels really underexplored for how statted it is & I think there are a lot more teams that should be using it over Talonflame.

Kyurem-W
this guy was basically unexplored for the vast majority of the format— a vocal minority of players would, in fact, slander its name and talk about how it was a dogshit mon and shouldn't be used. I heard all of this and decided to make an entire video featuring Kyurem-W and multiple possible sets for it, resulting in 3 teams:
1. Scarf
2. AV
3. Specs
would really like to see some additional exploration for it, as all 3 of these teams performed pretty well in tests & it seems really strong into the Groudon-infested metagame.

Zekrom
this guy got a lot of exporation in Regulation J, making it all the way to finals of a major tournament— and despite having a really bad Groudon & Zacian matchup I think this guy is still pretty underexplored in this tier. even in Reg J with Zacian-C & the Arceus formes legal this guy was able to carve out a niche & i think the same could be true for it in I.

i hope you're as excited to return to some of these formats as i am!!!
posts about G, H, and J will be coming within the next few weeks

Can concur on Roaring Moon. I think most people converged on just running Talonflame, but Roaring Moon's utility feels so much better on sun and honestly on some non-sun teams. Knock Off and Taunt are infamously very strong together, being used on some Incineroar sets, Scrafty, and a lot of other dark types that can afford it.

The last Reg I tournament, which was just a brief revival of the format, I used Groudon with Necrozma Dawn Wings and ran the following set:

This one allows you to guarantee Tailwind in front of something scary like Zacian, while being able to get off an important Knock Off. In a format where boosting items like Life Orb and Choice Band are so good on a wide variety of restricteds, item removal is valuable. At best, Talonflame can run no item and use Thief, but that's a ridiculously flimsy option that also does nearly 0 damage.

I can also honestly see sets with Dragon Dance being usable on some teams, similar to what is used in Reg F. Breaking Swipe, however, is another great option that you mentioned. My main gripe with it is that it's completely useless against Zacian, but again, Knock Off can go a long way by removing a crucial Choice Band.

 

[merrypasta]

Reg F UU STABmons Overview
The tier councilor AndruApple is going to host a tournament where the STABmons gimmick is applied to Reg F UU. This means any Pokemon can use any move* of their respective types. For example, Iron Valiant can now use Fleur Cannon, and Gyarados can now use Dragon Ascent.
*bans shown in the challenge code.

A lot of moves are banned because unfortunately any normal type having Belly Drum, Extreme Speed, Fake Out, and Follow Me was a little much. However, on those last two moves, we actually don't have a solution yet.
Problem solved, Fake Out and Follow Me have been banned unless the Pokemon already learns the move.

Without further ado, the challenge code is here. Have fun!

Challenge Code

/challenge gen9vgc2026regfbo3@@@-Urshifu-Rapid-Strike,-Flutter Mane,-Incineroar,-Raging Bolt,-Landorus,-Rillaboom,-Ogerpon-Wellspring,-Ogerpon-Hearthflame,-Ogerpon-Cornerstone,-Tornadus,+Tornadus-Therian,-Chien-Pao,-Amoonguss,-Urshifu,-Farigiraf,-Indeedee-F,-Iron Crown,-Gholdengo,-Dragonite,-Gouging Fire,-Ursaluna,+Ursaluna-Bloodmoon,-Chi-Yu,-Regidrago,-Porygon2,-Dondozo,-Ting-Lu,-Torkoal,-Roaring Moon,-Commander,-Bright Powder,Evasion Moves Clause,-Enamorus,+Enamorus-Therian,-King's Rock,-Razor Fang,-Cresselia,-Arcanine-Hisui,-Whimsicott,OHKO Clause,Evasion Clause,Sleep Moves Clause,STABmons Move Legality,-Last Respects,-Rage Fist,-Dire Claw,-Extreme Speed,-Revival Blessing,-Shell Smash,-Water Spout,-Tail Glow,-Decorate,-Eruption,-Surging Strikes,-Wicked Blow,-Dragon Energy, -Victory Dance,-Blood Moon,-Clangorous Soul,-Transform,-V-create,-No Retreat,*Follow Me,*Fake Out,-After You,-Instruct,-Araquanid,*Population Bomb,-Gigaton Hammer,*Jet Punch,-Fillet Away

 

[Sugarbear]

Since the in game ladder is back on Reg I, could we do that for the March tournament?

 

[gephicka]

Sample Teams:

i have once again updated sample teams post-regional

 

[hollowcrystals]

Since the in game ladder is back on Reg I, could we do that for the March tournament?

afaik there are no plans for vgc uu to follow the in game ladder
there is going to be a reg i uu classic tour in april, tour is up on limitless (link to tour and code in discord), geph discussed the classics tours a few posts up in the thread

 

[thebusinesspiggy]

Hello everyone! I'm here to announce that over on our Discord server, we'll be hosting a 4v4 Doubles UU Draft League! If you're interested, just go ahead and read the full announcement in the tournaments channel. Hope to see you there :)

 

[merrypasta]

The Fighting Type Dilemma

Reg F UU has a lot of viable fighting types, possibly the most out of any UU tier so far. (Last time around, we were using Gallade, Hisuian Sneasel, and Kommo-o. Dark times.) This makes it difficult to choose which one to use, and in some cases you see teams with more than one on them, for one reason or another.

Iron Hands, Iron Valiant, Okidogi, Galarian Zapdos, Great Tusk, and Slither Wing are all generally all considered to be pretty good in this tier. The first 3 are definitely a league above the others, with Iron Hands being considered the overall best Pokemon in most viability rankings as well. This is even after Sneasler and Annihilape were banned, mind you. Needless to say, Urshifu may have kept these away from viability in OU, but here they get to thrive.
All 6 of these have unique strengths, and have made their mark on the meta, and I'll go over their individual strengths and weaknesses, going in alphabetical order. I'll also briefly give my personal opinion of how good they are in the meta.

Galarian Zapdos

This creature is ranked the lowest out of the fighting types on the VR, and it's pretty easy to see why. It's unfortunately in a middling speed tier, leaving it slower than things like Garchomp, Alolan Ninetales, and Thundurus, while not being slow enough to work in Trick Room, like some of its peers. Its attack stat of 125 is also the worst out of all the viable Fighting-types in the tier, being outclassed even by Okidogi who has a lower BST. However, it does have some things that keep it relevant. Flying coverage is great, as well as the Defiant ability. It's able to outspeed and KO most other fighting types in the format, barring Iron Hands who isn't weak to Flying, and Iron Valiant who outspeeds and OHKOs it. For this reason, it often carries a Choice Scarf in order to outspeed Iron Valiant along with some other targets like Spectrier and Iron Bundle. Scarf sets can make use of U-turn to pivot into something that pairs well with it defensively, like a Steel type to resist an incoming Moonblast.

Galarian Zapdos also has a useful support movepool, though this is limited to sets carrying Focus Sash or something of the sort. Coaching, Taunt and Tailwind are all valuable, though it sadly isn't even the best Fighting-type at using speed control and Coaching. I'll get to that later. Overall, though, it's definitely not bad into this format but it's difficult to justify over the stronger fighting types with more desirable attributes.

Great Tusk

Great Tusk is definitely a step above Zapdos, and it takes advantage of a few useful traits to hang on to viability. Its abysmal special bulk, bad speed tier, and lack of an ability (outside sun) hold it back, however access to Headlong Rush keeps it in the conversation, even being able to justify its ranking alongside Garchomp who is much faster, better at using setup, and more defensively useful. Great Tusk is able to OHKO Iron Hands and Okidogi with relative ease, though Iron Hands requires Tera Ground to guarantee a KO, and it is also able to handle two common Intimidate users in the format, being Arcanine and Torracat. Gyarados is a different story, but allies like Thundurus can help with that. An unfortunate consequence of its speed tier is the fact it can't outspeed Iron Bundle even with Tailwind up, and is easily knocked out by something like Freeze-Dry. Assault Vest sets could help with that, though it's definitely a little flimsy to have 2 moves that drop your bulk on an Assault Vest Pokemon.
Tusk also has a few decent options besides its main STAB moves. Earthquake is typically used for spread (next to something like Murkrow or Thundurus) but Rock Slide or Taunt can function. Even Head Smash has been tried as an option to avoid the nightmare of being walled by Bug and Flying types. Overall, Tusk is pretty good on sun and is a cut above Zapdos but it's still weakened by its statline and lack of an ability.

Iron Hands

Generally regarded as not only the best Fighting-type but the best Pokemon in the tier, Iron Hands has quite a few things going for it. First, it's stupid bulky. With Assault Vest, nothing short of super effective STAB will kill it, and even things like Specs Iron Valiant and Life Orb Ursaluna Bloodmoon don't cut it. Second, it has a decent movepool. Its options for Electric moves are limited, but Wild Charge can do. Drain Punch / Close Combat are also good for Fighting damage, and Heavy Slam works well as coverage for Iron Valiant. Fake Out, however, is probably its most important move, as it can stop anything other than Inner Focus or Covert Cloak Pokemon in its tracks. This makes Iron Hands an amazing lead on Trick Room teams, as it can Fake Out while something else sets Trick Room. Its typing is also certainly not bad, it's the only Fighting-type discussed here that isn't weak to Flying and it's able to hit most of the meta super effectively especially with Heavy Slam coverage. There isn't much else to say, it's very good and most of the meta orbits around it.

Iron Valiant

While Iron Hands is the central piece of the metagame as a whole, Iron Valiant is probably the most central purely offensive Pokemon. It's the only Fighting-type on this list that is able to function as a special attacker, with Choice Specs sets dealing stupid damage and being a staple on HO teams as well as a breaker on balance teams. It's such a potent breaker that it's the most common Expanding Force user besides Indeedee, outclassing Armarouge, Hatterene, and ironically, Gardevoir. However, Choice Specs is only the first of its several viable sets. Mixed attacking sets with Focus Sash and Tera Stellar offer wonderful offensive utility, as well as supporting your team with Encore or Icy Wind. It also has a great speed tier, hitting 116 base speed that is nearly unmatched in this meta. The only relevant pieces that are faster are Spectrier and Iron Bundle, who are also knocked out easily by Iron Valiant. (Bundle can even fall to Vacuum Wave, a special Fighting type priority move.) The movepool on this thing is generally pretty insane, which makes Speed Booster sets very viable as well. Moonblast functions as reliable damage regardless of investment; with 120 base special attack you're doing enough chip to most things. It can then use the remaining 3 slots for a wide variety of utility like Icy Wind, Thunder Wave, Encore, Taunt, Coaching, and more.

Overall, it's by far one of the most customisable Pokemon in this meta, and I've even seen sets like Assault Vest and Trick Room do well. While Choice Specs Iron Valiant is definitely one of the most dominant special attackers here, thanks to the lack of real Fairy competition, I definitely enjoy experimenting with new sets every now and again. Fun mon.

Okidogi

Okidogi doesn't seem all that spectacular at first glance. It's weaker and slower than Iron Valiant, it's frailer than Iron Hands, and it's a slower Intimidate check than Zapdos. However, it has a decent matchup spread into most of the meta. It's able to 1v1 Iron Hands pretty consistently given Gunk Shot lands, or you're running Psychic Fangs, it can hit Heatran, Brute Bonnet, and others super effectively, and it's able to tank most of Iron Valiant's attacks with an Assault Vest. Psyshock or Expanding Force avoids this, but Okidogi usually runs a Tera type like Dark or Psychic to counter this. Okidogi's place in the meta is pretty interesting, as it's not necessarily the strongest on its own but it can use its dynamics with other Pokemon to gain viability anyway. In my (and most people's) opinion it's still ultimately worse than Iron Hands but it has a place in the metagame despite that. Some teams have certain matchups they struggle with that Iron Hands or Iron Valiant can't deal with, and Okidogi is able to counter a lot of the top threats using its good movepool. Gunk Shot / Drain Punch / High Horsepower / Knock Off is a nice all-around movepool for Assault Vest sets, with some choosing to swap out High Horsepower for Psychic Fangs, or another Fighting move like Close Combat. It's definitely in contention to be the 2nd best fighting type here, and most would agree with that notion. I prefer Iron Valiant and Iron Hands, but it is undeniable that Okidogi is nearly on par with them at worst.

Slither Wing

While not as good as the best the Fighting type has to offer, Slither Wing has a place in the meta on hard sun teams. It competes with Great Tusk for the fighting type slot, but it does have an argument to be used over it. While slower, it has slightly better overall bulk, with its middling physical bulk being much more manageable than Tusk's special bulk. It also has access to Flare Blitz, and slightly more Attack than Great Tusk. So Slither Wing is decent at firing off sun boosted Protosynthesis Flare Blitz. That said, due to its slow speed it's hard to choose its item. Choice Band can take a lot of OHKOs but is worse against teams with Heatran because it can't lock into Flare Blitz as reliably. Life Orb allows it to use First Impression more freely but it can't reach as many KOs and can't pivot with U-turn. Choice Scarf gets rid of its speed issues but it is suddenly not doing nearly as much damage as it needs to. Overall, Band is probably the best alongside Heatran answers, and it's definitely in an interesting situation where it can outdamage all these other Pokemon but its typing, stats and reliance on support make it pretty limited to being a core attacker on some sun strategies.


Also it's still better than Zapdos